Hmmm, I honestly have to say I'm not sure,after my step father passed away,my whole family claims to have seen him"just out of the corner of their eye",wandering around the house.
I do have to admit,when I would go to my mothers home,I also "saw" shadows move in my perrephial vision,I also got smacked in the head once,I had thought it was my brother messing around,but he swears to this day it wasn't him.
I even have a (totally unresearched) theory/idea as to what exactly they are. Rather than 'restless souls' I reckon they are electromagnetic imprints left in the wake of a death. Seeing as the Brain works using electromagnetic impulses (of a sort. I think. Told you it was unresearched!) and the Earth has an electromagnetic field, give the Brain a big enough jolt, and you could leave a lasting impression, albeit very locally. When others enter this area in a state of heightened emotions (brain firing lots) we can pick up on it.
I even have a (totally unresearched) theory/idea as to what exactly they are. Rather than 'restless souls' I reckon they are electromagnetic imprints left in the wake of a death. Seeing as the Brain works using electromagnetic impulses (of a sort. I think. Told you it was unresearched!) and the Earth has an electromagnetic field, give the Brain a big enough jolt, and you could leave a lasting impression, albeit very locally. When others enter this area in a state of heightened emotions (brain firing lots) we can pick up on it.
Just a theory though!
It makes alot of sense though,I always atributed my "seeing shadows moving" to my families insistance that my step fathers "spirit" was still in the home,thus "priming" my senses to "see" somthing.
So yes, I could see your theory as a potentialy valid explenation.
I just don't know how it works! But I understand their are odd areas in the earth magnetic field, so I don't think it's utterly implausible.
This does of course suggest that we don't literally see Ghosts, as much as our minds interpret the additional data into a way we can easily comprehend.
Could also explain psychic abilities. Some peoples Brains are simply more sensitive to the magnetic nonsense going on in other peoples, and over time learn to interpret them accordingly.
And interestingly, I do sometimes feel like I might have some psychic ability. Comes and goes, but stuff I know and guess about people seems to go way beyond simple intuition! Not something I seem to be able to control either.
FITZZ wrote: Hmmm, I honestly have to say I'm not sure,after my step father passed away,my whole family claims to have seen him"just out of the corner of their eye",wandering around the house.
I do have to admit,when I would go to my mothers home,I also "saw" shadows move in my perrephial vision,I also got smacked in the head once,I had thought it was my brother messing around,but he swears to this day it wasn't him.
FWIW, this is a clinically recognised symptom of grief/bereavement. It can go as far as people actually having full conversations with the recently deceased.
Doesn't mean they don't though! Also would kind of fit with my theory of psychic and ghosts all being magnetic jiggerypokery.
If you knew someone really well when they popped their clogs, your brain is used to their emanations. So whilst strangers in the house will walk through and not pick up anything, family members are more attuned, and thus pick it up.
IMO ghost sightings are caused by the brain's built-in tendency to create recognisable patterns out of general chaos, and 'spooky' environmental factors such as noises, darkness and subsonic vibrations due to wind and stuff.
Once I was asleep at home alone as the family were off in Japan. I was awoken in the small hours by a distinct noise coming from another room. I was rigid with terror, and my heart was hammering, as I heard it again. A pinging, tapping noise. I summoned up the courage to get my axe in case it was a burglar, and sneaked out to the kitchen. I discovered it was the compressor of the fridge-freezer.
As an example of pattern formation, Europeans see a "Man in the moon" while Japanese see a rabbit.
FITZZ wrote: Hmmm, I honestly have to say I'm not sure,after my step father passed away,my whole family claims to have seen him"just out of the corner of their eye",wandering around the house.
I do have to admit,when I would go to my mothers home,I also "saw" shadows move in my perrephial vision,I also got smacked in the head once,I had thought it was my brother messing around,but he swears to this day it wasn't him.
FWIW, this is a clinically recognised symptom of grief/bereavement. It can go as far as people actually having full conversations with the recently deceased.
Yes,my mother would claim that he also spoke to her on several occasions,I at times thought that perhaps she was loosing her mind,she was very insistent that he would tell her things concerning "the kids".
I thought I saw a ghost once, just my reflection in the mirror. Probarly didn't help that I had been up for three days straight and had ALOT of caffiene in my system.
A friend of mine thought one of his nurgling's was animated by a ghost while he was painting. He then passed out after it "waved" at him, and when he woke up his army was painted. Whether its true or not, I find it to be a funny story. I personally don't believe in ghosts...
Definitely a believer. Seen my share of weird things actually.
Fifth grade, we had a week long "end of school vacation" that the school had arranged where we stayed on board the USS Yorktown down in South Carolina. Saw a full figure, wearing WWII naval fatigues, doing the rounds in a section of the ship when going to the bathroom. Thought it was a security guard until he walked through a sealed bulkhead.
Most interesting part was that the sealed bulkhead led to an area that was damaged by a torpedo strike and the security guards were given the week that we were staying off, due to the fact that there would be people actually staying on board the ship.
Even more interesting?
Wasn't the first time that had been reported, which makes me want to go back there and try to document it or disprove it.
I don't know about whether or not ghosts are real, but an experience I had when I was 13 changed my perspective from utter disbelief to a grudging acceptance that there could be.
When I was 13 I visited Dachou, one of the holocaust camps. It was 30 above that day and when I walked across the five feet of gravel I felt as if I had entered a deep freeze. I got through the guided portion of the tour and decided I'd seen and had enough. When I walked back across the five feet of gravel, the 30 degree weather returned.
I have heard some interesting stories from perfectly reasonable people and have seen/experienced some odd things but as of yet, there has been nothing I have seen or experienced that I could not replicate using natural means except for one.
My only "experience" as it were was coming out of sleep/dream so (as weird as it was) I must discount it.
My mother took a photograph of a ghost once. Well, her friend did.
This was when they were about twenty or so, and her friend lived in a big old victorian house. They were in her friends room, and her friend took a photo of my mum on the bed, and when it was developed, there was a faint, but distinct Victorian lady behind her.
When I was younger, I experimented a little in the occult, from meditation to other things. I must say, I experienced several highly strange, and slightly terrifying results, which ended with me never touching any of that stuff with a bargepole since.
I am sceptical of most "huantings" as many of the phenomena can be explained by naturaly occuring factors. Quite often I will sit in front of the telly laughing my tits of a Most Haunted as they jump and scream at the slightest noise. A show I do like it Ghost hunters, it is a bunch of plumbers from Atlanta who do paranormal investigation in their spare time. They set out to disprove or de-bunk hauntings by useing common sence and scientific equipment, this makes it all the more satisfying when they can't explain something.
I do however believe in spirits, and once had a very unpleasant experience.
Before I start the story, you need to understand that I am a very rational and practical person, I am also not very easily spooked.
I was looking after my mums pub whilst she was away on a training course, I was staying there alone. The pub was in a very old part of Bristol called Westbury on Trym, the origional village dates back over 500 years and there are tunnels running under ground to and from certain buildings, including alegedly my mums pub. Most of these tunnels have collapsed and are now blocked up. The other thing worth mentioning to set the tone is that the pub's footprint is in the shape of a triangle and it backs onto a graveyard. suposedly one of the tunnels led from the pubs cellar to the church.
I had locked up for the night and gone to bed, at about 1am I was woken up by the pubs alarm system, still bleary eyed' I got up and started to check the windows, I made my way down stairs and through all the different areas of the pub (it is quite a sprawling bulding with a few dis-used store rooms which were kept locked ) eventualy after checking all the doors and windows I couldn't find a problem.
The only place I hadn't checked was the cellar so figured that I hadn't shut the cellar trap door properly and it banging in the wind had triggered the alarm. I went down into the cellar and over to the barrel drop to check the trap door. At this point the lights went out. I thought that a switch had blown and started to grope my way to the steps where the fuse board was. At this point I was still a bit dozy and not really scared.
Then I started to feel air movements next to my like someone whoshing their arms past my ear, I could also hear a light scraping sound, as I tried to get tot he steps it felt like I was moving through treacle. when I got there and flipped the switch everything int he cellar had been moved around, and very neatly restacked. At this point I was completely freaked out, I grabbed the keys and legged it out of the pub to a friends house, who was less than amused at being woken up so late, by me in a hysterical state, they agreed to come back to the pub with me and stay the night. Nothing further happened or ever did, but I refused to stay there alone ever again.
When I asked some of the locals about the pub being haunted they all shock there heads, but apparently, many years back, a drayman (beer delivery man) had once died in the barrel drop area when they were lowering a barrel into the cellar and the rope snapped, the barrel droped and crushed his chest killing him instantly.
All very odd, most of it explainable with alarm faults and a fuse's tripping, also by me being half asleep and a bit dazed, but the crates and barrels moving I can't explain.
Spirits? Yes I am a believer, I have a cabinet full of the buggers.
Chin, chin.
I'll drink to that.
Seriously, though - I don't believe... not saying that all of your stories are untrue or anything, I'm willing to be proven wrong and always keep an open mind on stuff like this. Same thing with UFO's/Aliens, really. Although, your story in particular was fething spooky Squilverine, I'll give you that!
They're not from Atlanta...They're from Warwick, New Jersey. But yeah, great show. Jay and Grant complain a bit about how the editors constantly have that annoying music playing, but they can only get so much of it removed even with their roles in the production.
squilverine wrote:I am sceptical of most "huantings" as many of the phenomena can be explained by naturaly occuring factors. Quite often I will sit in front of the telly laughing my tits of a Most Haunted as they jump and scream at the slightest noise.
Guy from Most Haunted: (Speaking Loudly) I sense something in this room, there's a spirit here, If you can hear us, send us a sign.
Camera Man: (Laughs Silently and taps side of the camera)
Random Lady: Oh god a ghost!?!
Guy from Most Haunted: Wait! It telling me about how she died.....She was 19, died in this room...killed by her lover....stabbed to death...
Camera Man: (Coughs and bangs foot on the floor)
Rinse and repeat, that is what happens on ever episode of Most Haunted.
Because Most Haunted is run by morons? I mean seriously.
Look at Ed and Lorraine Warren. They're considered by some of the paranormal research community as the absolute biggest joke because, rather than taking the approach that you see on Ghost Hunters or the groups that they help teach(which is: actually go and try to debunk events before shouting from the rooftops "It's haunted, it's haunted it's haaaaaaaaaaaauuuunnntteed!")--the Warrens go only by their "feelings" and by using so-called mediums.
Yeah. It's a common thing to happen. It's called "matrixing".
It's why a lot of claims of things like "faces in windows", mirrors, etc are thrown out. No matter how clean you get them, there's still fingerprints and the like on the inside or eventually worn into the surface that can cause the same effect.
If you're really interested, I suggest looking for "Spooky Southcoast" on iTunes, along with "Beyond Reality Radio with Jason Hawes and Grant Wilson" if you want to hear some interesting topics/conversations.
Sure, some of the callers and guests are complete wackjobs, but quite a lot of them are also professors at respected universities, work at NASA, or in law enforcement and do it as a hobby.
Kanluwen wrote:Look at Ed and Lorraine Warren. They're considered by some of the paranormal research community as the absolute biggest joke
Ouch. That's gotta hurt.
This video sums up most of my views on the subject, particularly the distinction between something being unexplained and something being explained through the existence of ghosts/magic/etc:
Well, you have to remember Ed and Lorraine Warren were unknowns and just looked like nutjobs...until the Amityville Horror flick came out(they were the actual "investigators" on the real life case that inspired the book/flick)...
Yet, if you look at how paranormal research(which it actually IS becoming acceptable to do, if you're looking at it scientifically rather than "Oh, I feel a dark presence in the home...did someone die here?" approach) is done now, the Warrens and their methods...well, they look about as valid as the early 20th century occultists and the transmediums from then.
@Wrex: I love Hieronymus Bosch! Weird guy that one!
@Kanluwen Ghost Hunters aka TAPS are from Rhode Island not NJ.
Where these shows (the more serious ones anyway) fail is that they don't show enough of what really goes on and they are for entertainment. It is just fact. If we got to see an actual, factual show with all the behind the scenes and 'debunking' stuff we would be bored out of our skulls. Uh, well, more so!
To me it is actually a wonder why most of these shows stay on the air. They are either very bad or usually very boring. I'll admit I sit through hours of boredom hoping to see a moment of something truly unusual. Of course it is still far better than most of what's on regular broadcast TV. So what does that say?
I am embarrassed to say that the Ghost Adventure guys are based in my hometown.
Yeah, Destination Truth (of which they never come close to any real truth) is usually pretty interesting if laughable (sometimes for Josh, sometimes not). The Chernobyl one was interesting.
Hell, sometimes it is just the story behind the place they go. Like the Island of the Dolls! Creepy place whether haunted or not.
They all get annoying sometimes for how the drama is amped up through editing. I almost can't stand it but it is what it is, I guess.
Oh and anytime anyone on these shows gets exited over floating dust it is pretty much guaranteed I don't watch a second time.
Also, Discovery has one coming out now. Ghost Lab, I think?
It's interesting though, because I guess SciFi got alot of complaints, or Josh just got fed up with the West Coast Paranormal(I think that was the name?) that SciFi had them originally giving all their paranormal evidence to and getting excited over dust(Best part was the abandoned mosque in the middle of Thailand--place that had been abandoned for DECADES, and they get excited over dust, but say the EVPs were trash?).
If nothing else, like I said, these shows are great just because the Jay, Grant, Josh and the like?
They've got a great presence on screen. It's like the guys from MythBusters. The stuff can be boring as all hell, but they just make it FUN.
My partner is a medium and I've been to a few of the evenings of clairvoyance that she goes to, some have certainly made me think me but others have brought out the skeptical side of me (and my partner). Can't say I've ever 'seen' a ghost but certainly had weird feelings when I've walked into certain rooms or places.
I remember seeing a pogramme once where they made a cgi copy of what was reputadly a haunted room in a castle then they went to a shopping centre and got people to put on virtual reality visor to see what their reactions would be. Most of the people who did this had an uneasy feeling about the room and some even got totally scared... The programme was trying to put across that it was the look and harmonics of certain places that give people chills and make them uneasy which sets of their imaginations.
Interesting and absolutely plausible. Perception is a screwy thing sometimes, as it is.
Hell, we are conditioned to believe old, run-down Victorian houses are haunted already, why can't there be older more subtle psychological affects we're not completely aware of that influence our feelings.
I'm rather confused by it all, i've seen some very strange things, but still can't quite accept it.
For example..........
While enjoying a lovely meal in our local pub *not even had a drink then just J20 and my food* i would swear Even now that the guy sat at the bar got up and walked into the wall. Cross my heart he did! the bar maid even asked me where "that weird guy" went...I said nothing lol. Now if everyone else saw him before he walked through the wall was he a ghost or was he something else?
Then only a few month ago i was taking care of a friends house while they were on holiday, It was about 8:30pm and i was making a cup of tea and loading Bioshock when the door to the kitchen and the door to the stairs slammed shut. Needless to say the noise gave me a fright but i didn't think abything was a miss i just thought id left the window open, which i hadn't but still it didnt seem to weird. I plonk my bum down on the sofa, put my cup of tea on the table and was just about to get my game on when BOTH doors open, same time...all the way wide and stop. So i'm still thinking draft and head off up stairs to check the windows. All shut, all doors shut, nothing weird, i get back to the stop of the stairs the door directly behind me opens. i just stood there looking simple...not frightend but confused...it opend all the way up and stopped. i shrugged went down stairs and played bioshock until i passed out on the chair. nothing else happend and it wasn't until the following day it even occured to me how odd it was. I wonder why i wasn't frightend?
Doors shutting (especially slamming) all at once in a through-way is most likely an atmospheric event, or simply there was a pressure change outside (or even inside if you have an air handler, although this is more common in newer homes with AC) caused by a breeze, temperature change or whatever. Was a window open or is the house older (drafty) or some other outside ventilation (Bathroom vent, etc.), especially in that area. Well, those would be my first thoughts, anyway.
I definitely believe ghosts and stuff are real. I also believe UFOs are real. The problem is, 95% of the reports are from crazy people that want attention.
What sucks is now that ghost hunters is popular evey dumb emo goth kid thinks they're gonna be a paranormal investigator and have their own show on cable tv. There's some haunted places in the Philly area that are pretty famous like Fort Mifflin and Eastern State Pennitentiary that were on shows like that, but there really is something thats just "not right" about those places.
I think when somehting horrible, or traumatic happens somewhere that awful feeling can get stuck there. My sister bought a house where someone was attacked, but they didnt die in the house they died in the hospital. There is always an uncomfortable feeling in her house. Maybe it's because we know something bad happend, but she's yet to see anything spooky.
I'm now doing a 4 hour ghost watch this Friday night between 11pm gmt and 3am gmt at Rougemont castle, Exeter. If people are interested I can do on the spot reports. The part we will be in is the old court house and cells. As I said before I'm not a believer or disbeliever but I will be there with a group who definately believe so it should be quite interesting...
Mick
I used to live in a house in Pennslyvania where a lot of wierd crap went on.
When my family first moved in there was a hallway our dogs would initialy not go down. They would lay on their stomachs by the open dorrway to it and growl.
A few times my father and others saw a little girl going up a staircase in that same hall, and a friend of my one of my sisters was doing electrical work on the house after we moved looked up to see someone standing there, glaring at him from a few feet away.
The thing in both of those instances was that there was no reasonable way someone would have been there.
The little girl was seen at night and the house was out in the country. When people followed up the stairs looking for her, the girl was not to be found.
The electician could not be persuaded to come anywhere near the house close to dark after his experience.
A friend of mine was staying over one night alone there as I worked a graveyard shift. When I got home he was gone. He called me later and said he didn't know what was going on in that place, but there was no way he was going to stay there alone again at night.
My own experience happened one night when I was there alone. I awakend to voices in the house. Thinking it was burglers, I grabbed my pistol and machete and went walking to the room where I heard the voices coming from. This room was on the second floor with no other way in or out, but no one was in there when I entered. The voices then started in another room and again, there was no one there. This went on for a little bit then ended. I figured the worst that could happen was a ghost would tell me boo and I went back to bed. My thought was that if a ghost could touch me, I had the stuff to be able to touch him back.
As far as the voices went, they were as clear as if someone were standing a room away talking, but it was like a different language.
The house was being remodeled after we left and some built in cupboards were taken out. Behind one of the cupboards was a newspaper and picture of a little girl. The new owner tossed both into the garbage outside, but when he came home that afternoon, the picture of the little girl was laying in the center of the kitchen floor.
Relapse wrote:I used to live in a house in Pennslyvania where a lot of wierd crap went on.
When my family first moved in there was a hallway our dogs would initialy not go down. They would lay on their stomachs by the open dorrway to it and growl.
A few times my father and others saw a little girl going up a staircase in that same hall, and a friend of my one of my sisters was doing electrical work on the house after we moved looked up to see someone standing there, glaring at him from a few feet away.
The thing in both of those instances was that there was no reasonable way someone would have been there.
The little girl was seen at night and the house was out in the country. When people followed up the stairs looking for her, the girl was not to be found.
The electician could not be persuaded to come anywhere near the house close to dark after his experience.
A friend of mine was staying over one night alone there as I worked a graveyard shift. When I got home he was gone. He called me later and said he didn't know what was going on in that place, but there was no way he was going to stay there alone again at night.
My own experience happened one night when I was there alone. I awakend to voices in the house. Thinking it was burglers, I grabbed my pistol and machete and went walking to the room where I heard the voices coming from. This room was on the second floor with no other way in or out, but no one was in there when I entered. The voices then started in another room and again, there was no one there. This went on for a little bit then ended. I figured the worst that could happen was a ghost would tell me boo and I went back to bed. My thought was that if a ghost could touch me, I had the stuff to be able to touch him back.
As far as the voices went, they were as clear as if someone were standing a room away talking, but it was like a different language.
The house was being remodeled after we left and some built in cupboards were taken out. Behind one of the cupboards was a newspaper and picture of a little girl. The new owner tossed both into the garbage outside, but when he came home that afternoon, the picture of the little girl was laying in the center of the kitchen floor.
Now all you need are some tapes, pictures and videos of this gak to prove its real.
I see no other expanation to this apart from ghosts, but I'l refuse to believe into Ive had a first hand exprience.
I honestly have a theory on ghosts and wormholes. Its really involved and have yet to have any scientists that study wormholes write me back on it.
I think most things can be explained. Pretty much when its an appliance, its the appliance, not a ghost. I have an old stereo that is just worn out, and it turns itself on and off an such at all hours of the day. ts purely random and would freak people out that didnt know that it does that.
Im not saying everythign is just your brain not working properly, I have seen things happen before that you just cant explain with logic. Thats when I laugh it off and say wow that was weird lol. I actually have a picture I took of my mud bogger (Ill have to find it, its creepy) all around shots. Then when I was behin it, the rear window has a face in it. It was a cloady day, and there is no tree or anything behind it to cause a glare. It was just there. It freaked me out when I saw it load up on my computer lol
KingCracker wrote:I honestly have a theory on ghosts and wormholes. Its really involved and have yet to have any scientists that study wormholes write me back on it.
I think most things can be explained. Pretty much when its an appliance, its the appliance, not a ghost. I have an old stereo that is just worn out, and it turns itself on and off an such at all hours of the day. ts purely random and would freak people out that didnt know that it does that.
Im not saying everythign is just your brain not working properly, I have seen things happen before that you just cant explain with logic. Thats when I laugh it off and say wow that was weird lol. I actually have a picture I took of my mud bogger (Ill have to find it, its creepy) all around shots. Then when I was behin it, the rear window has a face in it. It was a cloady day, and there is no tree or anything behind it to cause a glare. It was just there. It freaked me out when I saw it load up on my computer lol
I would definitely like to see that picture!
Is your wormhole theory related to the idea of parallel dimensions bleeding together?
I caught that new show Ghost Lab. Thankfully it wasn't any worse than Ghost Hunters (please understand I have a love/hate relationship with these shows, or just out and out hate for most of them). They actually talked briefly about parallel dimensions and such. They also did something unique by laying a complete EMF field/net to track supposed movement, however, I can only conclude at this point that it was about as spotty as regular, unexplained EMF spikes as they did not share any data regarding that with the viewer.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
@Orkeosaurus Great video BTW!
As boring as it may be I would love a much more realistic, scientific approach to this stuff. Less of the 'creative editing' and more scientific based experiments (something Ghost Lab actually shows some promise of doing even though they aren't scientists).
Thus I won't say what I saw was real or blah blah blah.
But rather what I saw.
When I was very little I lived in Seattle in a very creepy ass old house. Quite a few weird things would happen like, I would hear something run around in the attic.
Or a few times here something crying. Now what creeped me out the most was once I saw a little girl standing at the top of the stairs.
Well its 23.12 gmt and I'm here. Had lots of 'orbs' pointed out to me on the 4 cameras they have set up... must admit it looks like dust reflecting to me.
More reports to follow...
Mick
Mick A wrote:Well its 23.12 gmt and I'm here. Had lots of 'orbs' pointed out to me on the 4 cameras they have set up... must admit it looks like dust reflecting to me.
More reports to follow...
Mick
Still only 'orbs' but a few people feeling things in different cells... Have a few experiments on the go as well.
Mick
Automatically Appended Next Post: While watching the cameras I noticed a light in one corner for a few seconds (everyone was together at the time) just took the EMF in where the light was and it was going crazy! Not proof I know but more interesting than orbs...
Mick
Mick A wrote:While watching the cameras I noticed a light in one corner for a few seconds (everyone was together at the time) just took the EMF in where the light was and it was going crazy! Not proof I know but more interesting than orbs...
Mick
Well, cool. Not anything definitive but interesting. And, yes, better than orbs.
My best friend died 2 years ago and whenever i go into the pub we used to drink in there is always a flicker at the side of my vision, i like to think that it is him still there drinking with me
Latest update- just done 'table tipping' seems we had a head warden from the early 1900's, pre WWI. Interesting, and pretty sure no one was deliberatley moving the table.
Mick
Vulkan77 wrote:Table tipping? is that like a ouji board?
Its just a small table that you sit around and put the tips of your fingers on, the idea being that it gets moved by a presence for 'yes' when a question is asked.
Mick
Vulkan77 wrote:Table tipping? is that like a ouji board?
Its just a small table that you sit around and put the tips of your fingers on, the idea being that it gets moved by a presence for 'yes' when a question is asked.
Mick
So the 'Ghost' doesnt achualy speak to the medium?
How many non-mediums are there with you, are there partners of other mediums there with you?
Electro magnetic field detector. Also using temprature gauges.
Mick
Yes but the EMF issue is pretty wonky at best. While interesting and odd you could literally buy a detector and walk down the street (even a rural one) and get weird spikes. What does that mean? Idunno. Sadly, I think 'popular' ghost hunting perception is to sort of accept the whole EMF thing as proof. (This is NOT directed toward you Mick A)
I must admit iprefer a small to a medium!!
but joking aside if there is something past this life then sign me up, as long as its not on a golden throne
The group is 20 strong with 4 mediums the others are believers, as far as I know I'm the only one here who is a non-believer for a lack of a better name. Its been interesting so far, one lot say they have contacted a criminal who spoke through one of them as well as the head warden.
Mick
Mick A wrote:The group is 20 strong with 4 mediums the others are believers, as far as I know I'm the only one here who is a non-believer for a lack of a better name. Its been interesting so far, one lot say they have contacted a criminal who spoke through one of them as well as the head warden.
Mick
Interesting. Where are you anyway, an old house or something?
Mick A wrote:I'm now doing a 4 hour ghost watch this Friday night between 11pm gmt and 3am gmt at Rougemont castle, Exeter. If people are interested I can do on the spot reports. The part we will be in is the old court house and cells. As I said before I'm not a believer or disbeliever but I will be there with a group who definately believe so it should be quite interesting...
Mick
Can't think what you call a guy who doesn't belive (i am a little drunk)
sceptic knew i knew the word, i'd love to be proved wrong and see that there is something there when we shuffle off this mortal coil
Vulkan77 wrote:Can't think what you call a guy who doesn't belive (i am a little drunk)
sceptic knew i knew the word, i'd love to be proved wrong and see that there is something there when we shuffle off this mortal coil
Skeptic isn't a non-believer. Check the video link (thanks to Orkeosaurus)...
It explains things quite well regarding skeptics and closed mindedness.
Vulkan77 wrote:Can't think what you call a guy who doesn't belive (i am a little drunk)
sceptic knew i knew the word, i'd love to be proved wrong and see that there is something there when we shuffle off this mortal coil
Who the hell wants to live forever!
If I thought I had to live another life after this one, well I'd shoot myself now!
Very true fenris a skeptic is someone who has belief but needs it to be proved
But has anyone ever seen any spirits, as i metioned before my best friend of 20 years died 2 years ago and when i go to the same pub we used to frequent there is a flicker next to me which i believe is him there having a drink with me
Vulkan77 wrote:Very true fenris a skeptic is someone who has belief but needs it to be proved
Sort of. A skeptic is someone who might have a belief, but requires proof in order to act on that belief. He can also be someone who completely lacks a belief, though that is something of a separate issue.
How can you fight yourself and lose? That is just silly... each to their own I suppose. As long as one of me doesn't get knocked out, I am doing just fine thank you.
In fact... even if I knock myself out... I still have epic win on my hands... this is getting way too complicated man...
And some motivational music too. YES!! YES!!! I FREAKING WIN THIS SNAP!!! WOOT!
Back home now so this is the final report of the night. It was definately an interesting night with the light I saw (which happens to be where one lot say they got in contact with a criminal) and the table tipping where it seems they were in contact with a head warden. The night was finished with a spirit board, similar to the ouji board, where they were basically told to go...
Still can't say I've made my mind up one way or the other yet though but I would be interested in going to another one.
Mick
It's a well-known fact now that, before using EMF readings as "proof positive", that they have to be backed up by 2-3 things:
1) Is there faulty wiring or any form of malfunctioning electronic equipment present where the EMF reading was taken?
2) During that time were there any personal experiences or cold spots?
3) During the time of the EMF spike, were there EVPs taken?
Things like that are some of the ways they use to try to debunk evidence and ensuring that the proof is ACTUALLY good.
It's a well-known fact now that, before using EMF readings as "proof positive", that they have to be backed up by 2-3 things:
1) Is there faulty wiring or any form of malfunctioning electronic equipment present where the EMF reading was taken?
2) During that time were there any personal experiences or cold spots?
3) During the time of the EMF spike, were there EVPs taken?
Things like that are some of the ways they use to try to debunk evidence and ensuring that the proof is ACTUALLY good.
1) no wiring or electronic equipment where the reading was taken, just a chair propped against a sink.
2) definate drop in temprature in the area of the chair plus it was where I had seen the light earlier.
3) I don't know what an EVP is, sorry.
Checked the photos I took, nothing standing out on the ones I took inside but on the ones I took outside before and after there is definate 'orb' activity. When I get a chance I'll put them on here (doing all this on my phone right now).
Mick
I myself believe in ghosts, mainly because I want to, I have to admit. I would like it if those shows like ghost hunters, ghost lab etc. took a more objective approach. I think when they go for entertainment value they don't help anyone's case in proving the existance of ghosts and actually hurt their case. I would sit through hours of boring footage if they were to simply try to find usuable evidence, and not include eerie music, "oh a ghost just touched me!" kind of stuff.
The only experiance with ghosts I've ever had was when I was 5 years old, so it could easily be explained by my active childhood imagination. Deffinitly not hard evidence or anything, but I remember it well and it still gives me the jitters to think about. My aunt lives in Rosailia WA, close to where the battle of steptoe butte was held between white settlers and native americans. She lives in a rather large house above town, and for the first 10 years she lived there or so, she and her family had been noticing strange things goin on. Lights turing on and off, odd noises, bats being in the house all the time, things being moved etc. I was staying at her house while my parents were on vacation. It was just me and my aunt in the house at the time and I was running around the house playing around like a typical 5 year old. I went upstairs and went over to the closet at the top of the stairs next to the landing. When I opened the closet, there was a pearl white wax-like woman on her knees moaning sort of, she turn her head and looked at me with a featureless face and screamed. It wasn't like an audible noise, more like a sound in my head and it was terrible. Loud and peircing and like nothing I've ever heard. Her body looked to made of some waxy substance and was all interconnected, like a sculpture made out of creamy colored silly putty. I slammed the door shut, pissed my pants, screamed and ran down the stairs. My aunt knew somthing was wrong but I refused to talk for the rest of the night, I also didn't leave her side once until I left with my parents. I never have gone to the upstairs of that house since then. Also when I was older, (about 15 years old) I stayed with my aunt to help her work in her resturant, I had to stay in the basement, didn't see anything but I did hear strange noises all the time, like someone going up and down the stairs. Like I said, I was an inmaignative child and it could very well have been my imagination. So I can't really deny that, more plausible explaination. I still find the house very creepy however and hate being there alone.
I'm often sceptical, though I know for sure I've seen my dead Grandfather before, and that's a common symtpom of bereavement, as was mentioned earlier.
There's too many independent accounts of paranormal activity in some places to pass it off as coincidence - something I don't believe in.
Actually, I know I can feel the presence of my Grandfather when I go to his old house, often to pick up some of his tools or make sure nothing's fallen in. However, this presence/feeling I get may be totally psychosomatic/placebo, but it comforts me either way. I think the memory of the deceased is a beautiful thing, and is nothing to be frightened of, as I would have imagined if I had been younger.
It's a well-known fact now that, before using EMF readings as "proof positive", that they have to be backed up by 2-3 things:
1) Is there faulty wiring or any form of malfunctioning electronic equipment present where the EMF reading was taken?
2) During that time were there any personal experiences or cold spots?
3) During the time of the EMF spike, were there EVPs taken?
Things like that are some of the ways they use to try to debunk evidence and ensuring that the proof is ACTUALLY good.
I would argue it is a good start at something, but proof? Assuming these things are actually going on I think we're still a ways off from knowing exactly what is happening. I mean their is more science/math to support parallel dimensions bleeding over than ghosts existing, in the popular culture belief that our dead relatives carry on. As much as we discover, scientifically, the more questions we raise. I personally feel it is somewhat narrow minded that ghost hunters (from a show, not on a show, whomever leaps to this conclusion) immediately assume that what they experience are the spirits of deceased people that remain here. Regardless of what is happening, we just don't know.
It could be demons tricking us away from Jesus as Catholics believe.
Aliens toying with us for sport.
Aforementioned alternate realities bleeding over.
Psychic impressions left by dead people from when they were alive.
Fairies, pixies and brownies having a laugh.
Psychic impressions put there by the living investigators through their own subconscious that desperately WANT to believe.
Or whatever else anyone can come up with?
Since none of it can really be proved or disproved, none is any more outlandish than the other.
Please don't misunderstand, my intent is not to attack anyone specifically. Merely to point out that we just don't know what is going on. I also don't mean to take away from any positive experiences.
Here are the interesting pictures as promised. I know some people will think the orbs are reflections from the flash but the for the last photo I didn't use a flash...
While in the cells some people kept getting excited about what they thought were orbs but they could mostly be explained as dust being disturbed by people having just walked in front of the cameras which were all different shapes.
Outside was a clear mild night when I took the photos, I was just taking pictures of the actual buildings rather than expecting to see anything come up on them. Remember I'm not what you call a believer. If it was just dust on the lens or water vapour would the photo taken without the flash shown it up as there was no light to be reflected? Also on the 4th picture about two thirds up near the middle there is a bright dot as well, have a zoom in and see what you think.
I'm not saying they are spirits or anything like that just that they look quite cool Mick
You may be right, I'm not what you call technocologicaly minded (I only got my first computer 2 years ago!). What do you make of the small bright light though?
Mick
The camera is a Fujifilm Finepix Z100fd. The photo was taken at around 3am gmt in a large car park without any street lighting with a building to the left around 50 yards away and the old medieval city wall behind me about 30 yards away. There were no other light sources when I took the photo.
Mick
Yeah, that spot is a bit weird. I thought you were meaning about the 2nd photo, the 4 way split.
But, if I had to guess on the 4th one:
It almost looks like it might be just be a bug of some type. They tend to show up a bit brighter than dust particles, but are best spotted using time lapse photos or video.
If you go onto Google maps (satellite) and put in 'Castle Street, Exeter, UK' then look at the end of Castle Street you will see a a big courtyard with what could be a marquee in it. The photo was taken from roughly the middle of the right hand end of the marquee facing towards the building directly opposite (that's the part of the building we were actually under).
Mick
Hadn't heard about that. Like I said before I'm not really into all this paranormal stuff (that's my partners intrest) so I went there without looking into any history or anything about the place. Going to have to start researching now... Mick
Actually, that's the best way to go into it to be honest.
Don't do too much research, aside from finding out if it's open to the public for investigations or how cellular service is, the laws regarding the property, and the property's stability.
The common sense things, so you're not y'know...breaking into a place that could fall on top of your head and be without cell coverage to call for emergency services
You know, this thread brings up the topic of belief vs. empiricism. Many of you posted about "proof" one way or the other, when the question asked in the topic made such things moot. Its like when people ask me if I "believe" in evolution. The answer is, no I don't. Biological evolution is a scientific theory supported by empirical evidence, and it has no more bearing than, say, the study of thermodynamics on my spiritual self.
To answer the question though, no I don't particularly have any belief in ghosts, in the manner in which is being discussed. I'm not talking about proof, or lack thereof, I just don't believe in it.
Interestingly, in spite of my disbelief, I have seen what I believe ( there is that word again) many people would call a ghost. I had awoken and saw, in the corner of the room, and old woman in a gray robe, staring at me intensely. Although the woman didn't approach me or make any gestures, threatening or otherwise, the experience was terrifying, even more so than the expected fear of seeing a stranger in your bedroom at night. I have had several episodes like this, but only this one and perhaps one other would I think of 'ghost" in association with it. In another instance I experienced a shrouded figure, much like a man wearing very voluminous robes, but with all black inside instead of a body, and with glowing red eyes. This apparition swooped toward me and enveloped me, and I experienced a feel of dying. I can't describe exactly how that feels, but I know that is what I felt, I can't explain it any better than that. I don't frighten easily, at least from what I've had other people describe to me as fear, but I can tell you that was without a doubt the most terrifying experience in my life. To make a gaming analogy, when the Warhammer rules differentiate between fear and terror, I can say that the last experience was terror. I also found out that my mother had episodes like this.
I have since read about sleep paralysis, and it seems very much like what I describe. Since these episodes didn't have much spiritual significance for me, I am pretty much willing to look at the physiological aspects of it alone, and not look at a "belief" side of it.
I have also had a precognitive episode, even though it isn't something I believe in, and don't think it can be discussed in terms of science, I had something that without a doubt felt like a precognitive episode.
The mind is a powerful thing... OMG WHAT IS THAT!!! Wait... just my brain, nevermind.
Waking life is a pretty interesting movie if you haven't seen it. Lucid dreaming is fun stuff, like having a daydream while sleeping. Next time you see a monster, try and make it do something, or add some features to it that were not there before. If you see things like this all of the time, you probably are in dire need of sleep though... .
Wrexasaur wrote: How can you fight yourself and lose?
Suicide?
Killing yourself and fighting yourself are two entirely different things. You can put them in the same category if you want, but what you don't let kill you, only makes you stronger. When it comes to questioning the ground you stand on, you are probably entering killing yourself territory, but some do excel at finding where that line lays for them. On the same note, many people see the edge as an entirely different mechanism than others. While you may be falling, I may still be walking, talking, and strutting proud.
We can go all tangential on this, but being suicidal, does not equate directly to self-hate, nor does enjoying a good argument with yourself mean you are crazy. Wrex is crazy, but you don't have to be... .
I find this whole area of conversation to be very interesting, but overall, it may not be appropriate for Dakka; not this topic, but the tangent that were are currently headed down. Skulls and arrows, swords and pens... such and such and such and such.
While we were in the building I pointed out the same thing as this report to people who were watching the video cameras as there was plenty of dust moving around especially after people walked past the cameras but I'm not so sure about outside though, would there be that much floating around out there? (There are over 10 orbs in one of the pictures)
I'm still not convinced 100% myself either way, maybe I'll have to go on another one... (I've always said I'll only truly believe when a ghost walks up to me, says hello, then we sit down and have a conversation!)
Mick
Ketara wrote:You seem to have been very rational about the whole thing. I wonder if it would have been the same if everyone had been of your temperament.
Such behaviour is fully endorsed by the Fortean movement. You're as much trying to disprove as prove the existence of things.
I think it can be summed up with the famous quote from Sherlock Holmes...
Sherlock Holmes wrote:How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?
Generally, you note your observations, present the evidence which you feel eliminates explicable phenomena, and then post your findings publicly, where others better versed or equipped then disseminate.
