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Made in au
Death-Dealing Ultramarine Devastator






From the "Drones" entry in the Tau Codex:

If the character with the drone controller is killed then all his drones are removed at the end of the Shooting or Assault phase in which he died.

From "Complex Units" entry in the BRB:

The rules for taking saving throws and removing casualties, as presented so far, assume that all the models in the target unit are identical in gaming terms. By this we mean they have the same profile of characteristics, the same special rules and the same weapons and wargear.
Of course many units include different models, and when this is the case an extra step is needed to determine which warriors have been hit by which weapons. This is worked out as follows:


Now, say I have a squad of 3 Crisis Suits (all with same weapons and wargear), each with a single Shield Drone. Following the rules simply (without much consideration*) I roll saves for the 3 Crisis Suits and Drones, losing a drone and a wound on a suit. They come under fire again, and this time what happens?

a) I now have potentially 5 different types of unit,a single wounded suit and a drone attached, a suit with 2 wounds and a drone attached, and a suit with 2 wounds no drone, as such can allocate and roll saves separately for each of the 5.

b) I still have only the drones as one type, the crisis suits as the other, and allocate and roll for the two types.**

c) Some mix of the two where the drones are 2 different types, or the suits are 3 different types, but not both.

*Assuming a) I can further elaborate that since I have to choose which suit will have a single wound and which suit's drone dies, indicating that each crisis suit and drone counts as a single unit type for wound allocation.

**If such happens, then how do I decide which suits die and which drones to go with them?

As always, RAW is best, but also RAI and general opinion are welcome

 
   
Made in gb
Hanging Out with Russ until Wolftime







ihatehumans wrote:From the "Drones" entry in the Tau Codex:

If the character with the drone controller is killed then all his drones are removed at the end of the Shooting or Assault phase in which he died.

From "Complex Units" entry in the BRB:

The rules for taking saving throws and removing casualties, as presented so far, assume that all the models in the target unit are identical in gaming terms. By this we mean they have the same profile of characteristics, the same special rules and the same weapons and wargear.
Of course many units include different models, and when this is the case an extra step is needed to determine which warriors have been hit by which weapons. This is worked out as follows:


Now, say I have a squad of 3 Crisis Suits (all with same weapons and wargear), each with a single Shield Drone. Following the rules simply (without much consideration*) I roll saves for the 3 Crisis Suits and Drones, losing a drone and a wound on a suit. They come under fire again, and this time what happens?

a) I now have potentially 5 different types of unit,a single wounded suit and a drone attached, a suit with 2 wounds and a drone attached, and a suit with 2 wounds no drone, as such can allocate and roll saves separately for each of the 5.

b) I still have only the drones as one type, the crisis suits as the other, and allocate and roll for the two types.**

c) Some mix of the two where the drones are 2 different types, or the suits are 3 different types, but not both.

*Assuming a) I can further elaborate that since I have to choose which suit will have a single wound and which suit's drone dies, indicating that each crisis suit and drone counts as a single unit type for wound allocation.

**If such happens, then how do I decide which suits die and which drones to go with them?

As always, RAW is best, but also RAI and general opinion are welcome
Firstly, being wounded doesn't count towards the "identical in game terms". It has a VERY strict definition of what is considered "game terms" and being wounded is not one of them, as you pointed out

Secondly, you are ignoring the argument that 3 Suits with Drone Controlers and 3 Drones is actually 4 Differing Wound Groups, but I digress since it isn't RaW.

By the RaW, you have two Wound Groups, one containing the Suits and one containing the Drones. This is because the suits all "have the same profile of characteristics, the same special rules and the same weapons and wargear" and the Drones do too. One Suit being Wounded or One Suit losing his Drone does not count for wound allocation.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/05/26 18:54:15


Got 40k Rules Question? Send an e-mail to Gwar! for your Confidential Rules Queries.
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Made in us
Thrall Wizard of Tzeentch






It's b) and you should probably pick the suit with the least ammount of drones.

When you have a wound group with multi-wound models, you don't have to keep track of the wounds on individuals because you don't roll their saves individually. Just make note that they have a wound on the group.

If they suffer a wound that causes instant death, you have to kill a model with full wounds (if there is one), so you can kill whichever suit you want, even if there is an existing wound.

If one of the suits has already lost it's drone, you are going to want to kill that one first, to save as many drones as possible. Unless for some reason the positioning of the suit is important. Ala, maintaining 50% in cover. But that's more tactics than rules.
   
Made in au
Death-Dealing Ultramarine Devastator






Gwar! wrote:Firstly, being wounded doesn't count towards the "identical in game terms". It has a VERY strict definition of what is considered "game terms" and being wounded is not one of them, as you pointed out


Being wounded doesn't, but since if a drone controller dies, he takes his drone with him, and/or if he loses his drone he (may) count(s) as having different wargear (to be precise, he doesn't have a drone), it could be different "in gaming terms" under the rules.

Gwar! wrote:Secondly, you are ignoring the argument that 3 Suits with Drone Controlers and 3 Drones is actually 4 Differing Wound Groups, but I digress since it isn't RaW.


4 Differing Wound groups? How so?

Gwar! wrote:By the RaW, you have two Wound Groups, one containing the Suits and one containing the Drones. This is because the suits all "have the same profile of characteristics, the same special rules and the same weapons and wargear" and the Drones do too. One Suit being Wounded or One Suit losing his Drone does not count for wound allocation.


I repeat:

**If such happens, then how do I decide which suits die and which drones to go with them?

How do I specify which drones from which suits are dieing, or vice versa, which suits dieing kill of which drones?

 
   
Made in gb
Hanging Out with Russ until Wolftime







ihatehumans wrote:
Gwar! wrote:Firstly, being wounded doesn't count towards the "identical in game terms". It has a VERY strict definition of what is considered "game terms" and being wounded is not one of them, as you pointed out


Being wounded doesn't, but since if a drone controller dies, he takes his drone with him, and/or if he loses his drone he (may) count(s) as having different wargear (to be precise, he doesn't have a drone), it could be different "in gaming terms" under the rules.
And as I pointed out, it doesn't. Suit A is armed with a Drone Controler. Suit B is also armed with a Drone Controller. It doesn't matter if one guy has a Drone left or not, they are the same Wargear item.
Gwar! wrote:Secondly, you are ignoring the argument that 3 Suits with Drone Controlers and 3 Drones is actually 4 Differing Wound Groups, but I digress since it isn't RaW.
4 Differing Wound groups? How so?
As I said it's not RaW, but some people think that because of the whole "Remove the Drone when you die" thing, it causes a differing wound group (it doesn't though)
Gwar! wrote:By the RaW, you have two Wound Groups, one containing the Suits and one containing the Drones. This is because the suits all "have the same profile of characteristics, the same special rules and the same weapons and wargear" and the Drones do too. One Suit being Wounded or One Suit losing his Drone does not count for wound allocation.
I repeat:

**If such happens, then how do I decide which suits die and which drones to go with them?

How do I specify which drones from which suits are dieing, or vice versa, which suits dieing kill of which drones?
That's up to you to decide. All the rules care about is that you keep track of it and remove the drone when it's controller dies. You should have kept track of it when you took the first wound on the drones, and if you didn't, you were breaking the rules!

Got 40k Rules Question? Send an e-mail to Gwar! for your Confidential Rules Queries.
Please do not PM me unless really necessary. I much prefer e-mail.
Need it Answered RIGHT NOW!? Ring me on Skype: "gwar.the.trolle"
Looking to play some Vassal? Ring me for a game!
Download The Unofficial FAQs by Gwar! here! (Dark Eldar Draft FAQ v1.0 released 04/Nov/2010! Download it before the Pandas eat it all!)
 
   
 
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