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playing around with squad builders, trying something different. opinions, comments, and suggestions welcome.

Keyan Farlander in a B-wing with VI and HLC

Jan Ors in HWK-290 with Kyle Katarn

Horton Salm in a Y-wing with Ion Turret, BTL-4A, R2 Astromech, and Engine Upgrade.

Thinking is Jan keeps giving Keyan a 5th die for the HLC (or primary if Keyan is in rang one), or gives it to Horton for an initial ion blast, so next turn he can boost into range one and continually hammer his target.

Obviously, the HWK is the week link.

Keyan Farlander can have the same effect (5 dice at all ranges) with just taking Opportunist instead of VI.

A HWK with no turret is worse than useless. Horton's ability only works at range 2-3. Why would you want to boost into R1 and shoot unmodified dice?

Try this instead:

Keyan Farlander (42)
B-Wing (29), Fire-Control System (2), Heavy Laser Cannon (7), Opportunist (4)

Jan Ors (34)
HWK-290 (25), Lightning Reflexes (1), Twin Laser Turret (6), Tactician (2)

Gold Squadron Pilot (24)
Y-Wing (18), Twin Laser Turret (6)

 bocatt wrote:
Keyan Farlander can have the same effect (5 dice at all ranges) with just taking Opportunist instead of VI.

A HWK with no turret is worse than useless. Horton's ability only works at range 2-3. Why would you want to boost into R1 and shoot unmodified dice?

Try this instead:

Keyan Farlander (42)
B-Wing (29), Fire-Control System (2), Heavy Laser Cannon (7), Opportunist (4)

Jan Ors (34)
HWK-290 (25), Lightning Reflexes (1), Twin Laser Turret (6), Tactician (2)

Gold Squadron Pilot (24)
Y-Wing (18), Twin Laser Turret (6)

you missed what I was trying to do with my list.

Horton isn't there for his ability. He's there for his pilot skill. That's why he wants to be in range 1.. so he's throwing 3 dice attacks with a followup ionization to keep the target predictable till dead. Once there, he doesn' t need boost to stay there, and can take a TL or focus instead of boost... boost is only to get him there as quick as possible.

the Hawk isn't there to do damage, but to add to the damage from the HLC on the B-wing. Opportunist would be nice, but only useful if the target doesn't have focus or evade... so with nothing to strip that, useless.

Now, with that in mind.. perhaps removing Kyle and Engine upgrade, and popping a TLT on the Hawk may make some sense... but I'm not sure that doesn't actually take more away, as the y-wing will have a harder time getting into possition, even with R2.

TLT and Tactician puts two stress tokens on an enemy.Most players will not choose a white maneuver when they have 2+ stress on a ship so it becomes almost as predictable as if it was ionized. Even if they perform a green maneuver they still get no actions. Not even free actions. There are very very few cases where a ship will still manage to have focus or evade assigned to the ship. Therefore, Opportunist triggers. You still get Jan Ors ability which means you can throw six dice with Keyan's Heavy Laser Cannon or R1 primary. Triggering opportunist gives you a stress which is spent on the attack to change all 'eyes' to hits. Free target locks from Fire Control System makes it even more deadly. Lightning Reflexes let's you K-turn the Hawk and line up another R2 in arc volley from the TLT+tactician that will double stress a ship.

Taking a whole 30 point ship to add 1 dice to another ship's attack once per round is a horrible awful idea. Now if that ship adds one dice to a friendly and brings a great weapon and stress control and triggers opportunist for friendlies. Then it's a good investment.

pilot skill 8 is not great. Even with R2-D6 and VI and Engine Upgrade to make a worthy PS 10 repositioner you're still just putting wings on a brick and hoping it will fly when what you should be doing instead is using the Y-wing as a brick with a strong weapon upgrade with a 360 degree firing arc. Horton Salm is good for his pilot ability, as are most unique pilots. Don't waste it by trying to rush in to Range 1 to make a dinky 2 primary weapon do a wee bit more damage.

If you want a fast ship that will run people into the ground firing ion cannon shots and primary weapon shots in one round of shooting and gets modifications on both shots look no further than the TIE Defender.

TIE Defender: · Colonel Vessery (35)
Veteran Instincts (1)
Ion Cannon (3)
Engine Upgrade (4)
TIE/D (0)

43 points but it's everything you want Horton Salm to do but he actually does it in a way that's good and not in a way that is garbage. He's even the same pilot skill. He just has a much better, faster dial, a better primary weapon, 3 agility, just as many shields, only 2 less hull and he gets free target locks on both attacks as long as you plan correctly. So you can take your boost or barrel roll or focus actions and still actually hit things with the ion cannon and "keep it predictable" and the primary will hurt a lot more with 4 dice at R1 and a target lock.

Maybe I misunderstood at first but no matter how you spin it a Hawk that does nothing and a Y-wing trying to do something it sucks at will not get you very far.

Using stress instead of ion is the normal way, and I"m aware of the strengths of it. However, too many possible opponents have too many green dice, leaving me guessing, again, as to where they will end up.

I'm bad at guessing. I want to KNOW, without any question, EXACTLY where they are going to be if at all possible.

Yes, using a hwk for nothing but Jan's ability isn't the best use of those points... just like I know paying for horton just for his PS isn't the best investment of points (and I know ps8 isn't a world-beater as well), but to do what I want (ion the target AND have a chance of dealing damage), there aren't a lot of options in the rebel list that do both.

Have you considered just taking a couple ships you like with Ion Torpedoes? They have a weapon value of four and ion the target and don't "cancel" damage like most other ion weapons. And that's A LOT less inefficient than this. Munitions are even kind of a good option now with Guidance Chips.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also Intelligence Agents tell you EXACTLY where the enemy will be without having to roll dice or hit them with anything.

 bocatt wrote:
Have you considered just taking a couple ships you like with Ion Torpedoes? They have a weapon value of four and ion the target and don't "cancel" damage like most other ion weapons. And that's A LOT less inefficient than this. Munitions are even kind of a good option now with Guidance Chips.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also Intelligence Agents tell you EXACTLY where the enemy will be without having to roll dice or hit them with anything.

I actually haven't considered ion torps... and I really should.

However, to show your advice is not falling on deaf ears... a couple changes to my original... same general plan, but less wasteful I think

Jan with an Ion Turret and engine upgrade (I don't have Tactician or I'd use it instead of the engine upgrade) and adaptability (+1 ps)

Keyan with VI and HLC again

Ibtisam with VI.

2 PS 9 pilots and 1 PS 8. Boost to try to keep the hawk from being the focus of too much incoming fire, while hopefully staying at range 2 for the ion. Keyan and Ibtisam focus fire on 1 ship.

Still not perfect, but better?

Much better. Rolling unmodified dice with the ion cannon turret on your HWK is not preferable and 2 b-wings+HWK isn't super durable but you have the makings of a good list here. I don't know how to really help with Ibitsam. I want to like her but I dont know how to make her really good. She might just be fine the way you have. I would try to get fire controls on one of the B-wings. It's a superb systems upgrade to increase your firepower more than two-fold for only 2 points. But it's not absolutely necessary. B-wings can also take ion cannons and Tacticians if you want to go that way. And the R3-A2 warthog Y-wing with ion cannon is really not a bad choice. Give it a fly and see how it goes. See how you want to tweak it.