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I'm told that Pskyers are pretty dangerous to be around and can fall to Chaos pretty easily, so how often do Asartes chapters recruit these guys? It seems like it wouldn't be very often because of their powers.

it really depends on the chapter. The Grey Knights are ALL Psykers, some chapters have a decently high number of them (Blood Ravens) some chapters refuse to have them (Black Templars) all psykers however are generally put into the Librarius, and server as Librarians. the Ultramarines have about 28 Librarians, the dark angels, 25, the blood angels nearly 50.

this is actually a pretty decent number of psykers considering how rare they're supposed to be.

AFAIK most chapters don't actively recruit psykers (since most psykers manifest in their teens, long after they could be recruited into an Astartes chapter) but it depends on Chapter. It might also be the case that since all humans are technically latent psykers, some geneseeds trigger that more often than others.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
AFAIK most chapters don't actively recruit psykers

In one of their recent novels, when the Iron Hands need a new Librarian they 'ask' a passing Black Ship for a suitable psyker.

beast_gts wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
AFAIK most chapters don't actively recruit psykers

In one of their recent novels, when the Iron Hands need a new Librarian they 'ask' a passing Black Ship for a suitable psyker.

Well the Iron Hands are a weird bunch. And asking for a single prepubescent psyker isn't exactly a sure thing considering it's like a 99% failure rate.

Most chapters tend to have about a dozen or so at any given time. This obviously varies from chapter to chapter. Some like the Black Templar have none, some are far more likely to have a ton due to either the gene seed or the world that they recruit from.

As for being dangerous, yes all psykers are inherently dangerous and Liberians have fallen to chaos. That said the vast majority of chapters screen their psykers harder than any other recruit and are overly cautious when making decisions on whether to go forward with a recruit. That's on top of the guy already making the cut to be a space marine.

They are probably the safest psyker that the IOM can produce.

HoundsofDemos wrote:
Most chapters tend to have about a dozen or so at any given time. This obviously varies from chapter to chapter. Some like the Black Templar have none, some are far more likely to have a ton due to either the gene seed or the world that they recruit from.

As for being dangerous, yes all psykers are inherently dangerous and Liberians have fallen to chaos. That said the vast majority of chapters screen their psykers harder than any other recruit and are overly cautious when making decisions on whether to go forward with a recruit. That's on top of the guy already making the cut to be a space marine.

They are probably the safest psyker that the IOM can produce.

Well that's interesting. Now about the Black Templars, why don't they recruit Psykers? Is it just part of their culture, or does it have to do with their geneseed interfering?

Because they Abhor the Witch. It's less to do with geneseed (because Imperial Fists can and do have librarians) and more the case that the Black Templars are religious fanatics intolerant of any genetic mutation or deviation from the God Emperor's Divine Image.

 Jazzylee wrote:

HoundsofDemos wrote:
Most chapters tend to have about a dozen or so at any given time. This obviously varies from chapter to chapter. Some like the Black Templar have none, some are far more likely to have a ton due to either the gene seed or the world that they recruit from.

As for being dangerous, yes all psykers are inherently dangerous and Liberians have fallen to chaos. That said the vast majority of chapters screen their psykers harder than any other recruit and are overly cautious when making decisions on whether to go forward with a recruit. That's on top of the guy already making the cut to be a space marine.

They are probably the safest psyker that the IOM can produce.

Well that's interesting. Now about the Black Templars, why don't they recruit Psykers? Is it just part of their culture, or does it have to do with their geneseed interfering?

Because, to quote Rogal Dorn, "They are absolute lunatics." They abhor any sort of mutation, including psykers, despite psykers being needed to ensure the Imperium exists.

How mad would they be to discover The Imperium is just a tool The Emperor created to evolve humanity into a psychic race?!

 Drakeslayer wrote:
Because they Abhor the Witch. It's less to do with geneseed (because Imperial Fists can and do have librarians) and more the case that the Black Templars are religious fanatics intolerant of any genetic mutation or deviation from the God Emperor's Divine Image.

It takes some serious doublethink to do that given he was a psyker

Though, to be fair, some writers tried to fix that stupid bit and there are theories that either their geneseed has a flaw suppressing psychic power, or that one xeno super-psyker they killed cursed them in similar way to black rage and they genuinely can't have any. Depends on who you ask.

 Drakeslayer wrote:
Because they Abhor the Witch. It's less to do with geneseed (because Imperial Fists can and do have librarians) and more the case that the Black Templars are religious fanatics intolerant of any genetic mutation or deviation from the God Emperor's Divine Image.

This has all been retconned and is no longer canon. Modern fluff states the BT used to have Librarians like other chapters, but some unknown tragedy wiped them out wholesale. Once they lost their Librarians, they no longer had anyone who could safely train new ones, hence they could never replace them. Modern BT fluff also has them only hating unsanctioned and xenos psykers. Astropaths and other sanctioned Imperial psykers are fine.

 Duskweaver wrote:

 Drakeslayer wrote:
Because they Abhor the Witch. It's less to do with geneseed (because Imperial Fists can and do have librarians) and more the case that the Black Templars are religious fanatics intolerant of any genetic mutation or deviation from the God Emperor's Divine Image.

This has all been retconned and is no longer canon. Modern fluff states the BT used to have Librarians like other chapters, but some unknown tragedy wiped them out wholesale. Once they lost their Librarians, they no longer had anyone who could safely train new ones, hence they could never replace them. Modern BT fluff also has them only hating unsanctioned and xenos psykers. Astropaths and other sanctioned Imperial psykers are fine.

Wut. Just get rid of all the nice lore GW.

When did that retcon happen? Dear oh dear.

 Drakeslayer wrote:
When did that retcon happen? Dear oh dear.

The 6th edition SM codex. So nearly 6 years ago...

pm713 wrote:

 Duskweaver wrote:

 Drakeslayer wrote:
Because they Abhor the Witch. It's less to do with geneseed (because Imperial Fists can and do have librarians) and more the case that the Black Templars are religious fanatics intolerant of any genetic mutation or deviation from the God Emperor's Divine Image.

This has all been retconned and is no longer canon. Modern fluff states the BT used to have Librarians like other chapters, but some unknown tragedy wiped them out wholesale. Once they lost their Librarians, they no longer had anyone who could safely train new ones, hence they could never replace them. Modern BT fluff also has them only hating unsanctioned and xenos psykers. Astropaths and other sanctioned Imperial psykers are fine.

Wut. Just get rid of all the nice lore GW.

How really insane grimdumb was "nice lore" again?

First, they need navigators, especially seeing they don't have librarians. Period. Ship based chapter hating them would be utterly idiotic. Ditto for astropaths, not only they all had been, you know, blessed by Emperor in person but crusading chapter spread all over needs to be able to contact other fleets, and hating them was as stupid as hating navigators...

 Irbis wrote:

pm713 wrote:

 Duskweaver wrote:

 Drakeslayer wrote:
Because they Abhor the Witch. It's less to do with geneseed (because Imperial Fists can and do have librarians) and more the case that the Black Templars are religious fanatics intolerant of any genetic mutation or deviation from the God Emperor's Divine Image.

This has all been retconned and is no longer canon. Modern fluff states the BT used to have Librarians like other chapters, but some unknown tragedy wiped them out wholesale. Once they lost their Librarians, they no longer had anyone who could safely train new ones, hence they could never replace them. Modern BT fluff also has them only hating unsanctioned and xenos psykers. Astropaths and other sanctioned Imperial psykers are fine.

Wut. Just get rid of all the nice lore GW.

How really insane grimdumb was "nice lore" again?

First, they need navigators, especially seeing they don't have librarians. Period. Ship based chapter hating them would be utterly idiotic. Ditto for astropaths, not only they all had been, you know, blessed by Emperor in person but crusading chapter spread all over needs to be able to contact other fleets, and hating them was as stupid as hating navigators...

Because it's nice to have some of them take it to extremes in following the Emperors decree. The Imperium is MEANT to be silly and old BT were a good example of that. They pointed out the obvious problems in the Imperiums philosophy.

Pretty sure even the 4th Ed codex mentions they hold sanctioned psykers in high regard, as despite being a mutant, have directly communed with and been found worthy under the gaze of the Emperor Himself via the soulbinding ritual. Therefore, they would be instruments of His Will, unlike the witches they seek out, who are sorcerors using warpcraft and sorcery by consorting with daemons. I will see if I can check my friend's old copy. I thought it was from that far back.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

beast_gts wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
AFAIK most chapters don't actively recruit psykers

In one of their recent novels, when the Iron Hands need a new Librarian they 'ask' a passing Black Ship for a suitable psyker.

Well the Iron Hands are a weird bunch. And asking for a single prepubescent psyker isn't exactly a sure thing considering it's like a 99% failure rate.

Space marines routinely and purposely get psykers from the black ships. According to the adeptus astra telepathica lore the league of black ships sorts out marine candidates in addition to all the throne chattel, astropath, primaris, inquisition, and astronomican categories, and sends them to chapters. The marine chapters would need a steady supplemental supply from the black ships because like what Duskweaver said about the black Templars, they need to maintain a certain size of librarium to keep any librarians at all.

 Irbis wrote:


First, they need navigators, especially seeing they don't have librarians. Period. Ship based chapter hating them would be utterly idiotic. Ditto for astropaths, not only they all had been, you know, blessed by Emperor in person but crusading chapter spread all over needs to be able to contact other fleets, and hating them was as stupid as hating navigators...

That's 40k in a nutshell."all psykers are evil, and pawns of the dark gods. Well, not those ones, they're OK, because the Emperor said so".

I can't imagine astropaths and navigators assigned to Black Templars fleets have an easy time of it, and presumably keep themselves very much to themselves. The Navigators probably rotate out quite frequently.

 AndrewGPaul wrote:
I can't imagine astropaths and navigators assigned to Black Templars fleets have an easy time of it, and presumably keep themselves very much to themselves. The Navigators probably rotate out quite frequently.

Well, in the current fluff they have a very easy time of it. Black Templars revere Astropaths and Navigators, because they're "touched by the Emperor". They're like mini-Living Saints to them.

At this point, insisting that Black Templars hate Navigators and Astropaths is like insisting that the Ultramarines still have a half-eldar Librarian. It's obsolete fluff from several editions ago that never made any sense in the first place.

A SM chapter could theoretically get away with mistreating Astropaths, but Navigators? That was always stupid. Navigator Houses are very politically powerful. They are the one part of the Imperium that literally everyone else depends on. And, despite the usual rivalries and politicking, they stick together when threatened. You annoy your ship's Navigator enough and you won't be making any more Warp journeys ever. No other House is going to send you a replacement once you have a reputation for mistreating them. It's like being on bad terms with the Spacing Guild in Dune: you might as well slit your own throat, because at least that would be quicker.

 Duskweaver wrote:
A SM chapter could theoretically get away with mistreating Astropaths, but Navigators? That was always stupid. Navigator Houses are very politically powerful. They are the one part of the Imperium that literally everyone else depends on. And, despite the usual rivalries and politicking, they stick together when threatened. You annoy your ship's Navigator enough and you won't be making any more Warp journeys ever. No other House is going to send you a replacement once you have a reputation for mistreating them.

The Navigator Houses are probably oathbound to provide Navigators for marines, but someone who mistreats them is likely to get the worst available instead of the top of the class students. Warp journeys will be slower and/or more dangerous, your Chapter will arrive too late more often, enemies get away - it would start gnawing at the effectiveness and reputation of the marines.

 Duskweaver wrote:

 AndrewGPaul wrote:
I can't imagine astropaths and navigators assigned to Black Templars fleets have an easy time of it, and presumably keep themselves very much to themselves. The Navigators probably rotate out quite frequently.

Well, in the current fluff they have a very easy time of it. Black Templars revere Astropaths and Navigators, because they're "touched by the Emperor". They're like mini-Living Saints to them.

At this point, insisting that Black Templars hate Navigators and Astropaths is like insisting that the Ultramarines still have a half-eldar Librarian. It's obsolete fluff from several editions ago that never made any sense in the first place.

A SM chapter could theoretically get away with mistreating Astropaths, but Navigators? That was always stupid. Navigator Houses are very politically powerful. They are the one part of the Imperium that literally everyone else depends on. And, despite the usual rivalries and politicking, they stick together when threatened. You annoy your ship's Navigator enough and you won't be making any more Warp journeys ever. No other House is going to send you a replacement once you have a reputation for mistreating them. It's like being on bad terms with the Spacing Guild in Dune: you might as well slit your own throat, because at least that would be quicker.

I don't think the fluff has ever said even the Black Templars mistreat their Navigators (and probably their Astropaths); despite their hatred of psykers, Navigators and Astropaths "don't count" for both the reason you gave ("touched by the emperor") and a rather pragmatic hypocrisy. They probably don't have much if anything to do with them, make the sign of the evil eye as they go near to their chambers, etc.

The same goes for the more militant members of the Ecclesiarchy and the Ordo Hereticus. No matter what they may say, they still need go get around and send messages.