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Hey there all, pretty much a new user here. I recently decided to hop back into the game after a long playing hiatus (since 3rd edition) and 8th is nothing close to the beast of a game I remember. It seems to be a lot more streamlined and simplified, so I figured now was as good a time as any to hop back into things. My only issue is, I have no idea how any of the armies play anymore!

I decided that my return army would be Orks, but I'm honestly lost in the sauce as far as how anything plays. I was wondering if any of you would be kind enough to give me a crash course in how Orks are played this edition? Best units? Worst units? General tips and strategies? I'll be starting this army from scratch, so I haven't made any purchases other than a box of Boyz to keep myself occupied, so I'm definitely open to any and all suggestions. I wanted to do an army of Blood Axes, as they're a bunch of kunnin gits who know all about taktiks. Is it true looted tanks are no longer a thing now? I'd honestly love to do an Armored Krumpany, but from what I understand that doesn't exist anymore either. And whats all this about Ork helicopters? As I said, starting from scratch here, so if you had to explain Orks in 40k to a basically brand new player, what would you suggest?

Cheers!

Well, it's hard to say with any certainty how orks will play when their codex eventually comes. I can tell you that, at this moment, orks are struggling fairly badly, and are one of the weakest armies out there. Their only particularly strong build is a green tide of plain choppa boyz running down the field supported by characters, and they kinda struggle to find things to supplement it. That's really all I can tell you, there should be an ork tactics thread somewhere in this forum though.

As for other things that have changed, are you familiar with how the new codices work? Armies gaining advantages due to clan, regiment, or chapter? It'll come alongside the eventual ork codex, but it means clan is more than asthetic choice. Though for all I know clans had rules back in third, haven't been playing quite that long. So it should allow for sneaky blood axes, or fast evil suns, etc.

Looted tanks are again gone, and I'm not even sure if Armored Krumpany is referring to mechanized/tank heavy orks in general or something more specific. I can tell you that, while the normal ork tank options are not amazing, Forgeworld does have some good choices with grot tanks and kill tanks, which makes for a pretty strong complement to the footslogging biyz. But it is forgeworld which is pricey if you buy direct.

Orks also have kopters and planes now. They are also on the better side of the ork list st the moment I think. Not super familiar with them, what little I know comes from someone in my group who mainly does tanks, boyz, and big gunz.

Kaldoth wrote:
Hey there all, pretty much a new user here. I recently decided to hop back into the game after a long playing hiatus (since 3rd edition) and 8th is nothing close to the beast of a game I remember. It seems to be a lot more streamlined and simplified, so I figured now was as good a time as any to hop back into things. My only issue is, I have no idea how any of the armies play anymore!

I decided that my return army would be Orks, but I'm honestly lost in the sauce as far as how anything plays. I was wondering if any of you would be kind enough to give me a crash course in how Orks are played this edition? Best units? Worst units? General tips and strategies? I'll be starting this army from scratch, so I haven't made any purchases other than a box of Boyz to keep myself occupied, so I'm definitely open to any and all suggestions. I wanted to do an army of Blood Axes, as they're a bunch of kunnin gits who know all about taktiks. Is it true looted tanks are no longer a thing now? I'd honestly love to do an Armored Krumpany, but from what I understand that doesn't exist anymore either. And whats all this about Ork helicopters? As I said, starting from scratch here, so if you had to explain Orks in 40k to a basically brand new player, what would you suggest?

Cheers!

Simple rundown would be that our best units are probably boyz and the weirdboy. Most of our shooting options are either too expensive or too fragile, so the most successful approach is walking up the field with more boyz than they have bullets and show everyone your choppas from really close everything a lot. Looted tanks are gone, so are 'ard boyz and some other stuff you might remember from 3rd, but there is some new stuff.
For more detail, have a look at the first post of this thread: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727761.page

Currently there is a rules update called "Chapter Approved" under way, which might or might not change orks a lot. The new codex is expected to appear sometime next year, so a lot might change until then.
In general, I can advice getting the "Start Collecting: Orks" box, even though the deff dread is not the most awesome unit in the codex, everything else in there is at least useful and you get great value for your money. Besides that, you can't go wrong with more boyz, no matter what will happen.

As for bloodaxes... camouflage is a pain in the rear to paint on units of 30 - unless you really love painting, you might want to rethink your choice of clans

I appreciate the responses guys!

Well, I definitely have some research to do it seems. The list I would like to build would have plenty of boyz, kommandos, and tankbustas. From what I've seen on the topics I've browsed, all three of these units are on the better end this edition which works great for me. I hate to admit I'm one of those "play to win" kind of players, but I am. Before I start purchasing anything I start thinking of how things will work tactically.

From what I've gathered, mobs of boyz are the way to go. I was thinking of running two units of 20-30. I know that boyz can split their weapon loadout between sluggas and shootas for no cost, so I was wondering if I took say a 20/30 man unit, if a 15/5 or 20/10 split between sluggas and shootas would be worth it? I figure as they're running up the board, I'm bound to lose a few to enemy shooting, so having a portion of them with shootas would give them a bit of ranged bite if they don't make charging distance in turn one while still not impacting their overall close combat effectiveness. Or, am I just making baseless assumptions and should be just kitting them all out with choppaz?

Kommandos seem like they'd be very good in small to medium size units that can take advantage of their cover save rule. I was thinking of running two ten man units with two burnas, possibly with Snikrot alongside them. How is ol' Snikrot faring this edition? For his points value, he seems like a pretty good option to make a unit of Kommandos a bit more deadly, and the 3+ to cover for him seems like it would make him a pretty reliable buff machine for any kommandoz looking to deal some damage up close. Also, the fact that I can deploy them any turn I like means they'd probably be the best late game objective grabbers available.

Tankbustas seem fairly priced for what they do. I'm just wondering is it worth the points to give them bomb squigs, tankhammers, or rokkit pistols, or is running them bare bones the way to go? I've never played them before, so I really don't know if they're better used firing rokkits off, or trying to get up close using the tankbusta bombs/tank hammers?

As far as tanks and the like, I would definitely go with the forgeworld options. I likely wouldn't be using them unless the game was 1500 points or greater, which my store plays generally 1000-1250 point matches. I know I've got some Grot Tanks to look forward to come Christmas, but are the Kill Bursta/Blasta tanks worth investing in? Or wagons with Kill Kannons?

Thanks!

If you want to 'play to win' don't play orks. At least until sometime next year after the codex drops. Try Grey Knights, or something else Human based, that you don't have to put out lots of money on a horde army that may or may not get fixed.

Don't get me wrong, I'm playing orks too, I love the story behind them, but if you are buying from new, you may be disappointing.

Kaldoth wrote:
I appreciate the responses guys!

Well, I definitely have some research to do it seems. The list I would like to build would have plenty of boyz, kommandos, and tankbustas. From what I've seen on the topics I've browsed, all three of these units are on the better end this edition which works great for me. I hate to admit I'm one of those "play to win" kind of players, but I am. Before I start purchasing anything I start thinking of how things will work tactically.

Why hate to admit it? Because some people claim moral high ground because they put less effort in their game?
The goal of a hobby is to have fun. If you repeatedly steamroll the newbies or fluff players in your store with Celestine/Roboute Guilliman/Ravenguard/Conscript soup (or whatever else the flavor of the month is), they are not having fun, so simply don't do that.
However, the new edition gave us the great option to choose between fun narrative games and matched games, so no one playing a matched game can really justify complaining about you actually trying to win.
With orks, the only lists people might be mildly annoyed about is probably those with 200+ boyz, for multiple reasons - even though it's probably the fluffiest ork army you can field.

From what I've gathered, mobs of boyz are the way to go. I was thinking of running two units of 20-30. I know that boyz can split their weapon loadout between sluggas and shootas for no cost, so I was wondering if I took say a 20/30 man unit, if a 15/5 or 20/10 split between sluggas and shootas would be worth it? I figure as they're running up the board, I'm bound to lose a few to enemy shooting, so having a portion of them with shootas would give them a bit of ranged bite if they don't make charging distance in turn one while still not impacting their overall close combat effectiveness. Or, am I just making baseless assumptions and should be just kitting them all out with choppaz?

Some people are reporting great success with this. Personally, I don't mix my units because I feel it doesn't make much of a difference and it's a pain in the rear to find those shootas in a pile of slugga boyz. However, while I often face good players, the lists are usually not tournament material. Most of them play what is in their collection and rarely go out of their way to buy a lot of new models or even armies to be more competitive. For example, if a player has only one predator tank, he won't go and buy two more, but field a whirlwind and some centurions instead for the same job.

Kommandos seem like they'd be very good in small to medium size units that can take advantage of their cover save rule. I was thinking of running two ten man units with two burnas, possibly with Snikrot alongside them.

Short answer would be, "Orks don't get cover, ever". Due to how cover works, the size of our units and the need to move toward whatever you want to chop up kommandoz will rarely, if ever, be in cover.
However, they have the awesome ability to just appear out of nowhere at the end of your movement phase. Two units of 15 kommandoz combined with a weirdboy casting Da Jump, you can ave 60 orks appear 9" from your enemies and have a decent chance to get of some charges that turn as well while your other boyz continue closing in.

How is ol' Snikrot faring this edition? For his points value, he seems like a pretty good option to make a unit of Kommandos a bit more deadly, and the 3+ to cover for him seems like it would make him a pretty reliable buff machine for any kommandoz looking to deal some damage up close. Also, the fact that I can deploy them any turn I like means they'd probably be the best late game objective grabbers available.

Pretty much the last part. He is a character, so he cannot be shot unless he is the closest model, and by turn 3 the closest model for most enemy units should be some boyz. In addition, he has the combat prowess of a warboss, so most deep strikers struggle to take him down. If your gaming tables have tall ruins (3+ storeys), I've found him useful to clear those out, as you can often deploy inside that ruin despite some scouts or tacticals sitting on top.

Tankbustas seem fairly priced for what they do. I'm just wondering is it worth the points to give them bomb squigs, tankhammers, or rokkit pistols, or is running them bare bones the way to go? I've never played them before, so I really don't know if they're better used firing rokkits off, or trying to get up close using the tankbusta bombs/tank hammers?

Tank hammers are pretty disappointing, squigs are great. I quite like the rokkit pistols as you can shoot them from your transport if it gets stuck in combat and they have more shots (and I have the metal models modeled with those). Objectively, due to worse range, strength and damage they are generally inferior to just taking rokkits unless you plan to shoot infantry (you shouldn't).

As far as tanks and the like, I would definitely go with the forgeworld options. I likely wouldn't be using them unless the game was 1500 points or greater, which my store plays generally 1000-1250 point matches. I know I've got some Grot Tanks to look forward to come Christmas, but are the Kill Bursta/Blasta tanks worth investing in? Or wagons with Kill Kannons?

Kill tanks are awesome, grot tanks are pretty much worse killa kanz. Stay away from shooty battlewagons until their points get dropped.

My Experience so far is as follows.

Boyz before toyz is going to be Gospel in anything competitive. It was like that in 4th and its like that now. we just dont get the choppa rule anymore ;(.

Weirdboyz are strong choices, i have smitten hard and often, easy to get with boyz around. Also kept 1 in a squad of nobz with ghazzy and banner nob for a really killy team.

Killtank: I have used both Variants of the main weapon and both have a place, i prefer the blaster. and regardless of the lack of AP, i have still got work done in combat with it.
also if your gona add extra weapons onto anything, the rocket racks do alright.

KMK's and Lobbas have both made themselves usefull to me, KMK's are better if they dont have lots of deepstrike because you have to put em in good lanes of fire. Lobbas you can put
anywhere. try to convert or EBAY older ones, new ones are like 60 a pop for mek gunz.

For the Points increase i would always get Zhadsnark over bikerboss, And every single game i have played ghazzy has made himself worth the price and made me happy.

Limited use for painboyz with the nerf.

Deffkoptas used to be one of my favorite models but they took a hit this edition, i still managed to make them sorta usefull but they are not great. That said Ebay ALWAYS has a ton of koptaz available
from Old AOBR (assault on Blacks Reach). i have 20ish. the first 6 i bought on purpose off ebay and the rest came as part of lots of other purchases. They are still fun and orky as hell.

since you are taking advice at the start of your army this is a perfect time to tell you to "Magnetize Everything". Any vehicles, dreads, kans, Deffkoptas ect. You will end up having to buy less crap in the long run
than i did trying to keep my ability to make any army possible. I have nearly 20k pts of orks and im sure now i coulda got away with alot less if i had magnetized.

Well, after looking at everyone's replies and a few other topics concerning Orks, I drafted up my first 1500 point army list. Having never played Orks before, I'm hoping I did alright. My biggest concern with the list is the absolute lack of vehicles of any kind. This is 100% foot sloggin', which I have never played before. I come from the land of MSU Chaos Marine squads backed by Rhinos and the like. I might need to find points to shave somewhere for transports, but then again, maybe not. Of all the units I chose that I think will suffer the most with lack of transports, its the Tankbustas. With only ten bodies and a 24" range on the Rokkits, unless I get lucky on with deployment, I don't know exactly how much damage these guys will dish out before getting shot to bits. That leaves me with KMKs, which look like they'll put out decent damage but also look squishy. I also have zero reliable anti air capability. I'd love to find 75 points to put in a Banner Nob... Ah well. C&C Welcome!

Battalion Detachment:

Warboss - 99 Pts
Kombi Skorcha, Power Klaw, Attack Squig

Weirdboy - 62 Pts

8 Nobz- 208 Pts
8x Shootas, Big Choppas

30 Boyz - 180 Pts
Nob, Sluggas, Choppas

30 boyz - 180 Pts
Nob, Sluggas, Choppas

Mek Gunz- 144 Pts
3x Kustom Mega Kannons

Mek Gunz- 144 Pts
3x Kustom Mega Kannons

Vanguard Detachment:

Boss Snikrot - 69 pts

15 Kommandos - 135 pts
Sluggas, Choppas, 2x Burna

15 Kommandos - 135 pts
Sluggas, Choppas, 2x Burna

10 Tankbustas - 170 pts
Rokkit Launchas, Stikkbombs, Tankbusta Bombs, 4x Bomb Squigs

Total: 1526 pts

Edit: Apparently I got some points costs wrong. Now I havre to shave an additional 26 points.

I'm not sure what you're using to calculate your points costs, but some of the above list is incorrect.

8x nobz with big choppas and shootas - 208 points

5x KMKs - 240 points

3x KMKs - 144 points

I wouldn't worry about not taking transports. Generally, ork transports are garbage. In some fairness, all transports got substantially more expensive (except wave serpents), but ork transports are especially bad.

They got slower (trukks especially), are incredibly easy to damage, have bad saves and toughness, and do absolutely nothing to help assault units.

You are correct, though, in being concerned about tankbustas being hard to protect without transports, though. It's a bit of a catch-22.

If you do bring a transport for them, the transport is expensive, fragile, slow, and provides very limited protection if your opponent has things like missile launchers and lascannons.

If you do not bring a transport for them, they are cut to ribbons by things like storm bolters and twin assault cannons.

In all honesty, I'm really liking KMKs as ranged support. They are absolutely not squishy, with T5 and 6W, 4+ save in cover, and since they all independent units the enemy has to make decisions on how to allocate high damage attacks, which can result in them wasting some. Their only real weakness is that in kill points games, you will pretty much auto-lose the game if an enemy gets into melee with them, as a full 5x gun unit is worth TEN kill points.

They have good range, can move and shoot decently, and can be great AA guns too, oddly. I honestly expect KMKs to be heavily nerfed in our upcoming codex. I don't want them to be, but with orks what you get is rarely what you want.

I would also strongly encourage you to bring nobs in your squads, as they are free upgrades, even if unupgraded. Also easier to hide heavy weapons than a nob squad can.

Tankbustas are useless on foot, take lootas instead. Nobz can footslog but they need max ammo runts to soak some wounds.

Get at least a bigchoppa for every squad leader. It's gona do way more work than your footslogging tankbustas. They're not great for footslogging lists because any shooty opponent will just wipe them turn one. If you really want to add ranged AT try using Badrukk. He's around the 5-strong tankbusta squad level of effectiveness when he's stationary but he's much-much tougher and can't be targeted if he's not the closest.
You also have too many big gunz and too few boyz for my liking but it's a matter of preference. As noted above, nobz really need ammo runts - they simply don't work without those. If possible, try getting a bike for your warboss. It increases his durability and mobility A LOT. And you will need a boss near both your boyz and kommandoes. Leaving a large squad without a boss is suicide.

You can also have him climb a ruin and sit in 2+ cover with a great view to shoot anyone who tries to get him.

Thanks for the replies all! As a new member on the board, I really do appreciate how helpful you all have been. Trying to put together a good n' proppa mob is a lot more difficult than I thought, but I think I may be finally getting somewhere!

Blackie wrote:Tankbustas are useless on foot, take lootas instead. Nobz can footslog but they need max ammo runts to soak some wounds.

Aye, I've decided to drop the tank bustas entirely. Just looking at them, they're too fragile to footslog and only having one transport on the field will just turn into a fire magnet. I also updated the list to put ammo runts on the Nobz. Only gonna be able to make one unit Jump per turn, so they'll need some assistance getting up the board.

koooaei wrote:Get at least a bigchoppa for every squad leader. It's gona do way more work than your footslogging tankbustas. They're not great for footslogging lists because any shooty opponent will just wipe them turn one. If you really want to add ranged AT try using Badrukk. He's around the 5-strong tankbusta squad level of effectiveness when he's stationary but he's much-much tougher and can't be targeted if he's not the closest.
You also have too many big gunz and too few boyz for my liking but it's a matter of preference. As noted above, nobz really need ammo runts - they simply don't work without those. If possible, try getting a bike for your warboss. It increases his durability and mobility A LOT. And you will need a boss near both your boyz and kommandoes. Leaving a large squad without a boss is suicide.

List updated with big choppas. I downsized on the big gunz, reduced the boy mobs by 5 a piece, and added in another 25 man mob of boyz. Not being maxxed out will make it riskier as far as losing the Green Tide rule to shooting, but I think having three mobs of boys will compensate for the size reduction. Enemy has to either split fire and cause 5 wounds across each mob, or focus them down one at a time. Either way, he's looking at a crapload of orks in his lines by turn two. As far as the boss goes, I could remove Snikrot from board and replace him with another boss, but I don't know if I want to make that sacrifice. Snikrot looks like he can tear up a back line pretty well. Artillery, devastators, etc. Or if I'd like to use him more offensively, having him charge in with a unit of Kommandos makes them even more killy because of the reroll bubble.

So, all that being said, here is the updated list! Removed the Vanguard for a loss of one CP and rolled the Kommandos into the BN detachment to save points. If I did my math right I should be sitting with 25 more points to spend. But what to spend it on?

Battalion Detachment:

HQ:

Warboss - 99 Pts
Kombi Skorcha, Power Klaw, Attack Squig

Weirdboy - 62 Pts

Boss Snikrot - 69 pts


Elites:

8 Nobz- 240 Pts
8 Ammo runts, 10x Sluggas, Big Choppas

15 Kommandos - 144 pts
Boss Nob w Big Choppa, Sluggas, Choppas, 2x Burna

15 Kommandos - 144 pts
Boss Nob w Big Choppa, Sluggas, Choppas, 2x Burna


Troops:

25 Boyz - 159 Pts
Nob w Big Choppa, Sluggas, Choppas

25 boyz - 159 Pts
Nob w Big Choppa, Sluggas, Choppas

25 boyz - 159 Pts
Nob w Big Choppa, Sluggas, Choppas


Heavy Support

Mek Gunz- 144 Pts
5x Kustom Mega Kannons


Total: 1475

I would split up your kommandos into min squads of 5. You'll get more free burnas and nobs, unlock more vanguard detachments for a few extra cps and you'll get more chances to roll the 9 for your charge to tie more things up from shootings next turn. It also gives you some more flexibility to leave a unit or two in reserves until turn 3 to hop onto an objective away from the fighting.