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Obviously they missed out on the 7.5 buffs, but even before that I remember seeing a lot of disappointment regarding their new book.

I'm just curious as to what the problems are with the BA codex?

 vipoid wrote:
Obviously they missed out on the 7.5 buffs, but even before that I remember seeing a lot of disappointment regarding their new book.

I'm just curious as to what the problems are with the BA codex?

Go look at all the units that space marines lists use in their power lists. BA basically get none of those units. Only grav bikers in the FA slot. That summarizes the problem without going into grim detail.

It says a lot that the #1 use for BA is to take the Flesh Tearer detachment and buy 6 drop pods and fill them with non-BA units.

 vipoid wrote:
Obviously they missed out on the 7.5 buffs, but even before that I remember seeing a lot of disappointment regarding their new book.

I'm just curious as to what the problems are with the BA codex?

To my eyes, they were an army that was given way too much in the 5E book, made an army that was able to do everything better than most (at least when it came out on 5E), psyker spam, jump pack spam, deep strike spam, heavy tank spam, walker spam, AV13 spam, etc, and then the 7E book came out and toned that way down, just a couple months before GW then went back and reversed course super hard with the 7.5E books and massively up-gunned the core SM book, leaving the BA book rather out in the cold by comparison, suffering the fate that DA's did during 5E and 6E.

 Vaktathi wrote:

 vipoid wrote:
Obviously they missed out on the 7.5 buffs, but even before that I remember seeing a lot of disappointment regarding their new book.

I'm just curious as to what the problems are with the BA codex?

To my eyes, they were an army that was given way too much in the 5E book, made an army that was able to do everything better than most (at least when it came out on 5E), psyker spam, jump pack spam, deep strike spam, heavy tank spam, walker spam, AV13 spam, etc, and then the 7E book came out and toned that way down, just a couple months before GW then went back and reversed course super hard with the 7.5E books and massively up-gunned the core SM book, leaving the BA book rather out in the cold by comparison, suffering the fate that DA's did during 5E and 6E.

SW, IG, Necrons, and GK were still all better in 5th.

And the 7th ed BA codex wouldn't have even been good in 6th ed.

Martel732 wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:

 vipoid wrote:
Obviously they missed out on the 7.5 buffs, but even before that I remember seeing a lot of disappointment regarding their new book.

I'm just curious as to what the problems are with the BA codex?

To my eyes, they were an army that was given way too much in the 5E book, made an army that was able to do everything better than most (at least when it came out on 5E), psyker spam, jump pack spam, deep strike spam, heavy tank spam, walker spam, AV13 spam, etc, and then the 7E book came out and toned that way down, just a couple months before GW then went back and reversed course super hard with the 7.5E books and massively up-gunned the core SM book, leaving the BA book rather out in the cold by comparison, suffering the fate that DA's did during 5E and 6E.

SW, IG, Necrons, and GK were still all better in 5th.

Hrm, I'd say they were all about equal depending on build, BA's did just fine for themselves in 5E. Necrons were only there for what, 7 months of 5E? They only got better in 6th.

And the 7th ed BA codex wouldn't have even been good in 6th ed.

It's one of those codex generation things. I'd take the BA book over the early 2013 books like CSM's and DA's, but against the other 2013 books they feel a bit less scary, though against the late 6E armies like IG, and the other early 7E armies, it's pretty even. They do very much have the problem of these 2014 books in that they just simply fall flat against the 2015 books. GW seems to shift design philosophy about every year or so at this point.

Maybe the best players were using IG in my area, but I was regularly shot off the table against IG.

Martel732 wrote:
Maybe the best players were using IG in my area, but I was regularly shot off the table against IG.

I guess it would depend on what you were running (same with IG), and if the IG got first turn Turn 1 mattered a lot for IG, as it still does. Reserve-denial deep striking or heavy armor spam BA armies would generally work rather well.

 Vaktathi wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
Maybe the best players were using IG in my area, but I was regularly shot off the table against IG.

I guess it would depend on what you were running (same with IG), and if the IG got first turn

Lots of stun locked razorbacks

Sad thing is BA were an army I was considering next, but everything they can do I can do with my Ultramarines. Which is a real shame because I love the boys in red.

War Kitten wrote:
Sad thing is BA were an army I was considering next, but everything they can do I can do with my Ultramarines. Which is a real shame because I love the boys in red.

Yeah, it's a real kick in the nether regions. There is literally no reason to use BA over UM.

I mean, they have Death Company, Dante, Priests, and Melta Guns for their Assault Marines. That's about all they got that's nice, though.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I mean, they have Death Company, Dante, Priests, and Melta Guns for their Assault Marines. That's about all they got that's nice, though.

Curiously, all of which lose miserably to grav cents.

Martel... have you thought about buying the marine codex and running Angels as vanilla marines? Since blood angels are so terrible, and based on what has been said I imagine you are pretty sure they would lose to an army of nothing but gretchen?

Thyhadras wrote:
Martel... have you thought about buying the marine codex and running Angels as vanilla marines? Since blood angels are so terrible, and based on what has been said I imagine you are pretty sure they would lose to an army of nothing but gretchen?

Yes, but as a BA player, I lack all the models that make vanilla marines work better than BA. It's not that vanilla marines have better MARINES, they have better non-marines. They've got grav cents, White scars chapter tactics, Stormtalons, Thunderfire, skyhammer, enclave, and that asshat from FW who picks his powers. Marines even have better assault marines because they can allow them to assault from DS. However, I don't own the devs for skyhammer and I'm not buying them.

What's wrong with Blood Angels is that they were made obsolete by the new Codex: Space Marines. They have inferior tanks, Scouts, Terminators, and Dreadnoughts compared to the Codex: Space Marines versions of said units. Their special rule only grants Furious Charge when the other Space Marines get a host of other abilities through Chapter Tactics. They also lack a Strike Force detachment on the order of the Gladius Strike Force or Lion's Blade Strike Force, so they have no way to gain free transports the way other Space Marines do. They do have a Battle Company formation, but it is vastly underpowered and overcosted relative to the other Space Marines. Additionally, they are a Deep Strike assault army in a shooty edition with no way to get into assault without being shot off the board before they can accomplish anything.

I personally still wear my Crimson power armor and fly the banner of Sanguinius proudly. Am I going to be the end-all-be-all marine army? No. Am I going to be a 'power' list? No.

But my main army for the last several years has been I.G. (Vostroyan I.G. at that, Veteran squads FTW!), so I'm use to being the underdog. I'll build my Blood Angels to be an ally force to my guard and eventually turn it into a force unto itself one day soon.

Conversely, Blood Angels make pretty excellent allies to Guard as they do Assault pretty great even still, especially when you factor in the formation that allows for +1 initiative on the charge in addition to the furious charge bonus. Gels nicely with Guard shooting to have an ally that does assault markedly better.

I play the army I like. I don't play the army that's most competitive. Win, lose, or draw, I love the Guard, and I love the Blood Angels. That's what matters to me. Competitiveness be damned.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

I'm not switching either, but it gets tiresome losing game after game to units I can't get within 18" of because they are gunning me down from 36" away while running away.

Death Company is the only thing going for BA atm in relation to other dexes. Maybe Dante too, but that's it.

Sanguinary Guard are an expensive pin cushion in the current meta; our dreads are terribad, even the fragioso (when was the last time you saw a fragioso in a list on here, let alone on the table? And it is supposed to be one of our best units!); we still have to pay premium for rhinos, terminators, scouts and dreads; we lack the power builds, as Martel mentions of all the other power armour armies; we have, aside from Dante, no way to build a fast close combat monster (for the close combat chapter no less); the baal predator is rediculously expensive for what it does and was nerfed massively by losing scout; our 'CT' only works if we reach assault and doesn't help us get there; we are an assault army in 7th without the numbers or durability to actually make it work; and our formation bonuses are really really poor in comparison to 7.5 dexes.

When the dex was released we were initially blinded by 3pt jps for DC, -7pts for SG, grav for bikers and minor pts drops for tacs, asms and scouts. We missed the fact that these only made the 5th ed dex only just able to compete in 7th IF there weren't a raft of nerfs to go with it. AND BOY DID WE GET HIT HARD WITH THE NERF BAT!
-DC no longer troops
-DC dreads bo longer troops
-ASMs no longer troops
-ASMs unable to take dedicated razors or land raiders
-Sanguinor dropped in points but nerfed at the same time to make him still unusable
-Tycho became a teddy bear
-Priests no longer 3 to a slot or in elites
-Baals losing scout
-Baals moved from fast to heavy
-Corbulo losing his 2+ fnp
-DC losing 1 ws (this has made a much bigger difference than ws usually does make)
-Losing our only 'MC' Mephiston (admittedly getting IC and losing MC like stats is a fair trade off so even there).

The cheaper jump packs, nipple armour and Dantes at-initiative axe were so shiney and promising that we overlooked these nerfs, but by god/FSM, we can't ignore them any longer after actually playing the dex.

The reduction in price of vanilla termis and upgrade in stats of vanilla scouts and dreads is just salt in the wound. And that's not even mentioning squadrons and Gladius.


Oh 1 more thing. Are you aware that BA are for some reason, the only chapter/successor chapters that don't get to ise half the units in IA:2. (Yes I get it - the mechanicus begrudge them for keeping the Raven STC for so long, but it doesn't exactly translate fairly into gameplay, besides - everyone has the frikkin raven now anyway! And the talon just as a massive middle finger to the BA to top it all off).

Pretty much what Poly said

Which is a real shame because I've always considered starting Blood Angels, but each time I think about it I realize that everything they do my Ultra's do better, and then I go back to thinking about starting Eldar instead.

You can compare the SM Codex against the BA one and you can see the stat buff, points reduced and squadron enhanced entries for the SM.

Then the non-SM units, such as GravTurions, Stormtalons, TFCs, etc just work better in this shooty edition because, surprise surprise, they shoot really well either with what they can produce or for the points. BA are an assault army, which doesn't work as well as it should because they ideally want to assault from Deep Strike which 6th just removed completely.

Kind of a bummer, because BA were the last Codex to be released before Necrons Power Creeped. Before Crons, people were of the opinion that the 7th books were balanced against themselves.

Uh I think thats 'blanded against each other'.

But ya what poly said. Basically the same treatment as grey knights dark eldar wolves and so on.

Even not comparing BA to marines they got hit hard..
ASM in razorbacks went up in price to 180.
Scouts remain ws/bs 3.
Tycho boasts digital weapons as his only combat weapon.
A foot slogging power armoured CM is a lord of war.
Specialist dreads have nilla dread stats.
Relics are mostly a joke.
The FOC was made crowded and overly restrictive.
The list goes on.
5ths book was much better, same for most of the others IMO.

dominuschao wrote:

Relics are mostly a joke.

The Fury Of Baal and The Crown Angelic are pretty bad, but other than that the artifacts are pretty cool.

I'll agree that BA got hit hard, but I wish BA players would stop comparing their units to SM units when they do that. Seems like what A lot of them want is the SM power units, but wouldn't it be better to get some new unqiue units that make the army more unique overall than just what makes the baseline SM powerful? Just a question I'd like to hear some opinion s and maybe ideas on.

 saithor wrote:
I'll agree that BA got hit hard, but I wish BA players would stop comparing their units to SM units when they do that. Seems like what A lot of them want is the SM power units, but wouldn't it be better to get some new unqiue units that make the army more unique overall than just what makes the baseline SM powerful? Just a question I'd like to hear some opinion s and maybe ideas on.

From my understanding, the problem is that they're unique units aren't up to the standards of Grav Centurions in terms of power. Death Company are great at CC, but are very expensive. Sanguinary Guard have a 2+ armour save, but no invulnerable and are only T4. The Baal Predator is overcosted. The Sanguinior is now actively worse than an Avatar of Khaine. Furioso and DC Dreads don't have the 4 attacks base vanilla marines have.

Compound this with BS3 Scouts, overpriced Terminators, and no access to the Gladius or Demi-Company and you can see how Blood Angles are to 7th edition what Dark Angels were to 6th edition (and CSM still are).

Could be worse. 6th edition Dark Angels had it a lot worse than Blood Angels do now. Blood Angels have grav weapons and their special characters don't suck.

 TheNewBlood wrote:

 saithor wrote:
I'll agree that BA got hit hard, but I wish BA players would stop comparing their units to SM units when they do that. Seems like what A lot of them want is the SM power units, but wouldn't it be better to get some new unqiue units that make the army more unique overall than just what makes the baseline SM powerful? Just a question I'd like to hear some opinion s and maybe ideas on.

From my understanding, the problem is that they're unique units aren't up to the standards of Grav Centurions in terms of power. Death Company are great at CC, but are very expensive. Sanguinary Guard have a 2+ armour save, but no invulnerable and are only T4. The Baal Predator is overcosted. The Sanguinior is now actively worse than an Avatar of Khaine. Furioso and DC Dreads don't have the 4 attacks base vanilla marines have.

Compound this with BS3 Scouts, overpriced Terminators, and no access to the Gladius or Demi-Company and you can see how Blood Angles are to 7th edition what Dark Angels were to 6th edition (and CSM still are).

Could be worse. 6th edition Dark Angels had it a lot worse than Blood Angels do now. Blood Angels have grav weapons and their special characters don't suck.

Thanks for the clarification. Like I said in another thread, seems that everybody takes their turn under the bus in 40k editions.

Poly Ranger wrote:
Death Company is the only thing going for BA atm in relation to other dexes. Maybe Dante too, but that's it.

Sanguinary Guard are an expensive pin cushion in the current meta; our dreads are terribad, even the fragioso (when was the last time you saw a fragioso in a list on here, let alone on the table? And it is supposed to be one of our best units!); we still have to pay premium for rhinos, terminators, scouts and dreads; we lack the power builds, as Martel mentions of all the other power armour armies; we have, aside from Dante, no way to build a fast close combat monster (for the close combat chapter no less); the baal predator is rediculously expensive for what it does and was nerfed massively by losing scout; our 'CT' only works if we reach assault and doesn't help us get there; we are an assault army in 7th without the numbers or durability to actually make it work; and our formation bonuses are really really poor in comparison to 7.5 dexes.

When the dex was released we were initially blinded by 3pt jps for DC, -7pts for SG, grav for bikers and minor pts drops for tacs, asms and scouts. We missed the fact that these only made the 5th ed dex only just able to compete in 7th IF there weren't a raft of nerfs to go with it. AND BOY DID WE GET HIT HARD WITH THE NERF BAT!
-DC no longer troops
-DC dreads bo longer troops
-ASMs no longer troops
-ASMs unable to take dedicated razors or land raiders
-Sanguinor dropped in points but nerfed at the same time to make him still unusable
-Tycho became a teddy bear
-Priests no longer 3 to a slot or in elites
-Baals losing scout
-Baals moved from fast to heavy
-Corbulo losing his 2+ fnp
-DC losing 1 ws (this has made a much bigger difference than ws usually does make)
-Losing our only 'MC' Mephiston (admittedly getting IC and losing MC like stats is a fair trade off so even there).

The cheaper jump packs, nipple armour and Dantes at-initiative axe were so shiney and promising that we overlooked these nerfs, but by god/FSM, we can't ignore them any longer after actually playing the dex.

The reduction in price of vanilla termis and upgrade in stats of vanilla scouts and dreads is just salt in the wound. And that's not even mentioning squadrons and Gladius.


Oh 1 more thing. Are you aware that BA are for some reason, the only chapter/successor chapters that don't get to ise half the units in IA:2. (Yes I get it - the mechanicus begrudge them for keeping the Raven STC for so long, but it doesn't exactly translate fairly into gameplay, besides - everyone has the frikkin raven now anyway! And the talon just as a massive middle finger to the BA to top it all off).

None of what you said is wrong, per say, but the list of nerfs are just something to obsess over, and really, let's be honest, aren't that big a deal.

-DC no longer troops ---I don't care. They CAN score now, which they couldn't do before, and I can actually take multiple units of them now if I'd like.

-DC dreads bo longer troops ---I don't care. I know a lot of BA players liked em, but I never played with one. Didn't everyone agree walkers suck?

-ASMs no longer troops---I don't care. No one thought they were great before, but we had to take them. It only sucked that we suddenly had to purchase / paint new troop units.

-ASMs unable to take dedicated razors or land raiders---Still don't care. I like em as drop melta.

-Sanguinor dropped in points but nerfed at the same time to make him still unusable---Did anyone use him before?

-Tycho became a teddy bear---This is a reason people hate the codex? He's not an option at all without the Dead Man's Hand, but I didn't play him when he had it...

-Priests no longer 3 to a slot or in elites---This actually sucks, though many of my lists aren't feeling bare without multiple Priests in them.

-Baals losing scout---Don't care at all about this. I play my Baal at a distance, not with the Flamer. It's fast and can do what I need it to do without Scout.

-Baals moved from fast to heavy---This is a perceived nerf, but now that assault marines are in Fast, Baals had to end up somewhere else to get play. It hasn't really affected my list-building, though it does seem stupid.

-Corbulo losing his 2+ fnp---a nerf to be sure, but this one we had to see coming. It was WAY too boss.

-DC losing 1 ws (this has made a much bigger difference than ws usually does make)---Yeah, this one sucks no doubt, but they're cheaper with jump packs as well, so I don't seem to mind.

-Losing our only 'MC' Mephiston (admittedly getting IC and losing MC like stats is a fair trade off so even there).---Another perceived nerf, but Mephiston rocked the house for me in a game last night....he's still a boogyman against an army that's trying to assault you.


None of that is to say people should love the BA codex or say it's top tier. I just get tired of hearing all of these "who gives a crap" complaints that aren't affecting my games one bit. Also, the buffs to Dante were what BA players had been asking for for years, and everyone still casts him aside as "meh" because of what? The Wraithknight? Sure, I wish he wasn't in our LoW slot, but I'm not going to look down on him because he doesn't compare well to the most brokenly undercosted and well-rounded unit in the game.

Yeah, GW rejiggered our codex around and we had to buy / use some scouts or tactical marines. Assault is generally harder to win with that shooting and almost none of our units have access to fleet meaning our arses end up hung out to dry at least once or twice a game. When things go bad, they tend to go REALLY bad. None of that means I can't play, have fun, and win the games I take part in.

Why do I feel like I just said all of that to a brick wall?

BA were poor (and arguably one of the worst) from the start of 6th until now and still will be until we get a new dex in 8th or 9th. That's a long time under the bus. So bottom tier to bottom tier.

Compare that to:
SM - top tier to top tier
Eldar - top tier to top tier
Necrons - top tier to top tier

Or even just:
SW - mid tier to mid tier
GKs - mid tier to mid tier
Inquisition - mid tier to mid tier
Tau - top tier to mid tier
Daemons - top tier to mid tier
Sisters - Mid tier to mid tier
The last three are only downgraded due to not having recieved a new dex yet and unable to fully keep up with the 7.5 dexes.

When people say that armies take their turns being bottom of the pile, what they really mean is that BA, CSM, Orks, DE, IG and Nids (to an extent) take turns at being bottom of the bottom. No other army, aside from DA, can claim to be anywhere near that group for many years. BA were good in 5th... 4 years ago! 4 years is a massive amount of time to wait. It is 5% of your life if you live till 80 (that's 1 in 20 of your living days). So when people say 'well you were good in 5th', so flippin what? How about those who never played 5th? How about those who only have BA and have had to put up with FOUR YEARS of being bottom of the pile (it will probably be more like 6 or 7 by the time we get a new dex - getting close to a decade by that point). Is that an enjoyable hobby for them compared to their friends? I'm fortunate in the fact that I own multiple armies, many others are not so fortunate. However, the fact that I have to shelve thousands of pounds of models if I want even a semblance of a chance of winning, riles me up still.

On a side note, after writing it so much, the word 'tier' doesn't feel like a real word anymore.

BA just got it back to back because their 5th ed codex sucked in 6th.

 Voidwraith wrote:

Poly Ranger wrote:
Death Company is the only thing going for BA atm in relation to other dexes. Maybe Dante too, but that's it.

Sanguinary Guard are an expensive pin cushion in the current meta; our dreads are terribad, even the fragioso (when was the last time you saw a fragioso in a list on here, let alone on the table? And it is supposed to be one of our best units!); we still have to pay premium for rhinos, terminators, scouts and dreads; we lack the power builds, as Martel mentions of all the other power armour armies; we have, aside from Dante, no way to build a fast close combat monster (for the close combat chapter no less); the baal predator is rediculously expensive for what it does and was nerfed massively by losing scout; our 'CT' only works if we reach assault and doesn't help us get there; we are an assault army in 7th without the numbers or durability to actually make it work; and our formation bonuses are really really poor in comparison to 7.5 dexes.

When the dex was released we were initially blinded by 3pt jps for DC, -7pts for SG, grav for bikers and minor pts drops for tacs, asms and scouts. We missed the fact that these only made the 5th ed dex only just able to compete in 7th IF there weren't a raft of nerfs to go with it. AND BOY DID WE GET HIT HARD WITH THE NERF BAT!
-DC no longer troops
-DC dreads bo longer troops
-ASMs no longer troops
-ASMs unable to take dedicated razors or land raiders
-Sanguinor dropped in points but nerfed at the same time to make him still unusable
-Tycho became a teddy bear
-Priests no longer 3 to a slot or in elites
-Baals losing scout
-Baals moved from fast to heavy
-Corbulo losing his 2+ fnp
-DC losing 1 ws (this has made a much bigger difference than ws usually does make)
-Losing our only 'MC' Mephiston (admittedly getting IC and losing MC like stats is a fair trade off so even there).

The cheaper jump packs, nipple armour and Dantes at-initiative axe were so shiney and promising that we overlooked these nerfs, but by god/FSM, we can't ignore them any longer after actually playing the dex.

The reduction in price of vanilla termis and upgrade in stats of vanilla scouts and dreads is just salt in the wound. And that's not even mentioning squadrons and Gladius.


Oh 1 more thing. Are you aware that BA are for some reason, the only chapter/successor chapters that don't get to ise half the units in IA:2. (Yes I get it - the mechanicus begrudge them for keeping the Raven STC for so long, but it doesn't exactly translate fairly into gameplay, besides - everyone has the frikkin raven now anyway! And the talon just as a massive middle finger to the BA to top it all off).

None of what you said is wrong, per say, but the list of nerfs are just something to obsess over, and really, let's be honest, aren't that big a deal.

-DC no longer troops ---I don't care. They CAN score now, which they couldn't do before, and I can actually take multiple units of them now if I'd like.

-DC dreads bo longer troops ---I don't care. I know a lot of BA players liked em, but I never played with one. Didn't everyone agree walkers suck?

-ASMs no longer troops---I don't care. No one thought they were great before, but we had to take them. It only sucked that we suddenly had to purchase / paint new troop units.

-ASMs unable to take dedicated razors or land raiders---Still don't care. I like em as drop melta.

-Sanguinor dropped in points but nerfed at the same time to make him still unusable---Did anyone use him before?

-Tycho became a teddy bear---This is a reason people hate the codex? He's not an option at all without the Dead Man's Hand, but I didn't play him when he had it...

-Priests no longer 3 to a slot or in elites---This actually sucks, though many of my lists aren't feeling bare without multiple Priests in them.

-Baals losing scout---Don't care at all about this. I play my Baal at a distance, not with the Flamer. It's fast and can do what I need it to do without Scout.

-Baals moved from fast to heavy---This is a perceived nerf, but now that assault marines are in Fast, Baals had to end up somewhere else to get play. It hasn't really affected my list-building, though it does seem stupid.

-Corbulo losing his 2+ fnp---a nerf to be sure, but this one we had to see coming. It was WAY too boss.

-DC losing 1 ws (this has made a much bigger difference than ws usually does make)---Yeah, this one sucks no doubt, but they're cheaper with jump packs as well, so I don't seem to mind.

-Losing our only 'MC' Mephiston (admittedly getting IC and losing MC like stats is a fair trade off so even there).---Another perceived nerf, but Mephiston rocked the house for me in a game last night....he's still a boogyman against an army that's trying to assault you.


None of that is to say people should love the BA codex or say it's top tier. I just get tired of hearing all of these "who gives a crap" complaints that aren't affecting my games one bit. Also, the buffs to Dante were what BA players had been asking for for years, and everyone still casts him aside as "meh" because of what? The Wraithknight? Sure, I wish he wasn't in our LoW slot, but I'm not going to look down on him because he doesn't compare well to the most brokenly undercosted and well-rounded unit in the game.

Yeah, GW rejiggered our codex around and we had to buy / use some scouts or tactical marines. Assault is generally harder to win with that shooting and almost none of our units have access to fleet meaning our arses end up hung out to dry at least once or twice a game. When things go bad, they tend to go REALLY bad. None of that means I can't play, have fun, and win the games I take part in.

Why do I feel like I just said all of that to a brick wall?

No need for that last sentence. Rather insulting for no reason at all tbh.

The thing is YOU don't care about many of the nerfs. Most of us however do.
-Loss of DC and DC dreads as troops meant we lost full DC builds.
-Loss of Baals in heavies meant we can no longer run av13 walls.
-Loss of ASMs as troops means we have to take tacs or scouts, not all of us think tacs are all that.
-Loss of LR as DT meant no more AV14 spam.
-Loss of razors as DT meant no more cheap mass razors.
-Loss of scout on Baals made flamestorms (which I own a lot of even if YOU don't) absolutely useless. And yes - losing scout IS a nerf.
Almost all the BA builds from before were completely gone in this dex. Aside from mass JP.
There are a lot of things you don't care about. That doesn't mean they aren't nerfs just because they don't effect you.

Martel732 wrote:
BA just got it back to back because their 5th ed codex sucked in 6th.

To be fair, pretty much all the 5E books took a huge hit with 6E, at least the Imperial armies, Necrons got better, but IG, BA, SW, GK, SM all got much less capable with the release of 6E.