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So having learned the basics and liking the game, one of my mates has challenged me to step up. He's a nice bloke but very competitive and a tournament regular, so won't pull punches on his lists: I expect him to run double interceptor (or possibly dash/coran, as he's been muttering about that). This is intimidating but I am prepared to get my backside handed to me as a learning process.
I was thinking of:
HWK-290: · Roark Garnet (19)
Ion Cannon Turret (5)
Y-WING: · Horton Salm (25)
Ion Cannon Turret (5)
X-WING: Red Squadron Pilot (23)
X-WING: Red Squadron Pilot (23)
Y and hwk setting up targets for the XX, in theory. That work?

I have, in addition, XXYAE, 3 TIEs, Defender, Advanced and Slave 1.

Help me dakka Ben kenobi!

Rather than critique list right off the bat, I'm going to give you some tactics advice on how to fight interceptors, as I fly them a lot. I fly corran a bit but despise turret ships and have little experience with them.

Interceptors live and die by the following things, in no particular order

1.Push the limit
2. Actions
3. Dodging your arcs
4.Stealth device/autothrusters
5.Pilot skill
6.stress

If he's running two, one will be soontir fel, guaranteed. The other depends on his preferences. I think carnor jax is the 2nd best personally, but many prefer Turr Phennir with Veteran instincts as well. Either way, they'll be quick, hard to pin down, and pushing the limit. A lot. And unless you have Wedge or something with PS9+, he'll get to react to your movement, and either arc dodge (barrel roll and boosting) evade tanking (evade/focusing) or going for a killshot (usually boost or barrel roll into range 1 and focus) Interceptors can do this practically all game as every 2 they have is green and almost all their straights as well.

To beat this with rebel ships, you have to think like he does, and move accordingly. Stress is a death sentence. If you have ways to double or triple stress interceptors, you can buy yourself a crucial window to pummel that naked interceptor next turn. Also remember, YOU CAN NOT TURN WITH HIM. Even A Wings can't out turn fight an interceptor, as the interceptor hits harder on every pass and will have better actions for arc dodging.

What you can do though, is force head ons. A common trick involves "rolling scissors", where you take two or more ships and weave them back and forth across an area, preferably with asteroids. As your two ships come toward one another, they cover each others rear, forcing the interceptor to evade tank or dodge. This works best against a lone surviving interceptor, but can work against two or more, as long as you have the numbers advantage. Another tactic is to stagger your line of fighters in a "/\" shape. Essentially, you cast a wide net that he can't possibly evade from. Then you just pile dice on, burn off his tokens, and he'll be dead in no time. Remember, even your X wings have almost double the hp he has, head on passes will almost always be in your favor, provided you can keep him from slipping out of your arc.

To get an idea of how to fight it, ask him if you can play a round using his interceptor list. The best way to fight an enemy is learn how he plays. You'll learn very quickly what he can and can't do and will benefit greatly from it.

Thanks, really appreciate that. Lots to think about. I know he's planning some 6 evade soontir-ing!

Best way to beat interceptors: R3-A2 on an A4 ion y-wing. Interceptors without actions are dead, and R3-A2 lets you put multiple stress tokens on them. Once they're multi-stressed and actionless you can kill them with whatever you like. As a nice bonus R3-A2 y-wings are good against pretty much every other list as well.

Second-best way to beat interceptors: bring higher-PS ships that can get through the green dice. Ten Numb with a mangler cannon (and VI + advanced sensors) laughs at interceptors. As long as you roll at least one hit (or eye with a focus token) the mangler cannon turns it into an uncancellable crit. That's 1/3 of Fel's HP gone, the stealth device permanently removed, and potentially a nasty crit effect. And since it's PS 10 Fel can't dodge it very easily. Alternatively, Tycho with PTL/VI/proton rocket is a good interceptor counter. He moves at PS 10 to counter their maneuvering ability, and the proton rocket with focus + TL can kill an interceptor in one shot. The only drawback to this approach is that you risk tailoring your list too much and losing the ability to deal with other potential opponents.

Third-best way to beat interceptors: Corran with PTL + FCS + R2-D2 + engine upgrade. Get the fight down to a 1v1 between Corran and Fel, and then go into turtle mode with focus + evade + R2-D2. Fel can outmaneuver you thanks to his superior PS, but you can counter all of his damage and keep the game going. In a timed tournament match you win if your opponent doesn't get the dice luck required to kill Corran, and even when time isn't a factor you force your opponent to play perfectly to win while one mistake by Fel can end the game.

Tycho is the only one of those builds I can do with my limited resources. Corran / R2D2 / ptl is also doable (though I only own one ptl so couldn't do both) - what's FCS? I can see lots that I *could* do but I have limited stuff. Thanks mate, lots of ideas to thieve!

 Peregrine wrote:
Best way to beat interceptors: R3-A2 on an A4 ion y-wing. Interceptors without actions are dead, and R3-A2 lets you put multiple stress tokens on them. Once they're multi-stressed and actionless you can kill them with whatever you like. As a nice bonus R3-A2 y-wings are good against pretty much every other list as well.

Second-best way to beat interceptors: bring higher-PS ships that can get through the green dice. Ten Numb with a mangler cannon (and VI + advanced sensors) laughs at interceptors. As long as you roll at least one hit (or eye with a focus token) the mangler cannon turns it into an uncancellable crit. That's 1/3 of Fel's HP gone, the stealth device permanently removed, and potentially a nasty crit effect. And since it's PS 10 Fel can't dodge it very easily. Alternatively, Tycho with PTL/VI/proton rocket is a good interceptor counter. He moves at PS 10 to counter their maneuvering ability, and the proton rocket with focus + TL can kill an interceptor in one shot. The only drawback to this approach is that you risk tailoring your list too much and losing the ability to deal with other potential opponents.

Third-best way to beat interceptors: Corran with PTL + FCS + R2-D2 + engine upgrade. Get the fight down to a 1v1 between Corran and Fel, and then go into turtle mode with focus + evade + R2-D2. Fel can outmaneuver you thanks to his superior PS, but you can counter all of his damage and keep the game going. In a timed tournament match you win if your opponent doesn't get the dice luck required to kill Corran, and even when time isn't a factor you force your opponent to play perfectly to win while one mistake by Fel can end the game.

Echoing Peregrine too, these are all good hard counters to interceptors that are still useful against other lists too.

As for making a list, keep in mind that you shouldn't build your list solely to kill interceptors. You should keep in mind that it's perfectly perfectly possible this guy is bringing some sort of typical 2 ship build with a tanky turret ship and an ace such as soontir or corran. It's perfectly possible too that he could throw a swarm at you as well. They may not be near as prevelant as they were in the pre phantom days, but now with the phantom nerf I've seen them coming back with a vengeance.

What I'm trying to say is, any one of Peregrine's suggestions is an excellent suggestion to add to a list. The Y Wing in particular can be insanely nasty for the points it costs. Just realize that you should be planning for multiple possibilities and not just dumping every anti Interceptor thing you can think of into the same list.

EDIT: FCS means Fire Control System. It's the system upgrade that gives you a free target lock after you've attacked a ship.

Wait, how do you veteran and ptl? Both elite slots, surely?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
^ also many thanks!

 inmygravenimage wrote:
Wait, how do you veteran and ptl? Both elite slots, surely?

Ah. Thanks chaps. As i say, noob!

 Peregrine wrote:
Best way to beat interceptors: R3-A2 on an A4 ion y-wing. Interceptors without actions are dead, and R3-A2 lets you put multiple stress tokens on them. Once they're multi-stressed and actionless you can kill them with whatever you like. As a nice bonus R3-A2 y-wings are good against pretty much every other list as well.

As an extra bonus, if you're using the turret and the Dice Gods are with you, your target ends up with a stress token and an Ion Token - this is even better as he can only do a straight 1 next turn, which is white (so he doesn't clear stress), so he can't reposition or generate tokens to protect himself.

Of course, actually hitting an intereceptor, even if you've got a shot at it, is far from easy with a specific attacker, especially since R3-A2 may leave the Y-wing short on actions too. Horton Salm might be a possible suggestion, giving a reroll at range 2. The BTL-A4 mod is also good in that it doubles the rate you can shoot (and generate stress) but it does mean trying to point the front end of a warthog at one of the most slippery fighters in the game; there's an argument both for and against the A4 mod (which I guess is why it's free). You can generally survive with only putting one stress on a squint - he'll generally have put the second stress token on himself with Push The Limit (unless it's Turr Phenir, who, as mentioned, quite often turns up with Veteran Instincts instead).

A-Wing Test Pilot A-Wings and Squints make for some fairly dramatic dogfights given how easily they can reposition; one of our local A-wing pilots has got very good with Tycho with Daredevil - manouvre, boost, daredevil allows an A-wing to pull a damn J-turn.

locarno24 wrote:
The BTL-A4 mod is also good in that it doubles the rate you can shoot (and generate stress) but it does mean trying to point the front end of a warthog at one of the most slippery fighters in the game;

R3-A2 only works in your arc, so if you're going to have to get your target in arc anyway you might as well double stress them (or stress them and stress another ship) when you do.

Thanks again chaps. I'm looking at:
A-WING: · Tycho Celchu (26)
Push The Limit (3)
Proton Rockets (3)
A-Wing Test Pilot (0)
Veteran Instincts (1)
Y-WING: · Horton Salm (25)
Ion Cannon Turret (5)
· R3-A2 (2)
Btl a4 (0)
X-WING: · Wedge Antilles (29)
Flechette Torpedoes (2)
· R2-D2 (4)

Could swap wedge For Luke, I thought Flechettes for more stress and r2 For durability.

Are you allowed to proxy any cards?
If so (since you have 2 Ys and a HWK:

HWK(Roark), Auto blaster.
Y-Wing (Vander), Auto Blaster, R2D6, Swarm tactics
Y-Wing, Auto Blaster, R7T1
X-Wing (Biggs), R2F2
That's 100 points.
Roark gives Vander PS12. Vander uses his EPT to pass that onto the other Y Wing. That Y Wing (now at PS12) puts on a Target Lock and then gets a free boost to ensure a Range 1 shot. Autoblasters shoot for <hits> that cant be evaded. Then Vander gets to put his target lock on (passing a free lock to Biggs) and shoot thier the autoblaster (if in R1) for the kill of his normal gun hoping to do some damage or token removal).
Then the Ints have to shoot Biggs (who activated R2F2 for the extra evade). If Biggs survives he then gets to shoot back with the free target lock. And finally Roark gets to shoot his auto blaster (if R1) or regular gun to try an finish off anyone close by.
He's trying to arc-dodge his way into R1 for the 4 dice. Even if he stays back you have a guy at PS12 who can boost on AFTER all movement to at least get 2 damage on an Int. As long as you can stay in that R1 and arc bubble of Biggs, he's going to have problems.

KellyJ wrote:
autoblaster stuff

Autoblaster turrets sound nice in theory, but have major problems in reality. Range 1 is a huge limit, and grouping everything into Biggs formation prevents you from spreading your turrets around and leaving nowhere for the target to hide. That gives your opponent the opportunity to flank around the side of your formation and stay at range 2-3 (remember that a barrel roll directly away will almost always take a ship out of range 1) while inflicting damage. And as you lose ships the area covered by your turrets gets smaller and smaller, and your chances of ever getting a shot drop to near zero. A single autoblaster isn't a bad option if you're short on points, but designing a list around them is a trap.

Also, remember that your opponent has more than just Soontir Fel on the table. If they hold Fel back while using the meatshields to soften up your formation you can find yourself without enough turrets left before the target of your autoblasters joins the fight. And against a list like BBBBZ you might as well not even bother deploying your ships because you have no hope of winning.

"Autoblaster turrets sound nice in theory, but have major problems in reality."

Yeah, people keep telling me that. Yet I keep winning with it. Maybe it's just a combination that suits my flying style, because I have seen others try it and get crunched real bad.

So got 2 games in tonight, and here's the skinny. Thanks,first and foremost, for all your help.

Game 1 v Imperial
He took... Kath and Decimator with captain collision.

So yeah, that was terrifying. Flechette clearly a waste there! However, circling him meant that Tycho was able to repeatedly put the hurt on the Decimator - proton rockets well worth it. Stressing with R3/y nuisances just about anything and Wedge is incredibly durable. Eventually the Decimator took out tycho but not before it was down to 2 hull, wedge nailed it and then they set on Kath. A crew Vader in the would've hurt but to only lose the a wing was very satisfying. Also, my flying was pretty tight, and managed to use a deliberate bump with my Y to my advantage.

Game 2 v Imperial
This was really tough, against the local TO who is also one of my oldest friends and incredibly competitive - he absolutely pulled no punches running 6 TIE swarm with 4 ptl and 2 wingmen. Very nasty. He did 2 packs on each flank ; I sat them all on one side, shot up the table and split into A+Y and X. This worked really well, Flechettes more useful this time but still not great, tycho boosting to counter rolling ties worked a treat and the y, again, was a nuisance. Took out the wingmen as priority to limit action economy, the y took the damage but the others 2 hung on for the win.

Things I learned about the list:
First and foremost, it's fun and I felt comfortable with all 3 ships.
The A wing is just lovely, and I want more!
The y wing is tough but Horton's ability is of questionable use. I'm thinking going Grey and using the points on beefing up Wedge because...
Wedge was great, but the Flechette was pretty pointless and between switching out the y and losing them I think I can give him greater utility, possibly as a torpedo boat for range 3 shenanigans.

So all in all, delighted!

Some action pics :

he absolutely pulled no punches running 6 TIE swarm with 4 ptl and 2 wingmen.

What a random-but-cool idea. I may have to steal that one. How did it go?

It was very nasty. I would say that he didn't expect me to go for the wingmen. Being able to Ion thrust a TIE into an asteroid helped! He really needed to draw me more to him, maube scatter and then regroup whilst I was all over the place. It's certainly a tricky opponent!


I'm thinking of using Ion torpedoes and squad leader on wedge, switch Halton to grey. Seems ok-ish, although kinda ties Wedge to a support role. I could lose the Veteran Instincts I suppose, so he can lead tycho too. Thoughts?
Oh, and determination on tycho

I'm always hazy on squad leader. Unless it's someone who's got a free action for some reason (Darth Vader is the obvious one) then you're giving up a pilot's action to pass an action to another pilot who's not as good.

Especially if you're packing ordnance (which means you need to have your action to target lock), you're going to want to use wedge's action on himself. For that matter, a 3-dice attack with wedge's ability is one of your best chances to hit an evasive opponent - so you're going to want either a target lock or a focus token to improve your odds.

Swarm Tactics isn't bad for wedge, because it hands out PS9 and doesn't require his action.

Tycho really doesn't need a squad leader. More importantly, he's going to be hooning around the board like a fruitbat high on nitrous oxide, so trying to tie him to close formation of the (comparably) unmanouvrable x-wing is really limiting him.

Determination is probably a waste of his abilities - by the time an a-wing takes a damage card, you can at most have two hull points left - the odds of taking a pilot damage is relatively low (compared to something like a firespray or decimator). By comparison, being able to take actions when stressed means you ignore the downsides of a lot of get-a-bonus, take a stress token upgrades. Push The Limit is the obvious one, but Experimental Interface & Daredevil is also a good pairing.

Really grateful for these thoughts. It's definitely a different game to get your head round to Trek wing! Now just have to hope that family take the hint from my Amazon wishlist to help me stock up Also need to get this bad boy done

locarno24 wrote:
Unless it's someone who's got a free action for some reason (Darth Vader is the obvious one) then you're giving up a pilot's action to pass an action to another pilot who's not as good.

Spending a free action to use squad leader does nothing to change the problem of giving up an action on a good ship to boost a weaker ship. Vader wants both of his actions for his own benefit, and squad leader is a complete waste of his EPT slot. In fact, I can't think of any pilots that would even consider using squad leader.

Push The Limit is the obvious one, but Experimental Interface & Daredevil is also a good pairing.

Why not both? If you don't need VI for PS 10 taking EI + daredevil + PTL is a lot of fun.