Straight from Warseer, it looks like someone at GW screwed up while updating the site, giving us a look at the new Stormraven.

Thread

Pic

I'm disappointed.

we all said it was going too look like a box. But the models here at dakka dakka look so much better.

EDIT: DO not comment here we already made a thread for it here
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/327475.page
Please contact a mod to close this thread thank you.

If this is really it, then its okay. I have seen worse, but I have seen far better conversions as well.

Figured better post this in case they try to yank it -



Gotta say, I am not sure if it is a kit-bash or not. A good one mind you, but certain parts still look all too familiar. Pretty cool, but not as cool as it could have been if it is the real deal. It look a hell of a lot like the conversions done by hobbyists, almost like they copied the conversions for the design lol.

Yea.... considering that was the main reason I was excited for Blood Angels, I'm Kinda not feeling it... Looks like they took two valk engines with wings, and attached them to the front part of a thunderhawk, and then glued on the tail fin from the thunderhawk... I mean I get that this is sci-fi, but as far as combat drop ships go, thats gotta be the most unbalanced crate ever. I can't imagine it flying, which is a big reason I'm not feeling it.

I dub it the chibi-hawk

vitki wrote:I dub it the chibi-hawk

+1 lol

Well you could take the front and make a killer Spartan Landraider conversion for all you old school rogue trader players out there!

I like it

looks like a mark 1 landraider with wings!
Not my cup of tea I'm affraid,

I'd need to see the rest of the angles before I have an opinion on it. I'm a big hater of "clear glass" on models in our hobby so that's already a negative for me but it might work.

Looks to be the real deal. Note the bloodstrike missiles under the wings etc. It looks more like a helicopter than a plane to be honest. I'm just not sure what people were expecting. The Thunderhawk has to be one of the most unrealistic GW vehicle ideas ever and it was always known that the Stormraven would follow the same design lines.

Asherian Command wrote:we all said it was going too look like a box. But the models here at dakka dakka look so much better.

EDIT: DO not comment here we already made a thread for it here
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/327475.page
Please contact a mod to close this thread thank you.

I understand the intent here, but that thread is called '7 flyers', not Stormraven production model pics, this deserves its own thread. How would people even know that the stormraven pics were out unless they looked at the ambiguously titled '7 flyers' thread? Rename the other thread '7 new flyers in the works for 40k, 1 revealed, Stormraven! pics on page whatever' and that solves the problem nicely though!

Looks like fun to me. Not too big, not too small. Cool.

@ Therion

The thing is I could picture a Thunderhawk Flying... like I can suspend belief enough to believe that one could fly..... The Stormraven, I can't... I mean how in the hell does a pilot even land that thing, keeping it level would be a achievement worthy of the emperor...

Aerodynamics are heresy.

ugh its vile....... it looks like the thunderhawk smoked to much during its pregnancy.....

It's the wings that bother me the most. They barely look connected to the frame of it at all. If they had been placed further up front or if they had extended the body a bit, it wouldn't have looked too bad (chunky, yes, but at least more acceptable,) but as it is it just looks bizarre.

Same sort of feeling I got with the Caestus Assault Ram from FW, actually. Wings felt tacked on, which is weird, considering that they're kind of the reason it should be flying at all. At least with the Caestus you could kinda handwave it by having it be made for space combat instead of atmospheric, but still.

Aerodynamics are heresy.

Hilarious. I enjoyed that.

In a game with a galaxy spanning empire, magic weapons, daemons and altered humans that can spit acid, it amazes me what some fellow enthusiasts consider too implausible to be fun.

Similar design cues and shaping to the T-hawk without that horrific bowl os sucksoup would have been nice, thanks. That looks like someone dropped a bottle of superglue into a box full of parts.

It just looks silly. Makes me chuckle everytime I see it.

Hmm, the only positive I can think of right now is that when the plastic Land Speeder first came out I thought it was way too boxy looking.

Over time it grew on me, maybe this will be the same?

Eitherway, if I do go for Daemonhunters next year, I'll probably get a couple just to save me the hassle of converting my own.

Now that you mention it... the wings look a lot like the wings on the Assault Ram... which is ridiculous, you could shoot those off with a bolter, or turbulence.

Sgt.Roadkill wrote:ugh its vile....... it looks like the thunderhawk smoked to much during its pregnancy.....

Haha hilarious, I know GW vehicles are kinda 'Chunky' eg the Leman Russ but this is too far, It's little stubby wings are an insult to aerodynamics. I can actually see the 10 space marines fitting in but that is all i will say in it's defense.

It's adorable!

The_0perator wrote:Now that you mention it... the wings look a lot like the wings on the Assault Ram... which is ridiculous, you could shoot those off with a bolter, or turbulence.

In space, there's no turbulence. So, there's no issue with that for the Caestus Assault Ram.

Anyways, as I said in the flyer thread...

I like it. It's simple, and it makes me think the Astartes who designed it looked at a Sikorsky Skycrane and said "Holy Emperor's Teats, THIS IS BRILLIANT!".

It's a Goldfish.

Or a beta.

I might have to paint one up as a beta, dub her "The Flying Fighting Fish"

Lootable for the orks, but entirely too ugly to be taken straight, in my opinion.

BrassScorpion wrote:

Aerodynamics are heresy.

Hilarious. I enjoyed that.

In a game with a galaxy spanning empire, magic weapons, daemons and altered humans that can spit acid, it amazes me what some fellow enthusiasts consider too implausible to be fun.

Lol, there isnt much in the game that would actually fly let's face it. I don't mind most of the time, and don't mind that much in this particular case. I can see potential in the kit.

The only thing that really bugs me is all the lift and thrust is in the back while it looks like 80% or more of the weight is in the front. The Thunderhawk is a shoe-box too, but at least the weight looks distributed. It's not so much an aerodynamics thing as it is an aesthetic balance issue I think. Anyone who stops to look at a Thunderhawk, Thunderbolt, Fighta-Bomba etc with a critical eye will instantly pick it apart scientifically on aerodynamics. However, they are not so bad as to instantly and fundamentally bother you with being somehow 'off'. The SR just looks fundamentally unbalanced I think, as is. In a way that draws the eye to it every time. At least from this angle anyhoo.

Nothing a little Plasitcard and effort can't remedy though! It will probably be cheaper than buying the raider/valk kit to bash together the standardized homebrew template everyone seems to have been using lol, and take less work to convert too.

BrassScorpion wrote:

Aerodynamics are heresy.

Hilarious. I enjoyed that.

In a game with a galaxy spanning empire, magic weapons, daemons and altered humans that can spit acid, it amazes me what some fellow enthusiasts consider too implausible to be fun.

Magical weapons, daemons, or galaxy spanning empires haven't been encountered in real life. Space shuttles and aeroplanes however have. If GW designs a daemon that looks like Popey the Sailor Man I don't have any evidence to call it unrealistic or even lame, just a strange concept that my imagination finds hard to believe even on an imaginary world. If GW makes a plane that supposedly can "jink effortlessly through the interceptor fire and maneouvre at full speed through the cluttered spires of a hive city" but makes it look like a hundred ton brick with two steel plates glued on the sides of it, I can provide real world evidence about the stupidity of the concept. It amazes me that you can't see the difference. Your fellow enthusiasts can.

Now, if GW wants to sell any real amount of these kits, they need to re-write its rules for the Codex: Grey Knights. Right now it's just junk. I'm pretty sure the Valkyrie kit sales wouldn't even be half of what they are if the Vendetta option didn't exist in the IG codex.

worst model GW has ever produced it worst model

Why are people so hung up on the wings?

This isn't a fighter jet or a high altitude bomber.

This is a gunship.

It'll operate in the same role as an Apache does today.

InB4 "Apaches have too small wings for lift!"

The tail and body look nothing like any part a a Thawk...
I know because I finished building one a couple months back.

It does look like it has several parts cribed from other GW and FW models

Wings =Valk
Under wing missiles = new Ironclad dread shoulder missiles
Engines= familiar but can't place
Turret= resemblance to FW Marauder Bomber one but not the same....

For me it just looks a bit too small for every thing it has the rules to carry...

It's ugly as sin, but I really dig it. Love the turret. I think it'll look better with a Dreadnought in place.

I'm gonna call it the Chunderhawk!

Nope, I already set out Chibi-hawk

It reminds me of the old landraider, in the worst ways. I realize a Dreadnought needs to be able to stand under its rear and all but its way too tall with that hunchback intake and turret. They really should have kept that a razorback styled turret.

Not at all what I expected. Still dig it though.

Wonder how that turret would look on a Razorback.

Actually if you think Ork it makes perfect sense; looks front heavy, it'll never fly and its painted red. Its an Ork plane on secondment to the Blood Angels! On second thoughts it reminds me of a puffer fish.

Therion wrote:

BrassScorpion wrote:

Aerodynamics are heresy.

Hilarious. I enjoyed that.

In a game with a galaxy spanning empire, magic weapons, daemons and altered humans that can spit acid, it amazes me what some fellow enthusiasts consider too implausible to be fun.

Magical weapons, daemons, or galaxy spanning empires haven't been encountered in real life. Space shuttles and aeroplanes however have. If GW designs a daemon that looks like Popey the Sailor Man I don't have any evidence to call it unrealistic or even lame, just a strange concept that my imagination finds hard to believe even on an imaginary world. If GW makes a plane that supposedly can "jink effortlessly through the interceptor fire and maneouvre at full speed through the cluttered spires of a hive city" but makes it look like a hundred ton brick with two steel plates glued on the sides of it, I can provide real world evidence about the stupidity of the concept. It amazes me that you can't see the difference. Your fellow enthusiasts can.

Agreed.

There's a difference between "realism" and "believability".

Daemons, psychics, space alien elves, and a god-emperor aren't very realistic. However, so long as things are self-consistent, they're believable.

Eldar stuff does what it does because they're high-tect-elf-magics-tech. That's okay, we believe that.
Ork stuff does what it does because the Waaagh powers them. That's okay, we believe that.
Daemons are crazy and do weird stuff because they're from a parallel dimension. That's okay, we believe that.
Space Marines spit acid, weild magic, eat metal, and compose 95% of all conflicts in the galaxy because they're bioengineered that way. That's okay, we believe that.

However, the Imperial Tech is based on normal dry technology. There's no explanation as to why the thing that looks like a brick should fly. We're not given any explanation. It's not realistic, but then again nothing in the 40k fluff is. Every time something isn't realistic there is an explanation as to why it is so. So long as there's some sill explanation, it's believable.

When Blade the Vampire gets shot at and cut and he survives, it's believable because he's not human; normal laws don't apply to him. When Indiana Jones has a force field of "you Nazis can't ever hit me with your bullets", that's not believable nor realistic because he's supposedly a simple human.


In the end, I'll just attack and blow off the weapons of an airborne Stormraven with a few really angry Termagants and not consider realism nor believability for a moment.

Chibi-hawk could stick. Tau players will have a ball with that.

Kanluwen wrote:Why are people so hung up on the wings?

This isn't a fighter jet or a high altitude bomber.

This is a gunship.

It'll operate in the same role as an Apache does today.

InB4 "Apaches have too small wings for lift!"

In a gunship the wings, engines and lift surfaces are all around the centre of gravity. Here the weight and drag is focused at the front, while all the bits that control the movement of the thing are right at the back. It would be like jousting from a unicycle.

Asherian Command wrote:we all said it was going too look like a box. But the models here at dakka dakka look so much better.

EDIT: DO not comment here we already made a thread for it here
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/327475.page
Please contact a mod to close this thread thank you.

I'm keeping this one open and closing the discussion one since news and rumors is the better forum for it.

It reminds me of a sky-crane helicopter, which also tend to look unbalanced when unladen.

Need more pics for a real opinion though.

Does look like it will be super easy to make a Thunderhawk out of them though.

Jack

I dig it. I would like to see the back area for dreadnought hooking up purposes.

vitki wrote:I dub it the chibi-hawk

+lots more.

And...

Meh.

I guess this means the kit will be released with GK this winter.

I had been waiting for this. I hadn't included one in my BA lists because I didn't want to deal with converting one. I said I'd wait for the official model. I am no longer waiting. I will never run a storm raven.

I do not like it that much as a flyer,I like some of the kitbashes better.
But there are two great ideas I could use the parts for.
Like said Old School Razorback Turret ,Twin Las, plamsa.
And the main body looks like it would be a good base for a Mk1 Land Raider,maybe with baneblade tracks or even aftermarket WWII tank treads

I will still buy them. Like 2 of them...

MajorTom11 wrote:Aerodynamics are heresy.

Like Button

Seriously ugly!

I'm not really a fan of this and have seen much nicer scratch built ones.

This looks like a valk tried to swallow a thunder hawk.

Is this supposed to be some sort of joke? Scratch-Build, here I come... :/

Looks like utter and absolute garbage. Funny how the studio that put out kits like the Island of Blood set and the new Dark Eldar also puts out crap like the Razorgor and this abomination.

gothgar wrote:worst model GW has ever produced it worst model

You've obviously never seen the original Land Raider!

Kanluwen wrote:It'll operate in the same role as an Apache does today.

But Apaches look incredibly cool. This doesn't.

BloodQuest wrote:

gothgar wrote:worst model GW has ever produced it worst model

You've obviously never seen the original Land Raider!

Kanluwen wrote:It'll operate in the same role as an Apache does today.

But Apaches look incredibly cool. This doesn't.

So true
If they used real world references this would of never happened! Hopefully it will cost the same amount as a dreadnought

Kanluwen wrote:It'll operate in the same role as an Apache does today.

Apache isn't a transport. I do believe you mean the Hind.

I too am of the mind that this thing looks too front-heavy. The wings need to be more foreward, relative to the main fuselage, IMO.

Honestly, I've seen several Valk kit bashes that look better than this thing, although this one does have a more SM fell (the angular paneling around the passenger compartment looks a bit like the rhino/LR, for example). Maybe the ultimate kit bash will be to combine one of these kits with a Valk.

BrookM wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:It'll operate in the same role as an Apache does today.

Apache isn't a transport. I do believe you mean the Hind.

Apaches are classified as "gunships".

So no, I didn't mean the Hind.

This is pretty disappointing. It looks like someone just bashed wings onto a Land Raider until they kinda fit.

Well I think that this model will really show what type of gamer you are. Either you play an army for cool models, or because they are ridiculously op in game terms (and look like hell).

I sense that these will be really popular with people who only play blood angels for the cheese.

PS. The old Nagash model looks way better than this IMO.

The proportions are what are bugging me. Its like they had a bunch of different ideas but just didn't get any of them right.

This shows how they could have played with the proportions better.

That would have been a bit better, but overall, it still lacks something...

Hard to believe that this is what GW came up with!

I like it, but wish it was a bit longer. Although, my opinion might change when I see the model in person.

Well the wings look odd in length and the body looks too tall vertically and too short horizontally. Thats what I was trying to show. The details aren't bad, but a bunch of sub-par choices on top of bad proportions ends up with a sad model.

I was really hoping this would be an awesome kit. This is going to take some conversion work to be worth while.

I want to know what kind of fly base this thing is going to have. Will it be like the Valkyrie or none at all?

Where's the guy who dropped the daemon prince mold? Somebody see if he can drop this one too!

oni wrote:I want to know what kind of fly base this thing is going to have. Will it be like the Valkyrie or none at all?

I think due to its size and the fact it moves the way it does, its a safe assumption that it would be on the large flying oval base the valkyrie uses.

I've seen sooo much better conversions.
I'll go check out the stormraven leak and... WHAT THE FETH?! WHAT'S UP WITH THE FRONT?! how the hell could that many guys, the pilots, the engines, and all the equipment fit in that?!

It's way too tall and skinny- I was sure I was gonna get one when the model's released- now, though- pfft. Not unless I have a lot of plasticard spare...

shrike wrote:I've seen sooo much better conversions.
I'll go check out the stormraven leak and... WHAT THE FETH?! WHAT'S UP WITH THE FRONT?! how the hell could that many guys, the pilots, the engines, and all the equipment fit in that?!

The engines are under the wings and thrusters at the wing tips. No internal engines.

Doesn't GW have a history, at least one other time, of leaking information by 'mistakenly' posting it on their website for a few hours?

Stormraven? No

Lameduck? Yes

aka_mythos wrote:The proportions are what are bugging me. Its like they had a bunch of different ideas but just didn't get any of them right.

This shows how they could have played with the proportions better.

I like that version better. Looks more space mariney.

It kinda reminds me of the dropship from Starship Troopers. Not an exact duplicate mind you, but I definitely see some resemblances...

thedmstrikes wrote:It kinda reminds me of the dropship from Starship Troopers. Not an exact duplicate mind you, but I definitely see some resemblances...

Actually a Storm Bird reminds me of Starship troopers more than anything.
StormRaven looks like a land raider with wings.

The now pulled text that went along with the picture...

Over the next few pages, we will be taking a look at how to paint the Blood Angels Stormraven Gunship, including how to weather the vehicle and paint the interior detail. A great addition and centrepiece model for any Blood Angels army, this will be an invaluable guide to help you get the most from this fantastic kit.

Death from Above
The Stormraven Gunship is an incredibly versatile craft, able to fulfill the roll of orbital dropship, armoured transport and strike aircraft in a way that few, or indeed any, ships could hope to match. The Stormraven ensures that the Blood Angels remain undisputed masters of the skies, as dominant in the air as their troops are on the ground. Smaller and nimbler than the more cumbersome Thunderhawk Gunships, the Stormraven's compact hull and vectored thrusters enable it to operate at maximum efficiency in all but the densest terrain. A Stormraven can often be seen hurtling straight into the heart of the enemy forces, unleashing its considerable arsenal in a terrifying display of firepower, before disgorging a squad, Dreadnought, or even both, into the thick of the fighting.

On the tabletop
With its potent firepower, speed and transport capacity, the uses of a Stormraven on the battlefield are myriad, but its role of choice is as an unparalleled assault vehicle. With a huge variety of weapon options, and no less than four tank-busting Bloodstrike Missiles, both enemy infantry and vehicles alike fear drawing the attention of its guns. A transport capacity of 12 combined with the ability to safely carry a Dreadnought to battle as well certainly proves the Stormraven to be a transport vehicle of the very finest quality. This unique combination of speed, firepower and transport capacity means that a Stormraven can support any tactical preference, so there is always a place for it in any Blood Angels army.

Nick: A Stormraven will be the focal point of your army, so it's well worth giving it a lot of attention when painting it. These techniques can effectively be applied to any other vehicles in your Blood Angels army too, so keep this in mind and you will have a great looking fleet of vehicles in no time. I painted this Stormraven to match the battleforce that I painted for the Blood Angels army workshop in February 2011's White Dwarf; it's part of the 3rd Company, in keeping with the rest of the models. As a personal touch, I've weathered the model to appear heavily battle worn, but if you wish to keep your vehicle in pristine condition, skip page 6 and you'll have an immaculate vehicle, fresh as if at the beginning of a campaign.

..and you all see the interesting looking dreadnought in t'corner too yes ...?

Omg i found the libarian dreadnought! its like seeing whats in GW's MIND!

Worst kit ever. Wow that thing is ugly, and unflyable.

The first land raider kit was based on a REAL tank, so no, I don't think it's that bad of a kit, especially considering that it was made 20 years ago.

This is just...horrid. Sticking wings and engines on a Rhino Chassis would have looked MUCH better than this abomination.

It's too bad...the idea had so much potential...

In a universe with counter-grav why are people worried about aerodynamics? Its Boxxy as feth, but tis a SM vehicle. What were U expecting?

Plastic Furioso?!

Im not disappointed at all....looks pretty sweet! Cant wait for the release....never considered adding them to my BA army...until now!!!

flying school bus ftl.

BrookM wrote:Plastic Furioso?!

..could be... rumour has it the kit has parts to make one or two variants.. if that is the placcy dreadnought of course.

But that is the 100% genuine Stormraven model.

Flachzange wrote:flying school bus ftl.

I wonder if they did base it on a School Bus?

Well, that's one ugly motherf... for sure, but the good kind of ugly.
My main issue is that it looks far too front heavy though. If there are some thrusters in the front area though (it's hard to see with the angle), I'll give it a thumb up. If.

It certainly needs a new angle picture becuase that one doesn't help the model. However, I still kinda like it. If my friend gets one, I hope to paint it.

Whew, I got scared there for a minute until I realized it was April Fool's Day! *Looks at the calendar* ...Crap.

Looks like my Grey Knights won't be getting a Stormraven, or I'll be making my own. GW, what were you thinking?!

thanks for the quick photoshop, mythos. out of the three i cropped into one pic, the actual model by far is the WORST. mythos' conversion makes it a passable model but i think the valk kitbashes around a leagues better than what GW is coming out with.

p.s. i like the old land raider! not as much as the new one but its got a certain flair that this model lacks.

The proportions are all wrong. It reminds me of.....

warboss wrote:thanks for the quick photoshop, mythos. out of the three i cropped into one pic, the actual model by far is the WORST. mythos' conversion makes it a passable model but i think the valk kitbashes around a leagues better than what GW is coming out with.

p.s. i like the old land raider! not as much as the new one but its got a certain flair that this model lacks.

I like the 2nd one

olympia wrote:The proportions are all wrong. It reminds me of.....

she's way hotter than that model. also, i predict she'll be appearing in the 2nd annual dakka disgusting christmas avatar completely unofficial contest.

reds8n wrote:

BrookM wrote:Plastic Furioso?!

..could be... rumour has it the kit has parts to make one or two variants.. if that is the placcy dreadnought of course.

But that is the 100% genuine Stormraven model.

Libby and Furioso, I can see that happening. Let the despairing over the look of the magna-grapnel commence.

A red February it is then.

Its ugly, but in that Space Marine kind of way.

Whomever posted that it looked like a baby thunderhawk kinda got it right.

I like it.

the other thing that bothers me about the stormraven is it throws out the asthetic that they've been going with for marines since the great vehicle redesign of 3rd edition in which IG kept the old manned sponson WWI-WWII look and marines got updated looking vehicles with vision slits and remote turrets. the storm raven has, instead of a remote turret like the razorback, a b-17esque ball turret on the top. i still see myself getting one but i'll be taking a saw to it in no time.

This is what I woulda done/will do myself -

MajorTom11 wrote:This is what I woulda done/will do myself -

I'll try and do that! The Wanderers Shall be appeased!

While I think it looks better, that I think makes it much larger than its suppose to be, and doesn't represent the lascannons as a turret as its rules, I'm pretty sure, state. I also think it loses that connection to the Thunderhawk without the tail, and the front nacels make it look like its on the verge of being Tau.

oni wrote:

shrike wrote:I've seen sooo much better conversions.
I'll go check out the stormraven leak and... WHAT THE FETH?! WHAT'S UP WITH THE FRONT?! how the hell could that many guys, the pilots, the engines, and all the equipment fit in that?!

The engines are under the wings and thrusters at the wing tips. No internal engines.

Having played around with the picture the way I did, and comparing the marines bases to establish a sense of scale, the "crew compartment" appears to be larger than a rhino, with roughly the same width and much more head room inside.

MajorTom11 wrote:This is what I woulda done/will do myself -

oh snap! creative nerd fight! the guantlet is thrown and majortom has just served you, mythos! kidding, also very cool design.

Its super ugly. BA can keep it. My wolves wont be missing it on the battlefield.

Here is the worst part. They show the thing landed, it doesn't land in game. Ever. Its supposed to be on a Valk flying stand. Thats going to make it even look worse since you can't hide anything by putting your guys around it. Its just going to be stuck up on a 3" tall stick

Wow, it's kind of sad that the photoshops looks so much better then the actual model.

I'll still buy one...for parts

Well flying LR it is . Similar to my scratchbuild, Turret on top, weapons above ramp... gotta angle my wings now, so I'm happy. I Like Major Toms idea though.. would look better. And ...Now does it look like the thing in the Space Wolf Codex?

It looks about right for a chopped down Thunderhawk. However I still prefer the Valk-raider conversions to that (even if it's costlier).

Mythos - too big? It's the exact same size, just a bit more ass in the under carriage but the dimensions don't change? Turrets rules I have no idea, don't actually play 40k, just build models... are sponsons and turrets treated that differently? For the VTOL engines in the front, I just felt it needed some excuse to say it could remain hovering without looking like it would instantly start flipping end over end if you turned on the vertical thrusters lol.

Brother Paen wrote:Well flying LR it is . Similar to my scratchbuild, Turret on top, weapons above ramp... gotta angle my wings now, so I'm happy. I Like Major Toms idea though.. would look better. And ...Now does it look like the thing in the Space Wolf Codex?

Since you can only see the bottom and a little bit of the front of it, who knows. Defiantly couldn't make out a top turret or tail design from the SW codex pic.

I'll be putting a razorback turret on the top but otherwise I think it'll work out just fine. I might convert up some forward thrusters but that'll depend on my mood really. I'm still stoked for GK's!

MajorTom11 wrote:This is what I woulda done/will do myself -

Now this, I actually like. The proportions look a lot better.

Has anyone besides the guys over at Capture and Control and a guy on the BoLS thread seen the Dread in the background!? FURIOSO PLASTIC KIT!?

Aye, if it looked like that, I'd be thinking on how many I can fit into my force, not I hope it grows on me.

MajorTom11 wrote:Mythos - too big? It's the exact same size, just a bit more ass in the under carriage but the dimensions don't change?

The reason its rear is short relative to the tail is because thats the it carries the dreadnought. If you extend the crew cabin the way you have it wouldn't have a place to hold it. It holds a decent amount but for the length you make the transport space it would hold much more troops and no dreadnought.

MajorTom11 wrote:Turrets rules I have no idea, don't actually play 40k, just build models... are sponsons and turrets treated that differently? For the VTOL engines in the front, I just felt it needed some excuse to say it could remain hovering without looking like it would instantly start flipping end over end if you turned on the vertical thrusters lol.

Well you haven't made them sponsons either. Turrets can fire in all directions, sponsons upto three but possibly only two. Space Marines rely less on engine power and make larger use of suspensor plating, like what makes a landspeeder stay up in the air.

bryan40kman2000 wrote:Has anyone besides the guys over at Capture and Control and a guy on the BoLS thread seen the Dread in the background!? FURIOSO PLASTIC KIT!?

No. Read the entire thread
And if thats true, Id buy one.

MajorTom11 wrote:Figured better post this in case they try to yank it -



Gotta say, I am not sure if it is a kit-bash or not. A good one mind you, but certain parts still look all too familiar. Pretty cool, but not as cool as it could have been if it is the real deal. It look a hell of a lot like the conversions done by hobbyists, almost like they copied the conversions for the design lol.

Actually while everyone is gawping at the cute and zippy flying machine. Has anyone spotted in the background ... Is that the potentially new plastic Furioso dread(if thats how it is spelt)???

ah, but that is still a space for a dread, I just enclosed it for the sake of the sillouette. Imaging 2 panels on the sides, but the back and bottom still open -

If the turret/sponsons thing is an issue, then I would probably put a turret on top but more snugg and razorback style, i dont think the gunner chair is required at least! I may not play, but I like to keep my models table-legal too for some reason lol!

Thanks for the input though!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Good catch on the Furioso Ceoron, that def looks like a new plastic dready too!

If it is, it better come with the Librarian upgrades, and those insane Claws that let it keep hitting when it wounds (kills?) an opponent.

Absolutionis wrote:

Therion wrote:

BrassScorpion wrote:

Aerodynamics are heresy.

Hilarious. I enjoyed that.

In a game with a galaxy spanning empire, magic weapons, daemons and altered humans that can spit acid, it amazes me what some fellow enthusiasts consider too implausible to be fun.

Magical weapons, daemons, or galaxy spanning empires haven't been encountered in real life. Space shuttles and aeroplanes however have. If GW designs a daemon that looks like Popey the Sailor Man I don't have any evidence to call it unrealistic or even lame, just a strange concept that my imagination finds hard to believe even on an imaginary world. If GW makes a plane that supposedly can "jink effortlessly through the interceptor fire and maneouvre at full speed through the cluttered spires of a hive city" but makes it look like a hundred ton brick with two steel plates glued on the sides of it, I can provide real world evidence about the stupidity of the concept. It amazes me that you can't see the difference. Your fellow enthusiasts can.

However, the Imperial Tech is based on normal dry technology. There's no explanation as to why the thing that looks like a brick should fly. We're not given any explanation. It's not realistic, but then again nothing in the 40k fluff is. Every time something isn't realistic there is an explanation as to why it is so. So long as there's some sill explanation, it's believable.

The American Space Shuttle IS a flying brick and it manages to fly, so i could see this thing being able to fly as well

MajorTom11 wrote:ah, but that is still a space for a dread, I just enclosed it for the sake of the sillouette. Imaging 2 panels on the sides, but the back and bottom still open

Like an upside down pickup truck bed... gotcha. I'd just maybe raise up those sides a little higher.

One thing about the kit I think looks silly is the large flat glass section of the cockpit (haha pit). This area I thought would have needed more creativity. In the least they could have incorporated more of the angles and lines from the landspeeder, to make the cockpit broader but more flat.

If I ever get it, this will be my top priority




It does not look that ridiculous when you get rid of the manned turret and the "stupid tiny vents". It is not a good kit, but I find it salvageable. What do you think?

I think they could have gotten rid of that intake "tower" if they had made the cockpit less tall.
Like this:

MajorTom11 wrote:This is what I woulda done/will do myself -

How?! where is that pic from?! I NEED ANSWERS!!!

Um... my hands and brain? lol

Wow that's hideous.

aka_mythos wrote:I think they could have gotten rid of that intake "tower" if they had made the cockpit less tall.

They don't need the intake tower at all, because it's already got two big intakes for the engines.

I just meant as an aesthetic detail, that GW was insistant on. If they needed it. They could have kept it by what I showed in my above picture. We haven't seen the rear end, for all we know, like the Thunderhawk it could have a third engine below the tail that needs that inlet.

Epic fail in my opinion, I'm more excited to see what others do with it rather than the actually kit itself.

Yes, I know it doesn't matter that it's not aerodynamic as this is a just a game in a sci-fi world but damn is it ugly. I have to agree with others that the conversions using the Valks actually look better.

Looks like I'll be converting my own. Also, I do agree that this "leak" is quite suspicious. I doubt GW doesn't look at the interwebz but I do feel they stay out of it so they don't HAVE to listen to our opinions. So they toss us a bone (oopsie, we leaked a Stormraven picture, my bad! LOL) every once in a while and let the comments/hype run wild!

I think it would be better looking if it was actually complete.

That one isn't, there's parts missing.

It's modeled great but it's absolutly ridiculous. It would fall over instantly and forever, it looks like a flying shortbus, and the tiny non functioning tail is just silly.

I love games workshops artists and modelers, but seriously; whoever does the imperial designs should be punched in the gut and replaced by a highschool student who didn't fail physics.

As a side note, if that's a complete model then that's just a really crappy angle.

Wow... it's... umm... that is not what I expected.

It really does look like a plane that's had the back of the fuselage cut off and the wings left with the tiniest of connection points. And that turret... it's aesthetics don't match other Marine turrets at all (a bit like how the Wave Serpent turret is virtually alien compared to other Eldar weapon mountings).

I don't like it. It doesn't look 'right'. There's something very 'off' about it.

'Chibi-Hawk' is a great name for it though.

Looks like a thunderhawk that ran into a mountain and got accordioned.

However do you think the turret may be transferable to say a razorback? Now that could be quite a cool conversion.

Lennysmash wrote:However do you think the turret may be transferable to say a razorback? Now that could be quite a cool conversion.

Chances are you can swap them.

The Las turret from a SR with assault cannons instead of Lascannons would make a badass RB turret.

I think it only looks bad from that angle. I like the turret.

hmm, the turret could be used in combination with chapterhouse's MK1 rhino kit to make MK1 razorbacks

My word for it would be chunky.

I realized what they are doing. There is so much demand for this model, they are reducing demand by makingthe thing so ugly you don't want it.

spireland wrote:I realized what they are doing. There is so much demand for this model, they are reducing demand by makingthe thing so ugly you don't want it.

Clever girl

Chances are it will be the same price as the Valkyrie and Land Raider, so even less chance of it going anywhere fast.

The main part really does look like the first Land Raider...

I could see some conversions in that direction, if it weren't for the fact that this thing has got to be push $60 to $70, right?

If that thing is going to tank in at €50,-- I'm not expecting to see a lot of them.

I think it must have something to do with restoring balance to the universe. GW can only have so many armies with amazing sculpts, so having dragged Dark Eldar out of the mire, it's now Space Marines who have to suffer aesthetically.

I expect they will charge the same as the Land Raider and Valkyrie.

Which means, I can live without one.

Thanks, GW!

Its like an A-10. Ugly as Sin, but beautiful in what it does

The only thing I look forward to in regards to this model is seeing what people kitbash with the parts. I really like MajorTom11's photoshop though. That I might get excited about.

If you like this model you need to be deprogrammed.

Makes me sad because now I have to make two more of my scratch-builds and that cost me a damn mint! This unit just screamed to be a badass sculpt. Way to shat the bed GW!

Darkness wrote:Its like an A-10. Ugly as Sin, but beautiful in what it does

Oddly enough, I like the visuals of the A10 better than I do... any military aircraft with the F prefix that I know of other than the F-117. A pity that the F22/F35 crafts which replaced it are such ugly little gaks.

It's now time for all those 3rd party manufacturers to start making 'extension kits' that extend the fuselage outwards so that it looks like an actual aircraft rather than... whatever that thing is meant to be.

Maxstreel wrote:Yes, I know it doesn't matter that it's not aerodynamic as this is a just a game in a sci-fi world but damn is it ugly. I have to agree with others that the conversions using the Valks actually look better.

Looks like I'll be converting my own. Also, I do agree that this "leak" is quite suspicious. I doubt GW doesn't look at the interwebz but I do feel they stay out of it so they don't HAVE to listen to our opinions. So they toss us a bone (oopsie, we leaked a Stormraven picture, my bad! LOL) every once in a while and let the comments/hype run wild!

Yeah I think this is classic Oooopps GW made a mestake (but not really). The web page that got up was about to tell us how we are going to be painting this wonder machine (stupid seen as it hasn't been even mentioned as a released yet) which makes it easier for GW to make this out to be some sort of mestaken release. I.e. something they can easily clean off their respective boots later.

What they are most likely doing is testing the water with a beta model to get our first impressions on a model they are not 100% on themselves. With the idea being that if we all go "yay, we love it" they schedule a release sometime early 2011 with the new Plastic Furioso Dread (see my previous post). If we all go "no, thats just bad" (as in this case), GW pass it off as a goof up and the designers are sent packing back to the drawing board.

Though that may just be wishful thinking.

I think GW are going to sell more of these to Ork players then Space Marine players, it's got Big Trakk/Battlewagon written all over it.

I like it! It fits in rather nicely with the 'chunky' Space Marine aesthetic. I'lll hold off on my full judgement before I see a few more shots, but I have a feeling this will go down much like the new Daemon Prince did; ugly as sin in the promo shots, but actually quite nice IRL.

L. Wrex

Addendum: I see a lot of people complaining that it looks to front-heavy. Don't forget this thing has a DREADNOUGHT slung underneath it people! Imagine that pic, and then add a Dreadnought and I think your weight/balance issues might be addressed.

I would love to see an ork player turn this into a Battlewagon. I can just picture a deffroller on the front.....awsome


Honestly, I think that a little plasticard to extend the fusilage back a bit with a hollow bottom and a little more to connect the wings to the cockpit area and the model will be fine. It is meant to basically be a flying Land raider in terms of game use, so it should not look dainty.

Also, we have no idea what other decortive options come with the kit, for example there could be smaller wing sets or something else..

Maybe it's because I don't (and probably never will) play Space Mahreens, but I don't think it's that bad of a kit. If it wasn't ridiculously expensive, I'd even like to have it so I could wreck it.

Lycaeus Wrex wrote:I like it! It fits in rather nicely with the 'chunky' Space Marine aesthetic. I'lll hold off on my full judgement before I see a few more shots, but I have a feeling this will go down much like the new Daemon Prince did; ugly as sin in the promo shots, but actually quite nice IRL.

L. Wrex

Addendum: I see a lot of people complaining that it looks to front-heavy. Don't forget this thing has a DREADNOUGHT slung underneath it people! Imagine that pic, and then add a Dreadnought and I think your weight/balance issues might be addressed.

Except it wont have a dreadnought on the back. If scale is any indication a dread will be physically too big to put back there. Also who's dread? Not mine as there are banners or other top/shoulder/weapon embellishments that will make it impossible to attach. Even if you could physically put a dread behind it, after turn 2 the dread will probably not be a passenger anymore as its off rampaging on its own. The ship needs to hold its own as is, unfortunately its ugly and unbalanced on its own.

vitki wrote:I dub it the chibi-hawk

Like

svendrex wrote:
Honestly, I think that a little plasticard to extend the fusilage back a bit with a hollow bottom and a little more to connect the wings to the cockpit area and the model will be fine. It is meant to basically be a flying Land raider in terms of game use, so it should not look dainty.

Also, we have no idea what other decortive options come with the kit, for example there could be smaller wing sets or something else..

It wouldn't take much for GW to correct a few of the niggles.

Too front heavy : add some retros at the front
Too tall/not streemlined enough : remove the top twin lascannon turret and add a smaller razerback las turret in its place or a far more cool underslung lascannon turret below at the front.
Wings seem disconnected from the hull by too much of a gap : move them forward and/or extend the hull further backwards. Think this will make the proportions better, though will reduce the ammount of space for a dread.

Edit : Thanks Melissia

*mutters annoyingly at the use of the incorrect spelling of "turret"....*

I wish I was surprised that people judge something based off of a single pic with a weird angle instead of holding off for some more in depth images with a wider variety of angles.

If we can get BLOS to call it the Chibi-Hawk (when they report this as Breaking News a week from now), then it will stick.

Melissia wrote:

Darkness wrote:Its like an A-10. Ugly as Sin, but beautiful in what it does

Oddly enough, I like the visuals of the A10 better than I do... any military aircraft with the F prefix that I know of other than the F-117. A pity that the F22/F35 crafts which replaced it are such ugly little gaks.

This also is nothing like the A-10. The A-10 is an actual aricraft. It can fly. This can't even fly conceptually with magic space tech.

It's only source of lift is in it's tail
it's stupidly front heavy
it's wings aren't functioning (so it RELIES on that weird tail wing jet thrust)
it's melta weapon platform is positioned inside the craft despite being a close range weapon presumably designed to strike ground targets.
It's wing thrusters are jets, and this is a spacecraft. That doesn't work.
It's wing thrusters are placed at the top and rear of the craft meaning the moment they fired it would tumble forward.

It's got a tail!
A tail with no purpose
It's not aeodynamic
It's not a weapons platform
It doesn't control the aircraft in any way
What the hell is the tail for?


This would use it's tiny wing thrusters to lift it's tail up, it would flip forward, then it's tiny tail thrusters would push it forward like a vertical boat until it's big engines kick in and smash it into the ground. This thing is awful.

I thought that this was a new ork flyer at first



I wonder what GW's FB page is like right about now

ceorron wrote:It wouldn't take much for GW to correct a few of the niggles.

Too front heavy : add some retros at the front
Too tall/not streemlined enough : remove the top twin lascannon turrent and add a smaller razerback las turrent in its place or a far more cool underslung lascannon turrent below at the front.
Wings seem disconnected from the hull by too much of a gap : move them forward and/or extend the hull further backwards. Think this will make the proportions better, though will reduce the ammount of space for a dread.

except that would require a major retooling of the dye which is supposedly quite expensive (not my area of expertise). or... gw can simply put it out as is and count on fanbois doing their own conversions at no cost (other than lost sales) to them.

warboss wrote:

ceorron wrote:It wouldn't take much for GW to correct a few of the niggles.

Too front heavy : add some retros at the front
Too tall/not streemlined enough : remove the top twin lascannon turrent and add a smaller razerback las turrent in its place or a far more cool underslung lascannon turrent below at the front.
Wings seem disconnected from the hull by too much of a gap : move them forward and/or extend the hull further backwards. Think this will make the proportions better, though will reduce the ammount of space for a dread.

except that would require a major retooling of the dye which is supposedly quite expensive (not my area of expertise). or... gw can simply put it out as is and count on fanbois doing their own conversions at no cost (other than lost sales) to them.

If this thread is anything to go by there may be quite a few lost sales, I might consider the "considerable expence" worth it.

Your forgetting the inevitable cost of the minimal redesign years later that they could just go and do now. This could be a potential save for GW and a lesson in sometimes it is best to get it right first time.

Feth me, that's ugly.

Granted, it might be an unflattering angle, but no good model can look this bad, surely?

ceorron wrote:

warboss wrote:

ceorron wrote:It wouldn't take much for GW to correct a few of the niggles.

Too front heavy : add some retros at the front
Too tall/not streemlined enough : remove the top twin lascannon turrent and add a smaller razerback las turrent in its place or a far more cool underslung lascannon turrent below at the front.
Wings seem disconnected from the hull by too much of a gap : move them forward and/or extend the hull further backwards. Think this will make the proportions better, though will reduce the ammount of space for a dread.

except that would require a major retooling of the dye which is supposedly quite expensive (not my area of expertise). or... gw can simply put it out as is and count on fanbois doing their own conversions at no cost (other than lost sales) to them.

If this thread is anything to go by there may be quite a few lost sales, I might consider the "considerable expence" worth it.

Your forgetting the inevitable cost of the minimal redesign years later that they could just go and do now. This could be a potential save for GW and a lesson in sometimes it is best to get it right first time.

People buy Leman Russ' and space marine dreadnauts so I doubt that there is really a big concern about whether idiotic designs can't sell.

Its like an A-10. Ugly as Sin, but beautiful in what it does

The A-10 is the most beautiful aircraft of all time!

ShumaGorath wrote:
People buy Leman Russ' and space marine dreadnauts so I doubt that there is really a big concern about whether idiotic designs can't sell.

Russes and Dreads are cool (although predator>>>russ design wise)

this is laaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame

Don't like it, don't buy it... pretty simple.

I like it... I'm planning a GK force. I'll buy at least 1, if not more than 1 of them.

kenshin620 wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:
People buy Leman Russ' and space marine dreadnauts so I doubt that there is really a big concern about whether idiotic designs can't sell.

Russes and Dreads are cool (although predator>>>russ design wise)

this is laaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame

This thing can not logically walk, stand up, or even flip over after falling.
It has a tiny eyehole slit for the guy inside.
It has exposed floating cables on it's legs, arms, everything else that would catch on things at it walks or get hit with regularity.
It's got dozens of bullet traps at every angle

It's just as bad at this flying brick with tail jets.

Well we've seen how the Dread walks. Relic made it walk. It's not pretty, but it can walk (and then we try to factor out that 'Mecha' don't make any sort of practical sense anyway). All Mechs are style over substance. They don't make sense at all, so at least make them look cool. In the blocky aesthetic that is the Imperium, things like Dreads and Sentinels and even the Penitent Engine fit. The Chibi-Raven... does not.

As far as the cables and exposed wiring... so many things in 40K have that. That doesn't excuse it, but to single it out as a Dreadnought-centric problem is somewhat disengenuous. Marines have exposed cabling and no one seems to care about that.

Ed_Bodger wrote:

vitki wrote:I dub it the chibi-hawk

Like

I get what this is but it's just spam like this. Please post along with content from now on. Thanks!

Well we've seen how the Dread walks. Relic made it walk. It's not pretty, but it can walk (and then we factor in that 'Mecha' don't make any sort of practical sense). All Mechs are style over substance. They don't make sense at all, so at least make them look cool. In the blocky aesthetic that is the Imperium, things like Dreads and Sentinels and even the Penitent Engine fit. The Chibi-Raven... does not.

If you scrutinize the walking in the dawn of war games done by the dreads they technically break their knee joints and clip into themselves with every step. They also stay perfectly level when walking up hills, something dreads could not physically do.

As far as the cables and exposed wiring... so many things in 40K have that. That doesn't excuse it, but to single it out as a Dreadnought-centric problem is somewhat disengenuous. Marines have exposed cabling and no one seems to care about that.

I care :( .

All I can think of is a nerf ball lol. Maybe they should attach whistles to it and just lob it at the enemy, seems like it would be more realistically effective that way.
EDIT: For the unenlightened:

I wouldn't buy it as it is a Space marine model, but I kind of like cutie chibi-hawk. But then again, I also play Tau
Here a leaked pic of the Blood Angels crew BTW



But actually, I can't understand the hate for this model. It is an unaerodynamical blick (or current Land Raider) with wings for sure, but then again, the Arvus lighter or Thunderhawk are the same (or Rhino, Leman Russ, Land Raider and Chimera just unbelievable bricks with tracks):



Here is a quick photoshop of how a more aerodynamic transport could look like, but somehow, it doesn't fit into the IoM I guess



But I agree that MajorTom11's conversion looks better.

ceorron wrote:What they are most likely doing is testing the water with a beta model to get our first impressions on a model they are not 100% on themselves. With the idea being that if we all go "yay, we love it" they schedule a release sometime early 2011 with the new Plastic Furioso Dread (see my previous post). If we all go "no, thats just bad" (as in this case), GW pass it off as a goof up and the designers are sent packing back to the drawing board.

I don't buy that. For that to be the case, GW would need plausible deniability, whereas this is a model that's already been painted by their studio guy to their normal display standard. It doesn't look like a beta, or anything they could later pass off as not intended for release. They'd've had to go for a CAD drawing or a crude mockup in that case.

Lycaeus Wrex wrote:I like it! It fits in rather nicely with the 'chunky' Space Marine aesthetic. I'lll hold off on my full judgement before I see a few more shots, but I have a feeling this will go down much like the new Daemon Prince did; ugly as sin in the promo shots, but actually quite nice IRL.

L. Wrex

Addendum: I see a lot of people complaining that it looks to front-heavy. Don't forget this thing has a DREADNOUGHT slung underneath it people! Imagine that pic, and then add a Dreadnought and I think your weight/balance issues might be addressed.

Huh? People actually like that piece of crap? I'm still utterly repulsed by it. I've since bought two of the old metal ones.

Sorry for this guys but I don't have a copy of the BA dex to hand but isn't the SR supposed to hold 20 marines or am I misinformed?

The scaling of this thing seems to be even further out of wack than the Rhino APC if that is indeed the case. I mean frack me what is this thing the TARDIS or something?

Oh and agreed, can't believe that anyone actually likes the new DP, for a start one of its poses just looks like he's flipping someone off, that deserves an ASBO not a blood curdling scream.

ShumaGorath wrote:I care :( .

Then you're in the wrong hobby.

Lennysmash wrote:Sorry for this guys but I don't have a copy of the BA dex to hand but isn't the SR supposed to hold 20 marines or am I misinformed?

12, with termies and jump infantry counting as 2... plus the dread in the trunk.

Well, being a brick on tracks seems actually advantagous for a tank. As for the flying bricks, you would have though the mechanicum might have designed somthing beyond the point of "attach enough rockets to it and its BOUND to go somewhere!" Sure, innovation is heresy, but it wasnt during the crusade surely, plenty of time to work out aerodynamics.

Trilobite wrote: Sure, innovation is heresy, but it wasnt during the crusade surely, plenty of time to work out aerodynamics.

AdMech SINGS to a machine until it works for Christs sake, only Tau use real engineering. Make any SM vehicle sleak, aerodynamical and practical, everyone would complain about it being too Tau'ish.

Kroothawk wrote:But actually, I can't understand the hate for this model. It is an unaerodynamical blick (or current Land Raider) with wings for sure, but then again, the Arvus lighter or Thunderhawk are the same (or Rhino, Leman Russ, Land Raider and Chimera just unbelievable bricks with tracks):

The Arvus Lighter is no where near as preposterous as the Chibi-Hawk.

I mean, it looks like it could fly (especially in space):



This new... thing... not at all.

Not wanting to make too heavy a point but just had a friend of mine that is a big Blood Angels fan, that was definitely going to get the model, enter the room eager and excited to see the new stormraven model.

Only to be struck with that picture and tell me moments later that if that's what GW are going to put out then he won't be getting one.

Sigh

Samus_aran115 wrote:Huh? People actually like that piece of crap? I'm still utterly repulsed by it. I've since bought two of the old metal ones.

I very much agree that the old metal Daemon Prince and the Nurgle Daemon Prince are *leagues* ahead of the plastic one, but what I'm saying is that there was a massive knee-jerk reaction to how 'bad' that model was (I was one of them). And yet, upon seeing one in person and actually being able to view the model from every angle it didn't look as atrocious as the promo pics made it look.

I think this is very much in the same vein. People hate on it because the picture is unflattering, but they haven't seen the model in its entirety which may allay some of the proportion worries.

Also, if people haven't noticed yet, it's got four whopping great big VTOL engines (two on the main body and two on the wing). So it obviously does have a way to propel itself off of the ground.

L. Wrex

BTW I have heard GW UK is looking for a new website manager

On second thought, having this page written and tested now would point at a December Xmas release for that model.

Lycaeus Wrex wrote:

Samus_aran115 wrote:Huh? People actually like that piece of crap? I'm still utterly repulsed by it. I've since bought two of the old metal ones.

I very much agree that the old metal Daemon Prince and the Nurgle Daemon Prince are *leagues* ahead of the plastic one, but what I'm saying is that there was a massive knee-jerk reaction to how 'bad' that model was (I was one of them). And yet, upon seeing one in person and actually being able to view the model from every angle it didn't look as atrocious as the promo pics made it look.

I think this is very much in the same vein. People hate on it because the picture is unflattering, but they haven't seen the model in its entirety which may allay some of the proportion worries.

Also, if people haven't noticed yet, it's got four whopping great big VTOL engines (two on the main body and two on the wing). So it obviously does have a way to propel itself off of the ground.

L. Wrex

You have no basis to say it's an unflattering angle, for all we know it may be the best angle of the thing just as easily as the worst. Try to keep hopes out of arguments, they tend to detract from the good points you made. IMHO anyways... for the record, I am still no fan of the plastic dp, if they couldnt match or outdo the metal 40k dp's, or belakor for that matter, they should have just held off. Also IMHO though of course!

Ummmmmmm. . .Uhhhhhhhh. . .Ehhhhhhhhh. . .Frankly. . . .It looks like a giant anal suppository. It's complete crap. One of the worst models they've ever made and that includes the original Land Raider, the original tyranid line, those really manly looking slaanesh chicks from a million years ago. I would rather make my own then use that absolutely stupid model. Dimensionally, it looks incapable of flight. Honestly, all the weight's in the front. I just don't see how it can fly. . .unless it depends on anti-grav engines or some other sci-fi magic. Sadness has eaten my soul. Seriously, what's up with those ridiculous bubble turrets. This isn't supposed to be a WWII bomber. *Sigh* I'm done. . .until it comes out and I make fun it every game that I play that has one it in, for the entire game. . .

I am huge fan of the Marine range, and in my younger days, I often was happy to act as a defender of the range and concept. And I will continue to be so.

Now that my bona fides are established, let me contribute to the conversation. Conceptually, that is terrible. I get the desire to hew to the current chassis for the tanks, and even the thunderhawk. But the width, height, and length ratios are absolutely horrendous. It is literally a less aerodynamic Land Raider with wings stuck on the side.

Hideous.

Grim Smasha wrote:Ummmmmmm. . .Uhhhhhhhh. . .Ehhhhhhhhh. . .Frankly. . . .It looks like a giant anal suppository. It's complete crap.

most suppositories are actually quite aerodynamic being bullet shaped for easy entry. don't ask how i know... as for the model, i agree that it's pretty fugly.

Grim Smasha wrote:One of the worst models they've ever made and that includes ... those really manly looking slaanesh chicks from a million years ago.

Ugh, I don't know if I'd go that far!

Though I will not be buying one of these either.

I think the nays have it...

Good news for those who have the scratch building skills to convert valks for people.

I heavily dislike it the heavy boxy front with the empty back
the only way it could be redeemed is if they had some kind of "hook" or something to hold the dreadnought to hold the enormous gap on its rear

It might have one, you couldn't tell from this angle.

MajorTom11 wrote:Figured better post this in case they try to yank it -



Gotta say, I am not sure if it is a kit-bash or not. A good one mind you, but certain parts still look all too familiar. Pretty cool, but not as cool as it could have been if it is the real deal. It look a hell of a lot like the conversions done by hobbyists, almost like they copied the conversions for the design lol.

As for the realism of the model,it's really hard to say without seeing the back of the model and some other angles. The massive vent on top appears to be blocking a good deal of the airflow to the back wings. The only thing I can think of is that the Stromraven is a vectored thrust craft with thrusters on the bottom to help it maintain lift,which would require the top intake. That would also make sense,as then it would move forward with a tilt and the vent wouldn't get in the way of the rear wings. That would also make the top mounted turret make sense,as oppossed to a bottom mounted one,because if the SR moves forward at an angle,the turret would get a better field of fire to enemies on the ground if mounted on top than on bottom. If that is indeed the concept for the SR,then hopefully the wings will be able to pivot on an axis. Or,it could just be an unrealistic and poorly thought out design.

Aesthetically,the SR looks like crap from that photo. It screamed for a great model,and appears to have come up horribly short. Perhaps it can be made to look halfway decent with some kitbashing,but so far looks like a dissappointment. That sentiment may change once I see some more pics and/or the actual model,however. Unfortunately,this is apparently the kind of hit/miss stuff for other armies we can look forward to for a while after GW let their plastics design head spend 6 years on DE.

Kroothawk wrote:
But actually, I can't understand the hate for this model. It is an unaerodynamical blick (or current Land Raider) with wings for sure, but then again, the Arvus lighter or Thunderhawk are the same (or Rhino, Leman Russ, Land Raider and Chimera just unbelievable bricks with tracks):

The thing is, even though the Arvus lighter is a flying brick, at least the wings/engines are firmly attached to the body. With the StormRaven, it just looks like they're begging to be snapped off in terms of both the model and the air/spacecraft it is supposed to represent.

It's still savable, but it needs a LOT of work to look anywhere near as good as most of the conversions that have been made so far.

Yes, from this angle that is what they look like.

Still, I am quite certain that the design process started with a current Land Raider hull without the tracks, then adding Valkyrie wings and stuff. Seems to have the exact same volume and form (including lower part of front door, even having similar nodges at the upper edge of the hull). Makes sense for transport capacity and the Imperium being short on templates.

Melissia wrote:Yes, from this angle that is what they look like.

You trump angle too much. This isn't using a photostitch or some sort of ridiculous fisheye lens. It's faults are plain to see. The other side could look like the mona lisa but this side is still ugly as sin and painfully dysfunctional.

Melissia wrote:

Darkness wrote:Its like an A-10. Ugly as Sin, but beautiful in what it does

Oddly enough, I like the visuals of the A10 better than I do... any military aircraft with the F prefix that I know of other than the F-117. A pity that the F22/F35 crafts which replaced it are such ugly little gaks.

Agreed... A-10 is a very sexy beast, ugly is hardly a word I would use to describe it. Although I wouldn't go so far to say that the F22 is ugly, I actually quite like it. F-35... not so much... now the F-15(E especially)... thats a sexy F prefixed plane... and the F-4... awww yeah...

I think I'll stick w/ my plan of converting Caestus Assault Rams thank you... at least until someone produces an extension kit.

It would've been better like a flying rhino. IT's almost got the same AV any how. . .*vomiting profusely* I can't look at it any longer. . . :(

ShumaGorath wrote:

Melissia wrote:Yes, from this angle that is what they look like.

You trump angle too much. This isn't using a photostitch or some sort of ridiculous fisheye lens. It's faults are plain to see. The other side could look like the mona lisa but this side is still ugly as sin and painfully dysfunctional.

Yes, because I'm patient enough to not judge based off of a single picture that was released when it wasn't intended to be.

Wow it seems to me just about everyone is being cry babies...you cry when there is no model you cry when they do release a model..

"well it looks unrealistic the wings would be ripped off.. Flying brick etc etc" NEWS FLASH it is a game of plastic army figures!!! It won't be realistic!! There are no giants bugs trying to eat you and all that BS. Quit nerd raging and get over it.

Dahlberg66 wrote:"well it looks unrealistic the wings would be ripped off.. Flying brick etc etc" NEWS FLASH it is a game of plastic army figures!!! It won't be realistic!! There are no giants bugs trying to eat you and all that BS. Quit nerd raging and grt over it.

Its just that this thing is more unrealistic than usual

Dahlberg66 wrote:Wow it seems to me just about everyone is being cry babies...you cry when there is no model you cry when they do release a model..

"well it looks unrealistic the wings would be ripped off.. Flying brick etc etc" NEWS FLASH it is a game of plastic army figures!!! It won't be realistic!! There are no giants bugs trying to eat you and all that BS. Quit nerd raging and get over it.

Ya ya, buy it, don't judge it. If you have any response but utter love it's toy soldiers so it's not important enough to have an opinion on... it is important enough to buy though.

Cry-babies... You would cry too if you weren't firmly already clamped onto momma GW's teet lol. Go be an opinion faschist somewhere else dude, it's a discussion board. You just want to see the new models, stick to GW's news page. It will stress you less than all these awful people with different opinions lol

Great model, really, fabulous! Seriously, fabulous.

The only thing missing are two Giant fists coming out of the sides a-la the "Supermobile".

Then their failure would be complete.

Deadshane1 wrote:Great model, really, fabulous! Seriously, fabulous.

The only thing missing are two Giant fists coming out of the sides a-la the "Supermobile".

Then their failure would be complete.

Awesome quote

MajorTom11 wrote:

Dahlberg66 wrote:Wow it seems to me just about everyone is being cry babies...you cry when there is no model you cry when they do release a model..

"well it looks unrealistic the wings would be ripped off.. Flying brick etc etc" NEWS FLASH it is a game of plastic army figures!!! It won't be realistic!! There are no giants bugs trying to eat you and all that BS. Quit nerd raging and get over it.

Ya ya, buy it, don't judge it. If you have any response but utter love it's toy soldiers so it's not important enough to have an opinion on... it is important enough to buy though.

Cry-babies... You would cry too if you weren't firmly already clamped onto momma GW's teat lol. Go be an opinion fascist somewhere else dude, it's a discussion board. You just want to see the new models, stick to GW's news page. It will stress you less than all these awful people with different opinions lol

Funny that you're calling him "an opinion fascist" while trying to shut his opinion down.


You don't like the model? Fine, that's great you've expressed your opinion.
If someone does like the model, that doesn't mean you get to start in with this crap that's constantly thrown about here on Dakka accusing people of being apologists for GW.

moving to the other side of the bowl to take a picture of a turd from another angle isnt going it make it look any better. This model sucks from this angle, and it is going to suck from other angles as well. Many other angles.

MajorTom is in some serious danger of having his (derivative?) IP stolen, however, by posting that picture of win and awesomeness.

If I want one, Imma scratch build it for sure. I MIGHT get one of these for parts and for a base ot work from, but frankly I am not sure. It would just require so much structural work. Really not sure. Might give it a shot. Might just say screw it and bust out the plasticard.

This is so lame, it is obvious to me that this was a rushed job... I mean you can spot the reused design of the land raider which is so pathetic...

I think what is killing it the most is the tail and the sudden end to the hull in the back, I think I would add more thrusters to the wings also.

I wish I could destroy all memory of this event.

If Rhinos are metal bawkses and LR and giant bawkses ,
then certainly to keep up with GW 's Space Marine design scheme : "Large winged metal bawkses" is needed.

MajorTom11 wrote:This is what I woulda done/will do myself -

Wow someone ingrained with artistic talents even your random photoshop looks better than the original.

I'll take 6 (three red, three silver)... thanks

Kroothawk wrote:Still, I am quite certain that the design process started with a current Land Raider hull without the tracks, then adding Valkyrie wings and stuff. Seems to have the exact same volume and form (including lower part of front door, even having similar nodges at the upper edge of the hull). Makes sense for transport capacity and the Imperium being short on templates.

Well with that in mind, you might be able to get two of them to form the super-ultra-mega stormraven, just like power rangers!

On another note:

I dunno why they would have the back of the ship open for the dreadnought to be shot at by the enemy, you don't haul those simply as meat shields for the ship's crew!

well, we get a bad model every once in a while, razorgore now this so out of the good we get some bad. business as usual if there are those who will buy it despite not being happy with it

Kurgash wrote:well, we get a bad model every once in a while, razorgore now this so out of the good we get some bad. business as usual if there are those who will buy it despite not being happy with it

Must be becuase of the DE release. I hate conspiracies!

cygnnus wrote:

Asherian Command wrote:

Flachzange wrote:flying school bus ftl.

I wonder if they did base it on a School Bus?

If they did, it's the "short bus" for "special" Space Marines!

Wow... That thing is just simply horrible. With all the amazing kit-bash models that have come out, that thing is just plain disappointing. Regardless of any arguments of whether or not it could fly, the aesthetics of it are just terrible. Definitely not on the "to buy" list for my Blood Angels.

Very, very disappointing effort there GW...

Valete,

JohnS

Trust me there have been worse disappointments.

It look like a half of the Forge World Thunderhawk. Plus i feel that GW rip off some of they players design.

Mines better

LunaHound wrote:If Rhinos are metal bawkses and LR and giant bawkses ,
then certainly to keep up with GW 's Space Marine design scheme : "Large winged metal bawkses" is needed.

MajorTom11 wrote:This is what I woulda done/will do myself -

Wow someone ingrained with artistic talents even your random photoshop looks better than the original.

Those foreward lift thrusters had better exist. They could save the model.

ShumaGorath wrote:

LunaHound wrote:If Rhinos are metal bawkses and LR and giant bawkses ,
then certainly to keep up with GW 's Space Marine design scheme : "Large winged metal bawkses" is needed.

MajorTom11 wrote:This is what I woulda done/will do myself -

Wow someone ingrained with artistic talents even your random photoshop looks better than the original.

Those foreward lift thrusters had better exist. They could save the model.

I agree. Or add a giant Freaking Laser on the top with a Box for my paint brushes, and it must also hold my knife, and two thousand ultramarine, and blood angel space marine's skulls . Then the word AWESOME is written all over it and then a killer paint job, and racing flames on the front.

in my mind, the stormraven is painted up in chaos colors, and a noise marine metal band called the sky bricks play from atop it while going forth into battle

ShumaGorath wrote:

LunaHound wrote:If Rhinos are metal bawkses and LR and giant bawkses ,
then certainly to keep up with GW 's Space Marine design scheme : "Large winged metal bawkses" is needed.

MajorTom11 wrote:This is what I woulda done/will do myself -

Wow someone ingrained with artistic talents even your random photoshop looks better than the original.

Those foreward lift thrusters had better exist. They could save the model.

I dont know what that means , but majortom's design reminded me of an orca breaching the water to breath ,
its elegant and beautiful , which unfortunately for GW , its soooo close to been a nice kit , but just not quite there

I say now, that is a beautiful shoop

wish that would be the real deal!

Kanluwen wrote:

MajorTom11 wrote:

Dahlberg66 wrote:Wow it seems to me just about everyone is being cry babies...you cry when there is no model you cry when they do release a model..

"well it looks unrealistic the wings would be ripped off.. Flying brick etc etc" NEWS FLASH it is a game of plastic army figures!!! It won't be realistic!! There are no giants bugs trying to eat you and all that BS. Quit nerd raging and get over it.

Ya ya, buy it, don't judge it. If you have any response but utter love it's toy soldiers so it's not important enough to have an opinion on... it is important enough to buy though.

Cry-babies... You would cry too if you weren't firmly already clamped onto momma GW's teat lol. Go be an opinion fascist somewhere else dude, it's a discussion board. You just want to see the new models, stick to GW's news page. It will stress you less than all these awful people with different opinions lol

Funny that you're calling him "an opinion fascist" while trying to shut his opinion down.


You don't like the model? Fine, that's great you've expressed your opinion.
If someone does like the model, that doesn't mean you get to start in with this crap that's constantly thrown about here on Dakka accusing people of being apologists for GW.

I didn't say he couldn't like it. I would NEVER tell anyone they can or can't like something. If some people like it that's great, I am sincerely happy for them and there is absolutely nothing wrong with someone being pleased! I 100% support their right to like whatever they want, and my opinion of it should have no bearing on that. Likewise though it would be nice if people who did like it didn't start slinging crap at anyone who doesn't either. (Yes, I know there were one or two who stated their dislike as absolutes everyone should follow, but the vast majority simply said I don't like it, not NO ONE must like this)

So obviously the thing I took issue with is the crybabies comment. That is rude. That is not an argument, that's just being a dick.

You know what though? Saying oh you wanted a model so you should be happy no matter what that they gave you one is ridiculous and patently slowed. Just because someone wants something doesn't mean they should be satisfied with ANYTHING. If I say I'm hungry, and someone serves me (what tastes to me) horrid tasting barely edible gamey raw rat meat, it doesn't mean I have to say it's delicious. Or eat it. And anybody who says otherwise whilst defending a GW policy or product IS an apologist to me. Why? Because they are advocating the complete suspension of standards based solely on the fact a product simply exists.

Argue with me if you want, I don't particularly mind, but please don't misinterpret my anger at the other gentleman's tone as having anything to do with what he thinks about the model. In fact, if you go back, and you will find I said I am lukewarm to it, but saw a lot of potential, both to convert, and financially as it is a good base to convert from without having to shell out for a LR and Valk kit. I will definitely be getting one or two.

Stop being dicks to each other.

New Blood Angel players are reading the Dark Eldar Codex right now...and looking at the new models...and are pissed.

Kan and I made friends and fist-bumped, all good.

MDizzle wrote:Mines better

Yes.

Yes it is.

What annoys me most is that this model doesn't even come CLOSE to fitting the aesthetic of the Grey Knights as it is neither archaic, nor intricate, it has no grace, it's simply blocky. Being that it is 99.99% assured it will be in the DH rerelease, I wouldn't give it the time of day. I mean you have your Termies, your PA then...HOLY CRAP WHAT IS THAT THING!?

I would love to have one for my terminators so I don't have to risk deepstriking them. However this is no silk purse, this is the original sow's ear

Now now children. If we are done insulting eachother about a wargaming hobby over the interwebs I'd like to point out the furioso Dread in the top left corner. Also a new model? The plastic furioso I've always wanted for my Flesh Tearers, or just a kit bash? only time will tell....

Ehsteve wrote:What annoys me most is that this model doesn't even come CLOSE to fitting the aesthetic of the Grey Knights as it is neither archaic, nor intricate, it has no grace, it's simply blocky. Being that it is 99.99% assured it will be in the DH rerelease, I wouldn't give it the time of day. I mean you have your Termies, your PA then...HOLY CRAP WHAT IS THAT THING!?

So you've seen the sprues in person? Held the bare plastic in your hands and built it up?

You know for a fact that there's no bits in there for Grey Knight Stormravens to make them look "archaic"(which I've always found to be flowertalk for "old", which the Stormraven isn't. It's a brand new, fluffwise, design that's really only in use by the Grey Knights and Blood Angels)?

Deadshane1 wrote:New Blood Angel players are reading the Dark Eldar Codex right now...and looking at the new models...and are pissed.

Are we talking the hardcore Blood Angel players who've always been playing Blood Angels for their fluff...

Or the bandwagoners who latched on for wins?

Kid_Kyoto wrote:

MDizzle wrote:Mines better

Yes.

Yes it is.

How much did that cost?

Apparently 1 leaked picture = 8 pages of jumping to conclusions and sophomoric bickering with a smattering occasionally of civil conversation that is also on topic.

At a bare minimum it's got to be $62 like the Valkyrie. Probably more, especially if the release date is after June 1 when prices often get "adjusted".

Probably $75+. I'm seeing bits from a Star Wars Snowspeeder and a Valkyrie, along with some scenery.

I sure hope it is sooner than June!

I do agree with Kan though, if this thing is coming out with the GK codex, I find it hard to believe that it would come with BA iconography and not bits/touches of GK style stuff too.

My biggest issue with it right now is how freaking cartoony it looks in the Blood Angels livery.

I'm sure we'll all be used to the chibi-hawk soon enough. If the Leman Russ had just been released, there'd be a thread exactly like this about it.

Kanluwen wrote:

Ehsteve wrote:What annoys me most is that this model doesn't even come CLOSE to fitting the aesthetic of the Grey Knights as it is neither archaic, nor intricate, it has no grace, it's simply blocky. Being that it is 99.99% assured it will be in the DH rerelease, I wouldn't give it the time of day. I mean you have your Termies, your PA then...HOLY CRAP WHAT IS THAT THING!?

So you've seen the sprues in person? Held the bare plastic in your hands and built it up?

You know for a fact that there's no bits in there for Grey Knight Stormravens to make them look "archaic"(which I've always found to be flowertalk for "old", which the Stormraven isn't. It's a brand new, fluffwise, design that's really only in use by the Grey Knights and Blood Angels)?

Who knows, they might stick on some ribbons to make it look classy and all

If I want to spend money on my GK army, i'll stick to the on-foot forces. While the rules I take for the sheer awesome, i'm not sticking them in that flying clown car.

FW inquisitor rhino: awesome, only a few details make it look intricate, detailed, not bland.

Unless they release some epic FW add-on kit which adds something non-comical to it simply doesn't interest me.

And the aesthetic of GK is supposed to be 'old', the practicality of the storm raven is not my issue, my issue is simply it does not seem to fit in. Yes it is new, but that does not mean that it's hull won't have to be sanctified, or it's weapons blessed, because it will have to be modified to fit the GK's needs.

$62? $75? Where are you people thinking up these absurd values? I would be shocked if this kit was more than $50.

ph34r wrote:$62? $75? Where are you people thinking up these absurd values? I would be shocked if this kit was more than $50.

The $75 was in regards to someone's converted Stormraven which is posted in this thread.

The actual kit I'd put at probably $35-$40. It looks like, partswise, it'll be the size of a Rhino or Razorback.

ph34r wrote:$62? $75? Where are you people thinking up these absurd values? I would be shocked if this kit was more than $50.

$62 for Land Raider, Valkyrie

$50 buys you a Ravager , which i doubt GW will price it that low in comparison

Oops edited to reflect USD version

This thing looks really, really top heavy.
It almost gives the image of a really big insect with tiny wings struggling to keep itself in midair.
And that makes it awesome.

ph34r wrote:$62? $75? Where are you people thinking up these absurd values? I would be shocked if this kit was more than $50.

Valk carries a price tag of $62 US, I'd be shocked if this wasn't priced exactly the same.

Really? Looks like it has as much plastic as a LandRaider at the very least to me? Surface area wise... The 'block' area alone looks to be a rhino width high and equally as wide, so double rhino volume. Then the wings, engines and tail...

If it was 35-40 i'd buy 3 lol, love it or not, that is a very good dollar value per game point right?

Teek wrote:

ph34r wrote:$62? $75? Where are you people thinking up these absurd values? I would be shocked if this kit was more than $50.

Valk carries a price tag of $62 US, I'd be shocked if this wasn't priced exactly the same.

Really? This kit looks to be much smaller than a valk. I'd say $45. Knowing GW though, it's a mystery.

BrassScorpion wrote:Apparently 1 leaked picture = 8 pages of jumping to conclusions and sophomoric bickering with a smattering occasionally of civil conversation that is also on topic.

At a bare minimum it's got to be $62 like the Valkyrie. Probably more, especially if the release date is after June 1 when prices often get "adjusted".

Ah good! I do so love the part of every rumour thread where BrassScorpion shows up to tell us both how many pages the thread is and also and then to insult everyone (and then posts something on topic as to make his post slightly more than a vague flame). Could alsmost set my watch to it if it wasn't already set to KDT (Kanluwen Defenence Time).

Ah, apropos...

Kanluwen wrote:So you've seen the sprues in person? Held the bare plastic in your hands and built it up?

He's basing his opinion of what he's seen Kan - that's all - and to him, the new vehicle does not fit the aesthetic of the Grey Knights. I'm certain that he's allowed to hold this view without being challenged (or without being told he cannot hold his view because he hasn't physically seen the sprues). I dislike it because it looks like the front of a larger vehicle with some wings and a vestigial tail slapped on, and because the turret is God-awful, and because MajorTom's version is simply amazing (so much so that I want it to be made that way). I'm fine with people liking it, but I think the overwhelmingly negative reaction to this isn't just me this time. I mean even Chuck hates it (and explained his reasons why), and I'll take his opinion on things here before I take most of anyone else's as he certainly has his head on straight.

Edited by Manchu.

H.B.M.C. wrote:He's basing his opinion of what he's seen Kan - that's all - and to him, the new vehicle does not fit the aesthetic of the Grey Knights. I'm certain that he's allowed to hold this view without being challenged (or without being told he cannot hold his view because he hasn't physically seen the sprues). I dislike it because it looks like the front of a larger vehicle with some wings and a vestigial tail slapped on, and because the turret is God-awful, and because MajorTom's version is simply amazing (so much so that I want it to be made that way). I'm fine with people liking it, but I think the overwhelmingly negative reaction to this isn't just me this time. I mean even Chuck hates it (and explained his reasons why), and I'll take his opinion on things here before I take most of anyone else's as he certainly has his head on straight.

My point was that his statement was that it doesn't fit the aesthetic of the Grey Knights(which I wholeheartedly agree with)...but that at the same time, the Stormraven is something that won't fit with the aesthetics of the Grey Knights, period.

It's a brand new vehicle design, in terms of where it fits in the fluff of 40k. Simply because of that:
It's going to conflict with the baroque artificer look of Grey Knights, no matter how many purity seals and inscriptions you slap on it.

just seeing this now but wow.. that model looks just plain dumb. it's a short stubby thunderhawk. The valkyrie conversions people have been doing blow this thing away...

Kanluwen wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:He's basing his opinion of what he's seen Kan - that's all - and to him, the new vehicle does not fit the aesthetic of the Grey Knights. I'm certain that he's allowed to hold this view without being challenged (or without being told he cannot hold his view because he hasn't physically seen the sprues). I dislike it because it looks like the front of a larger vehicle with some wings and a vestigial tail slapped on, and because the turret is God-awful, and because MajorTom's version is simply amazing (so much so that I want it to be made that way). I'm fine with people liking it, but I think the overwhelmingly negative reaction to this isn't just me this time. I mean even Chuck hates it (and explained his reasons why), and I'll take his opinion on things here before I take most of anyone else's as he certainly has his head on straight.

My point was that his statement was that it doesn't fit the aesthetic of the Grey Knights(which I wholeheartedly agree with)...but that at the same time, the Stormraven is something that won't fit with the aesthetics of the Grey Knights, period.

It's a brand new vehicle design, in terms of where it fits in the fluff of 40k. Simply because of that:
It's going to conflict with the baroque artificer look of Grey Knights, no matter how many purity seals and inscriptions you slap on it.

That was my point. It doesn't fit. Hence why it will not grace my army list unless I can get either a modified version from a 3rd party or if there happens to be a FW kit able to redeem its appearance (like the door kits for the rhino, for the GK LR Redeemer which screams awesome).

And if it does end up costing as much as a land raider (over here in Australia a good $100AUS or more) then I don't know if there will be many sales down at the FLGS, being one of the few GK players there (there also being a limited number of BA players).

Don't even remotely assume for a second it'd be close to a Land Raider. The size is nowhere near justifying that cost, unless there really is a ton of Grey Knight bits that we're not seeing yet.

Whoever's spitballed those numbers is full of crap, or was confusing when myself and other posted a reply to someone who asked how much that conversion posted in the thread a few pages ago was(Not sure who said "$62", but that was because a Valkyrie at $58 USD was involved. I'm guessing $75 unless they bitz ordered stuff though, simply because it's an ENTIRE Valkyrie kit with a Star Wars Snowspeeder toy).

But yeah, I definitely agree with you on that it doesn't work too well with Grey Knights...or at least the version of it that we've seen so far doesn't.

I think the storm raven should have transport rules similar to the monolith, as I can all too easily envision a huge number of marines pouring constantly from its absurdly compact assault ramp. it looks like a flying space marine clown car.

The model is another turd spewed out by a company that lives by the motto, "If you paint a turd three colors, a bunch of idiots will buy it!" That is what GW thinks of their customer base.

Kan 2.3a wrote:Don't even remotely assume for a second it'd be close to a Land Raider.

Well why not? They can pretty much charge what ever the want for it? I see it being Valk priced, which is the same bracket as the new Demolisher/Russ, etc. (at least it is in Oz), but if they wanted to 'Goldsword' the price and give us the Goldraven, they certainly could. Well within their rights.

Necros wrote:just seeing this now but wow.. that model looks just plain dumb. it's a short stubby thunderhawk. The valkyrie conversions people have been doing blow this thing away...

Speaking of all the conversions, the last time we had a really popular 'Scratch Built' model was, I think, before the Defiler came out. Everyone and his dog was making their own Defiler. There were some awful ones, some great ones, and some inspired ones (I think someone on Taco Bell had one based around a Landspeeder with HUGE tall legs and eyes sticking out of it). Then, when we finally saw the Defiler just before the EOT Campaign, the general responce was "Wow. That's pretty cool", and people either kept theirs or bought one (or in my case two, as I got two in the one box thanks to a packaging mistake! ).

This model had the same build up. Same amount of excitment over it, same amount of people making fantastic and awful scratch builds (best I've seen was a GW staffer at the new North Sydney store here in Oz) but... now this model has been revealed (sorta, even if by mistake) and... people hate it? I wasn't expecting that. Were we spoilt by the Valkyrie kit? I've not seen such a universal reaction to a new GW kit since the Pumbagore, but even that was pretty low key.

taebeck wrote:The model is another turd spewed out by a company that lives by the motto, "If you paint a turd three colors, a bunch of idiots will buy it!" That is what GW thinks of their customer base.

Well that certainly added a lot to the discussion.

As bad as the reaction is, I think by leaving off the top bits and slapping on a razorback turret, it could be quite successful. It all depends on the cost.

taebeck wrote:The model is another turd spewed out by a company that lives by the motto, "If you paint a turd three colors, a bunch of idiots will buy it!" That is what GW thinks of their customer base.

Yep, that'll do it all right. I'm sure GW will see the error of their ways when they read balanced and well reasoned comments like that.

I think the major issue with this kit is its height compared to its width - the rest is just detail, and easily modified. In that respect, it's like the Battlewagon kit, which looks so much better once you've added about a centimetre or so of width. The other issue is the tail, which seems like an afterthought. Overall, it's ended up out of step with the rest of the Marine design ethos. Another issue is the weapon mounts, which seem to combine some of the less satisfactory features of Marine tanks (like the angled panels on the lascannon, which don't provide any frontal protection) with new features that would look more at home on an Imperial bomber (the glass panels in the top turret).

It looks to me as though the designer couldn't pull of what was probably the design brief - keep it relatively compact (as GW seems to have realised that WH40k battlefields are increasingly gridlocked), cram all of the weapons in, and try to suggest a 'gunship' while keeping it in line with the tracked Marine vehicles and the Thunderhawk.

I have to admire the photoshopping skill of people like MajorTom11. I think his version makes more sense in some respects, but it still looks unfinished and doesn't have a well-defined shape. I think aka_mythos' version comes closer to what I would have ideally wanted. For all the criticism of its supposedly unworkable appearance, however, the new kit is clearly based on a helicopter design rather than an aircraft (so all this talk of airflow and aerodynamics is misplaced). There are some very unwieldy looking helicopters, which share this model's high, narrow front fuselage and spindly tail. The Mi-4 (a Soviet helicopter) is an example. I still don't think they got it right (i.e. turned a helicopter into a sci-fi transport) - in the way that, say, the Republic gunship from Star Wars does.

I also question the cries of 'looks worse than most of the scratchbuilds'. Few of the scratchbuilds on the net are any more convincing either as gunships or as Marine vehicles than this kit. MDizzle's, for instance, is a very nice model (and one of the best scratchbuilds I've seen), but looks too much like an aircraft to me. And for all the hate being directed at it now (and some of you are practically falling over each other in your eagerness to tell everyone how much you hate it), I bet it sells like hot cakes. It's also quite possible that when photos of it from other angles appear, there will be a degree of reconsideration. When it's released we'll start seeing some conversions along the lines of the photoshop modifications - after all, we're not stuck with the model as it is.

Necros wrote:just seeing this now but wow.. that model looks just plain dumb. it's a short stubby thunderhawk. The valkyrie conversions people have been doing blow this thing away...

I must agree...I am very disappointed with this, at first glance. Okay, it's not the best photo, but it's fairly underwhelming at this stage.

I was wondering if it would be possible to extend the base plate, and convert it to be more TH-like, but even that looks difficult...

Real shame...I was looking forward to this release.

Padre^.

Would a Razorback turret look better or worse though?

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Kan 2.3a wrote:Don't even remotely assume for a second it'd be close to a Land Raider.

Well why not? They can pretty much charge what ever the want for it? I see it being Valk priced, which is the same bracket as the new Demolisher/Russ, etc. (at least it is in Oz), but if they wanted to 'Goldsword' the price and give us the Goldraven, they certainly could. Well within their rights.

You're actually wrong about the price bracket there. Valkyrie is $62 USD, Demolisher/Russ is $49.50.

Rough guess from the size of the model in comparison to the Marines, and depending on how crammed up the sprues are...I'd guess $45-ish. Same price as a Predator/Whirlwind/Vindicator.

Knock the price down to $35 if Grey Knights actually have nothing on the sprues and their upgrades are a $10 "Grey Knight Upgrade Sprue" available from mail order only.


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H.B.M.C. wrote:Would a Razorback turret look better or worse though?

Worse, in my view. It'd have an arbitrary armor plate over the twin-linked lascannons and some kind of sensor package over it too.

Regardless of how the model looks as a whole, it does look like a good kit for making conversions out of, it's got multi-meltas, wings, tail, even a turret which can be used for other things.

I'm starting to see some use for this model...for building better things, but I will hold out for the price.

Kanluwen wrote:You're actually wrong about the price bracket there. Valkyrie is $62 USD, Demolisher/Russ is $49.50.

Ah. It's gone up. Moved brackets to the Land Raider bracket. Hadn't realised that. Or could have been the initial price in Oz. I know that they change things, so it might've appeared AUD$83 when it came out, but then changed to AUD$96 (which is what the Land Raider was before the last price rise - now it's AUD$103).

Kanluwen wrote:Rough guess from the size of the model in comparison to the Marines, and depending on how crammed up the sprues are...I'd guess $45-ish. Same price as a Predator/Whirlwind/Vindicator.

Nah. You get more air than plastic in the Hellhound box and that's as much as a Russ. It's so tall as well. I can't see it being in a bracket below the Russ.

Kanluwen wrote:Worse, in my view. It'd have an arbitrary armor plate over the twin-linked lascannons and some kind of sensor package over it too.

You're right. The armour plate wouldn't make any sense.

Just wish they'd chosen an aesthetic that matched other Marine vehicles. The Stormraven turret looks like it belongs on a Guard plane, not a Marine vehicle. It's too... conventional.

Ehsteve wrote:Regardless of how the model looks as a whole, it does look like a good kit for making conversions out of, it's got multi-meltas, wings, tail, even a turret which can be used for other things.

I'm starting to see some use for this model...for building better things, but I will hold out for the price.

I wouldn't be surprised if a decent amount of sales came from this kind of reasoning. Wouldn't have to spend $62 on a Valkyrie for conversions (depending on the final price point, of course.)

I would love for it to turn out that this is either an early stage pre-production model that's been test built, or someone's custom made one, but I rather doubt that. Even so, it still might be worth the money depending on what you plan to do with it - as a bitz kit it would be fantastic.

MajorTom and Tailgunner,

Thank you for showing me the error of my ways. I guess I forgot that people would chastise me for giving my off the cuff reaction to what I think is a hastily designed model with no originality or effort. You are absolutely right to say that I should be ashamed for wanting a company that charges ultra premium prices to put some imagination into a item that they have the chance to build from the ground up, with no former models to try to "match styles" with. What was I thinking? The fact that they, IMHO, just slapped something together and threw it out there with a likely $60+ price tag is what makes this hobby great. The best thing to do now is go out and plunk down our cash along with the sheeple and fan boys, remembering to lick GWs boot.

Deadshane1 wrote:New Blood Angel players are reading the Dark Eldar Codex right now...and looking at the new models...and are pissed.

I can only hope that this is another one of those "all youve seen/read is a lie" deals. After looking at the kit for a while, it does have a certain kitbashed look to it. where the front landing skidds seem to be. that part looks like somewhat like a dread arm, and so on. one could only hope because if that is the real deal, i think GW wont make half the money they expected making with that thing. On the other hand, maybe GW doesnt care. People are already willing to pay half the price on top again to convert other kits

Well, THAT added something to the conversation!

Dude, that was something far more interesting to consider than 'poopypants makes smelly poops in his pants lol!'

Just a little clarification on what you are unsatisfied with helps a lot, and makes it easier to actually you know, respond and discuss and junk.

DiscoVader wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if a decent amount of sales came from this kind of reasoning. Wouldn't have to spend $62 on a Valkyrie for conversions (depending on the final price point, of course.)

Most of the sales will come from the fact that the majority of people will buy a bad official model before they make a good unofficial model themselves. Not to call people sheep in general, but most people aren't like us (which is good, otherwise the world'd be a boring place and we'd have no one to laugh at), so they'll just buy it because it's the Stormraven model, not because a good model.

MajorTom11 wrote:

taebeck wrote:The model is another turd spewed out by a company that lives by the motto, "If you paint a turd three colors, a bunch of idiots will buy it!" That is what GW thinks of their customer base.

Well that certainly added a lot to the discussion.

taebeck wrote:MajorTom and Tailgunner,

Thank you for showing me the error of my ways. I guess I forgot that people would chastise me for giving my off the cuff reaction to what I think is a hastily designed model with no originality or effort. You are absolutely right to say that I should be ashamed for wanting a company that charges ultra premium prices to put some imagination into a item that they have the chance to build from the ground up, with no former models to try to "match styles" with. What was I thinking? The fact that they, IMHO, just slapped something together and threw it out there with a likely $60+ price tag is what makes this hobby great. The best thing to do now is go out and plunk down our cash along with the sheeple and fan boys, remembering to lick GWs boot.

Well, THAT added something to the conversation!

Dude, that was something far more interesting to consider than 'poopypants makes smelly poops in his pants lol!'

Just a little clarification on what you are unsatisfied with helps a lot, and makes it easier to actually you know, respond and discuss and junk.

"And, GW said that it shall be blocky, ugly, and lame. . .it shall be done! And, then they said it shall be $95.00 US currency, to insult the BA players ever more!"

Flachzange wrote:I can only hope that this is another one of those "all youve seen/read is a lie" deals.

Another 'everything you've been told is a lie' deal? When was the last one?

Seems like an okay model to me. Lots of conversion potential at the very least. I've built 2 of my own stormravens and I'll still buy this new one

However, I also buy everything that is a blood angel

After looking at the thing for the last twelve and a half hours, I'm starting to like it a bit more.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

DiscoVader wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if a decent amount of sales came from this kind of reasoning. Wouldn't have to spend $62 on a Valkyrie for conversions (depending on the final price point, of course.)

Most of the sales will come from the fact that the majority of people will buy a bad official model before they make a good unofficial model themselves. Not to call people sheep in general, but most people aren't like us (which is good, otherwise the world'd be a boring place and we'd have no one to laugh at), so they'll just buy it because it's the Stormraven model, not because a good model.

I'll buy it because it's easier to modify into a Storm Raven that I like than anything else that's readily available.

[quote= On the other hand, maybe GW doesnt care. People are already willing to pay half the price on top again to convert other kits[/quote.]



This is most of my point. I am sick and tired of GW not caring what their customer base thinks. Hell, it almost seems like they are actively trying to irritate the players. Does that smack of arrogance? I guess they think they are too big to fail, and that no matter what rubbish they put out, people are going to rush out and buy it. They have done so much better with recent releases. The new fantasy box and the majority of the Dark Eldar are good example of what they can do when they actually try. The pic of the Storm Raven looks like the had four models on the design table and kit bashed them. Front is a Thunder Hawk, middle is a Land Raider, tail is a Valkyrie and the turret is a slightly altered Wave Serpent turret to hold a gunner and use marine weapons.

plastictrees wrote:I'll buy it because it's easier to modify into a Storm Raven that I like than anything else that's readily available.

Heh: "...easier to modify into a Storm Raven". Interesting choice of words. Implying that this kit isn't the Stormraven, but with a little work could allow you to make one. Doubt that's the reaction to the official Stormraven kit that GW would have hoped for.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

plastictrees wrote:I'll buy it because it's easier to modify into a Storm Raven that I like than anything else that's readily available.

Heh: "...easier to modify into a Storm Raven". Interesting choice of words. Implying that this kit isn't the Stormraven, but with a little work could allow you to make one. Doubt that's the reaction to the official Stormraven kit that GW would have hoped for.

It was one of my first thoughts too. A few things could be done to make it look better within the model itself.

Just remember that the Stormraven can't be fed after midnight and it hates brightlights.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

DiscoVader wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if a decent amount of sales came from this kind of reasoning. Wouldn't have to spend $62 on a Valkyrie for conversions (depending on the final price point, of course.)

Most of the sales will come from the fact that the majority of people will buy a bad official model before they make a good unofficial model themselves. Not to call people sheep in general, but most people aren't like us (which is good, otherwise the world'd be a boring place and we'd have no one to laugh at), so they'll just buy it because it's the Stormraven model, not because a good model.

This and the fact that the StormRaven will now have an official model. Lots of tournaments wont allow even scratch builds if there is an official model. So people who want to play in those sort of events will be forced to buy enough to have.

Seriously chaps, whilst this isn't possibly what our gold-tinted imaginations had come up with, what were we really expecting?

Sure, the fuzzy flyers in the background cover art of "The Hunt for Valdorous" book looked better, but they also looked way too big.

What we have is something that retains the T-Hawk design aesthetic (love or hate it) and the blunt and brutal lines of all space marine machines (Landraider, Rhino etc). Let’s be honest for a moment here - if it was a sleek aerodynamic flyer, this thread would simply be complaining that it didn't fit the rest of the range...

Don't get me wrong, I was disappointed at first too, but I feel it may be growing on me (that reaction could, of course, simply be pity)

If I put on my tin-foil hat of predicting, I see a time where almost every marine player complaining about this model ends up with one in their collection....

I think you make some very good points there, Gordy, especially about some sleek plane not being enough of a Rhino for Marines to fly.

I swear, people, the more you think of it as "chibi-hawk" the better it sits with you.

Gordy2000 wrote:Seriously chaps, whilst this isn't possibly what our gold-tinted imaginations had come up with, what were we really expecting?

Sure, the fuzzy flyers in the background cover art of "The Hunt for Valdorous" book looked better, but they also looked way too big.

What we have is something that retains the T-Hawk design aesthetic (love or hate it) and the blunt and brutal lines of all space marine machines (Landraider, Rhino etc). Let’s be honest for a moment here - if it was a sleek aerodynamic flyer, this thread would simply be complaining that it didn't fit the rest of the range...

Don't get me wrong, I was disappointed at first too, but I feel it may be growing on me (that reaction could, of course, simply be pity)

If I put on my tin-foil hat of predicting, I see a time where almost every marine player complaining about this model ends up with one in their collection....

I think you mistake people disliking it for the fact that it's a poorly proportioned mess with people disliking it for it's artistic direction. I like the blockiness in imperial flyers, it's weird and kinda refreshing (as long as you don't pay attention to the jet engines on space craft). However this model is a mess for dozens of reasons beyond the aesthetic direction. I would also argue against "almost every marine player" owning one of these. It's not in the main of wolf marine codexes after all. It'll get tossed in eventually with rewrites though.

crappest model gw has made... well ever, mabie they used up all their ownenge on DE ):

It is going to take a few drinks to make this bird look pretty...but there might be some potential...maybe...even if it is just for parts.

No matter what GW does, someone is going to fly into a "hated it" style nerd rage.
Personally it looks fine enough to me, fits the aesthetic, and the tail is supposed to have a dread hooked up so... Problem?
Yes, "chibi-hawk" does kinda grow on you doesn't it?

It's so cute!

It's like the Smart Car of the grimdark future!

i kinda like it,but still reminds of this:



sorry for the fugly potoshop

Nah. It's an improvement!

I bet it's really easy to park.

Gordy2000 wrote:
Sure, the fuzzy flyers in the background cover art of "The Hunt for Valdorous" book looked better, but they also looked way too big.

That's because they're Thunderhawks, some of them modified to carry more bikes.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Flachzange wrote:I can only hope that this is another one of those "all youve seen/read is a lie" deals.

Another 'everything you've been told is a lie' deal? When was the last one?

Well, I was referring to Spulk. I admit, that was more of a failed attempt. I was merely trying to spread hope that the chibi-hawk may not in fact be the actual model but rather a horrible, horrible joke!

Flachzange wrote:Well, I was referring to Spulk.

I thought that was what you meant.

And yeah... not the best example either. The whole mystery box debacle was just that - a debacle!!!

Kanluwen wrote:Don't even remotely assume for a second it'd be close to a Land Raider. The size is nowhere near justifying that cost, unless there really is a ton of Grey Knight bits that we're not seeing yet.

Whoever's spitballed those numbers is full of crap, or was confusing when myself and other posted a reply to someone who asked how much that conversion posted in the thread a few pages ago was.

Okay, you made me link another of your "full of crap" posts link for future reference
Guess, I can use it quite soon!

tedstea wrote:crappest model gw has made... well ever, mabie they used up all their ownenge on DE ):

You make Pumbagore sad!

...there's no manticore model right now yes ? Could we take the wings from the 'raven, get a Pumbagor and... no... no, that way madness lies.

ShumaGorath wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:

plastictrees wrote:I'll buy it because it's easier to modify into a Storm Raven that I like than anything else that's readily available.

Heh: "...easier to modify into a Storm Raven". Interesting choice of words. Implying that this kit isn't the Stormraven, but with a little work could allow you to make one. Doubt that's the reaction to the official Stormraven kit that GW would have hoped for.

It was one of my first thoughts too. A few things could be done to make it look better within the model itself.

Agree also...that was about my second thought - "hmmm, this has potential for conversion for improvement..."

My first though when I saw it was unprintable.

Padre^.

Relax people. Less than 5% of all BA players use these things, because Devastators, auto/las Predators, twinlas/hb Predators, Dakka Predators, Rifleman Dreadnoughts etc are all vastly more competitive choices than the Stormraven. GW should know by now that codex rules directly affect the sales of a new model (see Obliterators, Vendettas, etc).

The only reason I can see myself being interested about this kit at all is if the Grey Knight version has better guns and/or better armour combined with about 40-50p lower points cost.

haha 10 pages in 1 night impressive.

It does look rather meh! but does also have some possibilities for use for other things. I'll hold off comdemming it until there are a few more pictures.

seriously,whats up with the wings sneaking over the engines thing and those ig design lascannon turret?

it,ill buy an assault ram.for my wolves

I don't know what the problem is. I rather like it.

Ktulhut wrote:I don't know what the problem is.

reds8n wrote:...there's no manticore model right now yes ? Could we take the wings from the 'raven, get a Pumbagor and... no... no, that way madness lies.

Oh my Gog, that kit would be perfect to convert into a Razorgor chariot!

And just for good measure, let's give it a cannon that shoots Canis Wolfborn at the enemy.

And then mount it all on Nagash's hat.

I like it, i konw its abit boxy but we always knew it would be..

I will defo be buying a couple when they are relesed..

jim

Gordy2000 wrote:Seriously chaps, whilst this isn't possibly what our gold-tinted imaginations had come up with, what were we really expecting?

Something like what any one of half a dozen gold-tinted imaginations came up with. Because unlike this, they didn't look like ass.

This thing must fly by doing sumersalts.

I like it, some plasti card to make a box section to the rear to bulk it out and your laughing, maybe a few other tweaks aswell