Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I am new to Warmachine, like infant new. I have a few models, but have never played and never made a list. Can I use all ranged models and still be able to win a game? What i'm looking at is a Cygnar list with Tempest Gun Mages, Long Gunners, a Journeyman Warcaster, Feild Mechaniks, a Cyclone heavy, and a Sentinel light. I am using Captain Victoria Haley, I like the model, background/story line, and the rules of her. Is this feasible against an army that has close combat minitures, or should I include a CC squad? I'm starting with a 25pt game with the extra 5 from Haley.

Also, are the Cyclone Warjacks good? I like it because it has the two open fists along with a good looking (stat wise) range weapons. I also want to add in a Hunter light and a Firefly light someday (like the Hunters ability and love the Firefly, weapons and looks).

Thanks!!

You can certainly focus on ranged but you'll almost never be able to finish a game completely with ranged attacks.

Melee is also the only real way to deal with heavy armor, especially Jacks and Beasts. Shooting is fine for dealing with infantry.

I would swap the cyclone out for a different heavy that isn't pillowfisted in melee. An Ironclad is cheap and hits like a ton of bricks.

Hunters are the biggest anti-armor ranged threat you can get, and it is impressive, but there are a few things that can defeat it easily and could make your whole shooting strategy drop dead. Menoth for example can make all their jacks immune to non-magical shooting. So there is a serious danger in running a pure shooty list.

Combined arms is the best way to approach this game.

Do I have to use the Theme Forces in the Forces of Cygnar book, or can I mix it up and take what I want. If have to use a themed force, I can only use ranged Warjacks, plus the Lancer and Thorn Jacks. If I can mix it up, I like the Stormguard a lot and that would help me with the up close part of it. Plus it would let me take the Ironclad, which looks pretty good.

It is one or the other. Either you take a theme list which is a trade off (you give up the ability to field certain units/models in exchange for the tier benefits) or just field a "normal" list. The rules for making a "normal" list are in the main rulebook.

As far as fielding only ranged units, I wouldn't suggest it too much mainly because melee combat is very important in warmachine and cygnar does have rather good melee options to choose from. You can opt to field primarily range models but even then running some short of frontline style unit to jam and buy your ranged models more time to shoot and contest zones/flags would be a very good idea.

Ruberu wrote:I am new to Warmachine, like infant new. I have a few models, but have never played and never made a list. Can I use all ranged models and still be able to win a game? What i'm looking at is a Cygnar list with Tempest Gun Mages, Long Gunners, a Journeyman Warcaster, Feild Mechaniks, a Cyclone heavy, and a Sentinel light. I am using Captain Victoria Haley, I like the model, background/story line, and the rules of her. Is this feasible against an army that has close combat minitures, or should I include a CC squad? I'm starting with a 25pt game with the extra 5 from Haley.

Also, are the Cyclone Warjacks good? I like it because it has the two open fists along with a good looking (stat wise) range weapons. I also want to add in a Hunter light and a Firefly light someday (like the Hunters ability and love the Firefly, weapons and looks).

Thanks!!

First up, welcome to the iron kingdoms. Don't forget to pick up your complimentary goggles and ol rowdy plushy.

Second, you've got a nice spread of models there - it's a good start. Especially Haley. That girls nasty! Regarding your query, can you use all ranged models? I'd argue no. Don't get me wrong, having a good sized ranged chunk in your army is a great thing, but this isn't 40k and tau. You can't just 'gun line and win'. Scenarios force a very aggressive game where you gave to get up close and engage. And I think you are looking at this (ranged versus cc squad) very much like a 40k game. Don't. Reassess. Ranged is good. Ranged is vital. I play khador and circkr and never leave home without widowmakers, and love my winter guard riflemen with kovnik joe. ranged is great for the initial alpha strike, and picking off infantry at range. But look at the range of your guns. 10 to 14 inches. I can 'run to engage' with my pikemen or doom reavers from 14" away. Which means you get one turn of shooting before I've got you engaged with hard hitting melee units. Other issues are stealth, where ranged attacks auto-miss outside of 5". Third issue is big damage comes through melee, rather than ranged attacks. Now in all these cases there are ways and means around - everything can be countered in this game. Control/ Denial feats and Haley's damned temporal barrier spell will help. There are models that ignore stealth. But a good tarpit (eg boom howlers or sword knights) will go a long way to helping you out and play a more complete game, by letting you jam and tarpit stuff.

Ruberu wrote:Do I have to use the Theme Forces in the Forces of Cygnar book, or can I mix it up and take what I want. If have to use a themed force, I can only use ranged Warjacks, plus the Lancer and Thorn Jacks. If I can mix it up, I like the Stormguard a lot and that would help me with the up close part of it. Plus it would let me take the Ironclad, which looks pretty good.

You don't have to use a theme force. Think of them as being like the old farsight enclave rules. You suffer a bunch of restrictions, but you get some alternative advantages instead. Or you can play regular tau with the 'proper' codex. Same with theme lists. They represent a force associated with that caster in the fluff during a particular event, but that's about it. They're no more, or less 'fluffy' than picking a list from the regular roster.

Hope that helps.

Wow, thanks for all the help guys! I kinda figured a range army would not do too good, I've played Tau (good comparison Deadnight) and IG for way too long and am having a hard time shaking it. Thanks for letting me know about a standard list as well. I kinda figured I could just do a simple list, but have not gotten that far in the rule book yet. It will help me get some of the other units I wanted in there.

Its hard for me to get good solid support starting Warmachine in my area because not too many people play it here. looking at maybe 15 in my city and the cities surrounding! The help from good ol Dakka is much appreciated. Thanks again.

Well as soon as you start, it will be 16!

You can do an all ranged list, but I wouldn't. Scenarios would be nearly impossible so you'd have to go for the assassination each time. Combined arms, balanced lists are more effective. an all shooting list means it is a "skew" list. They tend to do really well or really bad. And once people figure out your skew you will lose.

My recommendation is find a caster you want and then research them to find out what kind of units and warjacks you want to use with them. Check out battlecollege and the PP faction boards.

Alternatively, if there is a unit you really like research hem and find out what caster likes them and then follow the steps above.

If you are interested in ranged jacks I would get yourself a Defender. Hunters are not bad, especially for Gun mages or Junior. But sometimes are a little overpriced and can have some bad matchups. If you want a melee jack I'd get a stormclad or Ol rowdy.

Again, check out battlecollege and the PP boards as well. As with anything on the internet you will have to sort thru good and bad info, but there is a lot of good out there if you do.

The only shoting army out of cygnar I can think of is ecain assasination army ,with ecain being the shoty part and everything else being there to clear the lane for an assasination run , buffing his shoting , buffing the dmg on his targets and stoping stuff from killing the gun Meister . Very fun to play with , light on jacks and doesn't require a stormwall and all the units it uses are useful in other cygnar builds .

Keeping the previous notes in mind if you cast snipe on the long gunners or the defender then they have a horrendous range. Some units have the ability to strafe the enemy, moving backwards and picking off things in movement range, but these are unreliable at best

If you get the plastic jack kit try magnetising it so you can use any of the three main jacks on offer

EHaley is scary. Beprepared to make people tear out their hair over her. To learn the rules i would highly recommend running primary haley or stryker, as such irregular casters tend to be less systematic and mean you miss learning rules, although keep in mind she is brilliant and certainly a caster who'll do you well. PHaley is also incredibly good at range vs melee lists too

The thing to keep in mind is that there is two winning conditions: capturing objectives or killing the enemy caster. I can tell you only a couple of casters can kill other casters at range, and they are reliant on heavy melee units too, and objectives are always close to the middle of the board, meaning you will have to walk into melee range to claim them