Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Most of my opponents do not like Synapse rules as they are. They don't like the protection against instant death, especially. One of my friends had a fantastic idea for how synapse should work:

Keep the same effects for Synapse. However, only the Hive Tyrant and Broodlord have Synapse power. All the other units that used to have Synapse are now Relays; they have synapse when they are in range of one of the synapse creatures.

I like this rule a lot. It works more like a brain, and it makes Instinctive Behavior checks more likely--which is more flavorful and fun.

The main problem I can see with it now is that it makes list-building for Bugs less flexible. But maybe the next book will let Warriors be used as Troops, and then...


Let me know what you think.

thats a bad idea, what happens if you don't wanna take a hive tryant or broodlord? and gaunts are leadership 5, if they go out of synpase range they just peg it

Right, it probably wouldn't work unless Warriors could be taken as troops, as well. As is, they are the only other HQ choice so, like I said, it sacrifices some flexibility. (And I'd be interested to see a bug list that doesn't take tyrant(s) or a broodlord...)

As for gaunts pegging it outside of synapse...that's the point. It requires the player to be more careful with his synapse. It makes the weaker bugs outside of the 'brain' go insane. It requires more IB tests. It's the way Tyranids are supposed to work. As it stands, Synapse is too easy to stay in range of.

Perhaps this would be best balanced by decreasing points costs for gaunts/hormagaunts by one or two points.

This would mean nids could only ever have two independantly operating parts in any given battle. Removing synapse from warriors, even with the relay ability, would mean we would need to get elite tyrants... Do you want to see a 4 flyrant list? Because this would be the only way to do speedy nids.


PS: Warrior spitter hordes are very possible in 5th. The warriors only for synapse can definitely be done.

Synapse should provide the LD bonus as before but protection from instant death should be an upgrade.

CrimsonTurkey: It certainly does not limit the player to two flanks. It limits the player to making more creative tactical decisions.

Think about it like this: two HQs allows a total of two flanks on their own. (I assume this is what you mean tactically by an independently operating part.) If you only pair one relay per HQ, then you will only benefit from the same flank. But if you pair two relay units per HQ...that gives you the potential for 4 flanking maneuvers...and it keeps adding up! (Who in their right mind would want to send out more than 4 is beyond me.) And if all that sounds too flimsy or spread out...don't forget Zoanthropes and, if the Warriors/Gaunts are a lower points cost...

Orlanth: Interesting thought. Is there a precedent in any other army for a special rule that does that, and also requires a points upgrade? (I only remembered Eternal Warrior, which IIRC is built-in.) The main problem I see with this solution is that it is so difficult to balance points-wise. Since it is such an effective rule, I can't see it requiring less than 10 points on an HQ and 4 points on a Warrior. If the current points costs of the Warrior is lowered, then that would make more sense. But I can see lots of players just dodging this biomorph. Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but Warriors do not need to be equipped identically within the squad and so the player could just give this uber-upgrade to ONE warrior for all the benefits.


ALSO! I was not being facetious about wanting to see a good Warrior list. Please show me one!

The big issue with protection from ID was that that was one of the very few problems GW fixed in the Tyranid book. Warriors are supposedly the most common Tyranid command construct, and yet people were avoiding them because they got chopped down by lascannon and bolter alike. Along with giving fleet to Genestealers, it was one of the best things they ever did for the race.

Of course this is the proposed rules section, so if voluntarily forfeiting your protection from instant death will keep your play group happy and ensure that you don't lose any friends, I say do it. It's not worth burning any bridges over a game of toy soldiers.

on the subject of warriors i think think thy should go back to how they were in the old dex.

wings - fast choice
venom cannons - heavy choice
and normal HQ and Elite.

my brothers army used to have a few units of genestealers and then pure warrior spam, 11 possible units.
or tyranid should get an extra HQ and troop on the force org.
in higher point games the FOC is filled up, and theres a lack of synapse on the board.

wight_widow: I agree on all points. Fortunately, no one I play with is really spiteful about this. I think my buddy's proposal helps balance it out against complaints. I will let you guys know if we playtest this.

JD: I agree, it would be nice to see the Warrior heavy squads come back, but difficult to balance in 5ed. The 39 point build for a Barbed Strangler warrior is perhaps too effective now to allow a whole squad of them on the board...perhaps a heavy squad would only allow 3 BStranglers and 3 VCannon. What I'd really like to see is CC Warriors become viable again; effective builds now are not worth the points. As for extra FOC, I don't think any army should have that advantage in a regular game, but if you are playing higher than, say, 2000 points, it's appropriate to agree with your opponent on both armies expanding their FOC slots. Even with the book as it is, it is possible to field 8 squads of 9 warriors. That should be enough synapse.

doak22 wrote:Right, it probably wouldn't work unless Warriors could be taken as troops, as well. As is, they are the only other HQ choice so, like I said, it sacrifices some flexibility. (And I'd be interested to see a bug list that doesn't take tyrant(s) or a broodlord...)

Never got around to actually making it because my painting hadn't gotten good enough to make them look good, but I'd been messing around with a list that had 2 warrior HQ choices, and 3 warriors as elites. No big bugs at all. 1850. This was 4th so I was ok with 2 small groups of swarms for troops. Course every last warrior had rending claws, and deathspitters. I think I was able to squeeze in about 50 or so of them. I figured that 50 small blasts would give people a little bit of pause. And even if it didn't work out, it'd still be fun.

At a tournament this past Sunday a guy won (IIRC) with only one squad of Warriors as his synapse.

The rest of his army was genestealers, blasty carnifexes and 3 lictors. So, not exactly balanced, but...

how is it possible to field 8 units of 9 warriors?

elite - 3
hq - 2

and thats it.
you can field more units of fex's!

JD21290 wrote:how is it possible to field 8 units of 9 warriors?

elite - 3
hq - 2

and thats it.
you can field more units of fex's!

3 Winged as Fast Attack

touche lormax, forgot about those.