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Don't ask why I'm asking about sixth edition rules...

1). Does armour piercing confer any bonus - the rulebook merely says if AP isn't equal to Sv, it doesn't do anything.

- In other words, would say a Terminator with a Sv of 2+ being shot by a gun with an AP of 4+, lose say two points of Sv?

(This basically makes the Terminators included in the Dark Vengeance box nigh-indestructable to the opposing Chaos force).

2). Can you just leave close combat in the movement phase, using your movement, with no penalty?

RomulanCommander wrote:
Don't ask why I'm asking about sixth edition rules...

1). Does armour piercing confer any bonus - the rulebook merely says if AP isn't equal to Sv, it doesn't do anything.

- In other words, would say a Terminator with a Sv of 2+ being shot by a gun with an AP of 4+, lose say two points of Sv?

(This basically makes the Terminators included in the Dark Vengeance box nigh-indestructable to the opposing Chaos force).

2). Can you just leave close combat in the movement phase, using your movement, with no penalty?

6th Ed:

Armour piercing does confer a bonus for saves that are equal or worse than the AP rating.

AP 5 means it ignores a save of 5+, and does not do anything to armor save 4+ or better.

In other words, a Terminator with a Sv of 2+ being shot by a gun with an AP of 4+ rolls the 2+ save as normal. (This in no way makes the Terminators included in the Dark Vengeance box nigh-indestructable to the opposing Chaos force, (the Terminators can still die on the roll of a 1, and they only have a single wound)).


You can not just leave combat. Units that are locked in combat cannot perform move actions.

RomulanCommander wrote:
Don't ask why I'm asking about sixth edition rules...

1). Does armour piercing confer any bonus - the rulebook merely says if AP isn't equal to Sv, it doesn't do anything.

- In other words, would say a Terminator with a Sv of 2+ being shot by a gun with an AP of 4+, lose say two points of Sv?

(This basically makes the Terminators included in the Dark Vengeance box nigh-indestructable to the opposing Chaos force).

2). Can you just leave close combat in the movement phase, using your movement, with no penalty?

Bloody hell this is a bit of a blast from the past.

1: No, AP did not modify saves back in 6th, and it was the opposite of what it is now in that lower AP values were more powerful.

A Terminator has a 2+ save, it would only lose the save if hit by an AP1 or 2 weapon. No modifiers, it's all-or-nothing.

Another example; a Fire Warrior has a 4+ save, anything with AP1, 2, 3 or 4 would remove it.


2: No, certain units like Skimmers had such rules IIRC, but there was no generic fall-back option. I believe you could be forced to do so if you failed Morale, but there was a good chance of being swept up by the enemy units and insta-killed.

Many thanks to both of you, I didn't expect replies that quickly. That really clears things up.

Note that non-Walker vehicles could not be locked in combat in 6th Edition, nor did they lock opponents in combat.

 alextroy wrote:
Note that non-Walker vehicles could not be locked in combat in 6th Edition, nor did they lock opponents in combat.

In this case it was bikes, so don't know if they count, as they are treated more like infantry?

Bikes are treated like infantry, they can't disengage, unless they have the "Hit and Run" special rule, which allows them to disengage following a specific process.

...and for a good example of a unit with hit and run, cypher.

Thanks for the extra information on bikes.

One last question, out of curiosity: In 6th edition, people with melee weapons get an extra attack dice in assaults. Do Terminators count? They carry their Storm Bolter in one hand like a pistol, and a melee weapon in the other.

RomulanCommander wrote:
Thanks for the extra information on bikes.

One last question, out of curiosity: In 6th edition, people with melee weapons get an extra attack dice in assaults. Do Terminators count? They carry their Storm Bolter in one hand like a pistol, and a melee weapon in the other.

Storm shields are not weapons, and SBs are not pistols.

Most melee weapons get an extra attack when paired with a pistol. There were a few exceptions. Things with the “specialist” tag only got the extra attack when paired with a similar weapon. This is what gets us 2xlightning claws, or LC/PF combos. And if you do end up taking a powerfist, might as well pair it with a combi weapon, because a pistol is not going help with CC attacks.

 DeathReaper wrote:

RomulanCommander wrote:
Don't ask why I'm asking about sixth edition rules...

1). Does armour piercing confer any bonus - the rulebook merely says if AP isn't equal to Sv, it doesn't do anything.

- In other words, would say a Terminator with a Sv of 2+ being shot by a gun with an AP of 4+, lose say two points of Sv?

(This basically makes the Terminators included in the Dark Vengeance box nigh-indestructable to the opposing Chaos force).

2). Can you just leave close combat in the movement phase, using your movement, with no penalty?

6th Ed:

Armour piercing does confer a bonus for saves that are equal or worse than the AP rating.

AP 5 means it ignores a save of 5+, and does not do anything to armor save 4+ or better.

In other words, a Terminator with a Sv of 2+ being shot by a gun with an AP of 4+ rolls the 2+ save as normal. (This in no way makes the Terminators included in the Dark Vengeance box nigh-indestructable to the opposing Chaos force, (the Terminators can still die on the roll of a 1, and they only have a single wound)).

A further point on this- the Chaos Lord, Helbrute, and some of the Chaos Chosen have weapons that are AP1 or 2 (ranged plasma pistol on the Lord, melee power fist and power axe on the Chosen, ranged multi-melta and melee powerfist/dreadnought close combat weapon on the Helbrute). Against these weapons, the Deathwing Terminators in the boxset would be forced to rely on their 5+ invulnerable save.