What armies would you never consider playing, for any reason at all? Which army "grinds your gears", to play with or against? Which armies model range has you gnashing at the teeth to assemble, or sneer at poor sculpts?
On the other hand, what Army has you stomping at the bit to start? Not in the poll, because we only care about seeing what people hate right?
Simply put, what army would you never play willingly.
For me, Necrons. The model range is gak IMHO, I don't like the rules, I don't like the fluff, and I hate phase out (Even when I play against them).
The only army I want to start is Orks. I have a few of the models, and even though the expense would destroy me, the model range+fluff has me head over heels in WAAAGH.
Eldar! Hate em. Can not bring myself to play them. I borrowed a friends army once and played with it. Was amusing and silly. However, I started out as Dark Eldar. The Eldar Cheese destroyed any desire to play them (this was ten years ago). Since then, the Eldar Codex has been remade twice, cheeser each time. While my beloved Dark Eldar are more or less the red headed step child of the 40k world. This has just turned into a seething sense of loathing for them.
I own or have owned a good many armies. some, have been given to blood relations to continue on. Or some just boxed away. Eldar, I only own one model and that is the Dire Avenger Exarch! Who serves as my Dark Eldar Archon.
Just, dislike everything Eldar. Dont mind killing them though.
Witch Hunters/Daemon Hunters - Both feel like half a codex and the Inquisitors are just fiddly character units.
Necrons - In dire need of a revamp, their army is just dull, uniformly, machined dullness.
Blood Angels - "Whirlwind of Gore".... enough said.
Dark Angels - In high school I knew 5 DA players out of 9 of us who played...
IG - After playing Orks for so long I can't stand another horde army. At least with 'nids I could justify the painting of the hordes with the Tervigons spewing 'em out, or taking a warrior army....
Black Templars - 2 of the 9 that I started playing with were "Hit On 3+" BTs...
Tau - Don't like their lack of variety. Shoot, Shoot or Shoot?
I will eventually have at least 1000 points of each army, possibly more. Each is unique and interesting in its own way, and even the ones I don't like have their redeeming qualities and something in there tugs at me and entices me, at least a little.
Witch hunters- nothing about them appeals to me. I don't like the fluff, the rules, or the most of the models.The models I do like are the inquisitors and I much prefer DH.
Necrons- The rules are boring and don't fit the feel of the army at all.
I will eventually have at least 1000 points of each army, possibly more. Each is unique and interesting in its own way, and even the ones I don't like have their redeeming qualities and something in there tugs at me and entices me, at least a little.
Yes, even Blood Angels.
Yes, I may even field them someday.
Yes, I will be filing their nipples off.
Yes, you will be writing fluff for them (Involving Tau and rubber gloves?)
I will eventually have at least 1000 points of each army, possibly more. Each is unique and interesting in its own way, and even the ones I don't like have their redeeming qualities and something in there tugs at me and entices me, at least a little.
Yes, even Blood Angels.
Yes, I may even field them someday.
Yes, I will be filing their nipples off.
Yes, you will be writing fluff for them (Involving Tau and rubber gloves?)
My Tau are damaged enough as it is, thank you. They don't need more "fun in the sun" with Blood Angels.
I will eventually have at least 1000 points of each army, possibly more. Each is unique and interesting in its own way, and even the ones I don't like have their redeeming qualities and something in there tugs at me and entices me, at least a little.
Yes, even Blood Angels.
Yes, I may even field them someday.
Yes, I will be filing their nipples off.
Yes, you will be writing fluff for them (Involving Tau and rubber gloves?)
My Tau are damaged enough as it is, thank you. They don't need more "fun in the sun" with Blood Angels.
Oh yes...
Man, where are you anyway? I'm disappointed that I'll probably never face the Tau I constantly poke fun at.
I'm just waiting for you to read my edit, and Alpharius to lock for OT.
ON TOPIC, are you entirely sure about the 1000 points of every army? Surely, one of them hasn't appealed to you in any way. Which of those armies have you enjoyed enough to expand beyond that little minimum you set?
I've definitely enjoyed Daemons enough to expand that one, I'm going for 2000 as soon as I have enough cashmoney to buy new models, and my Tau list will eventually reach 2500. Orks are getting an expansion to 1500. Other than that, 1000 points until I play and truly enjoy each army. I'm selling most of my Marines, since I don't enjoy playing them as much as I enjoy painting them, but keeping 1000 points of Deathwatch, using the vanilla codex.
As for armies that hold NO interest for me, there isn't one.
I like the "space Illuminati" feel of the Dark Angels, some of their fluff fascinates me.
I like the "space crusaders" feel of BT, and they'd be a fun choppy SM army to try.
I like the various quirks of the Blood Angels - none of their special characters interest me, but I do like the idea of an army made up of nothing but assault marines, since assault marines are fun as hell to play.
I like the look and feel of Eldar, and am currently working on a 1000 point Eldar jetbike list.
I like the fluff and to a degree the look and feel of Dark Eldar, though I'm waiting for a new codex.
I could go on. There is something about every army that I like, and as a result I want to eventually try them all.
Only when I buy them, paint them, play them, and really like them will I expand beyond 1000 points.
SaintHazard wrote:I've definitely enjoyed Daemons enough to expand that one, I'm going for 2000 as soon as I have enough cashmoney to buy new models, and my Tau list will eventually reach 2500. Orks are getting an expansion to 1500. Other than that, 1000 points until I play and truly enjoy each army. I'm selling most of my Marines, since I don't enjoy playing them as much as I enjoy painting them, but keeping 1000 points of Deathwatch, using the vanilla codex.
As for armies that hold NO interest for me, there isn't one.
I like the "space Illuminati" feel of the Dark Angels, some of their fluff fascinates me.
I like the "space crusaders" feel of BT, and they'd be a fun choppy SM army to try.
I like the various quirks of the Blood Angels - none of their special characters interest me, but I do like the idea of an army made up of nothing but assault marines, since assault marines are fun as hell to play.
I like the look and feel of Eldar, and am currently working on a 1000 point Eldar jetbike list.
I like the fluff and to a degree the look and feel of Dark Eldar, though I'm waiting for a new codex.
I could go on. There is something about every army that I like, and as a result I want to eventually try them all.
Only when I buy them, paint them, play them, and really like them will I expand beyond 1000 points.
I'd say I'm in the same boat (Can't really hate much of the armies), except for Crons. I've played a game with a store army, and don't like them. I feel that (a) until a new codex comes out, there is no real list variety (Hell, look at BA. I could run Librarian heavy Assault spam backed up with outflanking Baals, or run Dante with SG backed up by Dev and Scout squads with a Demolisher in tow, I could even run a 9 dread army with 3 Vens, 3 DC, 3 Normal, with Chaplain (Forgot the HQ version name) running my DC!), I can't customize my models unless I want to heavily convert, and the fluff is...stupid.
The other armies interest me on a sliding scale, from most to least I'd say
Orkz
IG Daemons
Tau
Eldar
Witchhunters
Space Wolves
Black Templar
Dark Eldar
Daemon Hunters
Dark Angels
Chaos Space Marines
Squa-
I will never ever play the fluff rape that is the Tyranid Codex. Thank you Robin Cruddace. I mean, some parts are fine,
But after seeing things like: ''The Iron Warriors have 6000 defilers. But we have a gakload of Trygons. The Iron Warriors Died!''
OR: ''The Imperial Guard tank army drove into the Eldar-occupied desert. But due to the dust and sandstorms, the Guard tanks could'nt see anything.
But they manage to win anyway.''
I have an extremely bad habit of falling in love with a piece of fluff from a given army, coming up with a list, then scrambling to buy the minis. I currently have six lists I want to buy minis for but can't afford to.
I accept the fact that I will eventually have 1000 points of each army not as a choice but as an inevitability.
I'm generally a "forces of order" guy, so I'm not a big fan of those factions who exists soley to destroy/consume. This pretty much rules out Chaos, Orks, Necrons and Tyranids for me. Their concept (I guess you could call it fluff) just has no appeal for me.
I am trying to get an army of each race, within reason..
Currently I have armies of at least 2000 points for..
Sisters (Play frequently)
Eldar (sitting until new codex makes transports cheaper)
Tyranids (Genestealer swarm)
Orks (play a lot, BW and Kan focused)
Vanilla SM (homebrew)
Space Wolf (homebrew color scheme)
Almost finished
Necrons (awaiting new dex, currently 1500 pts, unpainted)
Tau (awaiting new codex, currently 1500, painted)
Deathwatch (Vanilla SM, looking at 3000 with Vanguard)
Sitting in boxes awaiting next surge of motivation, (and actively looking for models in trade)
Chaos Daemons (Slaanesh/Tz mix)
Nurgle CSM Death Guard
Dark Eldar (awaiting codex, mainly getting jetbikes and raiders)
Contemplating ..
IG using Wargames Factory Greatcoats (down to HW teams)
About the only thing I have not given thought to is pure Grey Knights, and that may indeed change if the rumored codexes come to fruition.
I do not play with Black Templars, Blood Angels or Dark Angels.. but if I needed to, my vanilla SM force can supply any models I might want to use.. (I think)
tau, almost all the tau players i have met (save one) have just been no fun to play with, not just how the army works, but just the way they act and treat the game. i seem to have little fun playing them, thou i enjoy playing most other armies. later on in my life i wentover the rulebook and i just couldnt stand the rules, it just didnt seem to be an army that worked with me or seemed to be anything more than an IG codex that shoots more and has marker lights.
Necrons, definitely. Dislike everything about them - fluff, models, rules, and one of the two people I know who actually plays them (by proxy only, for now) tends to be a huge TFG when he loses, which he does constantly against my Wolves.
Although I will say that they aren't incapable of winning. The other Necron player I know plays them brilliantly.
I will never play a Daemons, Necrons or Tyranids army. It might be my Australian blood, but I love the idea of Mad Max style convoys of vehicles carrying the army around. Forces that wouldn't know mechanised infantry if they ran them over do not appeal to me.
I don't like the current range of Dark Eldar models and have no desire to collect the pack of freaks that is a Chaos Space Marine army, so they're out too.
Blood Angels - I dislike their background. I just can't bring myself to play them.
Tyranids - I hate every tiny little thing about the Tyranids. I hate their models, I hate their background (such as it is), I frequently run into Tyranids players who piss me off, and I absolutely despise their rules. If I played them I could probably win nine out of ten games, but I would disgust myself.
Dark Eldar - See the above statements in regards to players, rules, and my state of mind if I played them.
Although IG and Orks would be soul-numbing to paint and buy, I can see myself getting around to ALL of the other armies eventually.
I like BA fluff(the old fluff not the piece of that it is now), but i will never be accused of and so don't play them.
I will never EVER play IG. to many frakking models to paint and buy. i also dislike the new codex as it has very little customisation(bring back doctrans for emperors sake)
Dark Eldar: Their codex is the most outdated, their models are ugly, and the one person in my store who plays them is extremly loud and annoying. Their backround is also disturbing
Necrons: the most bland backround and a bland codex to go along with it
Blood Angels: new codex seems too over-powered and makes them into space vampires
Space Wolves: new codex makes them space werewolves instead of Vikings
Armys I would like to start:
Tyranids: I love the models, and I like the amount of ways to play them
crazyK wrote:I'll never play IG. I don't want that "autowin" label applied to me.
lol... guard... auto-win... lol...
As for me, there is an army out there that has virtually no options, terrible models, and all their special rules have been broken in half by 5th ed. Unless they get a COMPLETE overhaul, I wouldn't be able to take myself seriously if I ever played necron.
For me, it would be any Marine codex aside from Space Wolves. Assuming you mean "collect" at any rate, as I have played C:SM using Sisters models in Counts As.
Dunno, something about the puppies amuses me and appeals to me.
I'll probably never play Nec's, unless someone gives me a full army with the dex. But the main reason is that he model line IMO just sucks, to ... well long rant short everything already said about them.
However, very tempted to give DE another shot....someday.
I wanted to mention that I don't want to play any of the imperial armies, because EVERYBODY plays the imperial armies...
but then I realized that I have this desire to start an infantry themed IG list and paint them like the EDF from Earth Defense Force 2017. That was a great game. So any imperial army save ED-I mean imperial guard. Space Marines and their expansions are just too... mary sue for me.
I do want to start a Khorne Warband of CSM though. I plan on getting on that as soon as I can scrounge up my money. Something about Chaos is awesome. Their Primarch's actually have depth. Magnus the Red, Angron, Mortarion, these are charachters who have depth. I just don't see any depth in characters like Russ or Guilliman or even Dorn to an extent.
In the mean time, I'll just play my Eldar. My slender lithe little elves who have the best toy spaceships in the range, so much better than those jokes the Tau call "toy spaceships". zoom zoom
I don't think I'll ever play 'nids because they'd be a pain to assemble and I'd have to magnetize and create a lot of different models that GW hasn't released in order to build a decent army.
I'll never play tau because marker lights confuse me.
I like all the other armies though. I think GK's and SoB's are cool because they're unique and have pretty cool models. I like the masochism of the DE.
I used to play SW until the new codex came out and then everyone had to start playing SW and I was tired of looking like I was just hopping on the band wagon. Which is why I switched to necrons. That and I don't have to buy tons of troop transports... although the next codex will probably kill all of my interest in them.
Too anachronistic and vikings are hella lame. They only seem to exist as the ultimate nerd fantasy in other words they drink and party all the time, apparently are popular with the ladies? (or maybe thats just that trickster loser), and are all down with the man. They're pretty much all the things a greasy neckbeard wishes he could be
They're just space frat boys and don't fit. Orks are kinda similar I guess but at least they bring something different, are funny, and aren't more Spess Mahreens or humans. I wouldn't want Orks to go though, but if SW were squatted I wouldn't mind, or rather combined in one SM mega-dex.
Daemons of Chaos: I just think that daemons are a little stupid, and that they are too far-fetched and have no cool armour. Also, TOO MAWCH FLESHIE BITS!!!
Dark Eldar: They are crazy torture lovers. Uggh. Next.
Eldar: Prissy space elves. Never liked guys who are so weak.
Space Wolves: Bloody spankers. So much hair they could strangle you with it. Do they have Scottish accents? I always imagined them with Scottish accents. Anyways, too much flesh. Next.
Witch Hunters: An all woman army never appealed to me...
If I had unlimited time and money, I would play every army... as it is, I own two Eldar armies (one a very nice gift, one in progress,) and have recently pulled Space Marines and Dark Eldar out of storage. When I am done with my Eldar, I will build a Tau army, because they were created after I stopped playing last time around so they are new to me. And when I am done with them, I fancy Orks...
Thier name is stupid, they look stupid, they have those lame glowing green stick gun things and they only have like three different models...okay, maybe four...
Blood Angels
Chaos Daemons
Chaos Space Marines
Dark Eldar
Orks
Space Wolves
Tau
Tyranids
Witch Hunters - Will never play a SoB army. I actually DON'T like the models for them. Not because they are metal (I still wouldn't collect them if they WERE plastic), but because I no longer have the same hard-on for Debbie Harry clones that John Blanche still does.
Dark Angels
Black Templar
The main reason: I don't like enough of their models to make a legal army that is distinct enough from a plain vanilla one (in the case of variants-on-a-theme). I might like some of the models in the range, but one generally can't have an army consisting solely of them. I DO have a monolith, DE Raider, Tau Hammerhead, ork trukk and single tyranid warrior (used for a 54mm scale ALIEN conversion.
The rules are irrelevant. If I don't like the models, then playing that army is never going to happen.
I want to play tau, other than that, anything non imperial, or blood angels or space wolves I wont play. Id play BT or DA if they came out, i just hope their not as cheesy as the other chapters..
Black templars:
Black guns
Black Sword
Black Cannon
Black men
Black Attack
Black Talons
Black angels..is that even possible?
Dark Angels:
Dark Guns
Dark Sword
Dark Cannon
Dark men
Dark Attack
Dark Talons
Dark angel....wait...
Dark matter cannon!
Its all the same
Space wolves
Wolf claws
Wolf FACE
Wolfnaught.
I never rule out anything about anything, but it's safe to say I probably won't play any Imperium armies in the near and distant future. I won't ever play Eldar most likely either, but didn't mark them because I don't hate them (as poll insists).
Sageheart wrote:tau, almost all the tau players i have met (save one) have just been no fun to play with, not just how the army works, but just the way they act and treat the game. i seem to have little fun playing them, thou i enjoy playing most other armies.
care to elaborate? D they act boring? Obnoxious? Dbags? Uninteresting? Too serious? Too nice? Those awkward types ("weirdo virgin f*ggots" as one of my friend says)?
I've been generalized as a Tau player somehow. When I was playing my CSM at a new games place out of town, a guy I've never met was watching me and my friend play. After talking for a bit, I told him I play Tau the most. He said "I can see that, you seem like a Tau player." I didn't ask why, I just assumed it's because my great personality, honest face, ravishing good looks, selfless utilitarianism...I can go on and on.
chromedog wrote:Witch Hunters - Will never play a SoB army. I actually DON'T like the models for them [...] because I no longer have the same hard-on for Debbie Harry clones that John Blanche still does.
*bursts into giggles*
Heh, I wonder how many people expected me to react poorly to this. I agree, the models are sub-par at best. Sisters need new models, preferably with a chestplate that looks like actual gothic plate armor rather than "how much silicone should I have put in here?"
Why not just leave CSM with their demons..?
I don't like Armies that have things that can't talk or communicate like regular people.
Tyranids
I know I'll prolly get bashed "Oh no! Tyranids are people to!"....No, no they are not im my book, they are hungry space lizards.
Which Hunters:
Space Nuns with guns....Say wuuut?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
chromedog wrote:
Witch Hunters - Will never play a SoB army. I actually DON'T like the models for them. Not because they are metal (I still wouldn't collect them if they WERE plastic), but because I no longer have the same hard-on for Debbie Harry clones that John Blanche still does.
From a fluff standpoint, they have no recognizable standardised set of organs/structure that differentiates them from other taxonomical categorizations (Such as mammalian mammary glands, Avian honeycomb-structure bones and feathers, etc) so I guess we can call them "things" if you want to be accurate.
Me, I call em' bugs. But only so I can say that I'm gonna need a bigger boot whenever my friend expands his nid's.
Dark Eldar. I'm not really into homoerotic bondage. If they were as they were in Rogue Trader, "Space Pirates", I'd consider it. Right now, they're way too fruity.
Orks. All ahead full, slow speed boyz! Yeah...no.
Witchhunters. If I wanted to play Marines, I'd play Marines. The idea of nuns with guns is ridiculous.
I cannot in good conscience ever play bugs again since they got rid of the genestealer cult army... I loved the Genestealer cult's fluff, the look of the hybrid models the idea of guard units being infiltrated with hybrids and turning rogue mid battle is the best idea GW ever had for either army... and then they got rid of them in favor of a more lame tyranid list.... sigh...
squats, cause they got ret-conned This post has been edited by the supreme authority of the GW Inquisition. There is not now nor ever was there a race of subhumans known as the 'squats'. Any such mention of their existence shall be labeled "Heresy" and shall invoke harsh consequences. That is all!
I still have hope for DH. I play them for the GK and we all know GW has a thing for marines so fingers crossed. I do wonder what the fluff will be like. After the last marine codeci I wonder how super mega awesome GK will be.
Melissia wrote:Ah yes, the metal nipple armor. When your metal nipples are noticeable from a distance, you should re-evaluate your life.
Says Boobcups Mcgee.
Anyways, I added Grey Knights to the poll. Aren't they getting official seperate super speshul cheese army treatment?
Also, should I add "Any brand new army, we have enough already"?
Grey Templar wrote:Someone should model the Sanguinor covering up his "exposed" areas with a couple of Non-BASMs laughing at him.
No, someone needs to model Kharn giving him two-fisted S6 AP2 titty-twisters.
SaintHazard wrote:Oh, well if we're traversing into the hypothetical here, I'm going to ask that you add LatD, Deathwatch, Demiurg, and Hrud to that list.
Also, the combined , and SoB as their own army.
Your options have been added and you should FEEL added.
agnosto wrote:Tau shoots more than IG? What codex are you looking at? You can get two guardsmen for each firewarrior with the same BS...
OT: I think I'll never play Eldar....never liked elves.
i mean it feels more like a shooting army. like i can make a shooty IG army, but tau just seems to do it better. like i can get tons more firepower with IG but with tau it seems i get all the IG gets with just better weapons and a bit less of them. then theres that run away in assault thing they can do which is just boring to play against sometimes, tau moves from behind rocks, fires, moves back behind rocks.
You could not pay me to play Space , er, Wolves. Fluffosaurus Magnus Erectus. I've suspected ever since 2nd that they are GW's favorite. I can't stand codexes that constantly have you asking, "They can do what?! No freaking way!" Boooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Grey Templar wrote:Someone should model the Sanguinor covering up his "exposed" areas with a couple of Non-BASMs laughing at him.
Necrons. Hate their fluff that suddenly inserted them into so many points of back story. Also can't stand the veiled thoughts that the C'tan are basically behind everything.
I don't think I'd ever consider collecting any of the Inquisition stuff or any other SM chapter. Dark Eldar I might depending on what the new sculpts look like.
tau,just becaue they dont fit!i mena come on! they only survived because of a millenia-long warp storm,how much luck would that be!and i dont like thier style.they dont match up to other races(eldar DE `crons orks even) in terms of coolnes.and not to be trollin but the marines too,just because of ther fluff any of them(black templar,blood angels etc.)
FUUUUDGE! wrote:tau,just becaue they dont fit!i mena come on! they only survived because of a millenia-long warp storm,how much luck would that be!and i dont like thier style.they dont match up to other races(eldar DE `crons orks even) in terms of coolnes.and not to be trollin but the marines too,just because of ther fluff any of them(black templar,blood angels etc.)
Might I point out that even some more "open-minded" Inquisitors are suspicious about the long warp-storm. Hint: its part of a mythological backstory reaching into the really old canon that mentions the sensei's and the Old Ones etc....
Anything SPESS MUHREEN. I will never support such blatant favoritism in this hobby. Overpowered rules, codexes being updated retardedly often, constant over exposure in fluff and advertising, models getting levels of support that other armies only get in their wet dreams and the idiotic profusion of number of codexes.
Blood Angels. I hate the rules, I hate the fluff, and I sure as hell hate the filthy bandwagon jumpers who play them. Don't get me wrong, the people who started Blood Angels before the newest codex are fine by me.
I won't play Imperial Guard. Not sci-fi enough fo me. Although as an Ork player I will be looting many of their tanks, IG have some great looking vehicles.
Red_Lives wrote:Sisters- The model Line is bad and i'm not a fan of the overall "feel" of the army. It just doesn't feel right.
Personally I like the Sisters, but I won't consider Sisters until they have plastic models.
I love to hate nids. The model range is bad, the rules are almost overpowered, and the fluff i just hate. no offense to tyranid players, but did they have to introduce dinosaurs to 40K? This is what i think of... http://tinyurl.com/253thvf. And i have to agree with Ugavine, IG as well aren't really sci-fi as you think they would be, nothing's really changed.
And Space Marines... bolt pistols? You see soldiers on the battlefields today with something at least as deadly as a machine gun or a rifle. Bear in mind these are supposed to be the emperor's elite defense. hmm... GW might need to rethink a bit. Again, no offense to anybody, i'm not criticizing the players of these armies.
I'm going to say Tau because the Crisis suits look like some crazy top-heavy robot chicken.
The troops are cool, the vehicles are cool, I quite like the Kroot too to be honest, it's just those damn Crisis suits that make whole force look daft.
YmeLocSquirrel256 wrote:And Space Marines... bolt pistols? You see soldiers on the battlefields today with something at least as deadly as a machine gun or a rifle.
Are you trying to say somehow that a bolt pistol is inferior to today's armaments?
Rethink that real quick.
Your heaviest small arms built today fire .50 caliber FMJ rounds.
Bolt pistols (the Space Marine's lightest small arm) fire .75 caliber high-explosive armor-piercing rounds. 50% bigger, 100% better at penetrating armor, and they explode.
YmeLocSquirrel256 wrote:And Space Marines... bolt pistols? You see soldiers on the battlefields today with something at least as deadly as a machine gun or a rifle. Bear in mind these are supposed to be the emperor's elite defense. hmm... GW might need to rethink a bit. Again, no offense to anybody, i'm not criticizing the players of these armies.
Err, what? You realize that Marines have both bolters and bolt pistols, right? And you realize that Bolters are basically rapid fire rocket propelled grenade launchers with .75 caliber HEAP rounds, right? And that's only the basic trooper?
I love the Chaos Daemons and maybe one day I'll pick up a distraction army or perhaps my focus while wander, but I very much doubt I'd every be interested enough in an army to overcome the repulsion I harbour to playing as an army which has Horde/Swarm as a "core mechanic".
i will play you, but likely will bring on a tailored list to kill 
and so don't play them.
, and 
Don't get me wrong, the people who started Blood Angels before the newest codex are fine by me.