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Does a deathrolla work on a rammed vehicle?

The big question is whether we consider a Ram to be a tank shock. It is labeled as a 'special kind of tank shock move' but is an affected vehicle considered to be 'Tank shocked'?
My take is that No, a rammed vehicle is not tank shocked. But I'm interested to hear all opinions on the matter.

Corollary question will be what happens to a skimmer that dodges a Ram from a deathrolla vehicle? The Ork FAQ has stated that a deathrolla equipped vehicle that is stopped by death or glory still inflicts 2d6 S10 hits on the target. Does the skimmer making a dodge negate the ram before or after the skimmer is considered to be 'tank shocked' (if the answer to the first question was yes).

Original post deleted after re-reading pg 69 of the Rulebook. It says "Ramming is a special type of tank shock move and is executed in the same way". Honestly, I have no idea what the ruling on this should be. Since Ramming is a distinct rule apart from Tank Shock, I'd first say that they are two separate things and Deff Rolla cannot be used during a ram. However, the thing that could make a bit of controversy is the line I cited above and that any non-vehicle unit in the way of a ram suffers the effects of Tank Shock. I need a second opinion on this, because I'm really on the fence on this.

everyone i've asked has said that reinforced ram lets trukks ram (ram = tank shock against vehicle)

deff rolla causes d6 str 10 hits against whatever you ram

finally an incentive to take something other than a trukk or a cheap looted wagon as a transport for something nasty

NaZ

A special type of tank shock move, kinda implies that its not a "normal" tank shock, and as such cant use the deathrolla.

The deff-rolla entry doesn't say it works on a 'normal' tank shock move. In fact the entry says 'any tank shock move made by a battlewagon with a deffrolla causes d6 s10 hits on the victim unit'. Therefore, ANY tank shock move, ie. including 'a special kind of tank shock' counts.

What if a skimmer dodges the initial ramming? Does the Deff rolla get to inflict it's damage upon the vehicle still?

In that case, seeing as the skimmer avoids being tank shocked, it takes no damage, I may be wrong though.

'any tank shock move made by a battlewagon with a deffrolla causes d6 s10 hits on the victim unit'

I'd say that by the rules, the skimmer can avoid the ram on a 4+, but takes the roller hits. As to a fluffy reason, I can see that while you might move a skimmer just enough so a ram doesn't hit square, it may be a lot tougher to avoid a 20' wide roller.

Any skimmer that puts itself near a BW with a deathroller, and less than 12" of open ground between them, deserves to get squished.

Whats the exact wording for when a skimmer dodges a ram.

I was wondering about this too. Can we get a final ruling on what happens? I'd guess you would just tank shock getting d6 s10 attacks or you'd ram (risk harming your battlewagon) then get the d6 s10 attacks. Whats the word?

firstly you cann't tank shock vehicals you stop 1" away ... when ramming any infantry (or MC) in the way is tank charged ... now the tricky part is do you get D6 S:10 hits if you ram a vehical ... at a guess (as theres nothing one way or another) i'd say yes simply as a Dreadnought can make a DoG attack, so whould take 2D6 S:10 hits then normal vechicals would take D6 S:10 hits ... but only if the BW didn't get destroyed or imobilised by the ram

... skimmers that dodge i don't think would take no damage as the tank stops (not very orky but there you go) but what you should remember is that the Battle waggon could have a Wrecking ball (S:9 hit on a 4+) or a grabbin klaw (boyz jump out and shoot up the rear armour while the skimmer is pinned)

Firstly, as discussed earlier in the thread. ramming is a special type of tank shock. Therefore, you can tank shock a vehicle.

Secondly, 'when ramming any infantry (or MC) in the way is tank charged' what do you mean by that?

Also, if you look at the FAQ, regardless of whether the wagon is immobilised or destroyed, any unit attempting a death or glory attack takes 2d6 s10 hits, including dreadnoughts.

The skimmer dodging thing is as yet unclear, unless anyone cares to sort that out definitley.

My take is that because of the wording... "'special kind of tank shock move". That a Ram is a tankshock that allows you to effect enemy vehicles.

Just like a seedless watermellon is a special type of watermellon. It is still at its core. a watermellon.

As such any thing that happens during a tankshock happens during a ram. The rammed vehicle takes the damage from the ram and D6 S10 hits from the deth roller.

As for the skimmer, that one I'm iffy on. The fact that on a 3+ the ram fails, it would be the same as if the tank didn't have enough range to reach it. As such no D6 hits. But, the skimmer was still tank shocked, as such the D6 S10 hits should apply.

Like I said, the skimmer issue is a bit more iffy. wheeled/tracked vehicles however are screwed.

A vehicle is not "tank shocked" by another vehicle performing a ram manouvre, the effects of a tank shock are that you must take a morale check(falling back if you fail) and be pushed to the side. The effects of Ramming on a vehicle is "each vehicle immediately suffers a hit against the armour facing where the other vehicle has impacted".

they are distinctly different effects from a similar action which GW saw fit to define using two different words, tank shock, and ram.

Additionally, tank shocking and ramming aren't one and the same because for example the Dark Eldar FAQ specifically says that a piece of wargear which allows tank shocks does NOT allow ramming.

An infantry unit tank shocked/rammed recieves the d6 str 10 hits even if they make their test (a leadership test) and move out of the way.

A skimmer tank shocked/rammed recieves the d6 str 10 hits even if it makes its test (a special 4+ test) and moves out of the way.

Seems simple.

It's only 20 points... my guess, it wan't intended to work on vehicles.

Anyway, you should make a point of resolving the isue with oponents before playing.

To avoid unwanted conflict.

Well the Ork Codex came out well before the 5th edition RB. This case, and the Fleet of footing orks are both some of the examples (and there are a few more too) that the Ork codex was written without fore knowledge of the final rules for 5th ed.

With that said, it is obvious that the deffrolla among a couple other items was not intended for Ramming because Ramming was not invented yet.

This one is not really RAW tight either way. In as such, the wording for "a special kind of...(anything)" can be interpreted as either 'like the item enough to be the same' or 'not like the item enough not to be the same'. So both readings are indeed accurate unless you knew the intent of the writer in which case we don't.

So, this one is defiantly in the category of a House Rule. And if you are playing a pick up game outside your normal circle, it would be best to talk this one over if you feel this may come up in a game.

Ruddatt,

Please don't post in threads that are more than a few weeks dormant in the YMDC forum unless you have something significant to add that hasn't already been brought up in the thread.


Locking now due to thread necromancy. . .