Zeruel13 wrote:I've been working on my own house rules for 8th edition for a while now and one of my main points of contention is how detachments work. I think choosing which detachment you want to take should be more than
CP generation and how to best min/max. I know this comes up a lot and everyone has their idea for changing how
CP generation works but in the interest of beating a dead horse here's mine,
Everyone has their preferred solution. For the sake of keeping the focus of the conversation on your suggestions, I'll refrain from throwing out my own preferred solutions here.
To start every Battleforged army starts with 1 CP for every 1,000 points the game is rounded up. So an army up to 1,000 points gets 1 CP to start, up to 2,000 2 CP etc.
I'm under the impression that the vast majority of games of
40k are 2,000 points or less meaning that this rule only makes a difference of a single
CP. I'd cut down on the complexity of your suggestion by making it a flat X
CP base. I'd also personally prefer that X = 3 (or more) because stratagems are fun, and I like using them.
Then I want to introduce the concept of pre-game CPs and in game generated CPs. So essentially detachments under my system will instead of giving you in-game usable CP, they will give you pre-game CP and open access to special detachment specific stratagems. Pre-game CP can only be spent on pre-game stratagems that seem to becoming more prevalent in the game anyway like webway strike, veteran intercessors, alpha legion pre-game moves, extra relics, Vigilus style special detachments etc. Any pre-game command points not spent are lost at the start of the first battle round. The CP generated for being Battleforged can be used pre-game or saved and be used in game. Then at the start of each Battle Round each player generates an additional CP for each detachment they brought so long as at east one unit from that detachment is still alive. Players also roll a D6 if their Warlord is alive and generate a further CP on a 5+. Okay now for the detachments, CPs in brackets are the pre-game generated CP.
A few things here:
* This strongly favors armies with access to powerful pregame strats and units that can make the most of them. The tau player who spends his
CP on a spare relic for lack of a better option is at a disadvantage vs the guy who can infiltrate/deepstrike a bunch of units that make the most of such strats.
* This encourages people to fill out bare bones
MSU detachments and punishes armies that don't have cheap units. Compare the bare bones cost of a Grey Knights Batallion or Outrider to an ork or
IG version of the same.
* This favors armies that can keep specific units alive. Suddenly, a detachment of squishy dark eldar or a small patrol of Grey Knights might actively become a detriment if my opponent can wipe them off the table easily.
* This creates a lot of checking and rolling each turn just to determine how many
CP you get. You have to verify which detachment each of your units is in, confirm whether or not each detachment has been totally wiped out, confirm if the warlord is still alive, and then do a dice roll that will only generate a
CP in 2 out of 6 game turns on average. This is also weirdly gamey. Why do I get more command points if a lone fire dragon from a vanguard detachment is still alive?
Basically, I'm not sure what you're trying to emulate/convey here. I see the benefits of generating
CP mid-battle, but there are much simpler ways to do it.
Patrol Detachment (0 CP)
Stratagem: Advanced Scouts (1 CP)
Use this stratagem before the start of the first battle round but after both armies have been deployed. Choose a unit from this detachment, they can immediately make a free move just as if it were the movement phase. They can't end their move within 18" of any enemy unit.
This would result in a lot of very easy first turn charges. Shining spears, for instance, can move 16" and auto-advance 6" for a total of 22". Even without advancing, that's 32" of movement before I make my first charge roll. Plenty of other units would get first turn charges out of this as well.
Stratagem: Co-ordinated Battle Plan (2 CP)
Use this stratagem after a unit from this detachment has finished resolving a attack in the shooting phase or fight phase that resulted in at least one unsaved wound on the target enemy unit. Until the end of the phase add 1 to hit rolls for attacks from any other units in this detachment when targeting that same enemy unit.
This benefits some armies much more than others. Guard (mostly BS4+) will hit 33% more often while marines (mostly BS3+) will hit only 25% more often. Some powerful ork shooting units (like tank bustas and lootas) will be hitting 50% more often or even 100% more often if they're facing a faction like Alaitoc that imposes a to-hit penalty.
Stratagem: Tactical Supremacy (3 CP)
Use this stratagem on a unit from this detachment that is within 3” of an objective when determining if you score victory points for holding that objective. That unit counts as holding that objective this turn even if there are more enemy models within 3” of that objective than there are from your army.
3
CP to basically be objective secured for a single turn? And the detachment only gives you 5? And if you're playing a mission that requires you "defend" an objective rather than "secure" it, that might not even get you the
VP. I'd be hesitant to use this at 1CP given how sparse
CP are under this system.
Stratagem: Chain of Command (* CP)
Pick any number of CHARACTER models from this detachment that are not the warlord. This stratagem costs 1 command point for each model chosen. Each chosen model can generate a warlord trait, though it is not treated as a warlord beyond the purposes of the chosen trait. No two models in the army can have the same warlord trait. If your Warlord is ever slain, you continue to generate a command point each turn for your warlord on a D6 roll of 6 so long as at least one model you used this stratagem on is still alive. This stratagem can only be used once per game.
I do like having easier access to warlord traits, though they should probably just be optional upgrades that cost points or something.
Outrider Detachment (1 CP)
Stratagem: Rapid Advance (1 CP)
Select a Fast Attack unit from this detachment, until end of turn this unit treats any rapid-fire or heavy weapons as assault weapons instead (so Rapid Fire 1 would be treated as Assault 1 for example). In addition, if this unit advances this turn it automatically advances 6" instead of rolling.
This is another strat that impacts different armies very differently. Craftworlders have zero (I think) rapid fire weapons. Marine rapid fire weapons include things like hurricane bolters. At 1CP, this will be a huge boon for any army that has a
FA unit loaded down with heavy weapons but really meh for something like a vyper that only has a single heavy weapon.
Spearhead Detachment (1 CP)
Stratagem: Overwhelming Firepower (1 CP)
At the start of your shooting phase select a Heavy Support unit from this detachment and choose one type of weapon that unit is equipped with. All weapons of the chosen type add 1 to their damage until the end of the phase.
Again, different armies and units will benefit greatly from this while others won't. This is a meh bonus for a ravager with dark lances but 50% damage increase for a ravager decked out with disintegrators. This is just okay on a spearhead full of soul grinders but amazing on a spearhead full of dark reapers.
Vanguard Detachment (1 CP)
Stratagem: Marked for Death (2 CP)
Before the first battle round has started, select a single enemy unit. All models from Elite units in this detachment can re-roll failed wound rolls of 1 when targeting the chosen unit for the remainder of the battle.
Again, really solid on some armies/units. Really meh for others.
