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Heya,

I'm new and research (both on this forum and with google) did not lead to conclusive results.

I wonder about the interaction between Serpent Shield and Spirit Stones.

These are the last rules text to date:

Serpent Shield:
Any damage suffered by a wave serpent from a ranged weapon is reduced by 1, to a minimum of 1.

Spirit Stones:
Roll a D6 each time a model with spirit stones suffers an unsaved wound or mortal wound: on a 6, the wound is ignored.

What raised the issue is a youtube battle report where a Craftworld player was FIRST using spirits stones, THEN using serpent shield.
For example: hit 2 bright lances, both to wound roll successful, each rolls 1D6 for damage = 3 and 6.
The player rolleds 9 dices for spirit stones to ignore some of the wound with 6s, then reduce the REMAINING damage of each weapon by 1 to a minimum of 1.

That could mean that you can't fast roll but even if you roll seperately, I see some value in rolling for spirit stones FIRST as you'll have more chance for it to proc, THEN potentially reduce the damage of each remaining weapon if that damage is 2 or more.

Inputs/official ruling?

In both case the "suffer" keyword makes me think it happens at the same time but I could be wrong. I did not see anything precise enough in the shooting sequence rule to shed some light on the issue.
Also if both rules happen at the same time, then I guess the player whose turn it is choose the order? So in that case obviously opponent would choose the order that serves you less, but if it's not the case... VALUE : P.

Yours,
--Jay
PS : I know it might not make a world of difference in the grand scheme of things, but 1) I'm a sucker for precision, especially rule-wise, and 2) that CAN change a game, even if it's 1 game in 20 or less : )

So, to clarify, you've misquoted Spirit Stones. It actually reads

Spirit Stones: Roll a D6 each time this model suffers a wound or mortal wound: on a 6 the wound is ignored.

As per the rules for "Ignoring Wounds", this happens when models lose wounds (i.e. when Damage is suffered).

The Serpent Shield reduces the amount of Damage that is inflicted by a wound, so the Serpent Shield applies first, and then you roll the Spirit Stone effect for each remaining point of damage.

I think you have to apply Serpent Shield first. Reasoning is thus:

One triggers on suffering damage, the other on suffering a wound. You need to know the damage value before you can roll a dice for each wound that damage causes, so modifiers to damage must apply before things that happen on a wound by wound level.

It sounds like the 'Ignoring Wounds' rule on page 222 of the Core Rules should apply:

Some models have rules that give them a chance to ignore wounds. If a model has more than one such rule, you can only use one of those rules each time the model loses a wound (including wounds lost due to mortal wounds).

Don't both the Serpent Shield and Spirit Stones qualify as "... rules that give them a chance to ignore wounds..."?

 Ghaz wrote:
It sounds like the 'Ignoring Wounds' rule on page 222 of the Core Rules should apply:

Some models have rules that give them a chance to ignore wounds. If a model has more than one such rule, you can only use one of those rules each time the model loses a wound (including wounds lost due to mortal wounds).

Don't both the Serpent Shield and Spirit Stones qualify as "... rules that give them a chance to ignore wounds..."?

Interesting take on that matter... I wanted to answer with a decisive "no" at first, but then I realized, that I'm not sure about it.
IIRC the serpent shield doesn't ignore wounds, but reduce damage - that's why both rules apply

I think I may have been getting Spirit Stones and Serpent Shields mixed up scrolling up and down referencing those rules while checking the rules in the rulebook (too many SS's).

The explanation:

First reduce damage by any means, then try to ignore with FNP triggers makes total sense to me.
I don't see the Serpent Shield as a "ignore wound" effect, but a "Take less wound" effect.

To put it even clearer, Serpent Shield is a modifier to the Damage characteristic of an attack. It must be applied before the model starts losing wounds that can be ignored via Spirit Stones.

Agreed, Damage has to be calculated before Wounds.

Page 221 in the Core book:
"A model loses one wound for each point of damage it suffers."
You have to work out the damage first, before the model then goes on to lose those Wounds, and it's at exactly that point that the various Wound-ignoring rules trigger.