I love you Dakka folks, you support us, we support you.

We have a number of shoulder pads and Rhino Kits coming out as well as the awaited Salamander Land Raider kit. Check them out below, I am sending them in for molding this monday, so they should be for sale in 2 weeks.

I am molding Tactical, Assault and Devestator numbered pads as well





Space Wolf Armored Rhino



New Salamander Rhino




Landraider Salamander Sneak Peak (Track Guard)


Space Wolf Storm Shield WIP



Thoughts, Critiques, Hate Mail?

Nick
www.chapterhousestudios.com

Look great. Nice work.

I'm diggin the shield... now how can i get a few to work in an ork army... hmm...

What makes the Space Wolf Armored Rhino panels particularly Wolfy? They look great, and I initially thought they might be your predator parts, but .. where is the fang, wolfskull etc.. that indicated Wolves in Spppaaaaaccce?

Im guessing they used the mini for the SW Primarch as inspiration. (what the hell was that guys name?)
Thats what I thought of as soon as I seen those. I think those would look great on any rhino personally. Nice work

The "IX" looks a bit off- not centered. Might have to pinch the perspective to fit the triangle motive.

Space Wolf Shield looks too busy- too many details drags my eyes all over the place so I don't know what I'm looking at; it almost looks organic. Consider some larger flat/empty spaces as these will make your busy areas even more interesting. Some of the areas do not look tight/smooth.

The shot of the rhino front armor makes the salamander face look like it's giggling. The bar under the winds is not a consistent height- it's loses volume (shrinks) on the left side.

The land raider armor is 7 kinds of awesome.

I agree with the above. The Space Wolf shield is too busy. Please keep the round viking shield concept you posted before. That is awesome. The mug standard is great just do it on the rounded shield.

Lastly, the writing on the upper left part of the inside of the shield does not look like runes. There's not much payoff to have fine details on the inside of the shield since it's going to be held (mostly) close to the body.

Suggestion for the shield: Notice how a lot of the clutter in the Space Wolf figures is clustered around the center of the figure? The terminators for example- most of the new stuff goes from the top of their head, through their groin with a smattering here/there outside of it. Even with all this clutter, there are still large areas of flat empty plates on the armor. This order might be nice to carry through the shield, since the eye like following similar patterns. Clutter also works well when it's a different texture than the majority of it's surroundings, such as fur or bone next to plate.

Wolf Shield is still a Work in Progress, we will be making a few changes.

The Wolf Rhino Armor is more a canvas to be sculpted on. I do think people may want to buy it as is, but we are going to use it to do many different rhino kits on, the current one to be done is Wolves as soon as I get this master molded.

Number pads. I tried my best, its very difficult to get the detail you want at that level. I think once its molded and painted there wont be any issues as unless you are 2 inches away the detail is great.

Here are more shots of the Salamander Land Raider








Awesome?

Nick
Chapterhousestudios.com

How do you GS people do that? I see the picture in my head, but it looks like I used the whole can of play doh when I threw with it.
That landraider looks really cool man. Specially the crossed hammers. Nice work

Lots and lots of time and patience...

Im still new to the GS, I did the 2 pads, Im very new

How about a lizard Helmet? Kinda like the sponson cover, but for a marine helmet?

As usual Nick it looks great.

So a Dragon Helmet? That wouldnt be too hard to do, have to put it in the books.

Fishboy:

thanks

I'm not a fan of a lot of your stuff, but the scaly Salamanders Land Raider panels look really nice.

Hi there, I´m Tom, Nick and I own Chapterhouse and I´m the sculptor.
Thought its about time I dont just sit in a basement over a piece of greenstuff but come out and say hi and answer criticism etc about the greens.

The rhino segemented armour was an idea of mine to get some form of pre heresy looking rhino conversion kit that is very generic and also to use as a template for further sculpted addons.
I´ll be remaking it not only to be as it is but also with "iron wolf" symbols added on it and dragon symbols as well. If you guys like them enough I´ll most surely remake them into even more variations.

The wolf shield I´m workign on at the moment is a bit if a "celtic" inspired piece that can and will be remade into wolf iconography as well as dragon and other kinds.
Right not I´m battling with the attempts to have it look similar all over/around and with this scale its really a question of patience and well rested eyes.

Here is a WIP, I´m trying to get it as close to the actual art it is based on as possible.


f you guys have questions, requests, praise or hate to send dont hesitate to ask Nick or myself, I´ll try to pop in here now and then and give updates if possible.

Thanks

I like the way the Space Wolf stuff is coming along, especially that shield above my post. However, the Salamander stuff is very very cool. How soon do you guys plan on distributing that stuff and any idea on a price tag?

Well you can buy them direct from www.chapterhousestudios.com.

I am trying to get a distributor, but they are a bit hard to break into. We do work with stores directly and try to offer the stores a competitive price to get them to stock.

Nick

Alliance Games?

They pretty much shot down my email last week. I tried :(

I am working with E-Figures.com. if you guys hound the stores and distributors it couldnt hurt, lol.

The only other one I can think of (when I was selling comics and games) was: http://www.acdd.com/ The others that I worked with were eaten by Alliance.

Other idea would be to do ebay auctions for, say, a complete set of Salamander rhino armor, or a complete set of something. Gets your name out there and will sell. Nothing like advertising that pays you back.

Tom- wrote:

The wolf shield I´m workign on at the moment is a bit if a "celtic" inspired piece that can and will be remade into wolf iconography as well as dragon and other kinds.
Right not I´m battling with the attempts to have it look similar all over/around and with this scale its really a question of patience and well rested eyes.

Here is a WIP, I´m trying to get it as close to the actual art it is based on as possible.


f you guys have questions, requests, praise or hate to send dont hesitate to ask Nick or myself, I´ll try to pop in here now and then and give updates if possible.

Thanks

A suggestion: Take the 1/4 circle of knotwork you already have and make a mold of it, with a 'shiplap' section under the boss. Then, you can just place four of them on the outer rim of the shield, and add details to the center, and then make that your master. Not sure if this is feasible, but with as good as the first quarter section looks, it's be a shame if the piece gets scrapped due to inconsistencies.

A suggestion: Take the 1/4 circle of knotwork you already have and make a mold of it, with a 'shiplap' section under the boss. Then, you can just place four of them on the outer rim of the shield, and add details to the center, and then make that your master. Not sure if this is feasible, but with as good as the first quarter section looks, it's be a shame if the piece gets scrapped due to inconsistencies.

Well I actually already did that but the rubber makes for more problems.
If you press to light there will not be enough detail transferred, if you press to hard, the greenstuff will be "smeared" and the "copy" will be significantly wider.
Plus its almost impossible to gauge the correct thickness of the copy so this is a non can do.

It´ll have to be a battle of patience and scalpel it seems

Oh well, nothing is ever easy. Silly of me to forget that. GL. I'm really gunning for you on the round shields, the concept art is one of the coolest things for 40K I've ever seen.

No problem, thanks for the tip anyway.

Phew, half the rim is done, well besides the finishing touches
Just two more corners to go...

Love the LR armour and the celtic theme going on. Will there be more Blood Ravens stuff produced as well as it's one of the chapters I'm thinking of getting some models together to do since the DA are unplayable now.

I heartily approve of all this, I just hope you guys continue to expand your range! It's like having a second forgeworld that listens to feedback, and doesn't cost an arm and leg!

We try, but the tough part is getting our name out there!

I dont want to be an expensive FW wannabe if we can help it, I try to keep the prices where we can make a good profit without raping the customers. That is why I am a big fan of pewter, cheaper then resin for labor (which is a big deal, we use a USA manufacturer, not chinese).

We will be dumping alot of money this week into molds, 8 new Pewter Molds (shoulder pads, weapons and Fire Braziers, shields) and 3 new Resin Molds (Land Raider, and 2 Rhino kits).

I would love to get another sculptor on the staff to concentrate on IG. As it is I have a buddy, who is working on a new Storm Trooper model in 3D design, we will see how that turns out.

Nick

I'm not gonna lie I love your work, just wish I played salamanders :(

Your doing all this without GW's permission? Theres pages of legal stuff on the GW website saying that you can't produce modification kits for their ranges without their approval. How did you manage to get around this?

Great stuff, gents !!

I'll be ordering lots of those round celtic shields !!

I'd love to see you develop tank armor panels with the Celtic motif.

Hey Dan, let them worry about that. We don't need another wannabe lawyer chiming in- it seems to creep into these announcements too much. ;-) FWIW they have talked to legal counsel and I don't think alot of GW's IP interpretations hold much water anyway (and I actually am a lawyer, though admittedly not an trademark/patent/IP specialist).

Dan22 wrote:Your doing all this without GW's permission? Theres pages of legal stuff on the GW website saying that you can't produce modification kits for their ranges without their approval. How did you manage to get around this?

It PAINS me everytime I see someone refer to GWs Legal Page. That page is the same as myself going out and saying anything I write on a webpage is Legal and law. That page is a joke, and is GWs attempt to control the market with words, not law.

GW is not a judge, advocate of country that can make law. They have brainwashed so many people into thinking that anything they say is legal law. It is not. I can make ANYTHING I want that isnt a direct copy of a GW Image or model and sell it. How can GW say I cant make a completely new door that fits in a HOLE on their model?

To make it even funnier, Bolter and Chainsword, obviously payed for by GW (yes I think GW pays the owner, how else could they use IP like Bolter and Chainsword in thier title and run the site with no advertising income) pretty much banned my sculptor for showing, not selling, our products in developement. They did not email him or even warn him. Just banned. There was no offer to sell, just a Work in Progress thread to get critiques and show off his skills.

Kids, learn to think for yourself and not let the corporate entities tell you what to think.

Nick

Thats amusing if a little worrying, but GW always made threads dissapear if they weren't made by complete fanboys who thought everything they said was law and couldn't think for themselves.

If I played the chapters you do stuff for I'd be buying those extras from chapterhouse as it is I'm tempted by salamanders now but holding back in case more blood ravens stuff gets done. That and I have a fanatasy army still waiting to get painted after the eldar I'm wading through

Anyone notice that Dan's username is "Dan22" aka incredibly generic, and that is his only post? Can someone say GW spy? I'm not even kidding.

im sure a 'GW spy' would be a little more zealous in his lawyerific ramblings than that, but what ever...

the new land raider stuff looks great...
if i ever get another land raider for the sallies ill definitely get one of those kits when they are out...

So some random dude decides to join just to put that little bit up? Just seems fishy as heck. There are other suspects too. Hmm. Detective Cannerus is on the case...

LOL

Krusty,

You could always buy the kit and just glue on the new bits That is what I plan on doing with my prize-winning Salie-Raider.

stuff looks great, any expected date when the LR kit will be available? and cost?

some one a while back posted saying they wanted you to do a lizard helmet but im sure on one of chapter houses threads a scaly lizard helmet

Chapterhouse wrote:To make it even funnier, Bolter and Chainsword, obviously payed for by GW (yes I think GW pays the owner, how else could they use IP like Bolter and Chainsword in thier title and run the site with no advertising income) pretty much banned my sculptor for showing, not selling, our products in developement. They did not email him or even warn him. Just banned. There was no offer to sell, just a Work in Progress thread to get critiques and show off his skills.

I'm not sure if it's required to postulate that far, certain fansites are excessively terrified of GW and will do whatever it takes to avert their imagined wrath. 40k Online and B&C have always been poster children for this.

Agamemnon2 wrote:

Chapterhouse wrote:To make it even funnier, Bolter and Chainsword, obviously payed for by GW (yes I think GW pays the owner, how else could they use IP like Bolter and Chainsword in thier title and run the site with no advertising income) pretty much banned my sculptor for showing, not selling, our products in developement. They did not email him or even warn him. Just banned. There was no offer to sell, just a Work in Progress thread to get critiques and show off his skills.

I'm not sure if it's required to postulate that far, certain fansites are excessively terrified of GW and will do whatever it takes to avert their imagined wrath. 40k Online and B&C have always been poster children for this.

At the same time they are allowed to use GW images and IP originated art, seems a double standard, or that they have direct links to Games Workshop (Im more inclined to believe that.)

For your continuing pleasure, some Iron Snake Rhino WiP photos.

Ok. I am pleading you. No, more like begging you. Please make iron hand shoulder pads. I would pay out da wazzoo for some. We are so under appreciated!
-sobs-
I love your work though. The salamander stuff makes me want to play as them! You make a brother proud!
-Hehe, spess muhreens joke-

I like the Celtic wolf theme, it gives a nice point of difference over the GW Nordic wolf theme, but not so different that mixing and matching is impossible.

A couple of posters have suggested dragon/lizard marine helmets - I think that's well worth looking into, GW have proved 'animal head' helmets can look cool with their wolf helmet head on the new SW sprue. The important thing is that they need to look like stylised helmets, _not_ just a straight animal head

Well the issue with Iron Hands is that GW already made pads with the icon on them, and we cant copy the icon. So we would need to create our own that would be accepted by Iron Hands players, otherwise it would be a waste of time and money?

But what would we do that is similiar but not the same?

I think we will do Lizard helmets at some time, but we are busy with a ton of projects at the moment.

To make it even funnier, Bolter and Chainsword, obviously payed for by GW (yes I think GW pays the owner, how else could they use IP like Bolter and Chainsword in thier title and run the site with no advertising income)
Nick

I can tell you that GW does not own, nor does it pay for anything to do with the Bolter and Chainsword. And neither Bolter, or Chainsword, are trademarked by GW.

That Iron Snake front would also be fun for Alpha Legion Players, I'd think. As for Iron Hand Players, I'd think that having cog or tech doors would appeal to both them and also Iron Warriors players.

Games Workshop does not sell any Iron Hands shoulder Pads that I know of. If they do, please send me a link. I have been looking for some time now. I think you might be confusing the Iron Hands with the Iron warriors, ChapterHouse. But, I would be very interested in some Cog shoulder pads, doors or even decals. Adeptus Mechanicus Pads and doors would be very nice as well. I do understand that you are busy at the moment. But if you ever get around to any of these things, please let me know! I would be more than willing to buy.

I'm really liking the celtic work. In fact, I like it so much I'm having to fight the urge to run out and grab the new SW codex just so I can theme an army around it.

The infinity/snake I'm mixed on. Looks great overall, but the head sticks out a bit far for my tastes. Love the doors and hatches though.

For Iron Hands, maybe something with a bit more steampunk or dieselpunk influence.

GW did cast a Iron Hands shoulder pads set a while back. The point is we cant copy a GW Icon detail for detail from an existing model.

On the BnC deal, GW may not run BnC, but the owner of that forum has some definite ties with GW, so much in fact that rather then let me know what rules Im breaking or even PM me (according to his posted rules, I wasnt breaking any), he just banned my account with no warning.

Off topic in any case.

General Fuzzum wrote:Games Workshop does not sell any Iron Hands shoulder Pads that I know of. If they do, please send me a link. I have been looking for some time now.

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1150124&prodId=prod1140236

Dan22 wrote:Your doing all this without GW's permission? Theres pages of legal stuff on the GW website saying that you can't produce modification kits for their ranges without their approval. How did you manage to get around this?

Why does this ALWAYS come up...

/headdesk

just out of interest what ever happened to the armored predator front panels you guys were working on a while back?

Wouldn't the GW icon thing have some leeway? Example an omega symbol, winged daggers/swords, bird with a blood drop

That alternate front plate looks great!

Rico wrote:

Dan22 wrote:Your doing all this without GW's permission? Theres pages of legal stuff on the GW website saying that you can't produce modification kits for their ranges without their approval. How did you manage to get around this?

Why does this ALWAYS come up...

/headdesk

Because too many people are lemmings and do not think for themselves, they let big corporations do that for them :(.

Sorry that was a bit harsh, but many people take GWs "Legal Page" as real law and do not realize that it is GW's Policy, not any countries Laws they have posted on that webpage.

Sgt.Roadkill wrote:just out of interest what ever happened to the armored predator front panels you guys were working on a while back?

It is done, but since we are a small company and are investing $5-600 in molds this week, I need to space out the expenses. If more people buy, i can make more products available I am investing a lot of time into seeing if it is feasable for a company our size to have manufacturing done in china.

Vermillion wrote:Wouldn't the GW icon thing have some leeway? Example an omega symbol, winged daggers/swords, bird with a blood drop

Yes, but we have to walk a fine line there. It is hard to predict what people will buy when it comes to existing chapters, how close to the original Iron Hands icon do we have to stay to make some money off it?

well unfortuanetly only doing 2 marine armies and one of them is renegade so can';t invest more. the new snaky frontplate would be great for my marine army but thats about it.

i will have to hold out for the pred front plate then, i have a pre heresy predator which could benefit for a decent front place replacement which isn't bodged together out of the end of a land raider engine.

Chapterhouse wrote:Because too many people are lemmings and do not think for themselves, they let big corporations do that for them :(.

Sorry that was a bit harsh, but many people take GWs "Legal Page" as real law and do not realize that it is GW's Policy, not any countries Laws they have posted on that webpage.

For what it's worth, not everyone gets their information on this solely from GW's legal page. We've had several resident IP lawyers around here over the years, as have other forums... and while they don't tend to give out actual legal counsel, they tend to be listened to when they chime in with their opinion.

Not trying to stir anything up, just offering an alternate viewpoint... although it's possibly worth mentioning that insulting potential customers generally isn't considered a smart business tactic. You might find that some people don't like being referred to as lemmings just because they believe what they've read on a given subject.

I'm just hoping for some Iron Knight iconography... but despite the 'generic-ness' of their Chapter symbol they are still quite an obscure Chapter, so I doubt that'll happen.

insaniak wrote:

Chapterhouse wrote:Because too many people are lemmings and do not think for themselves, they let big corporations do that for them :(.

Sorry that was a bit harsh, but many people take GWs "Legal Page" as real law and do not realize that it is GW's Policy, not any countries Laws they have posted on that webpage.

For what it's worth, not everyone gets their information on this solely from GW's legal page. We've had several resident IP lawyers around here over the years, as have other forums... and while they don't tend to give out actual legal counsel, they tend to be listened to when they chime in with their opinion.

Not trying to stir anything up, just offering an alternate viewpoint... although it's possibly worth mentioning that insulting potential customers generally isn't considered a smart business tactic. You might find that some people don't like being referred to as lemmings just because they believe what they've read on a given subject.

I am in total agreement with you, but too many times you have people chime in with no legal experience and they try to force the GW IP page down your throat as legal gospel.

Take the lemming remark as you will, if it insulted anyone, I apologize.

Any chance for more soul drinker stuff? Possibly just a plain chalice symbol on its own? (would like some Chalice on me Drop Pods )

Buttlerthepug wrote:Any chance for more soul drinker stuff? Possibly just a plain chalice symbol on its own? (would like some Chalice on me Drop Pods )

Yes, Im hounding my sculpting team for icons now, even a good chance of a Rhino kit as well.

Chapterhouse wrote:

Buttlerthepug wrote:Any chance for more soul drinker stuff? Possibly just a plain chalice symbol on its own? (would like some Chalice on me Drop Pods )

Yes, Im hounding my sculpting team for icons now, even a good chance of a Rhino kit as well.

Sounds awsome! Already need to pick up a bunch of your shoulders... now I got to spend more money...

Chapterhouse wrote:
To make it even funnier, Bolter and Chainsword, obviously payed for by GW (yes I think GW pays the owner, how else could they use IP like Bolter and Chainsword in thier title and run the site with no advertising income) pretty much banned my sculptor for showing, not selling, our products in developement. They did not email him or even warn him. Just banned. There was no offer to sell, just a Work in Progress thread to get critiques and show off his skills.

S'alright, Nick, Ol Chap.

You've always got Dakka and Bartertown!

Eric

I'm not sure if it's required to postulate that far, certain fansites are excessively terrified of GW and will do whatever it takes to avert their imagined wrath. 40k Online and B&C have always been poster children for this.

Lol, all points towards that those hypocrites make money of GW themselves. Then the have the nerve to ban people for showing greens all according to their own rules. no wonder they dont even dare answering emails about it

Ok. I am pleading you. No, more like begging you. Please make iron hand shoulder pads. I would pay out da wazzoo for some. We are so under appreciated!
-sobs-
I love your work though. The salamander stuff makes me want to play as them! You make a brother proud!

Dont worry, I have came up with IH storm shield concepts and there will be shoulderpads as well and maybe even a thunderhammer and rhino kit but it takes time, I´m just one guy with a regular job next to my hobby.
The only issue is coming up with enough original icons that would please "machine loving" players out there. Right now I´m thinking cog-crenulations, iron gauntlets and crossed wrenches.

I can tell you that GW does not own, nor does it pay for anything to do with the Bolter and Chainsword. And neither Bolter, or Chainsword, are trademarked by GW.

I would need a little more then your word for it because by the way they act it really shines through.
Its not the issue with "bolter" and "chainsword" being trademarked by GW or not, its the hypocricy that the BnC beats down against their own rules on people "daring" to show greenstuff pictures that CAN be used in GWs games while themselves using clear GW art (bolter and chainsword) PLUS asking people for money to upkeep it all while in the background making a big investment of it.
Its low, disgusting, hypocritical and speaks volumes of the rotten core that is the BnC and I laugh at their attempts to silence it down under the rug.

That Iron Snake front would also be fun for Alpha Legion Players, I'd think. As for Iron Hand Players, I'd think that having cog or tech doors would appeal to both them and also Iron Warriors players.

I´m doing a second version of the snake front but this time but with a dragon head instead. It could fit "evil" dragon armies as well as salamander armies.

Games Workshop does not sell any Iron Hands shoulder Pads that I know of. If they do, please send me a link. I have been looking for some time now. I think you might be confusing the Iron Hands with the Iron warriors, ChapterHouse. But, I would be very interested in some Cog shoulder pads, doors or even decals. Adeptus Mechanicus Pads and doors would be very nice as well. I do understand that you are busy at the moment. But if you ever get around to any of these things, please let me know! I would be more than willing to buy.

I have sculpted more template shoulderpads to use as "canvas" in pad creation. Those should if all goes well be made available to me in 2-3 weeks. It will definately decrease sculpting time on pads since I will no longer have to spend time on doing the very pad foundations from scratch every time, having them cast in resin and then combining them with the sculpted icons. This is what made pad sculpting so slow.

As for pads that would go well with "Iron Hand" and other "steampunk" armies:
People, if you want those to come out faster you NEED to help out by sending in ideas and suggestions, sometimes a project is on hold a really long time simply becasue I am stuch with ideas and cant come up with something "cool" enough. I´m a lone guy and not a team of paid professionals that come up with concepts all days long
Just remember, the ideas need to be original and not GW copies...we dont want the poor BnC mods to sweat in their seats trying to delete and silence every thread showing our stuff now do we, it would not be taken well by their GW masters.

Any chance for more soul drinker stuff? Possibly just a plain chalice symbol on its own? (would like some Chalice on me Drop Pods )

I´m working on a chalice themed rhino. As for a standalone icon, why not but only when I get time over for it. Right now I´m bogged down with the chalice front plate trying to figure a way to make a chalice from a pair of folded wings.
It might be a disaster or it might actually look really nice when finished, at this moment I dont know.

As for the standalone icons being worked on the most right now are my own "iron wolves" creation.

As said, these things take time, this is not my main job (for now at least) and I´m one guy having to come up with all the ideas so these things take time.

Hi Tom (Pyriel) .. Nick ... As the owner of the B&C and the person who pays for it out of his own pocket (with no advertising as you commented), I find it almost laughable that you need to go to such lengths to critique the B&C. Looks like somehow we touched a nerve for you guys!

Obviously Games Workshop don't "pay" for the B&C, nor have I escaped the gaze of their legal team who tried to shut down the Space Marine Painter I wrote. Its almost comedic that you would say that really, given the hassle they gave me for the painter, however I am sure GW Legal have sent letters to you and will do again, good luck with that

Anyway moving on you guys were banned because you broke the rules over on the B&C, nuff said really. I understand that frustrates you, but we really don't let people try and sell stuff via our board (hence no advertising).

I had to pop in as I got so many people telling me about this thread I had to come take a look at the "B&C Hate", as a long time Dakka Member I wish you guys good luck here, its a great board and as you can see I do post here quite a bit, so I look forward to seeing you around.

Anyway back on topic, love the sculpting Tom, very talented work, you should try for a job at GW perhaps?

Brother Argos
Bolter & Chainsword Owner.

p.s. For the record, I am the Managing Director of a profitable computer business, which is how I can afford to pay for the B&C but that doesn't sound half as much fun as being a super secret spy fronting for Games Workshop special covert legal operations does it now? .. hmmm but as a covert super secret spy I would say that wouldn't I

Thanks for the thread hijack.

Instead of trying to defend yourself in our thread, how about you start one on BnC, and let us post on it? Instead of completely locking out my account with no previous warning or emails.

The simple matter is this, rather then explain yourself on BnC, or even moderate and edit a post that supposedly was a for sale post (how it is, I dont know since it was all Works in Progress showing greens and asking for critiques) you and your moderators deemed to arbitrarily delete the threads and then ban our accounts. According to your rules, you go by a strike system, funny I did not even get a warning or a reason on why the threads were deleted and what rules we broke.

You choose not to explain your actions and act very much like a GW Legal representative, so what do you expect? Your board in my experience has a very fascist moderating and admin team who rather then explain thier actions, locks accounts and deletes threads.

It readily appears you are doing Games Workshops work for them by eliminating any mention of a viable bits competitor, does it not?
The only thing we ever did on your site in a way of "advertising" was putting our link on the bottom of our signature, which according to your rules, is completely ok.

I did email your admin as soon as my account was locked, as I got no reason or any PM but they must be on a mighty high perch since I never got a reply back.

Simple, but I doubt very much you would like to have to explain yourself on BnC, or your actions..

Why don't you post our original Works in Progress threads and lock them and ask your general membership if they looked like another "Works in Progress" thread or an actual for sale thread, a poll would be nice.

Obviously we really did touch a raw nerve, chill Nick ... enjoy your time on Dakka

"You act very much like Gw Legal" ... I have got to put that in a Sig sometime ... its a classic!

Although my favourite has to be the Facist thing, really ... its all about a game of toy soldiers Nick, what do you think we are going to do ... invade toy Poland?

Tell you what, next time your in London drop me a line, we can kick back, have a beer and a game


Automatically Appended Next Post:
However ... as this is your thread we should stop now, and let you get on with selling stuff

A WIP - can be a gateway/method for indirect/social network IM (internet marketting) via pm sales/ product recognition.

B&C has their ways of running advertising & sales of product whether indirect or direct.
And it was their call..

Every place has their own rules on how things are run.
and..... owners of those places can do however they see fit...
even above established rules.

The most common misconception
Access to anyone's site is a privilege not a right

It is just how it is....

There doesn't seem to be a denial that the Chapterhouse guys were shut down fast, without the due process they normally give posters.

It's certainly their right to ban whomever they want for whatever reason, but there is still value in showing when/where an authority acts solely at their own discretion.

Pointing out when the emperor is really naked is fun. Sure, he's still an emperor, but we can still mock his genitalia

Good points all around, back to the regularly scheduled upcoming releases

Hi Tom (Pyriel) .. Nick ... As the owner of the B&C and the person who pays for it out of his own pocket (with no advertising as you commented), I find it almost laughable that you need to go to such lengths to critique the B&C. Looks like somehow we touched a nerve for you guys!

Obviously Games Workshop don't "pay" for the B&C, nor have I escaped the gaze of their legal team who tried to shut down the Space Marine Painter I wrote. Its almost comedic that you would say that really, given the hassle they gave me for the painter, however I am sure GW Legal have sent letters to you and will do again, good luck with that

Anyway moving on you guys were banned because you broke the rules over on the B&C, nuff said really. I understand that frustrates you, but we really don't let people try and sell stuff via our board (hence no advertising).

I had to pop in as I got so many people telling me about this thread I had to come take a look at the "B&C Hate", as a long time Dakka Member I wish you guys good luck here, its a great board and as you can see I do post here quite a bit, so I look forward to seeing you around.

Anyway back on topic, love the sculpting Tom, very talented work, you should try for a job at GW perhaps?

Brother Argos
Bolter & Chainsword Owner.

p.s. For the record, I am the Managing Director of a profitable computer business, which is how I can afford to pay for the B&C but that doesn't sound half as much fun as being a super secret spy fronting for Games Workshop special covert legal operations does it now? .. hmmm but as a covert super secret spy I would say that wouldn't I

Oh hi Argos (David).
After all the PM and email stonewalling from BnC I figured I post a bit nerve touching things in here to finally get a word with you and lo and behold, to my astonishment it actually worked (and people say I have a knack for the manipulative side, hehe).

So what gives, lets take it in here then rather then in BnC if you wish.

Yes you are right, you really touched a nerve there. I am least to say upset about the double standards the BnC has shown, getting booted of without even a PM for daring to show a green and helping a fellow sculptor out (no ads, no sales talk etc on my part) touched a nerve that is true. Surprised?

The things you say to and about me on your board about ripping GWs IP of and making money of them is laughable when you do so yourself using GW IP in the boards name and arts and that is not even a straight out comparison since I dont use direct GW IP contrary to you. The painter on BnC uses GW IP in a far more "illegal" way then any art copy of GW art transferred to greenstuff. Congratulations on wringling out of the GW legal trap on that one but then please dont preach to me that I´m doing "bad" things with GW IP since well, you know, stones and glass houses and all that.
Maybe you are not the GW secret spy but wrangling out of that calls for some high friends at the GW drinking bar at the least, that is if you dont want to mix in money into the equation.

We dont make money of GWs IP or rip them of as you said, any more then GW "rip" of Tolkien, Moorcock and Lucas and make money based of their IP and popularity crowd. The BnC itself using GW terminology to draw people in (and be a huge advertising boost to GW themselves) is different in exactly what way?
Dont say the difference is you dont make money of GW´s IP since the very same IP is what is alloweing your board/investment to grow and rise in value.
And those bolter and chainsword t-shirts and dice etc etc?
If I sold GW shoulderpad or chapterhouse T-shirts etc wouldnt you be the first to call me out as ripping GW IP of?

But here I am, posting a greenstuff picture, being previously called out to make money of GWs IP and funny enough booted of the site for showing a green, thats all, showing a green.
What happens next, will the BnC start banning people for showing of painted models using my sculpts on them answering questions about them that they bought them from CH?
That if anything is advertising.

What nerve did I touch with you David, was it you thinking I´m a bad person that dares to do the same thing that GW or you yourself do albeit in a different shape, was it an angry email from GW or was it just you thinking some my sculpts are ugly (nothing new here)? Because whatever it was it sure as hell wasnt me doing advertising.
I´m sure the BnC mods are going to bring out some old fight which I was a part of to excuse this "later" ban, I dont care and quite frankly its so blatantly transparent that I am amazed to find it more amusing then pissing of and I am known for being easily pissed of

If you had such a problem with my greens pictures taking them for advertising despite nothing close to that being written by me (I helped out a sculptor with problems) as I am sure you saw the pics as that, why didnt you simply PM me about it rather then hiding behind proxy mods and go with a boot and then have the mods hide under the rug not even answering an email?
If that was such an issue I would have been more then happy to basically stop posting any "green" pictures what so ever.
Or was it the mistake that I posted the picture in Nicks thread where Nick used a banner picture about the site? Ok if so then my mistake, funny that you collateral ban people you dont agree with then. Besides having a banner like Nick has is not forbidden by the BnC rules.

Maybe it was Phal banon (think his nick is) who mentioned the forbidden "sale" word in Nicks post that threw you in a fit of collateral banning?
You might want to PM Phal since as soon as I saw his "sales" reply I PMed him telling him to not write any references to selling things since that goes against the BnC rules!
THAT´S how I follow them and THAT´S how non advertising I am so yes you hit a nerve by banning me based on a lie.
That if anything tells me I was the one hitting a very big nerve with you rather then you hitting a nerve with me!

What pisses me of is you laughing this of instead of mending it and hiding behind Nicks word usage. Answering with a "Fascists, thats funny" to his questions instead of admitting I was banned for invented reasons is childish, embarrassing and quite frankly as far from you as I thought it would be.



Now days the BnC has lost its magical touch, at least for me personally, gone are the passionate fights and arguments I was used to have about valid topics despite trying out a few to see if the fire was still there.
Now days the BnC is about 20 000 new kids all asking the same questions over and over again, how old is a space marine, how big is a boltgun etc etc.
Now I only ever use(d) the BnC as a friends contact site to keep up with old fellow hobbyists and online friends and to show and help out the fellow sculptor/painter now and then, nothing more!
So this sudden ban didnt produce anything but annoy me of and make a bunch of my friends unhappy since I hardly ever talk to or show my work on any other site out of old habits sake.

Congratulations on a biased ban and to handling it all so "mature", that rocked me and my belief in the BnC.



So you had GW legal trouble, well with the blatant usage of direct GW IP in both software as well as board art and terminology and all that for "free", well, it makes me smile...
Yes GW legal sent letters to us too but those were far from "legal" and had my lawyer almost laugh his behind out of his chair when he read a copy of them. Corporate thugging and "demanding" might work on 14 year old hobbyists but the funny thing is how did it work on you when GW had substantial IP copying and usage to call you out in their letters?
Hmm...if you paid, are paid, have a mutual deal or simply great amountof luck doesnt interest me, congratulations to a very nice deal and hope it continue to be profitable for you.

However what is rather insulting is you accusing me of making money of GW IP, being illegal etc all while I work my behind of and pour significant amounts of money into a legal system to make sure everything is 100% legal and correct. That this doesnt always concur with GWs legal policy page (read, not the true legals) is irrelevant to say the least.
You are actually the last person that has the right to be upset, amused or surprised that I called you out on making money on GW in return. What goes around comes around.



I broke the BnC rules and was banned for it, "nuff said"? Allow me to laugh David!
That is a blatant lie and the really funny thing is that both I and you know it so please dont insult my intellect and just drop that approach.
I never ever advertised, I never ever mentioned selling things nor did I ever link to any site that sells my stuff.
Heck if I would want to even subtly advertise my things on the BnC I´d get a banner under my sig like Nick did, all allowed under your BnC rules.

I know from your past words that you personally hate what I do (ripping of GW IP...pot calling kettle), dont like my "sallie" sculpts and dont even deign to answer PMs from me even when I asked you about your personal opinion on sculpting issues and seeked a way for us to "make piece".
What you did banning me over a blatant lie like this is as I said, low and hypocritical and it reeks of GW bias at worst or your dislike of what I do at best.

You (plus donations) pay the BnC site out of your own (and others) pockets, ok if you say so (not that it matters to you if I say I am doing a legal business myself), all logics however point to quite the contrary.
The "upkeep" makes for quite some investment:
http://www.websiteoutlook.com/www.bolterandchainsword.com
Plus I bet the 45% of on all GW toys are thrown in the bargain.

Congratulations to some money well made on GW´s IP David and good luck making even more in the future, after all money and hobby together is the best of things.
but please dont stoop so low as to call me out on making money of GW and banning me for an invented advertising that I never did, that is laughable and really doesnt suit you from what I know of you from chats past.
The BnC is one gigantic free GW advertising neon bright sign, the eventual trouble you had with your guys at GW were surely more for show then serious or you would have been sued for using actual direct GW IP in a money/investment making way.

Yes and I still remember that day when the BnC crashed and you rushed headlong back to the UK from a vacation in Spain with family to as quickly as possible repair the damage and get the BnC site back up.
Naturally you were hailed as a living santa clause by the not knowing better community but it takes a blind fool not to see a person doesnt abandon a vacation in Spain with family to cut a few days of a board crash and get it back online unless there are money involved in it.
I cant recall any instance when the FoN or SB sites had their owners or us admins abandon all they were doing to "save" a couple extra days of surfing fun for some hobbyists around the globe. You must be the kindest person on this planet...which kinda doesnt make sense with you banning me for something I never did in the first place.

You must surely have confused me with my friend Nick why actually HAD an advertising banner under his name on the BnC and on occasion posted a bit to "provoking" threads but no, my and his accounts are not the same so do it right and do it again and please drop the you were banned because you advertised or at least incluse a new BnC rule of colateral banning if one person tresspasses.
To bad you never did as your mods preach and used the PM function with me to solve an irritating issue without polluting the board but then again why should you when you can simply make whole threads vanish and then refuse to reply to emailed questions.

Although my favourite has to be the Facist thing, really ... its all about a game of toy soldiers Nick, what do you think we are going to do ... invade toy Poland?

Strange, I thought it was about a site that acts as a pretty big future monetary investment and doesnt allow any "unwanted" persons on it and invents reasons to ban them but hey, the toy soldier part of the hobby is darn fun.

Tell you what, next time your in London drop me a line, we can kick back, have a beer and a game

If you really meant that why didnt you have a serious discussion in a PM or online with Nick rather then invent a rule breakage (on my part) and delete it and then stonwall it?
for crying out, it took me to post these things in here to even get an acknowledge from you (forced you out) and even then all you do is avoid the issue of my and Nicks banning like a politician avoids
raised taxation issues.
And no, "nuff said" is not an argument.


But I´ll take you up on your offer and even write about it after wards in here.
Next time I´m in the UK I´ll drop you a line, I think it would be kinda fun to have a beer and a game, best outcome we realize the other guy is not such a bad person after all, worst outcome, status quo.

Although I´d need some form of means to contact you, how on earth am I going to drop you a line about us having a beer when you never reply even to PMs sent on your very own board?
I cant even contact your admins and ask for a beer with you, they dont reply either the polite lot of them.
Do you use MSN? Skype? ICQ?
Please advise David!


Cheers.
Pyriel aka. Tom.

LOL at the hijacking comment. Since when is replying to accusations made by the thread originator is hijacking? If you don't want it responded to, don't post it in your thread. Duh!

Hmmm a solid wall of text ... but all I see is "Blah Blah Blah ..."

I learnt long ago not to argue on the net, no one ever wins apart from admins with banning powers!.

Enjoy yourselves on the rest of the net guys

Adios!

A moderator said:

It would be best if Chapterhouse and B&C took their argument against each other offline. Dakka is not the right venue for that kind of proceedings.

This thread has another purpose which is to discuss the Chapterhouse offerings.

In terms of IP and legal concerns, GW will no doubt knock on Chapterhouse's door if and when they have an arguable case. So that's another issue which doesn't need to be discussed in the thread.

Thank you.

Very cool stuffs, not for armies I play, but still cool stuffs.

Also, this thread did clear up some legal concerns I had about making my own sculpts and possibly selling them.

Those sculpts look fantastic.

I think all the legality of it is silly. If GW believed they could do something about it, they would. B&C's overly protective posture, is exactly why I think there is something seriously wrong. It is the sort of "fear" that GW's legal department wishes to impose on the hobby. Brother Argos, didn't deny the facist claim, I guess he's accepted reality.

This whole hobby is about creating unique yet derrivative works. Chapterhouse is just as protected from legal action when they make these sculpts and cast them as the guy who paints up an "Ultramarines" army and gets paid for it.

GW will always have the burden of proving that anyone who sells services or sculpts are doing something incongruous with the expectations of the hobby. GW has to ignore the precedents of the model building hobby that existed before while denying that it promotes the excercise of ones ability to create unique artistic works with its IP.

What people don't realize is that GW has granted everyone the right to do this type of work, by virtue of the fact that with out the implied consent, you would violate their IP just by assembling a model in a way other than it was intended, by painting it in a way other than it was intended, by replicating for ones self or for others the coloration and iconography of GW's IP. As these are all derivative artistic works, things without implicit consent we could all be sued for producing such works.

I would LOVE to have Brother Argos(David) give the facts and defend the actions of hisself and his moderating team(seeing as he has pretty much refused to do so), but I think it needs to be done elsewhere.

Sadly, seeing as he does remove any post from his forums that question his actions (he even removes any post that just mention Chapterhouse Studios), I dont see it happening where it needs to be done.

I roused up a beast on this issue by posting about my frustrations about "Bolter & Chainsword" and the hipocritcy shown there.

If you guys want to, I can start a new post on dakka regarding the issue, but can we attempt to move this post back into our upcoming items and the discussion about them?

aka_mythos wrote:What people don't realize is that GW has granted everyone the right to do this type of work, by virtue of the fact that with out the implied consent, you would violate their IP just by assembling a model in a way other than it was intended, by painting it in a way other than it was intended, by replicating for ones self or for others the coloration and iconography of GW's IP. As these are all derivative artistic works, things without implicit consent we could all be sued for producing such works.

But maybe that is what they intend? I mean, if I buy some space marines and don't assemble them according to the instructions (which clearly show the proper way to assemble them and even have little icons to denote which parts are optional) then perhaps I am violating GW's IP? I mean, they never gave me permission to assemble their IP in any other way, right? In which case I am only allowed to do so only through the beneficent sufferance of GW's legal department, and I should be grateful they don't sic their law dogs on me!

You better watch out. You better not cry. You better not pout. I'm telling you why. GW Legal is coming to town...

That was a bit of what I was getting out. You can assume GW has set a litigous trap or that they've given us implicit permission. Courts in general would frown upon the first, especially when GW is constantly giving us instructions in mixing and matching and sculpting new artistic pieces.

That said, Nick when are we likely to see some of those other Rhino/Predator add-ons I know Chapterhouse is working on?

However, GW also sell bits to customise their models, as well as sculpting tools and supplies. From this it can be understood that they expect or even want people to chop and change their model kits and even entirely alter tham with the green stuff and tools that they sell along side their model kits.

They sell parts which can be combined into models, but it does not, as far as I am aware, matter what you use them for once you have them (so long as you are not selling them on in some way as your own work etc I think).

I could build a remote control car with a shell made from Space Marine legs and Tau rifles without any problem if I really wanted to. Though I am not sure why I would want to

Persephone 66 wrote:Very cool stuffs, not for armies I play, but still cool stuffs.

Also, this thread did clear up some legal concerns I had about making my own sculpts and possibly selling them.

I would advise you not to rely on this thread for legal advice.

IP law is a minefield. Chapterhouse have made proper consultations.

I agree with Killkrazy... if you're going to do anything like this seek consultation. This thread gives you a general sense of things, but different countries have different laws and it can get sticky.

Yep, US law is a bit different then UK law (which is why a US lawyer laughed at a UK company trying to impose UK law).

I am actually paying for the designs this week from the designer, it will probably be a month until they are on the site (they still need to be "printed", shipped, then molded and produced).

Nick

BrotherArgos wrote:Obviously we really did touch a raw nerve, chill Nick ... enjoy your time on Dakka

"You act very much like Gw Legal" ... I have got to put that in a Sig sometime ... its a classic!

Although my favourite has to be the Facist thing, really ... its all about a game of toy soldiers Nick, what do you think we are going to do ... invade toy Poland?

Tell you what, next time your in London drop me a line, we can kick back, have a beer and a game


Automatically Appended Next Post:
However ... as this is your thread we should stop now, and let you get on with selling stuff

You still haven't responded to his complaints or answered his questions, and I don't think I'm the only one here who'd like it if you would.

I dont think we will get an upfront answer or explanation, and I hate to "pollute" dakka with a discussion that should be held on Bolter and Chainsword.
Sadly that will never happen as the "Bolter and Chainsword" moderators and owner refuse to let such a discussion happen out in public on that forum.

Neconilis wrote:You still haven't responded to his complaints or answered his questions, and I don't think I'm the only one here who'd like it if you would.

+1

Eric

It would be best if Chapterhouse and B&C took their argument against each other offline. Dakka is not the right venue for that kind of proceedings.

Ok then a new topic in the general section will be made. Poor little Argos is not weasling away that easy.
I cant see a general debate about the "alledged" hypocricy of the BnC be against any rules, should the owner keep running then let the public decide themselves.

Also, this thread did clear up some legal concerns I had about making my own sculpts and possibly selling them.

Its unfortunately not that easy, I advise you to get in touch with a professional attorney or legal firm or you might stumble into one of many pits.
It will cost you quite a sum and keep doing so in a rolling manner but I´d feel very bad if you took some ideas from "us" without the proper background knowledge and got in trouble for it.

What people don't realize is that GW has granted everyone the right to do this type of work, by virtue of the fact that with out the implied consent, you would violate their IP just by assembling a model in a way other than it was intended, by painting it in a way other than it was intended, by replicating for ones self or for others the coloration and iconography of GW's IP. As these are all derivative artistic works, things without implicit consent we could all be sued for producing such works.

This is valid on paper only and absolutely no judge in the entire world would ever attempt to impose or enforce such an action.
its like making it illegal for people to read books on mondays, doable in theory but how do you check every house hold for people reading books in privacy?

I would LOVE to have Brother Argos(David) give the facts and defend the actions of hisself and his moderating team(seeing as he has pretty much refused to do so), but I think it needs to be done elsewhere.
Sadly, seeing as he does remove any post from his forums that question his actions (he even removes any post that just mention Chapterhouse Studios), I dont see it happening where it needs to be done.

Do it in the general section since there are things worth debating, or I can compile it for you if you dont have the time, just ask.
Having Argos meet your arguments is a pointless task, its like having lying coward politicians meeting the public explaining what drain the funds went. Aint gonna happen.
I lured him out once straight into a barrage of his own GW IP money making examples and he said "blah blag" and dissapered. He will not make the same mistake twice or hopefully come back later much better prepared for a debate but dont bet on it, he has far more to win by playing the chicken card.

You better watch out. You better not cry. You better not pout. I'm telling you why. GW Legal is coming to town...

If GW were smart they would stop "scaring" us and meet us in a constructive discussion instead that might benefit both parties and is disclosure signed.
Going to court with a case that is not 100% waterproof and then some or relying on us being as giving in then the usual cases might seem like a fine idea for them but IF they loose we will make sure to open the flood gates to the whole chinese "copycat" tsunami that is just waiting such a court outcome. So is this might not be a court game GW would like to risk,especially when there are money making alternatives open to them instead.
Heck if I were them I´d contact us with a deal and make money and free advertising on it out of us in the process.

I mean look at the BnC owner, making big bucks of direct GW IP usage while selectively slamming down unlicensed manufacturers. Dont know weather to laugh or cry.

That said, Nick when are we likely to see some of those other Rhino/Predator add-ons I know Chapterhouse is working on?

They should be in casting at the moment. Sadly I was so rushed in finishing them that silly me forgot to take decent pictures of them so you´ll have to wait till I get my hands on a cast and paint it for show.

As for sculpting (what this thread is about):
Here is a WIP of landraider art that I´m workign on.

Funny enough this one picture was what David/Argos banned me for. To bad the hypocrite ran of instead of answered honestly why.

But chickens aside, what do you think, whats good, whats bad and what are your own ideas for the other landraider door art?
I´m thinking a similar theme with a robed skeleton but with another pose and another weapon.
What say you?

Tom, I think at some point you should do a sculpting tutorial on here. I think you could really show us alot we could benefit from.

Tom, I think at some point you should do a sculpting tutorial on here. I think you could really show us alot we could benefit from.

I might but that depends. You see I would need a mod in here to ok a tutorial since:
1: They take a lot of time for me to make, take pics of and compile and
2: The BnC refused to host a big tutorial of mine and that was even before the advertising lies.

But that was an an old one not related to my current sculpting so if you guys want custom tutorials I need an ok word so that I dont spend a weekend in vain.
Sorry but the BnC tought me a lot of things, amongst those that it pays to be cynical.

This site has an open tutorial section where you can post with limited moderation. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/forums/show/68.page

2nd'ed for wanting a tutorial....

And please chapterhouse make some different space wolf shoulders, if you do I'm all over them.

Love the Chapterhouse stuff though

My god Tom ... your still going on and on ... even when a mod advises you to stop doing it? ... huge vehement posts, about conspiracy theories with the B&C and GW, calling people all kinds of things, it has to stop sometime.

Sadly it was like this on the B&C for years, I kept cutting you slack and you kept ignoring the mods. Your warning record shows Trolling and flaming for YEARS since you joined in '02. The warning log shows discussions with admins and mods going back to 2003, all asking you to stop your rants and tirades. Most you were rude to or just plain ignored, those you listened too managed to calm you down but only for a few months at best.

Only reason you weren't chucked much earlier is you had a passion for the Salamanders similar to my own. Eventually you ran out of rope, most people get 5 warnings on the B&C max before banning, you ran to over 7 before enough was enough (and that includes the regular yearly removal of a single warning for last 7 years).

It was a mistake on my part really letting you stay beyond the five warnings. You harassed my moderators constantly, even to the point where they wanted to leave the board. The warning topic about you in the Moderators section ran to over 90 posts, only two other members in our entire history generated more hassle than you did.

For those that wanted to know, those are the reasons why Tom was Banned, normally we would not discuss such a thing publicly, but he seemed desperate to know. Obviously ongoing warnings and battles with moderators for 7 years weren't a sufficient clue.

Anyway I am kind of done here .. sorry Kilkrazy but they wanted to know why, I for one will respect what you said and won't carry on the discussion anymore!

So Nick, show us some more sculpting!

gee whiz, let it die already. or take it to PMs or something. Why does every chapterhouse post end up like this?

I think its GW legal mention that does it

I dig the tiered shoulderpad CH.


=][= WARNING - insults to other users are against Rule #1, I advise you check the forum rules before you post again. -grey_death =][=

My god Argos, you stopped lying? Yes I wanted to know David, I wanted to end it with piece on my mind and not lies. Does that surprise you?
Finally Argos, it took you a lot of time start being straight with me and in the end tell me why I was banned. See, not that hard instead of lying about advertising posts and using GW IP to make a buck (pot calling kettle).
Now you dont have to face explaining how companies like: http://privateerpress.com and http://www.maxmini.eu
are allowed to "advertise" on your site while I get kicked after one innocent picture.
I bet that was worth it rather then keep making claims that are counter proven when hiding from it didnt help due to my "ranting".
Although you still havent answered why all chapterhouse linking threads made my people on your site "vanish" in a second while tons of other so called "advertising" frequent your site. Cmon Argos, now when you´re starting to get "honest" with me dont stop! Use the PM if it is embarrassing. Heck I´ll even help you out and do it for you so we dont pollute this thread any more since you are so careful not to bother the admins here but that calls for you actually deigning to answer my PM for a change.

I find it hard to believe past bad behavior is so unwanted on BnC, after all one of your mods was banned from FoN TWICE and had a pile of warnings from SB the size of texas for bad behavior and for making members want to quit the boards but on BnC those kind of people are taken in as mods. Heck, I would fit at head admin level on your board with my "trouble making" credentials!

You try to act above criticism and vilify me by asking why I keep on ranting while excusing yourself by posting ot one-liners, you accused me of doing things you do yourself and of advertising while others are allowed to do so blatantly and now you are "shocked" that I over react? Is it part of your "warnings" about me to the dakka admins? It takes two to tango David and you sure lead well!

That SO much "ranting" was needed to make you stop throwing stones in glass houses about GW IP and making money, lying about me advertising and instead start telling me straight things to my face rather then hiding speaks volumes about who you are David.
I think it was worth it since now I know where I have you rather then having to face someone lying to my face I dont have to constantly second guess your words any more. Now stop bothering me with this, this is a CH sculpt thread!

Fianlly! "Rant" and of topic over *phew*, and finally I can get some piece.
Sorry dakka, needed to defend the public advertising lies and no, I couldnt take it in PM since I already tried that on BnC and Argos never bothered replying...but now its over
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So Nick, show us some more sculpting!

Nick doesnt do the sculpting nor the taking of pictures so he cant comply with the request, but I´ll do my best to meet it.

2nd'ed for wanting a tutorial....

Of what kind of tutorial, on what?
Easiest would be if I took things already existing on my table and photoed them as I go along.

Things I recently finished that are going to Chapterhouse (and examples of what kind of tutorials can be made are):
Fire and coal containing braziers that can be added to any vehicle (but are part of the Land Raider extra armour kit)
This is the "ugly" one (there are two different versions).



Heavy bolter cover for the LR or any razorback etc.


Some Land Raider track guards and side extra armour for any armies using dragons or simply salamanders:


Those buggers were a pain to sculpt but now all hangs on Nick and his ability not to wreck the sculpts in the moulding and casting process.

Some previous sculpts were ruined in the copying processes and that is a bummer since it eats away my time for nothing so lets see if these things go through well enough.

I should also have updated pics of that new wolf/celtic storm shield tonight, I should really benefit from a gigantic basement standing casting pressure pot now to speed up the work, stupid me for selling the one I had of, talk about making a past blunder:(

I have a question that i always wanted to ask ...
but not sure how to word it without sounding like im trying to cause problems ><

Shoot. I mean it cant get any worse then the previous little storm in here

Well, unless it is a legal question "again".

Tom- wrote:Shoot. I mean it cant get any worse then the previous little storm in here

Well, unless it is a legal question "again".

Kk , this is 100% real question ,

Awhile back when the Leman Russ are rumored to be remade , there have been alot of talk on how people
dislike the decades old design. And i found some resin conversion kits for Ssur Namel ( lol forgot the product name ) .

What it is , is resin Russ parts to be attached onto current LR , and they look really really really good.

However , they have been quickly shut down despite they are located all the way in Russia.

So i guess my question is , what did they do wrong , or how are you guys approaching this differently then
they did? to be able to stand against GW's rabid lawyers ?

Kk , this is 100% real question ,

Awhile back when the Leman Russ are rumored to be remade , there have been alot of talk on how people
dislike the decades old design. And i found some resin conversion kits for Ssur Namel ( lol forgot the product name ) .

What it is , is resin Russ parts to be attached onto current LR , and they look really really really good.

However , they have been quickly shut down despite they are located all the way in Russia.

So i guess my question is , what did they do wrong , or how are you guys approaching this differently then
they did? to be able to stand against GW's rabid lawyers ?

Ssur Namel?
Sorry but I would need to see what parts you are talking about, can you link to a picture?
How did do it wrong I cant even start to tell you without having seen the pics or know something about how they made them, how they advertised them or what they called them.

Being russia based doesnt matter in this instance, there are a few countries however that do offer vastly better protection from things like hostile shut downs of web sites etc and no, I´m not speaking of under developed african ones.

Tom- wrote:
Ssur Namel?
Sorry but I would need to see what parts you are talking about, can you link to a picture?
How did do it wrong I cant even start to tell you without having seen the pics or know something about how they made them, how they advertised them or what they called them.

Being russia based doesnt matter in this instance, there are a few countries however that do offer vastly better protection from things like hostile shut downs of web sites etc and no, I´m not speaking of under developed african ones.

Basically its an add on , very similar to chapter house .

Pm´ed you, lets keep this thread clean from legal stuff. Its "supposed" to be about sculpts and maybe tutorial ideas.

I'm glad to see that everybody here ends up looking like a tool.

I love the internet.

That Salamander stuff is VERY nice, but I sold my soul to the Alpha Legion (and the Raven Guard, ironically enough) long ago.

And that variant Leman Russ? Very nice as well!

Now there's a tank! Shame about them getting shut down...

Unlike that Russian company, Chapterhouse doesn't use recast GW components. Chapterhouse goes to lengths to produce from scrath analogues to be sculpted on.



Everything circled is an instance where that Russian company recast the a gmaes worksshop part.

I want those tanks to look cool, but for some reason I just keep feeling like they're backwards...

Those tanks do look cool though... Wonder if there was any way to procure thier molds, modify them to legality, and sell the main body

I realllly like those tanks!

Nick

Polonius wrote:I'm glad to see that everybody here ends up looking like a tool.

+1

As far as the sculpting goes, much better than I can produce. My only quibble is that the bits are too specific and don't fit my needs/ wants.

I'd like to see:
1) Pre-heresy Land Raider kit that is cheaper and can be assembled with less headaches than the current FW piece.

2) Generic squad shoulderpads- Tactical, Dev, Assault with squad #

3) Turbofan jump packs

4) More stuff I can't think of...

I think its an over cluttered abomination, like someone said how many different small GW parts can we recast and glue on.

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3215187&highlight=resin#post3215187

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2135909&postcount=3773

I've seen scratch builds that looked nicer. Speaking of which... this is a resin kit this guy in Germany made:
http://gwfwmort.bplaced.net/web1/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=1&category_id=1&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=2&lang=en

Painted up:
http://pickadamnarmy.blogspot.com/2009/07/painted-blood-pact-tank-6.html

My point compared to what you could do, that russian thing is ugly.

Flagg07 wrote:

As far as the sculpting goes, much better than I can produce. My only quibble is that the bits are too specific and don't fit my needs/ wants.

I'd like to see:
1) Pre-heresy Land Raider kit that is cheaper and can be assembled with less headaches than the current FW piece.

That isnt on the table, but we have the Pre-Heresy Rhino kit that will turn a MKII chassis into a MKI image with doors and grills and front panels.

Flagg07 wrote:2) Generic squad shoulderpads- Tactical, Dev, Assault with squad #

These are being molded as we speak, we have I-VI Tactical Arrow Pads, VII-X are Devestator and Assault Pads, Im looking foward to removing all my decal Squad pads from my Salamanders

Flagg07 wrote:3) Turbofan jump packs

On the drawing board along with some Pre-Heresy Terminator pads and other early era style pads


Nick

Chapterhouse wrote:

Flagg07 wrote:3) Turbofan jump packs

On the drawing board along with some Pre-Heresy Terminator pads and other early era style pads


Nick

I'll be waiting for these!

Pre-Heresy is an absolute untapped gold mine, as far as I'm concerned.

I'm still shocked that GW and/or FW hasn't made more of an effort in this direction...

They're leaving money on the table and in wallets on this one!

Yeah, I think you will see a push from us on PH stuff once we finish the Wolf stuff on the table. Id love to move faster but we need more sculpting manpower (which Im trying to procure without costing me an arm and a leg).

Nick

Since you are redoing the Salamanders Rhino front, I really think you should take a look at the 'lizard skin' pieces meant to go onto the gaps on the front and rear sides.

When I received your product, I was extremely happy with the other parts, but basically threw out those pieces. The problem is that they come in two separate pieces for each 'L' shape, but all of the sides are flush. In addition, there is a good 1mm gap all around them and the rhino body. When installing them will take more GS work than just producing the effect from scratch, I am not that interested.

The Space Wolf equivalent parts look like they will come as a single piece, can this be done with the Salamanders.

All this being said, I will be one of your first orders for the Land Raider kit.

Done.... Tom has remade those panels, he wasnt too happy with them himself, so they are 1 piece parts now

I think they will be more delicate to ship (no more bubble envelopes, need boxes). They may break, btu the fit will be there.

Even if they break, that is an easy fix.

Now, how long of a forecast on the Land Raider kit? I want to get that stuff glued on so that I can start freehanding the thing.

Late next week i should be recieving the new kits.

Nick

Nick and Tom - loving the Land Raider Salamander custom bits. Any chance of a Redeemer flame sponson cover?

I think we can do that, Tom?

LunaHound wrote:

Completely different. That kit is literally a conversion made of Leman Russ tank parts, recast. Chapterhouse makes from scratch add-ons for GW models.

Alpharius wrote:That Salamander stuff is VERY nice, but I sold my soul to the Alpha Legion (and the Raven Guard, ironically enough) long ago.

And that variant Leman Russ? Very nice as well!

Now there's a tank! Shame about them getting shut down...

Alpharius - as a Alpha legion supporter, Im surprised at you! Im keeping an eye on this Sally stuff specifically for my sneaky Alpha chosen! Ive got the Forgeworld LR doors, and am seriously considering greenstuffing scales (as Im not good enough to freehand paint the scales) all over the landraider (like I am my chosen) - these track guards would be a sweet addition!

Chaos it up a bit - golden!

darkkt wrote:

Alpharius wrote:That Salamander stuff is VERY nice, but I sold my soul to the Alpha Legion (and the Raven Guard, ironically enough) long ago.

And that variant Leman Russ? Very nice as well!

Now there's a tank! Shame about them getting shut down...

Alpharius - as a Alpha legion supporter, Im surprised at you! Im keeping an eye on this Sally stuff specifically for my sneaky Alpha chosen! Ive got the Forgeworld LR doors, and am seriously considering greenstuffing scales (as Im not good enough to freehand paint the scales) all over the landraider (like I am my chosen) - these track guards would be a sweet addition!

Chaos it up a bit - golden!

Good idea... what would you guys think of me forming a kit for sale that has the Iron Snake Serpent rhino front and the Salamander Scales for the rhino, sorta of a adhoc Alpha Legion kit?

OK I cant help it.. I need to post what Tom just emailed me... hes finished the hard part on the Wolf round Shield and he has the basics done for the new Drop Pod armor (we will haev wolf icons on this and use it as a template for more kits later).

If you produce that shield you will FORCE me to buy one for every model I own. I order you to stop at once before I'm broke. Looking forward to seeing what kind of "Viking" bits you come up with.

Pretty sweet looking stuff, loving that shield.

Tempt me not Wolves!

Chapterhouse wrote:[
Good idea... what would you guys think of me forming a kit for sale that has the Iron Snake Serpent rhino front and the Salamander Scales for the rhino, sorta of a adhoc Alpha Legion kit?

Well, I cant speak for anyone else, but whilst this sounds good, ive already got the forgeworld doors for a rhino & a LR, so I would probably just look for the specific components I wanted (the Snake Rhino hatch)... depending on the price of course!

This is some quality sculpting tho - top work.

YES! That shield is the awesomesauce.

I really like that shield. It's probably a little too purely taken from actual Celtic art for GW, but I think it's amazing.

ugh i hate that term celtic art ¬.¬,

But yeah very good

Dont forget, we will be sculpting wolfy stuff on that shield and probably use it as the base shield for other chapters as well.

(whoever said it) Im not a GW spy, my names dan and my bday is on 22nd - thus Dan22. I signed up to this forum because ive just recently produced a range of my own scratch built 28mm models and i was just interested to learn more about how to keep all of my designs legitimate (i know that this isnt the place for professional legal advice). However your from US and im from UK so the laws different, im not a lawyer im simply interested to follow the developments of these posts.

Chapterhouse wrote:

Flagg07 wrote:2) Generic squad shoulderpads- Tactical, Dev, Assault with squad #

These are being molded as we speak, we have I-VI Tactical Arrow Pads, VII-X are Devestator and Assault Pads, Im looking foward to removing all my decal Squad pads from my Salamanders


Nick

These I would buy many, many, many of.

To Chapterhouse ,

Can I suggest that you sell a plain version of that celic shield just the way it is ? While detailing with wolfish / runic iconography is also great, providing a "plain" version allows for the buyer to customize as they wish, too. I know I'd buy both ... and in bulk !!!

Thanks

I agree with Myrthe, I would like mine just as they are so I can freehand some runes or icons in the center to give my model an individual looking shield.

Will do, we planned on making them as they are for our future works, not too hard to show them on the website for sale

So.. when should we expect those neat layered shoulder pads and the layered rhino armour kits for sale?

I think the pads would make really neat assault squad pads. The rhino armour also looks like a really neat idea for extra armour.

(If its confusing, I'm talking about the shoulder pads and armour plates from the first page of this thread)

They are molding this week, I think they will be on the way to my mailbox next week, at that point ill bite the bullet and take unpainted pictures and list them on the site (I rather paint them up though ).

Chapterhouse wrote:I think we can do that, Tom?

After a second look, I realize that the Lascannons have a top cover, but the Redeemer flamers have a rear 'cover' backing them instead of top cover. I'm not sure how interesting the sponson backing would be, but insteaed perhaps a 'dragons head' over the flamer head itself? Additionally, dragon-head pieces to go over the Marine TacSquad flamers would be excellent as well - I believe theres an image of them in the Salamanders' Index Astartes entry in WD 274 (273 US), and the article also appears in Index Astartes 4 (not sure if all the images are present in Index Astartes 4 though).

Any plans for Chaos in the future?

Chapterhouse wrote:

They are molding this week, I think they will be on the way to my mailbox next week, at that point ill bite the bullet and take unpainted pictures and list them on the site (I rather paint them up though ).

Yay! I think I'll hold off my order until then. I'll be looking forward to them. Any idea how much the rhino plates will be?

Just wanted to pop in and say that I've bought some of your shoulderpads before CH, and they're just as awesome as I thought they would be.

Keep up the good work.

Lordhat wrote:Any plans for Chaos in the future?

Chaos is Tricky, first I dont play them and niether does Tom so we dont reallyhave an idea of whats needed or what people want. Second alot of the Chaos Icons are historical but many are GW created, so we cant do much with those unfortunately.
Third, Forge World has done a pretty good job on chaos in my opinion so again I dont know what we could offer to the masses that isnt already out there.

Nuwisha wrote:

Chapterhouse wrote:

They are molding this week, I think they will be on the way to my mailbox next week, at that point ill bite the bullet and take unpainted pictures and list them on the site (I rather paint them up though ).

Yay! I think I'll hold off my order until then. I'll be looking forward to them. Any idea how much the rhino plates will be?

The Armored ones that I showed in the first photos? Im not sure, it all depends on the production cost, I am thinking 10-15$ price range for resin.

bhsman wrote:Just wanted to pop in and say that I've bought some of your shoulderpads before CH, and they're just as awesome as I thought they would be.

Keep up the good work.

Thanks, the bravos and good works really help, I am taking it slow and steady and while I dont get paid any from this, I am not putting money in either, so its a labor of love and luckily doesnt affect my finances

Nick

What about non-MEQ bitz? I've been dying for you guys to try your hand at space elves... I even made an e-mail submission on your website!

Welll... Icons? W are thinking about those but are tyring to finish up the projects on the table now. Believe me, when we are done with the current stuff, Ill be asking for ideas on the boards and sifting through those.

Nick

What about shoulderpads with more flames, skulls and/or wings iconography? There are a huge amount of chapters that use those as icons (Sons of Medusa, Angels exemplar, Angels Malevolent, Angels of Fire, etc) For those of us that don't have good "fine detail" painting skills (or good luck with transfers) these would be a great help.

the land raider kit looks absolutely fantastic guys...
ill be getting on for sure

any hopes for a deathwing (or even just dark angels) kit or similar stature in the future?
or any dark angels at all?

If you look at "Tom-"s post you will see a grim reaper, angel of death that would go well with Dark Angels.

Beyond the Dark Angels Icon, which we cant really touch, what else would be a good theme for them?

I think you will see quite a few thinks like wings, skulls and flames in the near future. I have to remind Tom that sometimes people just want the simple stuff, no flamking skulls, just a regular old skull

Nick

I think a variety of grim reaper style angels with various weapons and poses work. I want to see one holding a broken sword stabbing a demon thing. I think that would make for a nice allusion.

There are rumors of Blood Angels after Tyranids... any plans for the other angels? Blood drops, challices, and more archangel looking angels seem to be their imagery.

"Third, Forge World has done a pretty good job on chaos in my opinion so again I dont know what we could offer to the masses that isnt already out there. "

In all seriousness you can offer reasonable prices, good quality products and excellent customer service. Something FW dramatically fails at.

I think the suggestion of small peices of things like wings, skulls etc to combine for shoulder pad icons, vehicle detail and so on is a top notch idea. Shouldn't be breaching any copyright stuff, add in a dagger/sword and water/blood drop things you might find a surprise market as long as it's just components not full icons?

Thanks for the compliment on price, quality and customer service.. I guess my post was more to the fact that if Forge World has done something already, it is hard for us to do something similiar without looking like its a copy..

Yeah, blood drops wings swords and daggers, wouldnt be too hard. I guess making a icon kit that would include, wings, blood drops, skulls and a sword (all seperate components but same scale) would make it legal to do and easy for the customer to glue them as they see fit

Nick

I'm all over the Wolf Shields, please release them soon.....seriously I cant wait to buy them.

They are coming..... save your money for a couple of more weeks

In relation to GW's word isn't law. Does anyone recall what happened to the people who made the "Army Builder for the internet"? I'm pretty sure they were shut down, and claimed they would never be.

(If something different happened, then let me know)

Otherwise.... your land raider work is AMAZING!

Datadep5 wrote:In relation to GW's word isn't law. Does anyone recall what happened to the people who made the "Army Builder for the internet"? I'm pretty sure they were shut down, and claimed they would never be.

(If something different happened, then let me know)

I think the Dakka-pinion is to try to keep the legal stuff out of the thread, but keep in mind that the mere threat of a lawsuit can mean a lot. If I was doing something that was 'potentially actionable' I would be nervous because even if I'm 100% certain I'm not infringing, if a large company can find grounds for a lawsuit, they can potentially destroy my profits with a lawsuit.

Chapterhouse presumably has worked this out, as I think everyone and heir brother has told them this. IP law is a tricky thing, and I'm not a lawyer.

Datadep5 wrote:In relation to GW's word isn't law. Does anyone recall what happened to the people who made the "Army Builder for the internet"? I'm pretty sure they were shut down, and claimed they would never be.

(If something different happened, then let me know)

Otherwise.... your land raider work is AMAZING!

Can you not restate the restated obvious? Everyone and their fething cousins have said that CH would get mightily screwed by GW, and they haven't yet. I personally don't believe they will. If you read any of the other CH threads (and I have no doubt that you did) you probably noticed the endless "lol bs ur scrood copycats" so unless you represent GW please consider PMing CH and leaving this News thread for News and not to post statements that so many other people have voiced concern about.

Rico...

Eh, we arent putting our heads in the sand and avoiding the possibility of a fun legal dance with GW. That being said, we have the legal power and funds to do the dance if it happens, and it will be a very public dance too.

We have STRONG ties with the online community and would let everyone know what was going on. None of this shush shush stuff GW does.

Nick

Look who cares about the legal side of this. I am sure its been discussed before. I just want these guys to keep making more stuff especially for my SW. Also just like the BA skulls and daggers etc some SW goodies would be great.

Yes, more about the products, less people running around in this thread pointing the finger and crying 'J'accuse!'

I'm very glad to see this company doing well and producing a quality product to compliment existing ranges.

Just a pity for me that they aren't doing anything Ork related.

Too many ideas, not enough sculpting time... you know a good sculptor for a good price and send them my way

Make me a set of Guard scaled models that look like


and I will personally pay for you to get a hot tub and a Porsche.

Gotta love the Rebel Alliance

Doing more with less for 30 odd years!

Kanluwen wrote:Make me a set of Guard scaled models that look like

and I will personally pay for you to get a hot tub and a Porsche.

Thats easy, talk to the sculptors of Infinity miniatures.
Pay him the Porche , i'll just have a skaven battalion.

You rich?

Spoke with the caster today, all the molds look good and I am getting samples of the land raider and rhino kits in a couple of days...

Seeing the Land Raider Kit, what do you guys think is a fair price for the kit, its in resin and you can see the photos below, its a 11 part kit (the braziers are in pewter that glue on the rear armored panels). I think we can stay in the 20-24$ price range and be ok.

I think the Rhino kit will be in the 15-17$ range..

That sounds like an excellent price... no plans on making doors for the front or side hatches?

sounds great ill deffinately be ordering a few of these. =o)

Yeah, we have the front and side doors already created (the base parts) we are working on the details and sculpt, so if anyone is good at free hand and has a good idea for what should go on a dragon-salamander door and front hatch, let us know.

I cant access your website from work. But do you post to the UK??

Dont have any pics of the new pads on minis but here is one with some older pads on:


Some things finished:




And lots of loose icons sculpted on recently to transform the segmented rhino plates to various army themes.


Ah, the celtic round shield yes. Some progress made by me, I wanted to bake in a hi-tech feel to it so I added some sort of power cable around the shield edge and also lock it in place by using the celtic ornaments but extend them to the back.
Still dont know if I got a better feel to the shield or not as I´m to immersed in it to be objective so go ahead and let me know. Fail or pass?








Yeah, simple things like skulls and wings, ok I get it but how are they suppose to differ from forgeworlds already awesome skull icons?
Is there any interest in chalices btw?
Am sculpting the chalice themed rhino and some loose icons as well at the moment.


As for chaos stuff or a chaos rhino, as Nick said, FW already does a good job covering those BUT...I have a cool idea for a chaos rhino top hatch that is 100% original and draws on Moorcocks compass. It will be made to represent either "chaos" rhinos or possessed vehicles. As for doors etc FW already covers those pretty much but I might do those to mach as well.

Thanks

Yes! I would love chalice stuff! If theres any chance for a drop pod chalice door (although if your making plain icons they could just be glued onto one eh?)

But yea... soul drinker stuff is awwsome... then again it might be just me since im starting a soul drinker army!

A chalice door set would own.

@Tom

Power cabling = PASS!
I like the "wrap around" celtic knots, too.

Eric

I don't think it looks much like "power cabling",more like rope or some other type of braided material. It looks good, however, and as is, could stand in for a 40k or FB shield upgrade.

Well, that was my intention. It all depends on how you paint the "cables", metal or rope-ish.

The only other thing hi-tech will be cables at the front but those will be easily removed and cables by the handle but those are not visible anyway (so why do I bother )

Because you know they are there and want to do the best job you can?

You guys sure like your salamanders/dragons...
We need more wolf stuff, that shield is FTW X2!

One wolf shield is done and waiting on its partner for the mold, bug Tom to make the wolf pads and icons for the vehicles, he is tired of me bugging him

Thanks MagicalMemories, glad you like it.

Because you know they are there and want to do the best job you can?

Well, I got inspired by the FW MO actually, they do lots of details even though half of them will be obscured but for the people wanting to do conversions of odd placements of the bitz I want the things behind the object etc, to be visible.
Sure it adds time but I´d rather do something good then rush out stuff. Hence the time spent on the rhino and LR addons and previous shields.

Now ehen all that remain of the shield are:
Handle, cabling at the back, knuckle guard.

What fronts would you guys want?
One front will be of a dragon/lizard.
One of a wolf head with metal ornaments on it.
One can be a chalice (however a chalice fits inside a celtic pattern I dont know).
And for the freehanders out tehre it will also come clean with empty space in the middle.

But then what?
A wolf skull?
A human skull?
An armoured open (closed?) gauntlet?
A spartan "V" symbol?

Tom, quick question:

The shoulder pads, they are concave in the back, right? Will they fit right over the SM arms? If so, Im ordering a bunch up for my Marines!

They have almost identical dimensions to the regular shoulder pads, take a look at the photo below, the pewter pad is ours, the painted one is a regular shoulder pad from the Marine kit.

All our pads are designed to fit the regular models.

Whilst I own no marines myself, just wanted to wish you well with the company.

I'm verymuch in favour of smaller firms adding diversity and customer choice to our hobby.

You mentioned you would not be doing chaos...but what about Pre-heresy icons and armour (which would be suitable) for the traitor legions?

There does seem to be a lot of HH interest online.

We are working on expanding the Pre-heresy stuff, but alot of that is pretty distinct symbols created by Games Workshop. Unfortunately I dont think GW is handing out any licenses these days. Unless its something that we can do, not sure it will be done.

As I suggested earlier: Turbofan jump packs!

JohnHwangDD wrote:As I suggested earlier: Turbofan jump packs!

Now that is a good call - seconded!

Alpharius wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:As I suggested earlier: Turbofan jump packs!

Now that is a good call - seconded!

http://www.maxmini.eu/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=12&products_id=49

I think we want to do some as well, they will be different then Maximinis though.

Tom- wrote:
But then what?
A wolf skull?
A human skull?
An armoured open (closed?) gauntlet?
A spartan "V" symbol?

You should definitely find a unique way to do some bird iconography. I'm not suggesting you copy this exactly, but GW does seem to lack any Icons that suggest a bird of prey in action.


Also, how about some Large cat stuff?

Lion heads,





Tiger heads,




one or two different cat forms in mid pounce.

We have a lion pad done though... hmm website is down due to traffic...

That Atlanta Falcons icon is no bird of Prey in action. Trust me...I have lived in ATL for 28 years and there is no prey hehehe...

OK websites up again

What fronts would you guys want?
One front will be of a dragon/lizard.
One of a wolf head with metal ornaments on it.
One can be a chalice (however a chalice fits inside a celtic pattern I dont know).
And for the freehanders out tehre it will also come clean with empty space in the middle.

But then what?
A wolf skull?
A human skull?
An armoured open (closed?) gauntlet?
A spartan "V" symbol?

A Griffon of course!!

We have one!

Chapterhouse wrote:We have one!

Yeah I know, I ordered 70 of them...I was talking about the celt shield.
8)~

There any chance for marine body fronts? So instead of the eagle or skull thang its different... Im thinking Chalice of coarse... like the front of the Soul Drinker Omnibus book Just curious

I second the Lion related iconography. One of their untouched chapters that could lead to many cool conversion bits...

We have been debating the space marine torsos. It is more a timing issue (as in not enough) as we would have to create a torso template from scratch that would fit on the GW back half and then do the sculpts...

Again a not enough time with the current sculpting staff we have.

Chapterhouse, why not make a freefloating piece that will fit over a certain torso or torsos that one could just glue on?

My first thoughts:

Fragility, Resin is not very efficient to produce unless they are thicker pieces and I cant see pewter staying on a model very well.

Ease of Use, everytime someone wants to put on the chest bit they would have to modify the GW chest part extensively.

Chapterhouse wrote:My first thoughts:

Fragility, Resin is not very efficient to produce unless they are thicker pieces and I cant see pewter staying on a model very well.

Ease of Use, everytime someone wants to put on the chest bit they would have to modify the GW chest part extensively.

What about a one piece torso that includes front and back?

I would like to see shoulder pads with just the head of a Raptor.
When I expand my SM chapter, I'd buy bucketloads.

To get an idea of what I'm thinking of, take a peek at FW Raptors iconography.
I know you can't copy the image (etc), but something like that would be PERFECT for people like me who use Griffon themes, but HATE the old "griffon rampant" look.


Eric

Yeah, it wouldnt be hard to do a raptor, but wouldnt people ratehr buy the FW ones when they are released with the new Hard cover book?

Price competitively?

TBH anyone willing to only buy GW and FW when there is cooler out there for a better price needs their head seeing to.

That is what is cool with the companies out there making bits, they are there if you want to use them but you dont have too.

I hope that soon we will have enough demand that we can drop our prices, right now we are just trying to stay even.

Chapterhouse wrote:Yeah, it wouldnt be hard to do a raptor, but wouldnt people ratehr buy the FW ones when they are released with the new Hard cover book?

I didn't realize they were going to be expanding their raptors line to tactical Shoulder pads.

Thanks for the info.

Eric

Thats the rumor, they will be in the next FW book.

ubberdorc wrote:

Chapterhouse wrote:My first thoughts:

Fragility, Resin is not very efficient to produce unless they are thicker pieces and I cant see pewter staying on a model very well.

Ease of Use, everytime someone wants to put on the chest bit they would have to modify the GW chest part extensively.

What about a one piece torso that includes front and back?

That would be cool too... and I imagine much easier then just the front half? Also gives you more room for modeling it aye?

There is a legal mess with a whole torso as well. I think just a front piece will be done in the future (Tom wants to sculpt it already). I know GW did pewter ones a while back with some models (Plague Marines) and they just fit on the plastic back halves, so it can be done.

I second the "whole torso" concept. You add that to a more PH look, and it should be significantly less GW-like.

Piousman

For torsos as a whole I´m against doing "whole" torsos. If so they need to be significantly different.
Otherwise only the fronts, that could be nice and that is what I had in mind for quite soem time now.

As for PH, that gives a big leeway to whole torsos and with enough good concepts I can do that.


But then again, torsos. Why torsos, they are totally covered up by two arms and a big weapon already so in reality nothing will be seen anyway. Thus why waste buying special torsos when they will be clogged up with arms and weapons?
Wouldnt it be better to make different pairs of legs with all kinds of hi tech cabling, ornamentation and themed iconography?
After all, the legs are a big part of a mini and contrary to the torso they are wholly visible.

Not all the miniatures get them covered. The problem might come down to economics but special torsos for IC's and some seargents etc might sell. Just depends how many would.

Special torsos and heads to convert plastic marines into the IC's like librarian head with hood, chest and shoulder pad set might for example, think you'd just need to do the research before adding to the to do list.

Just thinking out loud here, but how about some shoulderpads with Sergeant stripes on them?

I've always denoted my sergeants with modern army looking E6 stripes. I don't know if I am the only one...
And I've always liked how the old RT Sergeant stripes looked... that was a great decal that should never have been Squatted.

Chapterhouse wrote:There is a legal mess with a whole torso as well. I think just a front piece will be done in the future (Tom wants to sculpt it already). I know GW did pewter ones a while back with some models (Plague Marines) and they just fit on the plastic back halves, so it can be done.

Awsome! Any word on what kinds you will be making? Or rather what symbols and such will be on them... you are going to be draining me of money soon enough! Love the work though!

If I make front torsos they will be:

Old themed (pre heresy alike), probably two different.
Dragon/lizard themed, at least two types.
Chalice.
Wolf, at least two different.
Snake.
Eagle/wing themed.
Plain, at least 2-3 types.
Skull themed.
"Broken/skeleton" themed (perfect for sci fi knight zombies or death themes or legion of the damned) but this one needs to be a whole plus legs and not just a front torso but as of yet I dont know if that would be legal of us to do.

Awsome!!!! As soon as I read chalice my wallet caught on fire... darn it!

Yeah, moar skulls!

...And termie fitting versions!

JonnyDelta wrote:Just thinking out loud here, but how about some shoulderpads with Sergeant stripes on them?

I've always denoted my sergeants with modern army looking E6 stripes. I don't know if I am the only one...
And I've always liked how the old RT Sergeant stripes looked... that was a great decal that should never have been Squatted.

I totally AGREE!!
I loved the old SGT stripes!

I also like the idea of new arms and legs - maybe some bionics
or EXTRA armor.

Seconded for bionics! Mixed as many bionic parts as I could through my old marine army to give them that been there, done that, lost this bodt part and still going look