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Okay, I've been reading up on the origins and background of the Inquisition and it's my understanding that some of the earliest Inquisitors were drawn from the Space Marine Legions. But not only that, but that the Inquisition continues to draw from the ranks of Space Marines for some of their Inquisitors. Why is it, then, that Inquisitors get S3 and T3? Am I missing something in the fluff about this? Is it that these SM are so old and geriatric that they've lost some of their buffness?

Most Inquisitors aren't Space Marines, just regular humans with the authority to put anyone in the comfy chair! Marines would be represented by the Grey Knights and Deathwatch which work with the Ordo Malleus and Xenos.

dietrich wrote:Most Inquisitors aren't Space Marines, just regular humans with the authority to put anyone in the comfy chair!

Ha!

Good one!

And right on too, as T4 and S4 are meant to represent the major upgrades going from normal human to super-human.

I mean, I recognize that most Inquisitors are human, but I'm just a little disappointed that there's not a good way to upgrade an Inquisitor to represent one drawn from a SM Chapter.

Because to date, and to the best of our knowledge, there never has been one?

I think background-wise, the two (SM's and INQ's) are NOT a viable career path.

The Inquisitors are supposed to be humans. Well trained with access to cool gear, they're still just humans. One reason the Inquisitors seem so good in the fluff is because they're always put up against other Humans. WS 4 or 5 v WS 3 and 2, access to weapons and Armor normal humans don't have are all ways to represent the advantage Inqs have over normal human.

If you ever read the Eisenhorn novels, there's a scene where the Inquisitor Eisenhorn goes toe to toe with a Chaos Space Marine. It takes freak supernatural act for Eisenhorn to win and later when Eisenhorn is speaking with a Librarian of the Death Watch, he has to explain in detail how the hell he managed to kill a space marine.

So in the fluff, Inquisitors are viewed as not as powerful as Space Marines. A fairer comparison is how much better they are than IG.

Eisenhorn is a great book.

I think the machoness for inquisitors would come in as the increased WS, W and I. I and WS shows they are superior fighters than IG, and extra wounds shows they can fight with wounds that would put others down (like Eisenhorn haveing leg injuries). He's no tougher than a human but is mentally stronger. In an arm wrestle against a marine he'd loose everytime, and certainly is easier to hurt than a marine would be.

Saying that, I do feel it would be more fluffly if they could absolutly kick arse, but then again on the battlefields we use in games, the fighting is far greater than the small skirmishes described in the background for these guys. If they're fighting a war they use good old WW1 tactics, send the troops in and sit at the back with a drinks cabinet shooting the guys trying to flee the field past them. Well, i say shoot, that's the commisars, the Inquisitors are probably more likly to take them into custody and torture them incase they are a heretic or something

lifeafter wrote:If you ever read the Eisenhorn novels, there's a scene where the Inquisitor Eisenhorn goes toe to toe with a Chaos Space Marine. It takes freak supernatural act for Eisenhorn to win and later when Eisenhorn is speaking with a Librarian of the Death Watch, he has to explain in detail how the hell he managed to kill a space marine.

So in the fluff, Inquisitors are viewed as not as powerful as Space Marines. A fairer comparison is how much better they are than IG.

That's very true. I have read the Eisenhorn novels, but it's been awhile. Thanks for the reminder!

Yes, but fluff being what it is, and Eisenhorn is a very good set of books...theres also a scene where he is mentally controlled by rogue psyker and manages to shoot a Space Marine in the head killing him instantly.....fluff wise, the Inquisitors movements should have been detected a mile away and the Marine should have been able to dodge.....

We have to remember that the writers use fluff to generate a story, and not some kind of fictional "fact".

Yeah, I just don't understand how the actuaries of 40,000 years in the future can let the millions of credits that go into building, training, and equipping a space marine be risked by not requiring space marines to wear helmets at all times.

Foolish superstitous and intolerant fools!!! They should join the greater good and be nice to others!!!!

Then we could call it Peaceful Bargaining Hammer 40,000. Turn Sequence is Posture, Parley, Demand, Acquiesce, Compromise. The real excitement comes during the arbitration phase when players roll dice to see who gets the more favorable terms. Victory Points are determined by who controls the most bargaining chips at the end of the game. Of course, no one dies in the exchange of these chips.

You finally accepted the greater good my child, now come into my chamber

lifeafter wrote:Then we could call it Peaceful Bargaining Hammer 40,000. Turn Sequence is Posture, Parley, Demand, Acquiesce, Compromise. The real excitement comes during the arbitration phase when players roll dice to see who gets the more favorable terms. Victory Points are determined by who controls the most bargaining chips at the end of the game. Of course, no one dies in the exchange of these chips.

To die not by shooting or CC ? To die because endless dicussions will bore you to death?
I'll prefer the quick and dirty method of 40k than the slow and painful of peacehammer 40k.

lifeafter wrote:Then we could call it Peaceful Bargaining Hammer 40,000. Turn Sequence is Posture, Parley, Demand, Acquiesce, Compromise. The real excitement comes during the arbitration phase when players roll dice to see who gets the more favorable terms. Victory Points are determined by who controls the most bargaining chips at the end of the game. Of course, no one dies in the exchange of these chips.

Hah hah hah!

Don't forget the most technical phase, where the skilled player really has the opportunity to turn the tables in his favor, the Tea Ceremony Phase, where presentation, selection, and flavor of biscuits can win you crucial points.

I played Peacehammer, and i want to know when we're getting a new biscuit 'dex. Chocolate hob-nobs are ridiculously overpowered it's impossible to win, they need to be the same points as at least 3 Jammy Dodgers, not just 2.

I find the Rabble-Rousers could easily defeat those foolish Hob-Nobs. I mean sure they get 'Decisive Tea Sip', but it is easily countered when your Flamboyant Psychiatrists drop 3 or 4 'Justification' templates. Drop the Biscuits and go for the Rousers (I am way too into this).

raising anopther point ine Eisenhorn he always sais hes so weak and his retinue is far stronger than he is
in some cases he is right (Nayl and Midas) but in the place Eisenhorn actually starts fighting he usually kicks more than a SM

Eisenhorn also fought humans or human-variants near exclusively. Their primary armament throughout the books were S3 weapons, and the descriptions have them blowing people away. He never had to counter greenskins or Tyranids, who would very probably have gutted him like a fish. When he ran up against Mandragore Carrion, some Emperor Children Aspiring Champion, he was getting his face kicked in but for dumb luck of possessing the Necroteuch.

The baseline through all the books was 3's across the board.

there were a few bolters and power swords flying around
and arent hellguns strengh 5 or have i read the codex wrong?

you've read the codex wrong, hellguns are str 3

About the helmet thing, for SM at least, and everyone I suppose, it says in the fulgrim book one of the captains doesnt wear a helment because he feels it helps him experience the battle better. Who are the adepts at terra to tell a 200 year war veteran whether or not they need to wear a helmet.

Hughzle wrote:there were a few bolters and power swords flying around
and arent hellguns strengh 5 or have i read the codex wrong?

If memory serves, hellguns are AP 5, making them cut through guardsmen and most greenskins a bit better than flashlights. Definitely strength 3 though.

i read the codex again your right

but still there were plenty of str 4 and up weapons