ShumaGorath wrote: There's definitely a breadth to Japanese cinema, though realistically the vast majority of Japanese films are low budget with poor acting and writing. It's not a mature industry.
No, but it's larger than the average American believes(ie. more than just the aforementioned Godzilla, J-horror, and Sentai) and largely NOT dominated by the anime sector as American otaku would have you believe.
It's also only slightly younger than hollywood(at least according to all the books on it I bought whilst working at B&N when I went crazy over the subject).
Platuan4th wrote:
How about all those Samurai historicals that come from Japan, or anything by Akira Kurasawa, or Godzilla, or a large part of the genre that is named(shockingly) J-horror?
And those are just the ones that make it to mass market America. Once you go online and see the stuff you can import, you'll see your extreme ignorance on the subject.
Yes, but my ignorance is incredibly intentional. Seeing as though J-Horror movies are obscenely stupid and I think samurai are overrated, there is no reason for me to watch those. Anything directed by M. Night Shamylan or closely resembling anything close to an M. Night Shamylan film is not worth my money or time.
BTW, there are reasons that only certain ones make it to mass market America.
Yes, but my ignorance is incredibly intentional. Seeing as though J-Horror movies are obscenely stupid and I think samurai are overrated, there is no reason for me to watch those.
The horror genre is obscenely stupid in general and samurai are awesome.
Anything directed by M. Night Shamylan or closely resembling anything close to an M. Night Shamylan film is not worth my money or time.
He's an American film maker. I think you're trollan but I can't really be sure here.
BTW, there are reasons that only certain ones make it to mass market America.
Hollywood has one hundred times the budget of it's japanese equivalent?
halonachos wrote:
So I think that it would almost be safe to say that anime is just overcompensation for the inherent rascism in the country of Japan that would be apparant to the rest of the world if they made movies with an all japanese cast.
The enormous industry that is Japanese cinema proves this statement blatantly false.
If the Japanese need an non-Japanese cast member, they're not afraid to hire one.
Japanese Cinema, bah, never heard of it. If you mean FF XIV then that's CGI, not real people.
Now you're just being intentionally obtuse and argumentative.
How about all those Samurai historicals that come from Japan, or anything by Akira Kurasawa, or Godzilla, or a large part of the genre that is named(shockingly) J-horror?
And those are just the ones that make it to mass market America. Once you go online and see the stuff you can import, you'll see your extreme ignorance on the subject.
Sorry lets be real, none of that is mass market USA.
Yes, but my ignorance is incredibly intentional. Seeing as though J-Horror movies are obscenely stupid and I think samurai are overrated, there is no reason for me to watch those.
The Entire horror genre is obscenely stupid in general and samurai are awesome.
Pretty sure thats what you meant, but I added it in there for meself.
I am very unfamiliar with Jap films, only ones I have really seen are Godzilla. And those are mostly because my dad loves them.
halonachos wrote:
So I think that it would almost be safe to say that anime is just overcompensation for the inherent rascism in the country of Japan that would be apparant to the rest of the world if they made movies with an all japanese cast.
The enormous industry that is Japanese cinema proves this statement blatantly false.
If the Japanese need an non-Japanese cast member, they're not afraid to hire one.
Japanese Cinema, bah, never heard of it. If you mean FF XIV then that's CGI, not real people.
Now you're just being intentionally obtuse and argumentative.
How about all those Samurai historicals that come from Japan, or anything by Akira Kurasawa, or Godzilla, or a large part of the genre that is named(shockingly) J-horror?
And those are just the ones that make it to mass market America. Once you go online and see the stuff you can import, you'll see your extreme ignorance on the subject.
Sorry lets be real, none of that is mass market USA.
Seven Samurai, Godzilla 2000, The Ring, and Ju-On/The Grudge disagree with you.
halonachos wrote:
So I think that it would almost be safe to say that anime is just overcompensation for the inherent rascism in the country of Japan that would be apparant to the rest of the world if they made movies with an all japanese cast.
The enormous industry that is Japanese cinema proves this statement blatantly false.
If the Japanese need an non-Japanese cast member, they're not afraid to hire one.
Japanese Cinema, bah, never heard of it. If you mean FF XIV then that's CGI, not real people.
Now you're just being intentionally obtuse and argumentative.
How about all those Samurai historicals that come from Japan, or anything by Akira Kurasawa, or Godzilla, or a large part of the genre that is named(shockingly) J-horror?
And those are just the ones that make it to mass market America. Once you go online and see the stuff you can import, you'll see your extreme ignorance on the subject.
Sorry lets be real, none of that is mass market USA.
Seven Samurai, Godzilla 2000, The Ring, and Ju-On/The Grudge disagree with you.
Seven Samurai? Seriously? Kid that was made before you were born.
Godzilla 2000? DG did that even play in the US? I know PSAs that had more people see it. Come on pick a real movie.
The Ring-you mean the US version? yea that was a hit here. The US version. You have to rent the Japanes e version in the foreign section fo the video store.
The Grudge? Again, if these are examples of market penetration then your view of mass market penetration and mine are way way way way different.
Frazzled wrote: Godzilla 2000? DG did that even play in the US? I know PSAs that had more people see it. Come on pick a real movie.
Fail, Frazzled.
Tristar Pictures released Godzilla 2000 in 2,111 North American theatres on August 18, 2000. It grossed $4,407,720 ($2,087 per screen) in its opening weekend, on its way to a $10,037,390 final gross.
halonachos wrote:
So I think that it would almost be safe to say that anime is just overcompensation for the inherent rascism in the country of Japan that would be apparant to the rest of the world if they made movies with an all japanese cast.
The enormous industry that is Japanese cinema proves this statement blatantly false.
If the Japanese need an non-Japanese cast member, they're not afraid to hire one.
Japanese Cinema, bah, never heard of it. If you mean FF XIV then that's CGI, not real people.
Now you're just being intentionally obtuse and argumentative.
How about all those Samurai historicals that come from Japan, or anything by Akira Kurasawa, or Godzilla, or a large part of the genre that is named(shockingly) J-horror?
And those are just the ones that make it to mass market America. Once you go online and see the stuff you can import, you'll see your extreme ignorance on the subject.
Sorry lets be real, none of that is mass market USA.
Seven Samurai, Godzilla 2000, The Ring, and Ju-On/The Grudge disagree with you.
Movies from before I was born, monster movies that are dvd classics but mediocre in the box office and American remakes of Japanese films aren't what I would consider market penetration. Anime films are about the only things that manage to actually break into the cinema scene here from japan, even then it's a rarity.
Frazzled wrote:
Godzilla 2000? DG did that even play in the US? I know PSAs that had more people see it. Come on pick a real movie.
Fail, Frazzled.
Tristar Pictures released Godzilla 2000 in 2,111 North American theatres on August 18, 2000. It grossed $4,407,720 ($2,087 per screen) in its opening weekend, on its way to a $10,037,390 final gross.
Troll harder next time, please.
English version
Tristar, a division of Sony Pictures, picked up Godzilla 2000 for theatrical distribution in North America. It would be the first and only Japanese Godzilla movie since Godzilla 1985 to be released in North American theatres. Mike Schlesinger, who supervised the North American release, said, "It (Godzilla 2000) was such a spectacular success in Japan, we decided it was worth taking a shot, maybe the time was right for Godzilla to come back to theaters."[2] Sony spent approximately $1 million to re-edit and dub the movie, and an addition $10–12 million to market.[2]
[edit] Box office
Tristar Pictures released Godzilla 2000 in 2,111 North American theatres on August 18, 2000. It grossed $4,407,720 ($2,087 per screen) in its opening weekend, on its way to a $10,037,390 final gross.[3] Future Millennium Godzilla films would be released direct-to-DVD in North America.
First godzilla movie in 15 years and not a financial success. That was also 10 years ago.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Platuan4th wrote:
ShumaGorath wrote:American remakes of Japanese films aren't what I would consider market penetration.
Both Japanese version were also shown in American theaters in select cities.
So are indie films, silent films, and classics. That's meaningless.
BaronIveagh wrote:I might point out that, compared to the over all percentage of television and movies produced, anime has less gak per capita then, say, soap operas or 'reality TV'
I'd estimate it's gak content is about on par with live action sitcoms and action movies.
I mean, come on, I don't think any of us can say that Sly or AHnold have ever produced any deeply thought provoking films, but I think it's safe to say that a lot of them were over the top, nonsensical and cliche'd within an inch of their lives.
Point made.
I have to admit, I'm into the old Ahnold films, so perhaps it isn't fair of me to criticise anime for having the same features. I think perhaps my real objection to anime isn't really to do with the actual thing itself, but the more extreme fans, the kind that watch, say, Neon Genesis Evangelion and say it's really deep and philosophical. After all, nobody (except perhaps Ahnold himself) ever tried to label Commando as a deep examination of the human soul. I guess I just find that a little bit annoying.
Kind of like those people that claim 40K is a really deep game...
...my God. These people are in EVERY fanbase!
No Shuma, I'm not trolling, I think that M.Night Shamylan should be buried alive. And The Ring or the Grudge, wtf!
Those movies were incredibly terrible. I mean a haunted videotape that killed everyone who watched it in seven business days or a kid that sounded like a cat are just plain slowed.
I would say that the resident evil series had better plot developement and story developers.
I also believe that Godzilla 2000 was an american film. If it was Japanese the director should be hung and shot repeatedly with crossbows set on fire.
Frazzled wrote:
Godzilla 2000? DG did that even play in the US? I know PSAs that had more people see it. Come on pick a real movie.
Fail, Frazzled.
Tristar Pictures released Godzilla 2000 in 2,111 North American theatres on August 18, 2000. It grossed $4,407,720 ($2,087 per screen) in its opening weekend, on its way to a $10,037,390 final gross.
Troll harder next time, please.
US$10MM?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Thats why there haven't been anything since. US$10MM? Dude thats the coke and donut budget for a hollywood production.
Cloverfield's DVD sales alone were $29MM.
How to Train Your Dragon has made $210MM to date.
Even the horrific new nightmare on Elmstreet has made $60MM and it sucked balls.
I love these critics quotes for Godzilla 2000
24 Frames Per Second "...a gloriously bad movie." more...
Arrow in the Head "... a big waste of time." more...
E! Online (grade: C+) "...cheesy..." more...
http://movies.yahoo.com/movie/1800552740/critic
Your reality and apparently everyone else's are only tangentially related when it comes to USA market penetration.
Dang economics, I'm going to just put my fingers in my ears until this economic thing passes. Let me know when you need to discuss chemistry or something.
halonachos wrote: I also believe that Godzilla 2000 was an american film. If it was Japanese the director should be hung and shot repeatedly with crossbows set on fire.
If you meant the CGI Godzilla(based off of a mutated Iguana with Matthew Broderick), then that's the American film.
Godzilla 2000 was Japan's response to the American film.
#Coming from the co owner of Animedreaming, zomganime, animegiven and formally leetanine and rogueanime lol. (You find me by furan or raven - hit me up if you see me)
Now I know that this thread changed direction. I just wanted to chime in about how much I like anime =]
You know, me and a friend of mine are creating a Manga. It's a side project, so it's not anything fancy, but I have had this idea in my head (among with others, but this is my favorite) and I want to get it out there. Only problem is, we live in different states (Hers is Awesome and mine is Denial ).
And yes, It will be American drawn Manga, but hey, I asked another friend of mine for some artistic assistance, and she refered me to this other friend, and after seeing her work, I gotta say, if she didn't have a boyfriend I would kiss her for directing me to the Illustrator.
Japanazi druids? This sounds like a story I'd watch, regardless of its medium. Do they attempt to conquer the world, or eliminate all non-tree life? Or are the Japanazi druids the good guys?
The japanese nazi druids are the bad guys. They use pokemon/final fanstasy/anime to dominate the world because they couldn't do it militarily during WW2. After the war, all of the nazi scientists went to japan and that is why after the war japan became a technological powerhouse.
That is also why the ps3 looks like they took the roofs off of two miniatures volkswagen beetles and glued them together.
Your reality and apparently everyone else's are only tangentially related when it comes to USA market penetration.
Scuse me? Why don't you back that one up a bit.
To be clear, he has an incorrect view of what market penetration is in the USA of the films mentioned.
Let's be fair what nation has market penetration of any sort in the US?
French films?
German films?
Russian films?
British films
(Canadian films don't count due to the integration often making it difficult to determine when a film is Canadian or American)
Your reality and apparently everyone else's are only tangentially related when it comes to USA market penetration.
Scuse me? Why don't you back that one up a bit.
To be clear, he has an incorrect view of what market penetration is in the USA of the films mentioned.
Let's be fair what nation has market penetration of any sort in the US?
French films?
German films?
Russian films?
British films
(Canadian films don't count due to the integration often making it difficult to determine when a film is Canadian or American)
Brit films I'd say, with a slight helping of French films. There's so much transposition between Brit/US in terms of writers/actors/directors there's no real difference at this point.
Your reality and apparently everyone else's are only tangentially related when it comes to USA market penetration.
Scuse me? Why don't you back that one up a bit.
To be clear, he has an incorrect view of what market penetration is in the USA of the films mentioned.
Let's be fair what nation has market penetration of any sort in the US?
French films?
German films?
Russian films?
British films
(Canadian films don't count due to the integration often making it difficult to determine when a film is Canadian or American)
Brit films I'd say, with a slight helping of French films. There's so much transposition between Brit/US in terms of writers/actors/directors there's no real difference at this point.
Brit films that have cracked the North American market that are British in nature are still very rare. I can only think of maybe ten in the last 15 years.
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focusedfire wrote:You forget Chinese wire action films.
So, other then Crouching Tiger how much money have those made?
Please note, I don't think Japanese movies have had any real penetration either.
This is your good friend Alphen speaking, Grambo. I am afraid you are mistaken; "Libera Me From Hell" has a much higher default volume than "Raining Blood". In other words, I drown out Slayer with Shoko Nakagawa. Oh, in case any of you didn't catch on, I'm the friend Grambo refers to in the OP.
BREAKTHROUGHTHEDREAM wrote:This is your good friend Alphen speaking, Grambo. I am afraid you are mistaken; "Libera Me From Hell" has a much higher default volume than "Raining Blood". In other words, I drown out Slayer with Shoko Nakagawa. Oh, in case any of you didn't catch on, I'm the friend Grambo refers to in the OP.
IT'S ALIVE! ALIIIIIIIIIVE!
Paranoid Conspiracy theorist: this is an elaborate plot for one guy to have two accounts to post on one forum. I'm on to you, don't think I'm not....
Since DREAM brought it back from the dead, has anyone seen Helsing? Not really a good anime, but Alucard makes an amazing Vamp. (A note to all Directors: If your going to have a Vampire main character, go the route of Alucard from Helsing, not Edward Cullen from Twilight.)
).
