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I was playing a game yesterday with my Space Wolves vs Orks.

Ghaz charged a dreadnaught, and i heroically intervened with my warlord nearby as Ghaz was on his last 4 wounds.

My warlord had the warrior born warlord trait, which states "if at the start of the fight phase this model is in engagement range of enemy models it can fight first" which in my head would mean I get to attack Ghaz before he attacks me.

My opponent pointed out though that the rules stipulate that a unit which has charged, it also 'fights first', and therefore the rules cancel each other out and the play happens as normal.

Rules as written, he's absolutely right, but given that it's an ability (not to mention one i paid a CP for now thanks to Nephilim) I felt a bit cheated by it.

What do we think?


EDIT: I have just seen that somebody posted a similar question a few days back. Sorry in advance.

The easiest way to think about this is that there are 3 different stages of fighting in the Fight phase:

1. Strikes First
2. Neither striking first nor last
3. Strikes Last

Having multiple instances of either 1 or 3 doesn't do anything further, and having instances of both means you fight at stage 2. There's no concept of "fight even more first" for having two instances of a rule that allows you to fight first.

So, in your case, Ghaz would still go first because it's your opponent's turn and they decide who goes first out of all those who have the "Strikes First" condition.

Yeah, it certainly will make me think twice about paying for that warlord trait in future.

I take that back - i'll think about it once and then decide it's not worth the CP

It makes a big difference. Gives you the chance to interrupt without paying two cp, lets you "interrupt" in two locations

While nowhere near as powerful as fights last, it has great utility

Your opponent was right, although 'cansel each other out' is not the right wording. It is just that fight first is really bad as a trait as you get fight first from charging. And your opponent goes first.

The fight is broken down into 3 sections:

Fight first. Here the player who's turn it is goes first and then you alternate activation until all fight first is done.

Not affected by any rules. Here the player who does not have the turn gets to fight first. Then you akternate activations. (Note this this mean a unit that charged last turn and is stil fighting still has the benefit.)

Fight last. These models go after everything else, it waries a bit on timing. After that you alternate activations.

Some things worth noting. Fight last is not called that. It used the wording 'Is not elidebul to fight until all other units who can fight have done so.' Note that old codexes uses a slightly different wording, but every 9th edition wording has been the same.

Fight first and fight last cancel each other out.

There is a stratagem that let's you activate an eligible unit after your opponent has activated one of theirs. This skips the line, but you can not use this on someone who is not eligible to fight. (Meaning fight last stops this.)

As a SW player you have access to 4 different sources of fight last. This is one of the strengths of the space wolf codex. If you warlord had armour of russ and slowed down Chaz you would be going first. If you slowed him down and had fight first on your warlord you would be able to fight with your warlord (fight first) and your dreadnought before Chazz got to active. Unless they spent 2 cp to interrupt.

AS a SW player it is really important that you nail these consept down because it is very important for their play style.

Also note that the 'fight first' warrior trait comes with an aura if you can activate the sage. With that aura you can have multiple units have fight first and then you can really benefit from big fights with many units and heoric interventions.