Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I have reached an impass as to what to do with my command squad. I have probably popped the arms off of these models almost 30 times each, and each time the new combination of weapons for these 5 models and my Castellan become less effective or, at the very best, remain the same. My question for you all is this:

Given what I have to work with (shown below), what changes can I make to my command squad to make them more effective in combat and a less juicy VP target?

Castellan -115 points

Castellan (65) with Power Fist (25), Crusader Seals (free), Storm Shield (10), Terminator Honors (15).

Black Templar Command Squad - 205 points
(5 models, all armed with a Bolt Pistol and CCw at no extra cost.)

46 - Sergeant (16) with Terminator Honors (15), Bolt Pistol, Power Sword (15).

46 - Initiate (16) with Fighting Company Champion Specialist Upgrade (20 : bp, power weap and combat shield come with upgrade), Terminator Honors (10), Bolt Pistol, Power Sword, Combat Shield.

51 - Initiate (16) with Apothecary Specialist Upgrade (15 : Narthecium comes with upgrade), Terminator Honors (10), Narthecium, Plasma Pistol (10).

26 - Initiate (16) with Terminator Honors (10), Bolt Pistol and CCw.

26 - Initiate with identical configuration.
*****************************
Now, for some notes:
The Castellan is not staying that way. Having a Storm shield is a waste, and is going to change the moment I go home this summer. His new config will most likely be the following:

Castellan - 131

Castellan (60) with Power Fist (25), Crusader Seals (free), Bolt Pistol (1), Iron Halo (25), and Terminator Honors (15)

I'm also working on an alternate commander, to be used in tandem with my Castellan and his command squad in larger games, or by himself if I cannot afford to pay 330+ points for an HQ choice. Here he is:

Marshal - 145

Marshal (80) with Power Fist (25), Crusader Seals (free), Space Marine Bike (35), Teleport Homer* (5).

(* I have a 5-man Termie Squad with an Assault Cannon, Cyclone ML and Tank Hunters doctrine.)
**********************
I appreciate any advice given.

CK

Hmm. Well, I haven't used a command squad really up to this point, but I'll share some thoughts with you.

I'm not sure as to the wisdom of using a fist on an independant character, since he can be picked out individually in close combat. You can switch it off, but then you're just using a regular ccw. I'd swap the power sword from the sarge with the fist on the castellan. Also, if you've paying for a castellan, why not hop up to the marshall, as Leadership 10 is huge for an army that makes as many leadership checks as we do.

I'm not sure if you need the apothecary, really, as you've built a close combat unit and his abilities don't work in CC. Matter of fact, I think you've got an aweful lot of victory points sunk into this one unit that frankly isn't much better than the rather large crusade squad you could buy with it instead. Take th epoints for the termi honors and swap them over for more initiates! I'd buy a veteran skill of some kind for them, myself, which since it looks like you want to CC with these guys means it should probably be Furious Charge.

And the marshall on the bike is cute, but unless you've got a bunch of other bikers to go with him, he'll probably just end up out distancing the rest of the army and getting killed.

Thanks for the help. I was considering giving the Castellan a Power Sword, maybe a Master-Crafted one at that, but I think I'm gonna have to wait until the summer when I can run both configurations in some games. Come to think of it, Templar units get to use their commander's Ld so long as he's alive, so I think I will upgrade him to a Marshal.

As for the apothecary thing - I must have completely missed that part of the rules for them. I think I'll keep it though, especially since its saved my squad on a number of occasions. I just wish command squads weren't as inherently expensive as they are. Furious Charge sounds like a good idea. It never really became an issue though with the Terminator Honors, that is when you consider the fact that they usually move in tandem with a Termie Squad, a Sword Brethren Squad, and my Dread. It helps me by giving my opponent so many targets to choose, that he might panic and throw out his firepower across the entire group, allowing my flanker units to deal with his line elsewhere.

The Marshal on the bike has that bike for one reason: He attaches himself to a pair of Attack Bikes, one with a Heavy Bolter, one with a Multi Melta, to provide a mobile firebase while soaking up any wounds that might threaten the Marshal. In h2h, they have proven on more than one occasion to be devastatingly effective.

As for my initiates, they have kinda taken the fall up to this point. I have 4, 5-man squads. 2 squads have 3 bolters, a flamethrower, and a bolt pistol/powersword, while the other two have 4 bolters and a missile launcher. A fairly weak infantry base from which I've built up a very strong elites, fast attack and hq powerhouse. However, this turns my army into a "topheavy" machine, relying on small groups of uber-units to destroy the enemy squad in h2h. If I take more than 30% casualties before my assaulting units close the distance, I'm done for, unless I'm fighting Orks, Tau, or IG.

I plan to make a hefty 10-Initiate, 5-Neophyte h2h squad in the future. I'll let you know how it goes.

CK