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now i have been asing around about mega nobs and i keep hearing that they are not up to sratch with there lesser armoured brothren. now i propose that they get cybork bodies standard, the choice to have 2 klaws and have strength and toughness 5, at 60pts each or 80 each for 2 power klaws

Yay or nah?

You love power klaws, don't you? With good reason I suppose.

Anyway, how much does Grotsnik cost? I think the point changes need to reflect that, because of the standard cybork bodies you propose.

I'd give it more thought,but I'm a bit rushed atm.

I think that Mega-Armour should bestow improved strength and toughness, so I propose:
-Strength and toughness 5.
-Remove S&P in exchange for terminator armour rules.
-Cybork bodies as standard.
Not too powerful, maybe up the cost a bit.

what about 2 klaws, i think its reasonable for a points increase

Personally, S5 and then two power claws... I dont think so. For the rest, fine, but two klaws, S5, no S&P? A bit too much for my liking.

just my two toof

what if we upped the price for you then to 90pts for one?

That would sound fair, but I fear they would not see much use...

I like the T5. Or T4(5) maybe. I like replacing the TL Shoota with a Klaw, too. I would put it at 5 points, same as the other upgrades.

As far as Cybork is concerned, I would say +10 points considering they have already have 2W and a 2+. They used to have an upgrade where you could roll 3d6 rather than 2. This could be an upgrade that a Big Mek in Mega-armour could take/ give.

Mega-armoured Nobz are one of the units that are not perfect, but still fill a viable role. I mean if they were perfect everyone would always take them.

They don't need to be "fixed."

They're not Ork Terminators and they don't need to be.

... improving mega nobs? ok leave the points as is if you make them any more expensive no-one will pick them.

but add the following maybe? (changes in red)

MEGANOBZ 40 POINTS PER MODEL

Meganobz WS:4 BS:2 S:4 T:4(5) W:2 I:3 A:3 Ld:7 Sv2+

Unit Composition:
>3-10 Meganobz

Wargear:
>Mega armour
>Big Choppa
>Stickkbombz

Unit Type:
>infantary
Special Rules:
>Furious Charge
>Mob Rule (Special:each model counts as 2)
>Waaagh!

Transport:
>Battlewagon, may not have a killkannon upgrade
or
>Trukk if the mob numbers 6 or less.

Options:
>Any Meganob may take one of the follwing:
-Skorcha 5p per model
-rokkit launcha + 5p per model

I think the only fix is letting them take a Bosspole, or some other way of improving their ability to pass Ld tests. Letting them count as 2 models for Mob Rule would work too. With Ld7, and no rerolls, it's a pretty risky unit to me.

One way to fix them is to buy Grostnik and stick him in the unit, with Cybork Bodies. Now, 9 MANz with Grostnik is like 600 points, and they'd need a BW, so that's like 700 points. But, they have an open-topped transport (which every lascannon will shoot), are Fearless, W2, 2+/5+ save with three powerklaw attacks.

To me, any houserule fix needs to consider Grostnik. They shouldn't be better for less points than they are by adding the Mad Doc.

And they're not Orks in looted TDA (although that would be a fun conversion for a Blood Axe army), and they shouldn't try to be. I'm fine with no Invul save (at least base) and having S&P.

increace T to T4(5)
add option of 2 klaws
add option of a MegaDoc
and for gods sake, give em bosspoles!!!

after this i would say 45 points for increaces T
2 klaws adds 15 points or so. (not too much as they have the inceaced Str anyway)
MegaDoc adds 30 points.
bosspoles for 5 points.

on the line of weapons i think 1 out of every 3 should be able to take one of the following: (providing they havent taken 2 klaws)

skorcha: 10 points
kustom MB: 15 points
rokkit: 10 points
big shoota: 5 points

JD21290 wrote:increace T to T4(5)
add option of 2 klaws
add option of a MegaDoc
and for gods sake, give em bosspoles!!!

after this i would say 45 points for increaces T
2 klaws adds 15 points or so. (not too much as they have the inceaced Str anyway)
MegaDoc adds 30 points.
bosspoles for 5 points.

on the line of weapons i think 1 out of every 3 should be able to take one of the following: (providing they havent taken 2 klaws)

skorcha: 10 points
kustom MB: 15 points
rokkit: 10 points
big shoota: 5 points

I second that, and also think that they (And the Warboss) should have access to the shoota options listed for the Flashgitz. Granted, that would make them potentially more expensive, but then it's up to the players. Perhaps it would work better as an Apocalypse datasheet, where such an expensive unit would not take such a bite out of the army's total points, porportionally speaking.

@JD21290: yep be nice to have a doc with them

Another way to make them better is to make Mad Dok Grotsnik 25/30 points cheaper.

I'm going to start by saying that the actual profile shouldn't be changed, as it is the general Nob profile, and all they have that other Nobz don't is armor, not any hormones or anything to make them better.

I think the major problems are leadership and lack of an invul, along with the instant death problem of T 4 with 2 W.

Leadership can be handled 2 (already proposed) ways. Allow for a bosspole to be taken (this seems easy to implement, may take a bosspole at +10 pnts), or make Mob Rule counted by Wounds (this makes more sense than 2 per Nob, as a wounded nob would be less reassuring than a healthy nob). The change to the Mob Rule would be best (and make sense) to be universal, and therefore is not extremely likely, as you need to change a lot of the codex (although this could help many units). So, bosspole at +10 points, ideally universal Mob Rule based on Wounds, possibly for a slight points bump for all units that would benifit.

The invulnerable idea seems fine to just add the option for 5-10 points. There seems to be a trend to have upgrades as multiples of 5, but I don't think 5 or 10 is fair. 5 would remove some of the motivation to take Mad Doc, though it doesn't seem like an amazing price, but I suppose that it would always be taken, so maybe higher would be better. 10 seems to expensive, as it gives us the profile of a terminator, for 50 points, with small shooting capibilities, and forced I 1 (more or less), while we get 2 Wounds. I think 7 or 8 would be a good price for cybork bodies.

I don't think the T 4(5) thing is that great of an idea. They are mega armored nobz, and armor doesn't affect Toughness in 40k (such as Termies), and if they get the extra toughness, all nobz should, which is just not practical. Also, this doesn't affect the instant death issue, which I find to be the main loss of my (rarely fielded) mega nobz. I don't see a easy or fair solution to this problem, so this can be left as a drawback. Solving the invulnerable issue helps this anyway, and makes these guys much more realistic to not be able to take lascannons well.

The 2 Power Klaw thing I don't think is a good idea. I think that that rule is supposed to be an exception, and reserved for special individuals. Besides, at 15 points, you would almost never use it. For 45 points, you could get an extra attack on 3 guys (+3 PK attacks), or an extra mega nob with cybork (+3 PK attacks, 4 on the charge, and 2 extra wounds). It would be very hard to price it appropriately. It would also make for cool modeling possibilities, but I don't think that it would work out very well.

For their cost, it does seem fair already. They are 5 points cheaper than a normal Nob with a Power Klaw, and go from 6+ to 2+, as well as getting a TL shoota. Their drawbacks, as opposed to regular nobz are their lack of options, and their Slow + Purposeful. Normal nobz can get the TL shoota for 5 points, so one can ask if it is better to have 10 extra points and 2+ armor with the drawback of S+P. I feel like this is a good deal, so the base points for mega nobz seems fine.

So, all I would propose doing is adding the option for bosspole at +10 points, and cybork at 7-8, maybe 10.

JD21290 wrote:increace T to T4(5)
add option of 2 klaws
add option of a MegaDoc
and for gods sake, give em bosspoles!!!

after this i would say 45 points for increaces T
2 klaws adds 15 points or so. (not too much as they have the inceaced Str anyway)
MegaDoc adds 30 points.
bosspoles for 5 points.

on the line of weapons i think 1 out of every 3 should be able to take one of the following: (providing they havent taken 2 klaws)

skorcha: 10 points
kustom MB: 15 points
rokkit: 10 points
big shoota: 5 points

I totally agree with this one and am jelous someone else thought of it first

Bring back Turbo-boosta anyone?

I don't think they need changing at all

with a natural invul save, they are WAY too durable at 2 wounds a piece.

s&P is good for them, since you can take ghaz's waagh and give them a fleet move. no other terminators can do that.

I don't think they need fixing. mine never fail to just carve a path across the board onto enemy objectives.

besides, orks get to take them as troops when you take a warboss. and why wouldn't you take ghazghkull? he's an absolute beast. with proper placement in assault, you can force the power wpn or fist to go against him, negating the need for an invul save

the rest of the time, learn how to keep them in cover.. there you go problem solved

NaZ

NaZ wrote:s&P is good for them, since you can take ghaz's waagh and give them a fleet move. no other terminators can do that.

Commander Shrike gives SM Terminators fleet that remains until he dies (I think).

lol @ squig, what can i say? im just pissed to see a unit weighing 20 or so ton run off like a bunch of grotz.
at 200 points for 5 they deserve better, it says they are more wealthy than the common nob, so why the hell does the dex not show this? basic weps to say the least, poor profile, and not even a doc or bosspole upgrade? its a pisstake

/// rant over, sorry for language ect....

Dont worry we are all thinking it, they should have access to the armoury eg. a big shoota or kustom mega blasta or 2 klaws.

The fluffs points at it but the rules say otherwise

... yep if you read the fluff they should get options like the Flash gitz ... now there an option mash the 2 together

they each get a Snazzgun (+5pts) and can get any of the upgrades (including the pain boy but only +15p as he won't have mega armour) ... maybe this is to much