It's time to decide on one of those age old questions. If you were a Space Marine when the Heresy broke out, Which side would you pick, and why?

I myself am going to remain neutral.

/discuss.

Loyalist all the way. Going traitor sounds fun at the start but being stuck in the eye of terror for 10000 years is going to get boring. After 13! black crusades those chaos marines must be getting quite .


Also... IT'S HERESY

Traightors will always end up getting the short end of the stick.Sure you get to cause pain and suffering and get rewarded for it but who wants to spend the rest of eternity as either a Blood-sucking dog headed dragon, a walking pus-bag,a giant bird thing who can pull a rabbit out a hat or a perverted-he/she thing who loves its pot too much.I'll tell you doesn't.No self-respecting human being.Loyalists all the way!

I didnt want to ruin all i've fought for and also wont go against my battlebrethren so:

Loyalist.

Surprised?


PS: to the traitors

The Emperor left us to do his work. We're not just tools for him to use. Besides, we'll get infinite power from the Chaos Gods. For the Warmaster!

But you abandoned your legions,you became ugly little beasts with emotional problems and on top of that you guys end up almost killing your father.Try to live with that on your conscience.

Loyalist. Chaos promises power, but with great power comes great responsibility, ill just stick to killing xenos and heretics

Don't forget praising the Emperor.

Loyalist.Don't like mutation that you get if you worship chaos gods.Besides your soul is forefeit and after death you will be tortured for all eternity until emperor destroys chaos god and that destroy thing isfrom eye of terror(novel). to heretics,mutants and unclean and Creeeeeeeeed would outflank any traitors when they would somehow managed to attack Holy Terra.What's that behind door a Baneblade creeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed Failddon is fu...ed.

I fight for freedom, not to further the goals of your corpse emperor.

You Loyalist better hope your not in an legion which turned to chaos or a loyalist legion in the drop pod massarce.

Loyalists cause at the end of the day Im not going to be any gods Gimp.

Lord-Loss wrote:You Loyalist better hope your not in an legion which turned to chaos or a loyalist legion in the drop pod massarce.

Believe me, no legion I am in would turn.
Just kill the agents of chaos and save your Primarch.

About Isstvan: I'll be back. You cannot run far enough in this galaxy to escape my wrath .....

Loyalist 100 percent. I think that the concept of the Imperium when the Emp was alive is how things should be run united humanity deserves to rule the stars!!!!

Loyalty to the true Emperor! Redeem the traitors with sword and fire!

Little lord Fauntleroy wrote:It's time to decide on one of those age old questions. If you were a Space Marine when the Heresy broke out, Which side would you pick, and why?

I myself am going to remain neutral.

/discuss.

I as a SW player would stay loyal. There is nothing worse than an oathbreaker

As for staying neutral or sitting on the sidelines let the DA do that, no proud son of Russ would be caught dead staying neutral

Another reason for staying loyal is that I like my arms the shape they are. IMHO there are a lot better ways of saying "good job" than a long purple tentacle.

FOR THE EMPEROR!

Little lord Fauntleroy wrote:It's time to decide on one of those age old questions. If you were a Space Marine when the Heresy broke out, Which side would you pick, and why?

I myself am going to remain neutral.

/discuss.

Neutral?

There is NO neutral in this war!

You've just numbered yourself amongst the enemy!

Anyway, yeah, For The Emperor!

Indeed!

Loyalist. The Chaos gods don't care about humanity at all and only use them for pawns. The Emperor cares about mankind and was the one who lead them to nearly conquer the galaxy.

Loyalist. Chaos is nifty on the surface, until you start growing extra arms and mutating other things. Not really a pretty site.

CHAOS!!!!

Who wants to be a slave to a dead icon? Kill in the name of a corrupt regime? for the greed of lesser men, men who have never drawn blood themselves, or walked the battle-fields of a hundred worlds?

The Imperium of man is a place of hate and suppression, of ignorance and stagnation, of fear and slavery......I would willing enslave myself to a God who rewards my deeds, who craves my sacrifice and honours the skulls I place at its throne!

As a follower of the free paths, I can use my strength as I see fit, to help or hinder as I see fit, to protect or punish as I see fit, to free or enslave those below me!

Chaos is the path to freedom and enlightenment, chaos is our true nature, we were made to be gods, not slaves to mortals!

@ Alpharius have you read Legion? And while there still is no neutral the Alpha legion is the closest you can come to it.

Traitor, if thats what you want to call it. Not that i'd do evil things, just because I wouldn't want to be stuck serving for the good of the Imperium, who's general population follows more blindly than Americans.

Delephont wrote:CHAOS!!!!

Who wants to be a slave to a dead icon? Kill in the name of a corrupt regime? for the greed of lesser men, men who have never drawn blood themselves, or walked the battle-fields of a hundred worlds?

The Imperium of man is a place of hate and suppression, of ignorance and stagnation, of fear and slavery......I would willing enslave myself to a God who rewards my deeds, who craves my sacrifice and honours the skulls I place at its throne!

As a follower of the free paths, I can use my strength as I see fit, to help or hinder as I see fit, to protect or punish as I see fit, to free or enslave those below me!

Chaos is the path to freedom and enlightenment, chaos is our true nature, we were made to be gods, not slaves to mortals!

Foolish heretic. You do not see that, like Horus before you, you are merely a pawn of the Chaos gods, to be disposed of on a whim. You follow Khorne, eh? Well, you will think twice when your god decides that you have outlived your usefulness. Then you can place one final skull at his throne... yours!

Chaos.

Any fool-Emperor who would restrict one of his sons from using his gift that was GRANTED BY THE EMPEROR HIMSELF (i.e. Magnus the Red) doesn't deserve lackeys and lapdogs.

The Emperor wanted to bring the galaxy under HIS heel, despite whatever was said about uniting Humanity. Well, uniting humanity...yes, under HIS rule. None of this brotherhood stuff. As they say, all empires fall. The only constant is CHANGE. Tzeentch is the only entity that is the universal truth.

Everyone is blinded by thoughts of loyalty and honor. For loyalist marines, where's the honor is butchering whole populations that cant defend themselves just because they refuse to kneel to a false god?

I'd be a loyalist all the way.
But if I would belong to one of the heretic SM chapters, I'd stay there.

wuestenfux wrote:I'd be a loyalist all the way.
But if I would belong to one of the heretic SM chapters, I'd stay there.

Whoa whoa whoa...you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Screw the Imperium!
Fulgrim and Slannesh anyday!

C-C-C yeah!!!!!!

You dont have to follow one of the gods. If you were in the Night Lords, Iron Warriors or Alpha legion, you wouldnt become mutated.

Personally, having black eyes and having biological night vision would be sick. Plus, Night Lord tactics revolve around effective combat strategies and minimal casualties. They are the best of the best, and I think it would be safest there haha.

Well the Emperor's Children were really the screwballs of the war. Instead of fighting with the others we went on a rampage slaying civillians.
And after we were the first to go out and raid the imperium.

Although I think being with the Night lords or the Iron Warriors would be cool too.

Doombot001 wrote:Chaos.
Everyone is blinded by thoughts of power and selfglorification. For traitor marines, where's the power is butchering whole populations that cant defend themselves just because they refuse to kneel to pantheon of a false gods?

Fixed it.

Loyalist. All the way. I've always been sorta a goody-two-shoes kinda guy

FOR THE EMPRAH!!!

As a devout wolf-brother, I've got to say loyalist. I mean, I like having my arms and mind to myself, and not as tentacles or the playthings of greater powers. HERETICS

MC

Loyalest, far more squishy targets to rend apart with my weapons in the service of the Emperor!

Even though my chapter would be pretty much wiped out til the current time line in 40k I would still pick loyalist FOR the EMPEROR

Loyalist all the way. I like the the sound of fighting for honour and duty, so, For the Emperor!

Traitors.

Power is worth ANY sacrifice.

I'd, of course, join the Fail Legion (Read: Black Legion) as I'm one of the few who actually LIKE the Black Legion.

yes the imperium hates mutants cept oh idk Sanguinius and the fuzzy sw.. wolf mongrels and space vampires? no no they're not mutants. They're made by the emperor. Awesome so the loved hypocrite makes mutants to kill mutants that won't fall in line. Yea sounds like a super guy to follow.. no I'll stick with Perturabo and my legion.
In following my brothers I will not fall to mutation.

Iron Within, Iron Without!

The Devourer wrote:Another reason for staying loyal is that I like my arms the shape they are. IMHO there are a lot better ways of saying "good job" than a long purple tentacle.

You know, the chaos gods only make it an arm if you suck. If they like you, your mutation can be great... ladies.

Chaos.

Chaos, of course. Freedom of thought and action can be won only through loyalty to the Ruinous Powers.

Slaanesh in particular.

Mmmm. Cocaine.

I was looking at some space marine stuff to help a friend out making a list and can someone help me understand how a bunch of "good" guys are named after demons? Sammael, Mephiston, etc Sammael literally mean poison of god. Mephiston is awful darn close to mephistopheles. I mean really? There were a few other but those were ones I remember without pulling out his codex again.

For the Emperor!

BURN HERETICS

Viva Imperator!

Whichever side my Primarch chose.

I'd be a khorne zerker punching face! POWER FIST ARGGG!

Traitor, I can't live without my Iron-Warriors.

Seriously, none of you would wish to be alive during the heresy or fighting on either side imho....and I love Black Legion and Abaddon. They are less fail than all other marine organizations tbh...

karimabuseer wrote:Seriously, none of you would wish to be alive during the heresy or fighting on either side imho....and I love Black Legion and Abaddon. They are more fail than all other marine organizations tbh...

1) fixed it for you
2) only 29k years too wait....how boring can this be?
3) if I am the one who IS alive, thats a the good part isnt it?

karimabuseer wrote:They are less fail than all other marine organizations tbh...

This made me lol, and think of the 13 Black Crusades that Abaddon has undertaken and has still failed to actually break out of the Cadian Gate

metallifan wrote:

karimabuseer wrote:They are less fail than all other marine organizations tbh...

This made me lol, and think of the 13 Black Crusades that Abaddon has undertaken and has still failed to actually break out of the Cadian Gate

You've got to remember that not all of the objectives where to break out of the gate. That's something alot of people fail to realise. Consider him and the Black Legion. They've got to fight past a garrison of 20 marine chapters and countless guard. This slows him down allowing more and more reinforcements to come. Also, all of his crusades have generally caused more damage to the Imperium than the Imperium has dealt out in return. Seriously, Abaddon's crusades have reaped an awesome tally of victories. Abaddon himself got Drach'nyen and the black Legion has increased in size enormously. The "good guys" have suffered major casualties. Eldrad. The blood angels getting slaughtered at El'Phanor. It's even resulted in the death of a primach. Finally, not all crusades have been led by him. Replace him and his legion with any other fighting organization in the Galaxy and you would get the same, if not worse results.

karimabuseer wrote:

metallifan wrote:

karimabuseer wrote:They are less fail than all other marine organizations tbh...

This made me lol, and think of the 13 Black Crusades that Abaddon has undertaken and has still failed to actually break out of the Cadian Gate

You've got to remember that not all of the objectives where to break out of the gate.

No, but I'm pretty sure he's been trying nonetheless

karimabuseer wrote:Consider him and the Black Legion. They've got to fight past a garrison of 20 marine chapters and countless guard. This slows him down allowing more and more reinforcements to come.

And the BL has reinforcements at arms reach in the form of Daemons that're manifestations of the very emotions of both the BL and their enemies. In this way, the Black Legion has unlimited numbers in it's allies. Abaddon's just failure incarnate.

karimbuseer wrote:Also, all of his crusades have generally caused more damage to the Imperium than the Imperium has dealt out in return. Seriously, Abaddon's crusades have reaped an awesome tally of victories.

Such as? Besieging Cadia happens every time, and he always gets pushed back.

karimbuseer wrote:Abaddon himself got Drach'nyen

What can we say? Incompetance gets rewarded in reality too (Survivor, anyone?). Hey, he even somehow managed to score Terminator armour.

karimbuseer wrote:The "good guys" have suffered major casualties.

And yet are still managing to make him fail every time.

karimbuseer wrote:Eldrad.

What a Dick

karimbuseer wrote:The blood angels getting slaughtered at El'Phanor.

Vampire Emo Marines. Good Riddance.

karimbuseer wrote:It's even resulted in the death of a primach.

Not at his hands, so he can't really take credit for it (Though he probably would to help boost his low self-esteem )

karimbuseer wrote:Finally, not all crusades have been led by him.

Yes. Yes they have. Black Crusades 1 through 13 were born of his ...ahem... 'Genius' schemes.

In short: Abaddon is like a James Bond villain. For all his cunning and guile, all his effort and planning, eventually Sean Connery (In the form of CREEEEEEEED) will just come along and ruin everything he worked for. One morning he'll be eating his Chex at the breakfast table on the Planet Killer and his spoon will turn into an Imperator. Bye bye Abbey.

Ofcourse they cant let Abbadon win over the "almighty" imperium, its just the nature of the 40k universe. However, Abbadon annihilates as many irrelevant chapters as it takes to be deemed "badass".

SMs are full of failure. Even in the SM codex. One entry was "Ultras ambushed by Night lords, caught by surprise - death and casualties everywhere....uhh, ULTRAS WIN (because this is the SM codex)".

Night Lords wrote:Ofcourse they cant let Abbadon win over the "almighty" imperium, its just the nature of the 40k universe. However, Abbadon annihilates as many irrelevant chapters as it takes to be deemed "badass".

SMs are full of failure. Even in the SM codex. One entry was "Ultras ambushed by Night lords, caught by surprise - death and casualties everywhere....uhh, ULTRAS WIN (because this is the SM codex)".

He's not quite there yet, but he's trying. He gets a cookie for effort

No, Ultras win because Cpt. Sicarius "R DEH WINNINGZ! LAWLAWLAWLAWLAWL!!1!1!!!!!!1!2!" And "Ultramehreens Spehss Mehreens help get immature 6 year old children to convince their lazy parents to buy our product and make us rich so we can jack our prices up some more!"

May I have a cookie? I'm like Abaddon but I support the EMPRAH

Id go with the Traitors, id work for the alpha legion though cause they've got it figured out.

karimabuseer wrote:May I have a cookie? I'm like Abaddon but I support the EMPRAH

As long as it's a suitably GRIMDARK flavour.

Then yes.

Death to the Imperium and the Black Legion!

Shadowbrand shall have his day!

Shadowbrand wrote:Death to the Imperium and the Black Legion!

Shadowbrand shall have his day!

Death to the False Emperor! Death to worshipers of Slaanesh! Blood for the Blood God!

BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD

I would side with the loyalists until Emps got stupid and died (sort of) and than go renagade, because I don't do this Emperoar-worshiping thing.

WarmasterScott wrote:yes the imperium hates mutants cept oh idk Sanguinius and the fuzzy sw.. wolf mongrels and space vampires? no no they're not mutants. They're made by the emperor. Awesome so the loved hypocrite makes mutants to kill mutants that won't fall in line. Yea sounds like a super guy to follow.. no I'll stick with Perturabo and my legion.
In following my brothers I will not fall to mutation.

Iron Within, Iron Without!

This nails it right on. KILL THE MUTANT!!! (but if it's a space marine....not so much......and if it's an ogryn....and if its a ratling....and etc etc ad-naseum).

Yup, I'd join Chaos. Tzeentch for me. At his core, he's the most honest. Change is constant.

Night Lords wrote:Ofcourse they cant let Abbadon win over the "almighty" imperium, its just the nature of the 40k universe. However, Abbadon annihilates as many irrelevant chapters as it takes to be deemed "badass".

SMs are full of failure. Even in the SM codex. One entry was "Ultras ambushed by Night lords, caught by surprise - death and casualties everywhere....uhh, ULTRAS WIN (because this is the SM codex)".

This is also the reason loyalists never get to put down the big-bads for the count. Perfect example: Armageddon3. The Imperium holds on the ground, and the fleet kicks all KINDS of butt in space because Orks were never very good in BFG. The logical outcome is Da Boyz being slowly suffocated by superior orbital support and supply lines for the Imperium. Instead, we end up with Ghazkhull getting bored with constant bloodshed and fighting (??!!!) and flying away on his space hulk and nobody does much of anything. The stasis-blade of GW writing cuts both ways.

inquisitorfaust wrote:

Night Lords wrote:Ofcourse they cant let Abbadon win over the "almighty" imperium, its just the nature of the 40k universe. However, Abbadon annihilates as many irrelevant chapters as it takes to be deemed "badass".

SMs are full of failure. Even in the SM codex. One entry was "Ultras ambushed by Night lords, caught by surprise - death and casualties everywhere....uhh, ULTRAS WIN (because this is the SM codex)".

This is also the reason loyalists never get to put down the big-bads for the count. Perfect example: Armageddon3. The Imperium holds on the ground, and the fleet kicks all KINDS of butt in space because Orks were never very good in BFG. The logical outcome is Da Boyz being slowly suffocated by superior orbital support and supply lines for the Imperium. Instead, we end up with Ghazkhull getting bored with constant bloodshed and fighting (??!!!) and flying away on his space hulk and nobody does much of anything. The stasis-blade of GW writing cuts both ways.

Agreed. I think that a GW representative once said in a press conference that they would never kill named characters that they had minis for (named characters without them on the other hand...).
It's the power of profit. GW exists, like all private companies, to make money. As long as those character models continue to sell, they have no reason to kill off the characters and lose money to advance the story.

No sm or csm group fails more than the Imperial Fists(Iron Cage Incident) =D It's also in the fluff that only like 3 of the 13 crusades were for actual conquest. The rest were for supplies etc. The whiny Imperials can thank Eldrad and the space fairies for the assist on numerous saves from big bad Abby. So lets see it took the whole of the Imperial forces and space fairies to beat back the Legion. Oh yes Abby is the real wimp here.

WarmasterScott wrote:No sm or csm group fails more than the Imperial Fists(Iron Cage Incident) =D It's also in the fluff that only like 3 of the 13 crusades were for actual conquest. The rest were for supplies etc. The whiny Imperials can thank Eldrad and the space fairies for the assist on numerous saves from big bad Abby. So lets see it took the whole of the Imperial forces and space fairies to beat back the Legion. Oh yes Abby is the real wimp here.

Let's see, even assuming the 3 number is true (I have no idea), Abaddon managed to unit all the squabbling Chaos factions and gain the blessing of all 4 Chaos gods. He had millions of Chaos Space Marines, countless billions of cultist hordes, countless daemons from the Warp, and massive industrial support from the Chaos Forge Worlds. And each time he has failed to conquer a single planet..

Deathbot wrote:Agreed. I think that a GW representative once said in a press conference that they would never kill named characters that they had minis for (named characters without them on the other hand...).
It's the power of profit. GW exists, like all private companies, to make money. As long as those character models continue to sell, they have no reason to kill off the characters and lose money to advance the story.

You mean like Eldrad Ulthran (has a model)? Sgt Naaman (Dark Angel SC, has a model)? Capt Tycho (BA SC, has a model)? All killed during campaigns. Tycho killed during the last Armageddon campaign, actually.

GW is obviously not above offing characters. And I'd consider Eldrad to be a pretty important one. Which makes it even funnier that he shows up in every Eldar list...

Deathbot wrote:

WarmasterScott wrote:No sm or csm group fails more than the Imperial Fists(Iron Cage Incident) =D It's also in the fluff that only like 3 of the 13 crusades were for actual conquest. The rest were for supplies etc. The whiny Imperials can thank Eldrad and the space fairies for the assist on numerous saves from big bad Abby. So lets see it took the whole of the Imperial forces and space fairies to beat back the Legion. Oh yes Abby is the real wimp here.

Let's see, even assuming the 3 number is true (I have no idea), Abaddon managed to unit all the squabbling Chaos factions and gain the blessing of all 4 Chaos gods. He had millions of Chaos Space Marines, countless billions of cultist hordes, countless daemons from the Warp, and massive industrial support from the Chaos Forge Worlds. And each time he has failed to conquer a single planet..

So would you place the fail on a ficticious character or the writers for failing to make him a more worthy foe? Because it seems more often then not that not a single enemy of the Imperium has gained any ground either or very little. So would it be safe to say that the writers are afraid to have the Imperium lose too often and possibly blemish the image of the Imperials? As far as individual characters I would be more inclined to say the more powerful the character the harder he falls as to preserve a strange balance. I mean look at the primarchs. In the grand scheme of the fluff they vanished quite quickly from the scene. The quick rise and fall trend I think is more due to the fact that there are so many factions who want air time.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So by him not destroying everything in his few crusades he's a fail. Well that logic doesn't bode well for any long standing villain in books or heroes. The Joker has been after batman for 40+ yrs. The world has been after cancer for yrs now. The Imperium has been after xenos and chaos for just alittle while now. The world is full of examples where someone hasn't been all that successful, but does that make em a loser?

Loyalist
Create a galatic atheist empire centered around science and spreading the truth?
Yes please

WarmasterScott wrote:
So by him not destroying everything in his few crusades he's a fail. Well that logic doesn't bode well for any long standing villain in books or heroes. The Joker has been after batman for 40+ yrs. The world has been after cancer for yrs now. The Imperium has been after xenos and chaos for just alittle while now. The world is full of examples where someone hasn't been all that successful, but does that make em a loser?

It's not the fact that he's failed to destroy the Imperium. It's that he cannot conquer a single planet when he has the numbers to, if all else fails, bury the Imperials there under the weight of his own dead. Not to mention a good portion of his troops (the daemons) are immortal and can just be re-summoned over and over again if killed.

Deathbot, that's not technically true, since part of the 13th crusade results writeup is that the Archenemy has established worlds outside the Eye that are completely their territory. Cadia herself is not among them, but the Despoiler has conquered worlds.

Anyway, I feel like the question of how powerful Abbadon is or is not is besides the point. His biggest failing is that he is a poorly written character even by GW standards. He's a big bad who seems to have no purpose but to be a name dropped in association with all the terrible things that happen in the galaxy. It's not like Kharn or Typhus are all that deep either, but bear with me here.

People like Kharn, Lucius, and Typhus, they can get away with having no higher motive than to serve their master God well. Because that's really what they are, the chosen servants. They do what their boss man tells them to, or what they think will make the boss happy, and that's what they're looking for in life.

Abbadon, though, has no such excuse because he's supposed to be a leader, so he needs more to him than just doing what the 4 powers tell him. He needs an actual personality and goals of his own, and damn is he chock-full of self-contradiction.

He revered Horus, except he calls Horus weak and a fool. He wants to be a god, except he keeps turning down the biggest step between him and God-hood of Daemonhood. He's a cunning, wily guy who knows when to exit stage left, but he will execute underlings that show the same cunning in preserving his resources. The only thing he seems consistent on is that he really does hate the Imperium. His motivation is unclear, his goals are inconsistent with his actions, and he seems like a really crappy employer. I myself have no idea why the hell *anyone* would follow him, let alone the prideful, arrogant people CSM are supposed to be.

Mind you, if they really set their mind to it, I do think GW could salvage him, put Abbie's actions into some sort of consistancy, and make him into at least a tolerable villain. Hell, I probably could given a chance. As is though, he's just bad, and not just in the villainous sense. Maybe they'll sit down and straighten him out later, but as is he comes across as every villain stereotype rolled into one, with a healthy dose of anti-personality to boot.

inquisitorfaust wrote:Deathbot, that's not technically true, since part of the 13th crusade results writeup is that the Archenemy has established worlds outside the Eye that are completely their territory. Cadia herself is not among them, but the Despoiler has conquered worlds.

Anyway, I feel like the question of how powerful Abbadon is or is not is besides the point. His biggest failing is that he is a poorly written character even by GW standards. He's a big bad who seems to have no purpose but to be a name dropped in association with all the terrible things that happen in the galaxy. It's not like Kharn or Typhus are all that deep either, but bear with me here.

People like Kharn, Lucius, and Typhus, they can get away with having no higher motive than to serve their master God well. Because that's really what they are, the chosen servants. They do what their boss man tells them to, or what they think will make the boss happy, and that's what they're looking for in life.

Abbadon, though, has no such excuse because he's supposed to be a leader, so he needs more to him than just doing what the 4 powers tell him. He needs an actual personality and goals of his own, and damn is he chock-full of self-contradiction.

He revered Horus, except he calls Horus weak and a fool. He wants to be a god, except he keeps turning down the biggest step between him and God-hood of Daemonhood. He's a cunning, wily guy who knows when to exit stage left, but he will execute underlings that show the same cunning in preserving his resources. The only thing he seems consistent on is that he really does hate the Imperium. His motivation is unclear, his goals are inconsistent with his actions, and he seems like a really crappy employer. I myself have no idea why the hell *anyone* would follow him, let alone the prideful, arrogant people CSM are supposed to be.

Mind you, if they really set their mind to it, I do think GW could salvage him, put Abbie's actions into some sort of consistancy, and make him into at least a tolerable villain. Hell, I probably could given a chance. As is though, he's just bad, and not just in the villainous sense. Maybe they'll sit down and straighten him out later, but as is he comes across as every villain stereotype rolled into one, with a healthy dose of anti-personality to boot.

He revered Horus prior to his death. He denounced Horus as weak because he was killed, causing the defeat of his rebellion. In his view, Horus did not deserve to be leader of Chaos because he lost his fight with the Emperor.

He doesn't want daemonhood because he wants to be worshiped as a god for his strength, not because the Chaos gods made him a warp-entity. Also, that would prevent him from staying in the material universe most of the time. He wants to rule the galaxy, not be trapped in the warp forever.

He executes underlings for several reasons. First, he needs to maintain the favor of Khorne to keep a good part of his armies in line, and not spilling blood when he could isn't a great way to go about it. Second, Chaos is in constant conflict with itself. There is never-ending backstabbing going on among its followers. In order to keep his position, he has to kill cunning underlings before they become cunning enough to be a threat. Third, the killing helps to keep otherwise potentially rebellious underlings cowed and subdued.

His underlings follow him because he is the strongest. That's how Chaos works. You often get promoted by killing your superior, showing that he wasn't worthy of the job anyway because he was too weak. He represents the strongest unifying force, which is why they follow him. If someone else were to defeat and kill him, they'd get his job.

WarmasterScott wrote:Eldrad and the space fairies

Space Fairies....I like this a lot .

Yeah, trying to kill ur father is pretty messed up... Black Templars leader dude gave his life for the emporer... GO BLACK TEMPLAR!

Deathbot wrote: If someone else were to defeat and kill him, they'd get his job.

And when that happens Perturabo will be the man to pick it up.

They work on Abaddons characters in the HH series and novels like execution hour. It even has a extract about him telling a daemon 2 stfu in the apoc rule book

Sharik wrote:Loyalist
Create a galatic atheist empire centered around science and spreading the truth?
Yes please

And then they begin to quickly descend in power as they worship a corpse and limit their ability to gain technological knowledge...

It's the story of my life...

Loyalist all the way. Imperial Fist if I could choose. I would gladly lay down my life for my Emperor even knowing the outcome - even more so knowing that Corpse-God was only the least favorable of the 'good' outcomes. Seriously, if more participants had ignored the self fulfilling prophesies and whispers of Chaos that surrounded the whole event and just got on with doing the right thing (Night Haunter, Alpharius, Magnus, etc) then the Emp very likely would have won outright and a new golden age would have been in the offing.

Anyway, hopefully I could survive the whole mess, but (to paraphrase Spongebob) if I were to die in a fiery explosion caused by the treachery of a friend...well, that would just be okay.

I'm sorry but everyone is dreaming.

If ANYTHING we nerds who wargame would be scribe geeks in the Administorium or maybe some of us would be PDF. We would be on the side that pointed their guns at us and made us to their bidding.

Me personally? Run the $*#& away screaming. Yeah. If ANYTHING Loyalist. Chaos looks like it comes from your deepest nightmares, few peopel could live with themselves after doing such atrocities. I would probably either turn my gun on myself or go along with chaos and be sacrificed or chained into service if I had to fight with Chaos.

EzeKK wrote:I'm sorry but everyone is dreaming.

Well...yes. Considering the thread title uses "would" and not "are/will be".

i would be loyalist. a dead friggin loyalist though. especially if i played as one of my iron hands marines.

ME well I am going to go neither because it would be fun to sit on the fence and watch brother kill each other

For the Emprah. Either way you're a slave, but I'd rather be a slave to a somewhat less evil group. The punishments aren't as bad

For the Empraaaagh! ::

I'd rather not be a blood-crazed mutant, thanks. The traitors royally f**ked up the Emperor's plans. If not for them we would have progressed yet further.

For the Imperium and the Emperor!!!!

Imperial Fist and loyalist until the end! (even if Tzeenctch powers are corrupting me slowly)

Cryonicleech wrote:Traitors.

Power is worth ANY sacrifice.

I'd, of course, join the Fail Legion (Read: Black Legion) as I'm one of the few who actually LIKE the Black Legion.

Black Legion FTF! (for the fail )

I'd ditch te ehpura in like five seconds but I'd avoid becoming a toy for the chaos gods.
I'd just pillage and plunder my way across the galaxy, making friends all along the way.


P.S. @ Cryonicleech. We need to get another game in sometime ya?

traitor traitor traitor

Night Lords!
make you fear everything around you

Loyalist. I play Dark Angels, and I've read what Interrogator Chaplains will do. I'd rather ride on a giant friggin' ship as opposed to waiting for them.

Traitors. As much as I like to think I'm reasonably free minded there's something about the worship and/or necrophilia of a vegetable on a Golden Life Support System that just annoys me. And I am against the wanton slaughter of aliens you racist loyalist scum!

And Chaos > Emprah

Your stuck worshiping somebody either way.

penut the butter wrote:Your stuck worshiping somebody either way.

Ya but, and Emperor forgive me for saying this, at least when you worship Chaos, you do so with the illusion of free choice as opposed to being born into an ideology.
Don't get me wrong, Chaos isn't chosen freely, you're slowly corrupted, but you think you choose, and that's enough for some.

fair point.

Madgod wrote:Traitors. As much as I like to think I'm reasonably free minded there's something about the worship and/or necrophilia of a vegetable on a Golden Life Support System that just annoys me. And I am against the wanton slaughter of aliens you racist loyalist scum!

And Chaos > Emprah

So you'd rather go completely insane, worship dark gods that could honestly not care less if you live or die (except Khorne, who'd like you dead), and then after death have your soul consumed and tortured forever. Sounds great.

Traitor... I would have been the chaos marine who got way to drunk and threw a beer bottle at the big ol golden king space marine guy, to temporarily confuzzle him, whilst horus unleashed the greater daemon chuck norris from his weapon onto that udder guy... cause that makes sense!

CHUCK NORRIS IS THE EMPEROR! HERESY!!!!

Which is why my story makes sense... when horus struck the emperor with that fatal blow his soul clearly went into horus' weapon. and after a crap load of boredom he went into nerd rage... Horus found a time machine... went back in time to the fight, switched his own weapon with the new emp bound one, and hid in the crowd drunk whilst he threw bottles and watched himself beat the emp... which means... I would have been drunken horus in the crowd... while the former me had chuck norris fighting chuck norris and... wait a second, i can forsee a giant warp rift happening on the spot... I should write for black library mhmm

WTF!?

Maybe not then? Alright ill jsut refrain from posting any more gak nonsense lore on this thread lol.....

AH never mind... I'm a bit hammered anyways.

Alpharius wrote:

Anyway, yeah, For The Emperor!
!

I see what you did there Alph.

For me the decision is not an easy one to make. I can identify with an equal number of Traitor and Loyalist Legions, those being the Luna Wolves, Imperial Fists, Night Lords and Space Wolves, each for their own reason. I suppose though I would chose the Traitor Legions after having become disillusioned with the Emperor and the Imperium due to the Emprah's withdrawal and the people he chooses to run it in his stead.

i'd like to think that I'd be a loyalist, but just look at it:
you can believe in chaos gods that you know are real because you can acctually see them
OR
you can believe that a dead man is fighting chaos, thousands of years after he died, and he wants everyone else to do the same

It's a simple decision really