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 catbarf wrote:


There's also no gameplay benefit to suppressive fire, fire and maneuver, ambush, crossfire, or overlapping fields of fire to begin with. Basically none of the real-world tactics of infantry combat apply.

Not in the core rules, but there are many units in the the game that have rules via one source or another that are designed to simulate these things- Oath of Moment is an overlapping fields of fire effect; GSC still have crossfire rules (I think?), and they certainly have ambush; when my doms get to reroll wounds because the unit they target was hit by the transport they rode into range, that's an overlapping fields of fire effect; units that move in reaction to being targeted (whether by unit ability or strat) are using positioning to mitigate ranged attacks or melee attacks or in some cases, both; many units can move after shooting via strat or unit ability.

I get it- many people would prefer that these abilities were part of the core mechanics- that's a valid point of view, and that type of system probably would feel more like a wargame. But just because the tactics and wargame features that so many people love aren't part of the core mechanics, that doesn't mean they are entirely lacking from the game.

That's true, but given that the discussion is (or was) about IG Heavy Weapons Teams, bringing up what other factions get is a bit less relevant (even if catbarf's post was meant more generally than just IG).

 Niiai wrote:

 bullyboy wrote:
If you’re playing with friends, house rule it. Honestly, this game gets a lot better when you start modifying it.
The issue would be if you had 3 HW teams and deployed 2 in good positions but then parked the 3rd out of sight and protected just so you didn’t lose the unit for VP etc. That’s when it breaks down.

OMG yes. Please give me 20 point action monkeys who demand over comitment of shooting by the opponents 20 units. Investigate signals would be amazing.

Imagine me splitting my neophyte squad into 10 induvidual models.

See, you’re exactly the type of guy where buddy house rules just break down. Your first thought is “what can I do that’s gamey” as in performing actions. Just don’t allow the teams to perform actions if they are separated.
But obviously let’s not apply these changes to someone who just can’t think out of the box.

Making quick changes results in quick issues.

Besides-what’s gamey about a small HWT deploying teleport homers, instead of putting a single Heavy Bolter down range?
It makes more sense for them to handle it than a 20+ model Infantry squad.

 JNAProductions wrote:
Making quick changes results in quick issues.

Besides-what’s gamey about a small HWT deploying teleport homers, instead of putting a single Heavy Bolter down range?
It makes more sense for them to handle it than a 20+ model Infantry squad.

The new Cadian Heavy Weapons Squad is the perfect counter to the constant arguments about "no model no rules".
-There's a model for a Sergeant, but no rules.
-There's bits for a Vox-Caster, but no rules.

There's also flare guns all over the DKoK and Cadian stuff now...but no rules.

Why was that a response to my post?

 JNAProductions wrote:
Why was that a response to my post?

Yes, don't you see where he perfectly picked apart your points, and refuted them all?

That got a genuine laugh out of me, Fezzik. Good on ya for that.

 JNAProductions wrote:
Why was that a response to my post?

You made a mention of the Teleport Homers and it got me thinking about all the random crap that they threw into the new Guard squads, specifically the flare guns & voxes. The Cadian Heavy Weapon Squad is a big offender, but they did it with all 3 of the Cadian kits and the DKoK kit to boot.

So much of the stuff in these boxes would be great to add as wargear, specifically aimed at letting you fiddle with objectives/actions.

That’s just a general objective action you can take. Or at least, it was in 9th-not sure if it’s called the same in 10th.

No model no rules is dumb, though-you’ll have no argument against that from me.