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Post by: Krimmsonscurge
How far would you go to win?
If drawing the foul is okay what tactics are taboo ?
Do you fudge how many SoB are under the template?
Do you roll so quick your opponent doesnt catch what you roled.
Are your army lists 100% accurate or do you ocasionaly forget or add gear?
What kind of dirty tricks do we do?
Do your troops always make their charge even if they are a few centimeters short?
I'm sure no one wants to admit anything so any one who posts should tell us about "this guy I saw at the game store was....."
I think the the thing I see the alot at game stores is front to back measuring. Its something to watch for with those nasty hand to hand armies.
Its not something that works against an alert player but if they get distracted step away from the table its not very odvious and hard to check for.
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Post by: Nobody_Holme
I generally fudge an extra guardsman under the template, rather than one less, to be honest (when i'm being shot).
Although, realised afterwards I was 1 point over via a bolt pistol sarge who i thought was a laspistol sarge in a tourney once... didnt matter much, 0-5 ftw.
Anywho. most people cheat accidentally from time to time, lots of intentional cheating (shoving the back boyz of a squad up so that they all get into hth instead of just the front half when they were advancing spread out is a pet hate, ditto the silly 14" cruising speed land raider)
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Post by: Krimmsonscurge
I agree mistakes are just that mistakes and if its a friendly game It should be forgiven even laughed about.
But I think we all come to that place in the game where your own integrity is tested.
Whether its your opponent asking if he already fired a unit or your opponent forgeting a model of yours was shaken last round.
I find it hardest to be honest with people I dont like and or when the other parts of my day have been crappy.
If you catch a person say fibing on a dice roll do you think they are a cheat from then on?
Should you then tell everyone at the game store and effectively ruin their reputation?
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Post by: Tyras
I go out of my way to ensure everything, at least on my side of the table, is kosher. My army lists are broken down by unit type (HQ, Troop etc), points value and all upgrades with their points values. I let my opponent judge how many of his guys are under a template, and after determining what I need to hit or wound I 'll roll and pick out the dice that did not score so they can see how many actually landed.
I do this because I don't want there to be any question what so ever about my integrity. A victory where a person cheats isn't a victory at all. I can't stand cheaters, and if I catch somebody cheating I'll point it out, if they continue to do so I will remember not to play them again. To answer the reputation question, yes if I found them to be a cheater rather than just inexperienced and making mistakes I will let the rest of the players know.
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Post by: HellsGuardian316
I have a very black and white personality in life, it either is, or isn't. I never see the grey and this applies to my gaming too. So in cases of "is it under the blast marker or isn't it?" I choose to say it isn't or allow my opponent to have the final say and trust their honesty
As far as cheating goes I would never knowingly cheat, and if at any time I found out I had played incorrectly I would own up to my mistake and inform my opponent immeadiatly and then take it from there. In some cases that this has happened we've agree on some form of compensation, usually this means something along the lines of ... if I have killed members of a particular squad and then realised that a weapon i had shot could not of fired, then one model is replaced back into that squad for example
When i roll dice I try to make sure they are always visible and i make sure that they can see the results before allocating whats what or moving them into another position. ie putting all the successful dice together and seperate from the misses.
There was one instant where I was almost blue in the face from arguing over a rule. If I had allowed the rule to be played the way my opponent thought is was (he got confused with fantasy warhammer) then I would have won through an unfair advantage. I didn't let it slide because if I win a game I want to win from playing by the rules and by using skill and tactics where applicable, not from abusing a rule or allowing myself to take advantage.
If my opponent wants to make mistakes because he doesn't know his own army, then thats their choice. If it was someone who was completely new to 40K then I would at least offer to give them advice and if they agreed, I'd then let them know the adv and dis-adv of what they were about to do. But as all my opponents happen to be better opponents than me, I'm prepared to let them make a mistake or too 
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Post by: Vintagemustangs
The person who cheats doesn't understand that Warhammer is a game. It is intended to be fun and bring people together. Cheating ruins all of that.
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Post by: blue loki
Why anyone would consciously do any of those things is quite beyond my capacity.
If winning is that important to you, why not redirect your effort into a venue that would net you a profit?
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Post by: Dashofpepper
My games go from relaxed --> stressful ---> being a dick/rules nazi depending on my opponent. I'm kind of a chameleon. If they're laid back and relaxed, I am too. If they're being a rules nazi, I am too.
For blast templates: If my opponent is firing at me, and my troops are anywhere within reachable distance of them, I anticipate them checking the blast and telling me what they hit. I only second guess / check if it sounds preposterous, or if the game is getting stressful. When they blast template my own rear edge, I generally measure since I'm right there, and when I fire at their back edge, I get them to look for me. When its a close call for either side, my accepted practice is to 4+ it.
Dice-rolling: I will *never* EVER fudge a dice roll. That goes from the realm of potential mistake to straight cheating. I pick up my misses and leave my hits for my opponent to see UNLESS I'm shooting a *lot* of shots as Orks and have only a couple of hits. Doesn't make sense to roll 12 dice to shoot with, and pick out the 10 misses. I generally don't watch my opponent's dice rolling (too trusting?) because I presume that no one else is going to cheat either. If I happen to see someone keep something that shouldn't have been, then I take notice and start paying attention, and I generally always pay attention to rolls against vehicle penetration.
Moving: I've gotten into the habit of placing my tape measure on the table (static) with it opened to the distance I'm moving, then placing my models X" along the prescribed route so that there can be no mistake. I'm a little more attentive to measuring in my opponents because a lot of people seem to not worry about being precise here. The most common thing I see is for people to hold the tape measure over their model, note where its going, then pick up their model, lean forward, and place the model down where the end of the tape measure is. The problem here being that when you lean forward, your arm extends forward increasing the distance that you get to go.
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Post by: HellsGuardian316
All it proves is that cheaters have low self esteem as they don't think they can win if they play fair. I think cheaters are pathetic poeple.
(I'm not referring to those who make a geniune mistake about the rules, just those that purposely do it)
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Post by: malfred
Only unintentionally.
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Post by: HellsGuardian316
@Dashofpepper, yes thats something i do to, place the tape measure down on the table top and slide the model to get a more precise movement
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Post by: Emperors Faithful
I'll argue what I see, not what I want to see.
If that means ALL my models are under the blast so be it.
And by the way, though the other stuff is bad sportsmenship, the messing with the dice? No, the dice roll is sacred.
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Post by: OldPeculiar
I always try and avoid cheating and give my opponent the benefit of the doubt if there's some debate - however mistakes do happen
Movement is the biggest area for me that stretches the rules - it's just too painful to measure every ork in a 30 strong mob, especially if they're going round a corner. Normaly I measure the front one and the back one then sort of move the rest between in approximatly the same formation, this can result in a certain amount of 'shuffling' in the pack though, especially where terrain gets in the way
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Post by: Demogerg
In all my years of gaming I have only recently had the *joy* of playing against cheaters.
It pisses me off.
oddly enough most of the games I played against these cheaters I end up winning anyways. Maybe they cheated out of desperation, i dunno.
Also, i dont mention it in the game, calling someone out on cheating is a quick way to get into an arguement, and a quick way to ruin everyone elses (the games around you) gaming experience. I just work 10x harder to win when i see my opponent cheating, and I am doubly sure to very precise in my unit movements and making my rolls visible.
when i first started playing the game i would cheat all the time, unknowingly at first, then after the rules had been pointed out, i would just "forget" in game. but that was when i was 10 years old... I soon stopped cheating as it quickly dwindled your group of friends to play against.
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Post by: Redbeard
It is never worth the consequences to cheat. If you cheat and win, so what, who cares. If you cheat and get caught, your name is blackened forever. You'll always be "that guy".
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Post by: combatmedic
I really depends on the kind of person Im playing. If the person is an easy going guy who seems to know his rules and doesn't deliberately try to tip the game in his favor, its going to be a smooth ride. We will tend to agree on how many units are under a blast, or do a friendly roll off if we come to a disagreement.
Now if he starts picking up those "hits" dice quickly after each roll, or rolling where I cant see whats going on, or his armor save seems to fluctuate, I may have to pull some crap on my own, if not to balance the game out as it where, but to show that I can be just a big a jerk as him, and hopefully force him out, cause a cheater does not like to be cheated.
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Post by: Krimmsonscurge
Would it be rude to ask your opponent not to make any roles without you seeing them. Would you take offense?
I dont think I would but I was wondering what other people thought.
The question I ask myself and I think a lot of people do is if your opponent is playing/building his army list correctly.
I for one have not memorized every army list and realy have to take the word of my opponent that he can do what he says he can.
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Post by: Reaver83
I would never conciously cheat, yes we all make mistakes but for frak's sake it's a game if it really mean that much to you, you need to look at what your missing in life
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Post by: CajunMan550
I don't often cheat I sometimes forget I didn't add something mid game like hey this model I been using having a powersword I forgot doesn't so instead mid game I just decide I won't use say a Heavy Stubbor anymore just because I am cheatin at that point. Not my fault but whatev.
As for templates as a guard player with them I am often generous in both respects. I have some opponents that try to short the amount mostly cuz there stomach turns when the executioner hits dead on 3 times and get 5 models each time. But I can't blaim them much. I try not to cheat best I can if I do its mostly because I forget things my memory is no good and I am happy to be corrected by the rule book or my list.
I have met some players that do some really stupid stuff like there was this guy at my gamestore that would measure 18 inches when moved his landraider like head just put out 20 inches in front and move 12. Just making sure when he moved it that way he wouldn't be short on the charge out. Most people didn't catch it because at my gamestore we are pretty laid back. Its just small things.
Generally I try to put all my dice rolls in the middle of the field where my opponent and me both see them clearly and I try my best to always trust my opponent and give him the benefit of the doubt unless I dont trust him haha which there are those people who I know who would cheat.
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Post by: Xav
Some people cheat but dont know there cheating, like a friend of my mine, been playing for three years but was taught by a TFG and only recently got the rulebook, anyway i was playing him, it was my turn, i turned around for a minute and he stuck his drop podm down, and claimed its had been there all the time, im not sure if thats cheating, im going to help him learn the rules though, it not realy his fault he was misinformed.
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Post by: Demogerg
Krimmsonscurge wrote:Would it be rude to ask your opponent not to make any roles without you seeing them. Would you take offense?
I dont think I would but I was wondering what other people thought.
The question I ask myself and I think a lot of people do is if your opponent is playing/building his army list correctly.
I for one have not memorized every army list and realy have to take the word of my opponent that he can do what he says he can.
Yea, the last game i played against a guy who was cheating was manipulating his dice rolls, measuring his movements "front to back" and used the "krak grenades" on his penal legion to pop my predator.
and I still won the game. Would have gotten a massacre if my predator had one more round of shooting too.
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Post by: Cannerus_The_Unbearable
I only let some minor things "slip" if I've seen my opponent cheat that game. It's just fun to see douchebags get upset when they're in a possible game-loss situation, and the more you threaten them the more nervous they tend to get. The closest thing I do to consistently cheating is if I really, really don't like someone I'm playing against and they need to use a template, I let them borrow the 4th ed white ones since they're a little bit smaller.
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Post by: Havoc13
Honestly what is the sense of playing if you are going to cheat?
My IG are designed to kill themselves as much as the enemy. I love it when one of my plasma guns explode. f i could afford in in my lists I would take a commisar everywhere so I can shoot my own guys LOL.
It a game people.
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Post by: Krimmsonscurge
CajunMan550 wrote:I have met some players that do some really stupid stuff like there was this guy at my gamestore that would measure 18 inches when moved his landraider like head just put out 20 inches in front and move 12. Just making sure when he moved it that way he wouldn't be short on the charge out. Most people didn't catch it because at my gamestore we are pretty laid back. Its just small things.
quote]
Wow prety sneaky thats one to watch for.
Xav, what is a TFG?
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Post by: Xav
A TFG is a That F*cking Guy.
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Post by: Orkeosaurus
I hate it when I roll really well, but my opponent wasn't watching, or the dice lands somewhere he can't see.
I feel like I have to step away from the dice to prove that I haven't gone over and rolled my little 1s into 6s.
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Post by: Cannerus_The_Unbearable
Orkeosaurus wrote:I hate it when I roll really well, but my opponent wasn't watching, or the dice lands somewhere he can't see.
I feel like I have to step away from the dice to prove that I haven't gone over and rolled my little 1s into 6s.
Just use different handfuls of dice after a good roll. I have a little case I keep a ton in and just refresh them every few rolls and it always works out.
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Post by: SsevenN
I don't cheat. At least not intentionally, I have made mistakes before, being human and all...
I play with at least one guy I know cheats, he's a really fun opponent but when he is losing you have to watch him close.... :(
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Post by: Frazzled
People say cheating too easily. There's a difference between intentional violation of clearcut rules and accidental violation of rules, or rules interpretations.
Having said that I am a real buggaboo about horizontal LOS.
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
I generally play "tight", but have a tendency to occasionally "nudge" in my favor when rushed or hurried. I guess that just makes me human.
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Post by: skullspliter888
NO but i have made mistakes
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Post by: Ashaman
lol, when i first started playing some kid tryed telling me his Eldar HQ unit had a 2+ invunrable save. I let him get away with it, because he was losing, really badly. it was a game with like 6 players, and a Guard player was beating the gak out him.
but i have to confess, i've done the front to back measuring a couple times.
same with Jhon "I generally play "tight", but have a tendency to occasionally "nudge" in my favor when rushed or hurried."
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Post by: barlio
I intentionally cheated in one game about 6 years ago at a Fantasy tournament. It involved a break test and the guy forgot what the mod to my leadership was. I had already rolled for my test and I would have failed, but I told him my leadership was one higher than it was. I ended up winning the game, but I felt like a total scum bag afterwards. Since then if I have made mistake in a game I immediately inform my opponent and if it is something we can fix then we do. Otherwise I make sure that we talk it out.
Now if somebody is doing whatever they feel like in a game (i.e. picking up dice without counting, measuring funky, etc...) I try to not follow suit, but if I feel somebody is being dishonest with me I use my 'Gee-willickers I'm a newbie' voice and try to get them to explain what they are doing. Works like a charm.
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Post by: LunaHound
Cheating intentionally in any way shape or form is ultimately cheating yourself.
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Post by: barlio
GoFenris wrote:
I see what you did there.
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
LunaHound wrote:
Cheating intentionally in any way shape or form is ultimately cheating yourself.
Yup.
But I'm also OK to play very, very "fast and loose" with the rules and measurements if my opponent starts us down that road...
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Post by: Cannerus_The_Unbearable
JohnHwangDD wrote:LunaHound wrote:
Cheating intentionally in any way shape or form is ultimately cheating yourself.
Yup.
But I'm also OK to play very, very "fast and loose" with the rules and measurements if my opponent starts us down that road...
Summary: Yes, but not really 
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Post by: HellsGuardian316
A common thing I do if a dice I rolled is hidden, is i place my finger on the side of it and slide it across until visible.
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:JohnHwangDD wrote:LunaHound wrote:
Cheating intentionally in any way shape or form is ultimately cheating yourself.
Yup.
But I'm also OK to play very, very "fast and loose" with the rules and measurements if my opponent starts us down that road...
Summary: Yes, but not really
Nah, more of a "when in Rome..." approach, as not everybody wants to play a "tight", technical game.
If they want to play loose, then I'm OK with that, too.
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Post by: Dashofpepper
OldPeculiar wrote:I always try and avoid cheating and give my opponent the benefit of the doubt if there's some debate - however mistakes do happen
Movement is the biggest area for me that stretches the rules - it's just too painful to measure every ork in a 30 strong mob, especially if they're going round a corner. Normaly I measure the front one and the back one then sort of move the rest between in approximatly the same formation, this can result in a certain amount of 'shuffling' in the pack though, especially where terrain gets in the way
I play Orks too and I never considered that to be cheating. When I move vehicles, I put the tape measure down, move the vehicle up the tape measure (on top of it) then tilt the vehicle on its side to get my tape measure out. When I move boyz, I measure the front one the same way, then sort of just fill all the boyz behind in; it would take FAR too long to move them all individually. 'Ard Boyz, 2.5 hours and we'd get through...turn 2 maybe? =p
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Post by: Hollismason
I totally had been cheating my opponents when I gave my SGT of my Assault Squad a combiflamer. I was so ashamed.
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Post by: Anavrin
I would never knowingly cheat, I just can't stand it, and I honestly feel that if you "win" by cheating, you've actually only admitted defeat. I'm still a noob though so I make honest mistakes sometimes, but I warn my opponents before hand and ask them to correct me so it won't happen again.
I've only played against one person so far that cheated... he started off playing fairly by everything I could tell, but when he started losing he started with the rules lawyering and his terminators started miraculously moving 2-3 extra inches to get in range on a charge...
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Post by: Emperors Faithful
I do wonder, do you get upset when you roll a really important roll well (damage table or to hit with something) and the dice is just SLIGHTLY cocked, and your opponeent then demands that you re-roll.
Becuase they seem to ignore the slightly cocked FAILED ones.
The best way we work it out in the club is if you can balance a dice on top of the orginal cocked dice then it counts. I HATE it when people demand a re-roll if the dice lands perfectly flat down, but BOUNCED off something.
(Anything that falls off the table is re-rolled though, club rule)
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Post by: combatmedic
GoFenris wrote:
AAAAH! Nice.
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Post by: Kirasu
Cheating at 40k is so sad.. Tournaments have relatively lame prizes as far as games go
The biggest cheat I see people do is pivoting their tanks to get like 3" extra movement for disembarking.. Which is totally bogus and more tournaments should enforce "movement 12" = entire tank must be no further than 12" from its starting point"
If you do this, Im sorry to offend you but you're cheating so blatantly
Speak of defilers, I know this guy who tried to claim ONLY the defiler's tiny body part with the cannon counted as its hull so I couldnt shoot the legs.. Yet he counted the legs for purposes of cover saves lol
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Post by: artyboy
I'm usually pretty laid back and I tend to play fast and loose. I probably fudge in favor of my opponent just as often as I do myself.
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Post by: Emperors Faithful
@Kirasu: Really? He did that? Was he all TFG about it or just ignorant?
That's like saying the guys in your squad get a cover save from the other members of the same squad!
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Post by: LunaHound
GoFenris wrote:
Naturally , next question would be:
"does the guy's thick skull , thick skinned head get armor bonus against a bat"
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Post by: Kirasu
Emperors Faithful wrote:@Kirasu: Really? He did that? Was he all TFG about it or just ignorant?
That's like saying the guys in your squad get a cover save from the other members of the same squad!
He fought me tooth and nail on it with a judge.. So obviously it was pretty intentional
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Post by: jayjester
Kirasu wrote:Cheating at 40k is so sad.. Tournaments have relatively lame prizes as far as games go
The biggest cheat I see people do is pivoting their tanks to get like 3" extra movement for disembarking.. Which is totally bogus and more tournaments should enforce "movement 12" = entire tank must be no further than 12" from its starting point"
If you do this, Im sorry to offend you but you're cheating so blatantly
Speak of defilers, I know this guy who tried to claim ONLY the defiler's tiny body part with the cannon counted as its hull so I couldnt shoot the legs.. Yet he counted the legs for purposes of cover saves lol
I can not find a legitimate reason that you would not be aloud to pivot after you're movement. This pivot happens at the center of the vehicle, so yes I would think that it is possible to pull this. There are however many unintended rule problems that a person just shouldn't pull in a game to get an advantage. This being one of those highly unsportsmanlike like behaviors especially if the model was converted to gain extra advantage from it (ork stretch limo trukks, yes I've seen them.)
You're second example is plain and simply against the rules. I don't have the book at the moment, but it should be covered under line of site rules, where it mentions that a unit can not block line of sight to itself thus giving itself a free cover save (oddly convereted banners for example)
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Post by: Skorpion
I don't cheat. At all. Ever.
At least, at 40K. The Source engine's dev codes are hillarious at times.
Either way, it wouldn't feel right. I make sure all my rolls are in clear sight, and make sure I see all my opponent's rolls. I make sure everything's measured from the same (or at least similar) place, I call templates as I see them on BOTH sides, and even hand a clear, itemised printout of my army list over to my opponent before the battle.
However, I don't put up with cheaty bs on my opponent's part. If I see he's fudging things, I call him on it.
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Post by: Emperors Faithful
LunaHound wrote:GoFenris wrote:
Naturally , next question would be:
"does the guy's thick skull , thick skinned head get armor bonus against a bat"
LOL, QFT Lunahound! 
-High Five hand held out-
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Post by: combatmedic
Kirasu wrote:Cheating at 40k is so sad.. Tournaments have relatively lame prizes as far as games go
Speak of defilers, I know this guy who tried to claim ONLY the defiler's tiny body part with the cannon counted as its hull so I couldnt shoot the legs.. Yet he counted the legs for purposes of cover saves lol
Did we play against the same person or something? I just packed up when my guy said it.
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Post by: Krimmsonscurge
combatmedic wrote:Kirasu wrote:Cheating at 40k is so sad.. Tournaments have relatively lame prizes as far as games go
Speak of defilers, I know this guy who tried to claim ONLY the defiler's tiny body part with the cannon counted as its hull so I couldnt shoot the legs.. Yet he counted the legs for purposes of cover saves lol
Did we play against the same person or something? I just packed up when my guy said it.
I think I know this guy but could the claim that the body was only the tiny canon area be coming from the main book when its talking about targeting walkers or some other area?
speaking of cover saves some one I play with keeps claiming that if I am in a piece of terrain like a rubled building but their unit is in the open they say they get a cover save because im firing through cover even if my unit is right up against a wall facing out from a rubled building.
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
Either the "hull" is body+legs, or it's body only. Whatever the agreement is, you don't play it both ways when it's convenient for the Chaos player...
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Post by: Elessar
I've made a lot of mistakes over the years, but never intentionally cheated. If I realise one, I try to fix it, if possible - the other day, for example, I fired a non-existent MM out of a Rhino a couple times...luckily it did no damage. The MM was deployed in a crater the other side of the board *shame*
If I see someone intentionally cheating, then I politely ask them to undo the cheat. The first time. I get exponentionally less polite as it goes on...(From, "Do you want to roll for that Run move first? *Laugh* " to "Nope, you're still within an inch of my tank shocking vehicle.")
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Post by: frgsinwntr
let me give you an example of some cheatery that went on at a tourny I went to.
A certain team tourny at toywiz in nanuet NY had our first round opponents try to get away with the following.
1) Lumbering hulk rules means they can fire everything and move 6
2) shooting from the front of the chimera instead of the hatch
3) giving orders to units in chimeras
4) trying to fudge rules when it came to combat and engaged models
5) slow playing on purpose
In our game I addressed and showed the rules for all but #3.... i let them get away with it since I didn't know the rules for it... Now I do. All the above was cheating they committed during the game.
After the game was over, we gave them a 7 out of 12 on the rubric for sportsmanship. The rubric gave -3 for slow playing, -1 for no theme and -1 for not wysiwyg. I informed them that we also did not deserve wysiwyg since i left one plague bearer at home.
They did not follow the rubric and gave us a 5, (lowest score we could have received by rubric was an 8)
again cheating.....
their last round they played our friends. they committed #'s 1-3 again... even though they knew the rules after playing me... and I showed them the rules and the page they were on...
It bothers me that people would sell out their dignity to win a game with plastic soldiers.
I personally do my best to not cheat, by accident or on purpose.
on another note, other people from their club, Army of salvation, did the same thing to my other friends at the same tourny... I just kinda hope they weren't doing it on purpose... I have more faith in people then that
sorry... was just informed by another friend their club cheated like this (sportsmanship dinging/forgetting rules) at the conflict GT also....
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Post by: don_mondo
How is this even a question?
No, cheating is bad!
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Post by: Morathi's Darkest Sin
Not with any intention, although things can get prickly sometimes when you have five editions of a rule set bouncing around in your head.
Mistakes have and will be made. Although to be fair I'm just as likely to forget to shoot with a unit, or move even sometimes. Think I'm loosing it tbh. 
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Post by: waaagh!orksrocks
I have and will never cheat intentionally if I find out I've cheated then I apologise and offer a rematch but that probably would'nt work in tornemonts but I was doing a game at the planetstrike release at games workshop and was the only one expected to cheat everyone else just rolled and said and then I failed an armour save and nearly got thrown out because noone saw it
Oh and I forgot that I was the youngest one yhere at 13
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Post by: Krimmsonscurge
frgsinwntr wrote:
on another note, other people from their club, Army of salvation, did the same thing to my other friends at the same tourny... I just kinda hope they weren't doing it on purpose... I have more faith in people then that
sorry... was just informed by another friend their club cheated like this (sportsmanship dinging/forgetting rules) at the conflict GT also....
See this would be an example to me of systamatic cheating it sounds as if these people conspired to do what they did. One question where were the touney judges during all this??
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Post by: Tyras
I still don't understand why there's a question at all. I just can't stand cheaters.
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Post by: Hollismason
Well I cant stand honest people so there.
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Post by: Tyras
Hollismason wrote:Well I cant stand honest people so there.
Well, at least your honest about it. Wrap your head around that one!
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Post by: Emperors Faithful
lol, no seriosly cheating is bad. Don't stoop to thier level.
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Post by: frgsinwntr
Matt, the tourny organizer said "if thats what they feel you deserve..."
pretty much didn't care.
Needless to say, they won't be getting any money from my group at their store
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Post by: Emperors Faithful
...they encouraged cheating?
Matt=Dipstick.
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Post by: Jon Garrett
Never got the point of cheating. It's a game. If you can't take loosing then go play some Dawn of War on easy. The last time I saw someone cheating it cost them quite a lot. It was a wierd ass round robin style tournament. It was your job to get more matches, each win earned a point, guy with the most points at the end of two days won.
Well, my first game was with a Tyranid player who was being beardier than your average Dwarf. It was 300 points at his request, giving me a Captain with some upgrades and two five man Marine Squads. He took a ton of gaunts...all with without number, of course...and some Warriors as his HQ. He then split the Warrior Squad into three to lead his Guant squads. I didn't know that was cheating at the time.
I managed to kill off two of his Warriors and three of his Guant Squads before Without Number finally swamped my marines. He then announces he won because killing off his Warriors didn't count unless I killed all of them. His whining started drawing everyone in the shop over, and people tried to explain he was cheating, which caused more whining. I said that was fine, we all make mistakes (despite the number of fudged measuresments and roles hidden behind a building, the number of times he demanded I re-rolled because he didn't see them when they were in the middle of the board) but we'd treat them like the Guard's platoons, which meant since they were split up they counted as kill points. More whining.
Eventually he announced, 'Right, it's a draw.' I was busy playing my second match at this point and just went, 'Fine, whatever, leave me the hell alone.' The shop minion came up after my second match and told me, 'So that's one win and one loss for you Jon?' as I stared at him blankly, and explained.
Shop monkey went over and watched him playing another opponent, a young kid who was absoloutely brilliant at both playing and painting. And eventually publically blasted cheating boy. So, while he speant the next two days trying to get more games, no one wanted to play. He was bottom.
Karma: Makes you her bitch.
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Post by: Sidstyler
It's threads like this that make me hate this game, and lose faith in humanity in general. The fact that some people would stoop so low as to intentionally cheat with fething plastic toys.
Anyway, no, I never intentionally cheat. I've made mistakes and apparently I interpret rules differently than some people do, but that's the extent of it.
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Post by: Lukus83
Same as Sidstyler for me, though I guess I'm lucky no-one at my FLGS (that I know of) cheats.
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Post by: Emperors Faithful
Jon Garrett wrote:
Karma: Makes you her bitch.
LOL! Quote for Fething Truth!
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Post by: Bookwrack
Sidstyler wrote:It's threads like this that make me hate this game, and lose faith in humanity in general.
Oh please, get some perspective.  This is a thread about cheating, so of course you're only going to hear the worst stories. It's like how the newspaper reports, 'Four people die on the commute into Washington D.C. every day!' Instead of '399,996 people don't die everyday commuting into D.C!'
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Post by: Kapitan Montag
I thought I never cheat, but then I realized I did in my last game.
The master of ordnance was deployed right behind a pillar, so he couldn't see squat. I forgot to move him in the secnd turn movement phase, so when he cam to shoot I kinda wriggled him around the post (only 1/2" your honour) so he could see the enemy. My opponent saw this though, and didn't say anything.
Maybe that's because I didn't say anything the week before when his dreadnought assaulted the turn it arrived in a drop pod.
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Post by: Emperors Faithful
eh, it WAZ an honest mistake thier, but you should of ASKED him, Kaptin Montag. If he said no, well to bad for you. (he's in the right) but if he said yes or nothing then your conscience would have been clearer.
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Post by: deadratman
Bookwrack wrote:Sidstyler wrote:It's threads like this that make me hate this game, and lose faith in humanity in general.
Oh please, get some perspective. This is a thread about cheating, so of course you're only going to hear the worst stories. It's like how the newspaper reports, 'Four people die on the commute into Washington D.C. every day!' Instead of '399,996 people don't die everyday commuting into D.C!'
Yeah.You never hear about the cat who was stuck in a tree.You hear about the cashier at McDonalds who shot 4 people and then turned the weapon on himself. So even if you feel like humanity is going to hell well then your an emo.
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Post by: Wolf
Well im an honest player and do not like to cheat ever. Mistakes are mistakes evryone makes them i makethem too, i just hope my opponent sptos them out for me so i can correct it properly.
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Post by: High Commissar Biffsmack
I like to be honest about this kind of stuff, although it may be fun to fudge points and laugh all through the game while I destroy my friends. I might try that soon.
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Post by: karnaeya
Unless your hardcore and play lots of games you wont know the rules that well. When this happens like to me I cheat, but its ignorance and laziness. Sometimes I also zombie out.. I once move some infantry 12 inches by accident.. The guy got really upset.. Thought I did it on purpose.. If I was gonna cheat on purpose it would be subtle you fool I just had a brain freeze.
I also pretty much let my opponent play what they think unless I KNOW its wrong..
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Post by: Exarch_Nektel
I never cheat on purpose, but when I move guys the guys in the back of the squad seem to move more than 6", while the guys up front move the normal distance.
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Post by: Captain Fabulous
I abhor cheating. It's a game, and is meant to be fun, although I also enjoy the competitive aspect of it quite a bit. If I am to lose, I take the loss because I probably made a mistake and only in losing will I remember not to do it again. It even irks me when people suggest I take things back when I note a mistake I made during a friendly game. I screwed up, I can deal with it haha, I'm just letting it be known that I realize that I did and hopefully won't do so again.
Cheaters make me absolutely sick though. While games such as this ultimately bring out the competitive side in people, they are games first and foremost and are played to be enjoyed. Any time someone cheats they are playing on that expectation of fun inherent in the game and using it against their opponent, in order to get some odd sense of satisfaction out of it. If you can't win the game the way it is meant to be played, why play at all.
Reminds me of a time I was at Gencon playing in the L5R (Its a CCG) finals tourney. Was quite a few years back, 2002 I want to say, and there was a guy playing in the tournament who happened to be blind. He had braille on all of his card sleeves and played with his decks in card boxes so he could draw out of them more easily and not knock his decks over. It was pretty inspiring to see someone going to extreme efforts to enjoy a hobby I also enjoyed, even with an obstacle in their way, and reminded me of the general good spirited player base of L5R in general, as his opponents would have to accommodate him a bit more than regular opponents by explaining all their moves out loud so he could keep up with the action on the other side of the table, yet none had problems doing so. Being a nice parable on cheating I'm sure you've all assumed already that someone was caught cheating in cards on a blind guy, but sadly that was not the case, although I'm not quite sure which situation is worse. It actually turned out that the way the blind guy shuffled and such with the braille, he could read card names as he went and stacked his deck, and I believe there was also something fishy with the way he drew from his boxes and was able to top deck/bottom deck draw or some such nonsense, either way, he was caught cheating in a big way. It turned what was a really inspiring and feel-good sight into something that I'm still not quite sure how to react to, and goes to show that it can come from even the most unlikely of places.
Just don't cheat kids, I promise you the urgency of the moment that is pushing you towards doing so will fade, and you'll feel awful about doing it later.
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Post by: Krimmsonscurge
Captain Fabulous wrote:I abhor cheating. It's a game, and is meant to be fun, although I also enjoy the competitive aspect of it quite a bit. If I am to lose, I take the loss because I probably made a mistake and only in losing will I remember not to do it again. It even irks me when people suggest I take things back when I note a mistake I made during a friendly game. I screwed up, I can deal with it haha, I'm just letting it be known that I realize that I did and hopefully won't do so again.
Cheaters make me absolutely sick though. While games such as this ultimately bring out the competitive side in people, they are games first and foremost and are played to be enjoyed. Any time someone cheats they are playing on that expectation of fun inherent in the game and using it against their opponent, in order to get some odd sense of satisfaction out of it. If you can't win the game the way it is meant to be played, why play at all.
Reminds me of a time I was at Gencon playing in the L5R (Its a CCG) finals tourney. Was quite a few years back, 2002 I want to say, and there was a guy playing in the tournament who happened to be blind. He had braille on all of his card sleeves and played with his decks in card boxes so he could draw out of them more easily and not knock his decks over. It was pretty inspiring to see someone going to extreme efforts to enjoy a hobby I also enjoyed, even with an obstacle in their way, and reminded me of the general good spirited player base of L5R in general, as his opponents would have to accommodate him a bit more than regular opponents by explaining all their moves out loud so he could keep up with the action on the other side of the table, yet none had problems doing so. Being a nice parable on cheating I'm sure you've all assumed already that someone was caught cheating in cards on a blind guy, but sadly that was not the case, although I'm not quite sure which situation is worse. It actually turned out that the way the blind guy shuffled and such with the braille, he could read card names as he went and stacked his deck, and I believe there was also something fishy with the way he drew from his boxes and was able to top deck/bottom deck draw or some such nonsense, either way, he was caught cheating in a big way. It turned what was a really inspiring and feel-good sight into something that I'm still not quite sure how to react to, and goes to show that it can come from even the most unlikely of places.
Just don't cheat kids, I promise you the urgency of the moment that is pushing you towards doing so will fade, and you'll feel awful about doing it later.
That is a sad storry it makes me want to give the blind guy excuses for his actions. But when I think of all the people I have worked with that had disabilities and how hard they worked and how good of people they are I think to myself no he was an A-hole that intentionaly cheated. I'm glad they caught him even though it was so uninspirational.
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Post by: Cannerus_The_Unbearable
High Commissar Biffsmack wrote: I like to be honest about this kind of stuff, although it may be fun to fudge points and laugh all through the game while I destroy my friends. I might try that soon.
Dude! I'm totally going to try that I know a guy who ran his Necrons against me for a good few months without adding the cost of his Lords wargear to his total. I didn't realize he hadn't been adding it til I was helping him with a tournament list and he was like "Wait, it says he gets up to 100 points of gear? Isn't that free?" Next game I'm just going to throw two more Rhinos with squads on the board and see if he calls it We'll have a good laugh either way.
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Post by: Space Marine
I've been tempted to do this a while back but I didn't. But I'll tell you anyway what was tempted to do was to swap the weapons of my dread around (thats why you should never glue the weapons on) to match my opponents setup during the setup of the models. I wish I did now as it was quite a close victory to me.
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Post by: tigonesskay
I'll just feel bad if I cheat. But to avoid any problems I have my army books with me and my points list. I do all of my dice rolls right in front of my opponent that way there will be no issues. Since I'm a female I had some people try to take advange of me I guess because I play 13th company and they go "You can do that? With wulfen?"
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Post by: Krimmsonscurge
So is a nudge a cheat is spliting the diference in your favor wrong? When you move troops do they all move the proper distance because I know plenty of players that measure once for their jumppack troops and then moove them all too within assault range? What chaps my arse is the way the same people will then act all indignant.
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Post by: JohnHwangDD
A Necromancer appears!
Use tread lock!
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Post by: Kurgash
The only kind of cheating i ever do is putting down the monolith.
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Post by: Owain
I lol'd.
Personally, I think if you're going to cheat you shouldn't be playing.
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Post by: Orkestra
Can the OP necro his own thread?
It reminds me of this Holiday around April....
But instead of waiting three days, and the whole thing being a miracle, he waited 6 months. I think it's where Zombies come from.
Also, OP necroing his own thread is made sweeter by two posters who either missed the giant card image, or were just so swept up in the OP that they couldn't be bothered to read the other three pages.
There's never anything good in there anyway.
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Post by: Howard A Treesong
Krimmsonscurge wrote:Do you roll so quick your opponent doesnt catch what you rolled.
I'd ask them to roll it again. Rolling dice openly is for my benefit as well as their's. Good players make sure the other player has seen the roll and understand its significance, eg "Ok, my 10 men firing at yours behind cover, need 5s or more to hit...ok that's one, two, three hits" Why is that difficult? It's a matter of courtesy not about catching cheaters, I do it for others. Completing your shooting phase when I'm out the room getting a beer or having a crap isn't on, nor is rolling behind screens or other objects where I can't see the dice.
Another annoyance is people who throw dice and lose on on the floor, you'd be suprised how often they'll demand a reroll if it's a 1 but argue to keep it if it's a 6. My rules are that dice have to land on the table and lie flat, if the land against a hill and are slightly tilted they are void, if they go on the floor they are void, if they end up floating in my beer, they are void.
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Post by: metallifan
Howard A Treesong wrote:Krimmsonscurge wrote:Do you roll so quick your opponent doesnt catch what you rolled.
I'd ask them to roll it again.
Even easier would be to bring a dice tower.
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