Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I’ve just started with Warmachine (MK I) and I have the Cryx Battlegroup box set. My friend want’s to learn with me but didn’t like the Warmachine factions (‘cause he’s lame) so he picked up the Legion box set. I also picked up Iron Lich Asphyxious and was thinking of switching him with Deneghra, but I have no idea what I'm doing.

Here’s my question: what tactics should I use to defeat the soulless bastards?

Remember I’m new at this, but if you have spell specifics or something like that, just use the name and I’ll use my own initiative to find out the exact rules.

Thanks for the advice

One advantage that Warmachine casters have over Hordes warlocks is: arcnodes. You have three in your battlebox (the bonejacks). A standard tactic with Cryx is to move one arcnode up into spell range (run if necessary), then activate your Warcaster and arc as many damage spells as possible. Your bonejack will get charged and probably destroyed, but you don't care. Keep back, send another arcnode in, and arc spells. Save your Slayer for the big finish, when all/most of your jacks are gone and you can load him up with Focus to kick butt.

You probably want to take out his little dragonettes first, to reduce his tactical options and especially his ability to Transfer damage. Transfer is a big advantage that Warlocks have - they can move damage that they suffer onto a Warbeast. So always take out the easy-to-take-out Warbeasts before you go gunning for the Warlock, to reduce his options for Transfer.

If a bonejack gets damaged so that its arcnode is gone, but it still has cortex and movement: give it a couple of Focus and have it slam something. They have a 10" Slam range, use it. Knocking the Carnivean down for a turn is a great use for an arcnodeless bonejack. Bonus points for slamming the Carnivean into the Warlock!

Deneghra should be spamming her Venom spell, trying to line it up to catch multiple dragonnettes at once. Don't bother boosting to hit; she only needs 8's, so it's better to spend the Focus on casting a second (and/or third) Venom. If you can catch the Warlock with Venom early then do it, the continuous Corrosion effect is worth it. Corrosion will also mess up the little dragonettes if they survive the initial hit.

Crippling Grasp is a good spell to maintain on the Carnivean, to slow him down and reduce his armor. You can use Deneghra's Feat in combination with a charge from a Slayer with 3 Focus on him to take out a Crippling-Grasp-laden Carnivean. Just buy extra attacks with the Focus, don't bother boosting hits or damage.

Deneghra's Stealth is useless against the Legion beasts, by the way, since they all have Eyeless Sight. Keep her as far back as possible, and preferably behind cover or screened by the Slayer.

Asphyxious can arc his AOE spell (Breath of Corruption, I think); again, try to hit multiple targets and don't worry about losing the bonejack. He can also arc Hellfire, but you'll want to boost the attack roll against the high-DEF little guys, or the damage roll against the Carnivean.

If Asphixious can ever get a charge off on the Warlock then he should do so. Boost his first attack to hit, and then don't bother boosting damage; just keep buying more attacks. They will automatically hit due to Sustained Attack. When you run out of Focus, feat to get 7 more Focus and keep beating on the Warlock with sustained attack. He won't be able to transfer that many times; he has to spend one Fury each time he Transfers.

Asphixious can also do hit and run attacks using Shadow Wings to get away; he can do this to finish off wounded beasts, eg. Very effective if he has Scything Touch cast on himself. Another use for Scything Touch is on the Slayer. When in position, load the Slayer up with 3 Focus and have it charge the Carnivean and take it apart. Don't bother boosting damage or combo-striking, just keep hitting it with extra attacks. Don't forget the free tusk attack for good measure. If you can have the Slayer charge the Warlock, do it: you'll need to use the focus to boost your to-hit rolls with the Death Claws, but the low armor on most Warlocks means that he'll be transferring huge amounts of damage to his beasts.

Good luck, and don't let the soulless bastards get you down

Three tips for Asphixious vs. Legion

1. Charge his Warbeasts with Asphixious and destroy them in melee then use Ghost wings to run away.

2. Use Parasite in conjunction with his feat to destroy his high DEF low ARM infantry.

3. Use Hellfire on the unit leaders of non fearless units to make them flee.

I'd recommend using the MkII rules as soon as possible (Hordes MkII beta comes out 24th November) because it's much better than MkI.

George Spiggott wrote:Three tips for Asphixious vs. Legion

1. Charge his Warbeasts with Asphixious and destroy them in melee then use Ghost wings to run away.

2. Use Parasite in conjunction with his feat to destroy his high DEF low ARM infantry.

3. Use Hellfire on the unit leaders of non fearless units to make them flee.

I'd recommend using the MkII rules as soon as possible (Hordes MkII beta comes out 24th November) because it's much better than MkI.

Oh yeah, I forgot about Parasite! Good call. Parasite is a bit expensive for dragonettes, but once you guys start playing with infantry then it's definitely worth for a whole unit.

For battlebox games, you might want to arc Parasite onto the Carnivean (or Warlock) and maintain it, then charge the Parasited target with a Scything-Touched Slayer or Asphixious. Parasite (-3 ARM) + ScyTouch (+2 Dam) = +5 damage on each hit!

Thanks for the info doods! We are going to try for our first game tomorrow, so I'll have to make sure and study these stratagies really well.

Keep em coming. I'll let everyone know how the first game went and if i was able to pull the Dragonfathers kin down!

This just in... Arc Nodes rule.

Nah, that's been in for a while now

I get the impression that Legion play a bit like Cryx with the hordes of little creatures.

I am liking Denny's influence spell.

I used it to take down a bokur from behind with a Forge Guard.

I am tempted to run Denny and Fiona in a big game just to pull off 15 influences in one turn. (+1 from Skarlock).

I just want to see someones face when their own infantry destroys them.

That trick will not work often on the same opponent. And unless a unit is in shieldwall you will notget to many chances of pulling it off in a turn.....

Then again, when Vlad is moving up with a bodyguard of democorp and one swings at vlad, it is going to hurt him.... the threat value alone is worth it...

kain3883 wrote:This just in... Arc Nodes rule.

Battle Report?

It's hard to make a good battle report because these games where our first, so after a few days of checking rules I've found several areas where we messed up. There are also rules we forgot many times, like the fact that ‘jacks can use power attacks. While I was using Warmachine MK I rules, he was using my Hordes book for his Everblight force, which I bought back in 2006. Trying to learn two games while playing was a pain but each game got faster, smoother and was a lot more interesting as we learned and remembered how to use rules and powers.

In the end, I won all four games we played. Like I said above, arc nodes ruled the day. Asphyxious’s Breath of Corruption and Hellfire was used en mass and in game two, the Slayer ate the Carnivean’s face hard core. I bought the Cryxian Necrotite Mining Facility a while ago and that was used as our terrain for two of the four. The last game was without any terrain so it was a straight shot for the arc nodes. First and third games had the mining facility in two different positions but with several interesting ways to use cover.

With a better understanding of the rules by both of us, our next games will be much more interesting. The first game was played with Warmachine rules for both sides. After reading up about fury, a lot of questions where answered (not to mention some of the advice he got on forums). The next two games where slower as rule-checking was an even more integral part of every turn. The last game was fairly quick (comparatively) and the lack of terrain made it even faster.

After the four games, he threw his Typhon against my Deathjack (yes, we bought them because they look cool, not because we know what we’re doing). I’ll let you all figure out who one (I’m kidding, I want to gloat. Deathjack also dined on face that day). We used a basic rule set for the duel, where no abilities where used, just the basic attacks. Silly, but it was entertaining (especially for me. Go giant murdering deathbot!!!).

The more games we play the better we’ll get, but unfortunately between school and work and life, it’s hard to find time for more. Thanks to everyone for the hints and tips, taking out his baby dragons so he couldn’t share his pain worked very well. If anyone has more tips, I’d certainly be grateful. He wants to up the points because he went nuts buying more stuff, so now he has several troop units that I’ve got to smash (Blighted Swordsmen, Warmongers and I believe Striders). I picked up a Pistol Wraith but I’m not sure what else to use against troops. Either way, arc nodes still rule.

Your opponent needs to be taking out your nodes and forcing you to commit Gaspy.

As long as you are not using the full rules, the durablility of the Beasts will not show.

Also, are you using the Animi of the beasts?

Without those, a warlock will be severely hamstrung vs WM.

Yea, by the last game we had sorted out many of the rules we had done wrong. Fury was one of them that we fully read up on by the end of our second game.

After the games, we both have been reading the rules over again and making sure to share any findings with eachother, so as both sides understand the limitations of each game.

By the way, Deathjack is a STELLAR purchase for MKII. He doesn't go berserk anymore!......oh boy...

Really? I heard they took away Necrovent and made him more controllable. They took away Unbound?