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Hello! I am new to 40k and have begun building and painting my first army. I currently have 7 troops and 1 Invictor complete and am looking for advice to hone my shopping/painting list.

I've decided to go with Raven Guard. I am interested in building a semi-narrative/fluffy list that is still relatively competitive on the tabletop for local tournaments and clubs. I am aiming for Primaris only and leaning heavily into Phobos marines. I am looking for feedback on two potential lists I have drafted. Because I haven't actually played a game yet, I am specifically looking for feedback on how much of my army should start on the table and what looks strong on paper but is weak in practice.

The focus of both lists revolves around forward deployment and board control alongside turn 2 and turn 3 backline drops/harassment to focus on taking objectives away from my opponent while remaining suitably lethal and resilient to take all comers. I would appreciate substitutes that capture the stealth/ambush/disruption style of Raven Guard in the fluff.

LIST 1

2 x Patrol Detachments - 2000 pts.
Stratagem - Favor of the Ravenspire - 1 CP
Stratagem - Hero of the Chapter - 1 CP


Phobos Librarian - Warlord - Master of the Vanguard - Armor Indomitus, Enveloping Darkness, Shadowstep, Spectral Blade
Kayvaan Shrike
Captain in Phobos Armor - Master of Ambush
Lt. in Phobos Armor - Ex tenebris

5 x Incursor Squad
5 x Incursor Squad

Invictor Tactical Warsuit - Twin Ironhail autocannon
Invictor Tactical Warsuit - Incendium Cannon

5 x Aggressor - Boltstorm Gauntlets/Fragstorm Launcherr

10 x Reivers - Combat Knives, Grav Chutes

5 x Inceptors - Plasma Exterminators

3 x Eliminators
3 x Eliminators

Gladiator Lancer - 2 x storm bolters, auto launchers

The idea here is to forward deploy the Incursors, Invictors, and Aggressors near or on objectives with Shrike providing Chapter master rerolls to the Aggressors while the eliminators, Cpt. Lt., and Lancer provide long range fire support from (relative) safety taking advantage of the chapter trait. Ideally Smokescreen/Transhuman/Enveloping Darkness can keep the Incursors and Aggressors alive while the Invictors and Gladiator draw turn 1 fire. I can drop the inceptors on turn 2 and use the librarian to slingshot Shrike to the inceptors where he can enable safer overcharge. The Reivers come in turn 2 or 3 ideally to contest or clear rear objectives via the Terror Troops stratagem which removes enemy obsec. Shrike and the phobos librarian, who is geared for combat, can join up with and support the Reivers with +1'' to move and charge, re-roll charge, and aura support. Each character can redeploy as needed for 1 CP using the Guerilla Tactics phobos-specific stratagem. The Reivers are utility combat troops who can either clear out backlines, disable objective holders on contested objective, or reinforce weak points as needed. I'm aware they aren't considered top tier units but I'm enamored with the way they fit into the Raven Guard aesthetic as well as the fun tactical options they enable.

LIST 2

2 Patrols, 2000 pts.
Stratagem - Favor of the Ravenspire - 1 CP
Stratagem - Master of the Trifold Path - 1 CP
Stratagem - Hero of the Chapter - 1 CP

Cpt. in Phobos Armor - Warlord - Master of Ambush, Marksman's Honors (+1 flat dmg), Korvidari Bolt
Kayvaan Shrike
Lt. in Phobos Armor - Ex tenebris
Librarian in Phobos Armor - Enveloping Darkness, Shadowstep, Spectral Blade, Master of Vanguard

5 x Infitrators, Comms Array
5 x Infiltrators, Comms Array

Invictor Warsuit - Twin ironhail autocannon
Invictor Warsuit - Incendium cannon

5 x Bladeguard Veterans - Neovolkite pistol

10 x Reivers - Combat Knives, Grav Chutes

5 x Inceptors - Assault Bolters

3 x Eliminators
3 x Eliminators

6 x Eradicators, Melta Rifle

The second list is similar to the first but swaps plasma inceptors for eradicators for more durable anti-armor and aggressors for bladeguard for defensive rather than offensive midfield objective holders. Shrike will drop with the bolter inceptors in turn 2, which still put out a respectable 30 ap - 2 shots and have the same defensive profile as aggressors. The Eradicators are placed into deepstrike via Strike From the Shadows for 1 CP, then combat squad into two squads of three which can be dropped separately. Reivers are used the same as above.

I really appreciate any help and advice! Thank you in advance!

Hello,
I think that leaning in to the board control aspects of Raven Guard can really leverage a strong Primary Objective game. So it seems like you're off to a good start.

The Eradicators are a must include. Phobos in general have a distinct lack of anti-tank, which the Eradicators balance out. Deploying via Strike from the Shadows is an incredible play, but remember that you don't always have to put both units in reserve every game; If you're up against aggressive armor units, hiding a squad behind terrain can provide an excellent area of denial from such an advance.

Bladeguard are another excellent unit, because Phobos have limited melee capability. Using Master of Ambush with them can allow for an all out offensive play against a ranged army; it can also be used to put a threat within striking range of your opponent's backfield objectives if used a little more cautiously. Essentially by putting them mid-field combined with Invictors and Shrike, your opponent either doesn't take the board, or has to deal with threat saturation early.

So, Infiltrators are great, but I don't know if you ever really need more than 1. Also, the comms array is a bit of a trap, I would suggest switching to the helix adept instead for a bit of extra survivability.
Incursors can fill out the remaining troop slot if you want to stick with the Stealthy Marines, but point for point, Intercessors are going to be able to do just about everything your phobos can do, and you can add a Thunderhammer or something to the sergeant.

The biggest question I would ask yourself, is what tools do you need to play the mission? What secondaries will you take, if you play the mission pack, that sort of thing. This list isn't going to be able to take on some of the heavier hitting lists, but by getting out ahead early on Primary objective points and running lots of disruption, you should be able to score well despite losses.

Best of luck

I would at least take Fear Made Manifest as your warlord trait. Seeing as your going to be running Spectral Blade on your Librarian.

Str 9 and AP-4 against pretty much everything, is going to be a nice bonus to have. Now if only you can find a way of boosting his leadership up to 10.