Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I read the librarian and his psychic powers but to me he seems like a useless HQ unit while some people I talked to at the keep really loved having him so I was wondering what is the usefulness of a librarian?

He's cheap and he says FU to a lot of armies. Pyschic defense is huge right now. Being able to shut powers can really make a difference in a lot of matchups. Also, Null Zone is solid for competitive play simply because it makes it possible to kill things with good invulnerable saves (TH/SS Termies, Zoeys, Demon Princes, etc). It also has the added benefit of making Demons cry.

Basically, the Libby is a cheap force multiplier. He can't kill things like a Captain and doesn't change your whole army like an SC, but he still is very solid for his points.

Other then characters hes the best HQ for marines.
Null zone and vortex of doom on a terminator librarian is a huge force to be reckoned with.

If he isnt wearing pink terminator armor though he isnt worth having.

I have had very good luck with my terminator librarian using nullzone and either machine curse or avenger. The only thing mine is susceptible to is lascannons. And that is not the fault of the libby as a unit, its just that mine has the worst luck with that one weapon.

He is a good support HQ and useful for anti-psyker work. It is also good to have a second HQ because, in some tournaments at my FLGS, you get bonus points for taking out all an opponents HQs.

If you can afford it, take the librarian, give him termie armor and a storm shield and stick him in a land raider. Epistolary is also great if you can afford it and plan on really working your librarian.

Even if you take a bog standard libby and put him with a unit, he is worth the 100pts for the nullzone and psychic hood.

Cheers

If you check the battle reports in the BR section of Dakka and look at characters playing librarian HQs, you'll find null zone saving the day over and over again. Daemon armies, terminators (both assault and regular) and seer councils really hate it.

I use the 100 point basic librarian with null zone and another power (it doesn't really matter which one) in a razorback with a squad. With only I4 and Str4 you really can't expect him to be effective in HtH. He's kind of like a vet sergeant (with power weapon) who can be picked out, so when he fights it's usually suicide. But most games he doesn't even get out of the transport anyway, just rides around inside it casting null zone and using the psychic hood.

I already have 2 HQ's Pedro Kantor (The Crimson Fist guy) and a Chaplain with terminator armor who I run around with my assault terminators. I wouldn't get rid of Pedro and the Chaplain with the termies has really been rocking, rerolling hits and wounds with lightning claws, would the librarian really be worth swapping out my Chaplain?

Librarians are awesome. I was playing Dark Angels in a 2k tournie at the local FLGS. It was just after the new Nid codex. In 3 games he killed 2 Trygons in CC . . . Gotta love force weapons =]

Since then he has gone on to great success, felling multi-wound characters left right and centre. Here is someone who just can't wait for the Librarian Dreadnought =D

Oshova

He defends against the usage of some psychic powers.
He adds psychic powers to the army, lots of utility powers.
He adds 'some' combat punch before psychics are taken into account.

He's not as flashy as other characters, but he does what he does well enough.

And seriously, Null Zone says "feth you" to Codex Daemons and even the Seer Council.

So yea, he is a utility character bringing in a Swiss Army Knife character that has lots of choices with powers before a game.

Well, my vanilla SM army is usually led by a Librarian, even in RTTs.
I outfit him with terminator armor and storm shield, nullzone and whatnot.
He usually leads a unit of Assault Termies and this guy never disappointed me.

Hes dirt cheap. Gornall runs one with nullzone and avenger, and the basic load out. hes just there to take up an hq slot and add extra punch to the army when needed.

[edit: never mind, though it was a double post, but then it wasn't and don't feel like re-writing my post, so just move along, nothing to see here]

Libriarian is a necessary component of every competitive vanilla marine list. Librarian gives you Null Zone which is amazing against Thunderhammer Stormshield terminators, Zoanthropes, Daemons and anything else with good invulnerable saves. Librarian gives you a psychic hood for psychic defense against nastiness like Lash, Warp Blast, Catalyst, fortune, doom, Null Zone. Also don't estimate the force weapon. 2nd Power is really debatable but Avenger kills other marines pretty well if it gets past their hood.

I still reckon that Rune Priests are better. It's automatically done on a 4+, in my book that's better than rolling off and adding LD. Also think apocalypse here, Vanilla SM has a limited range. SW it covers THE ENTIRE BOARD!!! It totally screws over the opponent =D

Furthermore, Living Lightning in a Rhino . . . possibly the best tactic for your Rune Priest. He's adding D6 S7 AP5 shots to your Rhino . . . =O . . . And when the tank gets destroyed, him and his squad of wolves get out and munch whatever's closest. MMMMM! That's some tasty ownage right there =]

Oshova

Plus, when the Orks see him coming they say "Shet! its Sparky Sparky Boom Man!!!"

TheBlackVanguard wrote:I already have 2 HQ's Pedro Kantor (The Crimson Fist guy) and a Chaplain with terminator armor who I run around with my assault terminators. I wouldn't get rid of Pedro and the Chaplain with the termies has really been rocking, rerolling hits and wounds with lightning claws, would the librarian really be worth swapping out my Chaplain?

Well, if you have a combo like that already then idk, You probably have sternguard in your list, but a librarian in that land raider will force opponents to re-roll the invulnerable saves they take against those LC terminators with his null-zone power.

Also, two words, Psychic, Hood. In the era of Lash, Jaws, Catylist and Sword of Sanguinious, you need something to shut down those crazy psy powers, and the libby is LD 10, so if anyone can stop those powers with a LD dice off it's him.

I mean, the chaplain is another support HQ, but his supporting role is pure CC, the libby can help you out in the other phases of the game.

What do ya'll think of Force Dome? Especially with Sternguard, I'd think it's a nice bonus to have.

Cryonicleech wrote:What do ya'll think of Force Dome? Especially with Sternguard, I'd think it's a nice bonus to have.

It's not bad, but it's only a 5+, I'd think Gate would be cooler for Sternguard so they can jump around the board.

starbomber109 wrote:
It's not bad, but it's only a 5+, I'd think Gate would be cooler for Sternguard so they can jump around the board.

Do be careful with gate. It is really great for getting a more static element where it needs to be to do damage. Unfortunately it clumps your squad up nice and tight and is begging for a large blast to say hello. If its just a unit with a 3+ save an accurate battle cannon might eat the whole squad.

Cheers
~Volkan

Volkan wrote:

starbomber109 wrote:
It's not bad, but it's only a 5+, I'd think Gate would be cooler for Sternguard so they can jump around the board.

Do be careful with gate. It is really great for getting a more static element where it needs to be to do damage. Unfortunately it clumps your squad up nice and tight and is begging for a large blast to say hello. If its just a unit with a 3+ save an accurate battle cannon might eat the whole squad.

Cheers
~Volkan

Also you might lose a squad member.

But that is only 1/36 chance ~3% so I wouldn't be worried about that. What I would be worried about is the fact that they scatter and could be destroyed by bad scattering.

1/36, are you high?

there are 36 possible outcomes when rolling 2 dice; if any doubles are rolled (6 possible outcomes) the you lose a member that makes it a 6/36 chance or simplified down a 1/6 chance to lose a member of any squad gating with a librarian.

Then as you said they can be lost do to a bad scatter as well.

I put a Termie libby w/ no extra weapon into my termie squad w/ smite & machine curse (for armored IG comp.)/vortex o' doom/null zone for enemies w/ lotsa invuln.s. Basically, Smite is a storm bolter that is AP 2 so it is great for a reg. termie squad, and Null zone or any of the other ones are great for whatever particular enemy you are facing. He's my favorite HQ choice.

The only problem with librarians is they don't have Invuln saves and it is expensive to get one, but they are still rock solid.

a terminator Librarian with a storm shield is VERY difficult to kill, meaning he can either run alone or hid in assault terminators.

a particularly nasty power with this setup is the quickining. inititive 10 and fleet makes him effective at hunting charactors or killing MEQs before they strike and almost being garunteed to survive any counter strikes due to 2+ and 3++ saves.

machine curse is an ok power, but the other powers are so much better. Smite and avenger are good allrounders

I myself just started building a SM army, and I am lucky enough to own a copy of Space Hulk, and therefore that beautiful Librarian model in terminator armor.

What would be the best powers to run him with tagging along side an assault terminator unit chilling inside a LR? I've gathered that Null Zone is a smart idea.

Null Zone and Vortex of Doom appears to be the "standard" Terminator Librarian loadout.

Sacred Chao wrote:
I myself just started building a SM army, and I am lucky enough to own a copy of Space Hulk, and therefore that beautiful Librarian model in terminator armor.

What would be the best powers to run him with tagging along side an assault terminator unit chilling inside a LR?

I'd recommend null zone as it will help the Terminators do their job against anything with an invulnerable save.
The 2nd power can really be anything that could offer utility. Avenger could be pretty useful, machine curse has situational uses. Might or quickening could even be good. Also depends on if you are planning to make him an Epistolary.
Cheers
~Volkan

Volkan wrote:

Sacred Chao wrote:
I myself just started building a SM army, and I am lucky enough to own a copy of Space Hulk, and therefore that beautiful Librarian model in terminator armor.

What would be the best powers to run him with tagging along side an assault terminator unit chilling inside a LR?

I'd recommend null zone as it will help the Terminators do their job against anything with an invulnerable save.
The 2nd power can really be anything that could offer utility. Avenger could be pretty useful, machine curse has situational uses. Might or quickening could even be good. Also depends on if you are planning to make him an Epistolary.
Cheers
~Volkan

To Epistolary or not epistolary? That's the question.

I figure in games of 1000 points and up I would epistolary.

if you are going with an Epistolary then I'd choose between avenger if you wanted something to thin out a few models before charging (could deny you a charge as well so ymmv) or quickening/might depending on what you are looking for.
If you don't feel you need null zone you can use either of the assault oriented powers in conjunction with the force weapon to force Instant Death on a multi-wound model.
Conversely you can also use Null Zone and then use either might or quickening to augment the killing power of the Libby if the enemy models have only a single wound each (might would probably be more useful in this situation.)

Cheers
~Volkan

I've always wanted to try a Epistolary Librarian with the Quickening and Might of the Ancients, and use it to go MC hunting.

unbeliever87 wrote:I've always wanted to try a Epistolary Librarian with the Quickening and Might of the Ancients, and use it to go MC hunting.

The problem with that is, if you use both Quickening and Might in the same turn, you can't also use the force weapon.