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This is the first draft of my first attempt at Tau. Any input greatly appreciated.

BS5 HQ with missiles/plasma, 2 shield drones

2 bodyguards, missile/plasma, 2 shield drones

2 Elites suits, missile/plasma, 2 shield drones

2X4 stealth suits

2X12 fire warriors in devilfish with decoy launchers

8 pathfinders in devilfish with decoy launchers

3 railheads with decoy launchers, SMS, multitrackers, target lock.

So it's 5 suits, 8 stealth, 24 firewarriors, 8 pathfinders, 3 devilfish and 3 railheads.

Is that workable for a start? What nifty custom wargear should I be considering (I've got a few points left).

Classic Mech Tau but taking advantage of the new Markerlight rules.

>>BS5 HQ with missiles/plasma, 2 shield drones
Are this chap's missiles twin-linked? Because he doesn't need them with BS5. If you take away his bodyguard he becomes an independent character and may not need the shield drones. You could move the bodyguards down to the Elites section, or maybe put one down there and keep the other as a Shas'el commander (I don't have my codex to hand and can't rememebr the points.)

Any spare points could usefully be spent on targetting arrays for the crisis suits, and seeker missiles.

I'm actually thinking of dropping the pathfinders all together and just getting more suits.

hi,

i´m a longtime lurker , so i spend my first post to give some advice to the famous mauleed !!!

-i would take 6er stealth units, so any markerlight gets a bigger boom, and the so needed torrent of fire becomes more "reliable" 

-then, the only reasons for bodyguards (imo) are, more crisis if you have 3elite allready and bf4 fireknifes (82pts each)

-when ever possible, take 2 shas´els !!!

-im not a fan of the sms+target lock on the hammerheads, but thats just a personel taste

-my guess on the pathfinders is, you will drop them realy soon

greetings Badger

my current 1850 list consists of

2 fireknife shas´els (one with c&cn)

2x6 stealth

1x3 fireknife

2x10 firewarrior

2x10 kroot

3x piranha (fusion,target array) [to give some tankhunting,char killing that is lost with the 3rd railhead]

2x railheads

3xsniperdroneteams (there are my markerlights and some n1ce marinekilling [ 21 in 6 rounds if my calculations are correct ])

----

a real good list vs most opponents but with some big problems vs. droppods/fear and pimped up chars. (2+save rune/mantle on bike...)

your list is a little less "fear weak" (like most mech), so give it a try!

greetings Badger

Actually I just realised your elite slots are nearly full.

You could drop the pathfinders, add another commander, and the rest of the points into more Stealth suits.

It's a tough call.

I think the list is really balanced across what the army has available to it and, as was said before, classic mech tau.

I'm not sure how much value you'll get out of the pathfinders in this list. So far I've found pathfinders work very well with fireknife teams of three. No tricks or extra wargear, just a stock 3 man team relying on JSJ to survive. Getting them up to BS5 means they really can put the hurt on whatever you're shooting at.

The problem with the pathfinders in your list, I think, is that you're not getting a lot of bang for your buck with the units that rely on them. Take the 2 man elite team. It would simply be better if they had a third man. Your HQ has 2 extra men, but your HQ is already BS5, so he doesn't benefit at all. (By the way, is he a Shas'O, or a Shas'El with a target array? There's two ways to get BS5 for the HQ.)

I think the first thing I would do is drop both the bodyguards out of the HQ slot and shift one to the elite team. Then buy another cheap Shas'El, also running alone. There's a number of good configs for the Shas'El that run around 100 points. Cyclic/plasma/Target Array with HWMT is one such option. (Take a hard look at the cyclic. It's actually one of the more powerful MeQ killers in the new list.)

I'm not a big fan of FoF style tactics. I don't know what your plans for your firewarriors are, but I think you might get more mileage out of the army if you made them into smaller teams and then used the extra points to put SMS on your devilfish.

Also, one unit of 10 kroot really serve as a great throwaway infiltration unit/speedbump.

Ezz

And thats about the only thing that kroot are good for... throwing away...

List looks ok although ive heard some people say that the shield drone isnt worth it but Ive yet to play a game under the new codex so just take that for what it is... How many points do you have left? Those marker drones look interesting as do the Failsafe detonators on Shas'vre Bodyguard to try and save the Shas'o/el.

I see you having trouble against Nid lists with 3 or more big bugs since those Carnies can have t7 which makes plasma a bit difficult to use to bring them down, but then again the RailHeads can try and take him out before he become to great of a threat.

As of the new codex im considering using broadsides, they just seem more useful now for some reason with being able to have S&P and drones actually helping the,

Piranahs might be cool as well with fusion blaster... dont really know at the moment.

oh, i am assuming most of your suits have the multi-tracker so they can fire both the plasma and missle in the same turn, if not thats deff. a place to spend some points.

And thats about the only thing that kroot are good for... throwing away...

Actually, point for point, Kroot are more effective shooters than firewarriors. And I'd hardly call infiltrate a bad thing.

Plus now they can become a decent heavy weapons unit in a troops slot. Put them in cover and no one will want to assault a unit with 10 kroot, a shaper and 3 kroot ox riders.

The problem is that most people think kroot are there to give the tau some close combat teeth. Tau don't have close combat teeth. Kroot are just there to give them a cheap troop choice.

Ezz

If you're gonna run any shield drones you should be running the max, imho.

Taking one shield drone on a squad of 2 guys makes you infinitely harder to JSJ behind things. Same reason squads of 3 generally are harder to play than squads of 2. So, reasoning there is that if you are going to expose yourself to any fire you should use as many T4 3+/4+ extra wounds as possible. If I'm misreading your list and you have that already then ignore this. But consider more suits.

Your elite suits are better off with TLPR or TLMP, because they can't have multitrackers with drone controllers unless they take hardwired stuff (only team leaders/etc).

Shas'o is a better option than the 'el in my opinion. It's just not that much more expensive and hitting on 2's is a huge jump over 3s.

Pathfinders seem like, with the new markerlight stuff, they could be great. In my normal army I'm considering 3 x 6 pathfinders with SMS fish and then only one mounted FCW fish.

I do not think in this edition I will be bothering with stealth suits anymore. I never have any shortage of S5AP5 firepower, ever - devilfish, fire warriors, hammerheads with submunitions/sms, and so on. There has never in my entire career using stealth suits been a time I wouldn't rather have had more crisis suits, and never a time where I wished I had taken more stealths. vs. the things they kill well, they are superfluous because I can drop pie plates all over them. vs. marines i'd rather have 24" engaging crisis suits.

@longshot

Shas'o is a better option than the 'el in my opinion. It's just not that much more expensive and hitting on 2's is a huge jump over 3s.

el->0 +25p

el->el with target array +10p

so, you spend 15points more for +1ld and a useless wound, sry not my style!

greetings Badger

Thanks for the input fellas.

One of the requirements of the list is that it be able to deal with podders. That's why I haven't included broadsides, kroot, or sniper drones.

Though I'm considering using a TON of kroot, and using them to build a >12" buffer zone as my defense against pods, and see how that works. But right now I think I'd prefer to try the mechanized style.

kroot swarm is good, it works on pods and against seer council too as you can out-tarpit them for the pts

wouldn't bother with it most of the time though as they NEED terrain, i prefer to just pill box them, or hide on objectives.

first rules of list building: always 2 HQ's, solo. always 3 railheads, tricked out. min troops. max elites. all crisis as fireknife.
u need good reasons to deviate from those, but its not bad if you know what ur doing.

see my list for 1500 in here:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/Default.aspx?tabid=93&forumid=18&postid=53626&view=topic

i'd maybe add markerlights at bigger games, but all the places that can carry markers are awful.

most of the new toys are a bit junk, they're good but generally really limited in application.

Hey, Ed.

If there's one thing I'd encourage you to re-consider, it would be the broadsides.

A unit of two broadsides with stabilizers, team leader, and two shield drones clocks in right around 200 points. Now, I'm not the best at maths, but the way I figure it is that if a unit of terminators drops in to fire on the broadsides they should lose 1-2 drones and not even touch the suits themselves. A unit of ten marines traited to have two plasma guns will get similar results. The shield drones make this unit dead hard. As a matter of fact, if there's one unit I'd want drop pod marines to shoot, it would be this one.

You do lose out on a large blast template and some mobility, I'll grant that. But I can also tell you that twin-linked rails have saved my behind on a number of occassions.

If you want to go with pure mech, then obviously this might not work for you. But for any other purpose, I think the broadside unit is a good choice.

Ezz

And that 200 point broadside unit fires once, if it wasn't just feared off the board, and then is eaten in hth. There's no way to make broadsides work against podders.

Here's the rework of the list:

Shas'el, targeting array, multi-tracker, 2 shield drones, plasma rifle, ion blaster

Shas'el, targeting array, multi-tracker, 2 shield drones, plasma rifle, missile pod (though I'm considering swapping in the airbursting fragmentation projector).

2X3 Crissis suits, all with missilepods/plasma rifle/mutlitracker, leader with 2 shield drones and a bonding knife

6 stealth suits

2X10 firewarriors in a devilfish with SMS and decoy launchers (considering dropping a fire warrior from each to get a targeting array on the devilfish)

3 hammerheads with railgun, SMS, Multitracker, target lock, decoy launchers (two have blacksun filters as well).

 

 

 

Here's the rework of the list:

Shas'el, targeting array, multi-tracker, 2 shield drones, plasma rifle, ion blaster

Shas'el, targeting array, multi-tracker, 2 shield drones, plasma rifle, missile pod (though I'm considering swapping in the airbursting fragmentation projector).

2X3 Crissis suits, all with missilepods/plasma rifle/mutlitracker, leader with 2 shield drones and a bonding knife

6 stealth suits

2X10 firewarriors in a devilfish with SMS and decoy launchers (considering dropping a fire warrior from each to get a targeting array on the devilfish)

3 hammerheads with railgun, SMS, Multitracker, target lock, decoy launchers (two have blacksun filters as well).

So it's 8 crissis

 

 

Solid. I'd play that at 1500 for sure.

Your point about fear is well taken, but it's not as if the broadside have to start at the edge of the board with stabilizers, either.  Moreover, they won't be falling back very fats because of Slow and Purposeful.  As for hth, what doesn't get eaten in hand to hand in a Tau list?  Broadsides with shields still have the best chance of any non-vehicle unit.

Let me ask you this. If you were dropping against your own tau list, what would be your primary targets? If you played against your Tau list and someone had swapped out one of the hammerheads for a 2 man broadside unit with shield drones, would you go after it?

Ezz

Having played taua bit, I've never been impressed with plasma/missle pod configuration. I've been always running plasma fusion blaster myself. Kills powerarmor dead.

If it's fear you worry about, and rightly so, wouldn't the librarian just fear away the crisis suits? I am not sure what to do against fear. I have started a tau army also and many people have told me there is nothing to do except lose to fear, but I don't want to hear that.

In the end the only sure fire way to stop fear is to mount everything. Suits at a minimum and maybe attached to an ethereal until the librarian comes down. Castling with kroot would be the other option and it might work best, except it is not a universal tactic and is dictated by the scenario objectives.

What to do, what to do...........

Fearing crisis suits is not that bad if they are forward enough. They flee once, rally, and then dakka the crap out of things. It sucks, but it's not that crippling. They need to fail to rally twice to get really screwed.

Ed, your latest list is my list, once I fixed up the points.

As for crisis, I think there is an argument to be made for 2 man teams vs 3 man teams.  As for missile vs plasma...I think the critical factor is range. 

Quick question: how many points is this supposed to be?

If the army is designed to fight a Droppod Army, the Hammerhead is better than Broadsides. However with the new Move'n'Shoot they are quite nice and Podding Termis can cripple your vehicles quite easily. IMHO only against Fear the HH is superior against 2 broadsides with 2 Shielddrones.

The 'El should rely on their IC status and don't need shield drones. Do you like the new weapons? I think, the PR/MP Kombo is the best layout due to range and punch. IMHO the new weapons lack one of these requirements.

yea, shield drones on solo HQ's is terrible, it makes them a unit and gets them shot, rather than them not getting shot at all. against drop pods, hide them. infact, deepstrike all ur suits against pods, the only chance you have is to not be there when the pods fall.

i dont like the CIB, do you have any particular reason for using it?

 

consider disruption pods on the tanks as well. it will help if you don't get first turn, or if your tank gets stunned and can't move, it helps the tank not get penned in the next turn.

Against penetrating shooting from more than 12" away, the Disruption Pods will prevent the tank getting killed or immobilised, 2 in 9 times, or 22% of the time, or 1 and 1 third times out of 6

If the tank is worth 180 pts, for Disruption Pods to be a good buy, you'd only have to use it once in 8 games. i think its worth it.

 

just knocked this up for 1850. its quite balanced although low comp, its balance is more in terms of being flexible, units working in synergy with varied capabilityies. challenging though. i'd enjoy playing it if we used 1850

124 - shas'o plasma fusion stims vectors MT
97 - shas'el FK5

221 - 3 fireknife 2 shield drone
180 - 6 stealth
106 - 2 deathrain bs4

70 - 10 kroot
70 - 10 kroot
80 - 6 firewarrior with markerlight'ui
80 - 6 firewarrior with markerlight'ui

212 - 6 pathfinders with 'ui and SMS MT, DL, TA fish with seeker
80 - piranha, BS4 fusion, seeker

185 - Hammerhead, Railgun, SMS, MT, DL, TL, DP
195 - 2 Broadsides, ASS, 2 shield drones
150 - Skyray, MT, DL, TA, DP

To deal with podders, the tactic is to deploy your suits along the short board edge, moving up as far as possible. You then use the tanks to block off the 12" that podders would need to drop into to fear them. Now at least you've got a gunfight on your hands and have a chance.

Obviously it gets trickier if the librarian doesn't come in on turn 2, or it there's more than 1, but this certainly will save you at least one round of it.

What's funny, now that I think about it, is that this list I've made uses none of the new toys handed out in the new codex. That makes me rather pessimistic about it's possibilities.

That's an interesting approach you've got for dealing with with, Mauleed. Doesn't help on escalation, of course, but depending on how things go, you could decide how best to have your suits enter in that situation.

I, too, have to voice concerns over the shield drones on the commanders. Now that shield drones work (assuming you think they do now, see YMDC), I can see the appeal to take a bodyguard suit and some shield drones to get another scoring unit on the table. If you aren't taking the bodyguard, though, I think the shas'el should trust more to his IC status for protection.

Maybe something like this to rearrange your HQ/elites:

Shas'el, targeting array, multi-tracker, 2 shield drones, plasma rifle, ion blaster
Bodyguard fireknife

Shas'el, targeting array, multi-tracker, 2 shield drones, plasma rifle, missile pod (though I'm considering swapping in the airbursting fragmentation projector).
Bodyguard fireknife

2X2 Crissis suits, all with missilepods/plasma rifle/mutlitracker, leader with 2 shield drones

6 stealth suits

Switching the third suit from each crisis team to bodyguard status gives you two more scoring units. You're already considering drones for the shas'el (which probably remove IC status), so might as well get the benefit of scoring status. You can make up for the extra cost by removing bonding from the crisis squads, as they'll be at 4 models now, so the only time the bonding knife would come into play is if you had a single suit left, and he'll be taking AOYO tests every turn anyway.

I'm surprised you don't think sniper drone squads would help much. I think they have the potential to be a great unit. Dropping a hammerhead and two stealth suits get you three full squads of them. 9 railrifles, 3 BS4 markerlights, target locks to split fire, pinning and stealth fields? 2 Hammerheadheads and 2 devilfish should still be enough to create your buffer/wall against FOTD. I usually run a suit or two (HQs usually) with TL plasma/fusion/TA/HW MT, so I can deepstrike them to assist in taking out troublesome armor from the rear. Suicide mission usually, but the 97 point suit reliable takes out much more expensive armor, letting my hammerheads submunition other threats. The markerlights could help get more milage out of your crisis teams, especially if they get in rapid-fire range.

Just some thoughts. With the ned 'dex out, there are some new possibilities to explore yet.

Dropping a FW to upgrade the devilfish sounds like a good move. 7 shots from BS 3 to 4 for 10 points? Sounds like a decent deal. My only concern is there are lots of good things to add to the devilfish, but you end up with a 125 point non-scoring vehicle. You can get a ion-cannon hammerhead for 10 more points (just a different force org slot)! You could get 4 piranhas for the price of those two devilfish (although I don't know if that would be the best move...).

Mauleed, just a comment on the drop pods thing, and it really doesn't have anything to do with this list, but more with your idea of using static tau to create the dead zone. I've figured it takes 12 kroot to make a 12x12 area un-dropable if the drop pods are 3x3 in size, if 4x4, it takes a little less, around 10 average. 4 units of 12 kroot would give you a 12x24 size area to deploy the rest of your army in.

Let us know how it plays against the Droppers. If Tau can't beat them, they will never be competitve, especially after having gone to Adepticon and seeing them there.