1) Mannahnin's answer is correct, more or less. You can use FW models, but not the rules, for the GT/Trios. That's to say, you could use the FWGUO as a Great Unclean One if you wanted, provided proper base sizes / yadda yadda. You can use FW models AND rules for the Narrative, with the exception of Super Heavies and Gargantuans.
For the Narrative, there is both a Tactical Track and a Cinematic Track, so if you're more of a competitive player and want to get in some 6th Ed games with a FW-inclusive army, you can do the evening Narrative alongside the GT, and get 4 games using such a list in.
2) For the trios, your 2,000 point "singles" list needs to be from the same codex as your 1,000 point "team" list, but it does not need to use the same building blocks; it can be completely different.
3) The seminars are explained in more detail on the site - from there:
Hands-On Weathering -
Justin “misterjustin” McCoy, founder of Secret Weapon miniatures, will introduce participants to weathering pigments and give them an
opportunity to use pigments to weather a class exclusive 50mm base. Topics will include:
* What is a pigment
* What to look for when you buy
* Pigment weathering vs. painting
* HANDS-ON rust weathering
* HANDS-ON brick and dirt weathering
* Mud and muck weathering
DEMO Weathering Techniques:
Justin “misterjustin” McCoy, founder of Secret Weapon miniatures, will spend two hours introducing participants to a wide range of
weathering techniques working as quickly as he can to cover:
* Order of application
* Acrylic paint techniques (sponge, salt, hairspray, etc.)
* Weathering pigments
* Pencils
* Oil paints
DEMO Basing Your Models:
Justin “misterjustin” McCoy, founder of Secret Weapon miniatures, will share some of the techniques he has used to make hundreds of display
and gaming bases from 20mm singles to army display boards in this two hour demonstration class. Topics will include:
* Display vs. gaming – approach
* Display vs. gaming – materials
* Theme
* Composition
* Order of application
* Painting, pigments, and scenics
DEMO Airbrushing
Justin "misterjustin" McCoy, founder of Secret Weapon miniatures, will introduce participants to the basics of airbrushing models, from small infantry to large vehicles, in this two hour demonstration class. Topics will include:
* Airbrushes, compressors, and canned air
* Airbrush and compressor components
* Basic airbrush techniques
* Proper paint dilution
* Spraying techniques
* Pressure and flow regulation
* Airbrush cleaning and maintenance
I believe the DEMOS are more lecture-based, while the Hands On is DEFINITELY something where you will work with a model yourself. I'll see if I can route Justin himself to eyeball this for proper descriptions or explanations.
As Target shared, a lot of the people who've had courses with McCoy have had an AWESOME time; that and his very responsive nature were big reasons for why we pursued him as a sponsor and for giving demos.
Our Paint Competition will be awarding a Grex Tritium TG Pistol Grip Airbrush to EVERY Category Winner (that's a $300 MSRP highly-reviewed/regarded airbrush), in addition to vouchers from SWM, and numerous other prizes. It's cheap to get into, and it's getting in on the first year - if you've got models you think are half decent, submit them in for judging!
Though all information is available at the site, the points level is 2000, and the round lengths have been expanded to 2:30 each
Updates from further down in the thread:
re: the Narrative event:
It's actually going to be playable, and integrated with a variety of events.
Some of the tables will be terrained/designed to suit competitive play, some will be terrained/designed to suit the higher use of super-heavies, and at least one - the Washington Monument / National Mall centerpiece - will be more of a tactical map readout table, where the two overall faction commanders will work to assign teams/players to sections (tables), and "direct" the flow of the event.
These commanders, keep in mind, will mostly be part of the narrative/"cinematic" nature of it - perhaps even Black Library authors or the like if things work out ideally - and the event will be hard-wired, fine-tuned, and properly planned/run "behind the scenes" in terms of pairings, missions, formats, etc.
Think along the lines of the ability to register for team narrative, singles narrative, trios tournament, and perhaps some unique 40k mini-tournaments a la 6th Ed (if just out by then), mirror matching, fixed list, etc. ... all under the moniker of "Nighthammer" or similar, with most of them being primarily 3-4 round events occuring spread over the evenings Thurs - Sat, and Sunday during the day in more of a laid back fashion. These various events will be "Centered" on the DC tables, with events playing on table layouts appropriate to their design (i.e. the more competitive evening/side events being on more terrain-balanced tables, while the more narrative events happen on more cinematic tables with a higher concentration of DC memorials / accurate proportions / etc.). The net results of all events and individual games will have an impact on the day-to-day and overall final narrative.
There'll be a full line of blog posts, primers, etc., on this leading into the event.
The NOVA Open's schedule for 2012 is much friendlier to the more casual gamer. This combines well with the format we use for pairing and scoring ... further gearing our event toward ALL player types, all within the same event.
The draft schedule at present for the NOVA Open 2012 40kGT is as follows:
Friday, August 31, 2012
Up until 1:30PM, all day check-in and paint judging
2:00PM - 4:30PM - Round 1
5:00PM - 7:30PM - Round 2
Saturday, September 1, 2012
7:30AM - 10:00AM - Round 3
10:30AM - 1:00PM - Round 4
1:00PM - 2:00PM - Lunch break, Bracket Splits and Record Resets
2:00PM - 4:30PM - Round 5
5:00PM - 7:30PM - Round 6
After Round 6, the Final 4 for each bracket advance to Sunday's Final Fours. Renaissance Man will be determined after 6 rounds instead of 8. All players will be able to continue to participate in organized competitive or casual gaming on Sunday morning if they wish, or they can sleep in and enjoy the day, check out DC, or whatever they feel up to. Players no longer in the running for Generalship awards within their bracket will not be required to continue.
So, in a nutshell - 6 rounds mandatory instead of 8, 2:30 minute rounds instead of 2:15, and only a single day of 4 rounds in a day even for Final Four attendees. Plus those in it for Ren Man and the like are evaluated based upon 6 rounds instead of 8.
All 40k All the Time - "Nighthammer" - Integrated Experience
For those of you looking for the most comprehensive and universally appealing 40k experience out there, we're proud to add our night project to the 40k offering. Internally referred to as "Nighthammer" while we finish hammering out details and processes and missions and the rest, this will be a comprehensive all-player-style-integrating 40k experience covering Thursday, Friday and Saturday evenings, as well as Sunday all day and Saturday during the day for non-GT players.
A couple of highlights to anticipate for "Nighthammer."
- Unique, balanced, fun and interesting scenarios fine-tuned to player styles and narrative gaming
- A weekend-long, club-involving, mass-results-incorporating story unique to the NOVA's style and geographic location ... results of all game styles - from competitive tournament games to casual narrative games to "Gladiator-esque" (ref: AdeptiCon) Apoc-inclusive games - will be incorporated in the overall story
- Custom designed terrain built to the tune of some of Washington DC's most iconic memorials, with table layouts and structures designed to evoke the feel of battling for the future of our nation's capital
- Comprehensive social enhancers ranging from swap meets to drink specials, all designed and aimed at integrating and bringing together players after a long day of gaming for a blast of an evening every single night
Many of the NOVA's "side" 40k tournaments will occur amidst these evening events, including:
- The NOVA Invitational's Round 1 will be Thursday Evening
- The Warhammer 40,000 Trios Team Tournament will occur Thursday and Friday evenings, and Sunday afternoon
- Narrative Singles and Narrative Doubles Gaming will be added covering Thursday, Friday and Saturday evenings, and Sunday afternoon
- Additional offerings and side events, to possibly include 6e if it is released, across the evenings
- Drop in organizer-assisted gaming for all player styles - competitive gamers deployed to square off against other competitive gamers, all the way to hobbyists with gorgeous armies deployed to square off on scenic tables with other hobbyists fielding gorgeous armies
Saturday DC Narrative-Tied Scavenger Hunt
- For hobbyists looking to participate in evening narrative gaming, but not wishing to participate in the GT on Saturday, we'll be building and directing an event through our Nation's Capital during the day on Saturday. The results of this event and the teams sent out for it will have an impact on the continuation of the Narrative Gaming for Saturday evening. Explore the city with missions in mind during the day, and battle across its iconic monuments at night!
Hotel Reservations - Make sure you reserve your hotel rooms now; the weblink is on the NOVA Open's frontpage. We'll be once again holding our multi-thousand-dollar hotel cash raffle, and you get more raffle tickets the earlier you reserve your rooms.
There's a GREAT deal more information to come on the NOVA Open 2012, so stay tuned to the website, facebook, blog, twitter, forums and more as we move forward for the best NOVA Open ever!
At first I was a little sad regarding the location. But it looks like they are genuinely trying to work with you and the fact that I can shuttle from the airport is awesome. the increase in time and breaktime will be good too. If I'm reading this right though when would the Invitational be? Since you'd be playing 2 games on Friday night and 4 Games on Saturday?
Right now we're slotting the Invitational as also a little more spread out and less fatiguing ...
Since Invitational attendees all pretty much had to arrive Thursday regardless, we'd start with Round 1 on Thursday night, Rounds 2 and 3 Friday AM prior to lunch and the start of the GT.
Ren Man - like the GT sorta - would be based on the 3 rounds, and the Final Four would be Sunday afternoon. So, Invitational players would not at an y point have to play more than 2 Invitational games in a row, which should help keep the quality and flow of the games higher, and fatigue lighter.
This is shaping out to be a really good weekend next year. With the exception of a few little quirks(cough cough Hyatt) I really enjoyed the NOVA last year, and I'm glad to see that you are working hard to fix some of those quirks.
The entire system that you have planned out for the GT seems very unique. You're right an assuming it should help with the burnout that some people might get. I know I was getting some of that during the second day! I hope everything works out.
Hulk - definitely intense for those who Final 4 both the Invitational and GT, but at least no one will have to play in 5 games in a single day again
For those who don't feel like clicking flyers, one of the bigger deals is probably the dramatic cheapening of the weekend from the travel/hotel point of view - from $110/night and $25/day parking to $85/night and $12.50/day parking. GT and Weekend Badge rates will also NOT be increasing, so there's no secret upcharge hidden amidst anything.
Can you elaborate on the cinematic addition? Is it going to be like a apocalypse game or a bring and battle or just a diorama display table featuring cool stuff blowing up DC?
It's actually going to be playable, and integrated with a variety of events.
Some of the tables will be terrained/designed to suit competitive play, some will be terrained/designed to suit the higher use of super-heavies, and at least one - the Washington Monument / National Mall centerpiece - will be more of a tactical map readout table, where the two overall faction commanders will work to assign teams/players to sections (tables), and "direct" the flow of the event.
These commanders, keep in mind, will mostly be part of the narrative/"cinematic" nature of it - perhaps even Black Library authors or the like if things work out ideally - and the event will be hard-wired, fine-tuned, and properly planned/run "behind the scenes" in terms of pairings, missions, formats, etc.
Think along the lines of the ability to register for team narrative, singles narrative, trios tournament, and perhaps some unique 40k mini-tournaments a la 6th Ed (if just out by then), mirror matching, fixed list, etc. ... all under the moniker of "Nighthammer" or similar, with most of them being primarily 3-4 round events occuring spread over the evenings Thurs - Sat, and Sunday during the day in more of a laid back fashion. These various events will be "Centered" on the DC tables, with events playing on table layouts appropriate to their design (i.e. the more competitive evening/side events being on more terrain-balanced tables, while the more narrative events happen on more cinematic tables with a higher concentration of DC memorials / accurate proportions / etc.). The net results of all events and individual games will have an impact on the day-to-day and overall final narrative.
There'll be a full line of blog posts, primers, etc., on this leading into the event.
I do not know why a lot of people had a problem with the hotel.
The price was in line with most 4 star hotels.
Yes you had to walk a couple of blocks to get to food, or order pizza to your room. That is common for 95% of hotels.
You had to pay for internet. Big deal, so you had to use your smart phone or go without for a weekend. Really, no internet for 3 days is such a big deal?
The only problem I saw with the hotel was that parking was a bit high.
Blackmoor wrote:I do not know why a lot of people had a problem with the hotel.
The price was in line with most 4 star hotels.
Yes you had to walk a couple of blocks to get to food, or order pizza to your room. That is common for 95% of hotels.
You had to pay for internet. Big deal, so you had to use your smart phone or go without for a weekend. Really, no internet for 3 days is such a big deal?
The only problem I saw with the hotel was that parking was a bit high.
The rad thing Blackmoor is for better or worse some people DID think it was expensive, or DID think we should have had a food line right outside the gaming hall. So, rather than fret too much ... we convinced the hotel to DRAMATICALLY reduce rates, and add a food line right outside the gaming hall. Win Win
This years NOVA was an amazing experience and GT to attend, I was very pleased with the quality of the hotel though parking was a tad expensive like everyone said.
With all of these new perks there is no way I am missing it next year.
Maybe this time I will play in the GT too
I feel it was to expensive for what was provided. Additional costs were also to much for what was provided. I travel a lot and this hotel was one of my worst hotel experiences but it feels like Mike is addressing 99% of those. Now if they just put doors on the shower it'll be pretty perfect
the parking garage connected to the hotel (not run by the hotel) cost me $36 for thurs-sunday parking. I also had a full size pickup with a trailer attached.
If you want valet parking its going to cost you. The front desk offered other suggestions..thats how i found out about the other parking option.
Yeah, we found that place too, but that was after we used valet for the first day because the hotel staff strait up lied to us about the cost of other parking in the area.
The flipside positive here is we shared all these things with the hotel - the feedback from the survey (some of which was brutal, some of which was complimentary), and the Hyatt bent over backward to get us to come back ... 12,000 more square feet of event space (brightly lit at that for paint competitions, etc), a conference theater for seminars and other sorts of things, $25 less per night, and parking down to area affordable at $12.50/day instead of $25/day (among all the other things).
It's funny how effective a large group's worth of feedback can be
Yeah, I can imagine how brutal most of those reviews were. Like I said, I almost never complain about a hotel but that one had a lot of bad. But it looks like it's all being addressed which is all that really matters. Glad to see they were open to the changes.
The trip is already locked in with the wife and family that we visit after the event
Can't wait ... though we're hanging out in Chicago this year ... not playing in the GT or Sunday personally, as despite sickness causing it I enjoyed the free time last year / focus on the team tournament.
Interestingly, most of the reviews of the hotel were actually positive, but that's the way with the "majority" of attendees of any event; rather than focus our energies on "75% of ya'll said you liked the hotel more or less, the rest of you can deal," it was important to us to keep our focus on expansion of those who can enjoy attending, not ... guarding an annually decreasing core while saying "deal" to our less happy attendees.
For those curious, we opened registration for 40k a little earlier due to the high number of overseas and long-range-travel attendees, to give them as much time as possible for securing affordable airline tickets and the like.
Blackmoor wrote:
You had to pay for internet. Big deal, so you had to use your smart phone or go without for a weekend. Really, no internet for 3 days is such a big deal?
The only problem I saw with the hotel was that parking was a bit high.
Both of these are indicative of an establishment that's trying to nickel & dime their customers. I've traveled across the country on my bike several times, and even the smallest mom&pop inns offer free wi-fi these days. Pay extra to park at a place you're staying? They're being deceptive about the actual cost to stay there, and that makes people angry. They get away with it because business travelers, who probably make up most of their clients, don't care as they're expensing it.
I also noticed the 'pay-for-wifi' at the adepticon hotel last year, but oddly, there was free wifi in the lobbies and lounges. That makes me believe they're losing revenue from pay-per-view porn if they offer free wifi in the rooms.
To the point of the hotel, make sure to reserve your rooms now as well as purchasing your GT tickets.
We will be holding our multi-thousand-dollar cash hotel raffle again in 2012, with raffle tickets awarded in proportion to the # of nights you stay factored by how far in advance you reserved them.
To the point of the hotel - as mentioned earlier, there was a fair bit of nickel-and-diming done in 2011 ... which is why we worked with them to reduce hotel rates from $110 to $85/night, sliced parking and internet and beer rates in half, and got them to install full cell phone service throughout the hotel's convention space, among many other improvements.
Blackmoor wrote:
You had to pay for internet. Big deal, so you had to use your smart phone or go without for a weekend. Really, no internet for 3 days is such a big deal?
The only problem I saw with the hotel was that parking was a bit high.
Both of these are indicative of an establishment that's trying to nickel & dime their customers. I've traveled across the country on my bike several times, and even the smallest mom&pop inns offer free wi-fi these days. Pay extra to park at a place you're staying? They're being deceptive about the actual cost to stay there, and that makes people angry. They get away with it because business travelers, who probably make up most of their clients, don't care as they're expensing it.
That is exactly right. Hotels in Downtowns and other business centers jack up there prices and because most of their clientele are business travelers on expense accounts. Since companies are paying for it, and not people, it is just part of doing business in a hotel close to DC.
Parking is different though, they have a free shuttle from the airport and every place that is near an airport you have to pay for parking. At Adepticon you have to pay to get from the airport to Lombard IL and so is that a hidden cost?
The NOVA Open's schedule for 2012 is much friendlier to the more casual gamer. This combines well with the format we use for pairing and scoring ... further gearing our event toward ALL player types, all within the same event.
The draft schedule at present for the NOVA Open 2012 40kGT is as follows:
Friday, August 31, 2012
Up until 1:30PM, all day check-in and paint judging
2:00PM - 4:30PM - Round 1
5:00PM - 7:30PM - Round 2
Saturday, September 1, 2012
7:30AM - 10:00AM - Round 3
10:30AM - 1:00PM - Round 4
1:00PM - 2:00PM - Lunch break, Bracket Splits and Record Resets
2:00PM - 4:30PM - Round 5
5:00PM - 7:30PM - Round 6
After Round 6, the Final 4 for each bracket advance to Sunday's Final Fours. Renaissance Man will be determined after 6 rounds instead of 8. All players will be able to continue to participate in organized competitive or casual gaming on Sunday morning if they wish, or they can sleep in and enjoy the day, check out DC, or whatever they feel up to. Players no longer in the running for Generalship awards within their bracket will not be required to continue.
So, in a nutshell - 6 rounds mandatory instead of 8, 2:30 minute rounds instead of 2:15, and only a single day of 4 rounds in a day even for Final Four attendees. Plus those in it for Ren Man and the like are evaluated based upon 6 rounds instead of 8.
All 40k All the Time - "Nighthammer" - Integrated Experience
For those of you looking for the most comprehensive and universally appealing 40k experience out there, we're proud to add our night project to the 40k offering. Internally referred to as "Nighthammer" while we finish hammering out details and processes and missions and the rest, this will be a comprehensive all-player-style-integrating 40k experience covering Thursday, Friday and Saturday evenings, as well as Sunday all day and Saturday during the day for non-GT players.
A couple of highlights to anticipate for "Nighthammer."
- Unique, balanced, fun and interesting scenarios fine-tuned to player styles and narrative gaming
- A weekend-long, club-involving, mass-results-incorporating story unique to the NOVA's style and geographic location ... results of all game styles - from competitive tournament games to casual narrative games to "Gladiator-esque" (ref: AdeptiCon) Apoc-inclusive games - will be incorporated in the overall story
- Custom designed terrain built to the tune of some of Washington DC's most iconic memorials, with table layouts and structures designed to evoke the feel of battling for the future of our nation's capital
- Comprehensive social enhancers ranging from swap meets to drink specials, all designed and aimed at integrating and bringing together players after a long day of gaming for a blast of an evening every single night
Many of the NOVA's "side" 40k tournaments will occur amidst these evening events, including:
- The NOVA Invitational's Round 1 will be Thursday Evening
- The Warhammer 40,000 Trios Team Tournament will occur Thursday and Friday evenings, and Sunday afternoon
- Narrative Singles and Narrative Doubles Gaming will be added covering Thursday, Friday and Saturday evenings, and Sunday afternoon
- Additional offerings and side events, to possibly include 6e if it is released, across the evenings
- Drop in organizer-assisted gaming for all player styles - competitive gamers deployed to square off against other competitive gamers, all the way to hobbyists with gorgeous armies deployed to square off on scenic tables with other hobbyists fielding gorgeous armies
Saturday DC Narrative-Tied Scavenger Hunt
- For hobbyists looking to participate in evening narrative gaming, but not wishing to participate in the GT on Saturday, we'll be building and directing an event through our Nation's Capital during the day on Saturday. The results of this event and the teams sent out for it will have an impact on the continuation of the Narrative Gaming for Saturday evening. Explore the city with missions in mind during the day, and battle across its iconic monuments at night!
Hotel Reservations - Make sure you reserve your hotel rooms now; the weblink is on the NOVA Open's frontpage. We'll be once again holding our multi-thousand-dollar hotel cash raffle, and you get more raffle tickets the earlier you reserve your rooms.
There's a GREAT deal more information to come on the NOVA Open 2012, so stay tuned to the website, facebook, blog, twitter, forums and more as we move forward for the best NOVA Open ever!
as usual mike is pulling out all the stops to provide one of the best gaming experiances in the country. On top of that an incredible effort was put in to reducing all of the costs for the players plus gaming tweaks that are put in to make the tournament experiance more enjoyable.
Tons of support from myself and the rest of the BFS crew.
btw what are your target #s for 40k this year mike 256 or bigger ?
Booo...yaaaa....Tix purchased and hotel room reserved!!...See everyone there...Might even bring my daemons again!!...to let opponents curbstomp them...lol...
Is there a way we can register and guarantee a ticket like last year, without yet purchasing the ticket? I can just see my mom going "Why do you need to spend $100 on a warhammer tournament almost a year in advance?"
(BTW, Mike, this is Andrew, the kid who competed in the invitational. I'm not an older guy living with his mother )
Andrew, you played pretty awesome last year in a big, tough field!
Unfortunately we can't extend holds at this time.
Also, as an update for all, we sold a substantial % of our GT tickets last night. Fortunately not quite AdeptiCon sell-out rates, but I'd suggest obtaining a ticket for those sure they are attending sooner than later.
MVBrandt wrote:Andrew, you played pretty awesome last year in a big, tough field!
Unfortunately we can't extend holds at this time.
Also, as an update for all, we sold a substantial % of our GT tickets last night. Fortunately not quite AdeptiCon sell-out rates, but I'd suggest obtaining a ticket for those sure they are attending sooner than later.
Thanks, it was tough facing 5 Grey Knights players out of 13 games. This year I'll probably bring more balanced, probably Space Marine or Necron list; Daemons just drop too easily against some matchups (Dark Eldar, Grey Knights).
How many tickets have sold so far? If it's a large amount, I'll go ahead and buy mine now, if not I think I'll hold off for a little. Also, weekend badges can't sell out, correct? I'm going to hold off on getting one of those on the off-chance that I make the Invitational again.
Per your question, a significant number of our GT tickets have sold at this point. I do recommend purchasing one if you are surr you are attending. I don't think we'll sell out in the next few days, but the pace and high number of new attendees already = we will sell out.
When I'm no longer mobile phoning it, our multinedia chief has rightly asked me to post up our Facebook and Twitter feeds. Check em out / like / follow.
Fantasy, Infinity, Flames of War, 40k Narrative, and almost all other tickets / ticket options will be up for sale on January 1, 2012.
A newsletter will be sent to all registered newsletter recipients announcing as much as a reminder. You can request to join our newsletter by e-mailing novaopen@gmail.com
Keep close eyes at the website, blog, here and elsewhere for info on the Fantasy GT, plus increasing amounts of detail on our 40k evening events ... they're shaping up to be unique, fair, fun and awesome.
Having tried it for the first time at the Battle for Blobs Park, I'm not sure if I can stomach 4 rounds in a single day... perhaps I'll make it out for Warmahordes, though!
RiTides wrote:Having tried it for the first time at the Battle for Blobs Park, I'm not sure if I can stomach 4 rounds in a single day... perhaps I'll make it out for Warmahordes, though!
Definitely everyone has a different way of enjoying the hobby - and all the games in it. That's why we've built the NOVA for 2012 so it literally hits every type.
More info will be up about them shortly, but check into the Narrative and Nighttime 40k gaming opportunities when they are fully detailed out by Jan 1. The opportunity to game in a more relaxed (but still evenly-matched) environment in the evenings and Sunday afternoon, as a complement to something like Warmahordes activities (that are also all weekend long) might be right up your alley, without having to play the one day of 4 games at the GT.
For those that ONLY want to have to play a single 4 game day ... well, the other 2 days of the GT are only 2 games each for just that easier reason.
My point wasn't that I have a different way of enjoying the hobby just that 4 games in a day is a lot. Being local, I would have preferred to have 3 games on Saturday followed by 3 on Sunday, with the "champions" playing on Monday.
Obviously, that's really hard for people to plan for who have to fly in... but it doesn't change that it's what *I* would like
I would have also preferred 3 games on Friday followed by 3 games on Saturday, rather than 2 then 4- imo, it's just a lot easier to handle. I know you've already thought that through and I won't beat a dead horse, but it's definitely a marathon for the majority of people to play 4 large games of warhammer in a day... and I would have considered it had the schedule been less grueling (and I know you've tried to make it roomier- but it's still a bear).
I hope to make it out for the warmahordes, though! The guys I talked to had a great time with it last year.
Registration continues unabated by the holidays; 30% of our registrants so far are NEW/First Time attendees. Keep that in mind if you're a returning player in terms of acquiring tickets while they're still available.
Of note for this year as further improvement to the 40k events, we'll be adding SIDEBOARDS to every single 40k table. No more teetering your models on tables and what-not; you'll have a polished, properly prepared surface at least 1 foot wide next to your gaming table in all cases (which will also afford you more space in between the gamers to your left and right).
Hmm. While its nice to see a tournament scheduled this far out and it would certainly be easier to get to than many US tournaments. Plus its pretty dang close to ETC. Its just hard to plan that far out. I will probably not know to many definite plans for that part of the year until End of Feb. Is there a refund policy if I was to buy a ticket and at least a few months out find out I cannot make it?
Sideboards is a fantastic idea! I've grown spoiled with mikhaila's 8 foot tables (leaving 2 feet leftover for use as a sideboard during a normal fantasy game) and it's amazing how convenient it is. You don't know what you're missing until you've tried it .
Great news Mike! Sideboards make a HUGE difference. Not only for comfort of the players so they are not having to constantly reach under the table but also for game play. If your display board is right next to the table you will be able to play much quicker!
If you can bump the space to 2 feet wide, you will allow army displays to be dropped there.
The Mechanicon boards are quite well known for how awesome and integrated they are! You guys set one of the highest standards for polishing the nuances and details of the presentation of your event.
We're still working through the budget on whether it'll be 1' or 2' sideboards for this year ... always a tricky thing running what I think is now the 2nd largest pure wargaming convention in the country in terms of managing the high cost of our hobby and keeping rates as low as possible for our attendees (my partner often nicknames me "Santa Clause!"). I don't know HOW the boys at AdeptiCon manage the nuances and details of their vast quantity every year, but I suppose that's why I and 1500+ others of us keep going year in and year out.
Last year we cleared 400 attendees, and guaranteed the first 400 swag bags with their weekend badges. We'll be doing the same this year, so keep that in mind all ye registrants.
We also have some really big surprises coming up in 2012 on the vendor and sponsor front, so keep your eyes peeled here and on the website/blog.
Historicon and some of the other HMGS events are quite large, like Fall In and Cold Wars, you younger guys just forget about them since you play those new fangled games.)
That said, most historical cons aren't providing the scenery at all, the players and gm's bring it, so it's not a fair comparison at all to the work that's needed setting up tables for large events like Adepticon or Nova. Historicon is organized sort of like the sacking of Rome was organized. All the barbarians registered and got tags, but after that it's a free for all.)
Haha Mike you're right i always do forget! Not a big deal for me - superlatives are meaningless. My only point in the guessing was it's a Lot of people and logistics to manage affordably.
Didn't know that about terrain for those events either ... kinda fascinating it works in light of how much people complain about terrain they don't even have to provide.
Historicon is about as varied in terrain as you can get. Basically GM's and clubs sign up to run events, anything from tournaments to one shot, 2 hour games. They run from 7am to 4am. After midnight has a large amount of scenarios that involve drunken pirates and barbarians looting villages. Participants seem to drink a lot and get into character.) Every group shows up, sets up terrain, runs an event and tears down. Hundreds of events. People always packing stuff up, carting it in and out, and setting up for the next game.
I've seen clubs show up with 6' x20' gorgeous layouts to recreate a small civil war battle. Everything to scale and amazing to play on.
Then for Ancients tournaments you'll see a hundred guys playing just all roll out 6x4 matts or piece of colored tablecloth with some felt for the most minimal 'scenery' you've ever seen.
Scale ranges from 6mmm to 12" figures. Some games use rules you might have heard of like DBM, others are an unholy mishmash of rules from 40 years ago blended with homebrewed stuff. No event is the same in anyway. Flames of War is even considered 'not really historical' by many people attending, since you don't always play Germans vs. Allies, or on matching terrain.)
Definitely worth going, if only to see different scenery and games, and bring lots of alcohol. I think this next year is down towards Baltimore/VA.
Our January 2012 Newsletter includes tons of information on registration, new events, the opening of reg for all events, our new broad-sweeping Narrative 40k event, and other things.
THE 6th EDITION QUESTION
NOVA Open Position:
The NOVA decision at this time is to go forward with 5th Edition "unless GW releases a 6th Edition prior to June."
Our staff has been studying the question and we find the 6th edition release date (purported to be mid-summer) is based entirely on internet rumors, and a leaked PDF of limited authenticity.
The reasons behind the NOVA Open decision take into consideration many inherent problems that gamers will face with a release so near the convention itself. For example, our judges must be well-versed on the rules and, though they would double down in preparation, we believe gamer challenges would become overwhelming amid a 256-player, 4-day tournament. More importantly, we are concerned that few players have the wherewithal to replace or recalibrate entire armies (and then paint new models to matching standards) in such a short time frame.
If a 6th Edition is released before June, the staff will once again come together, review the work, and make a final decision. Please contact us at novaopen@gmail.com if you have any questions or concerns regarding this matter.
40KGT
NEW PLAYER NUMBERS CONTINUE TO RISE
Please do not assume
~ because you attended in 2011 ~
that we can guarantee your spot at 2012
We're having a TON of fun with the Narrative planning.
The story will not only develop by the day based on player actions, but by the year - the story will continue in 2013, kicked off from the climax of 2012.
Players whose HQ's/identified heroes perform at the highest levels or who do the most memorable deeds may in fact find memorials to their characters erected in city squares for the 2013 event.
As part of having the Narrative be set OUTSIDE of any given game universe, to better have people taking part in a unique story, it will take place in a near future Earth amidst an invasion from unknown sources; rumor has it an unfortunate on-looker even captured high quality video of the beginnings of the invasion of DC before his shots went permanently blank ... we'll be releasing this archival footage with our March 1 newsletter.
As the narrative-specific link indicates, in support of the Washington, DC setting for the majority of the conflict's battles/scenarios, we are busily recreating and LED-lighting scaled terrain pieces of the Washington Monument, Lincoln Memorial, White House, and many many more.
We'll also be incorporating a DC-wide scavenger hunt / historical/cultural riddle solving game aligned with the DC Metro for Saturday during the GT; spouses, friends, girlfriends/boyfriends and others not participating in the GT can participate on this while the day's events are ongoing, and earn scores that will contribute to the results of the Narrative.
Looking forward to seeing those gorgeous Orks of yours wading through the Reflecting Pool like Forrest Gump, Nick.
Im sad it got pushed back a weekend, as I dont think I will be able to attend based on prior obligations that weekend.
I will say that, novacon rekindled my love of competitive 40k. It was basically a dead hobby for me, and I planned on making nova my last real experience with it. Since it though, ive been highly active in my local tournament scene.
Glad to hear you had such a positive experience; hoping you'll find a way to sneak on over regardless this year, but totally understand prior engagements (especially "real world" ones!).
The Narrative is built to be awesome for all player styles as well - hardcore competitors and super soft casual fluff-armies all welcome and guaranteed to play against peers.
Updated current Invitational qual list:
1. NOVA Invitational 2011 - Nick Nanavati & Aaron Aleong
2. NOVA Open 2011 - Gabe Dobkin, Allan Hernandez & Tony Kopach
3. The Battle for Salvation 2011 - Eric Hoerger & Neil Gilstrap
4. DaBoyz 2011 - Nick Rose & Nate Stevens
5. The Mechanicon 2011 - Simon Leen & Mike Ludwig
6. Feast of Blades Invitational 2011 - Thomas Reidy (Rose already qual'ed) & Kenneth Boucher
7. 11th Company GT - Kyle Cox & Devin Schafer
8. The Conflict GT 2012 - Andrew Gonyo & Alex Fennell
9. Templecon - Bill Souza (Fennell already qual'ed) & Ben Mohile
Last year, the Colonial awarded free tickets but not Invitational spots. This year, GT's like the Colonial, Dark Star and others will be the source from which winners will be drawn to replace those who cannot attend from other events. It's tough figuring out which events qual and not, and in the future we will probably reduce the # of events awarded 2 spots to just the bigger GT's, and also once again reduce the # of spots awarded by the NOVA itself.
Terrain Update in link below. Please note - input is requested for alternate terrain formal layouts for Friday/Sunday to the one we "normally" use (seen in some photos in that post), but using the same terrain pieces per table enunciated in the post. If ya'll make a suggestion for a terrain layout we end up using, I'll comp your ticket.
Sales of tickets are starting to burn a hole in remaining spots, and 40% of the early birds so far are first time attendees ... Including multiple Australians. So each of those is taking a spot from one our last years attendees.
Also look for something really special for the March newsletter ... Or hilarious ... Or ridiculous. Staff won't let me talk about it yet.
First sneak peak at w.i.p. Monument project. Once finished these and over a dozen others will be fully lit as part of our evening narrative tournament.
We've sold over half our GT spots, with a recent uptick in sales. Looks like the regulars / repeat attendees are starting to register; until now half of registrations were first timers.
Narrative and GT ticket sales have started rapidly spiking in the last couple of days. Just a PSA for those getting ready to register.
Reminder that the Narrative rounds are 3 hours each, you can take one off voluntarily of the 4 (or drop your lowest), they're played in the evenings and do not conflict with the 40KGT; additionally, you are paired based in part upon list and past NOVA performance (where relevant), helping to ensure a casual atmosphere against peers on the list/skill front for the Narrative games, as part of a large spectacle involving LED-lit DC monument terrain and other goodies.
I'm so excited, Ed. I just can't hide it. You too, Andrew.
Wait I mean ... !!!!!!!
Will be blogging my $.02 on how to build for and win NOVA format, plus more on terrain and sample expected tables soon. Then like everyone else becoming nothing but an AdeptiCon megafan for a couple Weeks.
Just back from a fantastic 10th anniversary at AdeptiCon. The entire crew of folks who run that show needs a community-wide round of applause for not just another amazing show this year, but 10 years of amazing shows (and I've only been to 3 of them).
Truly the US meccha of tabletop wargaming.
Tons of stuff coming down the pipeline for NOVA, plus a registration PSA - we've had over 30 registrations in just a couple days, and people are starting to snag Narrative spots and Fantasy spots, plus 40k is accelerating toward full. Grab your spots while they are still available!
NOVA Terrain discussion in re: questions about what and why for 2012 terrain.
Following quoted Post is a reply to questions about our terrain format / reasoning on a blog (edited for context) ...
When we’ve finished our terrain project (and we’re getting there), I’ll put together a mock-up sample of what a board will look like.
Balance, fairness, and expectations are all important – I posted pics of our hills and other things leading up to the 2011 event, and posted write-ups on how I thought terrain should work. They weren’t clear ENOUGH, and so we’re working on that component this year.
More importantly, we didn’t have enough of what I thought were ideal center blockers when push came to shove last year, so we substituted the hills for a majority of our tables – and the hills were intended to be CORNER LOS blocking area terrain. This year, our 256 hills are exclusively dedicated to that task; there will be no hills in the center of NOVA tables (except for a couple of pieces that are mounted on smaller hill-like structures).
Another important note is that we do not produce cookie-cutter terrain. Every piece is an artistic work created by an unpaid volunteer, and we yield to the fact that with our terrain layout on every table being similar, there is a large component of our hobby that needs variety and good looks. In addition to the fact that terrain at 128 tables will always be knocked about some, even with aggressive judge management (more aggressive than last year will still have it), A GENERAL format/expectation will never be “perfectly” met at every table, and so your army should be able to handle some fluctuation. While you'll see most good players repeat performances in a wide variety of terrain layouts, it still CAN absolutely impact things, and knowing the general expectations helps, but one should moderate expectations with the reality that not every table will be identical.
So, while I don’t have a mock-up quite yet, for what a 2012 table will generally look like, here are some examples of each “component” piece from the 7 each table will have:
Two diagnoally opposed corners will have our LOS blocking hills: http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/7190/img1087f.jpg These block substantial LOS, and count as difficult area terrain. The bottom levels of these hills are cut from 1′x1′ 2″ tall pink foam. The top levels are cut from 6″x6″ 2″ tall pink foam. Some of these were longer than others, and those made "too large" center LOS blocking pieces of terrain.
These pieces will mostly not block LOS to even smaller vehicles, and will only block LOs to relatively small or bunched units. Where necessary, they’ll be “faced” such that any more significant solid pieces on them are faced “away” from the center of the table. That said, almost all the more solid pieces on these have holes punched or burned through them (butane torches make awesome terrain modifiers for pink foam!).
Every table will have two smaller area pieces (less than 1′ square) that basically do not impair line of sight at all, situated along the mid-sections of the long table edges. These will vary tremendously in form, but not in function. Examples are several pieces in the forefront of this picture:
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-9-sm4Db8jh4/T ... %2B021.jpg
Every table will have a dominant center-piece that DOES block LOS. Instead of the extra-long hills in the center like last year, the pieces are all placed on 1′x1′ bases, meaning they themselves are always a little bit less (at least) than 1′ wide or long. That said, they will block LOS to units, but instead of being so long that you have to practically cross the entire table to shoot things … you’ll be much more able to shoot around them if you take wide enough angles. You still won't be able to just deploy a stationary gunline, and shoot whatever you want ... so long of course as your opponent uses the center blockage tactically. He won't be able to block entire armies off, but should be able to at least get a unit or so to a position where it can't simply be torrented through coversaves *all* game. The intent is to provide some capability for opposing models (not entire armies) to cross some of the board without being easily prioritized and torrented. Yes, that does increase the variety of lists that can be taken. If you can shoot any unit at any time, and the only part of the game is cover, you are not playing the game by the description of terrain in the BRB.
Samples of center blockers built this past Saturday:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Nrl0rgVCxg4/T52VEH26wTI/AAAAAAAAAlI/LI0fZ5VbBYM/s1600/Tons+of+LOS+BLockage+7.jpg
I’m going to quote the key points here again, from Page 88:
“HOW MUCH TERRAIN?
As a general rule in Warhammer 40,000, the more terrain, the better the gaming experience. If you use too little terrain, games will be short and not very satisfactory, with too much advantage going to the player who gets to shoot first. For a balanced game, WHERE CLOSE COMBAT TROOPS HAVE A CHANCE TO GET INTO CONTACT WITH THE ENEMY WITHOUT BEING COMPLETELY BLOWN AWAY IN A COUPLE OF TURNS, we expect that about a quarter of the total playing area should have terrain on it. Snipped – Explanation of terrain piece size/%. commences here. –
In your terrain collection there should be a good mixture of types. An equal division between terrain which interferes with line of sight and provides cover (such as woods or ruins), terrain which provides cover, but does not block line of sight (such as barricades, craters, scrubland and low rubble), and terrain which blocks line of sight completely (such as hills, rocky outcroppings, buildings, etc.) makes for good tactical play. It is best to build your terrain collection with this in mind, otherwise the game balance could be seriously affected. Terrain that completely blocks line of sight is particularly important. Too much of it and your ranged firepower will be seriously impaired favouring assault troops; too little and the game will turn into a shooting match, with very little movement or tactical choices.”
So …
For our tables as we set them for the event, we drag all the pieces to a corner, and check to see if they cover about 25% of the board … they do. Note – the requirement is that the table have terrain on 25% of it … how much of the table actually is “covered” depends on every single shot, and how much terrain is in the way of it. So, we check off the % requirement.
“An equal division between … partial los blockage that provides cover (2/7), no los blockage that provides cover (2/7), and los blockage (3/7).” We’ve got all 3 covered, about as proportionally as we can with a 7-piece terrain layout. Alright, pretty good check here.
Further, we place LOS blockage at the center … to help ensure: “CLOSE COMBAT TROOPS HAVE A CHANCE TO GET INTO CONTACT WITH THE ENEMY WITHOUT BEING COMPLETELY BLOWN AWAY IN A COUPLE OF TURNS.”
Finally, in regard to the oft-repeated assertion that 40k is a “shooting” game … I’m going to reiterate the BRB/designer quote:
“Too much of it and your ranged firepower will be seriously impaired favouring assault troops; too little and the game will turn into a shooting match, with very little movement or tactical choices.” This is why the centerpiece is LOS-blocking, and not just area terrain; because if LOS blockage was only off to the sides, it wouldn't accomplish its primary function, of balancing close range and long range offensive capabilities.
Just wanted to drop in and let people know that we're running some FoW events at NOVA this year as well! We're having a one-day EW event on Friday, and a two-day LW event over Sat/Sun.
We got a chance to bring out some of the terrain last week, so incase you aren't subscribed to the newsletter, here's some sample pics. And if you aren't subscribed to it, why not?!
NOVA Open 2012 will be the first of three events to qualify primary spots on Team America for the 2013 40kETC. The other events are AdeptiCon 2013 and WarGamesCon 2013.
Additional information on the wild card qualifiers - Bay Area Open, Feast of Blades, and DaBoyz - can be found along with overall team data via
VIP Bags releasing June 1 will be available to first come first serve, only 50 for sale.
They'll be $40 more than the standard Weekend Badge, and include the Weekend Badge + standard swag bag contents, as well as additional swag bag contents.
The VIP Bags themselves are being donated by KR Multicase, and will be their Backpack 2, costed at over $75 retail:
So, for less than what the KR Backpack 2 would normally cost (not even counting the fact you won't pay shipping), you'll receive your $35 weekend badge, tons of regular swag, benefits (to be released along with the option to purchase on June 1), and special limited edition VIP-bag-only swag.
People who have already purchased a weekend badge will have an option to pay the difference to upgrade.
In addition to a TON of prize support, swag bag content additions, and other goodies donated by KR, anyone who purchases from KR the weekend of and week following the NOVA will get some SERIOUS free goods along with their purchase.
Basic swag bags already will contain numerous miniatures, bits, gaming aids and general gaming product, and are already at their most stuffed ever.
We're up to 7 vendors confirmed or near-confirmed this year, including the return of last year's popular booths with The Warstore and Spikey Bitz. We'll also be demo'ing several new and rising game systems this year, along with our full offering of events.
The 40kGT is starting to get much closer to selling out, so grab your tickets! They're selling at a faster pace than last year, and we sold all 256 before registration closed out in 2011.
Also, those who have, remember to get your hotel reservations pronto; the sooner you do, the more raffle ticket you get, and there's literally 0 cost to reserving rooms early ... THOSE are also reserving WAY faster than last year, and I want to make sure folks get their rooms.
Kelly is an old friend I grew up with, and a model in real life. She's pretty awesome, though ... and will be "in character" at the NOVA this year.
Tony was a great sport too, going along with the jokes and the pokes and making him out to look like a WAAC bling bling tourney dude.
We're totally stoked to have you out this year, regardless of event
Thanks for linking the movie, and everyone - check it out.
This thing was come up with by our staff ... they just demanded I get in it and put on stupid accents and act the parts they wrote out for me. The NOVA is all about our attendees, our staff, our sponsors ... the works ... and being a sandbox where anything can happen if you have the heart and mind for it.
Jon Pryts took the idea of doing a caricatured movie of our hobby making people laugh, and when he said "wouldn't it be cool if we did a movie," we actually ... well ... encouraged him and supported him in doing it!
Go on over, "like" it (or not, I guess), and I hope to see everyone at the NOVA too! I know Catbox and The Rage will probably also be there in character, if the appeal of Unicorn Boots isn't your cup of tea
Thanks again for posting it up man!
Automatically Appended Next Post: Actually, lol, that's not the link!
Ridiculous, yet oddly entertaining is about how I felt acting in it
I can't bring myself to watch it comfortably, though ... something about watching myself try to act is just plain impossible. We had a goofy, tongue-in-cheek "premier" night for the staff prior to release, where the fillmmaker and director/writer-of-script/comer-upper-with-idea guy talked about the process, and we watched it on a big projection screen ... and I basically stood in the back with drink in hand and facepalmed.
This hobby is awesome ... as is the support we've gotten for the NOVA ... it brought together an amazing staff of volunteers ... and has created a situation where what we want to do, we can do (all at 0 cost to our registrants', as we didn't use any registration funds to make the short).
Apparently I was watching the Dropzone Commander video before this one, whoops!
Hilarious and cool to know the background of it . Also edited my link, wish I could figure out how to actually embed a video in a post in this forum...
Edit: And figured it out so embedded it above for those who won't click on links
Sweet dude! Thanks for doing that; I have no idea how to do that sorta thing either.
For those keeping up, some more shots of our DC Narrative Terrain pieces, as well as images of completed 2012 Center LOS Blocker, and WIP of our airbrushed terrain for 2012
Is it safe to say that if 6th edition doesnt come out Saturday then NOVA will be 5th edition? This is really killing my prep for the tourny not knowing if my army that I have spent months on will be valid in the new edition.
What is your 6th edition cuttoff time? What I mean is at what point do you say not enough time we are going 5th regardless? Or if its 6th regardless? Or has this choice already been made?
Any info would be great. I like to prepare months ahead of time so I can test my lists etc. Same with the trios until we know we cant prepare. So again any info would be great on if or when there is a hard cap?
Disclaimer: Just in case this has already been answered somewhere in this thread my bad I never learned how to read well.
Grimwulfe wrote:Is it safe to say that if 6th edition doesnt come out Saturday then NOVA will be 5th edition? This is really killing my prep for the tourny not knowing if my army that I have spent months on will be valid in the new edition.
What is your 6th edition cuttoff time? What I mean is at what point do you say not enough time we are going 5th regardless? Or if its 6th regardless? Or has this choice already been made?
Any info would be great. I like to prepare months ahead of time so I can test my lists etc. Same with the trios until we know we cant prepare. So again any info would be great on if or when there is a hard cap?
Disclaimer: Just in case this has already been answered somewhere in this thread my bad I never learned how to read well.
Either way, 5th or 6th, you're kind of in the same boat. 6th's rules haven't been totally confirmed yet (unless I missed a leaked PDF somewhere), so all you can do is practice in 5th regardless. Winning team tournaments has always been more about communicating and tactics than rules sets.
The Invitational will be 5th, period.
If 6th Releases more than 1 month out, the Narrative will be 6th, period.
The GT is the big question mark. We've written about it on whiskey, and I'm up for input/discussion here as well, but the long and short is we'll know more soon.
If 6th looks to hit peoples' hands prior to July, there's a chance we'll go with 6th for the GT, unless the changes are just far too radical for players to fairly adjust.
If it looks like the rulebooks won't ship until July, we'll stick with 5th for the GT.
The long and short of all of this is - you should continue to prep for a 5th Edition GT, the last large 5th Edition GT ever, in fact.
If you wish to play 6th Edition at NOVA, you will have at least 4 rounds of opportunity to (the Narrative), in a setting that is built for both competitive and casual players (the Narrative orients its pairings around list and player preference).
For what it's worth, Troy, it also totally screws with our prep, haha!
If we do go with 6th, we will be unlikely to incorporate any extremely esoteric new rules compared to 5th (i.e. random terrain, bringing your own purchased terrain, etc.), which - if there's a TON of those things, and they're in the core rules, and not "back-book" appendices - means it's MORE likely we'll stick, with 5th out of fairness and fun in the GT.
Expounding on this more as I think through how to articulate it ...
Let's say randomized terrain is just "difficult or dangerous," Allies are in the back of the rulebook as a campaign or otherwise optional addendum, terrain LOS / etc. rules remain similar enough to cope, purchased terrain is an addendum or of limited capacity / benefit, etc. etc., and the real changes are more "how you play the game" and not "brand new things added into the game." Well, that'll be easier to switch to 6th with a 60 day window for player prep than not.
If, however, everything RADICALLY changes in terms of the CORE rules, we'll probably stick with a massive 256-player send-off to 5th Edition.
PS - For those still waiting on registration, we are a lot closer to sold out for the 40kGT than we were at this point last year ... and last year sold out.
Automatically Appended Next Post: PPS - It's in the works that a couple of top tier, grand prizes this year will be military-grade ballistic shielded (but still lightweight), upgraded figure cases. Literally one of a kind, hand-upgraded by a custom body armor / riot shield manufacturer. If you're military/law enforcement, ex-military/LE, or just a military/LE geek, these things will be shielded by next gen lightweight ballistic shielding that's tuned to stop extremely high powered rounds and impacts. They'll be the closest things to invulnerable figure cases ever owned.
Blackmoor wrote:
You had to pay for internet. Big deal, so you had to use your smart phone or go without for a weekend. Really, no internet for 3 days is such a big deal?
The only problem I saw with the hotel was that parking was a bit high.
Both of these are indicative of an establishment that's trying to nickel & dime their customers. I've traveled across the country on my bike several times, and even the smallest mom&pop inns offer free wi-fi these days. Pay extra to park at a place you're staying? They're being deceptive about the actual cost to stay there, and that makes people angry. They get away with it because business travelers, who probably make up most of their clients, don't care as they're expensing it.
I also noticed the 'pay-for-wifi' at the adepticon hotel last year, but oddly, there was free wifi in the lobbies and lounges. That makes me believe they're losing revenue from pay-per-view porn if they offer free wifi in the rooms.
Can I just say as a network engineer, there is a drastic cost difference between providing high-quality WI-FI in a lobby of a hotel and providing high-quality WI-FI for every room in an entire hotel?
That WI-FI infrastructure to keep the entire hotel blanketed and working for a place that big is a huge investment and a real cost which is nothing easy to dismiss. If they were to do free-wifi they would need to cover the cost somehow, probably with increased room costs.
When you are a 2 floor Motel 6, it is not at all a big deal to drop two hotspots and share off your business internet. There is no costs and makes people happy. For the Hyatt you are talking at least a 100k start up initiative with a substantial 10k a month upkeep fee for repair, data usage and staff to keep it functioning, and these are conservative estimates as I have done this exact thing for commercial offices and know the pain and cost of getting reliable Wi-Fi throughout a large building.
As for the 6th edition talk: I think there is no right answer unless 6th comes out basically tomorrow. It is hard to take an event which is based off of qualifiers on 5th and make it 6th, it doesn't make sense. But depending on the impact and time to practice, it may make sense for the tourney. And even if everyone is playing 5th all weekend, the narritive which is supposed to be fun allows people to maybe watch/participate in 6th.
Will the new Flyers be legit for any of the formats?
Unholy_Martyr wrote:Ballistic Glass/Materials for my miniatures? Epic level awesomeness and in no way shape or form do I want to see the price tag on those babies.
It IS epic! And it's being donated. So, priceless in numerous ways (not the least of which is that they'll be literally unique, and the most damage-resistant mini cases on the planet ... plus with soft foam inside due to KR's process that won't nick/damage your minis' extended bits).
Automatically Appended Next Post:
nkelsch wrote:
Redbeard wrote:
Blackmoor wrote:
You had to pay for internet. Big deal, so you had to use your smart phone or go without for a weekend. Really, no internet for 3 days is such a big deal?
The only problem I saw with the hotel was that parking was a bit high.
Both of these are indicative of an establishment that's trying to nickel & dime their customers. I've traveled across the country on my bike several times, and even the smallest mom&pop inns offer free wi-fi these days. Pay extra to park at a place you're staying? They're being deceptive about the actual cost to stay there, and that makes people angry. They get away with it because business travelers, who probably make up most of their clients, don't care as they're expensing it.
I also noticed the 'pay-for-wifi' at the adepticon hotel last year, but oddly, there was free wifi in the lobbies and lounges. That makes me believe they're losing revenue from pay-per-view porn if they offer free wifi in the rooms.
Can I just say as a network engineer, there is a drastic cost difference between providing high-quality WI-FI in a lobby of a hotel and providing high-quality WI-FI for every room in an entire hotel?
That WI-FI infrastructure to keep the entire hotel blanketed and working for a place that big is a huge investment and a real cost which is nothing easy to dismiss. If they were to do free-wifi they would need to cover the cost somehow, probably with increased room costs.
When you are a 2 floor Motel 6, it is not at all a big deal to drop two hotspots and share off your business internet. There is no costs and makes people happy. For the Hyatt you are talking at least a 100k start up initiative with a substantial 10k a month upkeep fee for repair, data usage and staff to keep it functioning, and these are conservative estimates as I have done this exact thing for commercial offices and know the pain and cost of getting reliable Wi-Fi throughout a large building.
As for the 6th edition talk: I think there is no right answer unless 6th comes out basically tomorrow. It is hard to take an event which is based off of qualifiers on 5th and make it 6th, it doesn't make sense. But depending on the impact and time to practice, it may make sense for the tourney. And even if everyone is playing 5th all weekend, the narritive which is supposed to be fun allows people to maybe watch/participate in 6th.
Will the new Flyers be legit for any of the formats?
I think we're inclined to allow the Flyers, but we haven't met to formalize that yet. None of them are very game-impactful, and the rules are readily available to everyone. TBD, but they'll for sure be legal in the Narrative.
The new flyers shouldn't even be an issue honestly. It's over 1 month prior to the event and they are official updates to the codex. GW doesn't do it often but they are official additions so I don't know why there is even a conversation. Until it was asked I didn't even think there was a possibility of them not being allowed
They are independent. I actually goofed a little earlier on, possibly in this thread, and stated the $75 was inclusive, it's NOT. The VIP are an additional rate.
Also, just an FYI, we've sold over half the VIP bags already! We DO NOT have more than the 50 for this year.
Plus, first of the DC Monuments for the Narrative complete!
MVBrandt wrote:Warmachine/Hordes have sold over 15 spots in the last weekend alone.
Get your tickets while you can!
A lot of the local Warmahordes players have been asking about a possible day pass, since most wouldn't be down for the entire weekend. It would be very popular for the Privateer Press crowd!
I think our local press ganger (Nate) was going to talk to you about this today, but figured I'd post it in the thread, too.
Although, I didn't realize there were still spots open for the 40kGT... that's a bit tempting, now that I know it's still open. Do you know about how many spots are left in it?
Nate didn't actually quite get to talking with me about it, though it's something we always bandy back and forth.
The general struggle is with finances; the NOVA is definitely still in a "start-up" mode, where attendee totals (~450-550) and costs roughly match our budget. So, I tend to fork out the next year in advance from my checking in terms of covering storage after September, and we operate at - where possible - a 3-figure loss instead of 4-figure. So, there's no technical barrier to day passes, but there's a bit of a financial barrier in terms of event space cost + operational cost for running wm/h vs. attendance total at present.
That gobbledeegook is what we bandy about in terms of determining what to do :p ... trust me when I say that my staff all call me "Santa Claus (that's actually the nickname they gave me)," because I'd just as soon have nobody pay a thing and donate $100 swag bags to every attendee ... I'm always the voice of "how can we make this cheaper?" That said, I'm not sure if we can this year.
I can say the weekend badge fee does certainly get you a pretty sweet swag bag, and we're trying by the year to make said swag bag far less 40k-centric (with notable success).
The 40kGT has well under 100 spots left at this point, and we sold about 25 ticket just this weekend. We're over 80% full, though, so I would not wait a lot to make that choice.
I'll chat with Nate about the day pass "idea," but it's also difficult b/c the WM/H event is also now more than 50% sold out, and we're expecting some significant PP presence/support to boot.
Thanks for the thorough explanation! That makes sense, and I guess it's a trade-off... you could draw in more warmahordes players with a day pass, but there would have to a be a signifcantly higher number to make up for the loss in people not purchasing weekend passes.
However, now that I know there is space in the GT, I think I will participate in it instead! It would be a great goal for me to finish out the army I started for the Adepticon team tourney.
I just PM'ed you a conversion question, as I didn't see where to submit those. Thank you
Haha I'm glad you enjoyed the impressions ... honestly wasn't my idea to do them! The guy who scripted it just knows me well :p
IN other news, Steve I got your question, and it's a go-ahead. I just need to craft the correct formal response for your PM box with some helpful tips. Been a crazy week at work but I hope to get to it today.
- Mike
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh, and for all - There are a dwindling number of tickets available for all events, none has quite sold out yet.
The VIP Bags have been selling like hotcakes ... only about 10 remain. Understandable sell-rate, considering you get a free KR Backpack 2 with the VIP purchase.
You'll have the glasses and shirts on sale seperately right Mike? I'm just not interested in another case with another size of foam. Sabol, GW, and Battlefoam are enough
MVBrandt wrote:In other news, Steve I got your question, and it's a go-ahead. I just need to craft the correct formal response for your PM box with some helpful tips. Been a crazy week at work but I hope to get to it today.
Awesome, I got the PM already! The tips are great and I should be good to go . Now to get painting to finish out the army!
I will be registering and paying early next week (I have a bunch of auctions ending Sunday). Already cleared the dates with my wife . Really looking forward to it!
I also hadn't realized it'd be possible to play in the GT and the Narrative campaign. Will check the times and see if I think that's something I'll be able to handle, or if I'll be all 40k'ed out after the GT
Based on a PM question, something that we should reiterate is what we half tongue-in-cheek call "Incidental Comp."
In evaluating and re-evaluating our format, last year we introduced a bracketing system that is oriented toward force-bracketing the field competitively, so that players are ALL participating in meaningful games as late as Rounds 5-8, regardless of their LIST and SKILL LEVEL.
What happens is, you play your first 4 games "in the field." 256 players compete for the first four rounds with no form of specialized pairing other than your WIn/Loss ratio, and your Win Path.
Win Path is the first key part of what we do, and it's done to enhance sportsmanship and fair play against peers. Effectively, you play people with the same W/L record, and who Won and Lost their games at the same time.
If you Win your first 2 rounds, and lose your third, your fourth game will be against someone who ALSO won their first 2, and lost their third.
This is especially helpful for players who lose their first game or two, and then win a game or two. You'll play someone who is having the same kind of tournament as you in terms of when they won or lost, and how their feelings mesh up with yours. Last year showed us quite visibly that this tends to encourage better sportsmanship, and more connection and common ground between players.
The KEY part of our "Incidental Comp" is that after Round 4, everyone's record is effectively reset.
People are bracketed based primarily on their W/L record into brackets of 16, and seeded within those brackets based upon their margin of victory/defeat so far. So, the 16 players who are 4-0 (if we have a full 256 after drops, which is actually unlikely) will play each other in Bracket 1, and the 16 players who are 0-4 will play each other in Bracket 16.
You DO NOT leave this bracket for the remainder of the event, which means that someone who goes 0-4 is guaranteed mathematically to go 4-0 during the Championship Brackets. EVERYONE who goes 4-0 in their subsidiary bracket wins honorrifics and prizes.
What this yields is a situation where you can bring ANY style of list you want, and still be playing meaningful games where tactics determine the win against people with similar list styles and skill levels during the key matches of Rounds 5-8.
Additionally, the Final Four in EVERY bracket advance to Day 3's Final Fours (Rounds 7-8). So, instead of it being only 16 people, 64 of 256 play in Final Fours on Sunday morning. Everyone else is welcome to continue to play within their brackets, or organized open gaming on Sunday morning, so no one is shorted games (we don't break all the tables down). But no one is required to labor through all 8 rounds either.
Finally, Best Overall is determined after Round 6 this year. Best Overall for the NOVA is only 50% determined by competition. So, if you're a gorgeous painter and manage to go 2-2 in your first Four Rounds, then 2-0 in Rounds 5-6 within your bracket of Peers, you have a legitimate shot at Best Overall, and our largest prizes.
To prove that point, last year Gabe Dobkin's gorgeous Cobra Commander IG army pulled off a 5-3 final record, and won Best Overall regardless. We truly keep everyone "in competition" to the very end, and you don't have to bring a copy-paste Netlist or a WAAC attitude to win Generalship honors and prizes at the NOVA.
The very top players with the most hardcore lists will still be competing for the top Best General prize in Bracket 1, but you can effectively play your way to an awesome tournament full of peers in Rounds 5-8 ... sort of whoever you are.
For those who need to know, the Narrative Event is also NOT competitive with the GT on the schedule - you can play in both, and they're worth checking out. Both, however, are rapidly running OUT of tickets.
I really like the sound of the layout, especially this part:
MVBrandt wrote:If you Win your first 2 rounds, and lose your third, your fourth game will be against someone who ALSO won their first 2, and lost their third.
Interestingly, I guess if you go 0-4 on Day 1, you'll have a better chance of playing on Day 3 than if you win a game or two (but not all 4) since the 4-0 and 0-4 brackets will be smaller than the others.
Actually, we bump the high-scoring 3-1's up to the 4-0 bracket ... so contrary to popular belief, you can actually win the NOVA or any NOVA format event after losing a single game, unless the event both sells out, and has a dramatic enough present wait list to cover drops. To give examples of how difficult this is, I believe AdeptiCon's 256-player champs this year had 256 sell out with a 50+ wait list, and wound up with 246 or so participants.
That said, we do try to limit the bottom bracket to just 0-4 players, for the sake of those participants.
I also hadn't realized it'd be possible to play in the GT and the Narrative campaign. Will check the times and see if I think that's something I'll be able to handle, or if I'll be all 40k'ed out after the GT
This is what I am excited about. I am gonna be tired though and still need to figure out what lists I am bringing (or bring the same list to both events)
I think it is worth a go because I suspect most narrative people will have just played hours of 40k and be in the same tired boat and ready for some casual facesmashing.
I bought one of the VIP bags on the 1st, but haven't gotten any kind of confirmation besides my reciept from paypal. Are you guys sending something out seperatly confirming out bag purchases?
PM me your name, if you will, so I can confirm you are good to go.
Nick - i think you're in the right place there in terms of what the Narrative will feel like (in addition to gorgeous terrain and a really, really cool and unique "non-hammer" story).
The other thing is, whatever your list is will influence who you play and why, so it's not like to be high stress in the "oh crap he's going to murder me!" department(s). Plus, three hour rounds and a one hour relax/get-food/briefing period.
Depending on who our final "celebrity" attendees are in the hobby for specifics (i.e. Black Library Authors vs. Well known gamers vs. Hobby / Vendor well-knowns), we'll have "Celebrity" Commanders giving the combat briefing and overall war status to their respective factions prior to the start of each round. Should get everyone in the playful and laid back mood, in addition to the various burned Newspaper Clippings that may be scattered around the hall, hinting at how the war is progressing from a public opinion p.o.v.
MVBrandt wrote:Andrew, that's still TBD. If 6th is actually releasing on the 23rd, very likely. If nobody will actually see copies until July, very unlikely.
Ah, I see. I think we should use a purely analytical way of determining 5th or 6th; that is, find the first person who shows up, blindfold him, spin him around a few times, and...
MVBrandt wrote:Andrew, that's still TBD. If 6th is actually releasing on the 23rd, very likely. If nobody will actually see copies until July, very unlikely.
Ah, I see. I think we should use a purely analytical way of determining 5th or 6th; that is, find the first person who shows up, blindfold him, spin him around a few times, and...
I would be fine all 6th. Think back and forth is going to be headache. I would hope most people going to an event like NOVA can learn the rules in a month enough to muddle through.
I put it up there but I'll put it up here too. I vote 6th for the main event. Heck, given a choice I'd vote 6th for the Invitational too if that was an option.
i would like to see the invite and GT be the same edition. Either edition at this point wouldnt bother me at all i would however prefer to not cross edition rule sets.
It might be worth asking folks in the invitational (via email?). If they all feel that way, perhaps everything could be 6th ed... 2 months is enough time, I think, to be ready.
I was glad that NOVA was going to maybe be 5th edition, but then I thought about it and there's no real reason why I should want it to be 5th. Go with 6th all the way!
I'll echo Hulk and zedsdead - One edition for the invite and the GT please. I don't care which one, but just one.
Honestly, if the invitational was done and dusted before the GT was over, I wouldn't have any issue with 5th for it and 6th for the GT, but the notion of playing 3 rounds of 5th, then 8 rounds of 6th, and then going back for 2 more rounds of 5th makes it not my idea of a great time.
That being said, it won't stop me from coming however you rule - all 5th, all 6th or a mix - but I will make my preference known.
+1 for RiTides suggestion of polling the Invitational players - EDIT - for the format of the invitational event.
I'll echo Hulk and zedsdead - One edition for the invite and the GT please. I don't care which one, but just one.
Honestly, if the invitational was done and dusted before the GT was over, I wouldn't have any issue with 5th for it and 6th for the GT, but the notion of playing 3 rounds of 5th, then 8 rounds of 6th, and then going back for 2 more rounds of 5th makes is not my idea of a great time.
That being said, it won't stop me from coming however you rule - all 5th, all 6th or a mix - but I will make my preference known.
+1 for RiTides suggestion of polling the Invitational players.
Cheers,
Nate Stevens
I don't think 256 players should have their tournament edition based on the wants of 32 players.
You can always not play in the invitational if you don't want to.
Um......They were suggesting polling the 32 players that are playing in the invitational to determine what edition they would want to play......in that portion of the event.
They wouldn't have any impact on the 256-man event. Hope that clears it up for you
I think you misunderstood. The wants of the 256 are based on Mike's (and company) opinion on what will be best for the 256, based on feedback. The invitational is not going to dictacte anything to the GT.
The wants of the 32 however, could be done in consultation with the 32. If the majority want 5th, then fine. If the majority want 6th, then fine. My vote (if given one) would be based on which edition the GT was using.
I'll echo Hulk and zedsdead - One edition for the invite and the GT please. I don't care which one, but just one.
This implied that they either both be 5th, or both be 6th. Mike so far has stated that the invitational will be 5th. I do not want to the GT to be 5th, least of all to make things easier for the Invitational players.
I'll echo Hulk and zedsdead - One edition for the invite and the GT please. I don't care which one, but just one.
This implied that they either both be 5th, or both be 6th. Mike so far has stated that the invitational will be 5th. I do not want to the GT to be 5th, least of all to make things easier for the Invitational players.
This is more so the invitational players hinting that they'd prefer that their event follow the lead of the GT, whichever way, rather than that they want the GT to mirror the invitational, but I see what you were talking about.
6th edition all the way. I was waiting for 6th to teach my girl to play so it will be nice to have the opportunity to teach her at the same time as prep for the tournament. Lots of practice games to be had
From the blog post about the Nova Open that Mike linked to above:
MVBrandt wrote:The question then becomes, do we stick to our contemporary plan of going with 6th edition if there's 2 or more months for players to prepare?
Right now, we're learning toward yes, but can't make a firm commitment until we get closer in.
...
Aside from the Invitational, which will remain 5th no matter what, all other 40k events would be in one system ... Narrative, Trios, GT.
So, keithb I think you have a great point that the preference for edition used in the Invitational should not effect the GT. However, from the rest of what MVBrandt posted, I don't think it will.
What he's been saying is that the Invitational will stay 5th, but that they are leaning toward 6th ed for the GT.
As carlosthecraven reiterated, I think it'd be a good idea to poll the Invitational players and ask them, if the GT is going to be 6th, do they really want to keep the Invitational as 5th ed? It seems like all the people posting here who are in the Invitational would prefer just one system (i.e., matching whatever the GT is decided to be).
I feel that Nova should be 5th edition. Playtesting and learning rules is only part of it. Painting your army to a showcase level if your aiming for best overall and best painted is really time consuming. Some of us have been working on our armies for awhile now and if 6th edition renders ineffective our current army, the release of 6th isn't leaving much time to convert and paint up a new army by the time Nova comes around.
I'm all for 6th ed for all of NOVA, including Invitational if I happen to make it again (1 chance left!). I think it'll be better to have a strong start with a new edition than a dying gasp with an old.
It's going to be difficult to get practice games of 5th; in my local area it already is. Only a few hardcore guys are still regularly playing 5th; other guys are concentrating on Infinity, Malifaux or Warmahordes while waiting for 6th to drop.
For the next two months we're all going to be playing 6th; switching back to 5th is going to lead to even more confusion and edition-mixing. Especially for anyone who's supposed to be playing in a 5th ed tournament AND a 6th ed in the same weekend. I really think at this point switching both makes the most sense.
That's a cool $100 with the weekend badge, and I may end up wanting to add the Warmachine/Hordes pass just for Sunday (can I do "open gaming" warmachine / hordes without a special pass?).
But definitely worth it to attend a GT that is actually close enough for me to drive to and not have to stay over and as a huge motivator to finish out my 40k army that I started for the Adepticon team tournament!
Mannahnin wrote:I agree 6th makes more sense across the board.
It's going to be difficult to get practice games of 5th; in my local area it already is. Only a few hardcore guys are still regularly playing 5th; other guys are concentrating on Infinity, Malifaux or Warmahordes while waiting for 6th to drop.
For the next two months we're all going to be playing 6th; switching back to 5th is going to lead to even more confusion and edition-mixing. Especially for anyone who's supposed to be playing in a 5th ed tournament AND a 6th ed in the same weekend. I really think at this point switching both makes the most sense.
It's going to be difficult to get practice games of 5th; in my local area it already is. Only a few hardcore guys are still regularly playing 5th; other guys are concentrating on Infinity, Malifaux or Warmahordes while waiting for 6th to drop.
For the next two months we're all going to be playing 6th; switching back to 5th is going to lead to even more confusion and edition-mixing. Especially for anyone who's supposed to be playing in a 5th ed tournament AND a 6th ed in the same weekend. I really think at this point switching both makes the most sense.
Based upon available release date information and feedback to date, we are EXTREMELY likely to move to 6th for the GT at present.
Additionally, the NOVA will now have HOBBY WORKSHOPS, presented by Secret Weapon Miniatures.
These will be ongoing throughout the weekend, covering several different subjects. Additionally, we've structured the schedule for workshops (to be released shortly) so that even those who are playing in the 3-day 40kGT can participate in each workshop during the course of their weekend schedule.
I'll add my voice to the chorus of 6th Ed people (at least for the GT). Being the first major tournament of 6th would be a feather in NOVA's cap, and will be a good shakeout of the new edition.
Some quick notes:
Are you in the 40kGT? If you are, do you want to participate in
a) Painting Competition ($100 cash prizes for each category, and raffle tickets for all submissions)
b) Narrative Event (6th Edition, standard games with unique but balanced missions, all contributing to an overarching story driven and narrated by attendees, with battles across LED-lit monuments from Washington, DC)
c) Trios Team Tournament (Three-man teams, that compete in 2v2 and 1v1 games each round against opposing teams, in a casual setting)
d) Hobby Workshops (given professionally by Justin McCoy of Secret Weapon Miniatures in 4 different categories, including weathering and drybrushing)
?
Well, you can participate in some or all of the above despite being in the 40kGT. Check out the schedule on the site.
Additionally, FOOD IS A MAJOR ISSUE for any wargamer participating in a busy convention weekend. We've worked hard to bring exceptional food items from the Hyatt at an affordable rate to gamers.
Options can be acquired a la carte, or "At best" by ordering a Weekend Meal Deal: for $68, you get Breakfast and Lunch on Friday, Saturday, and Sunday; very healthy portions as well.
Just the typical reminders here as we get close, also snag your hotel room.
WE GIVE AWAY $2,000 CASH IN INCREMENTS OF (1)$1,000 AND (4)$250 TO PEOPLE WHO STAY AT THE HOTEL, AT ITS RIDICULOUSLY LOW RATE OF $85/NIGHT.
The SOONER you reserve (which is free), the MORE raffle tickets you get, as a factor of the # of nights you actually end up staying, by the # of days in advance you reserve.
Use it as a checklist, while getting ready. Everything we are offering is selling at a faster pace than last year, or in the case of new offerings at a faster pace than last year's new offerings. Don't get left w/out a hotel room, or w/out space in the events and evening/side events you want to participate in.
Mannahnin wrote:I agree 6th makes more sense across the board.
It's going to be difficult to get practice games of 5th; in my local area it already is. Only a few hardcore guys are still regularly playing 5th; other guys are concentrating on Infinity, Malifaux or Warmahordes while waiting for 6th to drop.
For the next two months we're all going to be playing 6th; switching back to 5th is going to lead to even more confusion and edition-mixing. Especially for anyone who's supposed to be playing in a 5th ed tournament AND a 6th ed in the same weekend. I really think at this point switching both makes the most sense.
+1
I think everyone is sick and tired of 5th and they just want to move on to 6th.
As another Invitational Qualifier, I would like to see both the GT and the invitational be using the same rules set. This reduces the amount of confusion that will invariably occur over 13 combined rounds of 40k, and in my opinion will have more games decided by being able to make the most pertinent tactical decisions based on the most appropriate available information.
I know Mike sent out a survey for all the qualifiers and I'm pretty sure everyone who's posted in this thread has voted 6th or the same as the standard GT. Here's hoping most of the others agree.
Mike, will the tournament be changing the Force Org Chart? Multiple sources that have received the rulebook have confirmed that for 2000 points and higher, it's basically double force org, i.e. you can have 6 squads of long fangs, or ravagers, etc. I realize the book hasn't hit all of us yet, however I feel that if 6th edition is used, there will need to either be a restriction on the force org or simply a decrease in points level. I am all for 6th edition to be used, however.
That would be nice, as I like round numbers but not double FOC (Adepticon did the exact same with the fantasy big brawl tourney this year, 3K but not using "grand armies" rules, rather than making it an awkward 2999).
Edit: Spotted a typo for fantasy:
Infantry, swarms, and war machines are level 1
Monstrous infantry, chariots, and cavalry are level 2
Monstrous infantry level 3
Anything with the large target rule is level 4
I believe monstrous infantry were probably intended to be level 2, and maybe normal (not large target) monsters are level 3?
It's an interesting idea to make it less "TLOS"... might be a little hard to remember, though. Particularly with the typo
Went 2-1 at a recent Invitational qualifier tournament, went 3-1 at the last one So close! Good luck to all the qualifiers, maybe I'll make it in again next year.
We'll be rolling with sixth edition for GT, narrative, trios for sure. Invitational tbd but unanimously leaning sixth from attendees. Nuance rulings to come within the week.
Edition is looking very strong in terms of comparison to what we feared.
Looks like many mission components can be readily assimilated into proper tournament missions. Looks like allies can probably be played as is. Looks like there will be a FAQ to create for what GW hasn't done yet to the main rules (i.e. paladin/nob units allocating using Look Out Sir, and how to properly play things like exploding vehicles re: wound allocation ... things that have pretty clear answers but aren't yet spelled out).
Looks like fortifications and mysterious terrain/objectives will really be the biggest decision points ... we'll probably allow at least Aegis (with the rest being difficult to incorporate into a set-terrain tournament environment fairly, yet Aegis having the same AA capabilities), and probably will not turn on the optional rules for mysterious terrain.
We have a week of hard work to do, but it's looking like a much more 'ready' edition than rumor mongers feared, and much more tournament-friendly than some feared / hoped (outlook dependent).
I was pleasantly surprised by the new missions, warlord traits and mysterious objective traits. While the latter two are random, there doesn't seem to be anything too wacky or over the top. Even the football mission isn't as bad as most football missions I've seen. It's just grab the flag, not grab the flag and carry it to a deployment zone or something.
I was worried about allied Battle Brothers at first, then I starting seeing that the FAQs had errata'd wordings to prevent a lot of cross-codex abuses (like Grey Hunters or Deathwing benefitting from Sang Priest FNP). Overall looks pretty exciting.
Terrain interacting with Fortifications is a little tricky. I imagine you'll be keeping your terrain setup; alternating placement eats a lot of clock time and would require a lot larger amounts of terrain on hand to get decent boards. But normally Fortifications are supposed to go down first. I presume you'll tweak this to have Fortifications placed at the same time as you deploy, and just have to be more than 3" from another terrain piece? That seems simplest, and is about the only way to make sure they're on the owner's table half, as they're supposed to be.
That's generally I think the fair way to do it, Ragnar; so, probably tweaks in that direction; and, again, it's very difficult to fit Bastions, much less Skyshields and Fortresses of Redemption into balanced pre-set tournament terrain layouts. So, we'll see how and if we can fit those in fairly.
Some of the missions are NOT tournament-reasonable, such as a primary mission involving the killing of and scoring by Heavy Support and/or Fast Attack, and possibly the football (Though the restrictions on its ability to move help the mission's balance). We'll be playing the crud out of all of these with every dex in a blur of 40k before we finalize, and we'll have strong primers out that will be subject to change based upon further play.
Per you, Battle Bros worried me, but were largely fixed with FAQ's, though potent combos linger due to oversight or intent, such as Yarrick w/ 10 hammernators (still fearless / re-roll to hit on charge), Kyrinov creating fearless guard armies, etc.
Skyfire rule balances out things like Hydras so they aren't optional for all.
Flyers are balanced by either not being spammable, and/or being very limited in the movement phase (i.e. Night Scythes). Not giving the two Scythe types HOVER fixed a lot of worry from scythe-spam lists, b/c 90 degree turns and 18+ movement creates some very restrictive situations after the initial turn(s) of arrival.
Lots of testing and play to do. Thoughts, 'Broken' army lists, playtest results, etc. are all welcome here as we participate in our crash course, and get ready for the very first 6th Edition GT.
Sales have spiked huge since 6th dropped, and we're down under 50 GT spots left.
MVBrandt wrote:Some of the missions are NOT tournament-reasonable, such as a primary mission involving the killing of and scoring by Heavy Support and/or Fast Attack, and possibly the football (Though the restrictions on its ability to move help the mission's balance). We'll be playing the crud out of all of these with every dex in a blur of 40k before we finalize, and we'll have strong primers out that will be subject to change based upon further play.
Why are "the killing of and scoring by Heavy Support and/or Fast Attack" not tournament-reasonable? I thought that might make things quite interesting... and seemed to balance itself: if you don't take fast/heavy units, you can't use them to score/deny with, but you also wouldn't be giving up points if they were killed. Seems balanced enough?
I personally would either go full no fortifications than allowing the aegis defense line. Would be easier with just no fortifications at all. Just my opinions, but I would agree completely no allies makes it alot easier and the missions seem cool and easily integrated into current 40k along with the new deployment, it seems like a good rulebook.
That's not what MVBrandt said at all, though. He said that "allies can probably be played as is" and that "some of the missions are NOT tournament-reasonable" (which is what I asked about).
I agree with MVBrandt that at least the Aegis Defense Lines should be included if possible, as without them the AA guns with skyfire aren't available to most armies, which help balance out flyers.
I think having the Fast Attack / Heavy Support options that could count as denial/scoring depending on the mission (and could also be vehicles) might cause people to take more varied lists, rather than infantry machine... so that's why I'm wondering why that mission feature wouldn't be suitable for a tournament?
I agree with RiTides. The missions with scoring units other than troops make for monumental decision making processes out of list building and play style and pulls people out of their comfort zone which is what competition is about. If I wanted the same system over and over again and learned how to beat it I would go back to capming in Battlefield.
I also agree with at least the inclusion of the Aegis as deployable terrain as it is easy to position without too much manipulation as well as the Skyfire necessity that flyers will create (not gonna lie though, could make for some awesome army lists having to take flyers if you don't have Skyfire!)
Heh. I now have 2 months to paint another army for NOva, since mine got partially invalidated :( Don't know if I can do it.....will have to find another way to play....
RiTides/Unholy - I think you're already going to see monumental decision-making in terms of list building.
The problematic component is when match-up becomes the primary determinant on how much or what you can score, compared to people playing the same mission on tables next to you, in terms of fairness (which is what the NOVA tries to instill each round). As a result, while we haven't made decisions on missions and have a lot of playtesting ahead of us, you're not likely to see a simple presentation of the heavy support / fast attack scoring option/kill-point-additions so much as it being better woven into the missions.
We'll be weaving in the mission components one way or another, just - as with most every tournament ever - not by presenting them as simple one-off book missions. No worries
I'm sure people would love to make their hard-to-hit FA and HS fliers and flying MC's scoring units though, and that will probably show up in some capacity.
While i like the idea of allowing the aegis defense line (which is the only piece of terrain I'd vote for allowing), it'll have to be semi "restricted" in my mind, to a set of maximum dimensions.
As presented in the GW rulebook (they make a box with it), it's not so bad, though it does imbalance terrain density where it's deployed pretty heavily.
If you don't specifiy however, you're going to end up with people using them as 29 inch long lines, which might be a bit imbalanced. Mind you, I haven't tested it yet, and it's off the cuff at the moment.
God, my foot orks might be getting a painting after going thru the rules. Something about Ork artillery, tank bustas, and dakka jets....It's gonna be a rushed few months
Still waiting on securing a ride to sign up unfortunately. Hate driving long distance myself.
I agree with Claus that all fortifications should be allowed. It doesn't seem like anything other then IG Hydras and fortifications get skyfire so if fortifications are not allowed it going to be hard to deal wtih fliers.
Dunno about the new missions since I haven't played any games yet. I have always hated the football mission but the ability to get in a vehicle might help it a little for armies that have soft troops. Fast attack and heavy units scoring does favor armies with good fast and heavy choices but it might balance out as you can get victory points for killing those choices. Big question here is if zooming fliers or flying monsters can score? How does the random value objectives work will there be markers with the values on them that we can turn upside down?
Target does have a point about the Aegis line but it is called a line. I think the point of it is that you can buy it and deploy your platoon of guardsmen behind it to make yourself some cover in your deployment zone. That was an issue about playing infantry guard finding enough cover.
Kirika wrote:Still waiting on securing a ride to sign up unfortunately. Hate driving long distance myself.
I agree with Claus that all fortifications should be allowed. It doesn't seem like anything other then IG Hydras and fortifications get skyfire so if fortifications are not allowed it going to be hard to deal wtih fliers.
Dunno about the new missions since I haven't played any games yet. I have always hated the football mission but the ability to get in a vehicle might help it a little for armies that have soft troops. Fast attack and heavy units scoring does favor armies with good fast and heavy choices but it might balance out as you can get victory points for killing those choices. Big question here is if zooming fliers or flying monsters can score.
Target does have a point about the Aegis line but it is called a line. I think the point of it is that you can buy it and deploy your platoon of guardsmen behind it to make yourself some cover in your deployment zone. That was an issue about playing infantry guard finding enough cover.
Issue is even the rulebook says that player bought terrain counts towards table terrain density in the quarter where it is deployed. Does the tournament then pick up the pieces they built/made? Will the terrain density substitute be equal? Will all boards be even/fair now? Logistically, where does this terrain go so that it doesnt get damaged, and can the tournament be sure that it'll go back in the same place, or will terrain need to be reset every round by judges?
A lot of those logistical snafu's aren't too feasible is part of the issue.
Also, "aegis defense line" the word line is more in the sense of "it's a line of defense" not "it's a geometric line". If you look in the rulebook from the company that produces said kit, they build it in a rectangular box shape. :-p
I'm all for allies to be used. I'm sort of considering running an 8-psyker army just for kicks (6 thousand sons squads + 2 sorcerers) should be lots of fun.
I would definitely put "Should we include allies in future tournaments?" on a survey post championship. I'm curious to see how many Nob Bikers and Farseers make it to the table...
Maybe not as many, given that people will only have a few months to get those things painted... later tournies could be a whole different animal, though!
I've been dicking around on Army Builder for the last few days pretty constantly when I'm not at work and I've found allies rather hard to break and keep a solid core to an army.
Hulksmash wrote:I've been dicking around on Army Builder for the last few days pretty constantly when I'm not at work and I've found allies rather hard to break and keep a solid core to an army.
Same here. Some really cool Eldar / Dark Eldar combos but they are far from unstoppable. Adding Tau to a variety of armies looks promising, but again, not great in all circumstances.
Hulksmash wrote:I've been dicking around on Army Builder for the last few days pretty constantly when I'm not at work and I've found allies rather hard to break and keep a solid core to an army.
Same here. Some really cool Eldar / Dark Eldar combos but they are far from unstoppable. Adding Tau to a variety of armies looks promising, but again, not great in all circumstances.
That is what I have been doing. I have taken my Foot Eldar and just put in some DE warriors in place of my guardians. Hardly game breaking, but a nice upgrade.
Allies are a lot tamer than everyone had thought because of the battle brother rule, and the FAQ restrictions. There are still a couple of very good ones out there (Fateweaver+CSM) but nothing overwhelming.
It's suppose to be +1 ballistic skill for shooting at skimmers and jetbikes (was obviously intended for other flyer combat) but they didn't update it in the FAQ.
If it's a useless upgrade it's good to know before any ork player really starts digging into building his list
I can see NO forts out side the defense line provided the GW model is used
maybe pass on funky terrain types
aslo probably keep allies but lose 2 FOC ......no need for 9 dread GK lists or 6 annihilation barges crons
Hulksmash wrote:I've been dicking around on Army Builder for the last few days pretty constantly when I'm not at work and I've found allies rather hard to break and keep a solid core to an army.
Same here. One decent troops and an HQ tend to be at least 200-400 points, and that's a heavy price to pay just to add some other additional unit to an army. Then factor in the recent FAQs, which nerf many cross-codex rules sharing gambits...
Hulksmash wrote:I've been dicking around on Army Builder for the last few days pretty constantly when I'm not at work and I've found allies rather hard to break and keep a solid core to an army.
Same here. One decent troops and an HQ tend to be at least 200-400 points, and that's a heavy price to pay just to add some other additional unit to an army. Then factor in the recent FAQs, which nerf many cross-codex rules sharing gambits...
I say "mono codex" for the most part.
I got to agree. I have been trying to add a chaos marine detachment to my orks and I can't get out the door for less than 600 points... but I feel like all 3 units added by allies would bring large beneficial additions to my army but sacrifices core aspects of my existing army.
I think I am going to do orks only for the GT but use an ally for the Narrative or vice versa (if I can get some models done in time)
Mike, I realise it's probably too soon to the tournament to be proposing this, but how would you feel on lowering the points level of NOVA to say 1750? This does 3 majorly beneficial things and one other side thing:
1) Ends the controversy over using 1 FOC as opposed to 2. 1750 with one FOC is alot more straightforward than 1999+1 (I saw there was an argument on the NOVA forum going on about this).
2) Games finishing on time. With an entirely new ruleset, it's going to be fairly hard to get 2000 point games done. 1750 might be more manageable. People couldn't get games done last year at 2000 points with a rulebook that'd been out for several years. This one'll have been out for 2 months.
3) Lowering possibility of allies and fortification shenanigans. At lower points, you simply won't have as many points to spend on taking the more ridiculous combinations while still having a solid primary army.
4) Many people I've heard from are starting new armies for 6th ed and thus NOVA. This would make it much easier to build and paint said armies.
My thought: No matter how well you advertise such a change, someone will not get the memo.
I'd bet good money that there will be at least one person thinking the event will be held as a 5th ed tourney. A change to 1750 this close to go time, while a good idea, will bite someone in the ass. And while you might say that a person can just edit their list on the fly, we both know how well that goes in reality.
I'd prefer it to stay 2K, personally. 1999 wouldn't kill me, but 2K (i.e. MVB's "1999 + 1") is a nice round number
As Mike points out on the forum, it literally makes no sense that armies are fine with 1 FOC at 1999, but adding another point somehow requires a whole 2nd FOC.
GW should've scaled it, as someone suggested: every next 500 points opens up one extra slot in each category, or the like.
So, imo there's no "controversy" about allowing 2 FOC... I highly doubt we'll see any tournies doing so anytime soon, other than perhaps something like the Gladiator at Adepticon...
Tyranids allying with themselves is an interesting idea, but imo not needed. The fewer changes to the base rules at this stage, the better!
Widows - I'll get answers to that, and a lot more info about the Narrative scoring mechanisms and flow by - at the latest - early next week.
The Narrative is actually a REALLY exciting focal point for me and several others this year ... and I actually encourage EVERY GT attendee to play in it. You'll get to play more games, you'll get to play peers, and you'll get to play on some of the BEST LOOKING terrain pieces literally anywhere, fully LED lit and everything.
Plus the story is pretty cool.
In fact, just to re-link that while I get back to work here ... here's the intro teaser newsletter (read first) and teaser story (Earth perspecitve) for the Narrative.
Ugh. If you were to scale it down, 1850 and not 1750. Evan Lougheed came up with the 1750 number just to mess with people, not for any "scientific" reason such as game time etc. It's an awful point level....Every single army I've ever made at 1750 has lacked something, but once you bounce to 1850 it's all good.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Widowsbane wrote:Nova Staff,
I understand that the grand tourney is garnering time and effort right now... However,
Is the narrative still 2000 pts., single force org, IA approved allowed, etc...
Are lists still due by the 31st of July?
Are we to include if we would prefer the casual or competitive setting?
Thanks...
Wait what???? We're supposed to send lists in???????
MVBrandt wrote:
In fact, just to re-link that while I get back to work here ... here's the intro teaser newsletter (read first) and teaser story (Earth perspecitve) for the Narrative.
We'll formalize with Primers tomorrow most likely, but here's what we're looking at presently:
GT:
Allies - Yes
Fortifications - Aegis, Bastion ONLY (Fortress/Skyfire illegal due to logistics)
Points - 1999/1 (or, 1997/3)
Mysterious TERRAIN (i.e. Forests/Water Features) - NO
Here are a couple of things we're playtesting, but NOT decided on:
Mysterious Objectives:
Option A) - Standard, per rulebook
Option B) - Revealed at event, fixed as all of one type each round (i.e., Round 1 they're Skyfire, Round 2 they're Sabotaged, etc., but attendees would not know until event-time, so would not be able to tune based upon mission pairings)
Option C) No mysterious objectives at all
Option B is currently being tested
...........................
Warlord Traits
Option A) Standard per the rulebook
Option B) You select 2 of the 3 branches, and roll ONCE on each, then pick which of the 2 results you'd like to use (so, cannot roll twice on one of the trees)
Currently playtesting Option B
The NARRATIVE, with its three hour rounds, and pairings based upon list strength and competitive bent of the players, will be rolling with more like the following:
Points - 2,000; Additional Detachments legal
All random effects standard where applicable (i.e. Warlord Traits, Mysterious Objectives, Mysterious Terrain, etc.)
Allies - Yes
Forgeworld - Yes, no Super Heavies, always Ask before committing to any potential questionables
MVBrandt wrote:GT:
Allies - Yes
Fortifications - Aegis, Bastion ONLY (Fortress/Skyfire illegal due to logistics)
Points - 1999/1 (or, 1997/3)
Mysterious TERRAIN (i.e. Forests/Water Features) - NO
Here are a couple of things we're playtesting, but NOT decided on:
Mysterious Objectives:
Option A) - Standard, per rulebook
Option B) - Revealed at event, fixed as all of one type each round (i.e., Round 1 they're Skyfire, Round 2 they're Sabotaged, etc., but attendees would not know until event-time, so would not be able to tune based upon mission pairings)
Option C) No mysterious objectives at all
Option B is currently being tested
...........................
Warlord Traits
Option A) Standard per the rulebook
Option B) You select 2 of the 3 branches, and roll ONCE on each, then pick which of the 2 results you'd like to use (so, cannot roll twice on one of the trees)
Currently playtesting Option B
I think all of this is spot-on with what I'd like to see at the event... so, awesome . Option B for both items still being considered look quite reasonable to me.
B & B look good. Though honestly I think straight book Mysterious Objectives would be fine. Especially since, with pre-measuring movement, you'll almost never be forced to get hit by a booby-trapped objective.
We may GO with straight Mysterious. We really are trying to LIMIT the changes this first time around.
We're also ensuring that the Narrative (which is designed to appeal to competitive gamers as well, and doesn't require a different points size) is almost identical to the book with very little exception (if any), so that people can play unfiltered 6th as well, across 3 hour rounds.
Until GW says FW is no longer generally opponent permission / out there (and I know there are rumors that's going to happen), I can't jump the gun on the GT and legalize it.
That said, FW is totally legal for the Narrative. Give me a day or two and we'll have an answer/update for Trios as well.
I would start by PM'ing MVBrandt with specifics (several good, large pictures, a description of the army and conversions, and what it counts as... particularly addressing if base size and weapons are correctly represented, as they will need to be).
This is what I did, and I got a clear answer on what to do with my counts-as models (knights counts-as dreadnoughts) . Now just have to finish painting the rest of them... only 7.5 weeks left!
My name is Kevin. I work with Mike on the NOVA as the score master. I'm also helping with paint judging and anything else that the group needs. I just wanted to say hello and say how much I'm looking forward to this event.
The NOVA's Quarters Goal will be changing so that only Scoring and Denial units count toward the points totals for capturing Quarters.
Fortifications look like Aegis and Bastion, where the Aegis must be a continuous loop. No placing fortification selections on existing terrain pieces.
Random tidbits to chew on..
A note that we are actually selling Hobby Seminars by Secret Weapon Miniatures at a pretty good pace. We've scheduled them such that ANYONE can participate, even if they are in the 40kGT, Warmachine/Hordes main events, Flames of War Tournaments, Infinity Tournament, and/or Fantasy GT. Check it out, they're affordable and awesome ways to up your artistic game.
Additionally, the NOVA Open's independent paint competition is now a QUALIFIER for the Crystal Brush at AdeptiCon 2013. The winner will have their airfare covered by Cool Mini or Not for flight to and from AdeptiCon 2013.
MVBrandt wrote: where the Aegis must be a continuous loop. No placing fortification selections on existing terrain pieces.
AdeptiCon 2013.
This is a good clarification as I was thinking I could give cover to my entire army with one Aegis kit. Someone running multiple small units who only needs a 2 section to cover an entire unit, I could see it getting out of hand really quick. So it sounds like a good restriction.
The NOVA's Quarters Goal will be changing so that only Scoring and Denial units count toward the points totals for capturing Quarters.
Fortifications look like Aegis and Bastion, where the Aegis must be a continuous loop. No placing fortification selections on existing terrain pieces.
I dont understand the Loop part of this, in the rules it says that each section must be touching at least 1 other section of the Line, It would be impossible for someone to stretch this from one side to the other. There are 8 pieces, 4 long and 4 short What was the reason for the continuous loop ruling?
The NOVA's Quarters Goal will be changing so that only Scoring and Denial units count toward the points totals for capturing Quarters.
Fortifications look like Aegis and Bastion, where the Aegis must be a continuous loop. No placing fortification selections on existing terrain pieces.
I dont understand the Loop part of this, in the rules it says that each section must be touching at least 1 other section of the Line, It would be impossible for someone to stretch this from one side to the other. There are 8 pieces, 4 long and 4 short What was the reason for the continuous loop ruling?
This seems weird to me too. Mike stated that his goal is to change as little of the rules as possible, but this runs contrary to the existing rules and completely changes the function of the Aegis Defense Line. Prior to this, the changes made to 6th thus far seem to be in an effort to eliminate small sample size variability from determining game outcomes (e.g., eliminating mysterious terrain), but this seems to be an attempt to alter game balance.
It's a change we're "fenced" on ... and one we're likely NOT to stick with for this year.
That's to say, our current playtest is with closed circuit Aegis, but it's not something we're feeling is necessary, given the inability to place fortifications on existing terrain anyway, in relation to how our standard tourney terrain is in place.
Danny - NOT an attempt to alter game balance; more unwieldiness / etc., and also just checking out various permutations through what has been a pretty exhaustive(ing) test period so far
just a small clarification on the ruins rules. As per the book we are to use ruins with bases as 4+ for the actual ruin and 5+ for the base its on ? Having played a number of games im wondering if this is a good idea in a tourny setting. Keeping the whole thing as 4+ ruins seems to be a simple solution.
Also regarding the ageis. having used it a few times im on the fence as to keeping it a closed loop. It does restrict it a little but with placed terrain (the format ive used) its not really an issue. you could go either way.
Maintaining the feel of Hammer and Anvil without 256 wargamers running around 128 tables and side boards constantly due to issues related to a deployment zone.
zedsdead wrote:mike, in the modified hammer and anvil deployment the full short table edge is used for the purposes of reserves and fall back ?
This is a good catch / question. Play by Hammer and Anvil rules for now, and let us know how that works out.
As to your point on Ruins ... I don't know that I want to modify the rules, though I can understand confusion with people arguing about whether the actual ruin is obscuring or whether the unit is simply on the base.
FYI to all - feedback here is going to have an impact on the final missions, when it is positive / constructive, and especially when backed by some playtesting.
Each member of your three person Team Tournament Team must select one codex and bring:
• 1,000 Point Army List (1 HQ, 1-3 Troop, 0-1 Elite, 0-1 Fast Attack, 0-1 Heavy Support)
2,000 Point Army List (Standard Force Organization)
That said - this year armies will interact per the Allies Matrix of the new 6th Edition Rulebook.
Edit - Pause on the army interaction; we'll have to nuance it to ensure people who have "Desperate" or "Illegal" allies and no time to change aren't screwed over by the release.
Anticipate something like either:
1) If not Battle Bros, then Allies of Convenience for all
2) If Battle Bros, then ... Battle Bros
zedsdead wrote:Mike,
just a small clarification on the ruins rules. As per the book we are to use ruins with bases as 4+ for the actual ruin and 5+ for the base its on ? Having played a number of games im wondering if this is a good idea in a tourny setting. Keeping the whole thing as 4+ ruins seems to be a simple solution.
The base is 5+, but the vast majority of the base is behind the ruin, making most of the base a 4+. All that does it stop you from getting full benefit from the ruins by having a few millimeters on the forward lip of the base.
I agree with keeping the whole thing 4+ as it will cut down on arguments and speed up game play. It doesn't matter that it doesn't say to do that in the core rules...it doesn't have tournament rules, so streamlining for a smoother tournament is no big deal.
For the Trios, even though I won't be playing, I would vote for allies of convenience just be cause it levels the playing field.
They cut the parking in half for NOVA attendees, now $12.50/day. Also, just fyi, there's metro nearby serviced by a free Hyatt shuttle, and rooms are only $85/night.
MVBrandt wrote:They cut the parking in half for NOVA attendees, now $12.50/day. Also, just fyi, there's metro nearby serviced by a free Hyatt shuttle, and rooms are only $85/night.
There is also a parking garage on the other side of hotel that's $10/day, but it's a pain to get to. I'll probably go with the $12.50/day option.
MVBrandt wrote:They cut the parking in half for NOVA attendees, now $12.50/day. Also, just fyi, there's metro nearby serviced by a free Hyatt shuttle, and rooms are only $85/night.
There is also a parking garage on the other side of hotel that's $10/day, but it's a pain to get to. I'll probably go with the $12.50/day option.
You could just hope for another Hurricane; on-street parking was pretty easy to find last year and is free on Sunday (possibly Saturday too).
spyguyyoda wrote:
You could just hope for another Hurricane; on-street parking was pretty easy to find last year and is free on Sunday (possibly Saturday too).
Yeah, but then I have to contend with the wrath of my wife being home alone in a hurricane. I'll gladly pay the $10.
Can we please not invoke wishes for another hurricane, or earthquake?
The Hurriquake was the single least pleasant thing about the 2011 NOVA.
Seriously, in all of our feedback from the awesomely-responded-to survey we took, the single biggest negative comment ... not kidding ... was people jokingly asking if we could please not schedule the NOVA on the same weekend as a major Hurricane this time.
I had a look at the primer and I hope to get a few test games in. However, I would like some additional clarity on the dimensions of your terrain pieces. I don't expect that they are all the same, but I imagine there is a range that is typical. I skimmed your blog but didn't find exactly what I am looking for.
Specifically, the hills are X*Y with a height of Z? (I current;y have 8*10 hills with a height of 1".) The scatter area terrain is X*Y? (I currenty have 6*8 forests in place) The 3 ruins are X*Y? (I currently have a 10*10 LOS blocker in the middle, and 6*8 ruins in the outer corners.)
And just to be clear, we can expect LOS blocking terrain in the middle?
All of the terrain pieces will be closer than not to 1'x1' ... the middle pieces in particular are mounted on 1'x1' bases.
The hills, while irregular, are going to be of roughly that size (sometimes a little larger/longer), and the scatter pieces will be cut down from originally 1'x1' pieces, but more oddly shaped.
The ruins in the corners opposed to the hills are also on 1'x1' starting pieces, with some but not too major variability.
The hills are all 4" tall at some points, and sometimes a tad taller ... comprised of a minimum of 2 stacks of 2" thick pink foam as their base construction material. They are not that tall uniformly across their form, but you can consider them meaningfully LOS blocking, and with enough structure to provide a fair bit of "4+" ridgeline/crestline cover per the BRB. While none will generally cover a flyer at all, many will, from at least some angles, block LOS to a backfield land raider, artillery piece, etc. This does mean if you have a gunline army with no ability to get "across" the field with ordnance, outflankers, deep strikers, etc., your opponent will be able to hide at least something across the field.
The center buildings are generally also significantly LOS blocking, and while their shapes and structures are not all uniform, most of them can be used to shield your army from some firing angles.
The corner ruins only partially block LOS, and will only be able to fully block individuals from infantry units from most angles ... while you might find an odd angle at which you can hide a rhino or chimera behind them from certain points of the field, that will by far not be the case in 90% of the situations.
The area pieces in the middle of the long table edges also generally do not block LOS.
So, 3 significant LOS blockers, 4 area/ruin pieces, all of them substantial in size.
In addition to our Painting Contest (independent of the main events) yielding several hundred dollars in prizes, the Best in Show will win free airfare to the Crystal Brush at AdeptiCon 2013, paid for by Cool Mini or Not.
In support of this, expect some cool prizes on top of the already-hundreds provided by two of our attendant companies - Secret Weapon MIniatures, and Grex Airbrush.
Narrative registrations are spiking, with the primer releasing later on this afternoon/evening
Trios is ahead of last year's pace at this time
Fantasy has already sold its sell-out point last year, but we have room up to 64 this year; updated/revised packet will go up shortly (first draft needed some edits)
Warmachine/Hordes has already sold all its sell-out point spots equivalent to last year, with attendees from across the US at present; it has also been bumped up to 64 spots for this year
Infinity is in its first year, and has sold 13/16 spots ... grab these quick (Sunday only, can attend w/ just a Day Pass)
There are 8 VIP bags left, now loaded with TONS of unique and limited product, valued at over $200 at this point
Flames of War is in its first year, and both of its 32-man tournaments are beyond half sold out
Secret Weapon Miniatures Hobby Seminars are starting to sell quickly, especially Friday courses. If you are playing in the 40kGT, or any other major event, you can still attend ALL FOUR HOBBY SEMINARS if you so choose. Justin McCoy is a HIGHLY regarded instructor, who has given courses across the country, including at AdeptiCon
The Paint Competition at this point has 30 individual miniatures submitted; prizes now include donations from Grex Airbrush, and are VERY generous; top prize includes hundreds in value, AND airfare to AdeptiCon 2012, paid for by Cool Mini or Not
The site's registration page has been revamped to be easier to navigate (finally!):
http://novaopen.com
I believe they allow FW models to be used, if they are using the rules for a regular codex unit which is physically very similar, and don't cause confusion. For example, if you had one Leman Russ model in your army, and chose to use a cool LR variant from FW to represent a normal Russ, that would usually be allowed as it wouldn't cause confusion, but would look cool.
Each member of your three person Team Tournament Team must select one codex and bring:
• 1,000 Point Army List (1 HQ, 1-3 Troop, 0-1 Elite, 0-1 Fast Attack, 0-1 Heavy Support)
2,000 Point Army List (Standard Force Organization)
That said - this year armies will interact per the Allies Matrix of the new 6th Edition Rulebook.
Edit - Pause on the army interaction; we'll have to nuance it to ensure people who have "Desperate" or "Illegal" allies and no time to change aren't screwed over by the release.
Anticipate something like either:
1) If not Battle Bros, then Allies of Convenience for all
2) If Battle Bros, then ... Battle Bros
OR
1) All are Allies of Convenience
1000 point list have to be out of the 2000 point list? (ie using units that you were taking in the 2k list), or new list, same codex?
MasterSlowPoke wrote:What exactly comes with a seminar registration? Do you just watch a lecture or do you get something to hands-on practice with (and keep afterwords)?
I'm not sure what the seminars will be at the NOVA, but my gut tells me these will be a "make and take" format. I've taken a seminar with Justin before (secret weapon minituares) at Adepticon, and you got a model/base/something to work on and get some hands on coaching, with paints/materials provided. I'd GUESS that this will be the same/similar, but I'll let Mike chime in for the final word on it.
Edit: For what it's worth I took that seminar on a bit of a whim, and had a blast/learned a lot. I'd def. do it again given the chance.
1) Mannahnin's answer is correct, more or less. You can use FW models, but not the rules, for the GT/Trios. That's to say, you could use the FWGUO as a Great Unclean One if you wanted, provided proper base sizes / yadda yadda. You can use FW models AND rules for the Narrative, with the exception of Super Heavies and Gargantuans.
For the Narrative, there is both a Tactical Track and a Cinematic Track, so if you're more of a competitive player and want to get in some 6th Ed games with a FW-inclusive army, you can do the evening Narrative alongside the GT, and get 4 games using such a list in.
2) For the trios, your 2,000 point "singles" list needs to be from the same codex as your 1,000 point "team" list, but it does not need to use the same building blocks; it can be completely different.
3) The seminars are explained in more detail on the site - from there:
Hands-On Weathering -
Justin “misterjustin” McCoy, founder of Secret Weapon miniatures, will introduce participants to weathering pigments and give them an
opportunity to use pigments to weather a class exclusive 50mm base. Topics will include:
* What is a pigment
* What to look for when you buy
* Pigment weathering vs. painting
* HANDS-ON rust weathering
* HANDS-ON brick and dirt weathering
* Mud and muck weathering
DEMO Weathering Techniques:
Justin “misterjustin” McCoy, founder of Secret Weapon miniatures, will spend two hours introducing participants to a wide range of
weathering techniques working as quickly as he can to cover:
* Order of application
* Acrylic paint techniques (sponge, salt, hairspray, etc.)
* Weathering pigments
* Pencils
* Oil paints
DEMO Basing Your Models:
Justin “misterjustin” McCoy, founder of Secret Weapon miniatures, will share some of the techniques he has used to make hundreds of display
and gaming bases from 20mm singles to army display boards in this two hour demonstration class. Topics will include:
* Display vs. gaming – approach
* Display vs. gaming – materials
* Theme
* Composition
* Order of application
* Painting, pigments, and scenics
DEMO Airbrushing
Justin "misterjustin" McCoy, founder of Secret Weapon miniatures, will introduce participants to the basics of airbrushing models, from small infantry to large vehicles, in this two hour demonstration class. Topics will include:
* Airbrushes, compressors, and canned air
* Airbrush and compressor components
* Basic airbrush techniques
* Proper paint dilution
* Spraying techniques
* Pressure and flow regulation
* Airbrush cleaning and maintenance
I believe the DEMOS are more lecture-based, while the Hands On is DEFINITELY something where you will work with a model yourself. I'll see if I can route Justin himself to eyeball this for proper descriptions or explanations.
As Target shared, a lot of the people who've had courses with McCoy have had an AWESOME time; that and his very responsive nature were big reasons for why we pursued him as a sponsor and for giving demos.
Our Paint Competition will be awarding a Grex Tritium TG Pistol Grip Airbrush to EVERY Category Winner (that's a $300 MSRP highly-reviewed/regarded airbrush), in addition to vouchers from SWM, and numerous other prizes. It's cheap to get into, and it's getting in on the first year - if you've got models you think are half decent, submit them in for judging!
How do you wish narrative lists and playstyle submitted?
I am kinda bummed out, I intended to get a new unit converted and painted for this event using the narratives, but I don't think I will have time. I will barley get my transports finished in time :(
Another question, this time on painting evaluation for the GT and the Invitational around the inclusion of allies.
In terms of presentation, will you be considering the look of the allied section as a stand alone evaluation, or will you be considering how well the look of the allies blends together with the parent army.
For example:
I have some nicely painted Orks. The scheme revolves around traditional green skin, blood red and tin-to-chain metal, with blacks (with blue-grey highlighting) and browns filling out the rest.
I have some nicely painted Tau: The scheme revolves around Grey (grey scale), purple, and black with scaley green highlighting and orange accents.
Both are well done (IMHO), but they don't blend well (or at all really) because the schemes are radically different. Is the lack of cohesion likely to harm my painting evaluation?
TBD on that question, Nate. Leaning that they are judged independent of each other for purposes of cohesion, but I'm going back and forth on it with our appearance judge to feel out what is most fair / appropriate given the time constraints.
For certain, next year, it'll be that your allies have to have some kind of connection to your primaries in terms of appearance.
I'll have to say, after reading the Necron portion of the FAQ---I think that your clarifications are pretty elegant and thoughtful. In particular, I liked the way you handled the Death Ray.
One minor criticism if I may--is the wording of the MSS clarification. While I think the way you handled it is fair (Although it makes MSS substantially weaker and considerably less useful), the wording is pretty chunky. Why not;
"Mindshackle Scarabs vs. Challenges--Determine who is affected by MSS immediately at the start of the Fight sub-phase, before any challenges are made. Once a model is selected (either by being the only model in base to base or randomization if more than one more model is in base to base), the MSS affect will be applied regardless if the bearer subsequently moves out of base to base with that model. By rule, once the model is involved in the challenge, all subsequent MSS rolls will be resolved only against that model (as that model is the only model considered in base to base contact)."
Or something along those lines.
I didn't see a clarification regarding the Assault Vehicle rule and wrecks--are you allowing units the ability to assault the player turn after they are wrecked (Unlike normal transports)?
How is NOVA going to handle Digital only rules? Are you guys going to FAQ that Hypeprphase swords are 'AP3' and Ork Fighta Aces can hit flyers at BS 3?
The digital flyers seriously upgraded how Dakkajet works and people seem super fighty about digital updates right now. I am planning to bring a dakkajet so I want to make sure I can shoot flyers with BS 3 without having to bring my iPad or get sucked into a philosophical debate about GWs business model.
It might be good to add all differences (can only think of two) to the FAQ.
Hulksmash wrote:Not really unkillable, just tougher than he used to be
Which was nearly unkillable
Now your just being silly. Fateweaver never made it past 2 turns from him landing when I played against him and while flying is scary if you're already adjusting for 6th he won't be nearly as scary
Hulksmash wrote:Not really unkillable, just tougher than he used to be
Which was nearly unkillable
Now your just being silly. Fateweaver never made it past 2 turns from him landing when I played against him and while flying is scary if you're already adjusting for 6th he won't be nearly as scary
Psh Posh, 2 turns from him landing, and typically an entire army was firing at him to down him. Now he gets hit on 6's, so about ~50% less, meaning he lives quite a bit longer. Fateweaver before was a game where it took your army ~2 turns to kill fateweaver, then the rest of the game to go after the army that you'd largely ignored in lieu of fateweaver. It's a big difference. And we all know how games typically went where you didn't kill fateweaver before turn 4/5.
Will there be some sort of clarification about Powerweapons? Either that they must be model correctly and no changing power weapons game to game (so if someone has an axe they have an axe the entire tourney?)
Since lists will say 'powerweapon' peoplehave already begun saying it can be anything they want game-time decision. Physically modeling it may help lock people in but that doesn't stop people who have multiple sarges in their case to pull from.
nkelsch wrote:Will there be some sort of clarification about Powerweapons? Either that they must be model correctly and no changing power weapons game to game (so if someone has an axe they have an axe the entire tourney?)
Since lists will say 'powerweapon' peoplehave already begun saying it can be anything they want game-time decision. Physically modeling it may help lock people in but that doesn't stop people who have multiple sarges in their case to pull from.
Most of the tourney's I've been in since 6th have required that if you have a Power Weapon a) It has to be modeled correctly, and b) you must dictate on the list what it has as a weapon (so no changing game to game, as you state)
nkelsch wrote:Will there be some sort of clarification about Powerweapons? Either that they must be model correctly and no changing power weapons game to game (so if someone has an axe they have an axe the entire tourney?)
Since lists will say 'powerweapon' peoplehave already begun saying it can be anything they want game-time decision. Physically modeling it may help lock people in but that doesn't stop people who have multiple sarges in their case to pull from.
Woah! Who said they could choose at the time of the game? you have to have the weapon modeled to 'choose' and most folks/TOs are saying you need to have it on your list as well.
MVB said that you must specify on your list which one you chose over on the Nova forum.
Automatically Appended Next Post: That's crazy that people would magnetize or have multiple models to swap between games. How rude.
nkelsch wrote:Will there be some sort of clarification about Powerweapons? Either that they must be model correctly and no changing power weapons game to game (so if someone has an axe they have an axe the entire tourney?)
Since lists will say 'powerweapon' peoplehave already begun saying it can be anything they want game-time decision. Physically modeling it may help lock people in but that doesn't stop people who have multiple sarges in their case to pull from.
Woah! Who said they could choose at the time of the game? you have to have the weapon modeled to 'choose' and most folks/TOs are saying you need to have it on your list as well.
MVB said that you must specify on your list which one you chose over on the Nova forum.
I am saying I can't find that inside the FAQ and this was the first thing people have begun trying in 6th edition events. If I missed it in the FAQ, then I apologize.
I don't want to end up playing against people who tell me their swords are axes or change swords to axes when they see my list. The issue is if the list says 'power weapon' and he says it is an axe, I have no way of knowing what he played it as last game. So I am just asking it be clear. (and Digidex changes also be clear as people are complaining about digidex changes)
Me: Is it permitted to field DCA (or any model) that is listed in the Codex as having a Power Weapon with any of the listed variants in the Main Rulebook?
MVB: Yes. You must clarify what each model has as required on your army list, however. It's in the mission packet rules, but will be in the FAQ as well.
Hulksmash wrote:Well I'll be darned. You decided on RAW for the FMC's....Didn't see that coming
You'll also have to add how your going to handle the new Daemon units issues once they come out on Friday
Mostly looks good. I don't see anything to crazy but I'll read it again later to make sure.
New Daemon units do need some rulings. Not sure whether to go with RAW or not, given WD. If they're written as clear additions to / revisions to existing entries in Caemons, I'm inclined to go with 5++ saves, Eternal. Could use someone linking me the entirety of the rules pics if they're somewhere; I'm running around and droiding it today, and it's tricky to navigate through forums/etc.
Additional answers appending ...
Automatically Appended Next Post:
AgeOfEgos wrote:I'll have to say, after reading the Necron portion of the FAQ---I think that your clarifications are pretty elegant and thoughtful. In particular, I liked the way you handled the Death Ray.
One minor criticism if I may--is the wording of the MSS clarification. While I think the way you handled it is fair (Although it makes MSS substantially weaker and considerably less useful), the wording is pretty chunky. Why not;
"Mindshackle Scarabs vs. Challenges--Determine who is affected by MSS immediately at the start of the Fight sub-phase, before any challenges are made. Once a model is selected (either by being the only model in base to base or randomization if more than one more model is in base to base), the MSS affect will be applied regardless if the bearer subsequently moves out of base to base with that model. By rule, once the model is involved in the challenge, all subsequent MSS rolls will be resolved only against that model (as that model is the only model considered in base to base contact)."
Or something along those lines.
I didn't see a clarification regarding the Assault Vehicle rule and wrecks--are you allowing units the ability to assault the player turn after they are wrecked (Unlike normal transports)?
/The FMC ruling surprised me
Yeah, I need to word MSS clarification better. Long and short is, MSS randomization and Challenge issuance don't conflict and are both effectively simultaneous. Challenge(s) are issued while MSS is being randomized. There's no need to fully resolve the challenge process and move models around prior to finishing the other things that happen at start of fight sub-phase alongside the issuance of challenges.
I'll clarify Assault Vehicle rules and wrecks; good catch for something to do ... can you please post that up as a question in the NOVA rules forums? It helps me make sure I don't miss these things when I do the final revision! This applies to EVERYONE.
The FMC ruling is a necessary evil in my book; too much inference otherwise. That said, Flying Circus daemon armies are still eminently handle-able, so I'm not concerned about its impact on results and such. Frankly it further reinforces some of the meta changes to the type of army you should be bringing in the 6ed environment. That thought process is indie from the rules decision.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
nkelsch wrote:How is NOVA going to handle Digital only rules? Are you guys going to FAQ that Hypeprphase swords are 'AP3' and Ork Fighta Aces can hit flyers at BS 3?
The digital flyers seriously upgraded how Dakkajet works and people seem super fighty about digital updates right now. I am planning to bring a dakkajet so I want to make sure I can shoot flyers with BS 3 without having to bring my iPad or get sucked into a philosophical debate about GWs business model.
It might be good to add all differences (can only think of two) to the FAQ.
I don't know if I'm going to specifically RULE on digital rules. I'm not surprised that there are people out there who would try and prevent you from using them, but they're not going to have any sway over rules judges at NOVA. Your digital rules are the most up-to-date ones for the dex. Roll with it.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Blackmoor wrote:
Hulksmash wrote:Well I'll be darned. You decided on RAW for the FMC's....Didn't see that coming
Yay! Unkillable Fateweaver!
Borat-style NOT. I will say, the best way to tackle him isn't necessarily straight dakka anymore. More like, ground then assault ... the raw damage output of a flying circus is downright anemic.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Grimwulfe wrote:If Fatewaever is flying can he still give rerolls to units on the ground?
Yup, by RAW. He can also hide behind crap too. It's kinda weird. While I anticipate a GW rewrite via FAQ, and if that happens pre-NOVA we'll go with it, I'm not willing to outright change the rule myself.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Target wrote:
Hulksmash wrote:
Target wrote:
Hulksmash wrote:Not really unkillable, just tougher than he used to be
Which was nearly unkillable
Now your just being silly. Fateweaver never made it past 2 turns from him landing when I played against him and while flying is scary if you're already adjusting for 6th he won't be nearly as scary
Psh Posh, 2 turns from him landing, and typically an entire army was firing at him to down him. Now he gets hit on 6's, so about ~50% less, meaning he lives quite a bit longer. Fateweaver before was a game where it took your army ~2 turns to kill fateweaver, then the rest of the game to go after the army that you'd largely ignored in lieu of fateweaver. It's a big difference. And we all know how games typically went where you didn't kill fateweaver before turn 4/5.
nkelsch wrote:Will there be some sort of clarification about Powerweapons? Either that they must be model correctly and no changing power weapons game to game (so if someone has an axe they have an axe the entire tourney?)
Since lists will say 'powerweapon' peoplehave already begun saying it can be anything they want game-time decision. Physically modeling it may help lock people in but that doesn't stop people who have multiple sarges in their case to pull from.
Clarification is in Primer packet already, and will be in FAQ final revision.
Power Weapon = as modeled, but you must model it appropriately and put it on your army list.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
RiTides wrote:Yes, they have it down somewhere. Can't remember if it was in the FAQ or mission packet, but it was explicit.
This is random from another thread where RiTides posted, but in general for folks - look for Kill Points to play a suppressed role in most of our missions for the final packet (8/1 release). This is in response to the base mission change where only 1/6 missions is a Kill Points one. You can anticipate that the effect will be along the lines of the margin required each round (may / will be variable), and the frequency with which Kill Points is the Primary or Secondary, vs. the Tertiary, of our goal tiering.
Bringing pure MSU can still get you in hot water when going up against a deathstar type army, but it will more reflect the impact of the new game rules / missions, and less 5ed. Keep in mind that the changes to scoring/denial (which we've also implemented in our Quarters goal) has a MUCH more meaningful impact on whether raw transport / vehicle / msu spam is better than Deathstar armies than KP did ... and make sure you're adjusting your own playstyles and army lists accordingly. It's a new wild world out there, and fortunately or unfortunately NOVA (and a couple others) are right on the frontier for 2012.
Hulksmash wrote:Well I'll be darned. You decided on RAW for the FMC's....Didn't see that coming
You'll also have to add how your going to handle the new Daemon units issues once they come out on Friday
Mostly looks good. I don't see anything to crazy but I'll read it again later to make sure.
New Daemon units do need some rulings. Not sure whether to go with RAW or not, given WD. If they're written as clear additions to / revisions to existing entries in Caemons, I'm inclined to go with 5++ saves, Eternal. Could use someone linking me the entirety of the rules pics if they're somewhere; I'm running around and droiding it today, and it's tricky to navigate through forums/etc.
Additional answers appending ...
I'll get you a copy when I get a chance. Don't have it loaded at work. The main issue I see is that RAW they don't have any save....
I laid it out on the forum but the way it reads is that the new Daemons have the Daemon special rule. The problem is that since they go into the 40k codex the daemon rule defines their noted saves as being invulnerable. The FAQ also adds Fear to the army entry page but the book still uses a different Daemon rule. And the entries in the photos don't have a save noted. Meaning by RAW they wouldn't have a save. Intent would likely be the 5++ but that's not what it says. I bring it up because with the new units being pretty dang sweet people will be using and some slightly.....neurotic people may make an issue of it.
MVBrandt wrote:This is random from another thread where RiTides posted, but in general for folks - look for Kill Points to play a suppressed role in most of our missions for the final packet (8/1 release). This is in response to the base mission change where only 1/6 missions is a Kill Points one. You can anticipate that the effect will be along the lines of the margin required each round (may / will be variable), and the frequency with which Kill Points is the Primary or Secondary, vs. the Tertiary, of our goal tiering.
Bringing pure MSU can still get you in hot water when going up against a deathstar type army, but it will more reflect the impact of the new game rules / missions, and less 5ed. Keep in mind that the changes to scoring/denial (which we've also implemented in our Quarters goal) has a MUCH more meaningful impact on whether raw transport / vehicle / msu spam is better than Deathstar armies than KP did ... and make sure you're adjusting your own playstyles and army lists accordingly. It's a new wild world out there, and fortunately or unfortunately NOVA (and a couple others) are right on the frontier for 2012.
Thanks for addressing that... and it's good to hear! Not that I am going pure MSU or anything, but since I have a lot of drop pods, and with how fragile vehicles are now, kill points being dominant would sink my battleship...
Mike, how are you ruling Soul Devourer on C:CD MCs? It makes the daemon "count as wielding a power weapon", so if the model had a staff, would that mean they have +2 strength for 10 points?
Ok since the FMC is consider to be swooping even after I ground it. Does that mean every time I shot at it after I ground it the first time I dont get the out of control rule again? or because you are enforcing the Swooping and every time I hit it they have to make the grounding roll?
Lists will be due for the 40kGT day of this year. We'll have all lists double checked (minimum) by the end of Friday. Presubmission at this large a scale just proved unwieldy last year - people change their lists after submission (and reasonable fun-time hobby event organizers know if someone changes their list post-submission and shows up at event with something different, you can't/don't tell them they don't get to play), or simply don't do it in time, etc.
That said, presubmission is required for the Narrative (when you register, or August 1, whichever comes latest), and may be required for other events - check individual event rules.
So I'm a bit confused. Can heavy support fliers count for quarters in mission 1, and fast attack fliers claim/deny objectives in mission 2? I didn't see any clause forbidding it, but I thought I read on the whiskey blog that fliers will "*never*" score?
Did I miss something in the packet or do fliers indeed score under these circumstances?
)
just that 4 games in a day is a lot. Being local, I would have preferred to have 3 games on Saturday followed by 3 on Sunday, with the "champions" playing on Monday.
so embedded it above for those who won't click on links 
