Acumulated warp facts

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**lordrevege**

I've read over 30 40k books. A couple that I've read give me the following impression of the warp:

The warp is a netherworld composed of demons (ya, I'm american)

When a sentient being dies its emotions/spirit ascend to the warp OR a sentient being always sends its lifeforce to the warp even in life

This emotion, or life force, accumulates and pools together creating a great sentient being which embodies the characteristics of the species that created it (i.e. orks; gork and mork, eldar; slanesh)

The time and space inconsistencies features in the warp make it ideal to travel through (warp travel)

The astronomican guides all imperial starships (and maybe all chaos, I'm not sure) through the warp.

The Tau still cannot traverse the warp

HAHHAHHAHHHAHA, stupid blueys.

Am I wrong? Am I right?
I know I'm missing a bunch of stuff.
Please fill me in.

**metallifan**

lordrevege wrote:I've read over 30 40k books. A couple that I've read give me the following impression of the warp:

The warp is a netherworld composed of demons (ya, I'm american)

When a sentient being dies its emotions/spirit ascend to the warp OR a sentient being always sends its lifeforce to the warp even in life

This emotion, or life force, accumulates and pools together creating a great sentient being which embodies the characteristics of the species that created it (i.e. orks; gork and mork, eldar; slanesh)

The time and space inconsistencies features in the warp make it ideal to travel through (warp travel)

The astronomican guides all imperial starships (and maybe all chaos, I'm not sure) through the warp.

The Tau still cannot traverse the warp HAHHAHHAHHHAHA, stupid blueys.

Am I wrong? Am I right?
I know I'm missing a bunch of stuff.
Please fill me in.

I: It's not so much a netherworld as it is an Alternate Dimension where space, time, and creation are irrelevant. It's spelled Daemons regardless of nationality. This is the 40K spelling, not a cultural one.

II: This is fairly accurate, although not true for each and every race in the Galaxy. The Tau, for example, have no psychic ability and are thus safe from the Warp's dangers. Meanwhile Humans and Eldar are very Psychicly active and thus are at great risk of possession and/or having their souls devoured.

III: The gods and their Daemons are made of the emotions, thoughts, actions, and desires of ALL races, not just one per god or Daemon type. One race may play a greater role in bringing a god into power, but they are never solely responsible.

IV: Warp travel is -far- from ideal. It is fairly consistent, however there are cases where an army may arrive several tens, hundreds, or thousands of years before or after a war that they were shipping off to fight even begins, or has long since ended. They could make planetfall only to find themselves five hundred years in the past and everything is fine. Or they could exit the warp into the planet's local space and it has been enemy occupied for thousands of years and the fleet is completely destroyed by the enemy defenses.

There is also the possibility of the ship becoming stuck in the warp and having it's Gellar Field fail, resulting in Warp Entities swarming the ship and slaughtering the crew before the ship is released back into real space. While these incidents aren't common, they occur enough for the Warp to be considered quite dangerous and anything but ideal. The only reason it's used is because it's the only form of FTL travel for most races. For these reasons, most Captains make short "hops" instead of a streamlined journey.

V: The Astronomican guides Imperial Ships, the same way as the Northern Star or Southern Cross helped sailors centuries ago. Chaos fleets usually have Daemon navigators, and they are naturally able to ply the Warp efficiently. The fact that they are Chaos fleets does not protect them from the mindless Warp beasts, however. Chaos ships are still vulnerable to Gellar Field failure.

VI: The Tau cannot travel far, as they have no psykers. Hence why the Niccassar do most of the charting for them.

In summary, you're quite close on a lot of this. Your understanding of it is certainly adequate

**dayve110**

metallifan wrote:
IV: Warp travel is -far- from ideal. It is fairly consistent, however there are cases where an army may arrive several tens, hundreds, or thousands of years before or after a war that they were shipping off to fight even begins, or has long since ended. They could make planetfall only to find themselves five hundred years in the past and everything is fine. Or they could exit the warp into the planet's local space and it has been enemy occupied for thousands of years and the fleet is completely destroyed by the enemy defenses.

While flicking through the ork background stories in the army book, one ork warboss (forget the name, but its in the orky timeline under "the lost waaagh!" i think) managed to encounter a past (or future, im not to sure) version of himself and ended up engaging actively in attempting to kill him, not sure which version won in the end.

**Grarg**

The future Warboss killed his past self, because he wanted a backup of his favorite gun. Now he has 2 of his favorite guns.

**Zio**

Actually, chaos marines do not use navigaters. They just take "blind" hops and when they find an imperial world, they have at 'er. They're guided by "fate" (ie; luck and any derranged god that happens to smile on them... maybe).

Anyway, you got it pretty straight on my yankee friend.

Also, all emotions feed the warp, all the time. Especially for Eldar, who seem to "bleed" alot of warp energy. Humans not so much, bu it nickels and dimes it's way to signifigance (except for human psykers who shed/generate ALOT of warp energy). Orks can manipulate warp energy, and do so very well, uncounsciously, but for some reason chaos isn't (as) able to draw upon or manipulate this energy. I believe the orks were created after the eldar, and the old ones learned from some of their mistakes, after the eldar (well, ok, old ones) ruined the warp in the first place.

**metallifan**

Zio wrote:Actually, chaos marines do not use navigaters. They just take "blind" hops and when they find an imperial world, they have at 'er. They're guided by "fate" (ie; luck and any derranged god that happens to smile on them... maybe).

Which is strange, because I remember in (I think it was) Lord of the Night, a Chaos Battle Barge was covered in detail, and it was said that a Daemon Navigator was fused with his seat on the Bridge.

**warpcrafter**

I've never heard of the Niccassar. Are they one of the races that the Tau have assimilated into their empire?

**metallifan**

warpcrafter wrote:I've never heard of the Niccassar. Are they one of the races that the Tau have assimilated into their empire?

Yep. Squid people. With enormous psychic power

**Bran Dawri**

Run for your life! It's the mind flayers!

...

OK, back on topic. The necrons, like the Tau, do not have warp presence, but do have an alternate form of FTL travel.

**sniperjolly**

The tau *do* have a warp presence, just a very small one.
Their FTL consists of "skimming" off the surface of the warp.
Whatever that means.

**lordrevege**

metallifan wrote:
warpcrafter wrote:I've never heard of the Niccassar. Are they one of the races that the Tau have assimilated into their empire?

Yep. Squid people. With enormous psychic power

Thanks.
Very insightful.
And my pals and I thought "Deamons" was a cultural thing.
I learned something new today (actually just around five things).

**metallifan**

lordrevege wrote:
And my pals and I thought "Deamons" was a cultural thing.

It's spelled "Daemons"

**Locclo**

sniperjolly wrote:The tau *do* have a warp presence, just a very small one.
Their FTL consists of "skimming" off the surface of the warp.
Whatever that means.

My guess is that they do a slight dip into the warp, but only very briefly to get a burst of speed. Suddenly change the space/time laws, make travel much faster, and leech off of the gained momentum in normal space for a while. Not nearly as fast as pure warp travel, but infinitely safer.

I don't remember where I heard this, but I believe the Tau are the only race to have seen the warp (IE they encountered it) and decided that it was far too dangerous to try and use as a weapon. Seems they don't like the idea of their potential psykers getting eaten by a Greater Daemon out of nowhere.

**Gogsnik**

THE WARP
An understanding of interstellar travel requires some knowledge of the warp. The material universe is just one aspect of reality. There is a quite separate and co-existing immaterial universe. This is commonly known as the warp or warpspace, also known as Chaos, the otherworld, the ether, the empyrean, the void and the immaterium. The study and exploitation of the warp is the aim of warp technology, the most important achievement of which is warp travel.

Warpspace may be explained in terms of an endlessly broad and infinitely deep sea of raw energy. This energy carries within it the random thoughts, unfettered emotions, memory fragments and unshakeable beliefs of those who live in the material universe. In this sense it is the collective mind of the universe itself. It would be overly simple to claim that this is all there is to the warp, but the image is a useful mental tool which helps us to understand it.

THE PRINCIPLE OF WARP TRAVEL
A spacecraft drops into the warp by activating its warp engines. As a ship leaves the material universe it enters a corresponding point in warpspace. The ship is then carried along by the tides and currents of the warp.

After travelling in this fashion for an appropriate time, the ship uses its warp engines to drop back into real space. Because the material universe and the warp move relative to each other, the ship reappears in a new position several light years from its starting point. This process is called a jump or hop and the process of entering or leaving warpspace is known as a drop or shift.

Journeys are undertaken in short jumps of up to 4 or 5 light years. Longer jumps are unpredictable and dangerous. The tides of warpspace move in complex and inconsistent patterns and ships attempting longer hops often end up wildly off course.

Were this limitation to apply to all warp travel then humanity would not have spread throughout the galaxy as it has. It is possible to make long jumps of many light years by steering a ship within the warp itself - sensing, responding to and exploiting its currents and thereby directing the craft towards a corresponding point in the material universe. Only the strange human mutants known as Navigators can pilot a craft through the warp in this way.

Some people are sensitive to the movements of warpspace. They can, for example, sometimes tell that a spacecraft is approaching even before it drops back into the material universe. This human sensitivity to the warp is not generally well developed. However, in a minority of people this sensitivity is far more finely tuned. These people are known as psykers and they are able to consciously control and use the energy of the warp to affect the material universe. Navigators are powerful psykers of a specialised kind who can use their powers to steer spacecraft in the warp.

WARP NAVIGATION
Once a spacecraft activates its warp drives it is plunged into a dimension very different from our universe. It is convenient to imagine warpspace as consisting of a relatively dense, almost liquid, energy which is devoid of stars, light and life as we know it.

Once within warpspace a ship may move by means of its main warp drives, following powerful eddies and currents in the warp, eventually reaching a point in the warp corresponding to a destination in real space. The most difficult aspect of warp travel is that it is impossible to detect the movement of warpspace once a ship is in the warp. The ship can only blindly carry on, its crew trusting that it is going in the right direction. The longer a ship remains in warpspace the greater the chances of encountering some unexpected current that can turn it unknowingly off-course.

Navigation of warpspace can be achieved in two ways: the calculated jump and the piloted jump.

All warp-drives incorporate navigational mechanisms. When the ship is in real space, these monitor the ever shifting movements of the part of the warp corresponding to the ship's current position. By observing these movements in the warp it is possible to calculate a course, corrective manoeuvres, and approximate journey time to a proposed destination. Calculation relies on the assumption that the warp-currents observed from real space don't change significantly during flight. This method is known as a calculated jump. It is not safe to make a calculated jump of more than four or five light years at one go. The longer the jump, the greater the chances of a significant change in warp current movement.

The second, and more efficient, form of warp-navigation is the piloted jump. This method relies upon two factors: the human mutants known as Navigators and the psychic beacon called the Astronomican. The Astronomican is centred on Earth and is not only controlled by, but is directed by, the psychic power of the Emperor himself. The Astronomican is a beacon that, because it is psychic, penetrates into warpspace. A Navigator on hoard a ship in the warp is able to pick up these signals and can steer a spaceship through warpspace, compensating for current changes as he does so. A piloted jump can safely cover a far greater distance than a calculated jump. 5,000 light years would he the normal maximum jump, but longer jumps have been made.

That should explain some of the details of how humans traverse the warp. Tau ships only skim the warp and this is done by only going so 'deep' into the warp. If you were to think of a sea then a Tau ship could comfortably navigate a few tens of metres from the surface before surfacing and then diving again, hopping through the warp where the currents are mild and warp entities are few. Human ships on the other hand dive far deeper into the Warp, allowing for longer, faster trips but they are also more likely to encounter warp storms and daemons.

**Zio**

metallifan wrote:
Zio wrote:Actually, chaos marines do not use navigaters. They just take "blind" hops and when they find an imperial world, they have at 'er. They're guided by "fate" (ie; luck and any derranged god that happens to smile on them... maybe).

Which is strange, because I remember in (I think it was) Lord of the Night, a Chaos Battle Barge was covered in detail, and it was said that a Daemon Navigator was fused with his seat on the Bridge.

That was an unusual case. If the black crusades could be easily steered, I'm sure by the 13th, one of them would have just rushed straight for Terra. It's not like Abaddon doesn't know where the Emprah's chillin'...

**Shelegelah**

Strange that Chaos fleets don't have navigators, considering that the Chaos Codex states that Possessed are often used for navigation.

**4M2A**

Gogsnik I think your very close with the idea about tau. The only part which i think is a bit off is that the boundaries between real space and the warp arn't a distinct line in a specific point like the water and air. It's almost impossible for any one to understand just because there arent any examples.

I always thought that to get to the warp you travel in a direction in its own dimension and if this brings you into the warp. I guess that the tau just don't travel so far in this direction. I think that they just fly on the line between the two dimensions.

I only get this idea from the fact that the warp is a different dimension so you can't view it as a distict line in 3d dimension terms.

I hope every is as confused after reading this as I was after I wrote it.

(As you can see I have too much time on my hands so waste it trying to apply scientific ideas to a fantasy setting)

**Zio**

There's nothing wrong with reinforcing anything that assists in the "suspension of disbelief". It makes the world believable and thus, allows us to get into it.
Especially when we can have an entire discussion of the physical properties of an alternate dimension of space poulate by daemons and literally made of thoughts & feelings. =)

**Gogsnik**

I only use the reference to the ocean as an aide to demonstrate how the warp becomes more, err, 'warpy' the 'deeper' in you go. By that I mean, the closer to the warp/realspace boundary the more calm and stable the warp is but then the laws of physics are also less warped so travel is slower.

Whilst entering the warp is always shown (in the various comics and video games et cetera) as a rift that a ship flies strait into I see it a little differently. This is a short story I wrote ages ago to demonstrate one possible way it could happen:

With a rustle of interference a klaxon began its intermittent wail. Illumination was extinguished and darkness engulfed the ship before red emergency lighting flared into being lending the ship an infernal glow.

Work crews gripped tight onto greasy hand rails, gang-masters strapped themselves into threadbare harness-couches, officers stood in their padded alcoves and the mass of humanity trapped within the brig simply clung to one another.

With a vicious hiss of static a vapid servitor's voice came in over the ship-wide comm. The tinny voice was flat and dispassionate, a contrast to the palpable atmosphere.

++Warpspace Translation in "T" minus ten seconds++

With a crackle of energy the ancient turbines that powered the Warp Engines began to cycle up to speed. Inscribed copper bundles hundreds of feet high span with increasing speed until they were nothing more than a shimmering, golden haze.

++Warpspace Translation in "T" minus nine seconds++

Great brass hoses lead from the turbines and each one squirmed with barely contained power. The foetid water that gathered about them flashed into steam and the energies they transported began to charge the Warp Engines.

"Warpspace Translation in "T" minus eight seconds."

Sounds became muffled as the air grew thick. Some crew dropped dead as blood vessels burst in their brains. Blood spurted from noses and even the mindless servitor ratings whimpered and lowed with expectancy.

++Warpspace Translation in "T" minus seven seconds++

The turbines span to a halt. Every light dimmed for a fraction of a second until the Warp Engines roared into life with the nascent scream of a god.

++Warpspace Translation in "T" minus six seconds++

Streams of languid lightning wracked the hull like clawed fingers stretching the very fabric of the vessel until it looked like a watery reflection. In the mighty brig of the ship the living cargo wailed with absolute horror.

++Warpspace Translation in "T" minus five seconds++

Had the desolate Void of space made itself a home for sound, one would have heard an almighty tear as the Gellar Field erupted into existence wrapping the ship in a writhing cocoon of protection.

++Warpspace Translation in "T" minus four seconds++

The ship glowed with a dazzling brilliance as the Warp Engines began to rip through the fabric of reality. The whole ship shook as it juddered forward in its struggle to break through the boundaries of creation.

++Warpspace Translation in "T" minus three,++ The crew closed their eyes tight, hoping against hope. ++Two,++ The ship bobbed as a cascade of lambent energy pooled beneath it. ++One.++ With screams of primal terror the cargo waited for oblivion as the mighty vessel plunged into the Empyrean like a stone into water. Surely death now would be more merciful than the fate awaiting them?

Silence. The last few moments of thought of a drowning man before darkness engulfs him.

++Warp Translation completed++

The Astra Telepathica Black Ship ploughed through the Aethyr its destination the most sacred world within the vast Imperium; Terra, birthplace of Mankind and the bloody altar for untold billions.

In terms of Chaos ships sometimes they are able to capture Navigators and through various means are able to use them to steer their craft through the warp. Others use bound daemons, which logically makes a great deal of sense, although daemons are not known for being particularly co-operative. There are also those whose piloted of captained by Chaos blessed Psykers who are able to navigate and yet more who simply sail through the warp and trust to the will of the gods to steer them right.

**tigonesskay**

lordrevege wrote:

IV: Warp travel is -far- from ideal. It is fairly consistent, however there are cases where an army may arrive several tens, hundreds, or thousands of years before or after a war that they were shipping off to fight even begins, or has long since ended. They could make planetfall only to find themselves five hundred years in the past and everything is fine. Or they could exit the warp into the planet's local space and it has been enemy occupied for thousands of years and the fleet is completely destroyed by the enemy defenses.

There is also the possibility of the ship becoming stuck in the warp and having it's Gellar Field fail, resulting in Warp Entities swarming the ship and slaughtering the crew before the ship is released back into real space. While these incidents aren't common, they occur enough for the Warp to be considered quite dangerous and anything but ideal. The only reason it's used is because it's the only form of FTL travel for most races. For these reasons, most Captains make short "hops" instead of a streamlined journey.

Is there a limit of how far back or forward a ship can travel what if a ship get's suck serveral millinia in the past even to the time of the HH? I'm surpised that space time continuium isn't screwed.

In the World Bearers book dark apostle it says that their ship don't have a need for a Gellar field because they embrance the entities from the wrap. So some followers of choas might be more resistant to the negitive effects of the warp than others.

**metallifan**

tigonesskay wrote:
Is there a limit of how far back or forward a ship can travel what if a ship get's suck serveral millinia in the past even to the time of the HH? I'm surpised that space time continuium isn't screwed.
In the World Bearers book dark apostle it says that their ship don't have a need for a Gellar field because they embrance the entities from the wrap. So some followers of choas might be more resistant to the negitive effects of the warp than others.

There doesn't seem to be any limit, but if you end up in an era before the Imperium's existance, you're screwed thanks to no Astronomican.

And the WORD Bearers probably have knowledge enough of Daemonic Power to semi-control the entities and keep them from attacking.

**Emperors Faithful**

metallifan wrote:
warpcrafter wrote:I've never heard of the Niccassar. Are they one of the races that the Tau have assimilated into their empire?

Yep. Squid people. With enormous psychic power

Squid People?
Psychic Power?!?

**lordrevege**

DAEMONS
DAEMONS
DAEMONS
not deamons. okay. good.

**Pyriel-**

The bit that is missing though is where the heck are the "good" and positive feelings represented in the warp?
Hate and decay have their own gods so where are the opposite ones being represented?
Is this what the emperor stands for and draws power from?

The theory that a chaos power embodies both good and bad "feelings" equally is flawed. Otherwise a world that fell to a chaos power would be a balnanced thing with equal measures of negative and positive aspects of emotions but this is not the case.

**metallifan**

Pyriel- wrote:The bit that is missing though is where the heck are the "good" and positive feelings represented in the warp?
Hate and decay have their own gods so where are the opposite ones being represented?
Is this what the emperor stands for and draws power from?

The theory that a chaos power embodies both good and bad "feelings" equally is flawed. Otherwise a world that fell to a chaos power would be a balnanced thing with equal measures of negative and positive aspects of emotions but this is not the case.

Good doesn't exist because it isn't grimdark enough. In the super-oppressive hatefilled grimdarkness of Spacemarinehammer40K, there is only Sad Panda.

**Lexx**

Good and Evil are subjective terms. One man can do what the galaxy can call abhorrent and evil in the name of good and righteousness. Or be led astray due to lies without even knowing it till its too late. And the tau as far as I know do have a presence in the warp but its barely a flicker compared to the other races. Meaning they have a far far lesser chance of daemons having a go at possessing them. Though we don't know the full extent of the ethereal's power or source of it. So they might be entirely a different story.

On the subject of other warp entities. Ill restate what I thought on this in another thread. I think the other gods (celestial as i called them ) are too wrapped up in whatever they're doing in the warp to get involved with the mortal realm. Or they believe a being has to earn their respect and show themselves worthy before they even decide to get involved or help them in any way. Not wanting to be manipulative like the chaos gods can be as then they'd be no different to them. Plus very rarely they might see an exceptional individual who is selfless, righteous and strong enough in mind and body they deem worth their attention. Seeking not power for its own sake but to make a real difference in the universe. Such as the saint sabbat in the sabbat world crusade or the powers of the sisters of battle or even the grey knights.

**Morgrim**

That's an interesting point: where do some of these Imperial Saints get their gifts from? It seems either a supportive part of the warp, or the Emperor's warp presence itself.

**Gogsnik**

Pyriel- wrote:The theory that a chaos power embodies both good and bad "feelings" equally is flawed. Otherwise a world that fell to a chaos power would be a balnanced thing with equal measures of negative and positive aspects of emotions but this is not the case.

The Chaos Gods do represent both 'good' and 'bad' feelings as you put it and no, it does mean they are balanced, the key word here is Chaos. The warp is made of pure emotion and the the Chaos Gods as embodiments of emotions take everything to an extreme. For instance, love, which perverted and exaggerated becomes an all comsuming lust, obsessive and destructive. In this sense love, lust, passion, affection et cetera are all the same emotion just at different extremes or levels if you will, ordinary feelings turned up to eleven.

This is why Chaos is such an insidious foe, it turns normal, honest and good desires into things truly abominable. Since Chaos also contains 'good' feelings it uses these to attract followers. A healer may be seduced by Nurgle, the promise of immunity to disease drawing them in but over time these good intentions are sublimated into something terrible until eventually a healer becomes the disease he wished to eradicate, et cetera et cetera.

**aka_tizz**

Lexx wrote:Good and Evil are subjective terms. One man can do what the galaxy can call abhorrent and evil in the name of good and righteousness. Or be led astray due to lies without even knowing it till its too late. And the tau as far as I know do have a presence in the warp but its barely a flicker compared to the other races. Meaning they have a far far lesser chance of daemons having a go at possessing them. Though we don't know the full extent of the ethereal's power or source of it. So they might be entirely a different story.

On the subject of other warp entities. Ill restate what I thought on this in another thread. I think the other gods (celestial as i called them ) are too wrapped up in whatever they're doing in the warp to get involved with the mortal realm. Or they believe a being has to earn their respect and show themselves worthy before they even decide to get involved or help them in any way. Not wanting to be manipulative like the chaos gods can be as then they'd be no different to them. Plus very rarely they might see an exceptional individual who is selfless, righteous and strong enough in mind and body they deem worth their attention. Seeking not power for its own sake but to make a real difference in the universe. Such as the saint sabbat in the sabbat world crusade or the powers of the sisters of battle or even the grey knights.

Looks like you've watching Stargate lately, this is just like the Ori and Ancients conflict

**MOMUS**

'Good and Evil are subjective terms. One man can do what the galaxy can call abhorrent and evil in the name of good and righteousness.'

well that depends on what philsosophy you prescribe to, like this 'man' you give as an example, his actions are a means to an end which kant would have a few things to say about!
i could argue that 'right and wrong' are inbuilt in all humans, as raping your family then splitting them open and using their insides to decorate your house/flat/hut is considered evil in most cultures and societies no matter where you are in the world.

anyways
chaos fleets do NOT make blind jumps they can navigate very well
they choose what planets to attack and can set up traps or amushes with their ships also they can hide in the warp for ages to avoid detection
a few ways they do this:
chaos navigators
chaos sorcerers
cadres of posessed
bound daemons