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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/10/11 07:52:34
Subject: [1850] - KDK - Can I make this cheesier?
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Fresh-Faced New User
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Since I figured the most effective way to play Chaos these days (short of daemon psychic bull****) is KDK, I decided to make the cheesiest list I could think of for the local tourney (no super heavies)
Self-imposed rule: Battle-brother allies only (despite wanting competitiveness, it still grinds my gears seeing Necrons, Eldar and Tau allies lists)
Initially I would run a Blood-Host detachment with Slaughtercult, Gorepack and the 3 Daemon Engines and then ally a CSM Juggerlord with AoBF, Cultists and a Heldrake
And while the extra Blood Tithe per turn is nice, once the killing starts I really dont have a problem with getting the Blood points. The possessed tax seems a bit much, most of the time they get shot to bits and the most they end up doing is killing off a 5 man tactical squad and then footslogging to the nearest piece of terrain to avoid being obliterated the next turn. The bikes don't last long either, and get shot off the board turn one by most alpha strike armies. Same goes for any of my daemon engines.
So I though, how do cheese up a Chaos list? The simple answer is of course: add Be'lakor
THE LIST
CAD: Khorne Daemonkin
Chaos Lord, Juggernaut, Sigil of Corruption, Kor'lath, Axe of Ruin [205]
8x Bloodletters [80]
8x Bloodletters [80]
Heldrake, Baleflamer [170]
Soul Grinder, Phlem [165]
Maulerfiend [130]
Maulerfiend [130]
GOREPACK
3x Chaos Bikes, 2x Meltaguns, 1x Combi-melta [101]
3x Chaos Bikes, 2x Meltaguns, 1x Combi-melta [101]
8x Flesh Hounds [128]
5x Flesh Hounds [80]
5x Flesh Hounds [80]
ALLIES: CSM
Be'lakor [350]
10x Chaos Cultists [50]
The list is exactly 1850 points and seems to solve the issues I have (although I haven't play tested it). Be'lakor (if dice gods are good) could potentially cast invisibility on one unit (say Lord and 8 hounds) and then keep a couple of others safe with his shrouding aura (say bikes, hounds or even some of the daemon engines). The Heldrake, now being part of the KDK, can start adding blood points to the pile and never need to fly off the table with Be'lakors help. Korlath axe is a nice little insurance policy that my Lord kills his points worth if he gets unlucky and is killed early on.
All C&C is welcome
PS: I'm sure I'm not a genius and something along the lines of this list has been posted before, so I appologize if it has
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/10/11 10:38:03
Subject: Re:[1850] - KDK - Can I make this cheesier?
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Been Around the Block
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There's alot of things you could do to make this list cheesier.
Heldrake is great, but you're missing one -- and put it in an Air Superiority Detachment to make sure it arrives when you want it to arrive. Two Heldrakes are really a headache for people to deal with, especially with the new rules from Death from the Skies.
I don't know what you're planning on using the Soul Grinder with Phlegm Bombardment for. The Heldrakes will make short work of whatever they need to. Find a way to put in 2 bare Grinders with 2 Maulerfiends, and deepstrike yourself into position. 4 nasty walkers that you DO NOT want to be in CC with will cause some targetting decisions.
You're missing a few critical pieces to make this list really tick -- the biggest one is the Blood Host Detachment, and a Slaughtercult. Yes, Possessed are a tax, but you can get a Rhino (for more Tithe), and then you have a place to hide your Chaos Lord. He doesn't need all that equipment, your walkers and flyers will do all the heavy lifting. He just needs to be a big fething target.
The ability to summon a unit, and then buff your Slaughtercult is a big deal. FnP on the Slaughtercult and then drop down a Bloodthirster? Those of the dreams of Blood Chosen.
The Gorepack is great, 10-15 Hounds should be enough, but you're missing a very important Fast Attack choice -- Spawn. In the Slaughtercult they can get some serious buffs!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/10/11 20:39:40
Subject: Re:[1850] - KDK - Can I make this cheesier?
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Fresh-Faced New User
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I don't think the tourney is using "Death from the Skies", I probably should have mentioned.
A few issues here:
1. You cannot take just Heldrakes in the Blood Host, it requires you to take Bloodstorm formation (which comes with 2 squads of raptors and 1 squad of warp talons - a massive tax)
2. Deep striking large models like Soul Grinders and Maulerfiends I'm skeptical about, with the terrain on the table as well as other models scattered around - a mishap could be disasterous
Even if they don't mishap - leaving naked Soul Grinders and Maulerfiends out in the open for a whole turn would just make them an easy target for lascannons, meltas and grav to take out (unless of course you deep strike them into cover.. which is almost a guaranteed mishap
3. Also that is way too many points to fit into 1850
My plan for the Soul Grinder was to is to camp out back on an objective, with cultists from the CSM allies forming a protective barrier to prevent drop pod assault to get into melta range. With Phlem the Soul Grinder to get the tally going while I wait for my close combat and the heldrake to get into action
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/10/12 04:23:01
Subject: Re:[1850] - KDK - Can I make this cheesier?
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Been Around the Block
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If the tournament is not using Death From the Skies, you should use a different army to be cheesy.
I've been playing KDK since release, and I think they're ok, but not really cheesy. Their strength was boosted from Death From The Skies, but you can also take a herald, 2 cultist squads and up to 3 frames in a CAD, the cultists can sit on objectives.
Phlegm Bombardment is a trap. Take advantage of AV13 and deepstrike that thing right in their face. They gotta deal with it, and that's what KDK is all about, overwhelming the opponent with targets.
You need the Blood Host to gain +1 Tithe per turn. Its a huge bonus that gives you the ability to do some great turn 2 perfect deepstrikes. You want to get to 5 Tithe turn 2 to drop a Bloodletter squad using Tithe and then perfect deepstrike off of the banner which you get for free with that squad. Without DftS, you can't virtually guarantee your reserves coming in.
I cannot emphasize how big DftS with an Air Superiority Detachment is for KDK. Without it, you're going to be gunned down before you hit halfway down the field. Your army is close combat specialists with no ability to get into close combat, and weak resiliency.
170pts for something to shoot a pie plate a turn without Ignores Cover is tremendously expensive. Hiding it with cultists is even more nonsensical because in an MSU list losing a few troops here and there doesn't matter. Not to mention, you want some of your gak to die anyways, you actually need most of it to die, because it makes you stronger!
Automatically Appended Next Post: If the tournament is not using Death From the Skies, you should use a different army to be cheesy.
I've been playing KDK since release, and I think they're ok, but not really cheesy. Their strength was boosted from Death From The Skies, but you can also take a herald, 2 cultist squads and up to 3 frames in a CAD, the cultists can sit on objectives.
Phlegm Bombardment is a trap. Take advantage of AV13 and deepstrike that thing right in their face. They gotta deal with it, and that's what KDK is all about, overwhelming the opponent with targets.
You need the Blood Host to gain +1 Tithe per turn. Its a huge bonus that gives you the ability to do some great turn 2 perfect deepstrikes. You want to get to 5 Tithe turn 2 to drop a Bloodletter squad using Tithe and then perfect deepstrike off of the banner which you get for free with that squad. Without DftS, you can't virtually guarantee your reserves coming in.
I cannot emphasize how big DftS with an Air Superiority Detachment is for KDK. Without it, you're going to be gunned down before you hit halfway down the field. Your army is close combat specialists with no ability to get into close combat, and weak resiliency.
170pts for something to shoot a pie plate a turn without Ignores Cover is tremendously expensive. Hiding it with cultists is even more nonsensical because in an MSU list losing a few troops here and there doesn't matter. Not to mention, you want some of your gak to die anyways, you actually need most of it to die, because it makes you stronger!
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/10/12 04:39:09
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