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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Scyzantine Empire

While I'm close to fielding my eldar warhost, they have no rides. I've been very unlucky at finding any mechanized units when buying my models and as a result have no bikes, no serpents, no falcons, and no fire prisms. I do, however, have pretty much everything else on the eldar FOC... I need help building a list for my footslogging space elves. Any suggestions? Here's what I've got:

HQ
Autarch (w/ mandiblaster, warp pack or wings, making it magnetized for a variety of gear)
Farseer
Warlocks w/ Witchblades x4
Warlocks w/ Spears x3
Avatar
Eldrad
all the Lords except Fuegan

Elites
Striking Scorpions x5 exarch w/ claw
Fire Dragons x10 exarch w/ firepike
Banshees x10 one exarch w/ mirrorswords & one w/ executioner
Harlequins x5 troupe master, seer, x3 kisses
Wraithguard x1 (I'll be getting up to x5 when I can afford them)

Troops
Dire Avengers x20 exarchs w/ twin 'cats, pw/ss, and pw/ss
Rangers/Pathfinders x5
Guardians x20 (I'll be getting more eventually, probably another 20)
Weapon Platforms (a variety of weapons available, already posted a thread on that here)

Fast Attack
Warp Spiders x6 exarch has twin spinners, but I might model one to have a spinnerette rifle - anyone have any good pics of one?
Swooping Hawks x5 exarch has sunrifle

Heavy Support
Dark Reapers x10 exarchs w/ EML, Shuriken Cannon, and the old one w/ web of skulls
Wraithlords x2 (see weapons platforms for options)
Warwalker x1 (same as WL's)

It's a pretty heavy Aspect Warrior lineup and I was thinking of painting my guardians and machines Biel-Tan to play a "Court of the Young King". Suggestions anyone? Besides getting some transports, that is...

What harm can it do to find out? It's a question that left bruises down the centuries, even more than "It can't hurt if I only take one" and "It's all right if you only do it standing up." Terry Pratchett, Making Money

"Can a magician kill a man by magic?" Lord Wellington asked Strange. Strange frowned. He seemed to dislike the question. "I suppose a magician might," he admitted, "but a gentleman never could." Susanna Clarke Jonathan Strange & Mr. Norrell

DA:70+S+G+M++B++I++Pw40k94-D+++A+++/mWD160R++T(m)DM+

 
   
Made in us
Sneaky Sniper Drone





Kansas

How Many Points?

Armies owned
5th Ed:
Tau Stats: 14-2-8 Won against: :
Eldar Stats: 5-0-3 Won Against:
Space Marine:
Ork:

4th Ed:
Tau 82% Win, 5% Tie 13% Loss
Blood Angels: 70%  
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Scyzantine Empire

Sorry I didn't indicate the point value of the list I'm looking for.

Most local games are anywhere from 1000 to 1750. Some get as large as 2k, mostly RTT's or special events.

What harm can it do to find out? It's a question that left bruises down the centuries, even more than "It can't hurt if I only take one" and "It's all right if you only do it standing up." Terry Pratchett, Making Money

"Can a magician kill a man by magic?" Lord Wellington asked Strange. Strange frowned. He seemed to dislike the question. "I suppose a magician might," he admitted, "but a gentleman never could." Susanna Clarke Jonathan Strange & Mr. Norrell

DA:70+S+G+M++B++I++Pw40k94-D+++A+++/mWD160R++T(m)DM+

 
   
Made in us
Sneaky Sniper Drone





Kansas

Here is my idea.

A flexable Castle and counter assault. The lack of vechicles due cause some problems. This idea is a little more troop base. But it allows a good defense that can turn and strike. I have learned you need good troop choices, with support so here it is.

1750 pts

HQ:
Jan Zaar 190
"best counter assault will eat assault marines!"

Total 190

Elite:
Howwling Banshees
9x Banshees 144
1x Exarch (mirror Sword and pistol) 38

Total 182
Fire Dragons
9x Fire Dragons 144
1x Exarch (Firepike, Crack Shot) 41

Total 185
Harlequin Troup
3x Harlequin with Kiss 66
1x Shadowseer 48
1x Troup Master 38

Total 152

Troops:

2x Dire Avengers
8x Dire Avengers 96
1x Exarch (Blade Storm/Diresword and SP) 49

Total 290
2x Guardians
1x Warlock (Conceal /Witchblade/Pistol) 40
10x Guardians with Star Cannon 105

Total 290
Ranger
5x Rangers 95

Total 95
Fast Attack:

None

Heavy:

2x Wraithlords pt 280
(Bright Lance, Twin-link Flammer, Wraithsword)

Total 280
War Walker pt 85
(Bright Lance, Star Cannon)

Total 85
Grand Total 1749

2000pt Option:

To give alot more fire support remove the War Walker
and add a HQ Choice and a Heavy Choice
Ajusted Grand Total 1661

HQ:

Maugan Ra pt 195

Heavy:

4xDark Reapers pt 140

New Grand Total 2000

Armies owned
5th Ed:
Tau Stats: 14-2-8 Won against: :
Eldar Stats: 5-0-3 Won Against:
Space Marine:
Ork:

4th Ed:
Tau 82% Win, 5% Tie 13% Loss
Blood Angels: 70%  
   
Made in us
Sneaky Sniper Drone





Kansas

This army would work in the Castle defence because so little mobility, but with fleet all you have to do is us this also in a ground base spearhead attack. The Elite Choice would do well right behind the troop choices. The tip bieng the Dire Avengers. The make the initial punch through and the Harliqun and Banshee run up through the hole. The Wraith lord could also help the break through, or will eat up allot of heavy fire, also can be used as flankers to make sure no one comes around the flanks. Guardians with Star Cannons would be on the left and right to either shoot as assaulter come in or speed bump the assaulters for the Elites to slaughter on counter charge.

These are just some ideas and to open the discussion

Astalado

Armies owned
5th Ed:
Tau Stats: 14-2-8 Won against: :
Eldar Stats: 5-0-3 Won Against:
Space Marine:
Ork:

4th Ed:
Tau 82% Win, 5% Tie 13% Loss
Blood Angels: 70%  
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Here is my 1753 pt list based on your models. Drop a Dire Avenger or something to get down to 1750

Eldrad @ 210 pts
Avatar @ 155 pts

10 Howling Banshees @ 160 pts

10 Guardians w/ BL @ 110 pts
10 Guardians w/ BL @ 110 pts
10 Dire Avengers, Exarch w/ PW&SS, Bladestorm @ 162 pts
10 Dire Avengers, Exarch w/ PW&SS, Bladestorm @ 162 pts
5 Pathfinders @ 120 pts

5 Dark Reapers, Exarch w/ Tempest & Crack shot @ 217 pts
5 Dark Reapers, Exarch w/ Tempest & Crack shot @ 217 pts
Wraithlord w/ BL, 2x flamers

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2008/09/11 10:03:25


 
   
Made in us
Agile Revenant Titan




Florida

I've found the foot slogging Eldar is just not working out well in 5th ed. With the tweak to flamer templates, locally, these items are really being maximized and Eldar just crumple against this. Every troop choice you have dies to Heavy Flamers, which I'm betting is going to become even more common with the new SM codex.

If your local area hasn't caught on to this, great for you and keep at the Eldrad/Avatar footslogging horde. I had a lot of good games with it in 4th. Nowadays, mechanized and jetbikes are what is working.

No earth shattering, thought provoking quote. I'm just someone who was introduced to 40K in the late 80's and it's become a lifelong hobby. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Scyzantine Empire

@Astalado: my WL's are the older variety, without swords... w/ WYSIWYG, I couldn't field them as such. I might be able to convert them, but I wasn't planning on doing more than adding a second heavy weapon pintle. I like the list for the most part, but any reason for the Starcannons? I've been warned away from them as they aren't as reliable as EML's or Scatterlasers vs. cover saves. The tactics you provide are also very clear and concise, either holing up in Castle or advancing in Spearhead.

@MGIMD: I'd love to be able to play a game w/o the prolific and nefarious Eldrad, but alas, he's like crack: too good for the price and I don't think I'd be able to get around not using him if I'm going to have a seer in my HQ. The list you provide is also simple and straightforward and the same tactics would work with it as well. I might want to take Defend on the DA's as well, probably dropping a few models or swapping the Guardian's Lances for Scatterlasers. Their BS of 3 makes the lance a chancy configuration and I'd like the extra shots (and chances of hitting) that the scatter would provide. I don't see the advantage of the Tempest Launcher on the Reaper Exarchs though. Can you clarify that choice for me?

@Sarigar: whether it works or not, these are the models I have. Ideally, I'd field a jetbike council, have my elites in serpents, my troops on bikes, a falcon and some Vypers, and a Fire prism or two. Unfortunately, I have no Windrider Host, just a plethora of foot soldiers. Eventually that will change, but one must occassionally make choices between one's hobby and one's investments. That being said, how would you counter the effect of templates in a list with these models?

What harm can it do to find out? It's a question that left bruises down the centuries, even more than "It can't hurt if I only take one" and "It's all right if you only do it standing up." Terry Pratchett, Making Money

"Can a magician kill a man by magic?" Lord Wellington asked Strange. Strange frowned. He seemed to dislike the question. "I suppose a magician might," he admitted, "but a gentleman never could." Susanna Clarke Jonathan Strange & Mr. Norrell

DA:70+S+G+M++B++I++Pw40k94-D+++A+++/mWD160R++T(m)DM+

 
   
Made in us
Executing Exarch





Los Angeles

I don't have a codex at hand so building you a list is going to be difficult, however I can discuss the virtues of various elements in a foot slogging army.

Autarch (w/ mandiblaster, warp pack or wings, making it magnetized for a variety of gear)

Unfortunately an Autarch is of little to no use in an army like this. His hand to hand power is minimal compared to his price and unless you are going to have some units in reserve often (outflanking scorpions or the like) the +1 to reserve rolls will also be useless.
Farseer

Probably one of the better HQ options. You can either give him fortune and doom and mix him in with your forward units or give him guide (and maybe fortune too) and put him in with your back field units. In general though, with the options you have here, putting him in a forward position is probably the best idea.
Warlocks w/ Witchblades x4, Warlocks w/ Spears x3

Running a seer council with the farseer would work really well as a tough unit to screen your softer forward troop units. The shining spears will also help your lack of anti tank ability (although you have to get crazy close to use it. Give the squad embolden and your farseer can re-roll his psi tests. Pepper in an enhance and maybe a couple of destructors (if you don't just plan on running into hand to hand) and you'll be set. If you give out some warlocks to the guardian squads, make sure you give out the witchblade ones since the singing spears will just go to waste in back field guardian units.
Avatar

I would highly recommend using the avatar. He's tough and makes your whole army (mostly) fearless. Can't go wrong there.
Eldrad

Whiles he's great for the points, I always feel scummy if I use him or recommend that someone else does. So take that as you will.
all the Lords except Fuegan

I don't think you really have the models necessary to put the phoenix lords to good use. The only one that might fit into your army would be Jain Zar, but without a transport, he squad is going to get chewed up badly. As much as it pains me to say it, its probably best to leave the Phoenix Lords on the shelf for the time being.
striking Scorpions x5 exarch w/ claw

You simply don't have enough models to make this unit effective. I would never hit the field with less than 8 models in the squad. The lack staying power and lack punch with anything less. I too own 5 painted scorpions and they never see the field.
Fire Dragons x10 exarch w/ firepike

Another squad that's going to suffer due to lack of models. However the lack here is a transport. Without a transport, you have to bank on your opponent being stupid and moving his tanks into range of the fire dragons for them to be useful. The only time I would recommend taking fire dragons on foot is if your primary opponent plays a terminator heavy army all the time.
Banshees x10 one exarch w/ mirrorswords & one w/ executioner

Without a transport, this unit will suffer, but unlike the dragons, they are not reduced to worthlessness. What you will need to do is run them up behind a screen created by the seer council. This will ensure that they get 4+ cover saves all the time while they are moving up to get into assault. In the foot slogging case though, you MUST bring a full squad of 10, you have no choice. As for the exarch, the exarch powers for banshees are fairly useless but cheep if you have points laying around. Mirrorswords and the executioner are statistically the same so field which ever you like the most.
Harlequins x5 troupe master, seer, x3 kisses

Quins are ok, but without a shadow seer (or a transport) they are worthless. Either use the troupe master as a shadowseer or leave the squad on the shelf. If you do bring them though, they make a great screening unit for troops behind them (units behind them get 4+ cover and the enemy has to roll against the veil of tear if they want to shoot the quins).
Dire Avengers x20 exarchs w/ twin 'cats, pw/ss, and pw/ss

Dire avengers are decent foot troops. Run them up till they get close enough to shoot. Just remember that they don't do much (if anything) in hand to hand. Even with all the close combat upgrades you can give them, they only become decent at not dieing rather than doing any actual damage. You'll need to keep quins or banshees around to bail these guys out once they get into hand to hand.
Rangers/Pathfinders x5

A great unit that works well at any squad size. Always upgrade them to pathfinders as the increase in both offensive and defensive ability is well worth the points. These are the best back field objective holders you could possibly have.
Guardians x20 (I'll be getting more eventually, probably another 20)

Guardians are also decent troops if you understand their role. Their role is to be guardians and guard objectives. Basically what that means is that you take small to mid sized squads of them and move them onto back field objectives to hold them. You can also march guardians forward along with (or just slightly behind) the rest of your force. Once you steam roll over an objective, the guardians can stick around and hold the objective while the remainder of the army continues on. Putting scatter lasers or missile launchers in the squad will see that they have some decent long range fire power regardless of where they are. Also, a warlock with embolden will ensure that they don't break and run.
Warp Spiders x6 exarch has twin spinners, but I might model one to have a spinnerette rifle - anyone have any good pics of one?

I've never really found a good use for warp spiders. They are one of the fastest units you have available but their short range weaponry and the temptation to run them off into unsupported situations generally just gets them killed. You could try to use them as a stop gap unit that can zip around your lines to lend help where ever it is needed, but you have to be careful not to get them in front of your lines.
Swooping Hawks x5 exarch has sunrifle

Some of my favorite GW models and also the worst unit in the eldar codex (probably). They are simply too expensive for the minimal ability. Las blasters just don't do enough damage for the cost and the same goes for the hawk bombs. Trying to use intercept and have them be hand to hand vehicle hunters is just a death wish for them since tanks are back row units these days and that means you got a whole army shooting at T3 4+ save guys that are expensive. All in all, the unit is a no go.
Dark Reapers x10 exarchs w/ EML, Shuriken Cannon, and the old one w/ web of skulls

Dark reapers are going to be your biggest source of troop killing. Nothing else you can field (or possibly in the whole codex other than arguably war walkers) can put out the troop killing power that reapers can. Make sure you give your exarch a tempest launcher (I use the web of skulls model for it) and crack shot. You'll then be lobbing 2 templates that scatter 2d6-5 (if they scatter at all) that re-roll to wound rolls and ignore cover. I've had my reaper exarch wipe out 8 man squads by himself (before the other reapers in the squad fired). And while cover is becoming more common, you can make sure your opponent stays in it (and thus slows his advance) by pointing a bunch of AP 3 weapons in his direction.
Wraithlords x2 (see weapons platforms for options)

Unfortunately, this is going to really be your only source of anti tank power so make sure you put it to use. Put a missile launcher and a bright lance on these guys and send them off.
Warwalker x1 (same as WL's)

While I love war walkers, fielding less than a squad of 3 just isn't very effective. You have much better options for your heavy support slots, so don't waste one on a single war walker.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2008/09/11 19:52:13


**** Phoenix ****

Threads should be like skirts: long enough to cover what's important but short enough to keep it interesting. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Scyzantine Empire

Phoenix, I really appreciate the insight. I do have a full squad of harlies, including a seer and a troupemaster. My idea was to use them as counter-assault instead of as a vanguard though, an idea that I didn't think of. That's exactly why I posted this thread to begin with.

I totally agree about Dragons being sunk points without a transport, I mentioned that in another post somewhere. They'll probably sit out fights unless, as you said, there are Termies involved.

I forgot that the Reaper Launcher isn't a blast weapon, but the Tempest is. The exarch's Crack Shot ignores cover saves - good to remember. I assume that if there's a unit without cover to go with the Fast Shot ability instead (if I take both). I could feasibly field two units backed by a Wraithlord with EML and BL as my heavy choices.

I love Dire Avengers as troops and think that they give the best bang/$ when compared to Guardians which I agree should be used as backfield objective holders. I do have a question though: is the Warlock allotted from the HQ group of 'locks that a Farseer gets or is it independant of that? The codex doesn't specify.

Using the DA's as a spearhead with Harlies at the tip (for cover/Veil) and Banshee's in the middle should be a nice punch/counterpunch. That would leave the guardians in the back to provide cover on objectives and the reapers/WL/pathfinders to hit hard targets and provide cover.

I could use the Autarch with the Spiders, though, as an objective contester. Does his bonus on reserve rolls help when the Spiders Deepstrike? I'm not read up on how that works yet and thought I read about the winged Autarch helping Hawks Deepstrike on Stelek's Hawk-spam list. I'm not confident about Spiders being worth their points though, but it would be nice to have a highly mobile squad with a pinning weapon (spinnerette rifle) and an IC kitted for close combat (power weapon/forceshield) as well as a tank buster (fusion gun). Anyone tried this config? I'll try to put a list together based on this and post it in the List forum for feedback.

What harm can it do to find out? It's a question that left bruises down the centuries, even more than "It can't hurt if I only take one" and "It's all right if you only do it standing up." Terry Pratchett, Making Money

"Can a magician kill a man by magic?" Lord Wellington asked Strange. Strange frowned. He seemed to dislike the question. "I suppose a magician might," he admitted, "but a gentleman never could." Susanna Clarke Jonathan Strange & Mr. Norrell

DA:70+S+G+M++B++I++Pw40k94-D+++A+++/mWD160R++T(m)DM+

 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




You don't absolutely need Eldrad. A tooled up Farseer is fine too.

I think Tempest + Crack shot is almost mandatory for Dark Reaper squads. For most of the games you play your opponent is going to have a MEQ squad in cover, sitting on an objective.

I put bright lances on the guardian squads in my list because that list already has a fair amount of anti-infantry fire from the Reapers and DA. You have to kind of cross your fingers and hope the guardian bright lances.

I believe that the guardian warlock is simply a squad upgrade like a sergeant.
   
Made in us
Sneaky Sniper Drone





Kansas

Its me again... let me give my two sense...

1st. The sword issue. I had the same problem, but I came up with some fun fixes..

1. Go and see if any of your friends have a sword you can use or make one out of plastic card.

a. I used Demon Bloodletter swords or some other medium sized weapon.
b. cut a blade sized piece of plastic card

2. Cut the hilt and the grip off the blade. glue the blade to the middle of the Gauntlet. Leave some space to do the next step.

3. now take a blob of green stuff or model putty. the use a knife or something and model a blended pod shape that comes to the blade so it looks like the blade is part of the Gauntlet.

Now you have a Gauntlet blade Punch Power Sword. its not the ugly huge samuri blade and it reminds me of the blade like a preditor. its acceptible and to me makes it more evil.

Why star Cannons?

They kill marines Intantly.. unless in cover. ML will not kill instantly or wound on a 2+. But what does do is make them roll cover save. Better to roll a 4+ then a 3+ or a 2+. and with str 6 it is like a SL and will kill light armor.


Now may I say some thing about other posts.

Phoenix -
1. I agree
2. Farseerer, He is very impresive but can be instant killed. he is a helper not someone who can bring the fight to enemy. They can be expensive and be helpfull but you need to make sure with no transports that a stray lascannon or even a assault cannon with str 6 doesn't instant kill him. a fully loaded Farseer is not that much lower then a phoenix lord and he is eternal
3. The Council is to expesive. There cute and good but with out armor support they once again get killed. you need numbers when you field foot slogger
4. Eldrad good but again to many point and also easy to instant kill
5. Some of the Pheonix lord used properly.. yeah buddy.. use there skills... they can turn the tide
6. Scorpions are assault marines. use them in ten man squads and power fist
7.Screen Fire dragons and if you castle they become counter battery.. Marines do not like ap 2 weapons hitting assault units that come into lines
8. with Jane Zarr. they become interesting. I love them
9. I think Harlie are cute but to easy to get wacked. There a aswome prize fighter with a glass jaw. Use them but don't coutn your army because of them. If they hit.. yeah. But there checkered and they look prity in gun sites. 5 harlie will make a wonderfull target.. *winks* might get the diversion the banshees need..
10. Dire Avenger I Agree
11. Pathfinders I Agree
12. Guardians agree, but I like Conceal gives them cover saves. against most weapon you will only get the 5+. If you go from castle to spear.. you will be caught in the open.
13 I agree. Hawks are cute but to unreliable
14. Spider leave them at home. Best fast attack choice you have you don't have Vypers are the best for fast tank poppers in the game.
15. I agree put a lance on them and do the converson so if they have to then can assault remeber unless marines have a fist they just watch a wraith lord kick there ass. str 4 can not hurt t 8
16. I agree with the Walker. I like star cannons because of there dual use, and force inv saves are better then normal armor saves. but the lance.. yeah buddy.

Armies owned
5th Ed:
Tau Stats: 14-2-8 Won against: :
Eldar Stats: 5-0-3 Won Against:
Space Marine:
Ork:

4th Ed:
Tau 82% Win, 5% Tie 13% Loss
Blood Angels: 70%  
   
 
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