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HQ:

company command squad with creed and kell - 225

TROOPS:

2 platoon command squads- 60
6 infantry squads- 300
2 heavy weapon squads with lascannons- 210

HEAVY SUPPORT:

2 leman russ battle tanks with lascannons, heavy bolter sponsors and heavy stubber- 390
2 basalisks (in squadron) with enclosed crew compartments- 280

POINTS: 1465

please give advise on how to improve list and what upgrades tp give with my 35 points spare.

Thanks

Hi Roger. A couple of platoons backed up by tanks and artillery is my kind of guard army, but I think you should drop creed, kell and the vehicle upgrades and get some weapons for your infantry and command squads. Maybe keep one or two of those, but you need to arm your men imo.

Agree with the wise murdog.
those PCS and PIS need heavy(imho) and special weapons.
i'd drop the Bassys' upgrades and Creed and Kell.

I too don't think much of lasgun squads armed with absolutely nothing else. You could save a fair amount of points by folding your heavy weapon squads into the infantry, which would also serve to protect them from fire. Some special weapons should also be easily affordable. Ordnance batteries don't like being squadroned, in my opinion. I'd want to switch around the structure of the heavy support to put the tanks in squadron and run the Basilisks (which might as well stay open-topped) separately.

rogersss wrote:company command squad with creed and kell - 225

Why do you feel you're getting nearly 2 basilisks worth of stuff from this squad?

rogersss wrote:2 platoon command squads- 60
6 infantry squads- 300
2 heavy weapon squads with lascannons- 210

Firstly, you're spending 570 points for VERY little firepower. This is bad. You have 14 special weapons slots that are going empty. Fill them.

Secondly, your infantry don't have "stubborn" which means they will flee off the board en masse once your enemy gets close (which they will). Commissars or Chenkov is a must.

rogersss wrote:2 leman russ battle tanks with lascannons, heavy bolter sponsors and heavy stubber- 390
2 basalisks (in squadron) with enclosed crew compartments- 280

Crew Compartments aren't worth taking. They are helpful against a few stray shots here and there, but if your opponent is actually trying to kill your basilisks on purpose, they're going to rip right through the vehicle, crew cab or not.

Secondly, squads are bad. They limit your firepower and make the squads more fragile. You don't want either of these things with artillery.

Thirdly, sponsons can only shoot if the vehicle is sitting still. If the vehicle is sitting still in the backfield, then you might as well bring artillery, as it does the same job for cheaper.

rogersss wrote:please give advise on how to improve list and what upgrades tp give with my 35 points spare.

I'd dump creed+kell, the 2 lascannon HWSs, the armored crew compartments, the russ heavy stubbers, and the russ heavy bolter sponsons. This saves you 600 points.

I'd turn that into 4 plasma guns for your command squad and 3 meltaguns apiece for your PCSs (120 points), and I'd give a commissar with a power weapon and 2 sergeant power weapon upgrades and 2 sergeant meltabomb upgrades, and 2 flamers to both of your platoons (160 points). This leaves you with 320 points left. Add the 35 you didn't spend already, and you've got 355.

There are lots of things you can do with this, but I'd personally up the infantry+armor vibe you've got going on. One possible way would be to turn all 3 of your HS choices into heavy flamer demolishers (25 points), and add a third platoon with Al'rahem with 4 meltaguns, and an astropath for your CCS (200), and 2 infantry squads with power weapons and a commissar with a power weapon (155)

Getting charged by over 30 infantrymen and 3 demolishers only to have nearly 30 more infantrymen show up out of nowhere and start killing stuff sounds like a nice 1500 point infantry+armored list to me.

Anyone gunu tell me why i should drop creed and kell?

Why should you keep them in the list? Prehaps if you told us what your planning to use them for we may see them as slightly more viable. Personallly, they cost too much to use under 2000 pts and you don't have enough to make the best use of them at the low point level.

wizard12 wrote:Why should you keep them in the list? Prehaps if you told us what your planning to use them for we may see them as slightly more viable. Personallly, they cost too much to use under 2000 pts and you don't have enough to make the best use of them at the low point level.

^
this. Too many points on 2 guys for such a low point game level. if you're playing 2000+, you have a little more
extra points to play with. you're spending 140 for creed and his squad, before any upgrades(weapons or wargear).
i spend 145 for my CCS and i have 4 meltas and a Chimera.

In objective games i can use his tactical genius to ge an extra movement towards an objective, his frfsrf for lasgun spam with the 6 infantry squads, bring it down on the lascannon teams to take out vehicles early, get back in the fight if any guard is falling back and his unique order is good for assualting with big blob squads, and im taking more troops than usual so there probably going to be more spread out so creeds extended range will help there.

And i take kell to add a bit of combat power to the command squad and so that leadership tests for orders on the squads are 10 so there nearly always going to pass.

Well, the problem with that is that 10 guardsmen with lasguns, moving an extra 6" towards an objective or outflanking (This can be done waaaay better by Al'Rahem) is probably not going to be a problem (could blob to make that 30 guardsmen which might be cause for concern but because of a lack of commisar, a single dedicated shooting phase could see that blob running)

Then, remember kell only affects the CCS's Ld so the 'listen up maggots' rule is pretty much wasted on 2 lasguns and a twin-linked hotshot pistol (orders are done on the Ld of the unit that is reciving it not the Ld of the unit giving it)

So in short, kell isn't very useful, I wouldn't risk such a unit in close combat when all you have is 6 S3 attacks and 2 S3 power weapon attacks to throw against units which will mostly outnumber you and probably outpunch you in combat. Creed's job can be done much better by Al'Raherm who makes the whole platoon outflank instead of just one unt and old Al is better in combat and cheaper than Creed.

No the rule lets leadership for the squad recieving the order get taken on the officers leadership, and the officer is creed so the squads that are recieving orders take the the leadership of creed which is 10.

And i never liked alrahem hes too many points and all he does is let a platoon outflank, Also when you add up all the points for the command squad with an astropath, alrahem and his platoon command squad it comes to about the same amount of points as creed and kell and i just think creed and kell can do all the things alrahem can do and better.

rogersss wrote:And i never liked alrahem hes too many points and all he does is let a platoon outflank.

What were you intending on outflanking?

Al'rahem and a regular CCS are cheaper (like by half), and al'rahem lets you outflank way more stuff than creed. The real question is "does your overall strategy require the special character in order to stand a chance?"

In my case, I take al'rahem, and the answer is yes, as I have terrible mobility without him. In your case, I really don't see how he's necessary.

Na keep BIG C but have something from the fast or elite section.