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Made in ru
Flower Picking Eldar Youth




With Harlequins, barely surviving their transition to 10th, being left as an insignificant part of more interesting eldar index, I've decided to make some justice to my favorite boys in shiny stripes, while we are waiting one or two years for our new codex, where we may or may not get our interesting or at least flavorful rules.

So I've made my attempt to write a faction Index for Harlequins, without changing prices or datasheets (much), as well as it not being just my wishlist, but generally a balanced and acceptable alternative ruleset for your casual games, without too much rant from your opponents. The only major change I've made, was to the Shadowseer datasheet's abilities, in order to make them usable.

Please, give me your feedback and thoughts.

Link to the file

or check them here:
Spoiler:










   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle





In My Lab

Are harlequins in a bad spot?
This feels like pretty much pure buffs-especially on the Shadowseer.

Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne! 
   
Made in ru
Flower Picking Eldar Youth




 JNAProductions wrote:
Are harlequins in a bad spot?
This feels like pretty much pure buffs-especially on the Shadowseer.

If we ignore the fact, that they have to use inadequate rules, they are pretty mediocre. Monoqeens are not unplayable and with Ynnari stuff could even provide a challenge. That said, Shadowseers are, subjectively, the worst character in index, so I've decided to give it a little push.

About "pretty much pure buffs", not sure if I see it. You lose your ability to auto-pass important invul save and there is no more Fate's messenger DJ, which is a major loss.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 JNAProductions wrote:
Are harlequins in a bad spot?
This feels like pretty much pure buffs-especially on the Shadowseer.


They're pretty good when splashed into non-harlequin armies, but awkward on their own. For instance, official harlies currently don't have the ability to advance and charge on their own; they need the shadowseer for that.

Regarding the proposed changes:

* Rising Crescendo looks good. Definitely a rule that should be baked into harlies in some fashion.

* Luck of the Laughing God. Kind of boring for the same reasons the eldar detachment rules are boring. You've also added a bunch of kill-more-better rules in here which the LotLG rerolls could make even more frustrating for opponents.

* Fog of Dreams. I wish there was more counterplay here. As-is, you have to get right in the unit's face, and then you still have a to-hit penalty to deal with. I feel like telling your opponent that your units are untargetable until they've moved into charge range might not be well-received. Maybe make them untargetable outside of, say, 18" or 24" and maybe drop stealth? The grognard in me also feels like this should be renamed as Veil of Tears.

* Cegorach's Favor. Slightly feelsbad. It's basically a free Strands of Fate die every turn, albeit only usable on a specific model, and likely to be frustrating for the same reasons Strands of Fate are. At least the official version means that you're giving up your ability to use Strands of Fate on something else when you use it, and it's costing you a resource. I think I'd rather see something more fluffy and less kill-more-better-y.

* Player of the Twilight. Fluffy. I like it.

* Player of the Dark. I like the precision. Anti-Infantry 5+ is just there to fish for crits with the troupe master, right? That's fine, but my personal preference would be to swap out the kill-more-better rule with something fluffy. It's not quite capturing some of that juicy, visceral Dark Troupe flavor we got in previous editions.

* Webway Walker. Cool! I like it.

* Player of the Light. Is a kill-more-better rule, but that's kind of Light's thing.

* Stratagems. I notice you have them all marked as Strategic Ploys. I'm pretty sure a lot of them should be Battlefield Tactics instead; not that that's likely to impact much. These mostly seem good. War Dancers is a kill-more-better rule. I see what you're going for with No Price Too Steep, but it kind of gives Ynnari, marine, or even Khorne vibes more than tricksy clown vibes. Personal preference would be to swap those out with something that leans into the trickster/illusion motif. Enter strategic reserves after killing a unit? Inflicting damage on the enemy on invuln saves of 6 (stop hitting yourself)? Phantasm? Maybe a "super jump" representing a coordinated stunt with their flip belts? Just spitballing and spouting off personal preferences. What you have seems fine.

* No tweaks to Death Jesters to let each one in the army use Cruel Amusement instead of just one?

* Wondering if Star Weavers still have a place if your troops are untargetable thanks to shadowseers. At the risk of suggesting too much of a power boost, maybe let things assault out of them so they're functionally a threat range extender for troupes? Or possibly giving them an invuln that increases if they advance (but take away assault from their guns) so you can trade offense for defense + mobility?

* Sky Weavers and Void Weavers good as-is? I don't see any obvious problems with them, but your proposed changes don't seem to interact with them much.

Overall, I'd be fine playing with or against these rules. Good job.


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
Made in ru
Flower Picking Eldar Youth




 Wyldhunt wrote:

Regarding the proposed changes:

Thanks for the feedback, really appreciate that! Glad you picked up how I messed up with stratagem's types, never even saw it for some reason.

About some of your points, just to clarify my thoughts process:

* Luck of the Laughing God. Kind of boring for the same reasons the eldar detachment rules are boring. You've also added a bunch of kill-more-better rules in here which the LotLG rerolls could make even more frustrating for opponents.

This and many others weird unchanged parts, like the fact that only one DJ can use his ability, are due to my intentional design choice: "don't change if not necessary". The more similar those rules to the original, the easier they are to remember for you and your opponent. You both know, that eldar have re-rolls. So they still do, there's no need to worry about that. You can see, that most of the changes I've made to the datasheets are there just to fix stuff, except for one example.

* Fog of Dreams. I wish there was more counterplay here. As-is, you have to get right in the unit's face, and then you still have a to-hit penalty to deal with. I feel like telling your opponent that your units are untargetable until they've moved into charge range might not be well-received. Maybe make them untargetable outside of, say, 18" or 24" and maybe drop stealth?

Again, fair points, won't argue, just to clear things up. The shadowseer, original one, is bad. You get stealth, but it's still a t3 sv4+ models, it won't save you from any significant anti-infantry shooting, and with the current situation of every additional wargear being free, there are a lot more of small firearm glued to the vehicles for some cheap shots. Even worse, if you hide your shadowseer, it would be an excellent target for indirect weapons, who would just ignore your stealth. So the only one "role" for shadowseer is to give you an ability to make a long charge, but without any damage abilities, this is pretty worthless in most situations.

So, with the army rule giving every unit charge after advance, making shadorseer even worse, I've decided that this datasheet must be reworked. And with troupe master taking the role of damage dealer, I've decided that it is up to shadowseer to become your "objective holder". And since there is no way to make your troupes survivable enough, without turning it into a potential 13-elf murder-blob, the simplest solution was to make them untargetable. And with additional stealth on top, your opponent actually has to put some effort, if he wants to remove your squad from the table.

The grognard in me also feels like this should be renamed as Veil of Tears.

This was the hardest sacrifice for me, to preserve resemblance to the original.

* Player of the Dark. I like the precision. Anti-Infantry 5+ is just there to fish for crits with the troupe master, right? That's fine, but my personal preference would be to swap out the kill-more-better rule with something fluffy. It's not quite capturing some of that juicy, visceral Dark Troupe flavor we got in previous editions.

Actually, I believe, this is the cool one. You have two options, either troupe master, or DJ. With troupe master, yes, this is a cheap alternative for your one-and-only solitaire, with additional mortals. BUT! Relic works on any weapon, so melta-pistol-in-your-face in also a viable tactic. With a DJ you gain a free precision, meaning you either can shoot characters with sustained hits on top, or save this ability for your second DJ for second precision or sustained hits, if you need it.

* Wondering if Star Weavers still have a place if your troops are untargetable thanks to shadowseers. At the risk of suggesting too much of a power boost, maybe let things assault out of them so they're functionally a threat range extender for troupes? Or possibly giving them an invuln that increases if they advance (but take away assault from their guns) so you can trade offense for defense + mobility?
* Sky Weavers and Void Weavers good as-is? I don't see any obvious problems with them, but your proposed changes don't seem to interact with them much.

The obvious new use for Sky Weavers is that they can advance 20" (potentially even dealing some MW, scary!) and charge.

More hidden interaction, is that all the units above have an option to gain even more survivability. "Lightning fast" stratagem was swapped for "Prismatic blur", giving unit 3++ instead, but all the -weavers still have "Smoke" keyword, meaning for 2cp they could get -1 to-hit and 3++.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2024/02/04 01:16:52


 
   
 
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