Now that the 5th edition codex FAQs are out, it is time to compile a list of questions that remain unanswered by the FAQs (or that are still confusing despite the FAQ). This list can then be edited and submitted to GW or used for your own personal house rules, etc.

The point of this thread is to submit questions that get frequently asked and/or particular situations that are confusing to you personally. Whether or not you feel these questions can be easily answered by the RAW isn't the point. If you'd like to point out that you feel a question is covered by the existing rules feel free to do so, but in a polite manner and be done with it. If anyone would like to argue the validity of a question, feel free to start a separate thread to do so (violators will have their posts deleted from this thread).

Just off the top of my head I know that a lot of codexes don't have the weapons on their vehicles classified as either turret, pintle, sponson or hull so anyone who wants to take the time to catalog all those instances would be doing a world of good.

Thanks to Stelek for giving this project a kick-start. Most of the initial questions in this thread were submitted by him in individual threads. I only combined them because I was afraid certain threads would get lost in the shuffle and several people had already started to de-rail his threads by arguing the validity of his questions rather than working towards providing more questions.



RULEBOOK
Do codex rules for weapons, wargear, and equipment take precedence over those found in the main rulebook like Smoke Launchers do?

Page 68 BRB "When moving a tank, the player can declare that the vehicle is going to attempt a tank shock attack instead of moving NORMALLY" Please define what moving normally means. For example, is moving Flat Out a normal move? Is moving in the shooting phase with Star Engines a normal move?

Can Ramming be declared at any time other than the movement phase?

The rules state "Ramming is another form of a tank shock" does this mean that if a vehicle can Tank Shock, that it by all rights can declare a Ramming action? Were the rules for Ramming intended to be a exclusive of the rules for Tank Shock and the reference to Tank Shock nothing more than a guide to how you go about executing the action?

What is the maximum strength attack a Ramming attack can make?

What happens if your Ramming Attack takes you off the table?

Can passengers fire from an open topped fast vehicle if it moves 6-12" - Trukks, DE Raiders?

If a deep striking skimmer lands in difficult terrain, does it take a dangerous terrain test? Drop pods, same thing. And what about a unit from a drop pod disembarking into difficult terrain (they ARE considered to be deep striking, after all)?

Charge reaction and True Grit or Furious Charge (may have name wrong, the space wolves +2 on charge rule), how do they interact. Do all units with Countercharge get +1 attack on the charge reaction or do their own special rules for charge bonuses or lack thereof take precedence?

any clarification on weather or not you can stack rending and low ap hits on single models or do you have to spread them out like instant death taking away whole multi-wound models?

If you have a IC in one unit, and that unit is destroyed during the shooting step; and there is another unit within 2", does the IC join that unit? If so, when? His shooting, his assault?

In Spearhead missions, can reserves enter play anywhere along your board edge, or just on the half used for initial deployment?

In Dawn of War missions, can transport vehicles be deployed with other units or IC's inside? Or is the requirement strict so that you could deploy EITHER an HQ unit OR their transport, but not both?

Can units with both Infiltrate and a Dedicated Transport use the Outflank move to deploy?


BLACK TEMPLARS
The vow, "Uphold the Honor of the Emperor" states: "No unit may benefit from cover for Saving throws." Since intervening models are considered cover that provides a 4+ save, does this mean that with this vow Black Templars models may not take "intervening cover saves?" Also, does this mean that it is useless to Go to Ground when taking this vow?

The vow Abhor the Witch, Destroy the Witch talks about Concealment. Since I cannot find any such rule in the 5th Edition Rulebook, am I right in assuming that this part of the rule no longer exists?

Cenobyte Servitors are listed in the Wargear section of the Codex. They lack the superscript "T" that indicates what items models in Terminator Armor may take, which would suggest that Chaplains in Terminator Armor may not take Cenobyte Servitors from the Wargear section of the book. However,in the Black Templars Chaplain Entry, under the heading "Reclusiam Command Squad," the Codex clearly states that a Chaplain may be accompanied by 3 Cenobyte Servitors from the Company Chapel. In short, are Cenobyte Servitors pieces of wargear, or separate entries that do not count toward the Wargear limit and that can be taken even when the Chaplain is in Terminator Armor?

Cenobyte Servitors are described as being part of the Chaplain's entourage. They and the chaplain form a unit (despite the fact that the Chaplain can still attach to and detach from other squads), does this mean that the Chaplain cannot be picked out when in assault so long as he is accompanied by his Cenobyte Servitors? When attached to a unit, do the Cenobyte Servitors have to remain within 2" of the Chaplain? Or do they just need to maintain coherency with the same unit the Chaplain joined?

If the Emperor's Champion is taken in an army of 750 points or less, is he still required to take a vow, despite the fact that the army will not benefit from it? Is he must, does the EC at least benefit from his own vow, or are those just wasted points?

The Black Templars Bike Squadron subheading for "Options" says that up to three Initiates may exchange their Bolt Pistols for one of the following, yet the Weapons subheading mentions only the bike with twin-linked bolters and frag grenades. Is this an omission? Do Black Templar bikes count as having an additional close combat weapon as a result of this?

The Black Templars Land Raider Crusader is listed as having a Transport capacity of 15 models, while both the BA and DA codex list the Crusader as having a capacity of 16. Despite this discrepancy, both versions may carry 8 Terminator-armored models. What, then, is the capacity of Land Raider Crusader?

Despite the unofficial consensus regarding Righteous Zeal's interaction with Go to Ground, how exactly do the two work together? If you Go to Ground to benefit from a cover save, yet still take casualties, do you still make a Righteous Zeal check, even though you are technically pinned at the time of rolling? If you pass your RZ check, do you still get to make your D6" consolidate move as per Zeal, or are you stuck in place as per Go To Ground? If you get to make your Zeal move, do you no longer have to abide by the Go To Ground restrictions in the next turn?

Under the Emperor's Champion entry, in the text following "Slayer of Champions," it states that the Emperor's Champion must move into base-to-base with any enemy IC that is involved in the same close combat. My question is this -- if an IC takes a Retinue that makes him an upgrade character, does the Slayer of Champions rule no longer have any affect?


CHAOS SPACE MARINES
Can Chaos Dreadnoughts that Fire Frenzy opt to run instead of firing?

Can you force a unit to take multiple dangerous terrain tests if lashed in and out of dangerous terrain?

Does attaching Kharn to a unit let the unit ignore Psychic powers? Or is his null rod not the same as the Imperial version?

When a Sorcerer with Lash of Submission is attached to another unit and wants to use the Lash and have the unit he is attached with fire also, when does the effect of the Lash go off:
A) After rolling to hit but before wounding?
B) Anytime before or after you roll to hit and wound with the rest of the squad?
C) Before rolling to hit?
D) After rolling to hit and wound?
E) Any time you want during this units eligibility to fire?



DARK ELDAR
When you tank shock, since you cannot Ram other vehicles--do you stop at any vehicle, or fly over any other vehicle as if they weren't there?

The Webway portal is still unclear on whether the person deploying it can move in the movement phase on the turn it is deployed or not, the two common interpretations are that you have to remain motionless in both the movement and shooting phase(and not shoot) to deploy it, or that you merely deploy it instead of performing any other action in the shooting phase and can do this after moving in the movement phase.

The FAQ makes it clear the talos is a Monstrous Creature, it states it uses the Monstrous Creature rules "rather than skimmers" does this mean it no longer uses the skimmer rule in the Dark Eldar Codex or merely that it is not a Skimmer in the sense of the Core Rulebook?

Additionally, with the Talos' special rules for attacking a vehicle it is clear that it only rolls once for armour penetration, however, is this roll 2d6 as per a monstrous creature, or 1d6 since the special rule makes no mention of a special roll for penetration?

The FAQ states xenospasm grenade effects are cumulative if fired by the same unit, however the xenospasm is a 1 per army wargear, what is this entry in the FAQ supposed to be demonstrating?

The Nightmare Doll allows the player to force a reroll on the dice for table edge, is this piece of wargear now useless or can it be used to force a reroll of the dice off for table edge still despite this now also governing who deploys and moves first?

The FAQ says that a character on Hellion skyboard cannot charge 12" as the drugs cannot make the board go faster, what does this mean for a character on the skyboard assaulting into cover, do they still make a difficult terrain test as per normal jump infantry due to the fact that they "cover the last few yards of an assault on foot." or do they make a dangerous terrain test as a model on a bike would and assault 6" always?

Are Poisoned Blades (and therefore also Scissorhands) Poisoned Weapons granting them a re-roll for wounding when the user's strength is equal to or greater than the target's toughness as per the latest Core rulebook? What about Agonizers?

Can a Tormentor Helm be used as a pistol to fire in the shooting phase?

What happens when a Wraithcannon is fired at a Grotesque, do the wraithcannon wounding rules or the grotesque Feel no Pain rules take priority, or alternatively are the grotesques only wounded on a 6 which is also an instant death?

Can a Wych Dracite be used in a Dark Eldar Kabal army (one led by an Archon/Dracon)?

The restrictions for a Wych Cult army given with the Dark Eldar Wych Lord prevent the use of Dark Eldar Lords which include both Archons and Dracons, however the rules for a Wych Cult given with Lelith Hesperax only restricts Archons, allowing Dracons to be used. Is one of these more correct or does Lelith simply have different restrictions on her Wych Cult?

Were Wych Weapons designed to halve the opponent's weapon skill when the opponent attacks Wyches, or were the weapons designed to halve the opponent's weapon skill when attacking and being attacked by Wyches?

As a "skimmer", how far can a Talos move in the movement phase? It seems to me as though they should simply be treated as "jetbike" rules.

How do webway portals effect models attempting to leave or fall back?

Was Screaming Jets (written with the 3rd edition rules in mind) missed with regard to the latest FAQ? Specifically, should passengers aboard a DE transport be allowed to disembark when Deep Striking as a result of taking the Screaming Jets vehicle upgrade?


ELDAR
Can models that suffer from a 1 on Wraithsight, can they consolidate when a unit with the USR "Hit and Run" disengage from combat, leaving them the only combatants?

Runes of Witnessing versus Shadow of the Warp, you can suffer a perils of the warp on double 1 or 6?

Skyleap, it was intended with this ruling that Eldar players have a GUARANTEED deep strike drop on turn 5 onto objectives and hope the game ends?

Vibro Cannons can be fired through a close combat? Can this trigger morale checks in any way? If so, how are they resolved?

How does Starfire Engines work for the purposes of Ramming? Does this mean that they can Ram twice a turn (Move 24" in the movement phase and 12" in the shooting phase)? Does this mean they must use their Starfire Engines and move up 36"?

Are Eldar Psykers allowed to use their pshychic abilities while in transports? (I tend to think no.) (The question comes because it doesn't define Eldar psyker abilities as "shooting" anymore.)


IMPERIAL GUARD
Where can Lasguns on a Chimera fire? i.e. what is their fire arc?

Does the template used at range by a Hellhound Inferno cannon have a static orientation (short end pointing at origin, large end away), or are players allowed to rotate in order to cover "as many models as possible"?

Does an IG platoon rol a single die for Reserves or one die for each unit in the platoon. (Codex vs rulebook question)?



NECRONS
When do you actually remove Necron that have failed their WBB rolls?

When you move models that are eligible for a WBB roll, and they move out from under a Tomb Spyder's range which gave them the eligibility in the first place--are they then destroyed immediately?

Where do the models awaiting WBB rolls go if the Necron unit falling back they are 'accompanying', is assaulted and destroyed or falls back off the table?

Can Wraiths Turboboost?

Can I move a Monolith move, a unit not move...and still use the Monolith's ability to teleport the unit? This isn't in the answer given, which seems to cover every other situation but this one.

Can I use cover saves against the Deceiver's attack against my LD?

Can a Monolith teleport a falling back unit forward?

When a Monolith deep strikes, is it considered to be moving at crusing speed even though it can't normally move this fast?

Monolith teleport. The FAQ has got this all confused, I think I understqand who can move after teleporting through the Monolith. But since it seems to be acting as disembarkation from a moving vehicle, can a unit assault after teleportation if either the unit or Monolith moved prior to the teleportation?


ORKS
Can an Ork Trukk (non-Tank) equipped with a Reinforced Ram execute a Ramming Action?

Does a Deff Rolla cause an extra D6 S10 hits when it executes a Ramming action against a vehicle?

When releasing Bomb Squigs while inside a vehicle, when you roll a '1' does the vehicle that the unit releasing the bomb squigs count as the closest? If yes, what vehicle facing should be used to determine the direction of the attack?

If a skimmer is rammed by a battlewagon with a deffrolla and dodges, does it still take d6 s10 hits?

deffrolla causing d6 str hits on vehicles it hits?

if it rams a transport and they disembark can they be clipped by the ram as it passes by? what is the actual tolerance around the vehicle to determine if they are hit?

since units are on the table, would grotsnik in a transport be subject to his rage effects?

does the shock attack result that hurts only the model under the center hole scatter?

If an Ork Wierdboy is in a vehicle and that vehicle moves over 6" what happens during the shooting phase when the wierdboy has to roll for a psychic power and he gets one of the powers that act like a shooting weapon?

If an IC is turned into a squig by Zogworts curse, do you have to kill the squig to get the VPs for the independant character?

"One Scalpel Short of a Medpack" states that Grotsnik will always move as fast as possible towards the nearest enemy, assaulting it if possible. Does this require him (and any unit he is attached to) to run in the shooting phase? If so, can the player choose to shoot if he believes that Grotsnik and his attached unit are already in assault range? Would the player need to measure this to be sure, and then run if not already within 6"?


SPACE MARINES
Can Librarians cast Veil of Time when deep striking? The Chaos FAQ allows Warptime to be cast and it is essentially the same power cast at the same time in the game.

which version of power of the machine spirit is correct? there are different versions depending on which codex you're reading


TAU
Do drones from a Devilfish which was bought as a troops choice count as a scoring troops unit once they have detached from the vehicle to become infantry?

Do models equipped with a target lock which allows them to fire on a separate target from the one targeted by their squad have to take a leadership test to do so? (Current rule calls for a target priority test, which no longer exists in the main book.)

Smart Missile Systems says that a squad hit by the SMS can take cover saves if they are IN cover or are touching cover that lies between them and the SMS firing unit. Do they receive cover saves vs. SMS from screening infantry or cover that they are not in/touching?

Stealth Field Generators state that the unit with the generator counts as being "in cover" for the purposes of assault. As attackers are only slowed to initiative 1 by moving "through" cover as they assault, does the Stealth Field reduce the attackers initiative to 1?

Are Gun drones worth kill points if they were taken as vehicle wargear (devilfish, hammerheads, piranha). If yes then does this still apply if the drones were destroyed at the same time as the vehicle (as the drones have not become a unit yet), or during deployment does a vehicle with gun drones worth 2kp instead of the standard 1?

Do XV-8s that take a markerlight drone get to move and fire the markerlight? The new rulebook gives jet pack units the relentless rule, but the Tau Codex explicitly states XV-8s can never move and fire heavy weapons (p. 27 IIRC I don't have Codex handy). Interestingly, the stealth suit entry doesn't explicitly prohibit the move and fire heavy weapons. As I read it then rulebook's gift of relentless works for them, but not XV-8s.


TYRANIDS
Do Lictors (and other models) using the Secret Deployment special rule have to test for dangerous terrain when they "deep strike" into difficult area terrain?

Can Hormagaunts (and other beasts) get to the second floor of ruins? If not, do flesh hooks change the situation?

Does the hive tyrant (MC) gain a cover save if his three tyrant guards are in area terrain cover?

do spore mines taken as a fast attack choice count for a kill point? if not would it be similiar to an orbital bombardment?

what about spore mines that form a unit because they miss? or spore mines generated from a biomorph?

do lictors make a dangerous terrain roll when they enter play since they have to deep strike into terrain?



WITCH HUNTERS
What psychic powers are actually shooting psychic powers for the Sisters army?

What does the Mancatcher actually do?

Can inducted Imperial Guard in a Sisters army select from the Imperial Guard armory?

Unlike other powers in the Chaos codex, Warptime does not specifically state that a Psychic Test needs to be taken. Does a Psychic Test need to be taken to use the power?

What does thornback (carnifex biomorph) do now that there are no rules for outnumbering?

Do all landraiders (BT/DA/BA/SW/CSM/DH) benefit from the POTMS rule in the DH FAQ?

Do blood angels rhinos/razorbacks have access/firing points?

der Wiskinator wrote:What does thornback (carnifex biomorph) do now that there are no rules for outnumbering?

Would only be fair it gets tossed out the window, just like a Gruesome Talisman did for Dark Eldar in fifth edition. Would have been happier to see an errata: example: it counts as inflicting a wound for combat resolution purposes.

I was told this is the place to post my rules questions/FAQ issues... heres the first batch of 5th Ed questions we came up with.

1. Does the necron Nightmare Shroud require Line-Of-Sight?

2. If someone is forced to fallback during the movement phase and then gets shot at in the next phase do they fall back again. Examples I deep striked a 5 man squad into difficult terrain losing two due to unlucky dice rolls. i suffered greater then 25% casualties then failed my leadership test thus forcing a fallback. in the subsequent round they go shot at and lost 25% again i rolled and failed another leadership fallingback another 2d6. the same scenario also happened with a tank shocking monolith on one of my squads. the wording in the rules seems to indicate a per phase test. since the units were already "falling back" did i have to run them the second time?

3. so you have a multiple combat situation with an ic attached to a an enemy unit and you have two units and an IC engaging that unit and 1 of your units is directly engaged with the ic. the enemy unit is completely wiped out at initive step by the squad directly engaged with the IC. leaving the Allied IC and your second unit disengaged whereas before they were all engaged. do you still get all your attacks with them all flowing to the enemy IC? this was how we ruled it based upon our understanding of the rules but more input would be appreciated.

4. Someone targets a 2nd story unit with a blast weapon... it scatters out of the ruin into open terrain over other units. based upon the wording in the book, the blast template would only effect things on the 2nd story thus leaving all models underneath the blast template unharmed.

5. Does an IG Demo CHarge Deviate 2d6" or 1d6" I had one deviate 12 inches past the full 6" which seems like he should be in some sort of professional sporting event.

6. concerning missions. it states you automatically win if you wipe out your opponet. tyranids without number allows them to always bring them back on the table the following turn. if you wipe out all original units do you still win or do you have to wipe the table completely clean by the end of a game turn?

7. Okay a buddy of mine said today that he believes techpriest with signums only work with techpriests and the servitors themselves. I believe they work with anyone the techpriest is in a unit with. The wording is interesting in my codex it states
"This is a special form of communication device that allows the techpriest enginseer to access a myriad of useful battlefield targeting information, and then pass it to his companions." Now this sentence implies whoever his companions are. It then continues "In game terms it allows you, each turn, to re-roll one missed to hit shooting roll for the techpriest enginseer or his attendant servitors."

8. I have also inquired about the JO listing in the back of the Book. The FAQ states to ignore the "platoon commander" listing which has identical stats to the "Junior Officer listing in the front under HQ listing. I believe the intent was to have the JO with ws bs 4 as the back states but with only 1 wound and leadership 8. Otherwise he is little more then a sgt.

9. In the main rules it mentions that regardless of objectives if you wipe your enemy out you automatically win. What about tyranid "without number" units. since you technically can't kill them as
they will keep respawning, if you kill "all original units" does that constitute a wipe out thus automatic win? kind of a tyranids "phase out" sort of thing to counter balance unending horde armies?

10. Also can tyranids that choose scuttlers and choose to outflank.. that also have without number perform outflank maneuvars when they get wiped out and come on the board a second time?

11. lastly was it intentional to make the licter roll a dangerous terrain test every single time he deploys? these seems exceptionally harsh when that is his only deployment option.

12. Okay one more.. what about the callidus.. since she doesn't deviate if she choose to "appear" in cover does she have to roll a dangerous terrain test?

(this should have been in a different thread)

1. Dunno

2. Thy only time a "broken morale" unit needs to take a morale test is when they are assaulted. I see no reason for them to take a test and fallback again (as they are already falling back)

3. p.35 "to see if models are engaged is done at the beginning of the fight" So since they were engaged at the start of the fight they may still make attacks (against units they were engaged with ofcourse)

4. yes

5. Unless it has specific wording in the IG codex it functions like all other Ordnance/large blast weapons. So i would say yes 2d6-BS

6. You must wipe the table completely clean by the end of the game turn

7. You answered your own question "In game terms it allows you, each turn, to re-roll one missed to hit shooting roll for the TECHPRIEST enginseer OR his attendant SERVITORS."

8. A JO is a 2ond Lt. The FAQ is correct (they have less combat exp than a sgt)

9. Read #6

10. No, because outflank is from reserves while Without number is not treated as reserves, therefor does not benefit form scouts. (though i will post this in another thread to be sure)

11. No since its a 4th ed codex and this wasn't accounted for back then, however in 5th edition since he is entering play via deep strike he must take said dangerous terrain test.

12. She does not enter play via deep strike so RAW she does not take any dangerous terrain tests for entering play. (however if she enters in a minefield or other normal dangerous terrain she must)

Question 2.
Pg 44. Casualties A unit losing 25% or more of its models during a single phase must pass a morale check at the end of that phase, or else it will fall back. (ignoring close combat)
pg 46. Morale while falling back: Troops who are falling back automatically fail all morale checks, except those to regroup.

so two examples have caused this.

1. MOVEMENT PHASE Deepstriking into difficult terrain with 5 man squad rolled 2 1's two people died, failed their morale they start fleeing 2d6. SHOOTING PHASE i then rapid fire plasma guns come up with a 1. (out of 3 guys remaining) i automatically fail it since i am already falling aback and run another 2d6.

You can literally walk people off the board by hitting the 25% mark once they are falling back.

UNLESS you guys see something i am missing this seems to be RAW.

I intend on reviewing all of these closer but i think its significant.

Question 3.

3. so you have a multiple combat situation with an ic attached to a an enemy unit and you have two units and an IC engaging that unit and 1 of your units is directly engaged with the ic. the enemy unit is completely wiped out at initive step by the squad directly engaged with the IC. leaving the Allied IC and your second unit disengaged whereas before they were all engaged. do you still get all your attacks with them all flowing to the enemy IC? this was how we ruled it based upon our understanding of the rules but more input would be appreciated.

3. p.35 "to see if models are engaged is done at the beginning of the fight" So since they were engaged at the start of the fight they may still make attacks (against units they were engaged with ofcourse)

perhaps i was unclear

enemy unit(A) has IC(B)

Allied unit (1) has no IC and allied unit (2) has an ic (3)

Units 1,2 and 3 assault units A and B

Unit 1 is engaged with both A and B and units 2 and 3 are only engaged with A.

if unit 1 goes @ high init wipes out unit A
Units 2 and 3 were engaged but now are not since the unit they were engaged with is wiped out.
Since unit B is its own unit(IC) i believe all the previously "engaged models" (units 2 and 3) simply lose their attacks... OR do they still get to attack?

odinsspear45 wrote:
Question 2.
Pg 44. Casualties A unit losing 25% or more of its models during a single phase must pass a morale check at the end of that phase, or else it will fall back. (ignoring close combat)
pg 46. Morale while falling back: Troops who are falling back automatically fail all morale checks, except those to regroup.

so two examples have caused this.

1. MOVEMENT PHASE Deepstriking into difficult terrain with 5 man squad rolled 2 1's two people died, failed their morale they start fleeing 2d6. SHOOTING PHASE i then rapid fire plasma guns come up with a 1. (out of 3 guys remaining) i automatically fail it since i am already falling aback and run another 2d6.

You can literally walk people off the board by hitting the 25% mark once they are falling back.

UNLESS you guys see something i am missing this seems to be RAW.

I intend on reviewing all of these closer but i think its significant.

In light of that, I'd say you could very well cause multiple fall backs, RAW.

odinsspear45 wrote:Question 3.

3. so you have a multiple combat situation with an ic attached to a an enemy unit and you have two units and an IC engaging that unit and 1 of your units is directly engaged with the ic. the enemy unit is completely wiped out at initive step by the squad directly engaged with the IC. leaving the Allied IC and your second unit disengaged whereas before they were all engaged. do you still get all your attacks with them all flowing to the enemy IC? this was how we ruled it based upon our understanding of the rules but more input would be appreciated.

3. p.35 "to see if models are engaged is done at the beginning of the fight" So since they were engaged at the start of the fight they may still make attacks (against units they were engaged with ofcourse)

perhaps i was unclear

enemy unit(A) has IC(B)

Allied unit (1) has no IC and allied unit (2) has an ic (3)

Units 1,2 and 3 assault units A and B

Unit 1 is engaged with both A and B and units 2 and 3 are only engaged with A.

if unit 1 goes @ high init wipes out unit A
Units 2 and 3 were engaged but now are not since the unit they were engaged with is wiped out.
Since unit B is its own unit(IC) i believe all the previously "engaged models" (units 2 and 3) simply lose their attacks... OR do they still get to attack?

Ok... 2/3 may not attack as they were not engaged with B.

I feel it is questions like this, but more so the answers that is killing this hobby. The games are supposed to be fun. But it seems like all 4th edition was was arguing about the rules. I thought 5th edition was going to clear some if not most of that up. It was hyped up that 5th edition was going to go back to friendly games and being nice to your opponent. Like the whole cover save item. If you disagree, you just lose 1 off the cover save, not the whole thing. The rule book talks about being generous to the people you play with, not winning by being a "rules lawyer". In my group, we play with a thing called common sense and logical conclusions. But we still have one or two people who take the rules WAY TOO SERIOUS. As a result they don't get to play much because people don't like dealing with them. They look at the rule book as if it was the Bible, and the FAQ's as canon. That is why I think your posted FAQ's are worthless. Yes I said it but before I get banned for having an opinion that goes against the "board" hear me out. If GW is going to allow us or more to the point you to have some input in the game, make it for the better. Balance things out a little. Make it so that people will play the game not just for the love of the game, but because it is fun to play against someone. Make the game a way for people to share and spend time together lost in a different world. Limit the power gamers on how much power they have. I have been playing this game for what sometimes feels like too long. I have seen the game change during my time. I have sent suggestions to GW. But now, right now it seems like the players are getting a voice. Don't make it a whisper, make it a ROAR!

The Sarge:

it is not an unreasonable request of the playing community to expect a set of clear and concise rules

this comes from a former magic player. when the cards were worded badly a group of veteran players turned DCI judges would weigh in and come up with errata that was RAI based on RAW.

yakface has lead the charge in getting the rules worked out since games workshop would rather see us all roll a 4+ every time the rule comes up.

I hope to see your faq on 5th ed soon yakface!

NaZ

Naz,
I would like a concise set of rules also. Sometimes I feel the rule book is better used to hit someone upside their head then to look up a rule. Now in a game like this I know you can't cover every situation that can and will come up. What I am getting at is that if something is broke, fix the rule in a manner that is in keeping with a fun attitude and not a crush your opponent attitude. In the example above they talk about make a Ld test for taking wounds, then having to fall back again and again. Well to me that was an oversight when the rules were made up. Someone found it and now can try to exploit it to win the game. This is one of my points, why have the attitude of "win at all cost"? make the FAQ's limit what people can exploit. Don't give them the power. Fix it and move on to the next thiong that comes up. Sure it is a WAR-game but it is still a GAME. Everyone goes home at the end of the night.

Now, I applaud the initiative to put together and submit these FAQ's. I just feel they were wrong, in a lot of "rules" ways. Now that they have been posted on the GW site, people will look at them as "official". Have you read them yet? They should come with a heading that if you don't play one of the popular armies (SM, Tau) you are going to get bent over. Any rule that could hurt or hinder the special armies is FAQ'ed away. While anything in other army codex that could hurt them is changed. Why is that? Why after 10 years have wych weapons changed? Why do eldar get units that can affect play but never have to show up on the board? (swooping hawks with sky leap). Why do the tau have a vehicle and suit upgrades that allow them to increase their BS, split fire, and count as obscured all the time (and for only 5 points) yet none of that was addressed.

FAQ's should balance armies until new codexes come out (unless you're Dark Eldar). But so far I have not seen that. All I have seen is the beginner armies tightened up and the skilled/tactic armies put down once again.

If you want to make FAQ's that everyone will love, you either have to have someone who loves an army write the FAQ for it. Or, have someone who hates the army write the FAQ for it. But it has to be the same across the board. By looking at what was posted on GW, that was not the case.

Sarge, I feel your pain.

Yak isn't the only one leading the charge, believe me.

Don't worry about what other people post here as "answers".

They are worth precisely

Post your questions, they will get to GW in one form or another.

Sarge, please see my post here: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/215932.page and respond, I would like to avoid going too far OT in this thread.

Eldar: Do Swooping Hawks who get placed back into reserve for landing in terrain, etc. still get to drop their grenades?

Imperial Guard Skills and Drills:
How does the Doctrine Die Hards work in 5th. Edition?

Deepstriking units.. do the models making a circle around the first model have to be in base to base with each other.. ie can you make a line or an x (like to better utilize flame template or avoid difficult terrain.

PG. 95 The sentence reads "models must be placed in base contact with the original model in a circle around it."

The concerns is for low model counts in which you can not complete the first circle.

_____(X)(X)
____(X)(X)(X)
_____(X)(X)

That is a full circle

I believe as an example if you had only three models it would need to look like this

___(X)(X)
____(X)

I believe as an example if you had only four models it would need to look like this

___(X)(X)
____(X)(X)

Instead of three models like this

____(X)(X)(X)

or four models like this

_______(X)
_____(X)(X)(X)
_______(X)


IF it read:

PG. 95 The sentence reads "models must be placed in base contact with the original model."

I dont think this would be relevant

but it says

PG. 95 The sentence reads "models must be placed in base contact with the original model in a circle around it."

which i believe means you are trying to complete a circle not simply meet a base to base with original model requirement.

Thoughts?

Can units that have a rule that says they never count as scoring units contest objectives? For example, Zoanthropes can never hold objectives, but can they contest them?

Need to update this...

Eldar Psykers allowed to use their pshychic abilities while in transports? (I tend to think no.) (The question comes because it doesn't define Eldar psyker abilities as "shooting" anymore.)

As another thread pretty much comes to the conclusion that yes you can use psyker powers from a transport (wave serpent) as long as they are not a shooting ability (Guide, Fortune, Doom).

Skyleap, it was intended with this ruling that Eldar players have a GUARANTEED deep strike drop on turn 5 onto objectives and hope the game ends?

I just played a game trying to use this tactic and frankly while I think it is a valid (non-cheese) tactic it's not easy to do and costly!

It's expensive Swooping Hawk squad needs to have an Exarch and said exarch needs to take the Sky Leap ability (15 points).

This puts the whole squad at 153 points (aka not cheap).

You can get it down to 132 points if you drop the squad size down to 5 (including Exarch).

During turn 4 in the movement phase they need to leave the board, so no shooting or assaulting, nothing that turn.

5th Turn, they automatically come in, but still have to roll for deep strike location...

So if they don't land on target, they can be destroyed (1-2), placed anywhere on the board (3-4) or sent back to reserve (5-6).

Landing in difficult terrain is treated as dangerous.

To actually contest they'll have to land very very close as they only get 1D6" for a single run roll.

More units you have around, more likely a mishap will occur.

Can't assault the turn they land, even if they have fleet (which they do).

Low chance the game will end on turn 5.

So while they *can* jump up turn 4 and come back down to contest turn 5, if your opponent has troops on the location it's actually pretty hard to land close enough to actually contest the point.

Mezmaron wrote:
Eldar: Do Swooping Hawks who get placed back into reserve for landing in terrain, etc. still get to drop their grenades?

I've always done the grenades first (as they drop them when coming down) and then do the deep strike for the hawks, seeing how it says you get to use them every time they deep strike and it does not mention needing to be successful, I personally think they should still get to drop there grenades...

But... it could be nice to have a FAQ expressly saying so.

Jara, When you tried using the swooping hawks, did you sky leap every turn? Basically dropping a large blast every turn that you deep strike, then pick your unit back up (or your marker, they guy I play with never even puts his models out)?

Here is my question, it is an oldie but a goodie. The warp portal for dark eldar, I have always argued that you can move in the movement phase, then you placed it in the shooting phase (just like stated in the codex) instead of moving or shooting. My argument was that only models that could "fleet" back then could take the portal, hence they always had the option to move or shoot in the shooting phase. Now with the new run rule, it is possible to either move or shoot in the shooting phase. So do the new rules validate my point? If not please explain why. It counts as one action during the shooting phase.

Note: the one action thing is an implied guideline we (my group) have come to understand. It means most units can perform one action in each phase. Units the shoot can not run, units that enter the game from tunnels can not move, units that deep strike can not move (unless your swooping hawks).

The Sarge wrote:Jara, When you tried using the swooping hawks, did you sky leap every turn? Basically dropping a large blast every turn that you deep strike, then pick your unit back up (or your marker, they guy I play with never even puts his models out)?

You still need to place models, particularly if the squad is landing close to anything that may get in the way.

So do the new rules validate my point?

No. The Webway Portal rules state that the portal is placed instead of Moving or Shooting that turn, not that phase.

The Sarge wrote:Jara, When you tried using the swooping hawks, did you sky leap every turn? Basically dropping a large blast every turn that you deep strike, then pick your unit back up (or your marker, they guy I play with never even puts his models out)?

You still have to pick a location and roll scatter (and hope that you don't have a deep strike mishap or land in difficult terrain (which will become dangerous). This last game, I did nothing but DS and drop grenades each turn. I think they ended up killing off a squad of Vespid doing so and while that at least earned them some some points/value, I don't think it made up for there cost. I think it would have been better to drop them down and shoot a few turns and then jump back up late game.

Of course my problem, the hawks are fragile and I really wanted to try contesting with them... so I was playing very conservative with them that game. But really due to basically needing to DS on target 1/3 chance? On top of that needing a high D6 roll for run...

I think the Hawks are better off jumping up Turn 3, Turn 4 come down and get closer to the control point and Turn 5 make your contest move (12" jump + D6 Run if you need it, combined with 6" Assault if you really really need). I think overall that will have more consistent use. Granted it does give your opponent a chance to shoot at them and do any number of bad things to the poor little hawks.

-Jara

PS: Also, it might make a difference that my gaming group almost always places the control points inside or around ruins/terrain. This takes away the advantage that troop transports have if the locations are out in the open... as many of our early games would be decided by a tank shock (and it just seemed too easy to push a bunch of troops off a scoring location).

Question: When coming in from off the board, if a model is slow and purposeful, but also has a base that is over an inch wide, what happens if a double 1 is rolled?

This could happen to an Oblid coming in on the first turn of Dawn of War or simply from reserves.

Question: Does a Wreckin' Ball count as an assault and hit rear armor on a vehicle?

Question: Can an Ork vehicle with both a Boarding plank and Wreckin' Ball attack two separate units?

Insaniak,
You are right about it saying turn in the codex. But did you read the whole thing. It goes (paraphrasing) "the model places the portal in the shooting PHASE, instead of moving or shooting that TURN". Now correct me if I am wrong (which I am not) but it says nothing about giving up your movement in the movement PHASE. So by the correct interpretation for 5th edition, a model should be able to move or deepstrike in the movement PHASE. Then give up their shooting or running in the shooting PHASE of that TURN. How is this wrong?

We can not go by older edition rules or old FAQ's. With the 5th edition rules, everything changes again. Hopefully when the new codex comes out it will address this issue once and for all.

The Sarge wrote:Insaniak,
You are right about it saying turn in the codex. But did you read the whole thing. It goes (paraphrasing) "the model places the portal in the shooting PHASE, instead of moving or shooting that TURN". Now correct me if I am wrong (which I am not) but it says nothing about giving up your movement in the movement PHASE. So by the correct interpretation for 5th edition, a model should be able to move or deepstrike in the movement PHASE. Then give up their shooting or running in the shooting PHASE of that TURN. How is this wrong?

We can not go by older edition rules or old FAQ's. With the 5th edition rules, everything changes again. Hopefully when the new codex comes out it will address this issue once and for all.

Think of it has a heavy weapon... Can you fire a heavy weapon that turn if you moved in the movement phase (with standard infantry)? It does clearly say "INSTEAD OF MOVING or shooting that turn" What part of that is unclear? Its done in the shooting phase so you cannot move in reserves the same turn you place it. Play it however you want but this is one of the most beardy (rule bending) interpretations of rules i have heard in a long LONG time.

Red

Don't be mad about being wrong. Since now it is possible to MOVE or SHOOT in the shooting phase, it defaults to being a piece of wargear used in the SHOOTING phase of that turn. And although it is nice to picture a piece of wargear as a weapon (other then the real wargear that is a weapon). It seems like you are making things up to fit what you want and not keeping an open mind when reading the rules.

I have learned over the last few days that the FAQ's and this forum are not about changing the game or balancing the armies. It is about looking at the rules and the army's codex to find poorly written rules. Then with an open mind, finding the way things work in the game. Even if it was not the intent of the rule, or makes something more powerful then it should be. Since the rules have changed but the codexes have not, everything is up for revisiting. So just because the portal didn't work that way in 3rd edition (which it did because of the DE fleet move), and then in 4th (which most people carried the rule over from 3rd). The sun is shining on a new day for 5th.

So until you show me your GW employee ID, your degree in rules lawyering, or that English is truly your first language. We can agree to disagree, but I am right.

--Don't get all offended, this is all in fun, and jest--

New topic,

When moving on from a table edge, any table edge, does it count as moving? We go over this all the time. We have a SM player who can infiltrate his devastator squad. Some cheesy thing the SM stole from the IG. Anyways, he always wants them to show up on the board and be able to shoot all the heavy weapons that turn. How is this addressed in the rulebook, and how does everyone else play it?

"INSTEAD OF MOVING or shooting that TURN" turn not phase.

If you move in the movement phase did you move that turn?

If you moved in the shooting phase did you move that turn?

Its actually fairly clear. I don't know why you are trying to make the word turn mean phase... but it doesn't, if you move in the movement phase you moved that turn, therefor cannot place the Webway portal, since it requires you to remain stationary for a turn, though it is important to note that you can assault after placing the portal (as this happens after it is dropped and the codex says after it is dropped the model may move away freely).


On your other topic-
P.94 "arriving from reserve" its actually very clear on this. They measure their movement from the table edge then are placed and count as moving (because they did) so the space marine devs could not fire heavy weapons and such.

Guys, this thread is not the proper place to hash out rules questions and answers.

While I agree that many of these questions are properly answered by reading the rules, it doesn't hurt to have the questions submitted in this thread.

Anyone compiling their own FAQ can simply ignore the questions they think don't need to be included.

yakface wrote:
Guys, this thread is not the proper place to hash out rules questions and answers.

While I agree that many of these questions are properly answered by reading the rules, it doesn't hurt to have the questions submitted in this thread.

Anyone compiling their own FAQ can simply ignore the questions they think don't need to be included.

But...but...

I'm guessing Jaradakar hasn't noticed the Yo-Yo tactic that Skyleap affords.

132 points for a chance to land on an objective and contest it is a bargain.

Hopefully you figure out why, without bullet pointing.

I like the cartoon.

Hopefully this question will not make me look like I have not read the rulebook cover to cover.

It goes back back to the swooping hawks (SH) and the skyleap. Now before everyone groans hear me out.

It says that the SH can drop their grenades each time they enter play by deep striking. Now the rules for the grenades gives the range as N/A. So "by the book" since the grenades are not classified as a guess or barrage weapon, do the SH need to have LOS to the location where the template is from where they land, and does the unit that just got bombed get a cover save? Now I know the logical answers would be no and no because they are dropping the grenades from the sky and the direction of the attack is straight down. BUT... Do the rules support this speculation?

The Sarge wrote:Insaniak,
You are right about it saying turn in the codex.

And there you go, then.

If you're actually interested in discussing it further, feel free to start a new thread so we're not clogging up Yak's FAQ thread with discussion.

Just because there was some discussions in another thread:

Do Chaos characters with wings take dangerous terrain tests when landing in difficult terrain?



Can a character on a bike who joins a squad that turbo boosted shoot and/or assault?

Does that same character get a cover save if a majority is made with the turbo boosting squad?

Does a character leave a squad at the beginning or end of the movement phase? I.e. does he move independently until the end of the phase, at which point he rejoins any squad within 2"?

In Apocalypse games, can characters join one's teammates' squads?

Stelek wrote:I'm guessing Jaradakar hasn't noticed the Yo-Yo tactic that Skyleap affords.

132 points for a chance to land on an objective and contest it is a bargain.

Hopefully you figure out why, without bullet pointing.

Stelek, I'm fully aware of the yo-yo tactic, I've tried it many times and imo it's not as good as some like to make it out. Did you read any of my previous posts? Not only do they mention yo-yoing:

This last game, I did nothing but DS and drop grenades each turn.

The one prior to that logically outlines why (What's wrong with bullet points?). In the future if you disagree, please presenting a logical argument for/against, rather than imply a person is ignorant, which doing so is slightly insulting.

Yakface, sorry I'll stop posting in this thread. I had originally done so because the OP has the exact opposite information on psychic powers from inside a transport as the main thread dealing with it and I was wanting it corrected... then I got carried away, sorry ;-)

From a recent thread on the subject:

If a unit is forced to Emergency Disembark during the opposing player's turn, what abilities does it lose? Does it count as having gone to ground? Does this carry into the next player turn (the owning player's turn)?

Do intervening units allow a unit a cover save when a weapon that doesn't require LoS (such as a Tau Smart Missile System or Seeker missile) targets said unit?

Tau Question 1:

If a unit slips fire via the target lock in the shooting phase and then assults do all of the units assault the primary target in the shooting phase, have the choice of the primary or secondary target from the shooting phase, or assault both the primary & secondary target (or even third of 4th if multiple target locks are within the unit)

asugradinwa wrote:Tau Question 1:

If a unit slips fire via the target lock in the shooting phase and then assults do all of the units assault the primary target in the shooting phase, have the choice of the primary or secondary target from the shooting phase, or assault both the primary & secondary target (or even third of 4th if multiple target locks are within the unit)

N/A since by RAW target locks are a broken peace of wargear that people currently play with house rules. So if you use functioning target locks at all its a house rule issue.

Well then:

Question #2:

What is a target priority test in 5th edition? (we all know it'll be a LD test but for those who need everything spelled out for them......)

Epidemius vs Necron. Round 1 you drop in, with epidemius and knock down 10 necrons using daemons of nurgle or with his marks. Those necrons are eligible for WBB rolls. Come the beginning of the necron turn, 5 make the roll and stand back up. Assuming Epidemius is still on the table at the beginning of the daemons second round, is the tally at 10, or at 5?

thats awesome.. the necrons will spell their own doom with their resiliance.. if they are foolish enough to not simply shoot epidemus off the board on turn 1

Transport question 1
can multiple units embark into a transport. Eg 5 space marines get in a land raider can another 5 space marines from another unit also get in, also does this work in the same way for dedicated transports

The IG FAQ states that an independet commissar that joins a unit adds one to the commander's leadership and will execute him if a morale test is failed. What happens if an independet commissar joins a unit of conscripts (who doesn't have a commander)?

Aristotle wrote:Transport question 1
can multiple units embark into a transport. Eg 5 space marines get in a land raider can another 5 space marines from another unit also get in, also does this work in the same way for dedicated transports

No, only a single unit plus any joined/attached ICs can ride in a transport at one time.

PeterWelzien wrote:The IG FAQ states that an independet commissar that joins a unit adds one to the commander's leadership and will execute him if a morale test is failed. What happens if an independet commissar joins a unit of conscripts (who doesn't have a commander)?

He executes a regular trooper. Was in the old IG FAQ and needs to be added back into the current FAQ.

Another question:
If a transport gets shot up and enemy models blocks all the access points, can I then do an emergency disembarkation? Or is the unit destroyed?

the answer is no.. they get to deploy on top of the wreck of the vehicle. but are entangled for a turn.

yakface.. please come up with an answer to weather or not a deff rolla can be used during a ram move. we're stuck after 3 pages of debate and need an answer

NaZ

NaZ wrote:the answer is no.. they get to deploy on top of the wreck of the vehicle. but are entangled for a turn.

yakface.. please come up with an answer to weather or not a deff rolla can be used during a ram move. we're stuck after 3 pages of debate and need an answer

NaZ

this isn't true... they only get to do this if the vehicle is blown up RAW. If they are blocked in and it is destroyed with out blowing up they are destroyed.

It is very clearly stated in the rules.

frgsinwntr wrote:this isn't true... they only get to do this if the vehicle is blown up RAW. If they are blocked in and it is destroyed with out blowing up they are destroyed.

It is very clearly stated in the rules.

On page 67 under "Destroyed - wrecked" it says: "The passengers must immediately disembark..". And under "Disembarking" is says: "If any models cannot disembark because of enemy models or because they would end up in impassable terrain, the unit can perform an 'emergency disembarkation'...". So if the access points are blocked, but other parts of the vehicle are not, that must mean I can choose to do an emergency disembarkation?

PeterWelzien wrote:

frgsinwntr wrote:this isn't true... they only get to do this if the vehicle is blown up RAW. If they are blocked in and it is destroyed with out blowing up they are destroyed.

It is very clearly stated in the rules.

On page 67 under "Destroyed - wrecked" it says: "The passengers must immediately disembark..". And under "Disembarking" is says: "If any models cannot disembark because of enemy models or because they would end up in impassable terrain, the unit can perform an 'emergency disembarkation'...". So if the access points are blocked, but other parts of the vehicle are not, that must mean I can choose to do an emergency disembarkation?

that's the way i read it too so if you want to kill the occupants of a vehicle by destroying it then you would have to completely surround it so that they cant make an emergency disembarkation.

hmm I see now why it is confusing. The way it is written is suggests if they are getting out of the vehicle on purpose they can be deployed anywhere.

BUT if they are bailing out because of damage then they are destroyed if all hatches are covered.

Basically you can think of it as more of a rush and not enough time to get out the smaller hatches with the vehicle blowing up while getting on purpose it would be a little less rushed.

It was my understanding that "emergency disembarking" was added so that even if access hatches were blocked the passengers could survive. To prevent occasions like piranha feeding frenzy.

without quoting exactly.. the answer is on pg 67 of the main rulebook.

models are deployed anywhere within 2" of the vehicles hull

and -if even this disembarkation is impossible, they can't disembark.

so I suppose you could completely surround a vehicle to make sure they can't do that and stay 1" away from your models.

NaZ

When defending with a multi-toughness or multi-WS unit, what exactly does 'majority' mean? For example, if a unit with two WS 2 models, one WS 3 model and one WS 4 model is assaulted, does two out of four units count as a majority? Or is the unit WS 4 since no single type is > 50% of the units?

Okay... you all will probably get angry at me. I have three different GW people answering me on this question. I would love a FAQ on this matter.


Can a unit with Fleet disembark from a transport and run and therefore Assault?

I am asking this question now because of the new space Marine Ravensgaurd army. Space Marines with the fleet rule. I would like a real answer on this.

GW people have told me that if you can run you can fleet. therefore assault out of transports. I know we had a huge discussion on this topic. but this needs to be in a General FAQ. I played a game with a player telling me he can do it out of a rhino because he has fleet.

Astalado wrote:Okay... you all will probably get angry at me. I have three different GW people answering me on this question. I would love a FAQ on this matter.


Can a unit with Fleet disembark from a transport and run and therefore Assault?

I am asking this question now because of the new space Marine Ravensgaurd army. Space Marines with the fleet rule. I would like a real answer on this.

GW people have told me that if you can run you can fleet. therefore assault out of transports. I know we had a huge discussion on this topic. but this needs to be in a General FAQ. I played a game with a player telling me he can do it out of a rhino because he has fleet.

No, you cannot. Fleet overrides the may not assault if you run bit but does not override the may not assault after disembarking from a closed vehicle that moved bit.

I agree with Don_mondo

So this will sound really stupid, but I figure I should ask as it's not really covered in the rule book.
The Question is as follows.
Who can run?
The book only explains infantry running, it says nothing about jump infantry, or walkers.

Just in case this isn't on a list somewhere...

Issues from Codex: Daemonhunters:

1. Page 20. 'Daemons' Terminology. Is the list of things which count as 'Daemons' supposed to include the units from Codex: Chaos Daemons? Is this list supposed to include the Summoned Lesser Daemons and Summoned Greater Daemons in the Codex: Chaos Space Marines?
2. Page 18. Teleport homer. What should the text be replaced with, since the wargear entry is trying to incorporate 3rd edition deep strike rules?
3. Page 8. Daemonic Infestation. Should the list of units which are subject to this rule be expanded to include units from the current Codex: Chaos Daemons and Codex: Chaos Space Marines? What rules should be used for the 'Sustained Attack' rules which are referenced?
4. Page 49. Daemon Summoning. Should the text for Daemon Summoning be replaced with the appropriate text from Codex: Chaos Space Marines to keep the summoning and reserve rules consistent?

Issues from Codex: Chaos Daemons:

1. Page 54. How many times can the Changeling's ability be used per turn?
2. Page 54. Does the Changeling's ability allow triggering optional abilities of the misdirected unit? For example, can the misdirected unit be forced to use, for example, Bladestorm, single use weapons, or be forced to choose between various heavy weapons at the discretion of the Changeling's player?
3. Page 53. What's the proper timing for determining the second gift and target for the Blue Scribes? Do you roll to determine the second power before determining the target for the second power?

Issues from Codex: Chaos Space Marines:

1. Page 102. Can Summoned Lesser Daemons claim objectives even though they don't take up a Troop slot?

I can't find this question anywhere else on the forum:

An Ork Weirdboy rolls "Ere we go" for his power. He is allowed to teleport somewhere else on the board "per the deep strike rules"

If he's subsequently forced to roll on the mishap table and rolls the "delayed" result then what happens?

"Delayed" states that the model goes back into reserve. The WB was never in reserve so he can't really go "back." Does he go into reserve as if he had somehow been delayed or does he simply remain in his original position as if the teleport had not happened?

I could make a case for either one of those options.

Does the hive tyrant (MC) gain a cover save if his three tyrant guards are in area terrain cover?

Actually I think this should be expanded into "How are the monstruous creature rules of a hive tyrant in a retinue affected exactly ?". Since the FAQ implies the monstruous creatures rules do not behave normally in that case, quoting :"at which point the Hive Tyrant reverts to the normal rules for monstrous creatures".

That triggers the question of cover save indeed.
But also the "go to ground" ability of the unit.
And this could stretch to the ability to penetrate 2d6...and even canceling saves in hth...since after all the Prince in that particular set-up does not seem to be following the "normal rules for monstruous creatures" by RAW.

don_mondo wrote:

Aristotle wrote:Transport question 1
can multiple units embark into a transport. Eg 5 space marines get in a land raider can another 5 space marines from another unit also get in, also does this work in the same way for dedicated transports

No, only a single unit plus any joined/attached ICs can ride in a transport at one time.

PeterWelzien wrote:The IG FAQ states that an independet commissar that joins a unit adds one to the commander's leadership and will execute him if a morale test is failed. What happens if an independet commissar joins a unit of conscripts (who doesn't have a commander)?

He executes a regular trooper. Was in the old IG FAQ and needs to be added back into the current FAQ.

agreed needs readded... current FAQ explanation is not a clarification.

Question: Do Summoned Lesser Daemons count as a scoring unit?

The rulebook states that troops are the only unit type that count as scoring. More specifically it says that anything from your troops allowance counts as scoring.

To me, the word allowance would imply anything that takes up a troop slot in your force organization chart.

Daemons do not take up a force organization slot but otherwise get treated as troops.

Most everyone at my local store has been playing them as scoring units, and though it would benefit my Chaos army greatly if they could score, this seems incorrect to me.

Thanks for any help!

On initial deployment (not reserve deployment), does a vehicle/unit count as having moved, and if so, how far?

We've typically played that initial deployment counts as a full movement but the 5th ed BRB says absolutely nothing about it.

Second related question; if forced to deploy in the open, can a vehicle pop smoke immediately (as the smoke rule mentions movement but not the movement phase)?

In the new codex for Space Marines, it states that captains can have command squads, including Captain Shrike.
My question is that since Shrike is a Jump Infantry, wouldn't it make sense for his command squad to also have the capability to have jump packs? It seems kind of silly and dangerous to give them bikes just so they can keep up.
I can see it now..
Company Champion: "No capt'n, you go ahead, we'll be right behind you." *turns to command squad and winks*
*Apothecary pulls out the poker cards*

Ok, so second question about command squads. It states the squad doesn't count against your HQ allowance, but what do they count as? Do they count against another category like elites or troops?

pavonis wrote:In the new codex for Space Marines, it states that captains can have command squads, including Captain Shrike.
My question is that since Shrike is a Jump Infantry, wouldn't it make sense for his command squad to also have the capability to have jump packs? It seems kind of silly and dangerous to give them bikes just so they can keep up.
I can see it now..
Company Champion: "No capt'n, you go ahead, we'll be right behind you." *turns to command squad and winks*
*Apothecary pulls out the poker cards*

Ok, so second question about command squads. It states the squad doesn't count against your HQ allowance, but what do they count as? Do they count against another category like elites or troops?

They are an HQ unit that doesn't take up a FOC slot. Also they are not a retinue but a separate unit that functions independently of the captain.

DH/WH: Melta Torpedos are Ordinance and listed as 2d6 armor penetration. Do you roll each d6 and take the highest (as you would for Ordinance with 1d6 AP) or do you just roll the 2d6?

Tau Questions:

How do Target Locks on battlesuits function in 5th edition? Specifically, do they function at all? and who is the unit restricted to Assaulting?

Marker Drones: Do they have the Relentless rule if attached to a Fire Warrior or Broadside squad?

Stealth suits: Do enemies assaulting Stealth Suits still count as being at I1? and do Frag grenades remove this bonus if assaulted?

Disruption Pods: Are they really that awesome?

Pathfinders: The re-roll allowed by the Marker Beacon - does this mean the Scatter Direction, the distance, either or both?

Piranahs: All drones disembarking into a single squad - this could involve drones moving 24" in a single turn if you have your piranhas spread out enough. Is this intended? Is the entire unit of Piranhas worth one Killpoint and all drones worth another killpoint?

Drones on Vehicle: Does each squad of 2 drones count as a separate unit (ie, giving an additional Killpoint?).

Devilfish: May a unit of firewarriors that numbers more than 12 models including drones still select a transport, if they do not ride inside it?



Skimmers Tank-Shocking: A skimmer may always move over terrain.
A tank shock must be in a straight line, stopping if it reaches an enemy vehicle.
A skimmer may move over enemy units and vehicles.

May a skimmer then: tank shock a unit in terrain?
The rules seems to imply that a skimmer may move over enemy units during a tank shock. Is this correct? If so, can the skimmer move over enemy vehicles during a tank shock? And can the skimmer 'selectively' tank shock enemy units -ie 3 enemy units in a line, the skimmer shocks the first and third units but skims over the more dangerous middle unit?

How about dealing with the Ork Dethrolla being able to ram vehicles question.. That would be great to have your input on a FAQ....

-Porkuslime

Other Armies using your Locator Beacon, Teleport Homer, Icon, etc. etc. etc. for all time anywhere and everywhere as far as anyone can see into the future.

On a related question: How many times are they going to write these items up to leave this open to interpretation?

As a further follow-up, If my opponent continues to insist he can do this, can I reply with an assault from the terminators forced to disembark from the landraider in his shooting phase?

Ooh yeah. And a further real question:

Are weapons with a status difference different weapons?

For example the 10 Sternguard with 10 Combi-Meltas, half of which have been fired, how does one allocate 7 wounds to that squad? Is it 1 wound pool (Assuming the Sgt doesn't have a different load out), 2 wound pools (Assuming the Sgt doesn't have a different load out) with 1 pool being charged combi-meltas and one being discharged? Or as my third question brings up, Three wound pools: 1 being the charged combi-weapons, 1 being the discharged combi-weapons, and 1 being the sgt because his stat profile is different as he's a Sternguard Sgt- even though his weapons and equipment (in this example case) are the same.

How would this interact with temporary status changes? i.e. while I can't think of anything currently that can "jam" ala 2nd Ed Sustained Fire Dice, or non-vehicle apoc weapons that have to skip a turn after firing this stuff could show up in another codex.

As an adjunct to make sure the previous question doesn't get skipped. What if the only difference in statline is the model's "name"? If I have 5 Assault Terminators all with TH/SS, Is the Terminator Sergeant a seperate wound pool because his name is different in his stat line?

Red_Lives wrote:

pavonis wrote:In the new codex for Space Marines, it states that captains can have command squads, including Captain Shrike.
My question is that since Shrike is a Jump Infantry, wouldn't it make sense for his command squad to also have the capability to have jump packs? It seems kind of silly and dangerous to give them bikes just so they can keep up.
I can see it now..
Company Champion: "No capt'n, you go ahead, we'll be right behind you." *turns to command squad and winks*
*Apothecary pulls out the poker cards*

Ok, so second question about command squads. It states the squad doesn't count against your HQ allowance, but what do they count as? Do they count against another category like elites or troops?

They are an HQ unit that doesn't take up a FOC slot. Also they are not a retinue but a separate unit that functions independently of the captain.

so...by that same token, one could choose to not have the captain ride with his retinue?

LordPagus wrote:so...by that same token, one could choose to not have the captain ride with his retinue?

Yes - it's a unit unlocked by the captain that doesn't take up a FoC slot. And remember it's not a retinue. You can attach the captain, but you're not required to. It just counts as an additional unit.

The Tyranid codex states "only one tyranid warrior per brood may take a barbed strangler or venom cannon" is this to be interpreted as "only one tyranid warrior per brood may take a single barbed strangler or venom cannon" or is it plausible for one warrior to take a twin-linked version of either or one of each?

These next two have little to do with the rules themselves, just requests for minor alterations:
Genestealers now get re-rolls to hit at the low, low cost of 1 point per model. Will this be changed in the near future? I don't want to waste my time converting feeder tendrils onto my models if its going to change my army lists drastically.

Can anything be done about ork players in tournaments? Their movement phase alone takes about twenty minutes. Two different players in the Baltimore GT never got past turn 3 in any game.

can non-dedicated transport start the game with a unit embarked? if no why do dedicated transport get listed as being 'limited' to being deployed carry the unit that selected it? (quick ref pg67)

Dark Eldar Hellions. How does the Hellglaive work in 5th edition (or 4th for that matter). In regard to the +1 Strength on the charge even if they shoot.

Yes, non-dedicated transports can start with units and/or ICs embarked. They're more flexible than dedicated transports. And dedicated are limited because the rules say so, sorry, best answer I can give you.

don_mondo wrote:Yes, non-dedicated transports can start with units and/or ICs embarked.

Got a page reference for that?

insaniak wrote:

don_mondo wrote:Yes, non-dedicated transports can start with units and/or ICs embarked.

Got a page reference for that?

no he can't which is why i put it here ... RAI they must be able to ... but since there is no rule stating you can, they can't ... with friends i don't think any one would fight about this ... on the other hand how many people would fight this in a tournament to gain an advantage?

Can a Space Marine Captain calling down an orbital bombardment on a unit only assault that unit, since the rule states that it counts as firing a weapon for all intents and purposes?
Also, if he fires it indirectly he doesn't need line of sight (as it is barage) can he fire it from a vehicle that has no firing points (such as a land raider?)

Not sure if someone has put this here already, but can you deploy or disembark ontop of another model (ie disembarking ontop of the tank)? The rule says you can't move into space occupied by another model, but it never says you can't simply exist there if you got there some other way.

Also, on page 3 the rules state that a model is considered to occupy the area of the base, but area is only two dimensional, how does this work for 3 dimensions?

Q: Does a Landspeeder (and Attack Bike) purchased as part of a Ravenwing Attack Squadron count as a scoring unit as stated on Pg. 27 of the Dark Angel's Codex.

Note this has NOT been addressed in an Errata document.

Yes, I realize that this violates the usual restrictions on what the BRB says, but so do Sternguard Vets (as they are not a Troops unit). Codex is supposed to override the BRB when a direct contradiction occurs. In this case, it is not labeling the Landspeeder as "Troops" (which would then be shot down by being a vehicle), but outright declaring it to be scoring which is a direct contradiction between the two books.

Also keep in mind that to meet the criteria of pg. 27, you must purchase a full six-man bike squad at 220pts, then another 100pts to get the scoring Landspeeder.

DA have suffered enough really, I'd like to think we don't lose the Codex>BRB status as well.

Q: Can DA bikes turbo-boost during their scout move? (Pg. 27 as well)

In 4th Ed. it is my understanding that indeed nothing could make a scout move and use turbo-boost at the same time.

DA Codex says: Scouts: Not that no model may make a Turbo Boost move whilst using the Scouts Special Rule.

The Codex however, does not list the full rules for the Scout USR, which means you use the BRB for it. So in this case, is Pg. 27 a reminder of an out-of-date rule, or a restriction that now applies specifically to Ravenwing?

By RAW, yes indeed, the landspeeder and attack bike both count as scoring units, as they have a codex specific rule that says so, overriding the main rulebook restrictions on what is and isn't scoring. Expect lots of disagreement.
By that same standard, DA bikes cannot turboboost in their Scout move, as they have a codex statement saying they can't, again overriding the main rulebook statement that bikes can turboboost during Scout moves.

Thanks don_mondo,

That is how I interpret it as well, however my point in posting the question was at least to get it included (yea, I know people will hate the scoring Landspeeder), but also to make sure that the ruling is consistent.

i.e. If I don't have a scoring Landspeeder despite my Codex saying I do, then I better not have non-Turbo Boosting bikes because of my Codex as well.

On the same note, if I don't have scoring Landspeeders because of the BRB, then I shouldn't have restricted Scout abilities either.

Just want it consistent either direction.

A vehicle is considered to have a leadership of 10 for the purpose of the Changeling's special rule. How does that interact with said vehicle if there is a Culexus assassin standing next to the vehicle? The vehicle itself doesn't have a stat line to reduce to 7 normally but it does when it applies to the Changeling's ability.

Is a Nemesis Force Weapon considered a force weapon when used by any model as it applies to Blessing of the Blood God?

If a Daemon Prince uses Aura of Decay to do a shooting hit on every model within 6 inches and then shoots at a unit with a targeted shooting attack (Daemonic Gaze or Breath of Chaos) is he restricted to only assaulting the second target as Aura of Decay doesn't target anything or does the broad area hit allow him to assault anything within 6 inches?

DA.27A.01 – Q: Can Ravenwing Bikes Turbo-Boost
during their Scout move?
A: No [RAW].
DA.27C.01 – Ravenwing Combat Squads:
Ignore the reference to “scoring units” as the definition of
a scoring unit has since been changed [clarification].

Consistency, anyone?

The Scout USR has since been changed so that Scout bikes MAY Turbo-Boost.

What justification do you have for enforcing one but not the other? You believe it is appropriate to keep a restrictive old rule, but remove a beneficial one, when both should either be thrown out as outdated, or kept in as RAW?

Space Marines: Do either Teleport Homers, Locator Beacons or both work with "Gate of Infinity" (Librarian Psychic Power) ?

Also: Can "Gate of Infinity" be used to escape close combat?

Also: Can "Gate of Infinity" be used by the librarian to leave a unit?

Independent Characters: An independent character can leave a unit with his movement, can the unit also leave him (iirc disembarking from transports it can, normally (on the board) it doesn´t say)?

Trekari wrote:DA.27A.01 – Q: Can Ravenwing Bikes Turbo-Boost
during their Scout move?
A: No [RAW].
DA.27C.01 – Ravenwing Combat Squads:
Ignore the reference to “scoring units” as the definition of
a scoring unit has since been changed [clarification].

Consistency, anyone?

The Scout USR has since been changed so that Scout bikes MAY Turbo-Boost.

What justification do you have for enforcing one but not the other? You believe it is appropriate to keep a restrictive old rule, but remove a beneficial one, when both should either be thrown out as outdated, or kept in as RAW?

Along these same lines, is the FAQ going to say that Sternguard cannot be scoring because "the definition of a scoring unit has since been changed"? If not, why are the special rules of one codex able to make a normally non-scoring unit into a scoring unit and the special rules of another codex do not do so?

I posted this same series of questions as a topic, but would like an official ruling for upcoming FAQ's:

Are monoliths allowed to fire their particle whip while entering from deep strike? If not can it be used to teleport troops?

The rules state that vehicles deep striking count as having moved at cruising speed, but the codex states the particle whip may be fired even if the monolith moves. This was written before the fifth edition rules obviously. Which rule takes precedence? As for teleporting troops I feel as though if a squad can normally disembark after deep striking, then a monolith should be able to bring troops in as both reserves entering play from a monolith portal and when teleporting a unit within 18".

Also, I was wondering if the 'having moved at cruising speed' portion of the deep strike rules relates only to shooting or are sed vehicles also hit on 6's in the enemy's assault phase?

Might not be too much of a question, but...

...in the BRB, during pile-ins, after checking if the distance between both units' models is greater than 12" and finding that it is so, then commencing to do pile-ins for both units...who gets to move his unit first? Though we can estimate that the player whose turn it currently goes first, it actually doesn't say this.

I'm sorry if I happen to have missed relevant discussions/rules about this relatively minor issue.

yakface wrote:


TAU
Do XV-8s that take a markerlight drone get to move and fire the markerlight? The new rulebook gives jet pack units the relentless rule, but the Tau Codex explicitly states XV-8s can never move and fire heavy weapons (p. 27 IIRC I don't have Codex handy). Interestingly, the stealth suit entry doesn't explicitly prohibit the move and fire heavy weapons. As I read it then rulebook's gift of relentless works for them, but not XV-8s.

I'm pretty sure they still can move and fire, the drones count as moving as the squad they are attached to, so they would move as jetpack, making them relentless, only the battlesuit is restricted to not fire heavy weapons and moving. The battlesuit still counts as jetpack, but it is overridden by the specific rules, but the drones arent

I'm pretty sure thats the way it works

Edit : I submitted answers

Edit : I submitted answers

Edit : I submitted answers

Question for Orks that seems to not be resolved satisfactorily:

Can Ork trukks equipped with a boarding plank execute an assault against a Dreadnought or other walker with a weapon skill.

The description and rules seem to imply that an embarked ork gets free attacks against the dread and doesn't get attacked back because the attacks back would break the rules. Some sort of clarification would be nice.

@Yakface- questions from this thread:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/235909.page

1)Are broadsides equipped with A.S.S. limited to only team leaders taking drones or can the whole unit?

2)By RAW are the broadsides even allowed to take the A.S.S.

3)Do crisis suits have to buy drone controllers in order to but drones? This is a RAW problem.

4)RAW suggests that any battlesuit that can take weapons or support systems would be allowed to take from the wargear list, also.(This comes from the third sentence in the lead paragraph of the Battlesuit Armoury entry.)

Thank you for any help or clarification and sorry if this is threadromancy.

Do Thunderfire cannons count as Infantry for purposes of cover saves or Vehicles?

Do Sternguard get their special ammo with Bolt pistols, Storm Bolters and Heavy Bolters(GW rules has said yes before apparently)

Jaidon wrote:Do Thunderfire cannons count as Infantry for purposes of cover saves or Vehicles?

Do Sternguard get their special ammo with Bolt pistols, Storm Bolters and Heavy Bolters(GW rules has said yes before apparently)

P.55 BRB Says that the Weapon is treated like a Vehicle. So it would follow the Vehicle rules for cover.

C:SM says that you replace the Boltgun profile with the special ammo type profile. Since neither Bolt Pistol or Storm Bolter have a Boltguns Profile to replace, they get no benifit from the Special Ammo. As far as I know, now where has GW said otherwise. Any ruling at a GT, GW store or similar event/place does not count as such.

Marius Xerxes wrote:P.55 BRB Says that the Weapon is treated like a Vehicle. So it would follow the Vehicle rules for cover.

This is true, of course since it's in a unit with infantry models it can still gain a cover save if atleast 50% of the unit is in cover from the point of view of the firer, which the crew may satisfy quite easily.

p7 AOBR:
"ZERO-LEVEL CHARACTERISTICS
Some creatures have been given a ‘0’ for certain
characteristics, which means that they have no ability
whatsoever in that field (the same is also occasionally
represented by a ‘–’)."

p 16 AOBR:
"In their Shooting phase, units may
choose to run instead of firing, immediately moving
D6" (we find that this is a popular choice for units
that have no ranged weaponry or no target!)"

So: with no ability, and no weapon a model might not be able to run even though it makes sense to be able to. The ability is not attributed directly to infantry or walkers, rather the ability to shoot.

Editing the sentence above to read:
"we find that this is a popular choice for units
that have no ranged weaponry,BS 0, or no target!"
(although minor )will resolve this.

Edit: Parenthesis added for clarity.

Ok guys, firstly, Yakface has made a new thread for this.

Secondly @Oldgrue, I already answered your question in another thread, why bother cross posting it? Also, you admit that models with no ranged weaponry (and therefore cannot shoot) can run because they say you can, so what is your question?

And WTF does "although minor will resolve this" mean?

@Gwar -
Your position is interpretive and cites only opinion against conflicting source info.
As for the bad grammar, I have only my inattention in school to blame for this. Parentheses added for clarity.

I'm locking this thread as any further questions (that aren't already in the INAT FAQ) should be posted to the new sticky thread at the top of the forum.