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Still playing around with semi competitive list ideas, looking for feedback.

Carcharodons 1848

Tyberos - 190
Librarian - Terminator Armour, ML2, Force Sword, Burning Blade, Rolling on biomancy - 170

Honour Guard - Chapter Banner, Champion w/ Thunderhammer, 7 Veterans - 2 Relic Blades, 2 Power Swords, 3 Power Axes - 270
Sternguard - Drop Pod, 8 men, 2 melta - 231

Scout Squad - Camo Cloaks, 5 men, 4 Sniper Rifles, Missile Launcher - 84
2 x Tactical Squads - 10 men, Drop Pod, Plasma Gun, 9 extra CCW - 199 each

Assault Squad - 10 men, Jump Packs, 2 Eviscerators, 2 Flamers, Sergeant w/ Power Sword - 245

Land Raider Redeemer - Multi Melta, Extra Armour - 260

Found a list using honour guard, and I had no idea why I wasn't using them before with these chapter tactics. In general, they're obviously nasty. With Tyberos giving them preferred enemy, however, they're a rapetrain with no brakes! I decided to toss in a Librarian to aim for endurance, but the idea of a Librarian getting 8 attacks on the charge, at strength 10 and initiative 7, rerolling 1s to hit and wound, is also a disgusting option haha. Sternguard are there to either pop a transport or waste MCs. Tacticals to screen and wipe out threats to the land raider. Assault squad flies up the flank to cut around the back. Scouts just sit on an objective and pick away at things.

My concern is with the model count. It's currently at 57. I could increase it to 63 if I take the libby out, make the sternguard 10 and add another scout squad. What do you guys think?



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sorry, I mean make the sternguard 10 and give them 3 combi guns, then combat squad them for target saturation

So...those honer guard...yeah...what happens when a pod of 3 grav centurions drop and kill them all in one round of shooting?
Might be better to break up that death star and take smaller units.
.
Id only take a 5 man Sternguard unit with 3 Combi-Meltas as its cheaper, gets the job done, and does not waste points on essentially a suicide unit.
.
Only take 5 men in those Tactical Squads, give the sergeants combi-plasmas. Take them in a Red Scorpion's detatchment to give them FNP!!!
.
Put that massive assault squad inside the land raider, similar speed, much more survivable!!! You dont want 245 points of guys getting blasted off the table, and trust me Grav makes this happen a lot!!!
.
The honor guard are a massive point sink, same with Tyberos, but I get he is in there for fluff.
Id also get rid of the Libby. The Honor Guard could work so...keep them and see how they do.
To replace the Libby take a second detachment of Red Scorpions. Replace the Librarian with SEVRIN LOTH!!!!!
he is 5 points more and gets 3 powers he can choose from. Put him in a Tac squad in a pod.
This gives him FNP and the option to have Look Out Sir saves.
.
So with that the list would look something more like this:



Detachment 1 Carcharodons

Tyberos-190

5 Sternguard- 3 Combi-Meltas, in drop pod- 175

5 Sternguard- 3 Combi-Meltas, in drop pod- 175

Scout Squad-84

Scout Squad-84

Assault Squad-no jump packs-245

Land Raider Redeemer-260
.
Detachment 2, Red Scorpions

Sevrin Loth-175

5 Man Tactical Squad- Plasma gun, Combi-Plasma, in Drop Pod - 130

5 Man Tactical Squad- Plasma gun, Combi-Plasma, in Drop Pod - 130

By removing the Honor Guard you have an extra 202 points left over,
If you want honor guard you can run a smaller unit of them though
I would just run Tyberos in the Assault Squad in the Land Raider.
The army still needs some way to deal with flyers, so 2 Scorpion
Tactical squads with Flak Missile Launchers. That gives you 2
sky fire launchers in FNP squads. I really dont think that running
an assault deathstar unit works well for SM but if you want to make
it work I would suggest checking out this guy on youtube called
Fritz40k, he seems to do well running an almost pure assault
army of Khorne berserkers, so maybe some of his list building
tips would help with creating assault based armies? Best of luck,
let me know what you think of the changed I suggested

Ooooooook. So here's the problem I've got with your list suggestion, and I'll play nice here because I'm well aware that there aren't very many Space Sharks players. Four REALLY big issues with everything you've suggested.

First, and this is a giant glaring problem. Carcharodons should not be allying with anything, ever. Even other marines are Desperate Allies, so it would be an uphill battle before the game even began.

Second. Carcharodon chapter tactics are completely ignored in your list. Like, entirely. Carcharodons gain rage for killing something or making it fall back in the assault phase, and tactcials can either switch a bolter out for a ccw for free or take one for 1 point each. Your list suits Salamanders much better, with the mc melta shots and sergeants have mc combi plasmas to negate gets hot. You don't play Space Sharks to shoot things, you play them because you like beating things up in close combat (and WINNING). You can't accomplish that effectively with 5 man squads, either.

Third, Tyberos wasn't chosen for fluff. If you look at what I wrote about preferred enemy and the chapter banner, you'd see that Tyberos is a buffmander for the entire army. Don't get me wrong, he can and will wipe out your shiny new Knight in the first round of combat in a glorious explosion, but thats not why he's taken. He makes everything killier.

The idea of replacing the honour guard in a land raider with an assault marine squad in a land raider is a bit confusing. You suggest that both units can be shot off the board (rightfully so, it IS possible). But your idea to take the significantly nastier squad out of their protective box and replace them with the assault marines is odd. I don't follow. Assault marines can move up the board much faster than a land raider if I intend to shoot anything with it.

All that being said, I appreciate the response and the effort you put in, but your list is incredibly far off from the base list idea, literally fights itself, and is actually a lower model count than the list I originally asked the question about.

bigcheese86 wrote:
Still playing around with semi competitive list ideas, looking for feedback.

Carcharodons 1848

Tyberos - 190
Librarian - Terminator Armour, ML2, Force Sword, Burning Blade, Rolling on biomancy - 170

Honour Guard - Chapter Banner, Champion w/ Thunderhammer, 7 Veterans - 2 Relic Blades, 2 Power Swords, 3 Power Axes - 270
Sternguard - Drop Pod, 8 men, 2 melta - 231

Scout Squad - Camo Cloaks, 5 men, 4 Sniper Rifles, Missile Launcher - 84
2 x Tactical Squads - 10 men, Drop Pod, Plasma Gun, 9 extra CCW - 199 each

Assault Squad - 10 men, Jump Packs, 2 Eviscerators, 2 Flamers, Sergeant w/ Power Sword - 245

Land Raider Redeemer - Multi Melta, Extra Armour - 260

Found a list using honour guard, and I had no idea why I wasn't using them before with these chapter tactics. In general, they're obviously nasty. With Tyberos giving them preferred enemy, however, they're a rapetrain with no brakes! I decided to toss in a Librarian to aim for endurance, but the idea of a Librarian getting 8 attacks on the charge, at strength 10 and initiative 7, rerolling 1s to hit and wound, is also a disgusting option haha. Sternguard are there to either pop a transport or waste MCs. Tacticals to screen and wipe out threats to the land raider. Assault squad flies up the flank to cut around the back. Scouts just sit on an objective and pick away at things.

My concern is with the model count. It's currently at 57. I could increase it to 63 if I take the libby out, make the sternguard 10 and add another scout squad. What do you guys think?



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sorry, I mean make the sternguard 10 and give them 3 combi guns, then combat squad them for target saturation

I like the list, I've never had too much success with ASM (despite running them in a demi-company in most of my lists) but under the Space Sharks CT they can probably do some work. I'd say keep the Libby as well, as he'll give you a measure of psychic defense.

Thanks! I've been playing Sharks almost a year now. Sometimes the ASM squad wrecks things and wins me entire games, other times its a massive distraction. I'm ok with both . Its a nasty squad capable of doing massive damage very quickly with the CT

I've had mine do some pretty cool things before (taking down an Exocrine from full wounds to dead on the charge). They're pretty hit or miss for me, but the Space Sharks CT should help them out a bit.

I jumped on them for the eviscerators. Before they gain rage, its 6 attacks on the charge at strength 8 ap2, plus HOW. After rage, its 8. Now, with the 12" range of the banner as well, that jumps to a starting number of 8, and 10 after rage at strength 9.

Although, that applies to the tacticals too I suppose. I'll have to playtest this list quite a bit to find ways to abuse the hell out of the banner as it's quite ridiculous for an assaulty army.

I would suggest dropping the Honor guard and getting an Assault Termie squad with Lightning Claws, that could be your second Troop choice.

I would consider dropping the Scout squad and going with a Tac squad with extra CCW.

Other wise I like the list

I hummed and hawed over the idea of the assault squad instead of the honour guard. Both obviously very good options. I tried the LC troops choice a few games, they're just not worth it; assault termies just NEED a few storm shields, or they go down to fire too fast. I don't need the troops slot filled, so if I went this route I'd just go with the elite slot option. I'll try both, because I think both have merit. Honour guard with a banner provide a 12" attack bonus to everyone else and have a higher attack volume, but lower strength for the ap2 attacks, and no shred on the ap3 but still have rerolls on 1 from preferred enemy. On the other hand, terminators are more survivable and hit harder on a per model basis, but its lower model count and don't buff the rest of the army.

I think they'd play differently from each other in that the honour guard favour a more tightly packed drop pod deployment, whereas with the terminators I can spread out and hit weak spots without missing out on anything.

bigcheese86 wrote:
I hummed and hawed over the idea of the assault squad instead of the honour guard. Both obviously very good options. I tried the LC troops choice a few games, they're just not worth it; assault termies just NEED a few storm shields, or they go down to fire too fast. I don't need the troops slot filled, so if I went this route I'd just go with the elite slot option. I'll try both, because I think both have merit. Honour guard with a banner provide a 12" attack bonus to everyone else and have a higher attack volume, but lower strength for the ap2 attacks, and no shred on the ap3 but still have rerolls on 1 from preferred enemy. On the other hand, terminators are more survivable and hit harder on a per model basis, but its lower model count and don't buff the rest of the army.

I think they'd play differently from each other in that the honour guard favour a more tightly packed drop pod deployment, whereas with the terminators I can spread out and hit weak spots without missing out on anything.

Right you are. I usually take terminators, pair them with a termie chaplain and Tyberos, then put them in an Assault Ram and Deep Strike them near the enemy warlord.
This list looks really solid though, I've yet to try Honor Guard so I'll have to give them a go

Thanks for the input everyone! I'll be assembling some honour guard asap to try this out!

I'm gonna pass on some advice I was given about my list:

The Assault Squads are better off being 5-man squads so they can hide behind vehicles or in cover better. The idea of an assault squad is you don't want them to really be shot at until overwatch (that's the ideal scenario). Plus for 25 extra points, you can separate them out into two squads awith the following profile:

Assault Squad (135)
Power Sword (on the Sargent)
2x Flamers
1x Eviscerator
5x Jump Packs

With two squads with this profile as compared to your 10-man squad, you double the amount of attacks you get with a Power Sword and you double the amount flamers. Plus as i said before, you'll find it easier to take cover.

That's a great idea! I'll shuffle some points around and try to fit it in

Well, I tried it on the weekend with the honour guard, and I can honestly say that I'll never team Tyberos with assault terminators ever again. The general volume of attacks from having so many bodies, and the banner adding 1 to everything, including Tyberos, was insane. The big difference wasn't just that the attack volume was higher though, it was that I better utilized Tyberos' preferred enemy by having more going through, which of course only got better after the rage.

By the time my opponent brought the unit down with massed fire, they munched through 3 full sized squads, including the warlord. Definitely something to build a list around! I'm working on making a double honour guard squad list now, with a chaplain and second land raider, to really abuse everything.