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I'm trying to think about something the new release has that we can all agree on...hmmm...

Can we all agree, that it will be (by the current rumours) a better codex than we have now? Let's face it, it wouldn't be hard.

If so, any complaint we may have about the new codex needs to be tempered by this, whatever the changes, we are overall better off. Keep that in mind. Of course, if you think going by the current rumours the old one is still better...uhh...yeah.

I would agree with that. Anythign to even partially update the army will result in more people playign it, maybe dusting off those old necrons.

I for one would love to play against something other than marines for a change.

I still maintain that it will be pretty competitive, at least for the next two months.

Yes, people will grumble about all sorts of small details (the fluff change, the new flayed ones, the amount of destroyers you can take, the hats on the Lychguard), but most will hopefully accept that much like DE last year, this is a quantum leap forward for Crons.

Now only Sisters have to escape their 3rd edition model range and get a decent Codex.

As a side note, this seems a fortuitous time, perhaps, to remind you guys that Zealot Games sells "robot mites", which look rather... familiar, and germane to this discussion. You get 6 scarabs mites and a single base for £3.20, which I imagine could also be done as 2 bases with 3 scarabs each on it if you have a lot of bases.

I never bought their product, I don't represent them, your mileage may vary, etc. But if indeed scarabs are the new hotness, it's a consideration.

Myself, I have 13 scarab bases, 10 or so of which have 4 scarabs each on them, and I'm far more inclined to turn 9 of those 4 scarab bases into 12x 3 scarab bases (15 totes).

Interesting! I guess you could say, Zealot Games "mite" be the best option! Ah hah hah hah...I'll just let myself out.

Dr. Delorean wrote:Interesting! I guess you could say, Zealot Games "mite" be the best option! Ah hah hah hah...I'll just let myself out.

Well, I chuckled...

Oh dear......

Flashman wrote:Yes, people will grumble about all sorts of small details (the fluff change, the new flayed ones, the amount of destroyers you can take, the hats on the Lychguard), but most will hopefully accept that much like DE last year, this is a quantum leap forward for Crons.

No its not, as far as myself and alot of other people are concerned this is a step back for Necrons, both in their fluff as in the overal character of the model line / army.

They are now just Tomb Kings in space with very few things that make them unique or stand out from all the other 40k races and to make it worse GW has butchered 10+ years of their own backstory just to make everything "fit" together (like a round peg in a square hole).

@Yakface
Are the immortals or any of the new minis on 40mm bases?
Would you have any idea when the rest of the range will be released? Maybe in the same way as Dark Eldar was released?

@everyone else
You all do realize that you can create whatever backstory/ fluff for your armies much in the same wY folks create your own SM chapters? Not like anyone is going to parachute in and break all your minis because you created your own story.

A few people have asked why I don't just post basically the entire codex and be done with it and others have asked for an overall opinion from me on how competitive or uncompetitive I think the new Necrons are going to be. There have also been requests to reveal the points value for a particular unit or piece of wargear.

I'm going to try to address all those questions here:


Why don't I just post basically the entire contents of the codex? Well, posting copyrighted material up online without permission from the creator is illegal and will rather quickly garner the attention of the Games Workshop legal team. Making an uber-post that basically outlines the entire codex is probably legally rather safe (although I don't know, I'm not a lawyer), but even if it is, doing so would most certainly draw the ire of the GW legal department and frankly that's not the kind of attention that I want this site to have.

But more importantly, I was granted access to this information under the precondition that I not simply give the milk away for free so nobody would then want the cow. Why exactly the source wanted that is unimportant, because I made that promise and I intend to keep it. I am very grateful that this information was passed onto me, and I intend to make sure that person feels that I kept my word.

More than that really, there are many people out there in the world (and therefore also on the internet) that seem as though they are in some sort of race to be the first to declare that something 'sucks' or is 'broken' or just generally be the first to get their opinion down as fact.

That is not my goal. The idea is to tease everyone with enough details of the Necron codex to get you excited, but to leave the decision on whether or not you think the codex is broken or 'X' unit sucks up to you. I couldn't resist myself in a few places I know (such as when describing the Deathmarks), but for the most part I've tried to minimize my commentary.

Because these are rumors and unless I were going to post the entire codex verbatim (which I'm clearly not) then any argument/discussion about the viability of units or the codex as a whole at this point is generally moot as everyone doesn't have access to the full information.

So relax! There will be plenty of time to issue your decrees on how worthless or worthwhile the codex is when you read the full rules. I, for one, don't like to pass judgements on things until I get a few games under my belt with them trying them out, so that alone gives me good enough reason not to be the first to tell you that 'X' unit sucks or 'Y' unit is broken.


I'm also not going to post every detail about every point value in the game. While I may slip here and there and give out teasers, I'm not trying to get to the point where you can figure out every point value in the codex by doing a cross-reference of different posts, so please don't ask for point values!


----


With that out of the way, let's get back to the fun business of more teaser tidbits:

A lot of people seemed to like the idea of Trazyn the Infinite (aka the Necron who likes to collect artifacts), so I figure I'd go over a bit more some of his special rules.

First, I mentioned already that he is the named character that has the wargear that allows him to wound every model of the same 'type' that are in the combat with him (read the first page summary for more details on that if you're unfamiliar). This is his weapon, which means you've only got the base attacks of the model without any power weapon properties, etc. So to get this potential wound on every model in the combat is not going to be an easy task typically.


Beyond that he's got a few more unique rules:

1) He is a scoring unit (because in reality when he's 'claiming' an objective he's really seeking to claim a hidden Necron artifact nearby, it says).

2) Anytime he is removed as a casualty, roll a D6. On a 1, he is removed as normal (but would still get a chance to use Reanimation Protocols as usual I presume as he has that special rule too), but on a 2+ you randomly choose another model from all the friendly Lychguards, Crypteks, Necron Lords and Overlords on the table (not counting named versions of those) and remove that model and replace it with Trazyn, who counts as returning to play with the same amount of wounds the model he replaces had. And it even specifies that he only gives out Kill Points when he doesn't return this way.

3) He has Mindshackle Scarabs (which is a piece of wargear that other character-type models in the army have access to). These allow the bearer to randomly pick one enemy model in base contact before any attacks are made in CC that turn. That model must pass a Ld test on 3D6. If it fails the test, it instead does D3 attacks on its own unit using the weapons/special rules of the Necron player's choice (if the model has different weapons or kinds of attacks).


So while not a powerhouse or a character that boosts the ability of your army, he is a HQ that is a scoring unit which can give you a few different tactical options.

PhantomViper wrote:

Flashman wrote:Yes, people will grumble about all sorts of small details (the fluff change, the new flayed ones, the amount of destroyers you can take, the hats on the Lychguard), but most will hopefully accept that much like DE last year, this is a quantum leap forward for Crons.

No its not, as far as myself and alot of other people are concerned this is a step back for Necrons, both in their fluff as in the overal character of the model line / army.

They are now just Tomb Kings in space with very few things that make them unique or stand out from all the other 40k races and to make it worse GW has butchered 10+ years of their own backstory just to make everything "fit" together (like a round peg in a square hole).

Judging by this thread alone, a lot more people are excited and happy about the changes. I don't think I've heard anyone say it's a "Step Back" in the Model line.

There are very few things that make these "Tomb Kings in space" Besides that they share an Egyptian theme.

You can't please everyone, But GW went the right direction with this. This fluff appeals to a broader audience, and allows for a lot more character in the army.

Wow, Trazyn sounds stone-cold awesome. He sounds more like a trickster wizard than a CC monster, and that ability to replace another character is amazing, and making someone attack their own unit is always funny. Combining this with that other character's ability to control a vehicle could lead to some nice mind-taking hilarity!

Dr. Delorean wrote:I'm trying to think about something the new release has that we can all agree on...hmmm...

Can we all agree, that it will be (by the current rumours) a better codex than we have now? Let's face it, it wouldn't be hard.

If so, any complaint we may have about the new codex needs to be tempered by this, whatever the changes, we are overall better off. Keep that in mind. Of course, if you think going by the current rumours the old one is still better...uhh...yeah.

Actually, the only thing I suppose EVERYONE will agree on about the new release is the awful look of the flayed ones...both lovers and haters of the upcoming dex...

Trazyn does sound pretty neat, he has a lot going for him, that's for sure. I am surprised at the lack of a power weapon though.

Dr. Delorean wrote:Can we all agree, that it will be (by the current rumours) a better codex than we have now? Let's face it, it wouldn't be hard.

If I were going to bet money on this I'd bet the price of a codex in 5 years (so about $66.75?) that people will scream "OMG NECRONS ARE BROKEN" for the first month, like they always do, and then when people actually play with them, we'll all find out that the codex is actually garbage but with a prettier cover. Kinda like Tyranids.

Or no, they'll be sorta playable at first and might even be kinda good, but then the FAQ will come out six months later, it'll make no sense whatsoever and will seemingly just screw over random units and change how rules work for no reason other than to give the middle finger to Necron players, and then it'll suck and only die-hard Necron fans or people who just can't afford to buy another army will stick with them, all the while wondering when they'll ever get their jetfighter or missing characters.

Sidstyler wrote:

Dr. Delorean wrote:Can we all agree, that it will be (by the current rumours) a better codex than we have now? Let's face it, it wouldn't be hard.

If I were going to bet money on this I'd bet the price of a codex in 5 years (so about $66.75?) that people will scream "OMG NECRONS ARE BROKEN" for the first month, like they always do, and then when people actually play with them, we'll all find out that the codex is actually garbage but with a prettier cover. Kinda like Tyranids.

Or no, they'll be sorta playable at first and might even be kinda good, but then the FAQ will come out six months later, it'll make no sense whatsoever and will seemingly just screw over random units and change how rules work for no reason other than to give the middle finger to Necron players, and then it'll suck and only die-hard Necron fans or people who just can't afford to buy another army will stick with them, all the while wondering when they'll ever get their jetfighter or missing characters.

What leads you to this conclusion?

I think Trazyn will actually be pretty balanced and still very viable, some of his abilities are a bit OTT without being overpowered however which screams M. Ward to me to be honest, but at least it should still be balanced.

Yak, I completely agree with pretty much everything you've said (except for the model range) and I understand your methods behind the gradual release - which has done a great job of teasing/advertising, take note GW - and inability to just show the entire thing.
All this information is much appreciated Yak and has surely done a great job of stirring up interest in the Necrons and even sales for GW.

A big thank you to our mysterious benefactor too.

Thanks for all the info so far! I have a question though. On the first page are two quotes by Yakface on Praetorians...

Yakface wrote:Praetorians: S5 T5 jump infantry. 3+ save. Have a 6" shot S5 AP2 Assault 1 power weapon staff or 2 rending swords and a 3+ inv. 40 pts each.

yakface wrote:Triarch Ptaetorians: These used to be effectively the 'police' (my term) of the main Necron ruler (the last of which was the Silent King) to help enforce his will onto the Lords of the Empire. They are known to respect great warriors and honor valor and have sometimes ordered Necron Overlords to stop attacking a foe they deemed worthy of respect (much to the Lord's chagrin). They are Jump Infantry with a 6" AP2 S5 weapon. They can swap that out for Void Blades (a weapon with Rending and the same Entriopic ability that Scarabs have) and Particle Casters (a pistol weapon). No transport option.

So which one is correct? Is the staff a power weapon? And does taking the blades grant you a 3+ invulnerable save?

I'm also very curious about the Flayed Ones: do they still have a 'fear' based ability? No need for specifics if you can't give any, just curious if there's still something there

This thread is quite a roller coaster.
I've already bought in eager anticipation and subsequently smashed with a hammer in frustrated rage five distinct Necron armies based on the prevailing mood.

Yes Trazyn appealed to many, maybe because he is possibly one of the characters that most stray from the stereotypical Necron image we all had so far. And those rules don't sound bad at all. Sure, maybe one will choose someone more fitting to killing stuff but he can play around with the enemy enough to mess him up. Ld check with 3d6? Nice! Imagine your opponent's prized hero turning his Powerfist/Klaw/Whatever against his own unit. Now imagine the look on your opponent's face when this happens.

By the way, I've been looking at that cover art and for the past 10 pages or so and I just noticed the Scarabs. Damn I must be getting old...

Yeah, all Xenos get the shaft. Just look at DE. How terrible are they? Can't people just be happy with what Yakface is offering without going off the deep-end 1 way or the other? It's like 3 weeks till the release date and all we have so far is a brief run-down of some of the options. No need to get worked up.

PhantomViper wrote:

Flashman wrote:Yes, people will grumble about all sorts of small details (the fluff change, the new flayed ones, the amount of destroyers you can take, the hats on the Lychguard), but most will hopefully accept that much like DE last year, this is a quantum leap forward for Crons.

No its not, as far as myself and alot of other people are concerned this is a step back for Necrons, both in their fluff as in the overal character of the model line / army.

They are now just Tomb Kings in space with very few things that make them unique or stand out from all the other 40k races and to make it worse GW has butchered 10+ years of their own backstory just to make everything "fit" together (like a round peg in a square hole).

Well, pretty much all of 40K is basically Fantasy in Space (with the exception of Tau and Tyranids), so ho hum.

I'd also argue that Necrons have always been Tomb Kings in Space (see the big arse floating pyramid that formed the mainstay of the army in the original Codex) and that the new fluff/models merely refines this look. IMHO they've done a respectable job in using the Egyptian theme to inform the design rather than go down the Stargate route which was unabashed Egyptians in Space.

Trazyn does sound fun. Depending on how hard he is to take down in the first place.

based on what Yakface has already posted regarding other stats in the army i would guess he would be something like T5 S5 with a 3+ save (in line with the other Elite units in the army). Maybe the HQs will stand out by way of an invul save or a built-in bonus to the new WBB rule.

It would also be cool if he passes on his scoring ability to any unit he is with, thus making objectives easier to take in the first place.






Cannot wait for this codex to come out. Might hit ebay for some late "deals" on the essentials (immortals, scarabs) and then read the codex before investing in any new units though.

yakface wrote:Ressurrection Protocols returns the model to play with a single wound unless they have a Phylactery in which case they come back (the first time they get back up) with D3 wounds.

I assume that when a model fails its ressurrection protocol that it is permanently removed from play. Or does it continue to make ressurrection roles during the following phases?

Images on Beasts of War have been erased. Hopefully we can keep the images up here.

Praxiss wrote:Might hit ebay for some late "deals" on the essentials (immortals, scarabs) and then read the codex before investing in any new units though.

Or for some decent looking Flayed Ones...

wyomingfox wrote:

yakface wrote:Ressurrection Protocols returns the model to play with a single wound unless they have a Phylactery in which case they come back (the first time they get back up) with D3 wounds.

I assume that when a model fails its ressurrection protocol that it is permanently removed from play. Or does it continue to make ressurrection roles during the following phases?

While I haven't read the codex, I'm almost positive that it gets permanently removed if it fails it's rez save.

Thulsa Doom wrote:Images on Beasts of War have been erased. Hopefully we can keep the images up here.

Did they say why?

Flashman wrote:

Thulsa Doom wrote:Images on Beasts of War have been erased. Hopefully we can keep the images up here.

Did they say why?

I imagine Games Workshops amazing business plan is threatened by pics of their new products which they refuse to release themselves.