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10 man Destroyer Squad with 2x rad-missiles, jump packs, and artificer armoured Sergeant with phosphex bomb - 395
Fast Attack Legion Seekers with 5x combi-plasmas, nuncio-vox, and artificer armoured Strike Leader with melta bombs - 250
Heavy Support 10x Fulmentarus Terminators with cyclone missiles and 9x power fists - 745
Heavy Support Squad with missile launchers with augury scanner - 165
Spartan Assault Tank with frag assault launchers, armoured ceramite, auxiliary drive and flare shielding - 360
The Moritat Deep Strikes with the Destroyers into a good position, guided by the Recon Squad or other nuncio-voxes. Spartan drives up Suzerains and Praetor. Apothecaries attached to Tactical and Breacher Squads. MoS hangs back with backfield squads (Fulmentarii) and guides the longer ranged units. Seekers, Contemptors and Support Squads go where they can cause the most damage.
Thoughts (aside from it being an eclectic mess?)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/05/19 11:38:55
Capabilities extremely low. You don't even have adequate anti-tank/monstrous creature capability for a list half this size. At 5000 points there will we weapons that erase those blob squads in a single volley.
teban wrote:Lovely - my Fists want to do something quite like that as well :an Infranty based list at around the same aamount of points.
Just beware of quad launchers, whirlwinds... and artillery in general. All in all, it seems like an awesome list
Yeah, artillery would be an issue.
HandofMars wrote:Capabilities extremely low. You don't even have adequate anti-tank/monstrous creature capability for a list half this size. At 5000 points there will we weapons that erase those blob squads in a single volley.
Thank you for the feedback! Of course, it would be more appreciated if you could actually give me any idea on how and what specifically to improve, possibly citing some units to drop and replace with, but I guess that's asking a little too much.
I am tempted to lower the point size, and focus on the Breachers being supported by the Destroyers and other units.
Any chance of constructive criticism?
They/them
2016/05/17 09:44:42
Subject: Re:Ultramarines Legion - 5k Infantry based
He seems to do that a lot As for your list: the fulementari are a massive point sink and a huge part where your list is being driven up. Trimming them, the Spartan, and some of the other small squads, and this could be a pretty functional list. You also have a whole lot of boxes for not a whole lot of ordinance\deep strikers :(
I'll never be able to repay CA for making GW realize that The Old World was a cash cow, left to die in a field.
Brennonjw wrote: He seems to do that a lot As for your list: the fulementari are a massive point sink and a huge part where your list is being driven up. Trimming them, the Spartan, and some of the other small squads, and this could be a pretty functional list. You also have a whole lot of boxes for not a whole lot of ordinance\deep strikers :(
The Fulmentarus could easily be trimmed back, five men works well enough.
I mainly used the Spartan to get my large Suzerian unit to where they need to get reliably, but I can always use a Land Raider to get them there, and save some points (and money )
My nuncio-voxes are mainly there to guarentee my Destroyers can deepstrike where I need them, but I can always cut them out and instead only keep the vox on the MoS and Reconnaisance Squad.
The Volkite Charger Squad can also be dropped, I guess, as can the Seekers, especially as they're sans transport and outflank.
To make this a 4k list, the missile launchers or laser destroyers can be dropped too - which one would be better to drop? The missiles have a longer range, and more shots, but the Rapiers are stronger and would probably be a bit more durable. Or I could drop the double CCW dreadnought, and instead take a pair of DCCW/Kheres dreads?
Taking a look now, I've dropped the Praetor's pistol, upgraded the moritat to 2x plasma, upped the Tactical Squads to 15 man sizes, only taken 2 DCCW/Kheres Dreadnoughts, only taken 2 Laser Destroyers, made the Fulmentarii 5 man, and replaced the Spartan for a Land Raider Phobos with ceramite and an auxiliary drive, as well as dropping the nuncio-voxes from the Breachers and scrapping the Seekers and Chargers.
It's now a 4k list - any better?
Legion - Loyalist Ultramarines
HQ Praetor with artificer armour, mastercrafted Legatine Axe, Iron Halo, melta bombs, digital lasers - 180
Accompanied by 10 Invictarus Suzerains - 325
Moritat with artificer armour, refractor field and jump pack, 2x plasma pistols - 165
Master of Signal with artificer armour and refractor field - 115
Troops
20 man Breacher Squad, vexilla, artificer armoured Sergeant with power sword - 360
15 man Tactical Squad with extra CCW, vexilla, artificer armoured Sergeant with power sword - 265
15 man Tactical Squad with extra CCW, vexilla, artificer armoured Sergeant with power sword - 265
It's hard to give constructive criticism at 5000 points when the world is your oyster. You should be able to fit all sorts of fun and potent options in there, but you chose to just throw half a company of tactical marines in there. I assumed it was a fluff decision, in which case you will very fluffily die in droves like Marines do in the 30K books.
Ultramarines have some of the best special units (Suzerain, Invictarii), and you chose to bring the only poor one. Fulmentarus terminators are criminally overpriced and don't hold a candle to any of the standard Legion heavy support options.
A single spartan as your only heavy tank presence will see it evaporated turn 1 at 5000 points.
Your anti-tank amounts to half a dozen lascannons and some missile launchers. What are you going to do even against a single Knight, much less several?
No LOW when you will certainly see 1 or 2 at this point level (see above). How do you build a 5000 point Ultramarines army and not bring Guilleman? That alone should qualify you for the red helmet of shame!
No way to deal with fliers except snap-firing.
No way to fend off deep-strike heavy forces.
List overall light on heavy and special weapons, and has no sniper veterans, so has few answers to Mechanicum monstrous creatures.
No way to deal with deathstars or even tie them up with a fearless unit. Do you just capitulate when your opponent teleports Horus and Justaerin into the middle of your deployment zone?
Basically, 5000 points is an Apocalypse-level cataclysmic battle, and you brought the gear for a Zone Mortalis skirmish.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/05/18 20:32:19
It's hard to give constructive criticism at 5000 points when the world is your oyster. You should be able to fit all sorts of fun and potent options in there, but you chose to just throw half a company of tactical marines in there. I assumed it was a fluff decision, in which case you will very fluffily die in droves like Marines do in the 30K books.
Well, you can see it's an infantry based list. That much was obvious - Breachers and Tactical Squads mostly. I assumed that you'd be able to see that and throw out some ideas for that. Evidently not.
Ultramarines have some of the best special units (Suzerain, Invictarii), and you chose to bring the only poor one. Fulmentarus terminators are criminally overpriced and don't hold a candle to any of the standard Legion heavy support options.
That's the same unit. Invictarus Suzerains are the same unit. And I brought 10. And you seem to have forgotten the Locutarus Storm Squad - artificer armoured assault marines with power swords whose only unique rule is to fire twice on Deep Strike. That's got to be worse than Fulmentarus, surely. Also, Fulmentarii would be similar to Tyrant Siege Termies, no? There isn't that much of a points difference? I can see the point for reducing the squad size, but removing them? I don't see that?
A single spartan as your only heavy tank presence will see it evaporated turn 1 at 5000 points.
Your anti-tank amounts to half a dozen lascannons and some missile launchers. What are you going to do even against a single Knight, much less several?
Acknowledged. I really didn't think about this being a 5k list, and just more a collection.
No LOW when you will certainly see 1 or 2 at this point level (see above). How do you build a 5000 point Ultramarines army and not bring Guilleman? That alone should qualify you for the red helmet of shame!
Guilliman was tempting, and can easily be put in.
No way to deal with fliers except snap-firing.
I can always drop the DCCW Contemptor and make the other two Mortis Contemptors.
No way to fend off deep-strike heavy forces.
True.
List overall light on heavy and special weapons, and has no sniper veterans, so has few answers to Mechanicum monstrous creatures.
Not planning on every facing Mechanicum or MCs, and veterans ARE overpriced for what they are.
No way to deal with deathstars or even tie them up with a fearless unit. Do you just capitulate when your opponent teleports Horus and Justaerin into the middle of your deployment zone?
Well, I wouldn't be seeing Horus, so that's not an issue. If in doubt, I use the Suzerains and Tacs/Breachers to hold.
Basically, 5000 points is an Apocalypse-level cataclysmic battle, and you brought the gear for a Zone Mortalis skirmish.
Also true. I never really considered a 5k list - instead, could you direct yourself to the 4k list I put up and give constructive criticism on that, as an infantry based list? I have no aspiration for a Knight or other superheavy, in case you'd suggest that.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/05/19 11:39:26
I meant the jump pack guys with artificer and power swords, whatever their faux Latin name is. They are good too.
It's not an infantry based list, it's a list that basically only has infantry, most of them with basic weapons. If you plan to refuse any games involving Primarchs, super heavies, monstrous creatures or strong melee elements, you could have said so. I like infantry skirmishes (Zone Mortalis is the best), but you'd have to pay me my consulting rate to get me to deploy 5000 points of grunts and see who can roll more 4s. More power to you though if you have likeminded opponents.
Siege Tyrants are 100 points cheaper for the unit and like 30 points cheaper per guy.
Without a source of Fearless, those tacs and breachers aren't holding anything.
:an Infranty based list at around the same aamount of points.
As for your list: the fulementari are a massive point sink and a huge part where your list is being driven up. Trimming them, the Spartan, and some of the other small squads, and this could be a pretty functional list. You also have a whole lot of boxes for not a whole lot of ordinance\deep strikers :(
Invictarus Suzerains are the same unit. And I brought 10.