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As a player that has felt the pull of LOTR since its inception (and who will eventually get a force, I just know it) I have a question for you:

Which of the elven forces are better at melee, and are they viable? I don't mean top tier, just enough to give me a fighting chance while making it fun.

Tough one. I guess the answer is that they are all competent there in different ways. For your classic Shieldwall line, High Elves all the way. They are the only basic Elf troops with access to Heavy Armour and Shields (I think, Mirkwood Palace Guard might also have it), so are undoubtedly the toughest, but they do pay for that. They can also ally the Elrond's Household for the deadly Rivendell Knights (well, they all can, but this is undoubtedly the most fluffy way to do it), and they have the most competent melee heroes in the forms of Glorfindel, Elrond, Gil-Galad, Elladan and Elrohir.

Mirkwood Elves excel at Hit&Run attacks with the Mirkwood Rangers, but are overall quite limited in their options for close combat, they're really an army geared towards shooting.

Lothlorien/Galadhrim are the cheapest (points-wise) options, so you can bring more and obviously that has its advantages in melee. They are squishy as hell, though, especially for their points, and again, they are heavily focused on shooting. They can take armour and shields on the Galadhrim warriors, getting them up to respectable defence but still falling short of the Rivendell Elves.

So it's really your call as to whether you want a Thin Gold Line of very expensive models and kickass heroes (Rivendell), a sneaky hit and run force that can also shoot (Mirkwood) or a middle ground with competent and/or cheaper warriors, backed by some powerful elite troops and magic users (Lothlorien). Hope that helps.

It does, actually!

I had a sneaking suspicion Rivendell would be the go to for my preferred playing style (playing FB HE and all) so I'm gladd my gut wasn't that far off.

I am guessing assembling a pretty straightforward fighting force won't be very hard, but it may be costly - pts and $ wise.

Also, I read somewhere that Thranduil was a beast - can you give me a heads up on that?

If you're willing to go second hand, building a Rivendell force shouldn't be too pricey. The plastics were among the first released, so for swordsmen and archers you should be able to buy them by the dozen dirt cheap. Spearmen are a little more expensive and perhaps tricky to find (I can't recall if they're OOP or not). There's usually at least one version of each hero that can be had pretty cheaply. Rivendell Knights are pretty bloody expensive, but you'll want a box at most.

Those comments on Thranduil are probably referring to his BotFA profile, which yeah, can be pretty much broken from what I remember (he negates the biggest weakness of heroes, being outnumbered, by getting bonus attacks for each guy in combat with him). From what I recall, his 2 or 3 older profiles are more middle of the road, though still decent. You'd need a Mirkwood Warband (1 hero, 0-12 warriors) to bring the new versions, a Lothlorien Warband to bring the older version if I'm remembering that correctly.

Assembling rivendell/eregion force can be tricky because the frontliner minis don't have shields and the backline minis have shields.

You always want shields and normal hand weapons (swords, elven blades, axes etc) in the first row and obviously spears to support them from the 2nd row.

The old elves of the last alliance have either bows or elven blades and can't easily be modified to carry shields. This doesn't mean your army would be weak in melee though because elves are supposed to be fragile or low in number but able to combat even enemy heroes to a stalemate.

If you want to include warbands from more than one army list ie. rivendell and woodland realms, you can have a slightly more effective phalanxes by using heavily armored high elves with swords in the front row and weaker wood elf spearmen in the 2nd row to the same efficiency as having an expensive high elf spearman with a shield in the front row. that is, at least until the front row dies. Even so, the weaker wood elf spearman can make use of his unique spear ability when he's alone. An interesting combo in my opinion.

this high elf+wood elf combo is 3 points cheaper than high elf+high elf combo (assuming you buy a shield for the supporting high elf because the model has one). The cheaper combo is just as good until the frontman dies but then again, the traditional uruk-hai team of 1 sword/shield uruk and 2 pikemen suffer from the same problems.

Thank you very much for the info so far.

I am torn at the moment between making a pure HE list or a HE/WE hybrid list.

Is there any compatibility issue between versions. For example, would it be possible to have Gil-Galad and Thranduil in the same list (if the points allowed it, of course)

Apologies for the barrage of questions, I am just trying to build a wishlist of sorts

"Whilst there are no rules to prevent you doing otherwise, hobbyists generally enjoy theming their armies to match famous encounters and alliances, or at least situations that could possibly have arisen, and so eschew mixing improbable (or downright impossible) characters such as Elendil and Aragorn - who lived thousands of years apart." -sourcebook intros

but yeah Gil-Galad and Thranduil were alive at the same time so it's up to you anyways.

Yeah, due to their enormous lifespans you can fluffify most Elven heroes working together. Thranduil was definitely around while Gil-Galad was, although in general terms, as mentioned due to the nature of the source material. LotR players tend towards the more fluffy side than a lot over other games.

As a player of elves for years now I have learned lots about all the different flavors. This excludes the majority of hobbit stuff fyi, it will take too long

High elves can be def 6 and fight 6!!!! (huge) but come at a major cost, I believe 13-15ppm. There isn't much finesse in this army, swords up front with spears behind. archers in support with characters doing what they do(which they have the best CC characters for elves but also the most points wise) and cav to taste. This is really a rundown of a pure high elf army.

Galadhrim are just like the high elves but cheaper thus more numerous. Also they can bring mirkwood troops without mirkwood characters so that's a bit of a bonus but we are talking pure galadhrim elves. So basically just a little weaker in terms of def and fight but same str attacks and courage. the characters aren't as big of beasts but Rumil is a beast for his points. Galadhrim cav, good solid all around cav that can put a hurt on infantry.

Mirkwood is truly a finesse army. Def 3 troops all around making them really easy to kill. But again they are the cheapest troops though the points reduction isn't in comparison to what you lose. The limit to 1/3 bows with this army is its true weakness. it is designed to move and shoot but limiting bows will reduce its overall effectiveness. Fun but not super strong.

The real strength in elves comes with picking your fights. 1v1 not much in the game beats an elf but if you take a phalanx of galadhrim or high elves vs isengard phalanx. Elves will lose almost every time. Picking the fight at the right time after thinning out opponents with arrows. If you let other armies do what they do best then you will always lose(except if you use weighted dice). When elves try to go block on block with armies like isengard or easterlings they wont do well. If they run headstrong into gobblins and allow themselves to be fighing 1 on 3 or 4 etc they wont do well. If you think you are going to batter dwarf units with def 7 or 8 and some characters at def 9. you wont do it.

As I have said so many times LOTR SBG is all about army synergy. Utilizing units to maximize their strengths while using other units to mitigate their weakness. Its about army as a whole not specific units. So when planning think of what the unit can and cant do and try to balance that with your other choices.

Thanks for the information, people.

HE's seem to be my faction, I'll just have to decide what to get when I eventually grab me some models (Apart from Gil-Galad: he's there, end of.)

 Paradigm wrote:
You'd need a Mirkwood Warband (1 hero, 0-12 warriors) to bring the new versions, a Lothlorien Warband to bring the older version if I'm remembering that correctly.

Are you sure about that? I know you need (for example) a Mirkwood hero to bring a Mirkwood warband but I don't recall ever reading any prerequisite to bring a solo Hero.

 mdauben wrote:

 Paradigm wrote:
You'd need a Mirkwood Warband (1 hero, 0-12 warriors) to bring the new versions, a Lothlorien Warband to bring the older version if I'm remembering that correctly.

Are you sure about that? I know you need (for example) a Mirkwood hero to bring a Mirkwood warband but I don't recall ever reading any prerequisite to bring a solo Hero.

Yeah, in practice you would just take the 1 hero and 0 of your available 12 warriors. I was just covering the ally rules in general, but yeah, you could just add Thranduil. He'd be a 'warband' for reserves purposes and such, but there's no barrier to adding him.