Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

DarknessEternal wrote:

Aerethan wrote:It takes all of 30 seconds to slap some glue and ANY type of sand or flock on a base to make it look worlds better. Anyone can do it with fine results.

And it will look worse than if you had left it plain.

That's why you spend another 60 seconds to drybrush it two colors and it looks grand!

The problem I see is that when you base a mini and its on a table with a different color or terrain it looks absolutely terrible.

I have friends who don't base models simply because of that fact. Sure, basing a character is a good thing, but its the MODEL that counts not just the base.

Doctadeth wrote:The problem I see is that when you base a mini and its on a table with a different color or terrain it looks absolutely terrible.

I don't find this at all. But then I base mine so they'll be at home on most tables - dark brown, black trims and tufts of scorched grass looks good on green flocked tables, dirt with sparse grass tables, and even city tables. The only tables they look out of place on are desert and ice tables, and those are very rare where I play.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Doctadeth wrote:I have friends who don't base models simply because of that fact. Sure, basing a character is a good thing, but its the MODEL that counts not just the base.

I base simply because it finishes the model. If it's not based, to me, it simply looks unfinished. Though i've seen overdone basing, which has overpowered the model itself. The basing should just be there to make the model itself pop more.

Doctadeth wrote:The problem I see is that when you base a mini and its on a table with a different color or terrain it looks absolutely terrible.

I have friends who don't base models simply because of that fact. Sure, basing a character is a good thing, but its the MODEL that counts not just the base.

So it's better to have models that don't match ANY board than it is to have ones that only match certain boards? Plain bases don't match anything unless you are playing on asphalt.

To be honest, I'd rather have a plain base that looked semi-okay than one that was modelled awesomely on woodland, but then placed on a citifight map. Just I find things like that really silly.

Personally, models don't seem finished to me until they've been fully painted and based with more than just gravel quickly glued to the base. Of course, I'll happily play against bare plastic as soon as a fully painted masterpiece. The hobby =/= the game.

A display piece obviously won't be complete without all of the elements that make it a good display piece complete, and naturally, that's the basing. An unbased model shouldn't be winning any painting competitions. Personally, I really like having heavy layering on my bases, not just a single layer of flocking, but multiple, thick layers of dirt, rocks, grass, shrubbery, fallen leaves and snow are things that I love just filling my bases with. That, or war-torn and destroyed cities with mud and grime everywhere. It really adds a lot of context and personality to a model, and helps to make them really look finished.

That said, I'm also guilty (notorious) of fielding largely unpainted seas of grey, and that's even without basing. As much as I love extravagancy, it really takes a lot of time and effort, it's not something someone can do overnight. I have no problem playing with or against unpainted or unbased models. Not everyone has time to paint, and not everyone enjoys the hobby aspect as I do.

Personally, I'm just fine with painting the bases, I don't play in tournaments and probably never will however I can see why some people do want other players to do this.

Brother SRM wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:

Aerethan wrote:It takes all of 30 seconds to slap some glue and ANY type of sand or flock on a base to make it look worlds better. Anyone can do it with fine results.

And it will look worse than if you had left it plain.

That's why you spend another 60 seconds to drybrush it two colors and it looks grand!

No, it'll still look like someone puked on your bases and you just painted over it. You'll never convince me this looks better.

For me I think a based model looks great, but it ruins my suspension of disbelief. I can ignore a black base. but if it's designed to gain my attention... well it usually does, and it can be jarring. Ice based models in a desert board, woodlands bases on a city one, I'd personally prefer to ignore the bases.
For the OP, I'm one of the ones who isn't allowed to play at GW because of my bases. I refuse to base them (I even asked if basing meant bases on, or bases flocked and stuff. He meant flocked) and even explained why. I've never played a game there, and almost got out of the hobby due to it. City store in Sydney for reference. I couldn't find a game, so I didn't spend anything. You know what's _really_ funny? If he'd have let me play I wouldn't have looked elsewhere for cheaper models, and would have bought my stuff there. Instead I'm on the 'not buying anything from gw again' list.

You know Col, no offense, but every time I see a post from someone in Australia, I get freaked out about the place. It just seems more and more depressing each time. Is it really so terrible, or am I just only hearing bad stories?

And, thank you, I will avoid the GW in Sydney, if it ever comes up.

I don't base mine, not yet though. The day im finished with my ork army i'll base both armies.

It has good sides and bad sides, but I must admit... parts of it really make me lose faith in humanity. This is home now, but I miss the canadian donkey-caves... they weren't as bad. Plus I could just go for a walk in the woods. Here... I go for a walk in the bush after a 2 hour drive. it's just not the same.
The GW in Parramatta (a bit further away from the sydney one) as actually really good. They would have let me play with unpainted, unbased models but by that point I'd pretty much given up on GW and was just in there to see some of the stuff close up.

Jimsolo wrote:You know Col, no offense, but every time I see a post from someone in Australia, I get freaked out about the place. It just seems more and more depressing each time. Is it really so terrible, or am I just only hearing bad stories?

And, thank you, I will avoid the GW in Sydney, if it ever comes up.

It used to be a nice place. Then GW took away our best and brightest. And replaced them with mindless drones.
I used to be a weekly attendee of the place.
Even when I moved 170km away from it.

Then something about the place changed, and I began to spend more and more time away from the place.
Parramatta has a nice Bunker, and a cool crowd - it's just too far to travel for a game (3 hours each way).

For people who find the "arctic base/desert board" problem really jarring, why not have transparent bases? I'm sure someone was making them, and its not hard to get hold of acrylic sheets and cut them to size if they aren't.

DarknessEternal wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:

Aerethan wrote:It takes all of 30 seconds to slap some glue and ANY type of sand or flock on a base to make it look worlds better. Anyone can do it with fine results.

And it will look worse than if you had left it plain.

That's why you spend another 60 seconds to drybrush it two colors and it looks grand!

No, it'll still look like someone puked on your bases and you just painted over it. You'll never convince me this looks better.

Wow, hyperbolic much?
It won't look like someone "puked on your bases," it will look like this:


Which looks fething fine. It's also a great way to theme your army. If you want a winter war looking army but they're all on black bases, they'll look ridiculous. Put them on well done tundra or snow bases and they'll look fantastic. This can be done just by painting gravel blue and drybrushing it white. I'd rather have an army that looks right on one kind of table (in the case of my Marine, urban) than an army that looks awful on every single table.

Brother SRM wrote: I'd rather have an army that looks right on one kind of table (in the case of my Marine, urban) than an army that looks awful on every single table.

Fine, but you're trying to force your aesthetic sense on everyone else. Some people (like me) think that looks worse than a base which is simply a uniform color.

DarknessEternal wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:

Aerethan wrote:It takes all of 30 seconds to slap some glue and ANY type of sand or flock on a base to make it look worlds better. Anyone can do it with fine results.

And it will look worse than if you had left it plain.

That's why you spend another 60 seconds to drybrush it two colors and it looks grand!

No, it'll still look like someone puked on your bases and you just painted over it. You'll never convince me this looks better.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder I guess. So while it would be incorrect to say you're wrong, you are so far off the end of the bell-curve on this one that it is completely baffling.

Kaldor wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:No, it'll still look like someone puked on your bases and you just painted over it. You'll never convince me this looks better.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder I guess. So while it would be incorrect to say you're wrong, you are so far off the end of the bell-curve on this one that it is completely baffling.

Nicely said. Just what I would have liked to say, but more elequent and polite than I would have managed!

ArbeitsSchu wrote:For people who find the "arctic base/desert board" problem really jarring, why not have transparent bases? I'm sure someone was making them, and its not hard to get hold of acrylic sheets and cut them to size if they aren't.

It's a nice idea and has been raised previously and tried. It has a couple of issues. One is that a flat base cut from acrylic is slippery on the bottom, and not being concave on the bottom won't stand nearly as well on uneven terrain. The other is that the surface picks up lots of scratches, becoming cloudy and no longer truly transparent.

DarknessEternal wrote:

Brother SRM wrote: I'd rather have an army that looks right on one kind of table (in the case of my Marine, urban) than an army that looks awful on every single table.

Fine, but you're trying to force your aesthetic sense on everyone else. Some people (like me) think that looks worse than a base which is simply a uniform color.

I'm curious, how do you handle slotta bases and make them not look horrible without adding some flock to it?

The GW store I played at as a kid didn't allow people to play without proper basing.

I miss those days, it's so tacky when you're playing on a grass mat and some guy only has black bases.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Mannahnin wrote:

ArbeitsSchu wrote:For people who find the "arctic base/desert board" problem really jarring, why not have transparent bases? I'm sure someone was making them, and its not hard to get hold of acrylic sheets and cut them to size if they aren't.

It's a nice idea and has been raised previously and tried. It has a couple of issues. One is that a flat base cut from acrylic is slippery on the bottom, and not being concave on the bottom won't stand nearly as well on uneven terrain. The other is that the surface picks up lots of scratches, becoming cloudy and no longer truly transparent.

I wonder if glass would work, it's quite a bit tougher than acrylics.

They'd only be extremely expensive comparatively.

Emerett wrote:The GW store I played at as a kid didn't allow people to play without proper basing.

I miss those days, it's so tacky when you're playing on a grass mat and some guy only has black bases.

Where is the Games Workshop you played in as a child, out of curiosity?

I find basing in general to be a luxury.

I base mine, but ever with Slotted bases, I cut off the slot, masking tape the base, pin, add sand, glue to the base. Voila!

Would I expect anyone else to base? No. Expecting as much (when painting alone is time consuming enough) borders on snobbery to me. What seems a no-brainer and easy to you may in fact be mind numbingly difficult for someone else.

The hobby is a luxury. Basing to a decent standard is about the easiest task in it. Certainly easier than cleaning and assembling models.

See, I find the cleaning and assembling to be the easiest and most intuitive part of the job. It's one of those things where "easy" is relative, I think.

oh good lord... BASE YOUR MODELS.

... or are we determined to make an argument over ever single step of the hobby?

next, we will be arguing over whether or not we need to assembled our models, and some people will claim their individuality and liberty are compromised by "elitists" who "force" them to build their models.

Just do it... base your models. Find something you like and do it... or don't I guess, but certainly don't try to claim that Not Basing Your Models is based on some aesthetic or moral position. Its not.

I also do not buy that its "difficult"... if you've managed to paint your model, you can base it. The counter argument sounds like a child refusing to get dressed for school because its "too hard".

Seriously folks... if this is a controversial issue for you, you are in the wrong hobby.

Battle Ready Studios wrote:oh good lord... BASE YOUR MODELS.

... or are we determined to make an argument over ever single step of the hobby?

next, we will be arguing over whether or not we need to assembled our models, and some people will claim their individuality and liberty are compromised by "elitists" who "force" them to build their models.

Just do it... base your models. Find something you like and do it... or don't I guess, but certainly don't try to claim that Not Basing Your Models is based on some aesthetic or moral position. Its not.

I also do not buy that its "difficult"... if you've managed to paint your model, you can base it. The counter argument sounds like a child refusing to get dressed for school because its "too hard".

Seriously folks... if this is a controversial issue for you, you are in the wrong hobby.

Oddly enough, I often play people who have not assembled their models (not based on anything as dramatic as their individuality, strictly because they haven't had the time to magnetize arms/weapons).

Again, seeing as you are a Studio level painter/assembler/baser, this seems like a bare minimum step to you. Yet others have stated their reasons for not basing (i.e. aesthetics on various boards, taking away from the model, etc). Because it doesn't fit with your Aesthetics doesn't make it not an aesthetic choice. I doubt Michelangelo and Dali would have agree on every step on the painting process.

I see no controversy here, only anecdotes and opinions. Conferring the title of 'children' on people who choose not to base and don't considered part of a finished model is demeaning and unnecessary.

Battle Ready Studios wrote:oh good lord... BASE YOUR MODELS.

... or are we determined to make an argument over ever single step of the hobby?

next, we will be arguing over whether or not we need to assembled our models, and some people will claim their individuality and liberty are compromised by "elitists" who "force" them to build their models.

... if this is a controversial issue for you, you are in the wrong hobby.

Well said. It's a pretty slippery slope that happens all to frequently online where there are those who will argue away any widely accepted hobby standard as being an unfair imposition on their personal choice and asthetic sense.

gunslingerpro wrote:[Oddly enough, I often play people who have not assembled their models (not based on anything as dramatic as their individuality, strictly because they haven't had the time to magnetize arms/weapons).
.

So they are playing with just unpainted legs and torsos on unpainted bases? Give me a break. Anyone puts that down on a table and expects it to be accepted as normal or a "pesonal choice" not only is missing the point, they never had it to begin with.

Not basing may be an asthetic choice, but that doesn't mean it's stil not unfinished.

It's an asthetic choice where a person prefers an unfinished model.

... Assuming they've had time to finish t before the game came up...

For some, they may not get much time.Also, Armies are always a work in progress... people always like to add something new to their army, because that is the fun of the hobby in question.

I have no models based. Because I am more worried about finishing the painting of them first....