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If Triarch Stalker comes as 2nd wave I'll wait a few more months along with a Battalion :3

Grats OP for 200 page xD

Ouze wrote:I think I'm most looking forward to the Triarch Stalker model. On the other hand, I'd be happy just to have all the plastic crap I've already bought painted by then.

Going to need to do a lot of painting myself. Since so far I only have done, from my original stuff, 12 Scarabs that still need basing and about 20 Warriors.

And personally excitedly looking forward to the Scythes of various shapes and flavo(u)rs. I hope they don't take forever with them. Though I don't mind a little wait so my wallet can recover.

I am looking forward to the walker and the Tomb Spyders. Wraiths and Tomb Blades less so, but if they're especially cool, I might pick some up. The flyers it depends on how cool the finished product looks, but I like the pics in the codex.

I agree with some other people that the pilots in the vehicles seem silly. I've been converting my Ghost Ark and Command Barge to have built-in quasi-pilots, rather than ordinary Warrior-type dudes as drivers and gunners. Probably would do a similar thing for the flyers, if they are like the pics in the codex.

Can you post pics? I would like to do the same, want to see what your method is.

chaos0xomega wrote:Can you post pics? I would like to do the same, want to see what your method is.

I agree with this sentiment. I had thought of doing this, but would love to see how you've done it. ^^

EDIT

Looking forward to the Wraiths. Hoping for plastic, but probably going to be finecast.

Would make the running of a Destroyer Lord somewhat more fun/deadly.

Medium of Death wrote:Looking forward to the Wraiths. Hoping for plastic, but probably going to be finecast.

I'm guessing, based on some rumors from quite awhile ago about plastic Tomb Spyders roughly the volume of a Rhino, that with the new resemblance of Wraiths and Tomb Spyders, we'll see a new dual Wraith/Tomb Spyder kit. Which considering my collection of both Wraiths and Tomb Spyders, I'm pretty bummed about.

Oh, for sure. I am working on a whole bunch of different conversions, and my P & M blog is here:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/369482.page

I have just gotten the new stuff, and haven't made pics yet, but in my next update I will definitely take a pic. Right now, I'm working with a Destroyer torso/spine/pelvis, and attaching that to various hoses and wires and such to the chassis of the Ghost Ark. probably will attach only one arm, to make it look less anthropomorphic and more machine-y. As for the Command Barge, I'm not sure how to go yet, but was thinking a Tomb Spyder-like controller/pilot thing, even less anthropomorphic. But one project at a time...

Cool beans. Consider your blog subscribed to!

I totally agree with your blog post about the conversion potential for a New 'cron army.

SALIVATING!

DAMN YOU MONTHLY PAY!

So, while overall I'm quite pleased with the new Codex, there are a few things I'm disappointed about.

Flayed Ones should have some sort of Hideous Visage ability. Even if it isn't very good, like the last incarnation. They just feel waaay too generic now.

I wish C'Tan Shards had 8S. Being unable to insta-kill things is surprising.

I miss Warscythes were more unique. They had to change from how they were, but again they're just so generic now. Reroll successful invuln saves or invuln saves are one worse or something. I miss the idea that the other races' force fields were so primitive that they posed only a minor inconvenience to the Necrons.
And if not something like that for the weapon, at least something like that for the C'Tan.

I miss the idea of the Soulless rule and the pariah gene. I liked how it tied in with the Culexis and such.
Speaking of which, shouldn't we have a little more anti-psyker stuff if the Old Ones and Eldar are our ancient enemies?

A little disappointed that the'big four' C'Tan aren't still at large in the fluff.
Speaking of the fluff, I don't like the idea of them trading with other races, though I don't mind the lords having personalities. I liked when they treated the others as pests infesting 'their' galaxy and treated them as such.

So what is everyone else disappointed about, if anything?

I was hoping for furious charge for flayed ones, I mean atleast until there first kill.

yakface wrote:Pure speculation here, but it seems likely to me that a 2nd wave for Necrons with the same rapidity as the Dark Eldar 2nd wave was released seems a bit more likely for this reason

Kroothawk wrote:

75hastings69 wrote:Couldn't see this on the thread (although I didn't go through every page!) early next year youll be getting a second wave of necrons - entries in the codex not covered by this release, 4 vehicles, a walker and 2 aircraft, also new tomb spiders IIRC.
Can't recall of the top of my head about the vehicles, the walker Artwork shows a large spider with a necRon driver and scorpion tail over the head blaster type thing.

Another confirmation by him (on Wraiths and Tomb Spyders):

75hastings69 wrote:I've already posted on the necron rumour thread that these items will be part of the second wave on necron models released early next year. The jetbike type necrons are also amongst the new kits.

Oh, also disappointed that there isn't much of anything to help with the getting so easily swept in combat thing. A way to make them stubborn or a bosspole-equivalent or something.

I guess, and I only skimmed the codex at the shop today, but it looks like they'll be pretty good at blasting the fething gak out of anything before it gets close enough for that to be a problem, and even then, their (admittedly pricey) CC specialists are... pretty damn good.

My biggest issue is why give crypteks or lords ever living when the third paragraph states "If the model had joined a unit when it was removed as a casualty, and the roll was passed, it MUST be returned to play, with a single wound, in coherency with that unit as explained in reanimation protocols."

So say I have a unit of 10 immortals, toss a lord with a resorb in there, they get engaged in CC, loose 4 models , then fail their leadership save and fall back then get swept - that lord doesnt even get to roll his reanimation protocols... yet he if was wandering around on his own like a dolt he would... what sense does that make? When is a cryptek or a lord EVER going to be wandering around on their own?

Cryage wrote:My biggest issue is why give crypteks or lords ever living when the third paragraph states "If the model had joined a unit when it was removed as a casualty, and the roll was passed, it MUST be returned to play, with a single wound, in coherency with that unit as explained in reanimation protocols."

So say I have a unit of 10 immortals, toss a lord with a resorb in there, they get engaged in CC, loose 4 models , then fail their leadership save and fall back then get swept - that lord doesnt even get to roll his reanimation protocols... yet he if was wandering around on his own like a dolt he would... what sense does that make? When is a cryptek or a lord EVER going to be wandering around on their own?

Perhaps some sort of oddity with if the rest of the unit is killed, and then later the lord/'tek is killed, he would be able to get back up.

Cryage wrote:My biggest issue is why give crypteks or lords ever living when the third paragraph states "If the model had joined a unit when it was removed as a casualty, and the roll was passed, it MUST be returned to play, with a single wound, in coherency with that unit as explained in reanimation protocols."

So say I have a unit of 10 immortals, toss a lord with a resorb in there, they get engaged in CC, loose 4 models , then fail their leadership save and fall back then get swept - that lord doesnt even get to roll his reanimation protocols... yet he if was wandering around on his own like a dolt he would... what sense does that make? When is a cryptek or a lord EVER going to be wandering around on their own?

This is actually being discussed in the YMDC forum right now.

The White Dwarf battle report, played by the codex author (Mat Ward) clearly has Imotekh get to attempt his Reanimation Protocol roll when he was killed while being attached to a Lychguard unit. The WD even explains that the whole point of 'Ever-Living' is to allow models with it to get to use their Reanimation Protocols even if their unit is wiped out with them.

Given that, it seems highly likely that the wording in the codex that seems to indicate that a character with 'Ever-Living' which is part of a unit that is destroyed does not get to use his Reanimation Protocols is simply a case of poor choice of wording.

yakface wrote:

Cryage wrote:My biggest issue is why give crypteks or lords ever living when the third paragraph states "If the model had joined a unit when it was removed as a casualty, and the roll was passed, it MUST be returned to play, with a single wound, in coherency with that unit as explained in reanimation protocols."

So say I have a unit of 10 immortals, toss a lord with a resorb in there, they get engaged in CC, loose 4 models , then fail their leadership save and fall back then get swept - that lord doesnt even get to roll his reanimation protocols... yet he if was wandering around on his own like a dolt he would... what sense does that make? When is a cryptek or a lord EVER going to be wandering around on their own?

This is actually being discussed in the YMDC forum right now.

The White Dwarf battle report, played by the codex author (Mat Ward) clearly has Imotekh get to attempt his Reanimation Protocol roll when he was killed while being attached to a Lychguard unit. The WD even explains that the whole point of 'Ever-Living' is to allow models with it to get to use their Reanimation Protocols even if their unit is wiped out with them.

Given that, it seems highly likely that the wording in the codex that seems to indicate that a character with 'Ever-Living' which is part of a unit that is destroyed does not get to use his Reanimation Protocols is simply a case of poor choice of wording.

That was my argument I said to my friend about my lord who get swept, I brought up the WD and he allowed me to make it since really, it's 1 unit with a staff of light so it wasn't much of a threat.

Now the question

1 lord & 1 cryptek join a squad of 10 immortals, they all get swept, and lets say WD is right, that's how ever living is suppose to work - Do both the cryptek and the lord get the 4+ res orb since they were part of the same unit before death?

No, because Ever-Living doesn't specifically allow you to get up after Sweeping Advance, while Sweeping Advance specifically states that special rules won't save you. Sweeping Advance is more specific, so you don't get to use Ever-Living.

Chrysis wrote:No, because Ever-Living doesn't specifically allow you to get up after Sweeping Advance, while Sweeping Advance specifically states that special rules won't save you. Sweeping Advance is more specific, so you don't get to use Ever-Living.

Ever-Living/RP doesn't save you, per se. It brings you back.

Sweeping Advance:
"The destroyed unit is removed immediately. Unless otherwise specified, no save or other special rule can rescue the unit at this stage; for them the battle is over."

Not much wriggle room there. Ever-living can't bring you back because it doesn't say it overrules Sweeping Advance.

Chrysis wrote:Sweeping Advance:
"The destroyed unit is removed immediately. Unless otherwise specified, no save or other special rule can rescue the unit at this stage; for them the battle is over."

Not much wriggle room there. Ever-living can't bring you back because it doesn't say it overrules Sweeping Advance.

Yep, I concur. The Sweeping Advance rules specify that no special rule can allow you to survive a sweeping advance, so a special rule would have to specifically mention that it applies to sweeping advances for the rule to allow a model to survive a sweeping advance.

But under Reanimation Protocols it says Characters do not count as part of the unit for the purposes of Reanimation Protocols. So as he does not count as part of the unit, he would get to roll? Yes, No?

yakface wrote:The White Dwarf battle report, played by the codex author (Mat Ward) clearly has Imotekh get to attempt his Reanimation Protocol roll when he was killed while being attached to a Lychguard unit. The WD even explains that the whole point of 'Ever-Living' is to allow models with it to get to use their Reanimation Protocols even if their unit is wiped out with them

Hah, like that matters! Do you remember that KFF debacle (pre-FAQ), where it was proven that Phill Kelly played it a certain way, and it was still shut down? What would he know about the rules in Codex: Orks after all?

Maybe we can try and use that as precedent for this. If a rule is unclear, but there is clear evidence that the book's author plays it a certain way, maybe we can take that as gospel.

Ouze wrote:

yakface wrote:The White Dwarf battle report, played by the codex author (Mat Ward) clearly has Imotekh get to attempt his Reanimation Protocol roll when he was killed while being attached to a Lychguard unit. The WD even explains that the whole point of 'Ever-Living' is to allow models with it to get to use their Reanimation Protocols even if their unit is wiped out with them

Hah, like that matters! Do you remember that KFF debacle (pre-FAQ), where it was proven that Phill Kelly played it a certain way, and it was still shut down? What would he know about the rules in Codex: Orks after all?

Maybe we can try and use that as precedent for this. If a rule is unclear, but there is clear evidence that the book's author plays it a certain way, maybe we can take that as gospel.

I do remember that. In the Battle Report Phil Kelly played that the KFF provided vehicles with a 4+ obscured save (and all the 5th edition 'this is what is new' crap they put out also said that KFF gave vehicles a 4+ obscured save) and that's exactly how they went ahead and FAQ'd it.

Now, to simply assume that because they played that way in a Battle Report means that's the way it is is obviously not the case. There have been many instances in the past where they've gotten rules wrong...that's just human nature.

However, in this case we ARE dealing with the codex's author and its not like he just 'did it', the article actually stops to explain what Ever-Living is and what it does, and it specifically says that it allows models with the ability to use their Reanimation Protocols when the rest of their unit is wiped out.

So given the context of that, it makes the possibility of GW FAQing the issue along those lines pretty strong...they could of course change their minds (which is their prerogative), but it is a pretty safe bet, IMHO, about as safe a bet as you can get with GW.

Holy crap, wraiths are totally the new hotness for this army. I just had 4 wraiths in a game last night take out an entire black templar bike squad, Dreadnought, Land raider, assisted lychguard with a tac squad and assisted lychguard with a command squad. And only lost 2 wraiths and one with one wound by the end of the game. The dread and LR were untouched previous to the wraiths assaulting them (technically the dread assaulted the wraiths but I got super lucky on my rolls and exploded it before it could fight back).

Kevin949 wrote:Holy crap, wraiths are totally the new hotness for this army.

Agreed. Played a test game the other day and they more than pulled their weight.
Glad I got my six years ago.

Sounds like you got pretty lucky against the LR (full squad of Wraiths have ~20% chance to Wreck/Destroy a LR *moving at Combat speed*), but that's still within reason. Pretty awesome that they can do that. Now imagine what they could do after Scarabs take a few AV off here and there...

Dear Santa,

For Christmas this year stick your socks and slippers where the sun don't shine, bring me lots of Wraiths and Scarabs.

Yours,

Phill.

P.S.: I've been really good this year so you better deliver this time!

yakface wrote:

Chrysis wrote:Sweeping Advance:
"The destroyed unit is removed immediately. Unless otherwise specified, no save or other special rule can rescue the unit at this stage; for them the battle is over."

Not much wriggle room there. Ever-living can't bring you back because it doesn't say it overrules Sweeping Advance.

Yep, I concur. The Sweeping Advance rules specify that no special rule can allow you to survive a sweeping advance, so a special rule would have to specifically mention that it applies to sweeping advances for the rule to allow a model to survive a sweeping advance.

I think that would be the case if it wasn't a counter system. Yes the model is killed and removed because of the sweeping advance, however an everliving counter is placed following the rules of ever living. The model it self is not surviving or making any kind of save. Theres no rule under sweeping advance that disallows counters to be placed.

just bought the codex....

well well well,

i loved my old necrons and to me GW ripped them apart by deleting the Pariah....i always took 10 of these crazy guys into a fight and now they should be all gone - cant believe...

think i will try to re-do them and use them as these triarchat guys....

besides the critics on using vehicles i still love this command flyer - but hate the arks - does not fit i think.

and worst of all - they are not doing a new race....i think that is what could be a real boost again - i would be happy to see the squats redone, but something entirely new would be even better.