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As the title suggests, I intend for this to be some sort of "writing challenge". From what I've seen, most people believe that the Thousand Sons were at no fault and were purely victims. Most evidence that I've seen supports this argument, which is what makes defending this side of the argument a bit challenging. The purpose of this "challenge" is to use evidence and logic to defend the Space Wolves for the destruction of Prospero and the Thousand Sons, and although at first you may not believe in what you're writing, you and those who read your argument may come to a new way of thinking.

Good luck and have fun!

(Note: This isn't meant to be a debate about whether the Space Wolves were right or wrong, but a persuasive argument. That said, I do encourage disputing points for the purpose of further understanding on the subject.)

Horus was the Warmaster; given the duty of commanding the Emperor's forces during the Great Crusade, if he commanded/persuaded Russ that the destruction of the Thousand Sons was preferable to their imprisonment then Russ could hardly ignore him. And despite following Horus' orders, Russ did give Magnus one last chance to give himself up - of course he didn't realise that the Thousand Sons spy he was trying to communicate to Magnus through was corrupted by Chaos. Plus it didn't help that Magnus stayed inside for most of the assault sulking rather than simpler stride out to meet Russ and give himself up.

But despite that, MAGNUS DID NOTHING WRONG!

 mrhappyface wrote:
Horus was the Warmaster; given the duty of commanding the Emperor's forces during the Great Crusade, if he commanded/persuaded Russ that the destruction of the Thousand Sons was preferable to their imprisonment then Russ could hardly ignore him. And despite following Horus' orders, Russ did give Magnus one last chance to give himself up - of course he didn't realise that the Thousand Sons spy he was trying to communicate to Magnus through was corrupted by Chaos. Plus it didn't help that Magnus stayed inside for most of the assault sulking rather than simpler stride out to meet Russ and give himself up.

But despite that, MAGNUS DID NOTHING WRONG!

While Magnus did do a heck of a lot wrong, he didn't do anything malicious. Horus was smart enough (at least at the start) to know that Big Daddy E had secret plans for a reason and that when he said stuff like "Don't do daemonic stuff Magnus you bloody idiot", he said it for a reason. Even if that reason was stupid and the Emperor was so post-human as to not understand even basic human emotion anymore.

As for what the Space Wolves did, despite the Wolves being more and more painted as hypocritical furry fetishists with each passing day by GW, Russ was absolutely and unequivocally in the right. As far as Russ was concerned, Horus was still the Warmaster and loyal to the Emperor, and if the Emperor told Horus to tell Russ "It's time for purge number 3 go do what you were designed for." then that is what Russ would do. Russ had no obligation to show the slightest hint of mercy to Magnus, but he did because that is what brothers do.

Eh, Space Wolves have been made out to me (at least in the HH books) to basically be the stereotypical "I was only following orders" goons you see in a lot of silly military movies. While it's a reasonable excuse for a lot of stuff, it makes the Space Wolves one of the most shallow and uninteresting factions in HH.

Thousand Son's weren't malicious in their actions but they were arrogant and assumed they had a mastery of the Warp that they didn't actually have. Nikea should have been a major flag for them which caused them to rethink their assumptions and approach but instead they stubbornly clung on to their beliefs which ultimately ended up with Magnus damming the entire human race and ruining the Emperor's plan, all done with the best of intentions though.The Emperor is understandably upset about this and he sends Russ to fetch Magnus and bring him back to Terra armed with his legion, some Custodian and Sister's of silence assistance and this writ of censure https://i.redd.it/hxdyq91kxymy.png which basically says Russ can do whatever he wants in pursuit of his mission and there's nothing anyone can do to limit him.

Russ head's out to prospero with all this and with already existing bad blood between the two primarchs based entirely on their approaches to the warp and then he has Horus whispering into his ear about some new bad stuff Magnus has been up to and he urges Russ to go in heavy and punish Magnus, it's pretty understandable for Russ to take the Warmaster, Favoured son of the Emperor and the Brother he's known longest at his word. So when the wolves arrive all full of righteous fury they go straight on the attack, the Son's defend themselves everything as is expected but then the Son's reap the harvest they've sown, the flesh change strikes and turns them into monsters, all sorts of crazy, currupted pycshic gak happens and the Wolves have utter proof that they were in the right, the Son's were corrupted by their powers, they had strayed off the path and they needed to be purged. At this point the destruction of the legion is guaranteed, the Emperor would undoubtedly have ordered the legion dissolved and purged once he heard about the scale of the corruption in any case. And the final point to be made I guess is that Russ was charged to bring Magnus back to Terra, it doesn't say anything about his legion or Prospero. If Russ felt he needed to annihilate Magnus's legion and raze his homeworld then he was empowered to do so as long as he brought Magnus back, which he might have done if he and Magnus hadn't ended up in a fight to the death that ends with Magnus spiriting himself and his legion away.

Suffer not the witch to live. Anything else is simply heresy. No further explanation is needed.

 Elbows wrote:
Eh, Space Wolves have been made out to me (at least in the HH books) to basically be the stereotypical "I was only following orders" goons you see in a lot of silly military movies. While it's a reasonable excuse for a lot of stuff, it makes the Space Wolves one of the most shallow and uninteresting factions in HH.

Depends on how you read on what Russ and his legion had to do. Between what ever happened to the two we don't talked about legions, his conflict with Angron and his legion showing that if he was called in means that any time he's called in that what he and his legion have to fight is not gonna listen to reason and his personal problems with Magnus, he tried to avoid all out war. It didn't work out that way and both sides of the story is tragic in it's own way.

 buddha wrote:
Suffer not the witch to live. Anything else is simply heresy. No further explanation is needed.

Do as I say not do as I do and please ignore my runepriests

Horus' wish - for Russ to exterminate Magnus and his sons - was directly contrary to the writ issued to Russ by his Emperor, which very clearly stated that Magnus should be brought before the throne, there to answer for his transgressions.

Russ, however, being small and furry of mind and slow of wit could not see that the wishes of a brother could not, did not and should not countermand the wishes of his father emperor, and that the very act of trying to countermand them in fact should have placed Horus under a deep shadow of suspicion.

This was compounded by Russ' barbaric and insatiable blood-lust - which is to say that a lower creature, such as him, cannot fairly be held to the same standards of reason, honour and word given as can the average human. Therefore, while his actions and that of his pack of rabid dogs cannot be 'defended', they can at least be excused as the effect of brutal and instinctive minds. You might as well blame the sea for rising - it has no self control or reason.

Think that about sums it up?

A) The Emperor made a decree at Nikea and made it clear it was a capitol crime. Despite this Magnus continued his ways with catastrophic results justifying the emperors decision.

B) The Space Wolves were sent to bring Magnus before the emperor to answer for his crime, en route Horus led Russ to believe that the emperors orders had changed , that Magnus was too far gone and he was to be executed. Despite this Russ pleaded with Magnus through the remembrancer Kasper Hauser to surrender believing that the remembrancer was an unwitting spy for the Crimson King (this later turned out to be another deception by Horus).

C) Despite Magnus telling his sons indeed they were wrong and he'd made a horrible mistake, they chose to fight back anyway, this convinced Russ more so that Horus was correct.

D) Russ acknowledged to Valdor that there was some hypocrisy in his use of rune priests but it was necessary as it takes the warp to fight the warp. He also pointed out some differences - that he knew to be afraid of the warp and that his rune priests recreated the elements of Fenris , where the thousand sons and other psykers summon warp magic and other unnatural things. The 1ksons even consorted with demons!

E) The flesh change during the burning of Prospero is further proof that Russ was right and Magnus and his legion had lost control.

F through to Z) MAGNUS MADE A DEAL WITH FETHING TZEENTCH!!!

D) Russ acknowledged to Valdor that there was some hypocrisy in his use of rune priests but it was necessary as it takes the warp to fight the warp. He also pointed out some differences - that he knew to be afraid of the warp and that his rune priests recreated the elements of Fenris ,

They recreated the elements of Fenris... With the Warp!

I dislike the wolves, but neither side were really guilty.

They were loyal to their commanders. They were commanded to exterminate the Sons. They went there and made an attempt to avoid it then followed out their orders.

The Space Wolves are a bunch of flea-bitten, mangy beasts who were only too happy to follow Horus's orders, as they already didn't like the TKsons. They followed Horus's orders to the letter, without question (you know, "wipe your brothers out, cuz I said so"; I'm pretty sure if the Marines were told to wipe out the National Guard, they'd go "wait, wtf?!" and ask questions before doing so).

Granted, Magnus disobeyed his father; but he did it to save the Imperium. He disobeyed to save the universe and lost, meanwhile Russ obeyed insane orders to the letter, and lost an entire chapter of marines to Chaos. Bad dog!

The mongrels also have a history of saying "this is bad, but it's okay for us to do cuz we do it differently" in regards to psykers. They're hypocrites, donkey-caves, and they deserved to have Magnus return with a vengeance to wipe out most of their chapter. Too bad he didn't get all of them.

They get literally zero forgiveness. Except on the grounds that I have an awesome Daemon Primarch model. So...I guess there's that!

At the end of the day, Magnus messed up so bad its the single reason the heresy wasn't over in a month with Big E laying the smackdown on the traitor legions himself.

Despite not liking the SW look or them really in general (Russ was at fault completely with the whole DA debacle) Russ didn't do anything wrong in this case. Big E told him to bring back Magnus in chains and then Horus (who was speaking with the authority of the emperor) told him that there had been a slight change and to kill Magnus. Not only was he following an order but it wasn't even that big of a leap to think the order had been changed considering just how badly Magnus had just screwed over all of humanity

Nope... I'm a Thousand Sons fan. So, even if someone was able to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that they the Thousand Sons were completely at fault, I wouldn't lift a finger to defend the Space Wolves.

SG

I actually want to see the SW chapter get 100% annihilated. Tyranids, Magnus, Angry Marines, Deathworld Fleas, PETA...I don't care who does it.

Easy answer: everyone was wrong and should feel bad for what they did.

So when the wolves arrive all full of righteous fury they go straight on the attack,

That is blatantly untrue. Please read the relevant material.

The Space Wolves are a bunch of flea-bitten, mangy beasts who were only too happy to follow Horus's orders, as they already didn't like the TKsons. They followed Horus's orders to the letter, without question (you know, "wipe your brothers out, cuz I said so"; I'm pretty sure if the Marines were told to wipe out the National Guard, they'd go "wait, wtf?!" and ask questions before doing so).

Granted, Magnus disobeyed his father; but he did it to save the Imperium. He disobeyed to save the universe and lost, meanwhile Russ obeyed insane orders to the letter, and lost an entire chapter of marines to Chaos. Bad dog!

The mongrels also have a history of saying "this is bad, but it's okay for us to do cuz we do it differently" in regards to psykers. They're hypocrites, donkey-caves, and they deserved to have Magnus return with a vengeance to wipe out most of their chapter. Too bad he didn't get all of them.

They get literally zero forgiveness. Except on the grounds that I have an awesome Daemon Primarch model. So...I guess there's that!

Ah so thoughtful a piece of prose was never written. Also blatantly wrong. Again read the material. Thousand Sons were already consorting with daemons. They just hadn't realized how corrupted they had become.

Russ, however, being small and furry of mind and slow of wit could not see that the wishes of a brother could not, did not and should not countermand the wishes of his father emperor, and that the very act of trying to countermand them in fact should have placed Horus under a deep shadow of suspicion.

This was compounded by Russ' barbaric and insatiable blood-lust - which is to say that a lower creature, such as him, cannot fairly be held to the same standards of reason, honour and word given as can the average human. Therefore, while his actions and that of his pack of rabid dogs cannot be 'defended', they can at least be excused as the effect of brutal and instinctive minds. You might as well blame the sea for rising - it has no self control or reason.

Think that about sums it up?

I think it shows that maybe you need to simplify things then insult and make caricatures of things you don't like for some reason.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
As for what the Space Wolves did, despite the Wolves being more and more painted as hypocritical furry fetishists with each passing day by GW, Russ was absolutely and unequivocally in the right. As far as Russ was concerned, Horus was still the Warmaster and loyal to the Emperor, and if the Emperor told Horus to tell Russ "It's time for purge number 3 go do what you were designed for." then that is what Russ would do. Russ had no obligation to show the slightest hint of mercy to Magnus, but he did because that is what brothers do.

Yup, he was "right" if we take definition of "right" from dictionary of the Ethiopian language published in 1893 in order to prove his orders (that were loud and clear to anyone sane with a pair of eyes) didn't include permission to fire pistols in close proximity of the Thousand Sons therefore were totally invalid

Yeah, let's ignore the fact the Emperor ordered Magnus captured, not killed, the fact Malcador outright stated DON'T DO ANYTHING RASH YOU MORON, the fact that Valdor, a man arguably as important as Horus was screaming about censuring, not carpet bombing the whole time, and the fact head Wolfwolf went with orders of the at best fourth important guy ignoring the orders of the top three. Especially seeing the whole operation was purely the matter of Terran policies and Horus had literally nothing to do with it. Also, multiple new sources state battle of Prospero was in fact first real SM/SM fight (that so shocked multiple Primarchs they demanded Russ to be purged in turn, something that wouldn't happen if the fanon about the "other" purges was true) and to make SW treason even worse, Russ composed a treatise on how to best kill loyalist SM after Prospero and handed it to Horus, not giving a copy to any of his loyal brothers.

But I digress. In fact, we can put the blame on someone else. Namely, the Emperor. In his incompetence, when he saw Curze, Mortarion, Russ, Angron and Lorgar, he shown these wild animals completely absurd and pointless mercy, not ordering them shot on the spot, but allowing them to corrupt five fine legions. Had he simply had these barbarians killed, maybe Imperial Heralds or War Hounds would be slightly less efficient in the short term, but in the long one, literally everyone around would be better off and Heresy would not happen (or even if it did, it would be easily contained with loyalist forces). Therefore, the Emperor is to blame for the acts of these deviants, especially in the light of his supposed precognition

[quote=Irbis 762632 10123222 eb7537affff87d4e2e3959dd5b7ad92b.jpg

But I digress. In fact, we can put the blame on someone else. Namely, the Emperor. In his incompetence, when he saw Curze, Mortarion, Russ, Angron and Lorgar, he shown these wild animals completely absurd and pointless mercy, not ordering them shot on the spot, but allowing them to corrupt five fine legions. Had he simply had these barbarians killed, maybe Imperial Heralds or War Hounds would be slightly less efficient in the short term, but in the long one, literally everyone around would be better off and Heresy would not happen (or even if it did, it would be easily contained with loyalist forces). Therefore, the Emperor is to blame for the acts of these deviants, especially in the light of his supposed precognition

 Elbows wrote:
Eh, Space Wolves have been made out to me (at least in the HH books) to basically be the stereotypical "I was only following orders" goons you see in a lot of silly military movies. While it's a reasonable excuse for a lot of stuff, it makes the Space Wolves one of the most shallow and uninteresting factions in HH.

That might be the case if Prosperio was the END of the "Space Wolves character arc" but it's NOT. It's the beginning. far from being the "I was just following orders" guy. the Space Wolves is the guy at the beginning of the movie who is ordered to commit an atrocity, and finds himself asking ".. what have I done" To use a Star Wars Analogy, the Space Wolves aren't Anakin killing children in the Jedi Temple in ROTS. it's Finn taking part in the Raid at the beginning of TFA.

Prosperio is why the Space Wolves of 40k are notoriously independant minded, and tend to focus on their views of "what is right/best for the IoM" instead of mindlessly following orders of the Emperor's designated proxies. The High Lords of Terra had to create a whole new Space Marine Chapter (the Minotaurs) to do the Job that the Heresy era Space Wolves did.

 Galas wrote:
The new lore suggest that it was all the plan of the Emperor. He didn't make all Primarchs equal, and he had planed the Heresy from the beginning. What did go wrong was Chaos making it happen too soon, and the destruction of the Webway proyect.

In other words, the new lore suggests that the Emperor was so full of pride that he thought in his genius that he could manipulate basically every major player in the galaxy at that point in time in an exacting fashion that would result in the annihilation of the space marine legions and somehow leave his empire squeaky clean.

The Emperor thought he could outsmart chaos, and in doing so proved himself to be very, very stupid.

NERDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sorry, but every time I think of the wolves attacking Prospero all I can think of is that old movie with the Jocks yelling NERDS! and then beating the crap out of the geeky kids....granted the geeks won in the end (Spoiler alert, Magnus wins in the end)

 Arachnofiend wrote:

 Galas wrote:
The new lore suggest that it was all the plan of the Emperor. He didn't make all Primarchs equal, and he had planed the Heresy from the beginning. What did go wrong was Chaos making it happen too soon, and the destruction of the Webway proyect.

In other words, the new lore suggests that the Emperor was so full of pride that he thought in his genius that he could manipulate basically every major player in the galaxy at that point in time in an exacting fashion that would result in the annihilation of the space marine legions and somehow leave his empire squeaky clean.

The Emperor thought he could outsmart chaos, and in doing so proved himself to be very, very stupid.

Basically, yes. He wanted to destroy Space Marines after the Great Crusade just like he did with the Thunder Warriors. He fooled Chaos once, when he made that pact to make the Primarchs. But in the end, the Chaos Gods got him.

Here is my attempt (in truth I think it is both parties that are to blame to be honest for how things played out). Minor spoilers from Wolfsbane and a book here and there.


The whole hypocrisy and sorcery bit: What if Russ (and by extension the Khan but coming from opposite directions) are right? That is to say, what if there is a fundamental difference in how the Russ and the Khan utilize their warp powers versus the Thousands Sons, which to me seems to be supported in Wolfsbane and the books about the Khan (Path to Heaven? or maybe Scars I'd have to check). The V and VI both promote a more moderate approach to using Warp Powers, of knowing one's limit and lines and not crossing them. Meanwhile the XV promoted constant improvement and passing those lines in the name of understanding and personal improvement. This would be fine if it wasn't for the nature of the warp; the more you are exposed to it, the more corruption you receive. Combine this with the fact the XV tutelaries are literal chaos daemons in disguise. This would help explain how the TS suffer the flesh change in a more specific way- it's not only some genetic flaw but a direct result of working with daemons and channeling the warp directly through the XV legionaries themselves and their tutelary who is always closeby. They are the first chaos spawns, they just didn't live in the warp at the time so the only time it could happen would be when they are channeling powers, and the more you channel the worse it gets except for the most powerful, or those chosen to be spared by Tzeentch/chaos in general. In this hypothetical the TS need to censored not for the act of using the warp, but HOW they use it because it is fundamentally flawed. Now why would the Emperor make them this way (or allow them to operate for so long if it wasn't) is another question entirely, but this explanation seems consistent with what we have observed.


Compare that to the Khan, who's librarians always advocated limitations. Russ also advocated limitations, and Fenris itself seemingly has some sort of warp entity/something odd in the form of Morkai and his realm Russ visited who acts as a buffer. It is therefore not implausible to argue that this more limited approach to the warp was much safer. Since one knows ones' limits and won't channel nearly as much warp power, one can stay far safer, even more so if one is channeling the power in a more round-about way rather than a tutelary.

With these hypothetical (but relatively safe to say) points set as true, then Russ can feel completely fine censuring Magnus for sorcery because it is a nuance of how the warp is being used, not the use itself that is the problem. The flesh change (which Russ would know of because of the Ark Reach cluster) would confirm Russ' fears and he was as much trying to protect Magnus as rebuke him at Nikea. To hear Horus say Magnus has continued his practices and in fact did something so bad worthy of censure after being warned, to the point of being ordered to kill Magnus, the Wolf King could only fear the worse. Perhaps what happened the II and XI could have lent strength to his fears, but that is just conjecture. Either way given the limited information he'd have it's not ludicrious for Russ to attack Magnus as a wayward son.

Having said that, after the moment Russ saw the defenses were down at Prospero why he landed guns blazing is a major problem I have personally. I'm not sure if this is a defense for the SW per se, but it certainly would put into context on why they'd be fine censoring the sorcerers while they themselves used the warp, which is the main reason for the conflict in the first place.

 Irbis wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
As for what the Space Wolves did, despite the Wolves being more and more painted as hypocritical furry fetishists with each passing day by GW, Russ was absolutely and unequivocally in the right. As far as Russ was concerned, Horus was still the Warmaster and loyal to the Emperor, and if the Emperor told Horus to tell Russ "It's time for purge number 3 go do what you were designed for." then that is what Russ would do. Russ had no obligation to show the slightest hint of mercy to Magnus, but he did because that is what brothers do.

Yup, he was "right" if we take definition of "right" from dictionary of the Ethiopian language published in 1893 in order to prove his orders (that were loud and clear to anyone sane with a pair of eyes) didn't include permission to fire pistols in close proximity of the Thousand Sons therefore were totally invalid

Yeah, let's ignore the fact the Emperor ordered Magnus captured, not killed, the fact Malcador outright stated DON'T DO ANYTHING RASH YOU MORON, the fact that Valdor, a man arguably as important as Horus was screaming about censuring, not carpet bombing the whole time, and the fact head Wolfwolf went with orders of the at best fourth important guy ignoring the orders of the top three. Especially seeing the whole operation was purely the matter of Terran policies and Horus had literally nothing to do with it. Also, multiple new sources state battle of Prospero was in fact first real SM/SM fight (that so shocked multiple Primarchs they demanded Russ to be purged in turn, something that wouldn't happen if the fanon about the "other" purges was true) and to make SW treason even worse, Russ composed a treatise on how to best kill loyalist SM after Prospero and handed it to Horus, not giving a copy to any of his loyal brothers.

But I digress. In fact, we can put the blame on someone else. Namely, the Emperor. In his incompetence, when he saw Curze, Mortarion, Russ, Angron and Lorgar, he shown these wild animals completely absurd and pointless mercy, not ordering them shot on the spot, but allowing them to corrupt five fine legions. Had he simply had these barbarians killed, maybe Imperial Heralds or War Hounds would be slightly less efficient in the short term, but in the long one, literally everyone around would be better off and Heresy would not happen (or even if it did, it would be easily contained with loyalist forces). Therefore, the Emperor is to blame for the acts of these deviants, especially in the light of his supposed precognition

All of this is ignoring that Russ and his Legion are the only ones pre heresy who had been called on at least once and possible three times to fight another legion for real. Something that the first few HH novels make clear is something that is so alien that the first time it happens, the marines involved barely know how to process or justify it. Russ and his Legion have been through all of that, so the order to them is not unusual. Russ would have no reason to suspect that Horus was tricking him or lying. The Night of the Wolf happened well before Prospero. Not only had Russ fought another legion, he nearly had one of his brothers murder him. Plus most of the slaughter is on Magnus deciding to let most of his legion die out of guilt.

HoundsofDemos wrote:

 Irbis wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
As for what the Space Wolves did, despite the Wolves being more and more painted as hypocritical furry fetishists with each passing day by GW, Russ was absolutely and unequivocally in the right. As far as Russ was concerned, Horus was still the Warmaster and loyal to the Emperor, and if the Emperor told Horus to tell Russ "It's time for purge number 3 go do what you were designed for." then that is what Russ would do. Russ had no obligation to show the slightest hint of mercy to Magnus, but he did because that is what brothers do.

Yup, he was "right" if we take definition of "right" from dictionary of the Ethiopian language published in 1893 in order to prove his orders (that were loud and clear to anyone sane with a pair of eyes) didn't include permission to fire pistols in close proximity of the Thousand Sons therefore were totally invalid

Yeah, let's ignore the fact the Emperor ordered Magnus captured, not killed, the fact Malcador outright stated DON'T DO ANYTHING RASH YOU MORON, the fact that Valdor, a man arguably as important as Horus was screaming about censuring, not carpet bombing the whole time, and the fact head Wolfwolf went with orders of the at best fourth important guy ignoring the orders of the top three. Especially seeing the whole operation was purely the matter of Terran policies and Horus had literally nothing to do with it. Also, multiple new sources state battle of Prospero was in fact first real SM/SM fight (that so shocked multiple Primarchs they demanded Russ to be purged in turn, something that wouldn't happen if the fanon about the "other" purges was true) and to make SW treason even worse, Russ composed a treatise on how to best kill loyalist SM after Prospero and handed it to Horus, not giving a copy to any of his loyal brothers.

But I digress. In fact, we can put the blame on someone else. Namely, the Emperor. In his incompetence, when he saw Curze, Mortarion, Russ, Angron and Lorgar, he shown these wild animals completely absurd and pointless mercy, not ordering them shot on the spot, but allowing them to corrupt five fine legions. Had he simply had these barbarians killed, maybe Imperial Heralds or War Hounds would be slightly less efficient in the short term, but in the long one, literally everyone around would be better off and Heresy would not happen (or even if it did, it would be easily contained with loyalist forces). Therefore, the Emperor is to blame for the acts of these deviants, especially in the light of his supposed precognition

All of this is ignoring that Russ and his Legion are the only ones pre heresy who had been called on at least once and possible three times to fight another legion for real. Something that the first few HH novels make clear is something that is so alien that the first time it happens, the marines involved barely know how to process or justify it. Russ and his Legion have been through all of that, so the order to them is not unusual. Russ would have no reason to suspect that Horus was tricking him or lying. The Night of the Wolf happened well before Prospero. Not only had Russ fought another legion, he nearly had one of his brothers murder him. Plus most of the slaughter is on Magnus deciding to let most of his legion die out of guilt.

Also if the job was just to collect magnus and bring him abck peacefully with minimal risk of oppisition, why not use someone like I dunno? the Ultramarinessending the space wolves, given the amnimosity among the Legions was garnteed to make it worse

After the dangerous use of Psychic Powers and exploration of the Warp by the XV Legion, the Council of Nikea ended the Librarius Project and the direct command was given to Magnus and the XV Legion to stop using their Psychic Powers for the safety of the Imperium.

In direct and intentional violation of these decrees, Magnus continued his use of Psychic Powers and then breached the defenses of the Imperial Palace through use of Sorcery. He destroyed the Emperor's Grand Plan for Humanity and opened Terra and the Imperial Palace to invasion by denizens of the Warp. Magnus and the XV Legion committed multiple acts of treason.

The Emperor put Leman Russ and the VI Legion in charge of censuring the XV Legion and bringing Magnus to Terra to face judgement. He had Leman Russ collect his entire legion and seconded to his command elements of his personal guard, the Legio Custodes commanded by Captain-General Constantin Valdor, and forces of the Sisters of Silence.

Leman Russ and the VI Legion know their role in service of the Emperor better than most Legions Astartes. They are the Emperor's Executioners. The ones he calls upon to do the unpleasant task. The ones he'd called upon once, if not twice, to exterminate a Legion Astartes. You don't send your attack dog backed up by your personal guard and a force that is anathema to those they are facing because you expect them to come meekly. You do that because you know there will be blood. Russ knows this and so does the Emperor.

Then Horus sticks his Chaos corrupted self into the picture, as the Emperor's War Master and informs Russ the the orders have been changed. Just kill them. Kill them all, the tells Russ. Russ has no reason to doubt this order comes from the Emperor. It's not like it is an unprecedented order for him. The VI Legion has done this before.

But while Russ may be the Emperor's attack dog, he is not a rabid beast. He reaches out, in his flawed way, to Magnus the Red and ask him to surrender.

And what does he find when he reaches Prospero? Magnus the Red and the XV Legion are hiding from him. No surrender was forthcoming.

So he did his job. Without joy, Leman Russ and the VI Legion went about their business of destroying the XV Legion, starting with anything that got in there way. And when Magnus the Red finally showed his face, Leman Russ took him down. That is the just fate of traitors, who survived only by compounding the failings by joining Chaos to survive their just punishment.

My issue with a lot of the arguments defending the thousand sons is that people were forget that they were turning into literal chaos spawn and hacking people to pieces when they did. They were an extremely dangerous legion at that point.

While on the outside they seemed reasonable and full of heart. They were shown to be entirely corrupted. Magnus damned his legion and himself when he took that deal with Tzeench. His naviety and aggorance cost his soul and his entire legion their bodies, their wills, and their lives.

He damned his world for power to save his sons. While noble showed his naviety and caused his destruction.

Leman Russ arrived at Prospero and tried to contact his brother for parley but.... His entourage of captive Thousand Sons immedately turned into chaos spawn. Showing him, they were truly lost.

Leman Russ could've done more but he had a duty to his men, and to his brother, to put him down. Prospero was damned the minute Magnus contacted Tzeench.

I truly loved Magnus as a character, but we have to be real here Magnus did everything wrong. Its where the joke "Magnus did nothing wrong" comes from. Its making fun of how magnus literally screwed the imperium over with his idioicy (blowing up the psychic defenses of the imperial webway and leading to the deaths of the Custodes, and various others in the construction of the imperial webway .)