So, long story short, I lent my younger Brother €250 to pay for a deposit on a place to live near his college.
I don't particularly care when he pays it back, he is a poor college student after all.
I just found out he bought a €200 phone yesterday because his old one was "like a year old now".
Now, I am furious. Some have told me to calm the feth down, but I think this is the one time I can be justified in loosing my cool. He has owed me this money for over 4 months, and I would have gladly not cared if it had taken him another 4, 8 or 16 months to give it back. What infuriates me is that he had the money, but decided not to pay his dues because of the spoilt brat attitude him and his friends have.
I am only 21, is there really so much difference in attitude between my generation and my 19 year old brothers, or am I just oddly responsible and grumpy for my age?
Congratulations you are now an evil banker. The recession is now officially all your fault.
Get a stick. Get a nail. Put nail through top of stick.
In rapid motions, smack stick with nail against either 1. brother; 2. phone, whichever it comes into contact with first.
I would say that you've got the right to be pissed at this point. your brother is irresponsible. plain and simple. next time, (if there is a next time) suggest making him send you the receipt, and say you'll never offer him any money ever again if he pulls this gak again.
You're pretty responsible, and reasonable for being pissed. your brother should have owned up to his debts, not gone off and bought a cellphone after a year. Admittedly, I did something similar (signed a new contract, but old phone was crap) but this didn't cost anywhere near as much.
You should, however, calm down. keep your cool and just do as I suggested or something similar or fits the situation. I understand it's a complicated situation.
I'm 25(so not much older) and I'd be pissed, too. I could see up to about $50-75 USD where it wouldn't be a big issue for me, but for €250, I'd be a bit more wondering when at least some of it's coming back(without a good reason, anyway, such as your situation started).
But to spend €200, not paying you back, and then basically telling you? Sorry, I know he's your brother, but he's not being a spoiled brat, he's straight up being a selfish, irresponsible prick in that situation.
If he has a way to make enough for a phone that expensive, he has a way to make enough to pay you back some money.
Yea I'd make it clear to him that that behavior ranks on the level of d-bag and not something to be expected from a bro.
Handle it in a relatively civil manner since who knows when you might be the one asking him for money.
With the holidays right around the corner money might be even more tight than usual although if thats not the case since he bought that phone; perhaps he'll give you a gift to make it up. Or you could give him some strong hints towards such a notion.
Frazzled wrote:Congratulations you are now an evil banker. The recession is now officially all your fault.
Get a stick. Get a nail. Put nail through top of stick.
In rapid motions, smack stick with nail against either 1. brother; 2. phone, whichever it comes into contact with first.
Well, we are of Jewish Blood, so it was our fault anyway!
But yes, I already told him, when he comes up here to work next weekend, he either has my money, sleeps under a bush or leaves with two less legs.
The Green Git wrote:One thing I've learned in my time on this ball of dirt... friends may come and friends may go but it takes a family member to really screw you over.
Too true mate.
However, the old saying "Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me" has to come here. I actually thought I could trust him this time, but I learnt my lesson.
He is a massive prick anyway. My mother went to visit him one weekend when she was there for shopping. He actually refused to give her a single Euro to buy some milk so they could have tea together. I think I am just gonna cut him off and just ignore him from now on.
Shadowbrand wrote:Well you are the older bro. NOOGIEZ!
I also have about 200lb on him (We are Mario and Luigi, really. Italian Blood, I am the Older, Shorter Wider one and he is the Younger Taller Skinny one ).
Also, he just rang my mother (who he stays with when he is working) to tell her he is not staying there this weekend because he thinks I am gonna break his legs.
It would be funny were it not for the fact I know where he lives in college
I thought you just smacked everyone with nail boards...
That's the best kind of School!
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Fateweaver wrote:You learn online from Frazz, like online college but he is not accredited so it is technically schooling on his part and being a student on our part.
Oh hallow! Please get to raging. I was promised a Raging!
Well, you know, I'm not going to say anything against my own brothers and I'm not saint, God knows! But, just because someone is family doesn't mean they aren't an a hole.
After all, all a holes are related to someone in some way or other.
BTW you might want to start cultivating a lawn, because it takes years to get it up to the level that you really need to keep kids off it.
dogma wrote:I've never understood why people 'loan' money to family, friends, or anyone else outside of a formal contract.
If I'm going to help out a friend/relative financially I just consider it a gift. If I don't want to give them a gift, I don't give them money.
Seriously, if I needed the money back I wouldn't be in a position to 'loan' them anything in the first place.
Well, my issue isn't the money. I don't mind waiting for the money. What has fethed me off is that he has the money to pay back, but instead of being responsible and paying his dues, he buys a phone for no reason.
Seems you need to learn a valuable lesson.
Just because you've loaned someone money, it does not mean you now get to scrutinize their spending habits. You should have done that before, and since it's you're brother you should have known he was a wastrel.
I have a simple solution (that works for me) all "loans" I've given to family members are "gifts". I give them money and all expectations end there, if I get paid back, nice surprise; otherwise I don't care.
Of course my family isn't hitting me up for money all the time or even rarely.
MadEdric wrote:Seems you need to learn a valuable lesson. Just because you've loaned someone money, it does not mean you now get to scrutinize their spending habits. You should have done that before, and since it's you're brother you should have known he was a wastrel. I have a simple solution (that works for me) all "loans" I've given to family members are "gifts". I give them money and all expectations end there, if I get paid back, nice surprise; otherwise I don't care. Of course my family isn't hitting me up for money all the time or even rarely.
I think his point was that he "loaned" his brother the money, but with no real expectation(or care) of getting it back.
What's probably galling him is that his brother took the money, obviously had enough to pay it back(even if not expected to), but instead of even offering to pay Gwar back(which might or might have been declined), he goes and spends it on some new phone he doesn't really need.
It's not about the money, it's about the attitude and way his brother handled the situation.
Platuan4th wrote:I think his point was that he "loaned" his brother the money, but with no real expectation(or care) of getting it back.
What's probably galling him is that his brother took the money, obviously had enough to pay it back(even if not expected to), but instead of even offering to pay Gwar back(which might or might have been declined), he goes and spends it on some new phone he doesn't really need.
It's not about the money, it's about the attitude and way his brother handled the situation.
Whenever i have lent family members money in the past, i have done it whilst making sure all other family members know what is happening. I find this guilt trip to be most effective.
@GWAR: Your brother is being an ass. But i was an ass when i was that age; don't let him forget about the money you lent him, in time it will gnaw at him
True, he's messed up, but we all have to learn our mistakes at some point.
dogma wrote:I've never understood why people 'loan' money to family, friends, or anyone else outside of a formal contract.
Really? Got some college education and you can't understand something as simple as this? I think you are exaggerating for effect.Perhaps what you meant was that you don't think it is a good idea, not that you don't understand. It could be that you have no trustworthy people in your life that has lead you down this path and the conclusion, and that would be sad, but I could see it. Do you just mean large sums or any sum at all? If you mean large sums of money I could see that but if you mean anything that just seems to be a sad testament to the people you surround yourself with if you can't trust any of them at all w/o a signed contract.
I lent my bro $750 USD a while back. I do want it back, but he works at a fast food joint, so it is going to take him a while. I try not to trip. I am salary, he is minimum wage. I am glad I am in a position to help him, and the money I get back I am going to put into savings. That said, I was still pissed when he spent his money on frivolous things instead of saving... Damn Monkey! But, it could be worse...
Sorry for the lengthy post... I need to get this off of my chest. I am currently arguing with my sister, but not over money. Before my mom passed away, she said that when she dies, she doesn't want her kids to fight over her belongings. It is very relevant to mention that she was absolutely plastered off cheap Vodka. She put her arm around my wife and said, "I see you as my daughter, and I want to make sure you are included in this. What would you like when I die? I know it is morbid, but I want to make sure my kids don't fight over stupid material items." My wife, feeling kinda weirded-out about this candid chat about the inevitable and my mom's inebriation, said she wanted her dining room table. My wife started to cry because they never really got along, and she was very touched by my mom's candor and honesty. That was the last time I ever saw my mom alive...
A month later, after my mom's funeral, we are not thinking about the table. We are mourning. My sister apparently asked for said table, and my dad told her no. He said he is not in the proper mental place to be thinking about that.
Fast forward to the present, almost two years later. My family (me, my wife, and our two girls) is moving into a place of our own, and my dad asks if we need anything for our new place. My wife remembered what my mom said, and requested the table. My dad said, "Of course." I got a call from my sister a few minutes later. She said she asked first, and would like me to tell my dad she could have it...
Shenanigans ensued... She says my wife has no say in the matter because she is not blood, she is not one of the siblings. I told here the ring on my finger disagrees and to have a good day. What followed was three days of whining. She called my dad and told him I was being unreasonable. He doesn't think I am, but all the same, he doesn't want us fighting so if we can't agree, no one gets it. I am all for that, my mom didn't want us to fight in the first fething place. My sister has barraged us with 10-15 text messages, three voice mails, and two yelling matches. This is why:
She says SHE asked FIRST, and I am only doing this to hurt her.
She says my wife has no say and that it should only be the four siblings that have a say, regardless of what mom said, because she was drunk.
She said that would be the same as her wanting some of my wife's late father's belongings. I said no because my sister didn't even know Meescha, let alone be the spouse of his child... That pissed us both off.
She said we should have a rotation, in contract, where she gets it first for a year, then me, then my brothers, then back to her...
I said feth off, I don't want to argue, mom didn't want us to argue, dad doesn't want us to argue, my wife is furious with you for bringing her dad into this, my brothers think this is childish, and have a nice life.
Sorry for the rant, like I said, I really needed to get this off of my chest.
Sounds like the sis needs a provolone beatdown too.
1. switch it. Its not the wife that wants it. You want it. So its fair again.
2. This is why you take out the siblings when they are young and weak, to avoid these sorts of problems in the future. Only the strong survive!
Frazzled wrote:2. This is why you take out the siblings when they are young and weak, to avoid these sorts of problems in the future. Only the strong survive!
Frazzled wrote:2. This is why you take out the siblings when they are young and weak, to avoid these sorts of problems in the future. Only the strong survive!
tblock1984 wrote:I lent my bro $750 USD a while back. I do want it back, but he works at a fast food joint, so it is going to take him a while. I try not to trip. I am salary, he is minimum wage. I am glad I am in a position to help him, and the money I get back I am going to put into savings. That said, I was still pissed when he spent his money on frivolous things instead of saving... Damn Monkey! But, it could be worse...
Sorry for the lengthy post... I need to get this off of my chest. I am currently arguing with my sister, but not over money. Before my mom passed away, she said that when she dies, she doesn't want her kids to fight over her belongings. It is very relevant to mention that she was absolutely plastered off cheap Vodka. She put her arm around my wife and said, "I see you as my daughter, and I want to make sure you are included in this. What would you like when I die? I know it is morbid, but I want to make sure my kids don't fight over stupid material items." My wife, feeling kinda weirded-out about this candid chat about the inevitable and my mom's inebriation, said she wanted her dining room table. My wife started to cry because they never really got along, and she was very touched by my mom's candor and honesty. That was the last time I ever saw my mom alive...
A month later, after my mom's funeral, we are not thinking about the table. We are mourning. My sister apparently asked for said table, and my dad told her no. He said he is not in the proper mental place to be thinking about that.
Fast forward to the present, almost two years later. My family (me, my wife, and our two girls) is moving into a place of our own, and my dad asks if we need anything for our new place. My wife remembered what my mom said, and requested the table. My dad said, "Of course." I got a call from my sister a few minutes later. She said she asked first, and would like me to tell my dad she could have it...
Shenanigans ensued... She says my wife has no say in the matter because she is not blood, she is not one of the siblings. I told here the ring on my finger disagrees and to have a good day. What followed was three days of whining. She called my dad and told him I was being unreasonable. He doesn't think I am, but all the same, he doesn't want us fighting so if we can't agree, no one gets it. I am all for that, my mom didn't want us to fight in the first fething place. My sister has barraged us with 10-15 text messages, three voice mails, and two yelling matches. This is why:
She says SHE asked FIRST, and I am only doing this to hurt her.
She says my wife has no say and that it should only be the four siblings that have a say, regardless of what mom said, because she was drunk.
She said that would be the same as her wanting some of my wife's late father's belongings. I said no because my sister didn't even know Meescha, let alone be the spouse of his child... That pissed us both off.
She said we should have a rotation, in contract, where she gets it first for a year, then me, then my brothers, then back to her...
I said feth off, I don't want to argue, mom didn't want us to argue, dad doesn't want us to argue, my wife is furious with you for bringing her dad into this, my brothers think this is childish, and have a nice life. Sorry for the rant, like I said, I really needed to get this off of my chest.
Hmm. Well, I would say:
Simply being a person's child does not mean you have some sort of moral entitlement to their things when they die. Sure, things are usually given to the person's children, but if the person in question says anything otherwise then that's their wish, and they have every right to inherit anyone they feel like.
You're correct about your sister's analogy; it's invalid by both the fact that your wife's father hasn't declared your sister can inherit her table, and by the fact that your sister isn't married to a child of your wife's father.
Having a table moved between houses every year makes it pretty much worthless. You will still both need another dining table anyway in that scenario, and you'll have to drag a table around every year.
I can see the argument that saying something while drunk puts less value on it. However, if your sister doesn't have any valid counter argument for why she should get it, the drunk comment still stands (if your mom had said something else while sober that might take precedence).
If you really want to minimize fighting over it, you could always flip a coin (or have someone else flip a coin for you).
Frazzled wrote:Sounds like the sis needs a provolone beatdown too.
1. switch it. Its not the wife that wants it. You want it. So its fair again.
Tried this. Same result. It really doesn't matter what you say, she will take what she wants out of it and use it as ammunition.
She said I am just rearranging what I say to "win this argument", at the whims of my wife because I am her puppet. She says this makes her feel hurt, sad, and ashamed. This is followed by something from the Book of Mormon that discusses family ties, and that even though I am being in insufferable person, she still considers me her brother, and I am still welcome at her home any time I want...
What a fething tool.
2. This is why you take out the siblings when they are young and weak, to avoid these sorts of problems in the future. Only the strong survive!
I would have, but she is 8 years older than me.
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Orkeosaurus wrote:Hmm. Well, I would say:
Simply being a person's child does not mean you have some sort of moral entitlement to their things when they die. Sure, things are usually given to the person's children, but if the person in question says anything otherwise then that's their wish, and they have every right to inherit anyone they feel like.
You're correct about your sister's analogy; it's invalid by both the fact that your wife's father hasn't declared your sister can inherit her table, and it's invalid by the fact that your sister isn't married to a child of your wife's father.
Having a table moved between houses every year makes it pretty much worthless. You will both need another dining table anyway in that scenario, and you'll have to drag a table around every year.
I can see the argument that saying something while drunk put less value on it. However, as your sister doesn't have any valid counter argument for why she should get it, the drunk comment still stands (if your mom had said something else while sober that might take precedence).
If you really want to minimize fighting over it, you could always flip a coin (or have someone else flip a coin for you).
I also have about 200lb on him (We are Mario and Luigi, really. Italian Blood, I am the Older, Shorter Wider one and he is the Younger Taller Skinny one ).
I just pictured you as #21 and him as #24. Now I'm cleaning bits of sandwich off of my computer desk.
Back on topic, my brother not only owes me about that same amount of money, but he got a credit card in my name. Not that my credit rating wasn't already in the toilet, but now it's irredeemable. Here's a little musical interlude to see the proper mood.
CaptainCommunsism wrote:I would say that you've got the right to be pissed at this point. your brother is irresponsible. plain and simple. next time, (if there is a next time) suggest making him send you the receipt, and say you'll never offer him any money ever again if he pulls this gak again.
You're pretty responsible, and reasonable for being pissed. your brother should have owned up to his debts, not gone off and bought a cellphone after a year. Admittedly, I did something similar (signed a new contract, but old phone was crap) but this didn't cost anywhere near as much.
You should, however, calm down. keep your cool and just do as I suggested or something similar or fits the situation. I understand it's a complicated situation.
Aren't canadians nice?
I had a similar situation. I loaned my brother $500 for his car - which he promptly put on horses which as far as I know are still racing (he has a pathological ability to never pick winners). I haven't spoken to him since.
I had a similar situation. I loaned my brother $500 for his car - which he promptly put on horses which as far as I know are still racing (he has a pathological ability to never pick winners). I haven't spoken to him since.
+1 to the stick with a nail in it.
Heh, don't get me started on Horses
But yeah, I think the Nailboard is the best solution atm.
Ahtman wrote:
I think you are exaggerating for effect.Perhaps what you meant was that you don't think it is a good idea, not that you don't understand.
That would be the case, on both counts.
Ahtman wrote:
It could be that you have no trustworthy people in your life that has lead you down this path and the conclusion, and that would be sad, but I could see it. Do you just mean large sums or any sum at all? If you mean large sums of money I could see that but if you mean anything that just seems to be a sad testament to the people you surround yourself with if you can't trust any of them at all w/o a signed contract.
I would phrase it this way: If the sum of money is large enough to be considered a loan, and therefore significant to the lending party, it should be done under the auspices of a contract. If not, its a gift, and repayment should not be expected. Obviously the delineation of significance would vary based on the parties involved.
It isn't so much a matter of trust, as it is a way to avoid financial entanglements with loved ones. My family has a long history of feuds with respect to things like inheritance, debt, and other such matters.
Orkeosaurus wrote:I vote taking a pound of flesh from him as payment.
Yeah, they stopped us doing that in the 1970s unfortunately, after we unsuccessfully tried to retroactively add "as well as some of the other bits attached to the flesh with a weight tolerance of 20%" to the end of the contract. (See I may be a Trolle, but I am an Educated Trolle who reads Shakespeare OK??!?!?!?!)
See, I never got why Shylock didn't just say "hey, it's your responsibility to get me the flesh, if you lose blood in the process that's not my fault".
I mean, when you loan someone money do you then rifle through their pockets, open up their wallet, and take the money out of it yourself? Well, maybe, but that's usually when their feet are in cement.
I feel for you Gwar!. My little brother is exactly the same. We are a bit older, but between us we have the same 2 year separation (I'm 26 and he's 24). He used to pull stuff like this all the time. It gets better with age though. He has now paid off all his debts (except mine) and is saving up money for a mortgage.
I loaned my bro about 600 quid about 7 years ago, and when I asked for it back he whined like a little ***** to my mum until she told me to forget about it. "My baby doesn't have that kind of money...blah, blah, blah"
Oh And I nearly forgot...something that royally gets on my nerves, so I'm just gonna let the rage out. My mum has some savings that she basically wants (wanted?) us to share. Since I live in sunny Shanghai I haven't received my portion yet and the little turd of a brother asked for my share so he can get said mortgage. Mum said yes. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!
I'm now in the process of convincing my mother that since I'm married and we are trying to get pregnant I'm actually in need of the cash as well.
Cutting it short...+1 for the board with nail to the head.
Sorry for the rant, and I hope you get your cash back soon!
Everything someone lets my sister "borrow" ends up broken or lost. Or at the very least, not returned to you until you hound her for three days straight.
I've decided from now on to only either give things to her, or not let her take them at all. (Generally moving towards the latter. It's not like she doesn't have her own stuff.)
Lukus83 wrote:Sorry for the rant, and I hope you get your cash back soon!
I just exploded in rage, too. It is good to let it out sometimes.
That being said, sorry/thanks Gwar! I didn't mean to hijack your thread for half a page. It was worth it, though, to get Frazzled's opinion, not to mention therapeutic.
Tell your brother that he needs to start paying you back and establish a payment plan. 25 or 50 a month or some mutually agreeable amount. If you don't see him monthly he owes you whatever it would be (2 months worth, 3 months worth, etc.)
If he misses a month he owes you an extra 10. Put it in writing, have him sign it.
Tell your brother that he needs to start paying you back and establish a payment plan. 25 or 50 a month or some mutually agreeable amount. If you don't see him monthly he owes you whatever it would be (2 months worth, 3 months worth, etc.)
If he misses a month he owes you an extra 10. Put it in writing, have him sign it.
Might be a little too late for that.
Writing up a contract after the fact (especially one with penalties involved) doesn't really
help someone who can't manage their money.
The thing about contracts is that they're only useful if 1) you're willing to sue the other party in court and 2) they have some ability to pay.
I mean, in principle I agree with Dogma. Any loan that's meant to be a loan, and not a gift, should be in writing even if between family.
Families can be rough. I know that in a lot of them, emotions and guilt are used for power and material gain. So you get the deadbeat brother that the mom really dotes on, so nobody can call him on anything without a row, or some other such nonesense. Like any other relationship, just balance the good with the bad, and use that to determine how much BS you're willing to take.
I don't even want the money, but it is about the principle now, so I am making him give me the money this weekend or the Frazzled Class Stick-with-Nails is being Deployed.
dogma wrote:I was just wondering why someone (you?) would want the money back at all?
€250= US$374.413 Thats why. They had an agreement, and instead of keeping his part of the bargin *Insert new phone here*
Yup, that is pretty much it. I can understand if it was "I needed to pay rent" or "We had to buy oil for the heating" or "I had to pay for A&E cause I got a pickaxe up my arse", but "I wanted a new Phone" is taking the piss and several other bodily fluids.
And? I'm fully aware of how much money it is, and the amount in question is important, but only in the context of each party's financial situation. To me that isn't much money, and I wouldn't have any problem simply giving it to a friend or relative who needed it. To Gwar! it may be a significant amount, and if that's the case I would simply say that he's learned a lesson about handing needed currency to a relative over whom he has little control.
Drk_Oblitr8r wrote:
They had an agreement, and instead of keeping his part of the bargin *Insert new phone here*
I'm not questioning why he's angry that his brother reneged on an agreement. I get that completely. I'm questioning why the agreement would be made in the first place if the money was somehow significant to Gwar!.
dogma wrote:I'm not questioning why he's angry that his brother reneged on an agreement. I get that completely. I'm questioning why the agreement would be made in the first place if the money was somehow significant to Gwar!.
The money is insignificant to me. What matters is he asked for the money, and I agreed on the condition he paid it back whenever he was able to, which he agreed to. I would not have cared if I got the money back in a week, month or year. What has gotten me furious is that he has the money, is more than able to pay it back, but instead got a new phone and had no intention of telling me (I only found out because his room-mate knows about the money I lent him and isn't a douche).
I get why you're pissed. The guy bought a new phone and tried to keep it secret, knowing it would annoy you. He made the decision that a new toy was worth more than an honest relationship with his brother.
At this point your brother needs to rectify this, and he needs to do so by repaying the money as soon as possible.
I'm guessing the money was lent under the assumption that the brother needed it, in the strict sense of the word. When it wasn't repaid, it was assumed to be due to poverty, not due to spending on luxury goods. The problem is that the brother essentially lied and/or took advantage of the situation.
It sounds like you have a bit of a double standard here, but I understand why you would be angry.
If you just straight up told him that you were offended by that, and why you were offended by that (him having the money, etc...); I think that this would be your best option.
If dude is a flat out mooch, and he comes back to ask you for more money, then stop talking to him, and let him take care of himself.
It sounds like you have a bit of a double standard here, but I understand why you would be angry.
How do I have a double standard? I lent him the money so he had a place to live, on the condition he paid me back when he could. I did not say to him "pay be back when you can after you buy yourself new phones you don't need". I mean, he is going "ooh im so poor waaaa" but suddenly has 4/5ths of the Money he owes me to spend on a phone?
If dude is a flat out mooch, and he comes back to ask you for more money, then stop talking to him, and let him take care of himself.
Yeah, he is. I shall not be talking to him once I get this money back.
Gwar! wrote:How do I have a double standard? I lent him the money so he had a place to live, on the condition he paid me back when he could. I did not say to him "pay be back when you can after you buy yourself new phones you don't need". I mean, he is going "ooh im so poor waaaa" but suddenly has 4/5ths of the Money he owes me to spend on a phone?
I guess it wasn't clear that you had a relatively solid verbal agreement. If you had just lent him the money, and vaguely mentioned that you were lending it to him. The problem with that is, who the hell would just give someone close to four hundred dollars? I have never been a fan of borrowing money, especially when I am in a tight situation, but this guy does seem to be taking the piss somewhat.
Yeah, he is. I shall not be talking to him once I get this money back.
If he is just a mooching bastard, then that is all you really need to know. Did he really need a new phone by any chance?
Oh, and one last thing. Don't make this into a ten year vendetta, just get your money, and be done with it. If you can't get your money, and never end up getting it, I would hardly call that reason to never see family... ever again. Just seems harsh to me, but I can totally understand in the short term.
So your mainly angry that he did not tell you that he was getting a new phone? Or that he got an expensive phone.
I mean realistically, that money could have been for you; but if he needed a phone, because his old one broke or something, then I understand.
It really sucks to not have the internet, or a phone, and if he relies on one device (his phone) for both, it only makes sense that he would go out and get a new one.
I would completely understand if the guy went out, and bought 5 new shirts, for no reason.
Wrexasaur wrote:So your mainly angry that he did not tell you that he was getting a new phone? Or that he got an expensive phone.
I mean realistically, that money could have been for you; but if he needed a phone, because his old one broke or something, then I understand.
It really sucks to not have the internet, or a phone, and if he relies on one device (his phone) for both, it only makes sense that he would go out and get a new one.
Ah, sorry. I could have been a little clearer
I am angry that he bought a phone for no reason. His old phone is perfectly fine.
Gwar, you are longterm unemployed and have gleefully told this forum how you enjoy claiming benefits.
The fact you can amass this amount means you have been lying to the welfare people. You must declare all savings to them.
So, the money your brother had is what he's taken from you that you have taken from the state. You seem, from what you've written, to have been committing benefit fraud.
MeanGreenStompa wrote:Gwar, you are longterm unemployed and have gleefully told this forum how you enjoy claiming benefits.
The fact you can amass this amount means you have been lying to the welfare people. You must declare all savings to them.
So, the money your brother had is what he's taken from you that you have taken from the state. You seem, from what you've written, to have been committing benefit fraud.
Lolwhut?
Firstly, unemployment here in Ireland is €205 a week. Out of this, I have been saving €30-50 (if even possible) a week. My Rent is €100 a week, My Bills and other costs are €50-70 a week. I have 0 spare cash whatsoever.
The money I lent to my brother is from that €30-50 a week, saved over the course of 2 or 3 months. Of my saving, I actually have none left, as I have had to pay my TV Licence and buy a new Passport (which is a pain in the arse to organise from Ireland), buy insurance, pay medical bills (Ever had to pay €100 for A&E in the UK? No, I didn't think so) and a host of other costs.
dogma wrote:I've never understood why people 'loan' money to family, friends, or anyone else outside of a formal contract.
If I'm going to help out a friend/relative financially I just consider it a gift. If I don't want to give them a gift, I don't give them money.
Seriously, if I needed the money back I wouldn't be in a position to 'loan' them anything in the first place.
Well, my issue isn't the money. I don't mind waiting for the money. What has fethed me off is that he has the money to pay back, but instead of being responsible and paying his dues, he buys a phone for no reason.
Where in the rules does it say he has to pay you back before buying something else? I think that's a RAI interpretation.
Valhallan42nd wrote:Where in the rules does it say he has to pay you back before buying something else? I think that's a RAI interpretation.
LULZ! It doesn't. If that was a rule, I would be very poor and destitute because my creditors would take the money I owe them before I could pay my rent, or buy food or diapers. Like Gwar! said, it is principle...
Right lazy mode, cant be bothered fully reading the thread at this time.
any one sugested taking the phone as payment? or as a "deposit"? and if he buys a new 1 "to do" gim till he pays you back steal it again..... you get the picture....
All threads that are locked should stay locked as a matter of principle. I have seen many of Gwar's threads unlocked. No one else has access to this privilege. It has nothing to do with helping people with 40k rules. Policy should be consistent across the forums.
Valhallan42nd wrote:Where in the rules does it say he has to pay you back before buying something else? I think that's a RAI interpretation.
It's just before "What happens if you don't and it involved a brick"
I'd recommend this gentleman's solution:
It's the second entry for the Google Image Search for "sock full of quarters". The grand flag of my Republic in the window makes the image oddly compelling.
Green Blow Fly wrote:All threads that are locked should stay locked as a matter of principle. I have seen many of Gwar's threads unlocked. No one else has access to this privilege. It has nothing to do with helping people with 40k rules. Policy should be consistent across the forums.
G
I think now you fully understand Gwar!'s lament...
To play devil's advo... er... um, to play troll's advocate, Gwar was prolly posting as Modquisition was being instituted. It was a very small time frame from where I was sitting. A matter of approx 2-3 mins. Maybe Gwar! didn't even know he was on Frazzled's lawn until it was too late... Just saying...
Automatically Appended Next Post: I went back and looked, it was 30 seconds.
Gwar!, your little brother is taking you for granted and you are pissed at him for being immature. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this going on wherever there are little brothers and big brothers? He'll figure it out one day. In the meantime, perhaps a reasonable talking to? And not lending any more money, of course.
Either your brother has now paid for his deposit and has therefore returned that money to at least one lucky Irish taxpayer (or even to the college if they own the property, so they made a contribution to the education system), or the hardworking folks of Ireland have given your brother the early Christmas present of a spanky new phone.
Neither is cause for you to be upset, if you think of it from that perspective. In fact, removing any notion of your ownership of the money is the best way to take away that stress and anger you're bottling up.
Not sure how unemployment works in Ireland but don't you actually have to have had a job to collect unemployment over in Ireland? Meaning he (Gwar) has already done his share to help society over there.
I know in the US of A unemployment is a totally far cry from welfare. In order to get welfare in the states you don't actually need to do anything except not have a job (or work very very few hours), it's adjusted by how many kids you have, etc, etc, etc... Unemployment though is only garnered when you have worked a certain amount of time at your job, your employer deems you worthy of unemployment and the unemployment agency on both state and federal levels deems you qualifying and it is typically 67% of your highest AGI quarter going back 18 months but there is a cap on it as well. If I was working pipeline making $1800/week my unemployment will top off at $650/week.
So I don't get how Gwar is in the wrong doing for collecting unemployment benefits. If it works like the US I'm sure it's not exactly the best way to live and he obviously would have had to have had a job to even get unemployment so comparing Gwar to some welfare loser who won't even lift a finger and that his brother deserves the cell phone because Ireland paid for it is a flat out personal attack and a bunch of bullshite as well.
Fateweaver wrote:So I don't get how Gwar is in the wrong doing for collecting unemployment benefits. If it works like the US I'm sure it's not exactly the best way to live and he obviously would have had to have had a job to even get unemployment so comparing Gwar to some welfare loser who won't even lift a finger and that his brother deserves the cell phone because Ireland paid for it is a flat out personal attack and a bunch of bullshite as well.
I have to agree with fate on this one. What the hell happened to this thread?
I know an awful lot of people that have lost their jobs over the past year, and thankfully enough, they managed to get something to live on for the lack of work. My father lost a job because of cutbacks many years ago, and even though he practically had a new job finding work, it still took him many months to find it. In this economy, I mean geez, it is just a sucker punch to attack someone like that though.
I would go into welfare, because of my feelings about it, and the fact that welfare queens are some of the rarest creatures on the planet; but I think this thread has enough going on already.
tblock1984 wrote:
Green Blow Fly wrote:Well at least his brother apparently has a job.
I am sorry, I do not understand this statement. I want to verify your implication before replying...
Ummm... to shut the thread down by spamming insults? I dunno... maybe? This is not all that complicated mate.
).
I lent him the money so he had a place to live, on the condition he paid me back when he could. I did not say to him "pay be back when you can after you buy yourself new phones you don't need". I mean, he is going "ooh im so poor waaaa" but suddenly has 4/5ths of the Money he owes me to spend on a phone?
