1918
Post by: Scottywan82
Sweet! It made it to 50%! Soon, we get to see some sweet, sweet concepts!
Does anyone know how long it took before the android or the zombie concept art came up? I'm really eager to see what Wargames Factory can come up with!
5268
Post by: NO_SUCH_LUCK
Im so excited, I peed a little. Seriously, its' going to take them forever to get this set out.
look at my sig
9950
Post by: RogueMarket
So we just fill it out? And they make it?
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
Basically, yes. Provided 100 people and 1000 sprues "preorder".
5268
Post by: NO_SUCH_LUCK
AFAIK the "preorder" cost's you nothing, it serves the purpose of gauging consumer interest.
If you preorder it stands to reason you would buy the sprue if it were available.
3933
Post by: Kingsley
NAVARRO wrote:http://www.wargamesfactory.com/AnnouncementRetrieve.aspx?ID=21520
Horrible in a bad way... great, now I will skip it all.
Wait until painted pictures come out. The plastic that WGF uses generally looks bad until it's at least primed; just look at the Zulu Wars sprues in comparison to the painted pictures.
5272
Post by: Fallen668
How do these models size up compared to GW? Especially the zombies? I have been looking for a way to do a zombie horde for Apoc.
1084
Post by: Agamemnon2
NAVARRO wrote:http://www.wargamesfactory.com/AnnouncementRetrieve.aspx?ID=21520
Horrible in a bad way... great, now I will skip it all.
I had high hopes for WGF when they started working, but none of those have materialized. Companies like Warlord Games and the Perrys seem to be making consistently higher-quality plastics. Everything I'm seeing off WGF, on the other hand, seems to have the same general theme: soft, blobby detail.
5268
Post by: NO_SUCH_LUCK
IMHO, when painted up they look as good as any others.
3933
Post by: Kingsley
Yeah, like I said earlier, wait for the paintjobs before you dismiss the kit. The plastic used by WGF is "shiny" and does not lend itself well to pictures, but the detail really comes out once the models are painted or even just primed. This doesn't look bad at all, but the sprues for that line looked just as bad as the zombie ones when the prerelease pics came out.
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Post by: Vaktathi
Finally these are getting somewhere 
When I submitted the idea, I wish I'd put in some more detail than I did, looking back it really doesn't seem that descriptive.
I just submitted a suggestions for two other sets to go along with these.
One set is for a heavy weapons team with things like mortars, RPG rocket teams, light autocannons (PaK38 style) etc...
Another is for a special weapons sprue with things like a grenade launcher, LMG, panzerfaust type rocket (to represent a meltagun) etc...
Those should be up hopefully within a couple days here, I'll post links when they get them up, so preorder them too
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
Any idea how long it takes WGF to get pics up of the the "sketches"?
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
*Double post*
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
Well, I think they said they start work once it reaches 500 preorders, I'd expect to start seeing stuff get posted in the next week or two here, if the preorders keep coming we'll probably have the sprue out in time for the IG codex release
5268
Post by: NO_SUCH_LUCK
We can only hope.\
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
Woot almost 600 pre-orders!
5269
Post by: lord_blackfang
I tried preordering 20 sprues but the confirmation mail said that I just preordered female zombies :\
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
lord_blackfang wrote:I tried preordering 20 sprues but the confirmation mail said that I just preordered female zombies :\
O_O
That is...a bit weird.
Try shooting them an email maybe?
11776
Post by: Vertrucio
While they do look better painted, they would look even better with proper detailing on the miniature itself, rather than having to paint it in.
Admittedly, they have just the right amount of detail for tabletop miniatures, and their sprues are very affordable.
Paint them up with a table quality paint job and they work great. Just don't expect collector's quality.
5675
Post by: Kettu
I have a question; why is it out of the three or four different companies that do Celtic warriors in plastic sprues none of them do female ones?
On topic though, once I see the great-coat concepts then I might put my name down, we'll see though.
3081
Post by: chaplaingrabthar
Kettu wrote:I have a question; why is it out of the three or four different companies that do Celtic warriors in plastic sprues none of them do female ones?
Because girls are icky? 
7375
Post by: BrookM
It would require exposed chests, something that would be a complete hit with the target audience, but less so with the target audience's mothers.
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Post by: Agamemnon2
Actually, the historical wargames companies don't much care for that sort of thing. I know Warlord Games has several Celts who're not wearing a stich, with anatomically correct genitalia and all. It could just be that according to whatever sources they use, female warriors are ahistorical.
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
we're at 66% now
9950
Post by: RogueMarket
So close yet so far.
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
They won't go all the way until we see concepts. So let's see the concepts already!!
11295
Post by: Fattimus_maximus
Looking at their older stuff, I'm liking it, I'll think about it.
11295
Post by: Fattimus_maximus
Would anybody get mad if you use this in tourney army?
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
Fattimus_maximus wrote:Would anybody get mad if you use this in tourney army?
An official GW tournament probably would, an independent game store probably wouldn't care much.
518
Post by: Kid_Kyoto
An indy game store might, if they don't carry WGF stuff.
7375
Post by: BrookM
Uhm, wow?
That commander in particular looks nice.
518
Post by: Kid_Kyoto
Are the heads seperate? I like the bodies but not the heads and would swap in pig iron.
But I like them.
978
Post by: Shattered Soul
I'm with Kyoto. Those bodies are rockin'... but alas those heads make me want to vomit out obscenities and yell about Russians.
7561
Post by: MOTN
These are one piece (minus the rifle) to make things easier (casting, preparing/assembling: i want a LOT of these. Not to mention cheaper: fiddly little head sprues and what not really add up...) The heads can come off easily with some scalpel work. I might make some separate heads down the line.
FYI they size up with GW plastics, I'll get some comparison pics when I have the casts:
Next up will be the veterans with some armour and gas masks:
My Modelling thread has a load of other stuff(Trench Guard), it's only when I get the casts back and paint them that they go up in the store.
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
71% !
almost there!
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
Too bad we still haven't seen what we're buying...
518
Post by: Kid_Kyoto
Scottywan82 wrote:Too bad we still haven't seen what we're buying...
We're not 'buying' anything. No money down, they don't have our credit card numbers. We're supporting the idea with a commitment.
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Post by: Wehrkind
What manner of commitment?
And I gotta ask, not directed solely at Troll Forged, but why is it that IG guns are always pointed in odd directions? Straight off to the side is a really wierd way to hold a rifle you are planning to shoot shortly, as is any position where the butt is outside your arm. Granted, such positions are reasonable for infantry on parade grounds or standing sentry or something, but why do guardsmen never seem to be in actual fighting poses?
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Post by: augustus5
Because Space Marines are made for fighting. Guard are made for dying.
518
Post by: Kid_Kyoto
Wehrkind wrote:What manner of commitment?
Literally, it's a commitment. Say how many you want, put down your name and address. NO CREDIT CARD NUMBER.
So I guess they can hassle you when it comes out but I think the main thing is if you're going to type in all that data you must mean it.
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Post by: Agamemnon2
Wehrkind wrote:What manner of commitment?
And I gotta ask, not directed solely at Troll Forged, but why is it that IG guns are always pointed in odd directions? Straight off to the side is a really wierd way to hold a rifle you are planning to shoot shortly, as is any position where the butt is outside your arm. Granted, such positions are reasonable for infantry on parade grounds or standing sentry or something, but why do guardsmen never seem to be in actual fighting poses?
I guess a part of it is that "heroic scale" minis don't really bend to realistic poses well enough to look realistic.
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Post by: RogueMarket
Ice - If you make em gas head mask = win.
437
Post by: Sgt.Roadkill
are they gonna be multi part?
cause love the coats.... hat ethe heads
although i lov ethe moustache
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Post by: Wehrkind
Kid Kyoto: Yea, that's what I was wondering, how much was "Ok, I promise you cash when they are finished," and how much was "I would totally buy that! (Disclaimer: I have the spending power of a squirrel.)"
I was a tad worried that 4 years from now when I have whitteled my fingers down to ulcerous stubs and am too hopped up on paint to care I would get an email from a nice gentleman saying "The great coat guard sprues are finished! You pre-ordered... 473. Please send us the 624.76$ you owe us."
Aggy: That might well be the case. The tau are not too bad though, nor the space marines.
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Post by: MOTN
Nah these aren't multi-part: as mentioned it's to keep costs down having them one piece. Heads and waists can be sliced and repositioned easily (i kept the joins flat) and there's another 4 or 5 poses on their way (more firing and running) along with gas masks.
Working on some plain greatcoat torso's and legs that will be compatable with cadian plastics buy I'm not sure they'd sell.
978
Post by: Shattered Soul
IceSword wrote:Nah these aren't multi-part: as mentioned it's to keep costs down having them one piece. Heads and waists can be sliced and repositioned easily (i kept the joins flat) and there's another 4 or 5 poses on their way (more firing and running) along with gas masks.
Working on some plain greatcoat torso's and legs that will be compatable with cadian plastics buy I'm not sure they'd sell.
I'd buy 'em buddy. Your sculpts are wicked awesome.
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Post by: Vaktathi
82%, almost there
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
Still no pics though, eh?
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Post by: Vaktathi
They haven't updated anything since their last email. A couple other kits are also approaching the 1000 mark, hopefully we will see pics of the greatcoats and other kits very soon.
Hopefully it will be coming up soon.
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
What last email?
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Post by: Vaktathi
The last roundup they did I think at the end of Feb.
519
Post by: Noble713
Wehrkind wrote:What manner of commitment?
And I gotta ask, not directed solely at Troll Forged, but why is it that IG guns are always pointed in odd directions? Straight off to the side is a really wierd way to hold a rifle you are planning to shoot shortly
It's only a slightly-exaggerated depiction of the Ready Position. I've seen South Koreans pulling guard duty at far stranger positions: with the buttstock resting on the hip, and the hand gripping the handguard. Not exactly a fast and responsive position for someone pulling perimeter security in a country that is still technically at war with its neighbor. Biggest pic I could find
as is any position where the butt is outside your arm. Granted, such positions are reasonable for infantry on parade grounds or standing sentry or something, but why do guardsmen never seem to be in actual fighting poses?
When room-clearing with a full-length rifle (like, say, an M16A2...or a Lasgun), it's pretty normal to rest the buttstock up on the shoulder (definitely a position where the butt is outside the arm). It shortens the overall length of the weapon, making for better maneuverability indoors, and any loss of accuracy is negligible since you are shooting at people who are literally within spitting distance.
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Post by: pnweerar
84%. I signed up for a few. Maybe they'll have Nazi-looking helmets. Add GS pickelhaubes and I can be as happy as pig in slops  .
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Post by: Vaktathi
90% preordered, only 100 left to go!
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Post by: Agamemnon2
I wonder how many of those pre-orderers will be actually be interested in acquiring the finished sprue. I'm betting 10% if they're lucky. It's just so easy to click a button that says "Yeah! These would be totally cool!" and a lot harder to shell out the cold hard cash. Of course, considering how popular a request to GW the trenchcoat infantry is, I should thing it'd be a successful enough of a product for WGF.
I wonder how well the zombie set they did is selling?
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Post by: lord_blackfang
It looks less and less likely that I'll honor my preorder as the project seems to be moving away from what it was supposed to be. I get the feeling that people who want an entirely different set of models are trying to hijack a project that has more preorders than their own (those being near-future Russians and zombie survivors)
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
I just need to see the final figures. I thought they released sketches WAY earlier than this.
Then again, the website bullet list hasn't been updated in weeks, so why am I surprised?
1084
Post by: Agamemnon2
lord_blackfang wrote:It looks less and less likely that I'll honor my preorder as the project seems to be moving away from what it was supposed to be. I get the feeling that people who want an entirely different set of models are trying to hijack a project that has more preorders than their own (those being near-future Russians and zombie survivors)
Not sharing everyone's view on what a trenchcoat soldier of the future should look like is quite likely. Until they show up with a sketch, it's very much a crap shoot, and given their stagnation problems, that might never even happen. If I had the inclination towards a Guard army of that nature, I'd seriously look toward Pig Iron in the meantime.
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Post by: Vaktathi
Everyone lets wait until they release an initial sketch before we start speculating on how you think they are moving away from an idea or something. If the previews turn out crap, then oh well, go for gold on the complaining. But until then, wait for the sketches or preview sculpts.
As for pre-order honors, I doubt that they actually fully intend everyone who pre-ordered to follow through. If they get a quarter they'll probably make a profit and call it good. If the sculpts are good and solid, they'll probably sell a lot.
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
only 15 sets left, 1.5%
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
Still no pics.
11776
Post by: Vertrucio
After beating Killzone 2, and looking at the prices for Deathkorps models, I think I'm willing to try a healthy middle ground here for my IG army, also usable for several other games like the upcoming AE-Bounty and Vor 2.0.
I just ordered the last 15 sprues needed. However, they'll need to be up to my standards before I buy them. But, at least the pre-order lets me get my voice in.
Looking at the other models they've made I know what I'm getting. They use ABS plastic by the looks of it, same stuff that the old mongoose Starship Troopers game used. I know from experience that these paint up pretty well despite not having the same amount of detail as other sculpts and plastic types.
I also really like their system/concept for what they manufacture. It's a great meld of internet community building, a bit of marketing, and an easier way to gauge market interest before producing costly models.
I do think their sculpt, casting, and maybe art quality could be better, I wouldn't mind seeing an option for higher quality stuff, but at a higher price.
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
Apparently they are in the process of sculpting and will have screenshots available in the next 7 days or so.
It was popular enough that they opened up preorders again to allow for up to 2000 for this particular project.
Lets hope the screenies make us proud
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
No lie! I'll Edit the subject
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
No lie! I'll Edit the subject
5268
Post by: NO_SUCH_LUCK
Very exiting!
91
Post by: Hordini
Pics or it didn't happen.
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Post by: Vaktathi
We have some extremely early and rough renders now.
They are asking for feedback and changes
Comments on these can be made here: http://wargamesfactory.lefora.com/2009/01/29/sci-fi-greatcoat-infantry/page1/
This one is very DKoKish
really not a fan of the helmet here, but if they changed the coat and helmet to closer to the first render, this would be very very cool.
7375
Post by: BrookM
The head looks ass, the rest looks okay. Personally I'd go without the whole nazis in space look just this once.
8021
Post by: JD21290
the heads on the 2nd ones look gak, other than that they should be pretty good for traitor guard 
the 1st ones look pretty good
just waiting to see a standard machine gun / shotgun kombi wep on em now.
instant hellghast
518
Post by: Kid_Kyoto
this news probably deserves a new thread.
Personally I like the less-techy top guy.
The bottom guy is more of a generic high-tech trooper.
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
The bottom one looks like gak. Hope they produce the top one.
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
I'd like to see a pic of the second render with the first ones head. I think it has promise, I like the armor if it was adjusted a bit, and would help differentiate the models from the DKoK.
1084
Post by: Agamemnon2
I think the second one is more interesting in an aeshtetic sense, the first one is just too Nazis-in-space for me. Both have promise, the second one's gaskmask/helmet heads aren't quite to my taste, but I don't like the plain Stahlhelm + gas mask combo either.
8907
Post by: cadbren
With a seperate helmet on top, that second version would make a nice stormtrooper.
I think more people are looking for something like the first one though. I imagine they'll make it look better than that though, the belt seems to be hovering around his waist and his waist is too low. The helmet is also wrong, it needs a bigger peak at the front and should be much bigger overall. The high tech mask doesn't fit in well with the rest of the uniform either, they should have kept with the old style and gone with a gasmask with a big tube at the front.
I think they're been influenced by the anime about the Jin Roh, all they're missing is the MG-34.
4670
Post by: Wehrkind
Good call on the belt, that is a LOT low. It should be up closer to his elbows, not his hands. Likewise on the peak in front, there should be almost a little shade brim on the front of the helmet.
Possibly little shoulder plates would be cool too. I don't mind the techiness of the gas mask too much, though a lower tech look would probably be an improvement.
And Noble713, that's exactly what I am talking about. The Euro Ready Position in that picture is not the sort of position someone is in when they expect to be shot at in the next 3 minutes. A low ready or high ready would be much more appropriate for someone in an active combat zone, as most 40k figures are considering the entire engagement is a very short amount of time.
Granted, I could see the use for some of the other poses for say command squads, or the occaisional trooper on sentry duty, but the ratio seems to be the opposite of what it should be, with many guys putzing around and only a few ready to fight. Just an observation.
4412
Post by: George Spiggott
I'm not keen on the German helmet or the pinned back coat. Where's that Jes Goodwin pic of the Guardsman marching through the snow? That's what I want.
That or padded coats like the Brettonian men at arms. Heads are the least important part as the're the most easily replaced.
752
Post by: Polonius
I like them. I'm not madly in love with any of them, but they look nice. I'd like to see what they're doing for weapons though.
6005
Post by: Death By Monkeys
See, I'm not so worried about the heads or the arms - you can easily drop a pair of Cadian arms onto them for what you need. I'm more concerned with seeing them in different poses. Right now, they just look like Kenner Star Wars figures. I feel like the first one looks kind of frumpy - not a whole lot of shape to the torso. The second one looks too alien for my taste - kinda Dark Eldar-y, actually.
Personally, though, I could see using the legs from the top one and combine it with Cadian torsos and arms, throw a Pig Iron head on top and call it good!
320
Post by: Platuan4th
I prefer the 2nd one, it's more generic use sci-fi.
If I wanted DKoK, I'd buy them.
Oh wait, I did.
1736
Post by: Jay of Moore
I would like a blend of the two. The first is too bland. The second looks like he's wearing overstylized hockey pads, not to mention that his "chest plate" doesn't cover his chest while reducing the range of motion by covering his abdomen.
I would go with one because I'll take a little drab over overdetailed any day, as it's easy to add detail, a pain to take it away. Also there has been questions regarding the ability of the plastic Wargames Factory uses in their models to retain details, so a plainer model would be better than a detailed model whose details look like crap.
1084
Post by: Agamemnon2
For what it's worth (not a lot), the WGF zombies look nicer painted than they ever did either in renders or on the sprue.
519
Post by: Noble713
I'd definitely take the first one. The only thing I don't like is the pinned-back coat.
The second looks *terrible* IMO, like he borrowed some armor plates from a Chaos Marine or Dark Eldar warrior and strapped them onto his trench coat. As low as that breastplate is attached, if he bent over at the waist he'd crush the family jewels.
And what are those ridges on the boots for?
Platuan4th wrote:If I wanted DKoK, I'd buy them.
I think a substantial portion of the people trying to get plastic greatcoat infantry from the Wargames Factory are folks who are unable/unwilling to buy DKoK from Forgeworld. I know there's no way in Hell I'm paying $5/piece for rank & file infantry. So if you love the style but hate the price, what do you do? Get someone else to produce a rough approximation for far cheaper.
1084
Post by: Agamemnon2
Noble713 wrote:I think a substantial portion of the people trying to get plastic greatcoat infantry from the Wargames Factory are folks who are unable/unwilling to buy DKoK from Forgeworld. I know there's no way in Hell I'm paying $5/piece for rank & file infantry. So if you love the style but hate the price, what do you do? Get someone else to produce a rough approximation for far cheaper.
I think "substantial portion" is an understatement. The project has been about getting ersatz Death Korps from day one. As someone who can't afford DK, I would much rather see WGF do something less specifically 40k, but I believe this particular venture will sink or swim based on how well/badly the minis off the sprue counterfeit GW aesthetics.
8842
Post by: dashrendar
I like the second one if you put the 1st ones head on it and remove the whole chest peice thing. I really like the legs and arms of the 2nd one.
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
Here's some 'shoops someone did of the 2nd one with the 1st ones head and some changes to the armor
And a more subdued armor type
6005
Post by: Death By Monkeys
You can subdue that armor all you like, but unless it's designed so it can bend at the waist, you're gonna smush your gribblies! The subdued look is better, but there's still the problem of the codpiece that is over and above where a codpiece should actually go. That 'v'-shaped top to it is just unwearable!
1084
Post by: Agamemnon2
At any rate, these are concept art, nothing more. If they havent even decided whether they want to do futurist stormtroopers or space nazis, I doubt they're wedded to a specific design of body armor either.
7375
Post by: BrookM
Their anatomy is even worse than GW's!
1084
Post by: Agamemnon2
True, but even if these go to production, we'll have lost nothing. WGF on the other hand is more than likely going to suffer a financial kick in the nadgers for producing an expensive sprue that in all likelihood will sell badly. A couple more of these and they'll be out of business for sure.
Me, I give them 9-18 months.
1969
Post by: Raxor
So Helghast knockoffs. Is that what The People want?
1084
Post by: Agamemnon2
I'd rather have Helghast knockoffs than either DK knockoffs or Space Nazis. But if i had my druthers, I'd have none of the above.
4670
Post by: Wehrkind
I would be comfortable with that. I just want them to look like they are from or fighting in a very harsh environment that requires insulation and protection from the elements.
Whether as affordable DKoK, Helghast knockoffs or the fellow in the snow/ash from the now famous picture, I don't care much. Nothing says gritty to me like those images.
4670
Post by: Wehrkind
What is it with you and Space Nazis Aggy?
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
If you don't want helghast, space nazis or DKOK, what exactly did you want from this? those ARE the descriptions.
5421
Post by: JohnHwangDD
The helmeted head is good, but the greatcoat is unimpressive and causes the model to look feminine. The narrow shoulders, flared waist / thighs messes up the shoulder-waist-hip proportions. A broader greatcoat with more overlap might be nice. Especially with a trenchcoat / duster-style "cape" that flares off the shoulders. Armored shoulderpads would help tremendously. If the legs don't have the coat skirting pinned back, that would be good, as the overall shape would be more of an hourglass than a pyramid..
The armor on the 2nd is goofy overdone in a bad way, and I wouldn't have any interest in such a model.
But yeah, it'd be great if these guys actually knew what a trenchcoat or duster looked like...
1084
Post by: Agamemnon2
I guess they were fools not to relese these renders before now, given the overwhelmingly negative response we're getting. Had we see these at the 50% mark, there would be much less "preorders", I believe.
7375
Post by: BrookM
I would like to point out that the internets are bigger than just Dakka.
320
Post by: Platuan4th
BrookM wrote:I would like to point out that the internets are bigger than just Dakka.
I think what Agamemnon means is that, if you take Dakka as a microcosm of the whole of those who preordered, there must be a lot of people who will back out.
Not saying I agree with him, but I can see where he's coming from.
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
Raxor wrote:So Helghast knockoffs. Is that what The People want?
Agamemnon2 wrote:I'd rather have Helghast knockoffs than either DK knockoffs or Space Nazis. But if i had my druthers, I'd have none of the above.
Umm...out of curiosity, did you guys not read the original description of the sprue? Really?
I guess they were fools not to relese these renders before now, given the overwhelmingly negative response we're getting.
The response on *dakka* is negative maybe (EDIT: but then when is Dakka ever *not* negative?), on their own forums it's far from it. People here are just are basically assuming these are the final production models or at least acting like it. People need to comment on the WF forums on changes, thats what they are there for and they are listening.
Everyone needs to remember these are very rough initial renders in a neutral pose, not anything close to production models, they are there to criticize and nitpick, and to get an idea of what people would like to see, please go over to their forums and comment on any changes you would like to see.
46
Post by: alarmingrick
the shopped pics looks like a snowtrooper from "Empire Strikes Back"!
1736
Post by: Jay of Moore
I don't see why everyone is being so negative about these preliminary designs. It seems to me that they put out these two drastically different mock ups to gauge what people are interested in so that they can ultimately produce a model that a lot of people have interest in. How many worthless models have GW put out that could have been improved if they actually got some community feedback in the design stage. Just off the top of my head the performance enhanced catachans, the hug me brood lord and the metal possessed models are all good concepts that with just a little tweaking could have been good. Instead they're so bad it's hard to understand how they even got made.
As for them making Helghast, Jin Roh or Death Korps knockoffs, what were you expecting? There's only so much you can do when you start with the description "Trench Coat + Gas Masks," and frankly they'll probably sell better if they mimic an already popular style as opposed to trying to come up with with something completely unique when there's no background or game to tie it to. Without the popularity of some other universe to exploit only a few hard core gamers looking to fill a specific niche would buy them, then again I guess I just described a significant percentage of the regular posters at Dakka which explains a lot of the negativity.
As it stands my interest is piqued with these early designs and if the final models are any good I'm looking at buying enough for ~150 models, and I'm not one of the people who made a pre-order.
5462
Post by: adamsouza
Vaktathi wrote:Here's some 'shoops someone did of the 2nd one with the 1st ones head and some changes to the armor
Awe come on man, I use the same screen name on both sites !!!
It was an quick and dirty attempt to visualize what was being discussed in the thread.
I don't think anyone is particularly thrilled with the belt or crotch armor, but that wasn't discussed untill afterwoods.
6772
Post by: Vaktathi
adamsouza wrote:
Awe come on man, I use the same screen name on both sites !!!
Ah sorry, I had forgotten the name and didn't realize you were posting on both.
Your efforts to better visualize everything are much appreciated
5462
Post by: adamsouza
Just read through the rest of this thread. FWIW the people who matter, you know the one who acutally pre-ordered, seem pretty happy for the most part. It took something like 2-3 weeks to collect 100 people who collectively ordered over 1000 sprues. If you don't like them that's fine, but they've pretty much managed to collect enough orders through online and word of mouth to break even, without you.
They are in plastic. You know, that material that is soo much easier to work with than resin and white metal. If GW would produce trenchcoat plastics we could all die happy, but they don't. Wargames Factory was kind enough to do so.
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Post by: Scottywan82
Well, I preordered, and if that's what they look like, they can forget actually seeing my money.
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Post by: jamsessionein
I chucked this up on their thread for it. This took me about 30 seconds, but it's all I'd really want (maybe with the arms a touch shorter)
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Post by: Noble713
^^I'd buy that in a heartbeat.
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Post by: Foda_Bett
Damn Ein... I'll take 4 platoons please.
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Post by: ph34r
Indeed. I would love if the models looked like that concept.
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Post by: Vaktathi
Scottywan82 wrote:Well, I preordered, and if that's what they look like, they can forget actually seeing my money.
Again, they are early renders to gauge what direction people want them to go in, they are far from final products and will likely go through many revisions.
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
jamsessionein wrote:I chucked this up on their thread for it.
A Jin-Roh Panzer Cop wearing a greatcoat?
Works for me!
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Post by: Polonius
I really like that concept piece. I want something I can use as "counts as" sisters of battle, so cheap plastics would be perfect.
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Post by: smiling Assassin
I think they'd look good with the current Cadian Heads (the first one).
sA
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Post by: niceguyteddy
I have been following this with great interest and I have to say I’m a bit disappointed with the space nazi direction. I like the Pig Iron figs but I feel they don’t fit too well with my Steel Legion. I am looking for figs to do some conscripts with and would use these new plastics if they fit well.
I think what is available should be taken into account when designing these. Of course there are the Death Korps of Krieg based on largely on French WW1, but these are quite expensive. Pig Iron has some nice great coats for reasonable price, very si-fi and head swaps available to make cold weather looking. Valhallan and Steel Legion are both available form GW direct, again price is an issue. Valahallan have a Russian WW2 look. SL have si-fi storm trooper look to them with the German WW2 airborne helmet (could be the studio yellow coats pain scheme making me think that).
Having said that I think a good great coat plastic at a good price would do really well. Perhaps something as simple as changing the helmet to something more generic would help. I’m not sure about the exposed armor, looks campy to me.
My 2 cents.
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Post by: SlaveToDorkness
I liek the second one, for a good Sci-Fi feel it has it.
The first one looks like DKoK in a Wallace and Grommit movie!
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
[quote=niceguyteddythere are the Death Korps of Krieg based on largely on French WW1,
Um, as I see it, those are German-styled helmets, not French.
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Post by: ph34r
The helmets are sorta like German WWII helmets. They have French helmet crests, and French uniforms.
EDIT: And does anyone know when we will be getting updated renders?
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Post by: adamsouza
I think they are letting us have a field day submitting our own edits.
My latest was
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Post by: Wehrkind
JamSessionEin wins again! He may design and build all my models, forever and ever.
They need to produce that man, en masse, in plastic. Then they can have lots of my money.
And by "that man" I mean either Ein's pictured soldier, or Ein himself. Either army would be awesome.
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Post by: niceguyteddy
Um, as I see it, those are German-styled helmets, not French.
Helmet yes, the rest no.
Now I really like the WW1 armor and trench coat. Something still needs to be done with the helmet though.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
It's funny how many people are gripping they don't like the concept art.
IT'S CONCEPT ART! If you don't like gripe on the WGF forum and make suggestions.
Imagine if GW did this? Imagine if they'd run those damn Cadian helmets by the fans first? or if they'd asked what fans wanted before going all in with the Catachans?
So this is it, the mythical COMPANY THAT LISTENS. So let's talk to them, not just gripe!
http://wargamesfactory.lefora.com/2009/01/29/sci-fi-greatcoat-infantry/page45/
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Post by: Scottywan82
People hate the Cadian helmets? Why?
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
I don't think I'm alone in this but I can't stand the design, they look too... toy-like. they just don't look military.
Plus I want some gas mask heads on the sprue.
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Post by: Shepherd23
i agree with the gas mask comment. I recently decided to spend money without using brains first and bought a pack of the forgeworld gas mask heads. I wish that the price was better as I cannot afford to pay US$100 for 2 squads of ten infantry. As it is I will be improvising with the set I already purchased so that I can get those heads on more guys.
And I cant wait to see the design that is finally used for the trenchcoat guys. I personal loved the heavy armor concept art and hope they go with that one.
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
Scottywan82 wrote:People hate the Cadian helmets? Why?
 RL Cadian helmet
1918
Post by: Scottywan82
All I see is a red X
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Post by: Kagar
I can't help it but these renders look like they just escaped from a Wallece and Gromit episode.
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Post by: Peredyne
I like the first render helmet with the second render body.
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Post by: LunaHound
"I can read your mind"
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Post by: Scottywan82
That is wicked, actually
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Post by: Neconilis
Indeed, the psyker one is very impressive.
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Post by: number9dream
.. I want that psyker. Not sure for what but it looks sweet!
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Post by: Scottywan82
Is the floating dude not a creation by LunaHound? I thought he was just fething around with their models.
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Post by: Shepherd23
OMFG!!! I really hope that is an actual concept and not just someone farting around with us. I would love if each box has a guy like that. That is actually a hell of alot better looking than any of the other concepts. I think if we can get regular guys with the first helmet and a "modified" second body and each box containing one of these guys then I know I will be buying more than the 3 boxes I pre reged for. PLEASE! PLEASE! PLEASE!
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
Those renders were the first draft, this seems to be the current idea
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Post by: Bottle
Scottywan82 wrote:Is the floating dude not a creation by LunaHound? I thought he was just fething around with their models.
It's Psycho Mantis from the Metal Gear Solid video games.
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Post by: LunaHound
Scottywan82 wrote:Is the floating dude not a creation by LunaHound? I thought she was just fething around with their models.
Oh no lol you give me too much credit you think i can make that o_o?
thats why i typed " i can read your mind" its what that guy in the picture says xD
though its definitely a suitable model imo .
better than their 2 concepts
a) failed Jin Roh
b) someone dressing in great coat with jet plane gear ontop of it.
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
I'll agree with the poster who said the shoulders need to be broader. Overall I prefer the actual greatcoat render to the techno-corset & crotch-guard.
And the German-style helmet isn't that big a deal. I just want these Great Coat Infantry to have actual greatcoats and not have them covered up with useless techno-junk just to avoid being sued by GW.
If they could find a balance between Death Korp, Hellgast and City 17 Metro Cop they'd look pretty good.
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Post by: LunaHound
This is my version of greatcoat ( muwhaha male version use your own imagination )
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
I love the dainty way she's holding the machinegun with her fingers.
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Post by: Neconilis
Over 9000 hours of work and it shows =)
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Post by: Ghost in the Darkness
So when will we be actually able to buy these things?
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Post by: Neil
I don't really like the "wearing armour over a greatcoat" look. It just looks awkward.
Surely you'd wear the greatcoat over the armour?
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Post by: LunaHound
Neil wrote:I don't really like the "wearing armour over a greatcoat" look. It just looks awkward.
Surely you'd wear the greatcoat over the armour?
Not sure, but thats extra materials used to be able to wrap around the armor making it really poofy
when they arnt wearing armor beneath
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Post by: whitedragon
Why do they have to have big weird armor (the second concept looks terrible)...why can't they just wear big trenchcoats maybe with epaulets or shoulder pads? Is it too much to ask to wear armor under the trench coat? And the pinned back coat looks TERRIBLE.
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
whitedragon wrote:why can't they just wear big trenchcoats
QFT.
Why can't they just be Greatcoat infantry. Being Greatcoat infantry doesn't mean they have to be Space-Nazis, it doesn't mean they have to be Hellghast knock-offs, and they certainly don't have to wear ugly looking techno-armour over the top.
Just have sci-fi guys in Greatcoats with cool looking helmets and gasmasks. Ensure they're compatable with GW minis, and done!
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Post by: cadbren
I can't find a decent picture at the moment, but I'd like to see something like the Imperial Trenchers from Warzone.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
LunaHound wrote:better than their 2 concepts
a) failed Jin Roh
b) someone dressing in great coat with jet plane gear ontop of it.
H.B.M.C. wrote:I'll agree with the poster who said the shoulders need to be broader. Overall I prefer the actual greatcoat render to the techno-corset & crotch-guard.
And the German-style helmet isn't that big a deal. I just want these Great Coat Infantry to have actual greatcoats and not have them covered up with useless techno-junk just to avoid being sued by GW.
If they could find a balance between Death Korp, Hellgast and City 17 Metro Cop they'd look pretty good.
whitedragon wrote:Why do they have to have big weird armor (the second concept looks terrible)...why can't they just wear big trenchcoats maybe with epaulets or shoulder pads? Is it too much to ask to wear armor under the trench coat? And the pinned back coat looks TERRIBLE.
This need not be an academic disucssion. The design is still very much in play with the sculptor posting regular changes, asking for feedback and acting on the feedback.
http://wargamesfactory.lefora.com/forum/category/science-fiction-submissions/page1/
Honestly what's the point of attacking the design here (and BTW the renders Luna posted have been revised many, many times) when you could be helpful working on it on their site.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
cadbren wrote:I can't find a decent picture at the moment, but I'd like to see something like the Imperial Trenchers from Warzone.
As I understand the debate RATHER LARGE shoulderpads were turned down early on as too-GWesque/Space Marine and not appealing to enough people.
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Post by: Shattered Soul
Seriously, if you wore armor with a great coat it would be over the coat so when you got shot all they have to do is take it off and not struggle with getting your coat off first and letting you freeze to death when you go into shock.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
plus the coat is there to keep you warm, the armor to keep bullets and such away.
You want the coat close to your body and the armor outside so it can be nice and thick.
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Post by: stonefox
Shattered Soul wrote:Seriously, if you wore armor with a great coat it would be over the coat so when you got shot all they have to do is take it off and not struggle with getting your coat off first and letting you freeze to death when you go into shock.
Yep, just like your avatar the (important) krieg dudes also wore their armor on the outside. But don't let that get in the way of people wanting to get their cheap krieg stand-ins because having armor over the coat makes them look too different. 
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Post by: whitedragon
I was saying that so we could just have the great coat on the outside, which is what looks the coolest IMHO. Also, arguing realism as it applies to 40k is worthless.
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Post by: adamsouza
They are in armor becuase the majority of people who preordered and followed the discussion in the thread asked for it.
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Post by: ph34r
Yes. Complaining about how they are turning out over here does nothing. If they are not as you like them, then you should have done something about it, like posting your opinion in the thread over there.
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Post by: whitedragon
I'm not going to buy them either way, so I'm not going to post over there. I just think it was a really good idea that is being...wasted by poor concepts, in much the same way as I disliked Dr. Thunder's female guardsmen commission. I wasn't really interested either way, but the finished product sealed the deal that I wouldn't be buying them.
Since I'm not one of the ones that this product is being marketed to, my input really doesn't mean all that much, but as a collector of interesting models, or for someone that may someday decide to collect guard, these don't really do anything for me at all.
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Post by: Savnock
I for one like the current draft of the concept. It will look great in 28mm, and isn't too busy (thus very adaptable to other lines, like 40K). As for the "Space Nazis" theme, if the heads are separate, adaptation to "Space Russkies" or any other space-whatever-WWI-II will be easy. WGF will win with this one if they make it a good foundation for conversion as well as a decent fully-finished figure. Their market slice will be adaptation for converters, plus stand-ins for the less motivated/obsessed hobbyists.
And man, I loved those Warzone minis. I have a ton, and with the new IG codex they will finally see the light of day again. Human wave attack imminent!
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
Looks like things are getting close!
Um, okay fellas. I've been dealing with the 600 overdue L&U submissions. I think there are more yet to come ---
I have a brief from Tony to tell him what needs to be on the sprue.
Here's a choice. We've discovered that we can get six skinny chaps with no equipment at all on a sprue - the zombies. We can get 5 plus extra helmets and rifles on a sprue - the Zulu War British.
What we have here are fairly bulky figures (because A) they are consciously 'heroic' and B) they are in greatcoats and body armour). We've had a lot of discussion about what kind of gear they come with, ranging from the backpacks/no backpacks thing, the "I'd like a flamethrower" thing, the combat shotguns, the FG42s modified, the wish for a bigger SAW type thing, the extra pouches, the officers head with caps, the sergeant with a sidecap, the bunny ears, the rocket propelled chainsaw (or was that some other thread?)
Anyhow, it seems to me that the choice is probably -
1) a four figure sprue with core equipment (no backpacks, a standard gun for everyone, probably one each of the SAW, shotgun, maybe officer's head)
2) A three figure sprue with everything up to a combine harvester and a fridge full of 28mm beer.
In terms of cost, that probably means (at $5 per sprue) a difference of paying $1.25 per figure and $1.66. Plus all the gear of course.
What I need each of you to do ASAP is tell me A) which you'd prefer, and B) given that preference, what you'd put onto the sprue.
No saying, "Four figures plus all the gear, anyway." Laws of sprue design are immutable.
I also note that there are 1100 posts on this thread, so if you had a great idea at post 236, please do not expect me to go looking for it. It's taken me an hour to read everything I'd missed since, er, Tuesday. If you really want a jetpack/apple peeler combo, tell me now! (and also, what it's replacing from the other stuff!)
So if you want to make some substancial input this is the time!
http://wargamesfactory.lefora.com/2009/01/29/sci-fi-greatcoat-infantry/page56/#post7906359
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
And if anyone is wondering, this was my vote
I vote for 3 men plus the works.
3 bodies (running, standing, kneeling)
4 sets of rifle arms (either seperate rifle or at least left hand on the left arm, not left hand on the rifle), 2 aiming, 1 in the air, 1 lowered
4 rifles (one spare), NO BULLPUP so they're easy to replace with other guns
1 SAW (there are plenty of GW plastic flamers around)
1 phallic energy gun (ie GW plasma gun)
1 head with helmet but gasmask off, bare face
1 head with improved comms/vision
3 back packs
1 pistol arm
1 pointing arm
2 knife arms
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Post by: adamsouza
1 phallic energy gun (ie GW plasma gun)
I will never be able to look at one the same way now that you've said that.
Although it does give me an idea for a Slaneesh army...
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
"Bloodstorm! Ravenblade! Slayer of worlds! Felt the power throb in his weapon. He clutched it tightly in his hand and turned towards his foe letting it build in the twin energy spheres and then finally! RELEASE! The throbbing weapon ejaculated burning white fluid over them as Bloodstorm! Ravenblade! laughed manfully!" - From the epic novel, Bloodstorm! Ravenblade! Obliterates! the! Universe! coming in 2010 from the Black Library
MAXIMUM! VIOLENCE! NOW!
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Post by: Vertrucio
And now people are arguing whether we want a sprue with 4 troops and less gear bits (beyond the basic rifle), or 3 men and a bit more gear. Keep in mind that's $5 a sprue.
The reason for the low body count is that these guys will be in the heroic scale, closer to GW scale.
I voted 4 troops on a sprue with less extra gear bits. I can always get bits from other places, and in some ways would prefer getting it from other places, maybe even GW bits.
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Post by: Captain Vyper
I will keep my eye on this as they have great potential but my god I will not be trying to read that thread over there any more, the bickering about the littest of things is madning. Keep us posted though on their progress.
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Post by: Vaktathi
whitedragon wrote:I'm not going to buy them either way, so I'm not going to post over there. I just think it was a really good idea that is being...wasted by poor concepts, in much the same way as I disliked Dr. Thunder's female guardsmen commission. I wasn't really interested either way, but the finished product sealed the deal that I wouldn't be buying them.
For the upteenth time...they aren't finished. We have renders of different types to determine what route people wanted to go, and some photoshops of concepts by people, nothing approaching a finished product in any way.
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Post by: Tribune
Kid_Kyoto wrote:"Bloodstorm! Ravenblade! Slayer of worlds! Felt the power throb in his weapon. He clutched it tightly in his hand and turned towards his foe letting it build in the twin energy spheres and then finally! RELEASE! The throbbing weapon ejaculated burning white fluid over them as Bloodstorm! Ravenblade! laughed manfully!" - From the epic novel, Bloodstorm! Ravenblade! Obliterates! the! Universe! coming in 2010 from the Black Library
MAXIMUM! VIOLENCE! NOW!
You, sir, are the new sig I need.
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Post by: Shattered Soul
Kid_Kyoto wrote:"Bloodstorm! Ravenblade! Slayer of worlds! Felt the power throb in his weapon. He clutched it tightly in his hand and turned towards his foe letting it build in the twin energy spheres and then finally! RELEASE! The throbbing weapon ejaculated burning white fluid over them as Bloodstorm! Ravenblade! laughed manfully!" - From the epic novel, Bloodstorm! Ravenblade! Obliterates! the! Universe! coming in 2010 from the Black Library
MAXIMUM! VIOLENCE! NOW!
Kyoto, sir... you disgust me sometimes.
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
OK, anybody got a link to the more recent renders, or do we have to dig?
518
Post by: Kid_Kyoto
JohnHwangDD wrote:OK, anybody got a link to the more recent renders, or do we have to dig?
Nothing from the sculpter (except from refinements in the gasmask) but we have some that fans are tossing around.
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Post by: Greebynog
It'll be interesting to see what gets made in the end after this process.
Too many chefs spoil the broth.
Many hands, light work.
A camel is a horse designed by comittee.
Apply cliche as appropriate.
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Post by: BrookM
Kid_Kyoto wrote:JohnHwangDD wrote:OK, anybody got a link to the more recent renders, or do we have to dig?
Nothing from the sculpter (except from refinements in the gasmask) but we have some that fans are tossing around.
Space facists are very popular, not just in uniform but also in their weapon choices. I spy the MG 42 and a modified FG 42, I can't wait for the first designs with runic icons on them.
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Post by: cadbren
Kid_Kyoto wrote:cadbren wrote:I can't find a decent picture at the moment, but I'd like to see something like the Imperial Trenchers from Warzone.
As I understand the debate RATHER LARGE shoulderpads were turned down early on as too-GWesque/Space Marine and not appealing to enough people.
Thanks for the pic.
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
@Brook: I'm just hoping for paired "Sig" runes hidden in the armor detailing.
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Post by: Agamemnon2
Hm, looks like another GW-esque project of WGF's is moving onwards. "6mm sci-fi androids" have moved to the next stage, asking interested parties for a $1 deposit per sprue, and they're ironing out the sprue layout.
In the interest of all the people wanting 6mm Nec-- Space Androids, I hope it works out.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
Agamemnon2 wrote:Hm, looks like another GW-esque project of WGF's is moving onwards. "6mm sci-fi androids" have moved to the next stage, asking interested parties for a $1 deposit per sprue, and they're ironing out the sprue layout.
In the interest of all the people wanting 6mm Nec-- Space Androids, I hope it works out.
I didn't give them much thought until I saw the sprue. Yeah, they don't look anything like Necrons but that's clearly what they're meant to be. I didn't think there was that much demand for either Epic or for Necrons.
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Post by: adamsouza
There is soo much hype about playing anything other than 40K on the WGF boards that it never occured to me that people would want Epic scale Necrons.
In the greatcoat thread people openly stated that they wanted them for Imperial Guard, but I hadn't noticed anyone mention Necrons while discussing the 6mm Androids. Admittedly, I didn't follow that thread that closely.
I may pic up a sprue or two of the 6mm Androids to use as killer toy robots for a supervillain, but that's about all the interest I had in them.
John Bear Ross did an excellent job on them, I'm just not that interested in 6mm models.
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Post by: Balance
The Not-Destroyers look like a hybrid between the old (weird coffins-with-turrets design) and new (flying spider-centaurs) designs.
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Post by: Vertrucio
I think they're designed so you can clip one of the basic troops in half and use him as the centaur like destroyers.
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Post by: Balance
I figured the turret-like thingies above them were, well, turrets.
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Post by: Vertrucio
Yeah, but that's to appease the lawyers.
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Post by: George Spiggott
Why do they even sculpt heads (or guns for that matter) for these guys?
All we need is dynamic body and arm poses. A selection of seperate hands would be nice too.
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Post by: dashrendar
This was just posted about an hour ago over there.
wfsculptor wrote: Just a straight forward design (NOT A POSE). For input on our SCI-FI GREATCOATS INFANTRY models. This model is just for input, but a mold able piece. Everything is separate and can be removed or changed.
Gun is: Sci fi version of STG-44.
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Post by: George Spiggott
Any Photoshop ninjas want to run that through the Pig Iron, Citadel and West Wind Ranges?
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Post by: adamsouza
The Photoshop Ninjas over on the WGF boards have already made their mods to the image
I like it !!
You can pre-order them here
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Post by: Malika2
Hmm, got a pic of the actual model rather than a 3d drawing of it?
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
The photoshop version isn't bad - the helmet is clearly improved. Though the bodies aren't very heroic compared to GW.
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Post by: George Spiggott
That woud be key, the quality of the head and gun sculpts just isn't a factor to my mind.
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Post by: adamsouza
Malika2 wrote:Hmm, got a pic of the actual model rather than a 3d drawing of it?
My Time machine is busted, otherwise I would jump right into the future and get that for you
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Post by: Peredyne
adamsouza wrote:Malika2 wrote:Hmm, got a pic of the actual model rather than a 3d drawing of it?
My Time machine is busted, otherwise I would jump right into the future and get that for you
ROFLMAO! 
83
Post by: ZandrisIV
That Photoshop is very nice, much better than most of the other attempts on WF. Isn't the head a little too big though? Looks bobble-headed to me.
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Post by: Agamemnon2
hm, I agree about the head, I think it needs scaling back just a tad. I hope they at least experiment with it. Since WGF does its sculpting on the computer, it should be pretty easy to play with the ratios.
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Post by: MeanGreenStompa
raise the shoulders and bring the outer edges up, that would significantly bulk the mini and lend it 'heroic' stance. Reduce the 'cheeks' on the mask.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
MeanGreenStompa wrote:raise the shoulders and bring the outer edges up, that would significantly bulk the mini and lend it 'heroic' stance. Reduce the 'cheeks' on the mask.
Take it over here where the sculptor is reading and replying.
http://wargamesfactory.lefora.com/forum/
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Post by: Vertrucio
Don't slag the sculptor too much. It's much easier to nitpick and photoshop someone else's work than it is to sculpt something new that looks good.
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Post by: Kid_Kyoto
Vertrucio wrote:Don't slag the sculptor too much. It's much easier to nitpick and photoshop someone else's work than it is to sculpt something new that looks good.
I'm not doing that at all. In fact he's been great at listening to ideas.
could you imagine if GW did this before unleashing some of their kits?
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Post by: stonefox
They'd never release anything due to bickering and IG would look more like space naz- germans.
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