Wondering if anyone knew anything about this. I know the codex is ancient and they get no love, but earleir I was on the GW website and noticed that the big box of Battlesisters has been removed. I think it came with 9 or 10 models. All that remains is the three-model blister.

Anyone know if this is a sign that Witch Hunters are truly dead? I hope not. Finally got my wife to buy the codex LAST NIGHT!!! DOH!

If this is old news...I apologize for extreme noobness.

Boxed set could merely be phased out, no reason for alarm just yet. All boxed options are now available as blisters instead.

I just checked and the Sisters of Battle Seraphim Squad is still a box set. The main battle sister squad on the other hand, has gone to blisters.

FlightMek wrote:Wondering if anyone knew anything about this. I know the codex is ancient and they get no love, but earleir I was on the GW website and noticed that the big box of Battlesisters has been removed. I think it came with 9 or 10 models. All that remains is the three-model blister.

Anyone know if this is a sign that Witch Hunters are truly dead? I hope not. Finally got my wife to buy the codex LAST NIGHT!!! DOH!

If this is old news...I apologize for extreme noobness.

I have collected and played SOB since their arrival in 2nd, and love the whole "warrior nun"/ecclesiastic vibe. but they have always been the red headed step child of 40K (rivaled by DE).

They are a fringe army with a loyal yet small fan base and despite their cool fluff and concept don't really get the average "Timmy" pumped like the Spez Mahrines111. As such I am surprised they haven't gone the way of other similarly cool armies like LATD, Genestealer cult, etc.

If GW didn't need them as filler for the WH codex they would have surely gotten a stake through the heart before now.

I wish that SOB would get their own codex or that 40K would get an Ecclessiarchy codex with expanded units like redemptionists/fraternis militia, penitent engine variants, special characters like Uriah Jacobson, etc. ,etc. rather then shoehorned into some future WH rewrite, but sadly I think the chances of returning to the glory days of a devoted SOB codex is sadly slim to none at this point.

I have a large force of them, but worry that they might get "squatted" at some point...

The 2010 Mini listing that came out here last week had a lot of stuff for WH/DH

* New GK Terminators 3ups (5 poses, 1 HQ/leader)
* New Daemonhunter/Witchhunter concept art
* New DH/WH vehicles/support

Was all quoted. Maybe good things will happen and we will finally see a plastic sisters unit.

-Eric

trougedoor122 wrote:I just checked and the Sisters of Battle Seraphim Squad is still a box set. The main battle sister squad on the other hand, has gone to blisters.

Just went back there to check out the Seraphim Squad and there was a link to the SoB squad box. Weird...

Must just be something wrong with the website.

...I hope

Who knows we might be getting plastic sister... think of the modeling postions we can make them into..... hehe( mind in the gutter). sorry.

StarGate wrote: Who knows we might be getting plastic sister... think of the modeling postions we can make them into..... hehe( mind in the gutter). sorry.

and this is why they will probably get 'squatted". They just don't get any respect from the average 40K gamer who can't seem to ever stop with the "nuns with guns" jokes and the "booby shaped power armour" references and suggestions that they are "space lesbos" and so on and so forth. The sisters fluctuate between being seen as the "poor man's space marines" and fodder for potty mouthed adolescent humor and titty jokes...

CT GAMER wrote:The sisters fluctuate between being seen as the "poor man's space marines"...

More like rich man's space marines what with costing much more to build an army out of all metal models. I thank the emperor for them because they give us SoB cosplayers, and it doesn't get much more awesome than that.

Culler wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:The sisters fluctuate between being seen as the "poor man's space marines"...

More like rich man's space marines what with costing much more to build an army out of all metal models. I thank the emperor for them because they give us SoB cosplayers, and it doesn't get much more awesome than that.

"poor" as in "lesser" marines: sort of like diet-cola (looks similar in armour and weaponry but not quite up to what the average Joe-gamer is looking for stats/rules-wise)

I just don't imagine that the popularity of SOB will warrant a plastic kit for them.

I hope I am dead wrong, as the only thing that has prevented me from taking my SOB force to Apocalypse point levels is the cost of the metal models and lack of pose variation of the current sculpts.

And yes that SOB cosplay costume was one of the best 40K costumes to date...

The SOB, were/are some of the best miniatures GW produce....it would be very sad if they dropped them.

However, in addition to the general lack of exposure they recieve, I was also mulling over the fact that there have been (as far as I know) only one novel that actually focused on the Sisters!!! 1......even the DE get more love than that.....

...what a waste of a potentially awesome product line!

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1080206

It's still on there, just...not listed like it should be.

Most likely, an error of some form.

The owner of FLGS says they are now officially end of line. he can't order any more witch/demon hunters, not even codexes. But this could be a simple case of them going direct only rather than getting squated.

Have they squatted anything since the squats?

holidayhalflife wrote:... this could be a simple case of them going direct only rather than getting squated.

These two realities do not lie that far apart in effect.

privateer4hire wrote:

holidayhalflife wrote:... this could be a simple case of them going direct only rather than getting squated.

These two realities do not lie that far apart in effect.

Nor is it realistically that far apart from the fact that no one was buying them. They just don't collect dust as posters on hooks in this case.

I don't think it is an error - the boxed set of 10 is missing from all of the GW sites - Australia, Britain, US etc.

And considering that these sites often have different options for purchase (Aus gets short changed for most things, and a lot of the special models aren't available) it seems that it is a deliberate update across the board, its just that someone hasn't actually removed the link in the 'recommended purchase' window they have up on every page.

I would break my financial ban on new GW stuff for sisters/plastic GK's. Lets hope, huh? Especially if it got some proper attention (not just plastic basic sisters, but a couple of proper kits for Seraphim etc).

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Let me check with my LATD and GEnestealer cult armies...

Yup, both "squatted".

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Let me check with my LATD and GEnestealer cult armies...

Yup, both "squatted".

I'm not sure white dwarf armies count. Otherwise kroot mercs are in there too.

ShumaGorath wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Let me check with my LATD and GEnestealer cult armies...

Yup, both "squatted".

I'm not sure white dwarf armies count. Otherwise kroot mercs are in there too.

Technically, Lost and the Damned were a campaign army and Kroot Mercs were considered Index Astartes approved.

But it's a technicality, as either way they clearly weren't intended for anything more than fun and friendly games.

lords2001 wrote:I don't think it is an error - the boxed set of 10 is missing from all of the GW sites - Australia, Britain, US etc.

And considering that these sites often have different options for purchase (Aus gets short changed for most things, and a lot of the special models aren't available) it seems that it is a deliberate update across the board, its just that someone hasn't actually removed the link in the 'recommended purchase' window they have up on every page.

I would break my financial ban on new GW stuff for sisters/plastic GK's. Lets hope, huh? Especially if it got some proper attention (not just plastic basic sisters, but a couple of proper kits for Seraphim etc).

Er, anytime they remove an item from sale--they completely purge it, and usually break the site for a few days(most notably the What's New sidebar will vanish, from what I've seen. They had to remove the Imperial Strongpoint deal for awhile because it was incorrectly charging $0.90 rather than $90.00.) afterwards. That's part of what makes me think it's just an error.

Second part is that if it was removing the item from sale, clicking the "Recommended Purchase" link will load a blank page template, with all the standard trimmings--but no product in the center.

CT GAMER wrote:And yes that SOB cosplay costume was one of the best 40K costumes to date...

Does anyone have a picture? I am both intrigued and saddened, the latter because I apparently missed out.

I play SOB and I enjoy the fact that they are so pewter-dependent. It adds to their archaic, esoteric vibe. It takes more effort to model and convert, which is another aspect I like. I do not want it to be easy, I want it to be worth it.

ShumaGorath wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Let me check with my LATD and GEnestealer cult armies...

Yup, both "squatted".

I'm not sure white dwarf armies count. Otherwise kroot mercs are in there too.

LATD was in Codex:Armageddon and Genestealer cult was in Codex Tyranids (2nd edition). Neither was a "WD army".

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Let me check with my LATD and GEnestealer cult armies...

Yup, both "squatted".

I'm not sure white dwarf armies count. Otherwise kroot mercs are in there too.

LATD was in Codex:Armageddon and Genestealer cult was in Codex Tyranids (2nd edition). Neither was a "WD army".

Codex: Tyranids(2nd edition) was invalidated years ago when they updated it to the next edition.

I'm not sure what you really expect in that regards. Codex: Craftworld Eldar is gone, and you don't see them constantly complaining about outdated codexes that have been updated do you?

Kanluwen wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Let me check with my LATD and GEnestealer cult armies...

Yup, both "squatted".

I'm not sure white dwarf armies count. Otherwise kroot mercs are in there too.

LATD was in Codex:Armageddon and Genestealer cult was in Codex Tyranids (2nd edition). Neither was a "WD army".

Codex: Tyranids(2nd edition) was invalidated years ago when they updated it to the next edition.

I'm not sure what you really expect in that regards. Codex: Craftworld Eldar is gone, and you don't see them constantly complaining about outdated codexes that have been updated do you?

Do you understand the term "squatted"?

Loosely: It is taking a valid army legal in the game of 40K (from a codex) and removing it in whole with no warning or consideration for those that may have spent many hours and many hundreds of hours buying/building/painting/converting said army.

When it was "squatted" is irrelevant to the fact that it was "squatted". Gw "squatted" Genestealer cultists int he switch to third. LATD was "squatted" when Codex:Armageddon was nixed. So yes different things have been "squatted" at different times in GW's historical timeline.

So whats your point?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Mr. Bombadidaloo wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:And yes that SOB cosplay costume was one of the best 40K costumes to date...

Does anyone have a picture? I am both intrigued and saddened, the latter because I apparently missed out.

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Dogs of War for Fantasy.

Kanluwen wrote:
I'm not sure what you really expect in that regards. Codex: Craftworld Eldar is gone, and you don't see them constantly complaining about outdated codexes that have been updated do you?

Eldar still have a 40K army do they not? SO most figs that would have comprised a craftworld army can still be played in some form of Eldar force. Eldar=Eldar.

There is no "cult" list of any form that can be used to represent chaos or tyranid cultists, thus the switch is far more jarring and costly then for the craftworld example above, but I would have no objections to any Craftworld Eldar player complaining just as loud.


If I purchased and built/converted a genestealer cult for example I did so for the fluff/them of an "insidious cult". I am now left with the choice of having to switch complete army theme/comp to play a tyranid army (making half my models useless) or an "evil looking IG army" making my genestealers useless, or going out and buying stuff to make two armies (IG and Tyranids) that I didn't want to play in the first place, IF I wanted to play IG I would have played IG, same for tyranids.

Regardless, most people are not bothered by such things until it is there army that is "squatted". Keep your fingers crossed...

CT GAMER wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
I'm not sure what you really expect in that regards. Codex: Craftworld Eldar is gone, and you don't see them constantly complaining about outdated codexes that have been updated do you?

Eldar still have a 40K army do they not? SO most figs that would have comprised a craftworld army can still be played in some form of Eldar force. Eldar=Eldar.

There is no "cult" list of any form that can be used to represent chaos or tyranid cultists, thus the switch is far more jarring and costly then for the craftworld example above, but I would have no objections to any Craftworld Eldar player complaining just as loud.


If I purchased and built/converted a genestealer cult for example I did so for the fluff/them of an "insidious cult". I am now left with the choice of having to switch complete army theme/comp to play a tyranid army (making half my models useless) or an "evil looking IG army" making my genestealers useless, or going out and buying stuff to make two armies (IG and Tyranids) that I didn't want to play in the first place, IF I wanted to play IG I would have played IG, same for tyranids.

Regardless, most people are not bothered by such things until it is there army that is "squatted". Keep your fingers crossed...

Except it wasn't technically an army by itself.

It was a sublist to the Codex proper.

I guess the better way to make a comparison:
There've been PLENTY of sublists in Codexes that have been taken out or made into a more 'codex friendly' list that can be built.

I do not understand the obsession with filling the newer books with things like a Genestealer Cult(which, by the way, is NEVER something you would see on a battlefield, except maybe as cannon fodder herded into battle in front of a Tyranid army or rising up and fighting alongside the Hive invasion proper. In which case--it'd be a unit, NOT a full army in itself.) or Lost and the Damned(which, arguably, would work better for an army of its own--although, I would again see it as a unit choice that could be worked into the codex).

Yes, it sucks that you no longer have the option of playing them with all the special rules you had back then. Everyone's lost some character to their army, it's not just your little five page sublist in the codex that got screwed.

Let's keep in mind that the typical 40K game is not representative of "armies" but rather small detachments and battle groups. "Army" is a term that players use but it's meaning is stretched in this context.

A casual scan of Apocalypse or more appropriately Epic reveals this.

At the scale 40k represents forces of cultists, rebels and so forth are more than suited for the scale of the conflict being represented.

Also since you mention it Inquisitional forces should not be depicted on the 40k battlefield either since the main role they play is hunting down and eliminating the cult type forces you think don't belong. THeir main role isnt to go around fighting eldar and Necorn armies, etc., etc.

GW put a little section in each Inquisital codex with "justifications" for why siad forces would be fighting other armies almost as if they had to convince themselves releasing such armies was a good idea as much as convince us. It was weak justification.

Now they could have included proper/fleshed out cult lists in he back of the Inquisition codexes so that people could field decent representations of the traditional and most common enemies that said forces would be dealing with (and they did give it a half-hearted nod with what was included) but they definitely missed the boat on what could have added a ton of flavor and potential for characterful battles and deeper campaign and scenario play by including such lists.

Lets hope they come to their senses when they redo the Inquisition codexes and return to a more flavorful and varied representation of the 40K universe...

Here's hoping WH don't get nixed, my brother just spent a lot on them over the festive period.

Of course, it could just be a problem with the site (although the FLGS I buy from doesn't have the 10-Sister box either...).

WH don't need removing from 40k though, they seem to be a very fun army to play. Unfortunately they're one of the more niche armies, and if sales are poor who knows what will happen.

I love my WH, though if they went plastic I'd have to do more than "glue on the backpack" which would drastically increase build time!

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Let me check with my LATD and GEnestealer cult armies...

Yup, both "squatted".

I'm not sure white dwarf armies count. Otherwise kroot mercs are in there too.

LATD was in Codex:Armageddon and Genestealer cult was in Codex Tyranids (2nd edition). Neither was a "WD army".

Lost and the Damned were in Codex: Eye of Terror, not Codex: Armageddon. In general, armies from campaign supplements don't stick around-- the Black Templars proved popular enough that they got their own Codex, but they are very much an exception to the rule!

Fetterkey wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Let me check with my LATD and GEnestealer cult armies...

Yup, both "squatted".

I'm not sure white dwarf armies count. Otherwise kroot mercs are in there too.

LATD was in Codex:Armageddon and Genestealer cult was in Codex Tyranids (2nd edition). Neither was a "WD army".

Lost and the Damned were in Codex: Eye of Terror, not Codex: Armageddon. In general, armies from campaign supplements don't stick around-- the Black Templars proved popular enough that they got their own Codex, but they are very much an exception to the rule!

Maybe not as Codecii, but Mechanized Guard and Speed Freaks weren't viable until Codex: Armageddon either, but are still around in some form past that.

holidayhalflife wrote:The owner of FLGS says they are now officially end of line. he can't order any more witch/demon hunters, not even codexes. But this could be a simple case of them going direct only rather than getting squated.

He can't order daemonhunters?!?! My FLGS orders daemonhunters just fine. (of course my FLGS is a GW store so...)

RE: what armies have been squatted?

The are the armies that have had specific rules which no longer have specific rules

2nd ed;
squats
exodites
genestealer cults

armageddon;
salamanders
speed freaks
steel legion

eye of terror;
space wolves 13th co
ulthwe webway strike force
lost and the damned
cadians

codex: craftworld eldar

all the individual chaos legions

White Dwarf;
feral orks
kroot mercs
white scars
iron hands
imperial fists
raven guard
cursed founding chapters
relictors




And now for the justifications/ how you can represent use them nowadays

exodites - were only ever a unit anyway and not a full army, in fact I don't know if models even existed

sallies - are presented well, and very powerfully in the new marine codex

speed freakz - a reasonable version can be done with the new ork codex (everyone is in a trukk or on a bike or in a wagon) if not the exact same rules

steel legion - basically mech guard who can be done easily with the new codex

13th co - can be done reasonably well with the new space wolf codex (logan as leader gives wolf guard as troops, lots of fenrisians, lots of MotW and no vehicles)

ulthwe webway strike force - none of the models were invalidated as they can all be used for standard eldar but the rules went totally kaput

cadians - can be done with the new guard codex

craftworld eldar - none of the models were invalidated as they can all be done in the new codex, decent approximations of ulthwe, iyanden and saim hann can all be done. Biel Tan got a bit shafted but deservedly so and you can run DA as troops for the same effect

chaos legions - varying degrees of ability to be redone with the current chaos codex. Some armies can be done just fine with no models invalidated (black legion, night lords, word bearers) some had lots of models die. All had special rules go bye bye and whilst some can recreate their old rules fairly well others are buggered. But lets not open this can of worms again.

white scars, iron hands, imperial fists, raven guard, etc can all be recreated using the curent marine codex although iron hands are a bit shafted as are white scars (who have a lot more potential for a full codex than dark angels do).

cursed founding chapters are pretty damned squatted but considering practically nobody played them and they had some of the worst rules design ever conceived thats a good thing. Does anyone remember the Minotaurs? str5, t5 and fearless but all your non tank models had to move directly towards the nearest army and assault it if possible. Lotd players can use them as lotd in the current marine dex and everyone else gets to be the current marine dex with nice conversions. Pissed off warp dragons players (possibly the only ones outside lotd that anybody used) can just use shrike and his retinue to recreate their old unit.

relictors - radical inquisitor DH with allied marines or marines with allied radical inquisitor, done.



That leaves squats, kroot mercs, feral orks, genestealer cults, squats and lost and the damned.

squats are squatted, obviously.

theoretically feral ork players could be snakebite players with the new dex but there are no real snakebite units, no boar riders, no pigdoks, no squiggoths, no madboyz. I guess they're waiting for the new ork codex in 2016 to finally get to use their army again. squatted.

kroot merc players can use their kroot with tau but none of their conversions, I believe there is an apocalypse data sheet. If you played kroot mercs and tau you couyld wheel out the mercs for apoc but if you just played kroot mercs, squatted.

genestealer cults - you can use the models as renegade IG which is largely what the list was comprised of anyway, IG plus genestealers, plus hybrids plus magus and patriarchs. With present IG hybrids (ogryn or rough riders) magii (primaris psyker) and the IG units can all be done but no place for a patriarch or purestrain stealers. Like other posters have said the concept wasn't really well fleshed out to begin with consisting of bolting two armies together with only 3 new units. And whilst the fluff is cool it doesn't stretch well to a 40k scale. Squatted.

Lost and the damned - after orks, rebel planets, apostate cults, IG that have fallen in with dark forces, etc should be the most common threat the imperium has to deal with. Lost and the damned have a ton of potential modelling, art, concept and unit wise. Like genestealer cults they are basically several armies combined together but unlike genestealer cults they combine chaos marines, IG, daemons and 5 of their own units with lots of potential for adding their own original units (daemon engines, mad chaos preachers and human sorcerors, infiltrating cultist demolition teams, chaos hounds). Because they largely use models from other ranges you can still use most of their models and play your guard as traitors but this requires you to at minimum play 2 armies if not 3. Squatted.

Sisters could go with plastic models, that would really bring joy to the world. Recent plastic kits have proven that plastic tabards and robes aren't that hard too pull off.

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:RE: what armies have been squatted?

The are the armies that have had specific rules which no longer have specific rules

Given what we have heard of the new tyranid codex, 'vanguard' armies are gone. I.e. broodlord/lictor/genestealer armies, the first signs of Tyranid invasion. As you can't take anything that would be deemed vanguard as a HQ.

Funny, we saw those SoB datasheets for the FW Apoc book; you'd of thought that if they were being phased out GW would have cut that.

GW has little sway over FW.

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:genestealer cults - you can use the models as renegade IG which is largely what the list was comprised of anyway, IG plus genestealers, plus hybrids plus magus and patriarchs. With present IG hybrids (ogryn or rough riders) magii (primaris psyker) and the IG units can all be done but no place for a patriarch or purestrain stealers. Like other posters have said the concept wasn't really well fleshed out to begin with consisting of bolting two armies together with only 3 new units. And whilst the fluff is cool it doesn't stretch well to a 40k scale. Squatted.

As a former Cult player, I have to disagree that the fluff doesn't stretch to 40k scale. Over the years there have been loads of references to entire hives, or even planets, that have had to be destroyed because ground forces (Marine, Inquisition and IG) just couldn't contain a Genestealer cult uprising. The closest unit to hybrids would actually be the Psyker battle squad as they could take powers and were (mostly) not much better in combat or shooting than the cultists. It may not have been a big, or complicated list... but damn it was fun to play. It's just the sort of force that could be resurrected by FW without needing to produce too much in the way of miniatures.

Still that's all a moot point as my beloved cult got Squatted :(


Automatically Appended Next Post:

holidayhalflife wrote:

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:RE: what armies have been squatted?

The are the armies that have had specific rules which no longer have specific rules

Given what we have heard of the new tyranid codex, 'vanguard' armies are gone. I.e. broodlord/lictor/genestealer armies, the first signs of Tyranid invasion. As you can't take anything that would be deemed vanguard as a HQ.

That's a real shame as the whole vanguard thing has always been major part of the whole hive fleet strategy. I can only assume they have decided that the hive fleets just pick a direction and mindlessly munch on anything that is in it's path now rather than probing for the next best invasion site?

I was just thinking about this...with battle missions coming out in march it may be possible that the our precious S.O.B's may be getting a plastic kit for then? It would make sense seeing as the only model that has been 'shown' has been the ork dread. They also mention 'other kits' being released. Fingers crossed everyone!

Back on topic...

Rumors abound that SOB and DH will be a combined codex. It may be that GW has limited supply on models that dont sell much and have no interest in issuing more as new models are in the future.

I very much doubt the army is being squatted.

Is another hottie!

There is my Combi-Melta!!!

BrookM wrote:Boxed set could merely be phased out, no reason for alarm just yet. All boxed options are now available as blisters instead.

Actually, I've heard that GW is going the OTHER way with their offerings - fewer blisters, more boxes.

I think Sisters of Battle are an awesome concept, but I have to say, the models need work. I absolutely love Saint Celestine, the Living Saint, but as for the other models, who wants to play an army full of mannish-looking women?

Just saying, they could make these models more feminine.

Solorg wrote:I think Sisters of Battle are an awesome concept, but I have to say, the models need work. I absolutely love Saint Celestine, the Living Saint, but as for the other models, who wants to play an army full of mannish-looking women?

Just saying, they could make these models more feminine.

Dunno how you can make power armor look more feminine and the sisters repentia have no clothes on at all and wear S&M masks...

I wouldn't say the sky is falling just yet. It's probably just a reorganizing of the webstores. As one poster posted, they're still available as a box, just not where they're supposed to be. I won't say this is concrete evidence of them getting plastic models in the near future, but you never know what they'll do for the Battle Missions release in March.

I'd guess they'll just show up on the GW site again in a few days. I thought Witch Hunters were direct-only already anyway. I sincerely doubt they're getting phased out, especially with all the rumors swirling about them.

agnosto,

Don't get me wrong - I love the Sisters concept. And take a look around the net, you will find some very feminine and beautiful Sisters Art out there, that's for sure.



But as for the models, every face is angry and contorted. And look at those square, mannish jawlines. Big, buff shoulder pads (masculine). And, of course, let's not forget a friggin huge (not feminine) boltgun or whatever modeled on right in front of the female form. Three words for you:

YUCK, YUCK, YUCK!

I guess what I'm saying is that the army would be much improved if the models came to be more in line with the fan art.

I approve of:

http://derangedfirebird.deviantart.com/art/Littlest-sister-of-battle-149322164

http://b-at-at.deviantart.com/art/Sister-of-battle-143840970

http://malum-bathory.deviantart.com/art/Sisters-of-Battle-141999660

trougedoor122 wrote:

holidayhalflife wrote:The owner of FLGS says they are now officially end of line. he can't order any more witch/demon hunters, not even codexes. But this could be a simple case of them going direct only rather than getting squated.

He can't order daemonhunters?!?! My FLGS orders daemonhunters just fine. (of course my FLGS is a GW store so...)

Well, might just be because I'm special and GW loves me, but I had no trouble ordering sisters and seraphim today for my store, from GW Trade Sales.

Yeah, but Mik...you're actually competent!

9/10 times, these "my store can't order XXXX, he says it's the end of the line!" is just hiding the fact that they f'd up somewhere in ordering.

Solorg wrote:agnosto,

I approve of:

http://derangedfirebird.deviantart.com/art/Littlest-sister-of-battle-149322164

http://b-at-at.deviantart.com/art/Sister-of-battle-143840970

http://malum-bathory.deviantart.com/art/Sisters-of-Battle-141999660

I'm sorry, but that art is awful. Bad proportions, perspective, and an overall feel of generic anime-inspired garbage. I like the current Sisters design just fine, but I agree they could use new models with more feminine features. Their jawlines are a bit "mannish" I'll admit. However, they've aged far better than most models of their age; a lot better than the Dark Eldar, that's for sure.

Solorg wrote:But as for the models, every face is angry and contorted. And look at those square, mannish jawlines. Big, buff shoulder pads (masculine). And, of course, let's not forget a friggin huge (not feminine) boltgun or whatever modeled on right in front of the female form. Three words for you:

YUCK, YUCK, YUCK!

I guess what I'm saying is that the army would be much improved if the models came to be more in line with the fan art.

Yeah, the model really needs a rework; love the lipstick by the way.

That said, they are wearing power armor. I have no problem with them looking feminine, at least then people will stop ripping on Tau about being anime and focus on the hookers of the emprah. You could paint a big sign on the side of their transports saying "the emprah is my pimp" or something.

Brother SRM wrote:
I'm sorry, but that art is awful. Bad proportions, perspective, and an overall feel of generic anime-inspired garbage. I like the current Sisters design just fine, but I agree they could use new models with more feminine features. Their jawlines are a bit "mannish" I'll admit. However, they've aged far better than most models of their age; a lot better than the Dark Eldar, that's for sure.

Agreed.

The last thing the SOB need is to be re-sculpted into boobie-fetish anime crap. I'm sick of anime. Put a fork in it, it's lame, and not every female model needs to have exposed breasts and a porno stance to be feminine.

They are nuns that have taken up arms, they aren't nor do I hope they ever become "girls gone wild 40k style..." Buy some daemonettes if you like giggling and looking at "the boobies111"

And Solorg could you have found a worse painted SOB model to use as your example?


As for art this is tops in my book:

Glad to see so many others are concerned. SoB may be my only chance to get the wife to play!

Also, I think the models look awesome! They're hot..but angry. The only models I truly hate are the Inquisitors and Dialogus. Is it just me or does Dialogus look like Marcy from Charlie Brown?

Follow the link and compare: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat30047&prodId=prod1110153



While we are on the subject...anyone know of any cool "counts as models" for SoB?

Solorg wrote:agnosto,

Don't get me wrong - I love the Sisters concept. And take a look around the net, you will find some very feminine and beautiful Sisters Art out there, that's for sure.



But as for the models, every face is angry and contorted. And look at those square, mannish jawlines. Big, buff shoulder pads (masculine). And, of course, let's not forget a friggin huge (not feminine) boltgun or whatever modeled on right in front of the female form. Three words for you:

YUCK, YUCK, YUCK!

I guess what I'm saying is that the army would be much improved if the models came to be more in line with the fan art.

I approve of:

http://derangedfirebird.deviantart.com/art/Littlest-sister-of-battle-149322164

http://b-at-at.deviantart.com/art/Sister-of-battle-143840970

http://malum-bathory.deviantart.com/art/Sisters-of-Battle-141999660

I'm sorry but I could not agree with you less.

I not only like but love the current sisters figures. Tey are easily the best basic troop miniature of any army in the game. The pose, proportions and lack of exaggeration pout them as among the more realistic looking figures in GW's range plus they have a well thought through and executed design, plenty of detail and just are generally great. They don't look mannish to me at all (okay, the jawline is a bit square and could use work but otherwise they look like women to me).

The only stinkers in the line are the repentia which have bondage gear, ludicrously big swords, massive breasts and generally are everything wrong that the basic sisters get so right.

Why do they have to be beautiful? Why do they have to be feminine? They're nuns! Femininity and beauty are not considerations of theirs. So long as the figures are recognisably and decently proportioned women in ornate armour I'm happy.

The boltgun looks big because it is the same size as a marines but carried by a smaller figure, the shoulders are big because a) the 80's when women did indeed wear big shoulder pads youngster and b ) power armour and trust me in person compared to a marine those shoulders are practically tiny. Finally why can't they be angry? They HATE you! They HATE you and that is why they fight you. They're not calm and dispassionate they're angry and full of fury. They should look angry.

As for the artwork you posted, uninspired generic pseudo-manga crap the lot of it. The first one is okay basically fixing the jaw and downsizing the pads (both of which would be fine with me) but keeping the existing iconic look but the other two are horrid. Especially the last one. The last one doesn't even look like a nun, she looks like a star wars bounty hunter.

Not everything has to be slinky and sexy.

I like the current line as well. Compared to a lot of other 40k lines, they look surprisingly professional. The models I like least, in fact, were several of the C:WH releases like the canoness with point chest armor and a torch on her back...

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:

Solorg wrote:agnosto,

Don't get me wrong - I love the Sisters concept. And take a look around the net, you will find some very feminine and beautiful Sisters Art out there, that's for sure.



But as for the models, every face is angry and contorted. And look at those square, mannish jawlines. Big, buff shoulder pads (masculine). And, of course, let's not forget a friggin huge (not feminine) boltgun or whatever modeled on right in front of the female form. Three words for you:

YUCK, YUCK, YUCK!

I guess what I'm saying is that the army would be much improved if the models came to be more in line with the fan art.

I approve of:

http://derangedfirebird.deviantart.com/art/Littlest-sister-of-battle-149322164

http://b-at-at.deviantart.com/art/Sister-of-battle-143840970

http://malum-bathory.deviantart.com/art/Sisters-of-Battle-141999660

I'm sorry but I could not agree with you less.

I not only like but love the current sisters figures. Tey are easily the best basic troop miniature of any army in the game. The pose, proportions and lack of exaggeration pout them as among the more realistic looking figures in GW's range plus they have a well thought through and executed design, plenty of detail and just are generally great. They don't look mannish to me at all (okay, the jawline is a bit square and could use work but otherwise they look like women to me).

The only stinkers in the line are the repentia which have bondage gear, ludicrously big swords, massive breasts and generally are everything wrong that the basic sisters get so right.

Why do they have to be beautiful? Why do they have to be feminine? They're nuns! Femininity and beauty are not considerations of theirs. So long as the figures are recognisably and decently proportioned women in ornate armour I'm happy.

The boltgun looks big because it is the same size as a marines but carried by a smaller figure, the shoulders are big because a) the 80's when women did indeed wear big shoulder pads youngster and b ) power armour and trust me in person compared to a marine those shoulders are practically tiny. Finally why can't they be angry? They HATE you! They HATE you and that is why they fight you. They're not calm and dispassionate they're angry and full of fury. They should look angry.

As for the artwork you posted, uninspired generic pseudo-manga crap the lot of it. The first one is okay basically fixing the jaw and downsizing the pads (both of which would be fine with me) but keeping the existing iconic look but the other two are horrid. Especially the last one. The last one doesn't even look like a nun, she looks like a star wars bounty hunter.

Not everything has to be slinky and sexy.

I couldn't agree with you more, well said. For those who want more feminen mini's why? If you want big boobs and skinny girls, just go out and buy Image comic books. (are they even around? I stopped reading comics for 15 years sadly due to them being to expensive.) What I am starting to read, by posters who want sexier mini's remind me of Image comics all over again. OH NO, defeniently don't what that.

Bad Sisters Art

Solorg wrote:agnosto,
I guess what I'm saying is that the army would be much improved if the models came to be more in line with the fan art.

I approve of:

http://derangedfirebird.deviantart.com/art/Littlest-sister-of-battle-149322164

http://b-at-at.deviantart.com/art/Sister-of-battle-143840970

http://malum-bathory.deviantart.com/art/Sisters-of-Battle-141999660

Good Sisters Art




all the art posted under bad art completely mis reperensts the the theme of the sisters of battle and the idea of Power Armour. Even if its often of higher quality than Marines its still power armour and therfore shoudl at least look the size of bulky carapace.

@SgtRoadkill

Nice pics, man. Very cool!

Well, first off, very nice pics! Second off, should Sisters be beautiful? I agree with you that they need not, since RL nuns are as often ugly fugglies as not - THAT'S if you want more realism! But I don't! Here's how I see it - the Sisters are young because they die young - so the SoB are mostly between ages of 16 and 19 I figure, so chances are they're hot like Joan of Arc. If you want 40yr old+ mannish nuns, that's OK, I respect that, but I think there's room in the hobby for both. Now, I do agree that somehow, there isn't a lot of beauty in 40K to begin with - that's true - but the main draw of Sisters is: "I can have an all-female army, that would be AWESOME."

Orks have the gorilla thing going, Tau have the anime spaceman thing, Nids have the "Alien" thing and Necrons have the "Terminator" thing going on. Sisters have the "I have an all-girl army" thing going on. In other words, any guy's dream army. Hot. Take that away and you may as well play Space Marines.

So with femininity being the whole reason for Sisters, why would I want an army full of ugly women when I can have an army of hot feminine women? One draws more new players than the other, just saying.

Power Armor needs to be bulky? So you say! But in the future, I am sure they have ways to make armour light but strong. Heck, in our century we have Kevlar, so by the year 40K they would have to have some really awesome light-weight armour. If it must be 4+, so be it.

If I want bulky, I'd just pry the heads off my Space Marines and add female heads (or put lipstick on the Space Marine faces and keep the mannish jaws and scowls). What with all the power armor and tanks and such, they look an awful lot like Space Marines already.

Solrog read osm eof the Sisters background the in depth stuff in like Codex Sisters of Battles and the background. Some of the sisters get really old, especially the Celestines and Canoeness, althoguh onc ethey start geting creaky they tend ot end up on organ duty or somthing.
i don't deny that younger sisters woudl be the bulk of the battle sisters basice units, but there would be plenty of lolder sisters about.

Also ANy Girl or woman who proves herself capable as part of the the military arm of sorotias would vbe used so fugly and pretyt woudl all be included. so a good mix of features would be the ideal way. and IMO majory of them should be wearing helmets but that sjust me.

Solorg wrote:Power Armor needs to be bulky? So you say! But in the future, I am sure they have ways to make armour light but strong. Heck, in our century we have Kevlar, so by the year 40K they would have to have some really awesome light-weight armour. If it must be 4+, so be it.

Kevlar isn't Power Armor... It's Flak, at best.

I see nothing wrong with making the Sisters a 4+ save, but I'd prefer it to be with the current models. The current models do look like ornate but functional amor for the most part. My personal opinion is that it's power armor, but has a lot less features and is a lot less resilient than Space Marine armor. "Power Armor = 3+" is just a weird 'GW-ism' that's never worked for me.

I wouldn't mind some resculpted heads on minis that are pretty close to the current ones (I.E. plastics). The hair is probably more of a 'key feature' than the scowl and jaw, in my mind. To me, the SoB look female, but also look very businesslike. They're not here to inflame men's passions, but to flame them.

Of course, if I was actively building and playing SoB these days I'd also be fielding Exorcists that look more like rocket launchers than pipe organs*. I like the over-the-top stuff, but to me that's best left to the Inquisition and Special characters, not the rank and file troops.

* I made one for an old Rhino with Landspeeder and Immolator parts. I might consider an idea I had where a Rhino is built with a vertically extended rear section detailed to look kind of like sub-launched missile tubes, with a bunch of cells each containing a large missile.

Davor wrote:Why do SM have to be bulky and SoB be sleek? It goes against the fluff of what they are supose to be. Power Armour is suppose to be bulky.

The battle sister in the old RT book was armored but feminine.

FlightMek wrote:@SgtRoadkill

Nice pics, man. Very cool!

Agreed.

You guys are hilarious. I'm really trying to remember where this thread went from "Sisters models are missing!" to "16 year olds are HOT! Also, 14 is the age of consent!"

Could we get this back on topic? Or at least back to the idea of posting what we think new models could like.

Anime girls, SRM, bug-eyes and all.

"Death to the Heretic! Burn the Mutant! For the Emperor! Uguu~"






...but really, starlight on Warseer is saying that this doesn't mean anything at the moment, but we'll see how it turns out.

I stongly suspect that sales of the the boxed set are being reduced as a build up for new kits (hopefully plastic) this year, it seems to follow the same pattern as their other recent releases as they have already stopped shipping the 'dex to third parties (apparently).

I would love to see plastic sisters, with similar sculpts to the current line but maybe a choice of heads.

In response to the off-topic - After the hormonal treatments etc that they would doubtless get, the sisters are unlikely to look "slim" and anime like.
Power armour is always going to be fairly bulky in order to stand a chance against armour piercing shots, most 40k weaponry would cut straight through Kevlar. Artificer armour and well crafter power armour can be thin (look at Dante) but you wouldn't kit your basic troops in such difficult to produce armour.
I think SOB look absolutely fine apart from the lack of customisation, and anyone who thinks that they should look more "feminine" should go out and get themselves a top-shelf magazine and stop whining.

Also, Space Marines are likely to be even younger than sisters as it is best to implant recruits with the gene seed before they have gone into the later stages of puberty, and the new marine can be on the battlefield after just a year!

Grim.Badger wrote:In response to the off-topic - After the hormonal treatments etc that they would doubtless get, the sisters are unlikely to look "slim" and anime like.

Does Sororitas training actually include physical augmentations? I thought they just mindraped them with Imperial Creed propaganda.

yeah Agamemnon i thought that was the case as well adn they jus thad bad ass power armour ot make them hard, its was why they still hav eth same S + T as a guardsman.

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:RE: what armies have been squatted?

The are the armies that have had specific rules which no longer have specific rules

What has been "squatted" from Fantasy? Whole armies include Chaos Dwarves (and their hobgoblins) and Dogs of War. Smaller armies include the fairly recent Kislev, and there are lots of individual things like Fimir and Zoats, though they go back a few years now.

I think the main problem is that so many individual figures get squatted though, the Skaven Doomwheel was effectively written out of the game and then recently returned wasn't it? Many other things are not so fortunate, many models with certain weapon combinations are no longer useful and the only answer seems to be to saw them uo to convert them which most people are not going to do with their most treasured models. Is if right that there are no longer any hand flamers?

HOLD ON HERE!

Please keep this thread on topic.

I'll have a go at 'cleaning it up' later, but seriously guys, WTF?

Consider this an official warning.

Users who ignore it will suffer the consequences.

There is officially NO SoB 10x unit anymore. Not for real, not by mistake, not at all. Hopefully - as some of you have said - it just means they're going plastic. I am so close to getting the wife into them too.

While we're on the topic anyone know good conversion ideas?

FlightMek wrote:There is officially NO SoB 10x unit anymore. Not for real, not by mistake, not at all. Hopefully - as some of you have said - it just means they're going plastic. I am so close to getting the wife into them too.

While we're on the topic anyone know good conversion ideas?

Funny, because I was just able to order one straight from GW not even fifteen minutes ago to paint up for a friend.

Solorg wrote:I approve of:

http://derangedfirebird.deviantart.com/art/Littlest-sister-of-battle-149322164

http://b-at-at.deviantart.com/art/Sister-of-battle-143840970

http://malum-bathory.deviantart.com/art/Sisters-of-Battle-141999660

The second link doesn't bother me, but hell no to one and two.

Unlike Brother SRM I won't come out and say anime is "garbage", but that's really not the look they need to go for with Sisters of Battle. I really hate it when people think that since they're women they have to look like super models with guns, I much prefer the "business" look they have to them now.

As for the Sisters models becoming plastic...personally I hope they get Jes to do them if that's the case, as he did the metals IIRC and I really like the metals.

Frankly, if they're going to be plastic...I can see them just scanning in the metals and converting to plastic.

That would be nice, but usually when they put out plastic kits they're entirely new sculpts, no?

Piranha and Skyray say sup, Sid


Automatically Appended Next Post:
But I dunno. It seems like it's a 50/50 thing. We've seen some plastic kits that are completely new(Greatswords) and on the flipside--we've seen the Piranha, Skyray, Baneblade that have basically been scanned in or slightly retooled.

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:

The only stinkers in the line are the repentia which have bondage gear, ludicrously big swords, massive breasts and generally are everything wrong that the basic sisters get so right.

hehe I painted mine as though they are wearing tights underneath.

Solorg wrote:Well, first off, very nice pics! Second off, should Sisters be beautiful? I agree with you that they need not, since RL nuns are as often ugly fugglies as not - THAT'S if you want more realism! But I don't! Here's how I see it - the Sisters are young because they die young - so the SoB are mostly between ages of 16 and 19 I figure, so chances are they're hot like Joan of Arc. If you want 40yr old+ mannish nuns, that's OK, I respect that, but I think there's room in the hobby for both. Now, I do agree that somehow, there isn't a lot of beauty in 40K to begin with - that's true - but the main draw of Sisters is: "I can have an all-female army, that would be AWESOME."

Orks have the gorilla thing going, Tau have the anime spaceman thing, Nids have the "Alien" thing and Necrons have the "Terminator" thing going on. Sisters have the "I have an all-girl army" thing going on. In other words, any guy's dream army. Hot. Take that away and you may as well play Space Marines.

So with femininity being the whole reason for Sisters, why would I want an army full of ugly women when I can have an army of hot feminine women? One draws more new players than the other, just saying.

Power Armor needs to be bulky? So you say! But in the future, I am sure they have ways to make armour light but strong. Heck, in our century we have Kevlar, so by the year 40K they would have to have some really awesome light-weight armour. If it must be 4+, so be it.

If I want bulky, I'd just pry the heads off my Space Marines and add female heads (or put lipstick on the Space Marine faces and keep the mannish jaws and scowls). What with all the power armor and tanks and such, they look an awful lot like Space Marines already.

Why do I get the impression that the kind of models you want are the kind only slaanesh would approve of. :<

I love my sisters ( though I totally hate the lack of female variety in the GW francise) , and as a female player I have to admit, I appreciate the fact that they are awesome, powerful individuals that haven't been degraded to the level of pole dancers in power armor.

Mind you seraphim are my favourite, because they tend to be more graceful etc. without being skanky, but they are seraphim (ie. angels) and the others are battle sisters. So I assume thats part of the design.

Kanluwen wrote:

FlightMek wrote:There is officially NO SoB 10x unit anymore. Not for real, not by mistake, not at all. Hopefully - as some of you have said - it just means they're going plastic. I am so close to getting the wife into them too.

While we're on the topic anyone know good conversion ideas?

Funny, because I was just able to order one straight from GW not even fifteen minutes ago to paint up for a friend.

You ordered the squad box? The one that is $40+? Care to enlighten us? I don't see it anywhere...

Interesting, both the Witch and Daemon Hunters codex on Maelstrom have their stock level updated to "as stock lasts" meaning once sold out they won't sell them any more.

Why do I get the impression that the kind of models you want are the kind only slaanesh would approve of. :<

Not only that but he seems to make a lot of assumptions...like when he insinuated that we're all granny fetishists for liking the current Sisters line, that all Sisters are between 16-19 (I was under the impression they were all way older and only appeared as young as they did because of rejuvenation drugs...which is why there's white hair all over the place), and that the whole point of Sisters is to be the "hot" army, that the army would sell more if they were all big-breasted anime girls with big hips and form-fitting armor, etc.

If I were a woman I'd find all of it a little insulting, to say the least.

I'm glad to see that most people think Sisters are awesome, though, and for all the right reasons.

Piranha and Skyray say sup, Sid

Well yeah, I guess it happens with FW models all the time now, but have they ever done that when replacing a metal kit?

Not really, when going from metal to plastic they usually attempt to one-up the old designs. Just look at the plastic Dread, the upcoming Deff Dread and the uhm.. Minotaurs.

FlightMek wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

FlightMek wrote:There is officially NO SoB 10x unit anymore. Not for real, not by mistake, not at all. Hopefully - as some of you have said - it just means they're going plastic. I am so close to getting the wife into them too.

While we're on the topic anyone know good conversion ideas?

Funny, because I was just able to order one straight from GW not even fifteen minutes ago to paint up for a friend.

You ordered the squad box? The one that is $40+? Care to enlighten us? I don't see it anywhere...

I linked it on the first page of this very thread.

Considering GW will never phase out assassins, until you see assassin temple operatives as an option in a Space Marine or IG codex you dont need to worry about WH or DH being phased out.

seriously.

That box set is older than dark eldar sculpts and if I recall has few poses, its prolly still available from collectors, or as blisters, and I am guessing they are updating the molds.

Balance wrote:
I see nothing wrong with making the Sisters a 4+ save, but I'd prefer it to be with the current models. The current models do look like ornate but functional amor for the most part. My personal opinion is that it's power armor, but has a lot less features and is a lot less resilient than Space Marine armor. "Power Armor = 3+" is just a weird 'GW-ism' that's never worked for me.

I think part of it is that there is a broad definition to power armor. If we look at a more detailed game "Inquisitor" the difference between power armor space marines wear and power armor everyone else wears is mostly a matter of feature. Space marines have resperators and environmental protection, SOB don't. Space marines have thick ablative plates designed for added kinetic protection, SOB don't. Space Marine armor can be plated with various materials to better absorb the damage, of las, flame, and plasma weapons, SOB don't. Space Marines are out and out biggers and with the strange "heroic" proportions GW uses it makes them look bulkier than they actually be. But 40k is more abstract and generalizing than "Inquisitor" and all the distinctions are lost. So while SM might more appropriately be 2.9+ save and sisters of battle 3.5+ save... they have to be rounded down to the same thing, due to the limitations of being based around a single d6 roll. Thus in 40k the differences are neglegable and moot.

Another way you can think of it is if you stripped down power armor of its features its effective carapace armor with a low level energy field across the surface of the armor (kinda like this: http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Polarized_hull_plating ) and servos to assist the wearer to move in it. Thats whats SOB have.

The difference between stripped down power armor and carapce armor is the small nuclear power plant on the back of the solider that allows for the charged field that adds protection and powers the assisting servos.

Actually, I've heard that GW is going the OTHER way with their offerings - fewer blisters, more boxes.

People are just hearing this or didn't know it at all? Really? GW has been eliminating blisters and reducing the number of items in their product line for years. This trend started at least four or five years ago. It's not new and is not news. Eliminating blisters in favor of plastic box sets has been ongoing for years and will continue in 2010 based on product announcements already made.

As for the comments on the faces of the Battle Sisters being hardened, have you ever seen the face of actual people, male or female, who lives a "hard" lifestyle? GW can't win here, if they sculpt the faces to be a little hard and severe some customers will complain they are not feminine enough, but if they sculpt them to be soft and attractive some customers will dislike the models because they are not "realistic" or "edgy". They can't please everyone with any model, so why should Sisters of Battle be any different?

Back on topic...
I believe that stockists can no longer get the Witch Hunters Codex - and it doesn't seem to be on the GW site now. This usually means a new Codex in about 6 months. Of course whether there'll be any SoB in it is another matter...

One reason the SoB and Grey Knights ranges have been left alone for so long is that they are already beautiful sculpts, well to most customers anyway. There hasn't been much incentive to update them because they already have good aesthetics and are not major product lines. Moving them to plastic would be expensive and risky without significant planning to ensure they become less "fringe" product lines when they get relaunched.

Kanluwen wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
I'm not sure what you really expect in that regards. Codex: Craftworld Eldar is gone, and you don't see them constantly complaining about outdated codexes that have been updated do you?

Eldar still have a 40K army do they not? SO most figs that would have comprised a craftworld army can still be played in some form of Eldar force. Eldar=Eldar.

There is no "cult" list of any form that can be used to represent chaos or tyranid cultists, thus the switch is far more jarring and costly then for the craftworld example above, but I would have no objections to any Craftworld Eldar player complaining just as loud.


If I purchased and built/converted a genestealer cult for example I did so for the fluff/them of an "insidious cult". I am now left with the choice of having to switch complete army theme/comp to play a tyranid army (making half my models useless) or an "evil looking IG army" making my genestealers useless, or going out and buying stuff to make two armies (IG and Tyranids) that I didn't want to play in the first place, IF I wanted to play IG I would have played IG, same for tyranids.

Regardless, most people are not bothered by such things until it is there army that is "squatted". Keep your fingers crossed...

Except it wasn't technically an army by itself.

It was a sublist to the Codex proper.

Sort of like how SoBs are a "sublist" to the WH codex proper? Mark my words, if WH and DH get combined into a single codex then SoB will almost certainly cease to exist as a viable army. Codex: Inquistion (AKA Codex: Grey Knights) won't allow you to field a pure sisters army any more than Codex: CSM allows a pure Thousand Sons army.

Brimstone before he passed away assured me that we'd see the Inquisition less prominant when Witch hunters and Daemonhunters got updated in their separate respective codices. Brimstone was one of the few consistently reliable people for rumors and was in the know.

I think we might see some units common to both, but I'm sure they won't be in one book.

As far as the models go, the biggest reason Grey Knights and Sisters have not been updated into plastic is because the models in general have a high amount of depth to the models, as well as some undercuts that will require some reworking of details.

Sisters of battle for example, the most GW could hope for without reworking is a single piece body with a separate head and with forearms and forward connected to guns and attach at the elbows to the rest of the model. This makes for either a very limited number of poses or requires reworking.

Grey Knights, all the script and text embedded into the armor, will have to be better thought out since it has to be set straight on to the direction the model is pulled from the mold.

Both deserve plastics but have detail issues preventing it. GW will rework them and we will see them eventually.

Ugh... double post... *lowers head in shame*

aka_mythos wrote:Ugh... double post... *lowers head in shame*

It's not you, I've been having trouble with that problem today as well. Something is up with the server.

GW has already stated that Inquisition will be less prominent when they revisit WH and DH. Their current prominence is related to the release of the Inquisitor RPG/skirmish game that was released years ago. That will not be the case when the associated armies are revised, whenever that will be.

this may be a rumour but i was talking to the manager of my local gw and he says that there will be a new dark eldar codex released this year, and maybe tau within 2010-11. maybe the witch hunters will receive a glorious rebirth as well. personally i hope that just the battle sisters re-released but that's just me. sorry

aka_mythos wrote:
Grey Knights, all the script and text embedded into the armor, will have to be better thought out since it has to be set straight on to the direction the model is pulled from the mold.

Both deserve plastics but have detail issues preventing it. GW will rework them and we will see them eventually.

Have you seen the Space Wolves plastics? There's embedded text and amounts of detail that I would have thought were impossible a few years ago. I think they're definitely ready to do Grey Knights in plastic. 3-ups have been seen by Stickmonkey over on Warseer, whose rumor list I have quoted and put into it's own thread.

All this thread has done is remind me that I want my Dawn of Aweseome: SoulStormz!!1! sister avatar from BrotherSRM.

As bribe:

Brother SRM wrote:

aka_mythos wrote:
Grey Knights, all the script and text embedded into the armor, will have to be better thought out since it has to be set straight on to the direction the model is pulled from the mold.

Both deserve plastics but have detail issues preventing it. GW will rework them and we will see them eventually.

Have you seen the Space Wolves plastics? There's embedded text and amounts of detail that I would have thought were impossible a few years ago. I think they're definitely ready to do Grey Knights in plastic. 3-ups have been seen by Stickmonkey over on Warseer, whose rumor list I have quoted and put into it's own thread.

I know. What I was saying is why the GK had not been done previously. 2 years ago GW didn't have the capability, now they do.

ShumaGorath wrote:Have they squatted anything since the squats?

Define the word "squatted", and you'll have your answer.

ugh...... manchu thats exactly the kidn of fanart i hate... its to silly to be serious and to serious to be silly... Bleugh.

PLASTIC SOB NOW!!!! i want some palstic femal heads to make arbites with.

I am pretty sure we will see plastic Sisters - pushing plastic instead of metal was touted as one of the reasons for the good financials from GW.

Yes... because plastics give GW a larger profit margin. A $45 metal kit contains $10 worth of metal while a $45 plastic kit contains $5 worth of plastic. All other overhead is effectively the same. The only other difference is the expected sales volume, which metals make up for by having less up front cost.

So of course GW is happy when people buy plastics, they're paying beyond the premium of the metal kits and the mass production drives their cost down.

Yes we will see plastic sisters of battle. I just think all their cloth bits are going to be reworked.

Yeah, I like the variety of figs and army builds you can tinker with. They have the Freakshow stuff with the Inquistion, acroflags, penitent engines, sister repentia & mistress (that's where the older SOBs go), and assassins/death cult. or you could just run exclusive SOBs. Fun army to run and actually tougher with the Faith system than some of the other Psychic powers and they even get a 5+ to resist Psychics thrown at them. Different pose configurations and way easier conversions for sisters if they come out in plastic, much like how Eldar were for Guardians and DAs. It's just so much cheaper for them for plastics and robes are easy to do now for plastic figs. It would be nice to see what new figs they come up with for Sisters (some new special characters would be nice, Ophelia & Ephemeral, hint hint). They did finally come up with official tank kits for the Immolator and the Exorcist with the last codex. I do wish they would have Sister Dreads it would just take a change in the chest plate piece and give another elite or heavy slot, but that might go too much into SM territory (Yeah, I know there's the Throne of Judgement but just one guy. A Sister initiates for like a Scout squad for infiltration and/or another FA squad with maybe bikes because they seriously lack another FA choice(ho boy, Harley Sisters, I can see it now). Just even new rules on existing figs for characters like Confessor Kyrinov & Missionary Jacobus. Hell, they don't even have to make new molds or figs, just playtest and write up some rules for them, it won't cost them much at all. Ugh, I've wishlisted and ranted enough.
I love that first cosplayer SOB, very good authentic looking costume and cute girl. :3

I'm really confused about the whole situation because I just saw that they put the metal squad of 10 back on the gw website apparently. I think metal and plastic both have their upsides and I think plastic sisters would be pretty cool, but I really liked working with the metal as well. Either way, I think they look attractive enough as they are, especially after looking through the pictures in the codex, and honestly don't like anime and think it would be stupid if they made anime-looking SOB. I like how strong yet still attractive they look and am sure that this look will stay the same regardless of what they release. In any case I'm highly anticipating to see what changes they make, if any, to the Witch Hunters and hope they're good ones.

CT GAMER wrote:

As akward as it is to say, this is probably some of the best cosplay I've ever seen. Usually cosplayers come out looking really silly, but this is pretty good.

I think that is an awesome pic, LordofHats.

aka_mythos wrote:Yes... because plastics give GW a larger profit margin. A $45 metal kit contains $10 worth of metal while a $45 plastic kit contains $5 worth of plastic. All other overhead is effectively the same. The only other difference is the expected sales volume, which metals make up for by having less up front cost.

So of course GW is happy when people buy plastics, they're paying beyond the premium of the metal kits and the mass production drives their cost down.

Yes we will see plastic sisters of battle. I just think all their cloth bits are going to be reworked.

You're completely forgetting that plastic injection molds are vastly more expensive to make than the silicon or rubber molds used for metals.

You guys might want to take a look at my post over at Heresy. I see no point in posting this huge thread on all forums I visit but for some of you it might bring some hope from reading it.
Its mostly a compilation of rumours and should be treated as such.

http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?p=560146#post560146

@MCC: That's a lot of stuff.

I think the later "News" of releases is not credible. You've got 4 Codices (BT, DE, GK, & Necrons) starting Sep 2010 and finishing Q1 2011. That's more than a year's worth of releases in 6 months. GW simply isn't going to release that many Codices that quickly, and all of these are historically weak sellers. Sounds like a lot of effort by GW for low return.

The conceptual stuff (No Faith Points, No Allies), I can easily believe. The bit about no Imperial Assassins is rather tougher, given that the 4 temples were defined as canonical in C: Assassins 2E, C: Assassins 3E, and carried forward under the DH & WH books. Going back to a generic RT Imperial Assassin doesn't really make sense.

Most of those rumours are from Stickmonkey. He is a reliable source, but sees things VERY far out from the finished product.

On the other hand, that schedule rumour does not match up with my understanding of things. Last I heard, there was the *possibility* that there will be no further Codecies after Blood Angels as they focus on Fantasy Battle for the rest of the year. At *most* there should only be three 40K armies this year.

there was the *possibility* that there will be no further Codecies after Blood Angel

Happy to say that is not correct.

I don't know if it has come up in the thread yet, but GW has got to have realized the correlation between sales and perceived power levels. All they have to do is make their new concept or army as nasty as whatever is already out or better and it doesn't matter what it is, it'll sell.

@Elric: With WFB8 taking the spotlight, that'll be 3 release months towards the end of the year, but one can expect one more 40k release this year:
- Nids,
- BA,
- missions, and
- TBD.
I'd believe another couple releases for Q1 & Q2 next year, but aren't we due for Apoc 2 as one of them?

I HAVE NEWS!!! There may be a full Inquisitorial REDO by the end of THIS YEAR!!!! Battle Sisters and Daemonhunters are landing! My contact at GW told me this.

This was discussed in the `Codex After Blood Angels' thread a couple of weeks ago

Indeed it was.
Which is why I'm focusing on my Black Templars now, keeping the devoted ladies and their inquisitors aside for a while.
I rather practice with an army that isn't going to change a few months after I start winning my games.

Elric of Grans wrote:This was discussed in the `Codex After Blood Angels' thread a couple of weeks ago

He also told me that the blood angels box would not be released this year.

I was at the LA battle bunker last night, and flipped through the battle missions book, and saw no missions for inquisitors. Maybe it was just me not seeing them (did see them on the back cover though) but that made me worry.

But then the red shirt started going on about the GK greens hes seen in company emails so who knows.

Seems odd to miss them out of battle missions. Maybe (any plans to make them a standalone army notwithstanding) it's because they originally conceived as allies for Imperial Forces.

fallen_wolfborn wrote:

Elric of Grans wrote:This was discussed in the `Codex After Blood Angels' thread a couple of weeks ago

He also told me that the blood angels box would not be released this year.

Even though GW themselves confirmed Blood Angels for April?

=I= and sisters/Grey knight rumors are interesting. Not sure how to take it yet.

Yes, there is nothing for them in Battle Missions. Nor Cities of Death, Apocalypse or Planetstrike. Inquisition always misses out in the supplements.

Elric of Grans wrote:Yes, there is nothing for them in Battle Missions. Nor Cities of Death, Apocalypse or Planetstrike. Inquisition always misses out in the supplements.

Really?

WD December 2009 / Planetstrike / page 37 ( demonhunters, attacker and witchhunters, defender )

2 options for planetstrike, the witchhunters use sororitas or seraphim to raise your morale and lower that of your opponent.
The demonhunters may get and invul save 6+ and may stop demons from assaulting after deepstrike.

1hadhq wrote:
2 options for planetstrike, the witchhunters use sororitas or seraphim to raise your morale and lower that of your opponent.
The demonhunters may get and invul save 6+ and may stop demons from assaulting after deepstrike.

And thats it. Two (2) for the Ordos of the Inquisition in TOTAL. See a problem?

A-P wrote:

1hadhq wrote:
2 options for planetstrike, the witchhunters use sororitas or seraphim to raise your morale and lower that of your opponent.
The demonhunters may get and invul save 6+ and may stop demons from assaulting after deepstrike.

And thats it. Two (2) for the Ordos of the Inquisition in TOTAL. See a problem?

No. Both got 1....

I just deemed it interesting to look at the date of dec 09, which isn't so long ago.

Could be the DA treatment: want a codex?, here take this fortress....

1hadhq wrote:

A-P wrote:

1hadhq wrote:
2 options for planetstrike, the witchhunters use sororitas or seraphim to raise your morale and lower that of your opponent.
The demonhunters may get and invul save 6+ and may stop demons from assaulting after deepstrike.

And thats it. Two (2) for the Ordos of the Inquisition in TOTAL. See a problem?

No. Both got 1....

I just deemed it interesting to look at the date of dec 09, which isn't so long ago.

Could be the DA treatment: want a codex?, here take this fortress....

Almost every army got only 1 special rule in planet strike. But yea, it does remind me of the whole DA thing. So much pain.

A-P wrote:

1hadhq wrote:
2 options for planetstrike, the witchhunters use sororitas or seraphim to raise your morale and lower that of your opponent.
The demonhunters may get and invul save 6+ and may stop demons from assaulting after deepstrike.

And thats it. Two (2) for the Ordos of the Inquisition in TOTAL. See a problem?

4 actually.

There's two more in the Planetstrike book proper that are "Imperium Only".

And frankly, they're not for the Ordos of the Inquisition.
They're for the Chambers Militant. /fluffnitpickery.

Someone buys White Dwarf?

Technically, there is a Grey Knight formation for Apocalypse on the website. I seriously doubt anyone has ever actually fielded that abomination.

There's also a couple of Grey Knight formations in the third Siege of Vraks book.

oops

Elric of Grans wrote:Technically, there is a Grey Knight formation for Apocalypse on the website. I seriously doubt anyone has ever actually fielded that abomination.

I seriously doubt there's a single Apoc formation that hasn't been founded within a month of its release.

Somewhere, there's a GK player who's wanted to play all of his GKs at once in the group game, probably did so, and finally gave the GK formation a try. Not because it was good, but simply because he had the models and could do it.

You cannot deploy unless your opponent has a Greater Daemon on the table, and once it dies your opponent now uses the Grey Knights instead of you. If you wanted your opponent to field all your Grey Knights, maybe, but I doubt that fancy passed many people

As part of a scenario event, sure.

Elric of Grans wrote:You cannot deploy unless your opponent has a Greater Daemon on the table, and once it dies your opponent now uses the Grey Knights instead of you. If you wanted your opponent to field all your Grey Knights, maybe, but I doubt that fancy passed many people

It says once all the forces of chaos are defeated as in chaos space marines deamons lost and the dammed any possessed vehicles ect.
but if that is all your opponent has on the table there is no need to worry about it.

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1180075_Space_Marines_Datasheet_-_Grey_Knights_Redeemer_Force.pdf

Edit to add link

We shouldn't have to buy White Dwarf issues to get some rules about an army that's been left out of a supplement.

Then again, the Inquisition isn't an "army" in the same sense as most armies so it would be kinda weird for them to have their own superheavies and stuff. They have Inquisitorial Stormtroopers so they probably have Inquisitorial Baneblades as well. >.>

Now for Planetstrike, there really isn't a whole lot of special stuff to use but they really could have included it. >.>

And for Cities of Death well...no army has anything specific for that? o_O

Brother SRM wrote:

fallen_wolfborn wrote:

Elric of Grans wrote:This was discussed in the `Codex After Blood Angels' thread a couple of weeks ago

He also told me that the blood angels box would not be released this year.

Even though GW themselves confirmed Blood Angels for April?

I dunno about that but I'm only going on what he told me.

At my local Gamesworkshop the Daemon Hunters and Sisters of Battle Codexes are not on the shelves and have not been restocked for a couple of months.

Which may mean something.

Or, of course, nothing.

Other than that they don't sell particularly well anymore, especially in your area?

I really do not get the fuss. I have had difficulty getting Sisters models for the last two years. Most of the range has been direct order for around three years now, so the one or two remaining items going to it really means a whole lot of nothing.

This is a really weird thread, and I don't know why it survived so long

1.) The German WH and DH Codices are OOP and gone from the GW store for 2-3 years, and guess what: no new WH or DH Codex release since then. Before the online-store merger, GW Germany actually offered free pdf-downloads of these Codices (just the rule ssection, not the hobby part though).

2.) No WH or DH mission in the Battle Mission book. But no Space Wolf, Black Templar, Dark Angels or Blood Angels mission either. Does that mean that Space Wolves, Black Templar, Dark Angels and Blood Angels are all discontinued and squatted? No. Just read the book section on "other armies".

Having to buy Sisters in blisters instead of boxes is not a big deal. Hey even the Exorcist is still available.
The rumours and wishlistings on a new Sororitas/Ecclesiarchy and Grey Knights Codex are covered elsewhere.

Not sure if this has been pointed out yet, but Battle Sisters are also missing from the 5th Ed Rulebook. Now the models are gone too? Probably not a good sign.

Actually, they are there. Apparently, based on the fluff section, half the Orders Majoris have disappeared without explanation(!). They also appear in the hobby section.

Kroothawk wrote:
Having to buy Sisters in blisters instead of boxes is not a big deal. Hey even the Exorcist is still available.
The rumours and wishlistings on a new Sororitas/Ecclesiarchy and Grey Knights Codex are covered elsewhere.

Buying them that way costs $1.38 more per model (U.S.) That's over $10.00 extra for a squad of ten. They are already more expensive than full squads of just about ever other army, so an extra 10 bucks certainly doesn't help. I don't know how much disposable income you have, but adding a 20% increase to my troops cost would hurt my budget. Not that I intend on playing them anyway...

In retrospect - the main (10-strong) squad is back on the website, so I guess it doesn't matter anyway. Must have been an internet burp.

20% more or less: Let's agree that a Sororitas army is not a low budget army currently (never was, like DKoK) and that a price increase is not an indicator for the squating of an army. BTW, still can't see the 10-box.

InquisitorBob wrote:We shouldn't have to buy White Dwarf issues to get some rules about an army that's been left out of a supplement....

It's been awhile but I'm assuming Chapter Approved went away long ago Those were the days, if they're gone. Nothing like lugging rulebook, codex, additional codex if you played a specialty army and one or more White Dwarfs so you could cross referenced any special scenarios/rules/errata.

10 pack Grey Knights missing from the UK site as well now

I've been told by a store manager to expect a stop-gap PDF codex for each army with a full new codex for each before the end of 5th edition.... not sure how true that is though.

FlightMek wrote:Buying them that way costs $1.38 more per model (U.S.)

Even with the box, you had to buy two blisters anyway. You needed to replace the Sister Superior with one equipped with a Boltgun, then replace the Storm Bolter with a Heavy Flamer, or both the Storm Bolter and the Flamer with two Meltaguns. You needed to buy 2-3 Blisters just to make a playable force out of the box. As such, many people never bought the box in the first place, preferring to just buy blisters.

I think that Gamesworkshop will re-do the Witch-hunters as plastic with a new codex because people seem to like the story behind them and the minis (My favorite are the Pentient engines) which would look awesome if they came out in plastic. If they re-done them I would possibly collect them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Yet again after reading the posts before these, there might be a chance that they are slowly trying to discard them but not all at once so we won't notice as much. I not sure, in my opinion it is too early to tell.

Kroothawk wrote:20% more or less: Let's agree that a Sororitas army is not a low budget army currently (never was, like DKoK) and that a price increase is not an indicator for the squating of an army. BTW, still can't see the 10-box.

I would agree 110% that it is not a cheap army to play. It certainly doesn't appeal to your new 40k player who is already intimidated by the price tag of the hobby. However, this isn't a "price increase" as much as it is -WAS- the dropping of the main box for the army. If Tac squad boxes disappeared from the Marines list I am sure there would be concern. I am surprised that you can't see it. It showed up for me again a few days ago. Weirdness.....

Maybe GW is pulling the box from certain IPs to get a reaction and gauge whether or not they should squat them..

Elric of Grans wrote:

FlightMek wrote:Buying them that way costs $1.38 more per model (U.S.)

Even with the box, you had to buy two blisters anyway. You needed to replace the Sister Superior with one equipped with a Boltgun, then replace the Storm Bolter with a Heavy Flamer, or both the Storm Bolter and the Flamer with two Meltaguns. You needed to buy 2-3 Blisters just to make a playable force out of the box. As such, many people never bought the box in the first place, preferring to just buy blisters.

I'll have to take your word for it. If 9/10 WH players agree, then I guess the loss of the squad box is not as big a deal as I originally thought. I just figured that a few of them with the addition of a few blisters and you were set for troops.

You are aware that WH didn't have that 10-box at their 3rd edition release and for most years of their existence (not to speak of their 2nd edition release). Was only a convenient repackaging as part of their blister to box policy. And yes, at that time, everyone had to fill his units with extra sisters (e.g. Heavy Bolter) best bought from bitz service to make all those different units (for Seraphim as well). Same with Inquisitor retinue, best filled with heavy weapon servitors.

BTW we all know that GW currently works on a new Codex, with plastic Sororitas, so spreading panic is of no use.

Grim.Badger wrote:I've been told by a store manager to expect a stop-gap PDF codex for each army with a full new codex for each before the end of 5th edition.... not sure how true that is though.

As said, was done by GW Germany on their website 2-3years ago, when the German Codices for DH and WH went OOP. Got deleted with the merger of all GW websites.

Kroothawk wrote:BTW we all know that GW currently works on a new Codex, with plastic Sororitas, so spreading panic is of no use.

Actually we don't all know that - which is the exact reason why I started the thread in the first place. Why make an accusation about "spreading panic?" I guess certain people are capable of such an immature act. Then again...there's a reason they call it "News & Rumors", isn't there?

Do you have anything substantial to back up the claim of a new codex and plastics, or should we just take your word for it?

This is a subforum for posting news and rumours, not for starting a thread just asking for news and rumours more than 1 year ahead of a possible release. We know that no current army will be squatted again, we know that all armies get plastic standards. Brimstone RIP and Harry even made some first hints, with at least Grey Knights plastic models already spotted. But with the current GW rumour policy, noone can give more substantial information now and get away with it.

Grim.Badger wrote:
I've been told by a store manager to expect a stop-gap PDF codex for each army with a full new codex for each before the end of 5th edition.... not sure how true that is though.

I don't see that happening. GW came out and said the PDF codex thing was a bad idea, and they got a lot of backlash from the Blood Angels codex. Then again, GW changes ideas and philosophies pretty often, so you never know. I still can't see them doing this again though.

Did the Orders Majoris that went missing simply get left out of the book or were they mentioned as missing?

Penitent Engines given the killa-kan/deff dread treatment would be better than Christmas.

I doubt GW would go ahead and release stop-gap pdf codices. It just isn't their policy and they wouldn't like dealing with all the fan whinery anyway.

There used to be six Orders Majoris; the rule book now states there are three, but there is no explanation to what happened to the missing three.

Elric of Grans wrote:There used to be six Orders Majoris; the rule book now states there are three, but there is no explanation to what happened to the missing three.

Eaten by Zoats on the eastern fringe which were subsequently destroyed by Squats who were then consumed in retribution by the Tyranids who then promptly forgot everything these three races could do when designing their next codices.

Kroothawk wrote:This is a subforum for posting news and rumours, not for starting a thread just asking for news and rumours more than 1 year ahead of a possible release. We know that no current army will be squatted again, we know that all armies get plastic standards. Brimstone RIP and Harry even made some first hints, with at least Grey Knights plastic models already spotted. But with the current GW rumour policy, noone can give more substantial information now and get away with it.

So your answer would be "no" - you don't have anything substantial to offer to the conversation other than speculations and false accusations. I will admit that your specualtions are based on a solid "trend" in the industry and have some merit, but they are still an opinion. So - again - your answer to my question is "no."

And again, your post is filled with "we all know" comments. Is this "we" a special society of privileged 40K players? Do you guys have a secret handshake and uniforms? Dude...we don't "all know" what you consider to be common knowledge in the community and as a result may ask questions that seem redundant to you and your buddies. I apologize if this - for God knows what reason - offends you or incoveniences you, but it was an honest question. Maybe you should look back at the first page and read the original question again...

I don't understand why you're getting so upset about this anyway. I posed a question that the community is obviously interested in.

FlightMek wrote:And again, your post is filled with "we all know" comments. Is this "we" a special society of privileged 40K players? Do you guys have a secret handshake and uniforms?

Off topic, but that would be freakin' awesome

Elric of Grans wrote:There used to be six Orders Majoris; the rule book now states there are three, but there is no explanation to what happened to the missing three.

I think the missing three were turned into Minor Orders. Can't say for sure as my Witch Hunters codex has vanished.

Elric of Grans wrote:There used to be six Orders Majoris; the rule book now states there are three, but there is no explanation to what happened to the missing three.

The Chaos Spawn come from somewhere.

No, in Codex: Witch Hunters there were still six. In fourth edition, there were still six. This has only happened in fifth, but there is no explanation.

FlightMek, you are starting to come across pretty agro; might want to watch that before the mods come down. As for the topic of contention, there are certain individuals in the fan community who are known to have access to information far ahead of the official announcements. For all intents and purposes, the secret community you are lampooning effectively does exist, albeit without the whole organisation thing. They see concept art, 3-ups, rules development, etc. From these guys, we know that Grey Knights and Sisters are in the works. We have also had official announcements to that effect, and Games Workshop HQ knows as well as anyone else what they are working on

Elric of Grans wrote:No, in Codex: Witch Hunters there were still six. In fourth edition, there were still six. This has only happened in fifth, but there is no explanation.

FlightMek, you are starting to come across pretty agro; might want to watch that before the mods come down. As for the topic of contention, there are certain individuals in the fan community who are known to have access to information far ahead of the official announcements. For all intents and purposes, the secret community you are lampooning effectively does exist, albeit without the whole organisation thing. They see concept art, 3-ups, rules development, etc. From these guys, we know that Grey Knights and Sisters are in the works. We have also had official announcements to that effect, and Games Workshop HQ knows as well as anyone else what they are working on

That simple statement would have been a perfect way to answer a logical and honest question....thank you. Where can I find the announcements? I would like to read them. Or is this an example of the speak-easy 40K underworld you referred to?

The official announcements, or the unofficial things?

For the official, they are all pretty old: search here or Warseer. Every time he opens his mouth, Jervis says they are not squatting anyone, so that is easy to find. A Games Day last year (the year before?), it was announced that Phil Kelly would be doing Grey Knights; Andy Hoare Sisters. No word on who picked up Sisters after Andy left. Last year, after finishing Space Wolves, Phil commented that he had started the Grey Knights and dropped that he was looking at introducing Jump Infantry. It has also been stated several times that they view the Inquisition as a mistake and intend to restore Codex: Sisters of Battle, while making Daemonhunters more Grey Knights and less Inquisition. HBMC has used every curse under the sun over this statement, so search this forum for that

As for unofficial stuff, this is mostly to be found on Warseer. These take some serious trawling to find, so I would recommend searching for posts by people like (as mentioned before) Harry and Brimstone. There was a thread on here where Brass Scorpion dropped a few vague hints, but that was locked some weeks ago.