Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

A very straightforward list, intended for ITC format (i'll be trying this in a 80+ player tourney soon..)

Previously I had been running 3x twin AC razorbacks + 2x quad lascannon preds with chronus. 24" range was problematic, and the lascannon predators were powerful but were focused quickly and pretty fragile. Either i didn't have enough razorback shooting in range, or my lascannon preds would get shot apart on T1 and i would be slowly picked apart by heavier stuff. Short range meant i had a hard time keeping a decent amount of space between me and my opponent in the early turns. Keeping all the vehicles near RG was pretty tough as well, as they take up a lot of space.

This list aims to address all of these problems while maximising damage on T1.
Longer range, and no single targetable unit fulfilling an important role, limiting my opponent's options. UM chapter tactics fall-back & shoot on the dreadnoughts is a nice plus compared to razorbacks losing a turn of shooting, although at -2 to hit, not a major consideration.

In terms of firepower:
36 autocannons -> 72 autocannon shots, the bulk of which is going to get RR to hit & wound. Simply standing and shooting (assuming i can fit them in the RG bubble and i'm not against a neg to hit army), that's 66 autocannon hits on T1 with RR wounds. With 48" range, can focus pretty much whatever i want on the table, and am not forced to move and suffer -1 to hit.

Scouts because I can only afford scouts or tacs for the slot without compromising on firepower, and scouts occasionally will have more utility. I expect them to get shot off the table very quickly.

I'm not really attached to the HQ choices, but i'm pretty limited in what i can choose without dropping a dreadnought. At least one techmarine seems like a good idea, though.



++ Super-Heavy Auxiliary Detachment (Imperium - Space Marines) [18 PL, 400pts] ++

+ Lord of War [18 PL, 400pts] +

Roboute Guilliman [18 PL, 400pts]

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [95 PL, 1600pts] ++

+ HQ [8 PL, 124pts] +

Techmarine [4 PL, 62pts]: Bolt pistol, Power axe [5pts], Servo-arm [12pts]

Techmarine [4 PL, 62pts]: Bolt pistol, Power axe [5pts], Servo-arm [12pts]

+ Troops [18 PL, 195pts] +

Scout Squad [6 PL, 65pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 3x Scout w/Boltgun [33pts]
. Scout w/Heavy Weapon [21pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 65pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 3x Scout w/Boltgun [33pts]
. Scout w/Heavy Weapon [21pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 65pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 3x Scout w/Boltgun [33pts]
. Scout w/Heavy Weapon [21pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]

+ Elites [45 PL, 876pts] +

Dreadnought [7 PL, 136pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Dreadnought [7 PL, 136pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Dreadnought [7 PL, 136pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Venerable Dreadnought [8 PL, 156pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Venerable Dreadnought [8 PL, 156pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Venerable Dreadnought [8 PL, 156pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

+ Heavy Support [24 PL, 405pts] +

Mortis Dreadnought [8 PL, 135pts]
. Two twin autocannons [60pts]: 2x Twin autocannon [60pts]

Mortis Dreadnought [8 PL, 135pts]
. Two twin autocannons [60pts]: 2x Twin autocannon [60pts]

Mortis Dreadnought [8 PL, 135pts]
. Two twin autocannons [60pts]: 2x Twin autocannon [60pts]

++ Total: [113 PL, 2000pts] ++

While it's certainly impressive, would it be worth considering dropping one Dread and using the points to bulk out your Troops a bit more?

Yeah, I'm considering dropping one of the venerables to spend on troops or something else to bolster list.
If i ran 6 squads of scouts i'd have significantly more presence and would be able to actually hold objectives in the early turns.

This would also mean that there is less pressure on the dreadnought / guiliman bubble to move forward and penalise their shooting for pretty much the first half of the game.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So this is what it looks like if i do the above and drop a dread for more scouts:

++ Super-Heavy Auxiliary Detachment (Imperium - Space Marines) [18 PL, 400pts] ++

+ Lord of War [18 PL, 400pts] +

Roboute Guilliman [18 PL, 400pts]

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [105 PL, 1599pts] ++

+ HQ [8 PL, 124pts] +

Techmarine [4 PL, 62pts]: Bolt pistol, Power axe [5pts], Servo-arm [12pts]

Techmarine [4 PL, 62pts]: Bolt pistol, Power axe [5pts], Servo-arm [12pts]

+ Troops [36 PL, 350pts] +

Scout Squad [6 PL, 65pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 3x Scout w/Boltgun [33pts]
. Scout w/Heavy Weapon [21pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 65pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 3x Scout w/Boltgun [33pts]
. Scout w/Heavy Weapon [21pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 55pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 4x Scout w/Boltgun [44pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 55pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 4x Scout w/Boltgun [44pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 55pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 4x Scout w/Boltgun [44pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 55pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 4x Scout w/Boltgun [44pts]

+ Elites [37 PL, 720pts] +

Dreadnought [7 PL, 136pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Dreadnought [7 PL, 136pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Dreadnought [7 PL, 136pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Venerable Dreadnought [8 PL, 156pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Venerable Dreadnought [8 PL, 156pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

+ Heavy Support [24 PL, 405pts] +

Mortis Dreadnought [8 PL, 135pts]
. Two twin autocannons [60pts]: 2x Twin autocannon [60pts]

Mortis Dreadnought [8 PL, 135pts]
. Two twin autocannons [60pts]: 2x Twin autocannon [60pts]

Mortis Dreadnought [8 PL, 135pts]
. Two twin autocannons [60pts]: 2x Twin autocannon [60pts]

++ Total: [123 PL, 1999pts] ++

Its more efficient to use contemptor mortis dreadnoughts. They are 166 pts. with twin autocannons, have BS/WS 2+ T7 W10 and 5++.

At first glance, yeah. I thought about it.
It is a bit of tradeoff, as they also give up big game hunter points (they are 10 wounds) in ITC which was part of my decision to go with regular mortis dreads. The extra wounds are basically a liability in that format, especially if i take 3 of them. Shooting-wise, BS2+ isn't really worth the extra points. The 5++ is very nice though so i was almost swayed, as the list can always use more durability.

Against some armies (really powerful / durable gunlines) and in terms of stats, they would be a better choice though, just depends on the mission format I guess.

The above said, it might make sense to mix in 1 or 2 contemptor mortis dreads.
2 points isn't really a viable secondary objective.

So, if i were to trade a scout squad and a HB for the upgrade to contemptors:

++ Super-Heavy Auxiliary Detachment (Imperium - Space Marines) [18 PL, 400pts] ++

+ Lord of War [18 PL, 400pts] +

Roboute Guilliman [18 PL, 400pts]

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [101 PL, 1596pts] ++

+ HQ [8 PL, 124pts] +

Techmarine [4 PL, 62pts]: Bolt pistol, Power axe [5pts], Servo-arm [12pts]

Techmarine [4 PL, 62pts]: Bolt pistol, Power axe [5pts], Servo-arm [12pts]

+ Troops [30 PL, 285pts] +

Scout Squad [6 PL, 65pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 3x Scout w/Boltgun [33pts]
. Scout w/Heavy Weapon [21pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 55pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 4x Scout w/Boltgun [44pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 55pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 4x Scout w/Boltgun [44pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 55pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 4x Scout w/Boltgun [44pts]

Scout Squad [6 PL, 55pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Boltgun/Bolt pistol
. 4x Scout w/Boltgun [44pts]

+ Elites [37 PL, 720pts] +

Dreadnought [7 PL, 136pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Dreadnought [7 PL, 136pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Dreadnought [7 PL, 136pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Venerable Dreadnought [8 PL, 156pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

Venerable Dreadnought [8 PL, 156pts]: Twin autocannon [33pts], Twin autocannon [33pts]

+ Heavy Support [26 PL, 467pts] +

Contemptor Mortis Dreadnought [9 PL, 166pts]
. Two twin autocannons [60pts]: 2x Twin autocannon [60pts]

Contemptor Mortis Dreadnought [9 PL, 166pts]
. Two twin autocannons [60pts]: 2x Twin autocannon [60pts]

Mortis Dreadnought [8 PL, 135pts]
. Two twin autocannons [60pts]: 2x Twin autocannon [60pts]

You could make them RG for -1 to hit, with a seperate techmarine. Makes them even harder to kill.

The other option is Deredeo with atomantic Pavase. He's only 36 inch range but he can give a few dreads that sweet invulnerable and stationary he's still hitting alitoc flyers at -1 instead of -2.

I think as far as the Rifleman Dread spam are, I would still like to have a dread or two having DCCW to help Guilliman in combat. The Primarch cannot be at everywhere at the same time. So imho a helper dealing with multiple big MCs in combat would be welcomed.

I've ran a similar list to really great success (won 2 tournaments with it). You'll be solid with what you have, but I've made some changes to my list and maybe it'll help or give you some ideas.


One thing I've done is swap 2 dreads (16 shots) for 1 leviathan with dual storm cannons (20 shots) and you get that sweet -2 AP. I also only play a single techmarine and add Tigurius to buff the leviathan to T9 and -1 to hit with the natural 4++, as well as access to Null Zone (which has cause the deaths of many Custode Bike Captains). This Leviathan has eaten multiple turns of shooting from 5 Leman Russes in one tournament round to 6 Broadsides in another round. The T7 8W dreadnoughts always die much quicker and having a bullet sponge helps them keep firing for longer.

Another unit I've found to work really well is the Whirlwind Scorpius. S6 AP -2 and 2D with 48" range is almost identical to the autocannons, but with better AP and no need to for LOS. Guilliman buffing this thing woth 6D3 shots (normally 11) really helps kill scoring units out of LOS or if needed any target that the dreads would shoot. Kill enemy scary stuff early then hunt troops.

This leaves me with about 5 dreads, 1 levia, 1 whirlwind, the 2 characters, 3 scout squads, and Roboute. Essentially the list looks great but I just recommend adding some OP Forgeworld.

Amazing post, i hadn't thought of any of those combos and some real wisdom here!
Buffing the durability of the leviathan really helps deal with the problem of it getting focused (at T9, -1 to hit & 4++ instead it becomes a damage sink - win). I wasn't running it because i didn't want to create a "chink in the armour" by giving my opponent an obvious target. But at 309 points with the added durability it's certainly attractive, and i can overlook 24" range for extra shots & AP.

For some reason i had always glossed over tigurius because my brain auto-associates "space marine librarian = terrible". Null zone may also occasionally come in handy and be absolutely clutch when fighting monstrous creatures, and now i have a solid reason to actually include it. Awesome.

The scorpios is a cute choice and may really come in handy for pushing MSUs or weak infantry off objectives in the midgame.

On top of all that, it sounds even more competitive, good at all the same things, while achieving a more balanced & fun list - great stuff.

Neophyte2012 wrote:
I think as far as the Rifleman Dread spam are, I would still like to have a dread or two having DCCW to help Guilliman in combat. The Primarch cannot be at everywhere at the same time. So imho a helper dealing with multiple big MCs in combat would be welcomed.

Chaplain dreds fit this role perfectly. As being characters, they cannot be shot, and could safely shoot back with BS2+.