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I have another post going but I think this will be more to the point all my basic questions have been answer and I am very grateful how diligent people have been in helping me.

I have one final request, if someone feels up to it would you be willing to design me a list around the following specs either a Cryx(assassination) or Khador(melee) army either 350 or 500 points. Please give a "BRIEF" explanation as to how the units interact with each other i.e. this power/focus increases this aspect of the jack or troop ect.

Here you are

A sample 500pts Cryx army (please, take into account the influence of my personal preferences. )

Faction: Cryx
Points: 500
Model Count: 19
Victory Points: 18

Warwitch Deneghra - Your caster and she's a really good one
> Deathripper - just a fast arcnode, don't expect too much from it except that.
> Deathripper - same as above
> Nightwretch - a fast arcnode that can also shoot. Due to the way AOE's work it could be used to kill stealth/high DEF - low ARM models
> Nightwretch - same as above
Skarlock Thrall - utility solo that lets you save focus on support spells
Bile Thralls [6] (0 added) - Incredibly useful unit that can kill masses of infantry with "purge" special attack. Top priority target for your enemy though.
Gorman di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist - great mercenary solo. Can create smoke to provide cover or use other special "grenades" for making enemy easier to kill.
Pistol Wraith - Cryx shooting solo with a special effect that prevents model hit by it from moving/making action for a turn.
Pistol Wraith - same as above
Ogrun Bokur - a mercenary solo with quite a HtH punch. To be combined with one of the pistol Wraiths as his "client" (that gives Bokur boosted attack/damage).
Withershadow Combine [3] - A fantastic unique Cryx unit. Let you upkeep a spell for free every turn and has many additional abilities.

This army is all about assassination. Be aware that it has no real strenght for a prolonged combat or attrition war. Your goal is to present enemy with too many possible dangers, from too many angles for him to handle at once. The plan is to run a bonechicken or two close to enemy caster, pop Denny's feat, drop him/her down with Scourge and finish with Pistol Wraiths and/or Bokur.
There're many small tricks that can make that easier to achieve. Eg. ghostwalk (cast by Skarlock so focus-free) will allow a bonechicken to aproach enemy caster without worrying about free strikes/rough terrain. Withershadow Combine's Puppet Master spell allows Deneghra to reroll a single roll a turn so it's so much easier to hit with Scourge or any other spell. Crippling Grasp cast early in the game on enemy's strongest HtH unit will effectively make it (almost) useless (no run, no charge, no orders). And it can be upkept for free by Withershadow Combine.
Gorman's Black Oil combined with Deathchill form a Pistol Wraith can stop dead an enemy model for a turn. And the list goes on...
Hope I helped a bit.

mazgier,

Thank you this is exactly what I was looking for, I greatly appreciate any time you spent making the list it really helps me visualize how game play works when you break it down unit by unit like that.

The funny thing is, that when you drop Biles, WC and Bokur you'll get an exactly 350pts. list that is also very dangerous and playable. In any case, Wraiths and Gorman are optional and may be replaced with any other Cryx/Mercenary solo(s) that suit your style.
I'll also try to convince one of my friends to suggest something Khadoran...
BTW, never forget that when you find yourself in deep trouble you may cast Death Rage on Deneghra to keep her fighting for a round more even if she gets killed. Your opponents will hate you for that

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Here's one of my friend's armylists:

Faction: Khador
Points: 499
Model Count: 18
Victory Points: 22

Karchev the Terrible
> Kodiak
> Kodiak
Gorman di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist
Manhunter
Yuri the Axe
Battle Mechaniks [5] (1 added)
Battle Mechaniks [5] (1 added)
Lady Aiyana & Master Holt [2]

Keep in mind that effective playing with this list requires quite a bit of WM experience. The main idea here is not the straightforward charge at the enemy but the combination of Karchev's spell Iron Curtain and the ability of Kodiaks to run without focus. Mechanics help to keep your warjacks running and the rest of the solos just perfom support roles. If you manage to KD enemy's caster with Iron Curtain the Kodiak special rule against KD'ed models just guarantee a kill.
It's hard to play but extremelly funny list. I've seen it "at work"

Here's a Khador list that's a little more forgiving and uses the battle box.

Sorscha
-Destroyer
-Juggernaut
Iron Fang Pikemen (9+UA)
Yuri the Axe
Greylord Ternions

16 models
19 VPs
498 points

The idea is to advance and Shield Wall the IFP under the cover of Fog of War and the Greylords' Blizzard spells, charging as soon as you can line up a good one. Have the Destroyer advance along side them while providing covering fire. Send the Juggernaut after your opponent's biggest, nastiest model. Yuri Advance Deploys and harasses a flank. Sorscha advances behind the IFP and waits for her troops punch a hole in the enemy line. When you're close enough, Cast Wind Rush to get her a charge lane to the enemy caster, pop her feat, and charge. This won't work against the harder warcasters (Darius, Karchev, Butcher, etc.), or focus campers, so may have to use an alternate strategy in that situation.

If you want a 350 list, drop the Juggernaut and Greylords for 350 on the dot.

This 500 to 350 list sounds like a good idea for learning starter armies.

Khador:

Vlad
Destroyer x2
Manhunter
9 IFP +UA
Winterguard mortar

496 points which is very simple and to the point.

Cryx:

Skarre
2x Nightwretch
Deathripper
Helldiver
Scarlock
Tartarus
10 Bane Knights
6 Bile Thralls
6 Mehcanithralls

495 Skarre bomb or hellfire all day

Wow, thanks for all the posts and especially the brief explanations. This has to be one of the friendliest and helpful boards on dakka, I am very impressed no one has been rude or condicending in any way, which is most excellent.

I have been looking over the lists and really like the play style described by Mazgier's first list, I was just wondering though is it possible to fit a warjack into that list without loosing too much potency.

I know he said the jacks for cryx are more for advanced players but I have never been one to take things step by step. Also one of the main reasons I am really into starting this table top game is that I get to use mechs (that list has none, and the bone chickens don't count lol).

Zhetsuken wrote:I have been looking over the lists and really like the play style described by Mazgier's first list, I was just wondering though is it possible to fit a warjack into that list without loosing too much potency.

You may try to modify the list to include either Cankerworm (Even if it's technically a light jack, used properly it kills stuff dead. Any stuff.) or Nightmare or, maybe a Helldiver. Those are so far the most forgiving of the Cryxian warjacks. I don't count Deathjack as he's a story of its own. The problem with the rest is not that they lack potential but that they lack ability to survive long enough to get into a real fight. And so you need experience to learn how to protect them long enough to make them count on the battlefield. Once you learn how to do it, you'll start to enjoy playing with them.

So what would I replace to take nightmare and still bring viability to the list?

You may try something like this:

Faction: Cryx
Points: 500
Model Count: 18
Victory Points: 18

Warwitch Deneghra
> Nightmare
> Defiler
> Defiler
> Deathripper
Skarlock Thrall
Bile Thralls [9] (3 added)
Gorman di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist
Pistol Wraith
Ogrun Bokur

Should work but you'll need a bit of patience to figure out the right balance of focus application.

Faction: Khador
Points: 500
Model Count: 22
Victory Points: 20

Kommandant Irusk
> Beast 09'
> Mortar
> Mortar
> Great Bears
> Iron Fang Pikeman + UA
> Yuri the Axe
> Lady Aiyana and Master Holt

This list excels at what Khador is best at, tough hard hitting infantry. All of the melee units are atleast ARM 16.
This army either attacks or counterattacks in waves. With the IFP and Beast taking Point. Superiority is beastly when cast on well Beast Spd 6 Mat 8 Def 12 Un-knockdownable Beast 09' tearing it up. Irusk Casts Battle Lust on whatever unit has the best opportunity to do the most damage, with Airburst available to kill those pesky Overpowered Solos (Gorman, Aiyana & Holt Eryss ETC...) Confusion and Iron Fleshed Greatbears can be game winning spells if used right. Problem with this list as with most Khador Lists is that assassination abilities are limited and its imperative that you recognize what you need to kill and take it down quickly.

@Zhetsuken - one general note, before you start playing any list. When you decide what caster will you use in a game, take his/her card and read all what's written on it. Read the feat and all spells, repeat and then read again. This system is all about how a certain rule is written, word by word. Check the erratas and FAQ's on PP site. If you know how each and every spell and the feat work, check all the special rules involved (spray, AOE etc.). When you finish - try to imagine how you can use them in practice, eg.: how to kill invisible models with Denny's Venom, how to get a guaranteed KD of a high DEF model with Scourge and so on.
And if you're sure about how everything works check what each and every spell/feat/ability can give you when you hit an enemy model with it and when you hit your own. You'll be really surprised how many sneaky combos you can find playing WM (trust me, you'll love Cryx for that )