I need some colour SOB art for a banner that I will be making as soon as I can find pics for it, but all the SOB images I can find are in black and white. Please help.

Thanks

Skizzik

No problem:

Here you go

S_P

Can't help, pretty much all of my Sisters arts is not safe for work.

My external harddrive is kaput for the moment, so I can't get my archives... but here's the ones I already have uploaded.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/Sister_of_Battle_final_by_Sheason.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/BattleSister.png
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/SistersArmor.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/1239103246584.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/HolyOrders.png
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/AnimeSororitas.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/PalatineElisaUbanek.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/Battle_Sister_by_IronShrineMaiden.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/Adeptus_sororitus_by_Sly_Stalker.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/Other/1210261323374.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/Other/1210250022443.jpg

Second one is gone. I like the third one the best

Fixed the link to the second one. It's a cropped screenshot from C:SoB.

Personally, I favor the first one (from Sheason on DeviantArt).

I feel sorry for the Nids in the Warhammer 40Chibi one, they look so cute! Leave the poor things alone, evil SoB's! Get it, because it also means Sons of....oh never mind.

I first saw the 40chibi pic years ago, but I only just realised that there's three Nids in it. Mind == Blown.

More seriously:

Wallpaper: http://www.ljplus.ru/img4/f/i/first_keeper/Adepta-Sororitas.jpg
Cosplay: http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs48/i/2009/212/f/3/Adepta_Sororitas_by_grimdarkkommissar.jpg















But then again, for a banner you should better google for Fleur de Lis:

I wish I had the source pic for that last one...

Azezel wrote:http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q101/MCP1/1210963706232.jpg

"Why won't my hips un-sway?"

Some of these cartoons are deeply frightening.

Nitros14 wrote:Some of these cartoons are deeply frightening.

Just wait until you see the NSFW stuff

here's one of a female in 40k with a believable 3+ save... somehow a leather corset doesn't scream 3+ power armor to me.

warboss wrote:here's one of a female in 40k with a believable 3+ save... somehow a leather corset doesn't scream 3+ power armor to me.

Good thing it's not leather then. I hate the corsets myself, and the boob-cups, and the metal garter belts and crap, but John Blanche's horrible gakky pieces of crap that masquerade as artwork aside (Which is what the Sisters chest area was supposedly inspired by, despite the fact that John Blanche can't draw women to save his life) Sisters armor is exactly that-- armor.

Also dude, no. NO! Don't do that. Do not bring up female Space Marines in this thread.

Sisters of Battle are NOT female Space Marines. They never have been.

Melissia wrote:
Sisters of Battle are female Space Marines. They always have been.

i fixed your quote.

here's one of an actual sister nest to a scale IG and SM; still doesn't look 3+ to me (or even powered other than the backpack but at least i can explain that part away). and the obligatory "i'm sexy but not trying to be" SOB pic. personally, i'd love for the SOB to fill the spot directly inbetween IG and SM (heck, i was trying to get an army of them for that reason but the ebay prices for them are actually close to retail). half the skills of a marine (bs4 but ws3), the boltgun of the SM, the physical stats of an IG (s/t/i 3) and armor inbetween (4+) for the standard sister with 'eavy nuns in the elite or heavy support slots with modelled bulkier (read less sexy) 3+ armor.

Sisters wear power armor, the gakky design of hte power armor because of John Blanche being a crappy, perverted artist notwithstanding. This is kinda how they should be, too. If they had a 4+ save they'd basically be IG veterans...

Melissia wrote:Sisters wear power armor, the gakky design of hte power armor because of John Blanche being a crappy, perverted artist notwithstanding. This is kinda how they should be, too. If they had a 4+ save they'd basically be IG veterans...

hey, if they redesign the armor to make a believeable 3+ save, i'm there with you. you can have a believable 3+ save and still appeal to (im)mature gamers (ie. be sexy). the current line of sisters just don't have one in my opinion.

i'd love to find a mini that could do the pic below justice but i haven't and my greenstuff skills are quite limited. samus has a believeable 3+ save and i'd love to use her as a power armor equiped inquisitor. also, one of the SOB pics above is a believeable 3+ armor (hint: it's not the one where her iliac crests are showing under her tshirt/armorbreastplate).

Or like these two:

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/Other/1210250022443.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a28/melissiablackheart/Sister_of_Battle_final_by_Sheason.jpg

Melissia wrote:Sisters wear power armor, the gakky design of hte power armor because of John Blanche being a crappy, perverted artist notwithstanding. This is kinda how they should be, too. If they had a 4+ save they'd basically be IG veterans...

I still don't get all the hate for sister's power armor. Keep in mind that there are only 7 categories in the whole universe:

2+: Walking Tank
3+: Heavily Armored
4+: Medium Armor
5+: Light Armor
6+: Armor is for Wussies
-: What armor?

There has to be a certain amount of squinting past broad categories of armor in order for the game to work. The same as with BS/WS, Str, T, etc.
Is a Sister's Power Armor give as much protection as SM power armor? Probably not, but it is close enough.
Is an IG Vet really as good a shot as a 500 yr old Space Marine? Probably not, but it is close enough.

As for the 'leather corsets don't protect you' stuff, I'm not sure where the 'leather' part comes from. Sister armor is constructed of ceramite, etc, just like a marines. It is just smaller to accomodate the fact that they are not 8ft tall mountains of muscle.

Lastly, I happen to like the design and concept of Sister's power armor. Even if it is 'Corsets and High Heels', it still is visually striking and unique on the battle field. It differentiates them from girl marines or Samus lookalikes (which that last example shot was).

pretre wrote:Is a Sister's Power Armor give as much protection as SM power armor?

Actually yes, C:WH specifically says that it does.

Melissia wrote:Sisters wear power armor, the gakky design of hte power armor because of John Blanche being a crappy, perverted artist notwithstanding. This is kinda how they should be, too. If they had a 4+ save they'd basically be IG veterans...

If you hate the design and the rules of Sororitas: Nobody forces you tp buy and play them.

pretre wrote:

Melissia wrote:Sisters wear power armor, the gakky design of hte power armor because of John Blanche being a crappy, perverted artist notwithstanding. This is kinda how they should be, too. If they had a 4+ save they'd basically be IG veterans...

I still don't get all the hate for sister's power armor. Keep in mind that there are only 7 categories in the whole universe:

2+: Walking Tank
3+: Heavily Armored
4+: Medium Armor
5+: Light Armor
6+: Armor is for Wussies
-: What armor?

There has to be a certain amount of squinting past broad categories of armor in order for the game to work. The same as with BS/WS, Str, T, etc.
Is a Sister's Power Armor give as much protection as SM power armor? Probably not, but it is close enough.
Is an IG Vet really as good a shot as a 500 yr old Space Marine? Probably not, but it is close enough.

As for the 'leather corsets don't protect you' stuff, I'm not sure where the 'leather' part comes from. Sister armor is constructed of ceramite, etc, just like a marines. It is just smaller to accomodate the fact that they are not 8ft tall mountains of muscle.

Lastly, I happen to like the design and concept of Sister's power armor. Even if it is 'Corsets and High Heels', it still is visually striking and unique on the battle field. It differentiates them from girl marines or Samus lookalikes (which that last example shot was).

the problem is that, in general, it doesn't look like "3+: heavily armored" to alot of gamers. it looks like a leather corset and stripper boots combined with a velvet cape half the time. the "look" is what i'm talking about; i completely agree that the fluff gives them fully fledged power armor. it's just that the models and most art (by virtue of placing sexy over protection) doesn't. this is actually the pic i was talking about regarding a sis with 3+ looking armor.




and here's a bit more sister art spam... of the 4+ but sexy variety.

Which is a gross oversimplification of anything I've ever said on the subject, isn't it?

Regardless...

I like the fluff of the Sisters. I like the general design of the armor aside from the chest/abdomen (indeed, Sisters have the best looking helmet in 40k, and I do enjoy the limbs and shoulder plates as well). I like their playstyle, and it suits my naturally aggressive personality quite well.

However: The fluff needs expansion, and very few sources actually give the Sisters any respect. Soulstorm-- yes, that fluff disaster that was the last DoW1 expansion-- gave the Sisters more respect than Black Library does despite all of its myriad flaws. GW's fluff doesn't really show much respect for the Sisters, BL's fluff doesn't really show much respect for the Sisters, and quite a bit of fanfiction doesn't either. It's strange, GW seems to enjoy bashing the Sisters just as much as one of the prepubescent brats that bash Sisters with epithets about kitchens. The chest/abdomen region needs reworking to make it less idiotic looking (I'd prefer the chestplate look something like this myself, remniscent of the plate armor of medieval times, with a single Fleur de Lys on the middle and sectioned plate under it covering the abdomen like Marines). And finally, the rules are very much out of date and need expansion.


Just because I believe there's a lot of room for improvement does not mean I do not like the faction overall.

warboss wrote:
the problem is that, in general, it doesn't look like "3+: heavily armored" to alot of gamers. it looks like a leather corset and stripper boots combined with a velvet cape half the time. the "look" is what i'm talking about; i completely agree that the fluff gives them fully fledged power armor. it's just that the models and most art (by virtue of placing sexy over protection) doesn't. this is actually the pic i was talking about regarding a sis with 3+ looking armor.
and here's a bit more sister art spam... of the 4+ but sexy variety.

But it is all about the materials. Eldar armor doesn't look like 4+ to me, it looks like 5+ body glove but is made of wraitbone and puppydog tails and magic so gets a 4+... I don't see a big difference between Crisis and Broadsides, but there is and they get a 2+ out of having heavier guns on their shoulders and 'thicker' armor plate or somesuch.

If the corsets and stripper boots are made of Ceramite and the velvet cape is Kevlar with Adamantine strips sewn in, then yeah, it's a 3+, regardless of if you think it is in poor taste.

I'm not saying that Sisters aren't aimed at 'sexy', but I also don't know that there is a problem here.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I'm not saying that I wouldn't welcome a redesign, but I also think that existing design is pretty fine.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
(No pun intended)

i'm making a new thread to discuss the matter of SOB armor. you can find it below:


http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/297901.page

Melissia wrote:... it suits my naturally aggressive personality quite well.

You don't say!

Anyway, I have read only two novels with Sororitas participation, "Faith and Fire" and "Grey Knights" (BTW have you read this novel? You never mention it), and both show respect for the Sisters. By far more than Goto's Eldar novels show for Eldar. And more than most BL novels show for Xenos (hopefully this will change with the upcoming Eldar-novels by fluff-master Gav). While an expansion of fluff is always nice, the 2nd edition Codex gave the Sisters a larger amount of background information that Tau, Necrons, Tyranids and Dark Eldar can ever hope for.

And the chest armour is an obvious nod to the tastes of the male target customers. And at the same time, it is by far the favorite 40k cosplay costume among women. Maybe the design is not that perverted and bad at all.

Nope, I want to though.

But I'm thinking like Redemption Corps or Cain's Last Stand, where the authors basically whimsically decide entire Orders of Sisters turn to Chaos on the drop of a hat. As much as I like Cain's Last Stand, Sandy Mitchel has yet to prove that he can actually write Sisters and give them any respect, so I'm iffy on his upcoming book which is supposedly a Sisters book.

As for my comment about GW not respecting Sisters, just look at how many times GW uses Sisters as a scratching post. I recall a story about Tau destroying Sisters, I know Necrons ripped apart Sanctuary 101 with basically no reprisal, Orks tore apart the Sisters on Armageddon, and the Sisters, though present on Cadia, basically have zero fluff there on how they performed. And all of the Sisters characters are dead, we have no "modern" ones. And I think FW had a bunch of Sisters dying, too, due to an Inquisitorial snafu. Basically they're making the Sisters out to be an entire army based off of the Lamenters, only they're female and human. I can't even remember the last time Gw made Sisters fluff where the Sisters actually WON the goddamned battle they participated in. C:WH mentions a few, but it's like six examples in a single paragraph that get less than a sentence each.

It's no wonder to me why people don't buy into it. Even Eldar win battles every now and then despite being a failing race... nobody likes to play the army that sucks and always loses.

Well, "Grey Knights" is one of my favorite BL novels, Sororitas do well in battle and there is even an interesting female Inquisitor character in it (not related to the Sororitas, before you ask ). Nice plot. Have fun.

BTW FW invented their own IG regiment, the Elysian Drop Troops, and they never won a single battle in FW books

Kroothawk wrote:Well, "Grey Knights" is one of my favorite BL novels, Sororitas do well in battle and there is even an interesting female Inquisitor character in it (not related to the Sororitas, before you ask ). Nice plot. Have fun.

BTW FW invented their own IG regiment, the Elysian Drop Troops, and they never won a single battle in FW books

FTW .

Here is a picture I found awhile ago

That pic's kinda 4chan /b/ or /tg/ trash... fish kneepad, slowpoke shoulderpad, the fact taht she's Suigintou from Rozen Maiden, the "fap not to the furry" quote on her right shin, "I want to be the little girl" on her robes, etc etc etc.

Kroothawk wrote:

I am not going to lie, that got me to seriously LoL.

Also, that picture of the "3+ save" sister that Warboss was talking about is badass, and with the exception of the feathers? on her shoulders, she still looks kinda sexy.

Not to stir the pot here melissia, but I don't think anyone has the right to complain about the design on the sister armor and clothes that arts them to anime or manga

Talk about not taking something seriously.... again, just my own tastes.

Nightsbane wrote:Not to stir the pot here melissia, but I don't think anyone has the right to complain about the design on the sister armor and clothes that arts them to anime or manga

Talk about not taking something seriously.... again, just my own tastes.

To be fair, just because they are on her photobucket doesn't mean that she drew them. I myself have plenty of pictures on mine I didn't draw.

Not a single image on my photobucket account I drew myself. I have done manipulations, recolorings, and other edits, but none of my actual art is my own. I like certain manga/anime (specific ones-- most of it I do not enjoy) for entirely different reasons than what causes me to enjoy 40k.

Melissia wrote:Not a single image on my photobucket account I drew myself. I have done manipulations, recolorings, and other edits, but none of my actual art is my own. I like certain manga/anime (specific ones-- most of it I do not enjoy) for entirely different reasons than what causes me to enjoy 40k.

understandable.

Just saying that I don't find manga or anime of warriors to make them look like 8 year old girls to be helping the cause of bruting them up.

While we are on the topic of art, does anyone know any good Chaos Space Marine art? I haven't really been able to find any online that I liked, so I was going to start a thread on it, but since this one is already here....

Nightsbane wrote:

Melissia wrote:Not a single image on my photobucket account I drew myself. I have done manipulations, recolorings, and other edits, but none of my actual art is my own. I like certain manga/anime (specific ones-- most of it I do not enjoy) for entirely different reasons than what causes me to enjoy 40k.

understandable.

Just saying that I don't find manga or anime of warriors to make them look like 8 year old girls to be helping the cause of bruting them up.

I don't agree with the idea of "bruting the up", so much as I'd like to make it more crusaderesque in appearance on the chestplate.

The link I gave that showed how I'd like the chestplate to be done was here. Basically a single curved plate, with enough protrusion to give the illusion of femininity while maintaining the knightly look. Below that, segmented plates would do fine, like the Marine armor. A single fleur de lys in the middle of the chestplate to top it off. Furthermore, something like this would fit better with the rest of the armor-- the boob-cups and corset are horribly mismatched with the limbs and helmet of the armor.

Melissia wrote:

Nightsbane wrote:

Melissia wrote:Not a single image on my photobucket account I drew myself. I have done manipulations, recolorings, and other edits, but none of my actual art is my own. I like certain manga/anime (specific ones-- most of it I do not enjoy) for entirely different reasons than what causes me to enjoy 40k.

understandable.

Just saying that I don't find manga or anime of warriors to make them look like 8 year old girls to be helping the cause of bruting them up.

I don't agree with the idea of "bruting the up", so much as I'd like to make it more crusaderesque in appearance on the chestplate.

The link I gave that showed how I'd like the chestplate to be done was here.

Not going to lie, put the Sisters' trademark Fluer De Lay on that, and it would look pretty bad ass.

Melissia wrote:

Nightsbane wrote:

Melissia wrote:Not a single image on my photobucket account I drew myself. I have done manipulations, recolorings, and other edits, but none of my actual art is my own. I like certain manga/anime (specific ones-- most of it I do not enjoy) for entirely different reasons than what causes me to enjoy 40k.

understandable.

Just saying that I don't find manga or anime of warriors to make them look like 8 year old girls to be helping the cause of bruting them up.

I don't agree with the idea of "bruting the up", so much as I'd like to make it more crusaderesque in appearance on the chestplate.

The link I gave that showed how I'd like the chestplate to be done was here. Basically a single curved plate, with enough protrusion to give the illusion of femininity while maintaining the knightly look. Below that, segmented plates would do fine, like the Marine armor. A single fleur de lys in the middle of the chestplate to top it off. Furthermore, something like this would fit better with the rest of the armor-- the boob-cups and corset are horribly mismatched with the limbs and helmet of the armor.

That seems much worse than current setup. The legs, midsection and arms and almost completely unprotected. It seems that your fixation with "boob cups" is hindering you from seeing how much more it covers on many models. As an aside, historical exapmles of female plate (though VERY rare) had "boobcups" because of the way armor was tailored to the wearer to maximize battle potential.

Please read my post and don't just look at the pretty picture, kthxbai.


edit: Now that the wave of annoyance has passed through me at your inability to actually read the entire post instead of just a single section, please note that I specifically stated that I was indicating the CHEST portion of that picture only, and that I have specifically stated that I actually LIKE the other parts of the Sisters armor.

Furthermore, I actually think this chestplate would fit BETTER with the rest of Sororitas armor than the boob-cups and corset. They'd look like Knights Templar of the Holy Crusades rather than bondage sluts. The corset and boob-cups are incongruous when you look at the armor as a whole, they just don't fit in with the gauntlets, pauldrons, helmet, greaves, and boots.

What do you dakkaites think about this kind of armour?



The mini is Finari, female crusader, 54mm, by Reaper.

I don't, I never particularly liked Reaper's female minis and usually am inclined to ignore that they exist

Melissia wrote:Please read my post and don't just look at the pretty picture, kthxbai.


edit: Now that the wave of annoyance has passed through me at your inability to actually read the entire post instead of just a single section, please note that I specifically stated that I was indicating the CHEST portion of that picture only, and that I have specifically stated that I actually LIKE the other parts of the Sisters armor.

Furthermore, I actually think this chestplate would fit BETTER with the rest of Sororitas armor than the boob-cups and corset. They'd look like Knights Templar of the Holy Crusades rather than bondage sluts. The corset and boob-cups are incongruous when you look at the armor as a whole, they just don't fit in with the gauntlets, pauldrons, helmet, greaves, and boots.

Actually, while you recommended decorations you did not ever specifically mention added arm, leg and mid section plates. I did and do read your posts to entirety. If you had read all of mine you would have read that it is actually "boob cups" that is more realistic and protective than male plate on a female. It does not quite have to be so obtuse, but yes need to be form fit to the female.

At this point I have to assume this is more anger about feeling like the females are more sexed up than you would like, than considering protection.

Nightsbane wrote:it is actually "boob cups" that is more realistic and protective than male plate on a female.

No, it's not. The shape basically just funnels a bullet into the center of the chest.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
For comparison:



Commercial body armor, in male and female styles (though the female style has the groin protection tucked in her pants, so it's a bit misleading). Notice that they do not use boob-cups. They use a single curve in both cases. The reason for this is exactly as I said-- boob-cups would cause the bullet to be funneled into the middle of the chest, while having an overall round shape would cause it to be more likely to simply deflect off of the armor.

However Melissia, Sisters wear power armour, which is meant to be impervious to small-arms fire as is.

Not that boob-cups aren't stupid but the general idea must've been that if it was able to penetrate power armour then the general shape must not matter much.

You're missing an awesome work of art. Here it is:

You want awesome art? I give you awesome art >



(I'm fairly sure this is one ^)





Muju is the artist, and he has a page on deviantart.

Been looking through my HD and found a couple of pics (in my lulz folder)






Even I have some kind of morality and respect as such the next pic shoud NOT be viewed by people who are easily offended, extremist feminists and possibly SoB Fanatics.


You have been warned if you still want to see the pic check the link below.

May the Emperor guard your soul...


http://i46.tinypic.com/2i1grrr.jpg

Melissia wrote:

Nightsbane wrote:it is actually "boob cups" that is more realistic and protective than male plate on a female.

No, it's not. The shape basically just funnels a bullet into the center of the chest.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
For comparison:



Commercial body armor, in male and female styles (though the female style has the groin protection tucked in her pants, so it's a bit misleading). Notice that they do not use boob-cups. They use a single curve in both cases. The reason for this is exactly as I said-- boob-cups would cause the bullet to be funneled into the middle of the chest, while having an overall round shape would cause it to be more likely to simply deflect off of the armor.

You still just don't seem to get it, and for all of your rather rude assumptions about my reading ability have failed to read what I said. I said that form fitted armor is authentic to known (though rare) instances of female PLATE. We aren't talking about modern NYPD gear, but PLATE. This was also referenced again by you asking for crusader styled armor. The fact is that PLATE has to be form fitted to be the most effective, meaning that their will be breast shapes in the armor.

and I'm sorry, but saying "boob cups" funnel bullets into the chest is flat out false. It is a horrid assumption of ballistics that has no sound science behind it. Bullets are not funneled, they penetrate, ricochet, or glance. If the metal is strong enough to not be penetrated, thus taking the primary force of the blow, it is a nigh impossibility that it will penetrate another part of armor with even less force behind the projectile. This is even throwing out the near impossible feat of bullets "funneling" as you claimed, but in a pretend world where they would, they would not have sufficient force to penetrate at a lesser speed after failing to penetrate the original entry point.

TLDR version: What you have claimed is not possible under any realm of science or science fiction under any even minimal adherence to physics.

That is not true. You don't need breast 'plates' in armor they'll smoosh down fine into a more logical 'plate' like king Henry VIII of englands, which makes a convex shaped, almost conical centered breastplate in order to fend off direct strikes, making it far more efficient for deflecting direct blows by glancing them off to one side or the other. If his gut could fit in that armor, I'm pretty sure the spacenun's hootahs could fit.

My thought: they rank almost up there with penitent S&M chick, those scanty eviscerator things, DE wyches and slaanesh... hot lobster things.... as far as fetishist 13 yr old fantasies and an embarrassment to the game.

If your going to be shameless space skanks I say you may as well go all the way with it. maybe they can get some power push-up-bras or something. The laws of physics need not apply in the mind of a 12 year old who just likes girls and doesn't figure out why until he gets into 40k and hot chicks in laser gear suddenly bridge the gap between childhood and a poorly concieved boner. I guess we all have our own ways of dealing with puberty. Mine was playing DnD where chicks wear chainmail bikinis and such, or princess leia in a slave girl outfit.
I wish the dudes at GW would get rid of the hot-chick-with-lasers fetish and just get down to everything being ugly, brutal, and badass.

In the Grim Darkness of the future, chicks should stay home and paint their boyfriend's figures while they go to war on their one night off. Whoever invented sororitas armor (in 40k universe) was wasting a lot of resources....

lemme see.. we could make power armor for an 8 foot 500 pound genetically altered badass... or we could make a form fitted version that requires far more technology knowhow due to its diminished size... but we make it for this lil' space nun wanna-be because it gives us boners...

Well nobody ever said the techpriests of mars had girlfriends either.

maybe I'm a misogynist. Maybe I just hate skankiness.


I liked the wounded girl on the floor pic though, it was much more classy than the 'hooker boots' type thing, and not so embarassing to show off later in life.

Are we really discussing the functionality of 40k equipment?

a couple of stills from the movie Shroud. Hmm looks like a woman in plate armor....

Nightsbane: Damn man. It's seven thirty in the morning here, I don't think I can respond seriously to that post... cool it, okay? I never intended to insult you, I just get annoyed occasionally myself.

Kettu wrote:However Melissia, Sisters wear power armour, which is meant to be impervious to small-arms fire as is.

Not that boob-cups aren't stupid but the general idea must've been that if it was able to penetrate power armour then the general shape must not matter much.

However, having boob-cups presents a structural weakness that doesn't need to be there.

Fair warning to all here...

IF you feel someone is crossing the line in terms of the Rules of This Forum (check the link in my sig), please use the MOD ALERT button.

Do not attempt to self-MOD a thread.

Do not throw around "Pro Tips", 'clever' edits and/or cast aspersions on someone's 'reading comprehension' ability.

OK?

Excuse me, but I'd like interject about the whole boob cup thing in armour....where would get such an idea? How would the mold this in the middle ages? Do you suggest each blacksmith went through the time and effort to make breasts on the armour? Do you know how silly that sounds? The slightest mistake would leave the wearer uncomfortable. It makes sense that they would just use a normal breast plate and just make it slightly smaller or bigger depending on the woman and have that margin of error.

The only reasons that SoB are like that is most likely because Games Workshop wanted to include sex appeal somehow o_O Otherwise a plate like the Marines would've made more sense...cut down to a feminine figure...I guess?

tldr; You're suggesting that an armourer measure and craft every woman's figure exactly when they didn't even do that for men?

http://www.jetrefilm.com/shroud1_lo-res.jpg

THAT pic is kinda how I want Sisters' chest armor to look, only with a large Fleur de Lys on the center. Keep the shoulders, arms, legs, helmet, etc, but add something like this, a bit more stylized perhaps, but like that.

helgrenze wrote:a couple of stills from the movie Shroud. Hmm looks like a woman in plate armor....

stills from a movie does not = examples from actual history.

There are VERY few examples of female plate that have been dug up, but those that have, have been form fitted. Plate must be form fitted to be the most effective. As stated before that does not mean that it needs to be so overt like the current "boob cups", but it would still be noticably there. The problem I see here is that some people seem to be more angry at feeling that showing any breast definition is sexism. Women have boobs. Showing them is not demeaning them. Or should we side track into what only making "alpha males" says about men in general?

No, because we don't care. It's a game and we want to have models that look bad *** not politically correct.

Nightsbane wrote: politically correct.

Don't whine about politically correct or crap like that. The boob-cups just look horrible, it has nothing to do with "political correctness" or any other vague political terms you want to throw around.

Also?

http://www.culture.gouv.fr/Wave/image/joconde/0002/m503604_95de20778_p.jpg
http://www.kellymoore.net/images/396px-Joan_of_arc_miniature_graded.jpg
http://csis.pace.edu/grendel/WS5/JoanofArc/images/st%20joan%20of%20arc%20large.jpg
http://historyissexy.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/arc-joan_of_arc_engraving.jpg
http://www.gradovi.net/images/armour4.jpg

In before people declare that a given aesthetic is objectively horrible.

Oh, wait.

Has anyone claimed such? No, I was merely objecting to someone using lame terms like "politically correct". My saying something looks ugly is quite obviously subjective... not that I should have to actually go out and say that, but I suppose this is the internet after all

Not everything is about you, babe, all evidence to the contrary aside.

Of course everything is about me. How could you dare suggest otherwise? Why, just the other day, I saw commercials talking to me, to me specifically. And just yesterday, had a nice conversation with my cat, and he agrees.

I don't see why form-fitting plate mail is a good idea. They didn't do it in Medieval Europe.

Plate mail often dents; a formfitting plate mail suit would carry the risk of suffocating the person inside with a few dents in the chest and gut area. Plus, a sloped edge allows swords, bullets, etc. to be deflected much better.

See this?


The armor is not completely form fitting.

Kettu wrote:However Melissia, Sisters wear power armour, which is meant to be impervious to small-arms fire as is.

Not that boob-cups aren't stupid but the general idea must've been that if it was able to penetrate power armour then the general shape must not matter much.

What about a chainsword? A glancing blow from a chainsword would also slide off easier on sloped armor.

Nightsbane wrote:and I'm sorry, but saying "boob cups" funnel bullets into the chest is flat out false. It is a horrid assumption of ballistics that has no sound science behind it. Bullets are not funneled, they penetrate, ricochet, or glance. If the metal is strong enough to not be penetrated, thus taking the primary force of the blow, it is a nigh impossibility that it will penetrate another part of armor with even less force behind the projectile. This is even throwing out the near impossible feat of bullets "funneling" as you claimed, but in a pretend world where they would, they would not have sufficient force to penetrate at a lesser speed after failing to penetrate the original entry point.

The flat space between the boobs cannot cause shots to glance off as easily. The bullet that hit the insides of the boobs glance to the center due to the overall shape. That's what he/she meant by funneling.

Just look at tanks. The T-34 could survive easier due to not only being big and scary, but also due to its sloped armor causing bullets to glance off.

That's precisely what she meant.

The reason tanks have sloped armor is because the angle helps reduce the force of bullets hitting it. Same with medieval armor being curved, so that it helps deflect arrows and bolts.

edit: Actually, just looking at penetration alone, curved/sloped armor is better.

About the only places you see the "boob cups" design element are Renfaire Leather armor, cosplay/fantasy/movie false/partial plate and in some Madonna videos from the late 80s early 90s.

Melissia wrote:

Nightsbane wrote: politically correct.

Don't whine about politically correct or crap like that. The boob-cups just look horrible, it has nothing to do with "political correctness" or any other vague political terms you want to throw around.

Also?

http://www.culture.gouv.fr/Wave/image/joconde/0002/m503604_95de20778_p.jpg
http://www.kellymoore.net/images/396px-Joan_of_arc_miniature_graded.jpg
http://csis.pace.edu/grendel/WS5/JoanofArc/images/st%20joan%20of%20arc%20large.jpg
http://historyissexy.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/arc-joan_of_arc_engraving.jpg
http://www.gradovi.net/images/armour4.jpg

great collection of joan of arc images! Except...that's one person not all of history, and she was armored to blend in as a man for much of her combat career.

helgrenze wrote:About the only places you see the "boob cups" design element are Renfaire Leather armor, cosplay/fantasy/movie false/partial plate and in some Madonna videos from the late 80s early 90s.

Not only

Nightsbane wrote:great collection of joan of arc images! Except...that's one person not all of history, and she was armored to blend in as a man for much of her combat career.

May you show some pictures of historical armor with boob cups, then?

Boob cups are the cornerstones of the fantasy world they are never going away.

Linkdead wrote:Boob cups are the cornerstones of the fantasy world they are never going away.

But indeed, the Slaaneshi part of me rather enjoys the conversation.

Nightsbane wrote:great collection of joan of arc images! Except...that's one person not all of history, and she was armored to blend in as a man for much of her combat career.

Present some counter-examples, then. The reason she wore men's clothes, by the way, wasn't so much to blend in as it was because they were better for battle.

Necroman wrote:

Nightsbane wrote:great collection of joan of arc images! Except...that's one person not all of history, and she was armored to blend in as a man for much of her combat career.

May you show some pictures of historical armor with boob cups, then?

Couple of good points here. Joan of Arc was dressed as a man. Secondly, post up a pic of the so called "boob cup" mail you speak of? Seems like its an easy point to make. And yes, I am sure there is a plethora of movie armor to support this, however we can hardly call that acceptable. I am not doubting some form of this armor exists, I can only imagine it to be a more ceremonial nature than battle.

As for the convex shape of the bullet proof vest shown, of course it helps by dispersing the inertia of the bullet as well as providing a angle to deflect off of. As a bullet hits it directly energy is pushed outwards towards the edge of the vest as it flexes inward and hopefully stops it. If the area had a concave shape, well it wouldn't do that for sure!

If we're talking medieval plate then you probably won't find many if any examples of what would be worn by a woman as women weren't knights. Women fighting on the battlefield in the middle ages was a very rare occurrence. Obviously the vikings had shieldmaidens and the celts had female warrior leaders but these women didn't wear plate armour. Equally most historical examples of women fighting during the middle ages come from peasant revolts, or a women leading an army after her husband had died, etc and these women were not properly armoured either.

Of those women that did wear plate armour almost all of them were disguised as men at the time. There are plenty of historical examples of women disguising themselves as men to fight. Joan of Arc being one of them. In fact it was a point against her in her condemnation trial that she crossdressed (it was excused because it was argued that as she was given the mission of a man it was only appropriate she be attired as one). So you can't really argue Joan of Arc as an example of what "women's armor" looked liked as she wasn't wearing it.

Nonetheless I could have sworn that I have seen actual boob cup style plate armor somewhere but I couldn't tell you where. A quick trawl of the internet only returns almost nothing except this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Isabella_and_Roger_Mortimer.jpg - which is a bit hard to tell but looks like a boob cup to me.

A boob cup design would have been horrible because it would have channeled blows into the chest. Not so much with a bullet but definitely with a sword or an axe or a spearhead. The difference between a projectile and a hand wepaon is that whilst it loses momentum after the first blow a porjectile loses almost all its momentum immediately whilst a hand weapon still has force being directed behind it. Picture a lance. If the first contact is made on the outside of the cup it glances harmlessly to the side. If it is made to the center of the cup it directs to the middle and all the momentum of the horse and rider is now plunged straight into the heart. A single curve makes much more sense.

However, whilst I wouldn't really have an issue with sisters getting a single curved breastplate I think I prefer the currently styled armour. It just looks cool. 40K doesn't have to mkae sense, it only has to be cool and frankly I think the sister's models are absolutely gorgeous. They combine personality, a wonderful sense of the gothic, a nice sci-fi sheen, some sex appeal and religious stylings in one figure. The faces have great expressions (even if the proportions are all wrong for a woman) and the detailing is great.

There, we will have to disagree.

I think it looks stupid, not cool . Cool would be if they gave a medieval knight appearance to their armor, like futuristic gothic plate mail-- which they kinda do, except for the chest and abdomen. Which clash hideously with the rest of the armor. Instead it looks like they let that farce of an artist (when it comes to the female form at any rate) John Blanche get far more input into the artistic design than he ever deserved, and so he decided "they need giant tits and corsets".

Course, they must have reigned him in somewhat, or they'd have looked like [edit: removed the link, I just realized it's NSFW. I must be tired if I didn't realize most of his art regarding women is fetish porn...]

Melissia wrote:There, we will have to disagree.

I think it looks stupid, not cool . Cool would be if they gave a medieval knight appearance to their armor, like futuristic gothic plate mail-- which they kinda do, except for the chest and abdomen. Which clash hideously with the rest of the armor. Instead it looks like they let that farce of an artist (when it comes to the female form at any rate) John Blanche get far more input into the artistic design than he ever deserved, and so he decided "they need giant tits and corsets".

Course, they must have reigned him in somewhat, or they'd have looked like [edit: removed the link, I just realized it's NSFW. I must be tired if I didn't realize most of his art regarding women is fetish porn...]

See I happen to think that John Blanche is a great artist and next to Jes the guy most responsible for the GW aesthetic. I love his work and I wished more models looked like it.

Melissia wrote:Of course everything is about me. How could you dare suggest otherwise? Why, just the other day, I saw commercials talking to me, to me specifically. And just yesterday, had a nice conversation with my cat, and he agrees.

Oh by the interwebz, this deserves a cookie!






PS: BA payout.

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:

Melissia wrote:There, we will have to disagree.

I think it looks stupid, not cool . Cool would be if they gave a medieval knight appearance to their armor, like futuristic gothic plate mail-- which they kinda do, except for the chest and abdomen. Which clash hideously with the rest of the armor. Instead it looks like they let that farce of an artist (when it comes to the female form at any rate) John Blanche get far more input into the artistic design than he ever deserved, and so he decided "they need giant tits and corsets".

Course, they must have reigned him in somewhat, or they'd have looked like [edit: removed the link, I just realized it's NSFW. I must be tired if I didn't realize most of his art regarding women is fetish porn...]

See I happen to think that John Blanche is a great artist and next to Jes the guy most responsible for the GW aesthetic. I love his work and I wished more models looked like it.

John Blanche MIGHT be a good artist, if you get hit in the head and forget what real art is like and all, but he cannot draw women to save his life.

Melissia wrote:John Blanche MIGHT be a good artist, if you get hit in the head and forget what real art is like and all, but he cannot draw women to save his life.

he doesn't do that great of a job with men either.



his male figures tend to look like wierd fantasy pimps with all the bling, horns, and feathers.

I like his art style. Not to say it doesn't have issues with proportion or the stylization of the character can sometimes be over the top. But it reminds me of gritty, Conan-esque comics. I think the prevalence of digital art and anime style art has a strong foothold with most people below the age of 30 now days. Nothing wrong with that medium or style, I like both as well as some other styles of art. Of course this is just my opinion, and I am skewed towards a more middle aged audience; combine that with my love for comic book geekyness.

Maybe, ut I've yet to see him draw a female that cannot be defined as softcore porn.

Point to the anti-boob cup lobby (did I just type that?). In WWII several countries toyed with the idea of dual turreted tanks but found that the space between the two turrets tended to "trap" enemy fire and signifcantly increase the damage to the tank, I believe boob-cups would accomplish the same thing.

Oh and because I will probably never get to type it again....boob-cups.

Melissia wrote:Maybe, ut I've yet to see him draw a female that cannot be defined as softcore porn.

perhaps...if you're a quaker

Nightsbane wrote:

Melissia wrote:Maybe, ut I've yet to see him draw a female that cannot be defined as softcore porn.

perhaps...if you're a quaker

at least the porn women go with the pimp men in a wierd motiff...

Nightsbane wrote:

Melissia wrote:Maybe, ut I've yet to see him draw a female that cannot be defined as softcore porn.

perhaps...if you're a quaker

Bare breasts, high heels, no underpants (at an angle that shows nothing, however), etc. are normal for his art. Even his Sisters art is practically softcore bondage porn. He draws power armor as if it's skin-tight leather.

I don't know if this is an SoB or a Femarine, but it's quite nice. It could be adapted anyway.


Found on DeviantArt.

From the shoulders, that's a Dark Angel, Femmarine.

gardeth wrote:

I loled

Melissia wrote:

Nightsbane wrote:

Melissia wrote:Maybe, ut I've yet to see him draw a female that cannot be defined as softcore porn.

perhaps...if you're a quaker

Bare breasts, high heels, no underpants (at an angle that shows nothing, however), etc. are normal for his art. Even his Sisters art is practically softcore bondage porn. He draws power armor as if it's skin-tight leather.

I say let it the heck go. You don't see me raging about bulky space marines making me feel inadequate.

It's a fem marine. The original name for it was "Space Maryn", a pun on Space Marine.

Of course I let it go, he can draw whatever the hell he wants. That does not, however, make me respect him as an artist, or think that his art is worth a damn.

Melissia wrote:It's a fem marine. The original name for it was "Space Maryn", a pun on Space Marine.

Of course I let it go, he can draw whatever the hell he wants. That does not, however, make me respect him as an artist, or think that his art is worth a damn.

whatever floats your boat. I cannot comment on that artist myself, but in general I don't find female sexuality to be such an awful thing.

Ever seen his 'Femme Militant' miniature line? I have seen some bondage shoes that were not as bad as his designs.

Nightsbane wrote:

Melissia wrote:It's a fem marine. The original name for it was "Space Maryn", a pun on Space Marine.

Of course I let it go, he can draw whatever the hell he wants. That does not, however, make me respect him as an artist, or think that his art is worth a damn.

whatever floats your boat. I cannot comment on that artist myself, but in general I don't find female sexuality to be such an awful thing.

Because Females being looked at sexually is stereotypical, which is why most people who suggest Chaos Sisters, or think of something of the like, think they would all be Slaaneshi. This is also not helped because your a guy (Due to your sig, I assume that, though it will probably make and ass out of you and me), and as such you and me don't think much of female sexuality. However, since women are becoming more independant (and more sexy because of that , nothing like a strong woman) they want more independant female characters. Melissa wants female characters who are there to kick ass, not show ass.

Now I feel something must be said:

I <3 BOOBIES!

Personally, I would not want to field an army of Sisters that looked like guys from the neck down.

And John Blanche is an excellent artist.

Slarg232 wrote:Because Females being looked at sexually is stereotypical, which is why most people who suggest Chaos Sisters, or think of something of the like, think they would all be Slaaneshi.

Maybe. I've always thought that a Khorne centred Chaos Sister mission would be pretty cool. Heretical. But cool.

I <3 BOOBIES!

BUTT seriously folks...

Emperors Faithful wrote:

Maybe. I've always thought that a Khorne centred Chaos Sister mission would be pretty cool. Heretical. But cool.

I would just rather have them with all the gods, Khorne and Slaanesh included.

BUTT seriously folks...

That too. And the legs... and the area where the legs meet. And above that, too.

Manchu wrote:And John Blanche is an excellent artist.

If you're into bizarre, overly sexualized, hideously proportioned and often just plain hideous pictures, sure...

Melissia wrote:

Manchu wrote:And John Blanche is an excellent artist.

If you're into bizarre, overly sexualized, hideously proportioned and often just plain hideous pictures, sure...

Blanche set the visual tone of 40k. Given that you don't get his work, I'm not surprised that you don't like how Sisters currently look. The only thing that surprises me in this regard is that you like 40k at all.

Melissia wrote:

Manchu wrote:And John Blanche is an excellent artist.

If you're into bizarre, overly sexualized, hideously proportioned and often just plain hideous pictures, sure...

I really think this whole conversation just reeks of deeper and more personal issues the more it carries on. I'll leave it at that.

One example I can give is John Bolton. EXCELLENT artist, especially his vampire stuff, which is filled with female nudity and sexuality.

I really cannot get behind the crowd that thinks that a woman showing skin is ALWAYS a sexist thing. Some women do allow themselves to be exploited to be sure, but many also own their bodies and their sexuality. Thinking that every woman that shows some leg or midriff is an insecure woman in a man's world is just a horrid narrowsightedness that belittles females altogether.

Most of the hang ups about the female form come only from latent puritanism, not feminism. The same goes for men.

Slarg232 wrote:

Emperors Faithful wrote:

Maybe. I've always thought that a Khorne centred Chaos Sister mission would be pretty cool. Heretical. But cool.

I would just rather have them with all the gods, Khorne and Slaanesh included.

Hmmm A Typhoid Mary based Nurgle unit.
Sister torsos with Marine legs for Tzeentch unit.
Girlschool/Runaways based noise marine types for Slaanesh.
A female Kharne.....

Could be my next army.....

Heh seems I have created some kind of monster...

Thanks for the pics guys, I may post results later depending on flucutations in my dialup the Warp.

Manchu wrote:Personally, I would not want to field an army of Sisters that looked like guys from the neck down.

And John Blanche is an excellent artist.

Agree on both.

Besides, whoever suggested "making them look like guys from the neck down" other than Manchu?

Giving them the single curved chestplate could still leave them feminine.

a slight swell on a smooth cuirass worn by an inch tall figure is not going to register as feminine

Manchu wrote:

Melissia wrote:

Manchu wrote:And John Blanche is an excellent artist.

If you're into bizarre, overly sexualized, hideously proportioned and often just plain hideous pictures, sure...

Blanche set the visual tone of 40k. Given that you don't get his work, I'm not surprised that you don't like how Sisters currently look. The only thing that surprises me in this regard is that you like 40k at all.

Have to agree with Manchu on this one. Art is subjective, and Blanche's work doesn't have the super clean and "realistically proportioned"*cough* lines of modern 40K, but his art has as an ethereal quality to it and it just works with Warhammer (especially back in the late 80s/early 90s before they got all child-friendly).

Whatever you may think of his stuff, it's certainly better than the fanart crap you're constantly posting, Melissia.

Blanche set the visual tone of 40k.

People keep saying this, but I don't see it. Blanche's art doesn't fit in with 40k in any way.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Manchu wrote:a slight swell on a smooth cuirass worn by an inch tall figure is not going to register as feminine

Sure it will . You don't need giant gazongas bigger than the model's already swelled head to look feminine.

Melissia wrote:People keep saying this, but I don't see it. Blanche's art doesn't fit in with 40k in any way.

Funny, that looks about as Eldar as it gets to me. But again, art is subjective.

That doesn't look very Eldar to me... edit: maybe a bit Dark Eldar? But not even much of that.

It was an early work of his from the 70s, and actually had nothing to do with 40K, but the first thing that came to mind when I saw it was "Eldar Harlequin."

Again, subjective, and in any case miles beyond the fancrap you posted on the first page of this thread.

This is not fan drawn. I assume you're referring to the other ones, in which case I would put this as a better piece of art than that any day. This, too, even if they made her... far too well endowed. They are at least pleasant to look at, unlike the John Blanche piece a few posts up which does nothing but annoy me.

The second picture fails because it looks like a pouty anime character. And gasp! She has the boob cups you hate so much!

The last is actually from a GW artist.

Terminus wrote:The second picture fails because it looks like a pouty anime character. And gasp! She has the boob cups you hate so much!

The last is actually from a GW artist.

The second image is better than the John Blanche crap you posted earlier because it actually portrays some kind of emotion. And how is that "anime"?

Just because I like to play Devil's Advocate, Melissia's suggestion would work and still hold an ounce of sexuality if the chest plate was more of a one piece 'sports bra' instead of individual 'cups'. You would have to redo the whole section of armor of course and make it one fluid design instead of the spirals that are used now a days to highlight the roundness of each cup. I'm imagining a simple sweeping design downward from a collar that goes up just past the chin, with a mild victorian era flare at the top. I like the corsset look, the sweeping design I mentioned earlier would be metal and go down the abdomin into the belt following the curves. What would be wrong with this image?

- Collar highlights the neck maybe a strong collar bone, this may not be possible due to scale.

- Coresett stays. But maybe have plate inserts in the more ridged areas of the body.

- Curves are not eliminated for grim-dark functionality. But the wall eyed look of the chest plate is scrapped.

I am a fan of what he did with the long legs and high boots though so the rest of the model would remain largley untouched.

Melissia wrote:

Terminus wrote:The second picture fails because it looks like a pouty anime character. And gasp! She has the boob cups you hate so much!

The last is actually from a GW artist.

The second image is better than the John Blanche crap you posted earlier because it actually portrays some kind of emotion. And how is that "anime"?

Are you seriously saying that ISM isn't anime-inspired?

Warboss: "Anime-inspired?" Maybe. That picture, however, doesn't speak "anime" to me.

I'm just glad that they didn't go with Blanche's high heel fetish, as high heels in a combat zone is a disastrously bad idea.

Melissia wrote:The second image is better than the John Blanche crap you posted earlier because it actually portrays some kind of emotion. And how is that "anime"?

It's anime because of the proportionally huge eyeballs and tiny mouth. But again we're back to art being subjective. You see emotion, I see a blank pouty anime face. You see emotionless crap, I see something hauntingly alien. To each his own.

Terminus wrote:It's anime because of the proportionally huge eyeballs and tiny mouth.

Are we looking at the same image?

@Melissa: Discussions require good faith. If you're going to argue that Blanche's work isn't definitive 40k then there's little point continuing this exchange. You are either being willfully contrary or don't know much about GW. I've seen a lot of people on Dakka who like scifi or wargames or miniatures but don't really like 40k. They are forever talking about how 40k should be something other than what is actually is. Your sisters fandex and harping against Blanche are examples of this.

Good faith != accepting everything everyone says without proof to back it up. I look at the John Blanche art that I have seen, and I see nothing of the 40K I know and love.

He's GW's art director, and has been one of their principle artists since the late 70s. He also paints a mean miniature.

That said, GW has been moving away in recent years from his brand of "punk fantasy", but the new GW art just sucks (see BA cover).

This is getting very off topic now, though... so yeah.

*exits stage left, pursued by a bear*

Melissia wrote:

Terminus wrote:The second picture fails because it looks like a pouty anime character. And gasp! She has the boob cups you hate so much!

The last is actually from a GW artist.

The second image is better than the John Blanche crap you posted earlier because it actually portrays some kind of emotion. And how is that "anime"?

EMOTION?! Are you SODDING KIDDING ME? I think you got lost looking for the sex in the city boardgame when you found 40k. This is WARhammer, not hormonehammer.

First of all, melissia you exaggerate way too much. The sisters models do not have giant breasts oversizing their heads. Their boob cups are not all that large, and in fact show a tone of sexiness while also exhibiting strength and power. They aren't wearing g-strings and pasties while wielding a power sword as you make it sound.

I can't believe you continue to shed so much hate an drawings by blanche , but then post anime?! Are you serious?! There is no form of media that objectifies and overly sexualizes women MORE than anime. In addition the effect is even further plunged into depravity by making them all look like they are 8-12 years old. They do not look like strong women, but giggly little primary schoolers. It's pretty gross actually.

The more you post, the more I think that this is just a subliminal "I hate tina because she's skinny and gets attention" thread. If I am wrong, I appologize, but you seem to just want women covered up and made a asexual as possible. How does that fit to making women equals and allowing them to be themselves? Based on what you want, why don't you just make some tiny felt burkas and put over the models. The sexual repression motif might suit you.

Nightsbane wrote:First of all, melissia you exaggerate way too much. The sisters models do not have giant breasts oversizing their heads. Their boob cups are not all that large, and in fact show a tone of sexiness while also exhibiting strength and power. They aren't wearing g-strings and pasties while wielding a power sword as you make it sound.

ahem.. would a corset that only covers one breast and a giant phallically held chainsword be the equivalent?

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1080202

Blanche's art sucks warm piss through a straw.

Ah, I can see this is your first foray into trolling. Not a terrible first attempt, but leaves something to be desired. But don't despair, just keep at it and I'm sure you'll successfully annoy someone someday! Keep that chin up, boyo!

warboss wrote:

Nightsbane wrote:First of all, melissia you exaggerate way too much. The sisters models do not have giant breasts oversizing their heads. Their boob cups are not all that large, and in fact show a tone of sexiness while also exhibiting strength and power. They aren't wearing g-strings and pasties while wielding a power sword as you make it sound.

ahem.. would a corset that only covers one breast and a giant phallically held chainsword be the equivalent?

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1080202

"Confession and penance are part of a Sister's everyday existence, those who fall short of the rigorous codes may find themselves banded into groups and led into battle in an attempt to earn redemption."

Do you know a single thing about ancient repentance? Ripping your clothes and wearing sack cloth? If not then you don't get to have an opinion on the unit referenced.

Phallic symbol? Really? That's an argument used my militant female college lit professors, not the rest of the thinking world.

Lets bring this back on topic.

http://majesticchicken.deviantart.com/art/Adepta-Sororitas-161999678

A nicely colored version of some GW black and white art.

Melissia wrote:Lets bring this back on topic.

http://majesticchicken.deviantart.com/art/Adepta-Sororitas-161999678

A nicely colored version of some GW black and white art.

Kind of hard to have ANY topic with you when you continue to make statements and then ignore any counterpoint.

However I would like to know what you find wrong with THAT picture you just listed.

Nightsbane wrote:
Phallic symbol? Really? That's an argument used my militant female college lit professors, not the rest of the thinking world.

Calm down, mate.

Nightsbane wrote:

However I would like to know what you find wrong with THAT picture you just listed.

Even in that, I can see that the boob cups are a bit overdone for even my tastes. But hey, this is GW. They not going to let the boob cups go. As for John Blanche, he does some pretty cool stuff:'re



But then...



Evidence suggests that the claim of a "High Heel Fetish" is not entirely unfounded.

Nightsbane wrote:

warboss wrote:

Nightsbane wrote:First of all, melissia you exaggerate way too much. The sisters models do not have giant breasts oversizing their heads. Their boob cups are not all that large, and in fact show a tone of sexiness while also exhibiting strength and power. They aren't wearing g-strings and pasties while wielding a power sword as you make it sound.

ahem.. would a corset that only covers one breast and a giant phallically held chainsword be the equivalent?

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1080202

"Confession and penance are part of a Sister's everyday existence, those who fall short of the rigorous codes may find themselves banded into groups and led into battle in an attempt to earn redemption."

Do you know a single thing about ancient repentance? Ripping your clothes and wearing sack cloth? If not then you don't get to have an opinion on the unit referenced.

Phallic symbol? Really? That's an argument used my militant female college lit professors, not the rest of the thinking world.

Actually, the pose and positioning of the sword can be viewed as quite phallic. And that outfit isn't exactly "sack cloth", which is essentually a bag of rough cloth used to carry seeds or grain.
However: those models would be perfect for my planned Chaos sisters army.

Actually I ignored it so that this topic wouldn't be closed. It was getting too heated for my tastes.

As for what I find wrong with that picture I posted? Do you mean the one by Karl Kopinski that was recolored by MajesticChicken? I like it quite a bit, actually. Although I still dislike the corset and boob cups, that particular image did it tastefully. Mind you, I think the lipstick is out of character, but that's hardly an issue that detracts from its artistic merit.

@EF: That is one of my favorite 40k pics of all time. Used to be the cover of the BFG boxed set.

@Melissa: I love that last one you posted. I think that captures the Sisters pretty well as far as the "modern" GW style (like IG4th cover) goes. At the end of the day, however, 40k is illustrated by John Blanche, scripted by Ian Watson, with soundtrack by Iron Maiden. Anything else is just a marketing scam.

@Terminus: As far as "punk fantasy" (awesome label for it btw) goes, GW is actually going back to that a bit--not to everyone's delight, as you noted. The BA5th and IG5th covers were both by David Gallagher. Personally, I love both covers (Sanguinary Priest's weird neck bend aside) but I can also see why people don't go for them. It's hard to see how anyone claiming to love 40k wouldn't love this, however:

I don't mind that picture, I just wish it were more coherent.

That style of art reminds me a lot of the works of Sergio Aragones. Lots of little details that can draw the viewer in. Unfortunately it can also be too busy and confusing if done wrong....

Nightsbane wrote:
Do you know a single thing about ancient repentance? Ripping your clothes and wearing sack cloth? If not then you don't get to have an opinion on the unit referenced.

Phallic symbol? Really? That's an argument used my militant female college lit professors, not the rest of the thinking world.

\

i'm quite familiar with the biblical acts of wearing sack cloths and covering yourself with ashes, NEITHER of which is pertinent to the models referenced since they're not doing that. if you don't realize this then you don't get to have an opinion (your trolling words, not mine). if you don't realize that a giant sword whose hilt is held to the crotch of a scantily clad S&M female model is a phallic symbol then you shouldn't consider yourself a part of the thinking world (your words again). if you don't see the blantant sexuality in those models then you must be the most innocent minded pure hearted virgin on dakka.

A virgin on Dakka? No way! I thought virgins were only allowed on the BoLS!

Melissia wrote:A virgin on Dakka? No way! I thought virgins were only allowed on the BoLS!

this is a site devoted to playing toy soldiers frequented by more than a few grown men. i'm sure there is more than one 40 year old virgin on this site, lol.

Sorry for going back to the OT, but here's some pictures I like. Sorry if I've posted any repeats.













And this is for you anti-boob cup people:

The first one is an arbitrator from the Dark Heresy rulebook.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e317/tacotheif/wh40k/1255858907769.jpg
That one's a psyker, rather than a Sister

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e317/tacotheif/wh40k/1274618871688.jpg
I'm... not sure what that androgynous mess is. An Inquisitor or an Arbitrator no doubt, based on the shock maul.

cool color art there. those were definitely new for me although i'm not exactly a collector of sob art any more than IG.

warboss wrote: . . . a giant sword whose hilt is held to the crotch of a scantily clad S&M female model is a phallic symbol . . .

To paraphrase Freud, sometimes an Eviscerator is just an Eviscerator.


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Melissia wrote:http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e317/tacotheif/wh40k/1255858907769.jpg
That one's a psyker, rather than a Sister.

Actually, that's a Planeswalker from MtG.




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Melissia wrote:http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e317/tacotheif/wh40k/1274618871688.jpg
I'm... not sure what that androgynous mess is. An Inquisitor or an Arbitrator no doubt, based on the shock maul.

And that is Shira Calpurnia. See: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Shira_Calpurnia_(Novel_Series)

Haha Chandra on fire as a psyker, thats a good one.

EDIT: I need a couple of those.

On the topic of MtG women...


Elspeth definitely has a "Sisters" feel to her.

Manchu wrote:To paraphrase Freud, sometimes an Eviscerator is just an Eviscerator.

To paraphrase the internet: "Yeah, and sometimes it's a big chainsaw dick"

*Note that I do not approve of adding subtext to everything, not everything has it. But it's rather blatant on those miniatures given all the other sexualization present.

I was looking through DeviantArt, and sadly, I couldn't find much that was actually worth posting that hadn't already been posted. Damn DeviantArt.

Melissia wrote:

Manchu wrote:To paraphrase Freud, sometimes an Eviscerator is just an Eviscerator.

To paraphrase the internet: "Yeah, and sometimes it's a big chainsaw dick"

There's your problem right there.

I won't deny that there is some sexuality to the Repentia (not buying the phallus-chainsword nonsense). But I'm not really sure what you're getting at by pointing it out.

Actually I mostly just dislike the Repentia models. I wish they were wearing robes instead of tiny stripperific strips of leather.

Robes make sense, but bondage gear doesn't really...

Robes make sense how? And "bondage gear" does NOT make sense how?

The "strips of leather" look (1) allows free movement, (2) illustrates the Repentia's penitential indifference/loathing regarding their physical bodies (i.e., in favor of the soul--no woman hating here, you internet psychoanalysts), (3) make for striking models that fit the world of 40k specifically rather than just being generic Reaper mish-mash.

Manchu wrote:Robes make sense how?

Because robes are the typical vestments of the Ecclesiarchy. The Sisters, outside of their armor, wear robes, and indeed even their armor has robes incorporated into it. Ecclesiarchal robes do not provide protection, but they do signify servitude to the Immortal God-Emperor of Man.

Sisters are not priests. They do not wear vestments. They wear "habits" (i.e., their power armor). The Repentia are not technically in good standing within their orders. Symbolically, they are stripped of their habits, including shaving their distinctive hair. This is in Faith & Fire, remember?

Manchu wrote:They do not wear vestments.

Erm, yes, they do. It's listed as part of their starting gear in Dark Heresy even.

This is an oversight by someone who does not understand what the difference between a vestment and a habit is. Vestments are liturgical garments--i.e., worn by officiants at mass. The members of a religious orders wear habits as their day-to-day raiment.

So, for example, here is a Dominican priest out-and-about (wearing the habit of his order):



. . . and here is a Dominican saying mass (wearing vestments):

The latter is closer to what the Sisters wear than the former.

The sleeves alone show that much.

We really have no idea what the liturgical rites of the Imperial Creed are or even what they are like. Imperial citizens are strangely never (to my knowledge) described at their worship. But we do know that the material and organizational culture of the Ecclesiarchy is modeled on (a parody of) medieval Christianity. It stands to reason, therefore, that the priestly hierarchy of deacon-presbyter-episcopos is reserved for males. I have never heard of a Priestess of the Emperor, at least. Vestments are the clothing of priests officiating the rites of worship and so a Sororita would not be wearing them.


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Melissia wrote:The sleeves alone show that much.

Those aren't sleeves. That garmet is a chasuble. It's the green part in the picture below:



As you can see, it is patently not like what the Sisters wear.

Then it is neither vestments nor a habit, as the Sisters robes look absolutely nothing like the habit you presented.

To clarify, "habit" is a general term just like "robe." The only thing about it that is specific is, unlike the word "robe," it refers to the garments that someone in a religious order wears. The one pictured above is specific to the Dominican order. I wasn't pointing out how the Sisters dress like Dominicans because they clearly don't.

Anyway, the main point is that there is nothing at all slowed about how Repentia currently look. They look awesome, in fact.

Asrodrig wrote:Sorry for going back to the OT, but here's some pictures I like. Sorry if I've posted any repeats.

Camel toe? Really?

Most of the rest are quite good, thanks for sharing!

Didn't even see that. J'ai ri. Proves Melissa's point . . . regarding fanart rather than GW, however.

Melissia wrote:Actually I mostly just dislike the Repentia models. I wish they were wearing robes instead of tiny stripperific strips of leather.

Robes make sense, but bondage gear doesn't really...

she is made uncomfortable my woman parts, to sum up this entire topic.


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warboss wrote:

Nightsbane wrote:
Do you know a single thing about ancient repentance? Ripping your clothes and wearing sack cloth? If not then you don't get to have an opinion on the unit referenced.

Phallic symbol? Really? That's an argument used my militant female college lit professors, not the rest of the thinking world.

\

i'm quite familiar with the biblical acts of wearing sack cloths and covering yourself with ashes, NEITHER of which is pertinent to the models referenced since they're not doing that. if you don't realize this then you don't get to have an opinion (your trolling words, not mine). if you don't realize that a giant sword whose hilt is held to the crotch of a scantily clad S&M female model is a phallic symbol then you shouldn't consider yourself a part of the thinking world (your words again). if you don't see the blantant sexuality in those models then you must be the most innocent minded pure hearted virgin on dakka.

Look at the image, torn cloths, and covered in cloth, repentance. It's a stylized version of the same idea.


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Melissia wrote:Then it is neither vestments nor a habit, as the Sisters robes look absolutely nothing like the habit you presented.

Manchu, even if you were to conjure the 40k universe into being, so that melissia could sit down with the sisters and verify her claims she would still argue. There is not any sense to be made here. Melissia will argue every single point regardless of the amount of sense or logic it contains. She is convinced that the sisters need to be stripped ( ) of all sexuality and made into man girls. No makeup, no breasts, no legs, no female garments. Make men into women, and then they will be equal.

Outside of that she won't be happy.


Perhaps they should turn the space marines into overweight socially awkward men wearing second hand star wars t-shirts next? I keed, I keed.

Last note, that image you posted of the sisters with color by majestic is all metal armor up top. It's not a corset.

Well, for what it's worth, whether they are metal or cloth, I dig the corsets. They fit into the whole gothic/punk feel of 40K in my opinion, and if there is a touch of sexiness (if there is, I think it's very subdued) to the models, it's a welcome contrast when everything else is a hulking monstrosity, a freakish alien or some barely-human cybernetic amalgam.

It's been a long time since I commented and am a bit upset that this temporarily devolved into a minor tiff but some of that art was amazing.

Also yeah, the 40K universe could do with a bit of sexy-ing up as long as it doesn't get extreme or weird. (Sanguinary guard...) That's got more to do with what GW thinks Continental Europeans from 700 years ago think is pretty than anything else. Nothing wrong with being attractive though but that shouldn't be the mini's only point. I'd paint Reaper mini's if that's what I wanted..

Being pretties nice but I'd rather the unit fight well in the army.

Thankfully, with most of the new kits I get to have both.

Melissia wrote:

Manchu wrote:To paraphrase Freud, sometimes an Eviscerator is just an Eviscerator.

To paraphrase the internet: "Yeah, and sometimes it's a big chainsaw [deleted]"

Please remember that Dakka Dakka is, as much as possible, a 'family friendly' forum.

Alpharius wrote:

Melissia wrote:

Manchu wrote:To paraphrase Freud, sometimes an Eviscerator is just an Eviscerator.

To paraphrase the internet: "Yeah, and sometimes it's a big chainsaw [deleted]"

Please remember that Dakka Dakka is, as much as possible, a 'family friendly' forum.

no saying chainsaw ****, rgr that.

~The more you know!~

I am shocked, shocked I say, that anyone here could possibly claim that GW would resort to phalic symbols in thier models. Obviously, that Bonesword that that Hive Tyrant is stroking is just that, a Bonesword! Who the devil could ever suggest it might possibly mean anything else? Why, the gall of some people, to even suggest that GW might sexualise models to cater to an obviously non-existent sex-starved teenage market. Harumph!

1.) 90% of this thread is off topic, as most Sororitas threads since 19th May.
2.) Warhammer 40k is not meant as a realistic simulation of warfare in 38.000 years, it is just SciFi. Neither is Conan meant as a realistic simulation of the Middle Ages, that's why noone argues there that the clothing is far from historical evidence.
3.) The target customers are male teens, not aggressiv female feminists. And the grossly exaggerated differences in male and female anatomy and clothing are common stereotypes to please these target customers.

At first it was amusing, but now I am annoyed that every single thread on Sororitas turns into an off-topic adult flaming feast by the same few people. I sincerely hope that some time in the near future it is possible again to discuss WH/Sororitas issues in a civil and on-topic way again. The fans of this army deserve that much respect.

Kroothawk wrote:not aggressiv female feminists.

If I see one who plays 40k, I'll be sure to tell them that

Kroothawk wrote:

At first it was amusing, but now I am annoyed that every single thread on Sororitas turns into an off-topic adult flaming feast by the same few people. I sincerely hope that some time in the near future it is possible again to discuss WH/Sororitas issues in a civil and on-topic way again. The fans of this army deserve that much respect.

Seconded. It's a shame, because the actual point of the thread is good, and we've seen some great art.

Terminus wrote:Camel toe? Really?

That's practically worksafe compared to some of the other stuff by that artist!

Or a Repentia Mistress being a... well... let's just say the artist had DIFFERENT ideas on what it meant to be a mistress of penitent Sisters.

I just think they should be more brutal and bulky instead of stripped down power bra stripper boots. It fits the 40k theme better. I really don't care about sci/fantasy cliches of hot chicks in skimpy armor, or what wierd S&M fetishes go into the idealism of it, they just don't look that tough. I think it's kind of lame and wouldn't want to field an army of 14 yr sci/fantasy fetish models if I'm playing a game about giant killing machines, superhuman hulks, and horrid aliens. I had some D&D figs when I was a kid who were doing the chainmail bikini, or short cut robe sorceress thing for an outfit and they were embarrassing back then as they are now. Dragon magazine had a cartoon back in the 80s where some chick is in the tavern, in her big boob chainmail bikini outfit chatting with some lusty gamer looking guy.. bunch of arrows stuck in her armored areas... and the quote underneath is "...thankfully I was wearing my armor..." kind of shows whats up with women characters in games mostly played by men. Why aren't they tanked up like the guys are? oh yeah... cuz they're chicks. When I see a fat angry bald lesbo bitch model for sister supreme I'll be a little more convinced.

If you think the current Sisters of Battle are rocking "stripped down power bra stripper boots", you put the "tard" in "Guitardian".

WARBOSS TZOO wrote:

Terminus wrote:Camel toe? Really?

That's practically worksafe compared to some of the other stuff by that artist!

Spoiler:

Chainsword strap-on.

Oh THAT I have to see. Talk about penance! Link to this guy's stuff?

Terminus wrote:If you think the current Sisters of Battle are rocking "stripped down power bra stripper boots", you put the "tard" in "Guitardian".

WARBOSS TZOO wrote:

Terminus wrote:Camel toe? Really?

That's practically worksafe compared to some of the other stuff by that artist!

Spoiler:

Chainsword strap-on.

Oh THAT I have to see. Talk about penance! Link to this guy's stuff?

wow, total destructive ownage

personal attack removed.

Well, I'm not sure if this image is any good, but...



Hope I helped.

Necroman wrote:[img1]
[img2]
Hope I helped.

The first one is a nice action shot, the second one is... well, not really a Sororitas. Looks more like an assassin of some kind.

I'm still waiting to be linked to that bizarro artist. He sounds like Oglaf, which breaks all hilarity boundaries.

I'm not sure who that artist is in specific. I've only seen a few pictures in my (rare) forays into 4chan.

Yikes, I may be intrigued, but nowhere near curious enough to venture into THAT cesspool.

Guitardian wrote:I just think they should be more brutal and bulky instead of stripped down power bra stripper boots. It fits the 40k theme better. I really don't care about sci/fantasy cliches of hot chicks in skimpy armor, or what wierd S&M fetishes go into the idealism of it, they just don't look that tough. I think it's kind of lame and wouldn't want to field an army of 14 yr sci/fantasy fetish models if I'm playing a game about giant killing machines, superhuman hulks, and horrid aliens. I had some D&D figs when I was a kid who were doing the chainmail bikini, or short cut robe sorceress thing for an outfit and they were embarrassing back then as they are now. Dragon magazine had a cartoon back in the 80s where some chick is in the tavern, in her big boob chainmail bikini outfit chatting with some lusty gamer looking guy.. bunch of arrows stuck in her armored areas... and the quote underneath is "...thankfully I was wearing my armor..." kind of shows whats up with women characters in games mostly played by men. Why aren't they tanked up like the guys are? oh yeah... cuz they're chicks. When I see a fat angry bald lesbo bitch model for sister supreme I'll be a little more convinced.

Brutal and bulky, is not the theme of warhammer 40k the theme of warhammer 40k is grimdark and the rule of cool. If nuns with guns wearing power armor shaped to there fine feminine figure that feature breast cups, is consider cool

and grimdark then warhammer 40k has it.

Melissia wrote:

Blanche set the visual tone of 40k.

People keep saying this, but I don't see it. Blanche's art doesn't fit in with 40k in any way.

What!!?

Blanche is the definitive 40K artist. He produced some of the earliest artwork for 40K. Between him and Jes Goodwin they came up with what the world of 40k looks like. His art is scratchy, wild, crazed and energetic. It incorporates lots of gothic designs as well as some stylistic features that are actually present in gothic period artwork such as the oddly proportioned figures.

If Blanche isn't a 40k artist then who on earth is?




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Melissia wrote:

bravelybravesirrobin wrote:

Melissia wrote:There, we will have to disagree.

I think it looks stupid, not cool . Cool would be if they gave a medieval knight appearance to their armor, like futuristic gothic plate mail-- which they kinda do, except for the chest and abdomen. Which clash hideously with the rest of the armor. Instead it looks like they let that farce of an artist (when it comes to the female form at any rate) John Blanche get far more input into the artistic design than he ever deserved, and so he decided "they need giant tits and corsets".

Course, they must have reigned him in somewhat, or they'd have looked like [edit: removed the link, I just realized it's NSFW. I must be tired if I didn't realize most of his art regarding women is fetish porn...]

See I happen to think that John Blanche is a great artist and next to Jes the guy most responsible for the GW aesthetic. I love his work and I wished more models looked like it.

John Blanche MIGHT be a good artist, if you get hit in the head and forget what real art is like and all, but he cannot draw women to save his life.

I'm a little amused by this as I just spent my Saturday in an art gallery.

I was looking at examples of Japanese esoteric buddhist artwork.

A lot of it was done in inks and is scratchy, oddly proportioned and very stylised. I guess it must be bad art too.


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Asrodrig wrote:Sorry for going back to the OT, but here's some pictures I like. Sorry if I've posted any repeats.

This is extremely well done but the corset is wrong. Although shaped like a corset it should be metal textured not leather.

Cheesecat wrote:the rule of cool.

So when are they getting rid of the very uncool looking corset?

To each his own, again. I think the corsets look very cool.

Melissia wrote:

Cheesecat wrote:the rule of cool.

So when are they getting rid of the very uncool looking corset?

Well too a bunch of greasy nerds who play with toy soldiers, those corsets that capture the lovely curves of the sisters are considered cool.

Well, one instance where corsets are not cool is cosplay. I don't know what it is about miniature gaming, but the prevalence of obesity eclipses even video gamers or general sci-fi/fantasy geeks, and that unfortunate trend extends to the (miniscule) female subsection of the mini-wargamer population.

Nothing worse than a fat chick in a corset.

They look badass on Jes' miniatures, though, especially if they are painted well.

I saw a big fat guy dressed as Sailor Saturn once.

Asrodrig wrote:I saw a big fat guy dressed as Sailor Saturn once.

Sailor Bubba! Man, I love that guy.

Terminus wrote:Yikes, I may be intrigued, but nowhere near curious enough to venture into THAT cesspool.

Yeah, sorry, saw it there too. I'll keep an eye out for it again though.

Whut?

I've seen worse cosplays. Much worse.
*considers posting image*

...No.

Man-fey anyone?


I'm lucky enough that I live in Japan where obesity is incredibly rare. The one time I actually went to a cos-play event all the cosplayers, boys and girls, were incredibly hot.

Please, please, please. We've already talked about Chainsaw phalic symbols and corsets. Please(!) let's not drag this thread down into the realms of Cosplay fail.

Emperors Faithful wrote:Please, please, please. We've already talked about Chainsaw phalic symbols and corsets. Please(!) let's not drag this thread down into the realms of Cosplay fail.

lest the warp swallow us whole.

Nightsbane wrote:

Emperors Faithful wrote:Please, please, please. We've already talked about Chainsaw phalic symbols and corsets. Please(!) let's not drag this thread down into the realms of Cosplay fail.

lest the warp swallow us whole.

That could be a better alternative...

I recommend you to do research in DeviantArt which has a substantial collection of 40K material, much of which is rubbish but some of which is rather good. You can also commission work from some of the artists.

Apart from that I think this thread has fulfilled its useful ife, so I will now lock it.

If someone wants it to be unlocked, please feel free to contact another moderator.