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Post by: Korcheski
The Shadow Spectres Aspect Warrior Squad
And
Eldar Warp Hunter
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/ELDAR-WARP-HUNTER.html
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Post by: Kanluwen
Sweet zombie jesus, that's right the hell out of nowhere!
Shadow Spectres preordered. Those are gonna be a blast to paint.
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Post by: vaatbak
Holy moly, those are beautifull...........
btw just read the rules, jet packs give the relentless rule?
Never knew that.
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Post by: Just Dave
Kanluwen wrote:Sweet zombie jesus, that's right the hell out of nowhere!
Shadow Spectres preordered. Those are gonna be a blast to paint.
 You're not kidding!
Those both look absolutely awesome though, seriously great looking models. *wolf whistles*
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Post by: AlexHolker
I like the Warp Hunter. I'd like the Shadow Spectres if they were in plastic, and less likely to have flimsy, load bearing tabards snap.
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Post by: Mad4Minis
Very cool. Really like the Warp Hunter. Not too bad a price for FW either. Might have to pick one up.
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Post by: Samus_aran115
Man, those shadow spectres are amazing.... If GW made them, they'd probably be falling all over the place. Hopefully FW fixes that
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Post by: SlaveToDorkness
Very nice looking, I'd use the Warp Hunter for a Fireprism in normal games.
Too bad the Spectres rules are craptacular.
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Post by: Calibanite Lion
Both looking really good, the warphunter is a great looking *cheap for fw* eldar tank lol!  lets hope they release more pocket friendly vehicles
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Post by: Melchiour
Wish they would fix the link to rules on the tank.
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Post by: Necros
Times like this, I miss having my eldar army :(
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Post by: Kanluwen
It's entirely possible they don't have the experimental rules for the tank ready yet, hence the inactive link.
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Post by: Necroagogo
Shadow Spectres are Heavy Support? Eldar players - will they make it into your army?
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Post by: Alpharius
Yes indeed - "load bearing loinclothes" are a terrible idea, especially in resin! 
Still - nice models!
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Post by: Kanluwen
If you look at them from the rear, it appears that the tabards are actually attached to the stone plinths.
So it may not be that bad of an idea.
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Post by: SagesStone
Necroagogo wrote:Shadow Spectres are Heavy Support? Eldar players - will they make it into your army?
Maybe. I like the models except the heads a little. The experimental rules look cool as well. If I'm reading it correctly the entire unit can shoot a single 60" S10 AP2 Lance. I like the Ghostlight rule it's pretty unique.
I may even get a few to try and make a more interesting Seer Council with eventually.
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Post by: Kanluwen
n0t_u wrote:Necroagogo wrote:Shadow Spectres are Heavy Support? Eldar players - will they make it into your army?
Maybe. I like the models except the heads a little. The experimental rules look cool as well. If I'm reading it correctly the entire unit can shoot a single 60" S10 AP2 Lance. I like the Ghostlight rule it's pretty unique.
I may even get a few to try and make a more interesting Seer Council with eventually.
And if the Exarch takes the Cynosure Warrior Power, they can reroll failed Ghostlight attacks.
It's definitely a very interesting unit, especially given that you can theoretically get the full powered blast without the Exarch firing too.
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Post by: warboss
hmm, a duo of very cool looking models. once again, i wish forgeworld had to ok gw's designs as i wonder what the stormraven would have looked like if FW had designed it instead. at least the eldar get a super cool looking tank and it seems quite resonably priced too. it's 5 pounds (sorry, i don't know how you brits type the stylized L) LESS than the stormraven and its a complete resin/plastic kit.
i'm quite surprised about the holofields on the spectres though.... i would have given them 3+ armor due to the look of the figs instead.
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Post by: Alpharius
Kanluwen wrote:
If you look at them from the rear, it appears that the tabards are actually attached to the stone plinths.
So it may not be that bad of an idea.
Those 2 on the left look like a pretty bad idea, actually!
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Post by: AlexHolker
Kanluwen wrote:If you look at them from the rear, it appears that the tabards are actually attached to the stone plinths.
I know, but the weakest link still looks like the cross-section of the tabard.
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Post by: Kanluwen
*shrug*
I'll give my review when I get them 
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Post by: DX3
Damn you Forge World for taking all of my discretional income!
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Post by: MIKEtheMERCILESS
Good God, they look astounding! Great to see a viable alternative to Fire Dragons; I never usually touch Forgeworld, but even I'm sorely tempted by these...
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Post by: Mr Nobody
Where's christmas or birthdays when you need them. University has made me poor.
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Post by: MajorTom11
beautiful minis... gotta love FW infantry
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Post by: Just Dave
Good call Baragash!
Wowza, I would definitely take a Warphunter in that case! Jeeze! I do love a good D-cannon.
Shame they've just added two more units to the Eldar heavy support slot though. 
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Post by: elaverick
A D-cannon’s attacks bypass power fields and void shields.
That's going to make the Warp Hunter one hell of a power titan killer in that case...
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Post by: deejaybainbridge
wowzers, having just started an Eldar army this news makes me happy. Those Shadow Spectres Aspect Warriors look really good, nice work Forge World.
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Post by: SkaerKrow
Gorgeous figures. If I A) Had an Eldar army and B) Didn't shun resin figures then I'd definitely pick some up.
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Post by: Necroagogo
Heavy Support: A Warp Hunter is a Heavy Support choice for an Eldar army and an Eldar Corsairs army.
What's a Corsairs Army ... IA11?
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Post by: Gorechild
Necroagogo wrote:Shadow Spectres are Heavy Support? Eldar players - will they make it into your army?
Competitivly....No. They lack the AP1 that dragons provide and lack the ability to kill hordes that you can get with a fire prism.
That aside, I will probably buy some to paint and for friendly games, they look amazing.
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Post by: puma713
Loving the Shadow Spectres. Wonder what the chance is they'll make it into the next Eldar 'dex.
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Post by: Xca|iber
Now, I'm not an Eldar player, but aren't these just two more units competing for HS slots? The Shadow Spectres are cool, but I don't feel like their use justifies replacing a Fire Prism. The Warp Hunter is better, but do Eldar need more anti-infantry?
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Post by: Just Dave
Yeah, you're right Xcaliber. The Shadow Spectres don't really seem like they can compete with the Fire Prism, despite their beautiful models.
The Warp Hunter however looks really good and the D-cannon is a freakin' nasty weapon against ALL targets. Including titans. I know I'd include one...
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Post by: Gorechild
Xca|iber wrote:Now, I'm not an Eldar player, but aren't these just two more units competing for HS slots? The Shadow Spectres are cool, but I don't feel like their use justifies replacing a Fire Prism. The Warp Hunter is better, but do Eldar need more anti-infantry?
You're completely right. They are both interesting units but its not like they are filling a role that is actually needed
tbh the spectres would be better for hunting terminators than vehicles.
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Post by: Misguidance
Those shadow spectres are beautiful! Man.... almost makes me miss my Eldar army.
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Post by: SilverMK2
I've loved the new aspect warriors since I saw pictures of them a while ago. Though the rocks look a bit silly.
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Post by: DarknessEternal
It's like there's a formula for creating Eldar units:
1. Make pretty model.
2. Make interesting rules.
3. Increase points cost by 50% over what it's actually worth.
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Post by: Prophecy07
I love the Eldar support, I really do. For the love of Khaine though, someone fill out ANY slot besides Elites or HS. We're full up! She cannae take anymoah!
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Post by: Nick Ellingworth
I do like those new models, shame I don't have an Eldar army.
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Post by: Agamemnon2
Hm. So they gave an Eldar unit CRA? Figures.
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Post by: viney
Prophecy07 wrote:I love the Eldar support, I really do. For the love of Khaine though, someone fill out ANY slot besides Elites or HS. We're full up! She cannae take anymoah!
+1
Now if they would just shift a few things like <cough> falcons, war walkers<cough> to FA slot then these units might get used, or let us take tanks in squadrons.....
Excellent looking models, the tank might get ordered with a world Eaters dread..... now were is my wallet
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Post by: Kanluwen
SilverMK2 wrote:I've loved the new aspect warriors since I saw pictures of them a while ago. Though the rocks look a bit silly.
Pft. The rocks are important.
It's because they're "haunting" the ruins! Duh, Silver
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Post by: I-bounty-hunt-the-elderly
Necroagogo wrote:Heavy Support: A Warp Hunter is a Heavy Support choice for an Eldar army and an Eldar Corsairs army.
What's a Corsairs Army ... IA11?
I am extremely excited about this as well - I like to imagine my eldar as a bunch of space pirates, and would really like rules/models to back that up.
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Post by: FM Ninja 048
i'm don't play eldar but
Warp hunter rules:
"aether rift: TL;DR 6" extra range flamer that wounds on 2+ and is Ap2"
that's nasty
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Post by: MudgeBlack
Once again, nice looking figs from FW. Thinking of picking up some of the Spectres (my wallet is already squirming).
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Post by: Kirasu
Nice, getting 2 of those warp hunters.. D-cannon hellhound flamers? yes please
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Post by: chaos0xomega
Necroagogo wrote:Shadow Spectres are Heavy Support? Eldar players - will they make it into your army?
Yes. I don't use anything in the Heavy Support section of the Eldar codex w/ the exception of Dark Reapers. Weird, right? Well, I decided long ago to field an infantry list(I'm including jetbikes as infantry...), since lets be honest, thats what makes the Eldar unique. Thus far, the only vehicles I have are 6 wave serpents (infantry needs some transports...). The temptation to break that rule for some Nightspinners/Fireprisms has been overwhelming recently, and warwalkers have also been given serious though... but that Warp-Hunter... I must have it...
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Post by: Platuan4th
Definitely ordering 2 sets of the Spectres for a full unit. Here's hoping for an actual Exarch to be released, though.
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Post by: Reaver83
Will enjoy painting them
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Post by: chaos0xomega
Platuan4th wrote:Definitely ordering 2 sets of the Spectres for a full unit. Here's hoping for an actual Exarch to be released, though.
Unless something changed in the last 10 minutes, a set contains 5 models, and a unit contains 3-5 specters incl. the exarch...
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Post by: Kanluwen
Platuan4th wrote:Definitely ordering 2 sets of the Spectres for a full unit. Here's hoping for an actual Exarch to be released, though.
A full unit is 5 Spectres, according to the experimental rules.
3-5, with option to upgrade one to an Exarch.
Totally ninja'd by chaos.
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Post by: shingouki
they look mint.
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Post by: Mannahnin
Gorgeous. If I had no monetary restrictions, I'd buy the Spectres to use as Scourges in my Harlequin counts-as DE army, and use all-new Harlie models.
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Post by: Panic
yeah,
The new squad looks amazing.
But everyone here is right, there are better heavy support choices... These should have been made fast attack or elite and people would be falling over themselves to make a prism army.
HQ ?
Troops ?
3x Specter Squads
3x Fire Prisim
Panic...
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Post by: Griever
Those Shadow Spectres look fantastic...wowzers.
Not a big fan of the of the tank thingy. The gun is just TOO big, very un-eldar like.
Oh look, MORE Heavy Support choice for the Eldar Codex.
# of good heavy support choices: 5
# of good fast attack choices: 1?
I think the Spectres are plenty good with those rules. 190 points for a BS 4 twin-linked str 10 ap 2 lance with jetpacks and a decent save is quite reasonable, and then the Exarch still gets to shoot his own weapon.
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Post by: Kroothawk
Well, panic posted it first in the other thread, here a copy of the newsletter:
Hi There,
This Newsletter contains some fantastic news for Eldar players with two releases available to pre-order now. We also have two previously unseen Badab War scenarios for you to download, and news of our first three Events for 2011- AdeptiCon in Chicago, the Forge World Open Day here in Nottingham and Salute in London.
Thanks,
Ead Brown
Eldar New Releases Available to Pre-Order Now:
Shadow Spectres Aspect Warrior Squad
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/SHADOW-SPECTRES-ASPECT-WARRIOR-SQUAD.html
Disguised behind shimmering holo-fields, draped with gossamer-thin robes and appearing like ghosts, the Shadow Spectres are armed with prism rifles, each a potent anti-tank weapon. Their jet pack mobility allows them to hunt down their chosen targets with the implacable patience of the dead, materialising seemingly from the very air to unleash their overwhelming firepower.
Believed long lost by the Eldar’s Seers, this detailed full resin kit, sculpted by Simon Egan, contains 5 of these mysterious and deadly Aspect Warriors. Experimental rules for the Shadow Spectres Aspect Warriors are available to download from the Forge World website, taken from the desk of Imperial Armour writer Warwick Kinrade: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/S/shadow-spectres.pdf . The full story of the discovery of the Shadow Spectres will be featured in Imperial Armour Volume 11: The Doom of Mymeara, released later this year.
Warp Hunter Grav Tank
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/ELDAR-WARP-HUNTER.html
The Warp Hunter, perhaps the rarest of Eldar tanks, sacrifices the transport capacity of the Falcon chassis to mount the terrifying firepower of a large D-Cannon, a weapon capable of tearing open the very fabric of reality and engulfing its target in the dark energies of the Warp.
This complete resin and plastic kit, sculpted by Stuart Williamson, adds additional mobile heavy firepower to an Eldar army.
The Warp Hunter will be fully detailed in the forthcoming Imperial Armour Volume 11: The Doom of Mymeara, but in advance of this we’ve managed to secure experimental rules for the Warp Hunter from Warwick Kinrade’s manuscript as a free download: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/W/Warp-Hunter.pdf .
Both the Shadow Spectres Aspect Warrior Squad and the Warp Hunter Grav Tank are available to pre-order now for despatch in the week commencing the 24th of January.
Additional Badab War Content Available to Download Now
After the impressive response to the additional Badab War material from our last newsletter, this week we’ve added another two scenarios that you can download here http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/d/Death-Mire.pdf and here http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/l/Last-stand-on-Khymara.pdf . To get the most out of these scenarios will require Imperial Armour Volume 9 and Imperial Armour Volume 10, as each provides a unique tactical challenge based on some of the major engagements in this most bloody conflict.
Warhammer Forge
As you may have noticed, the Warhammer section of the Forge World website has altered slightly in anticipation of the imminent launch of Warhammer Forge. We’re excited to announce that the very next Newsletter you receive will feature the first Warhammer Forge releases, which will be sent out alongside our usual Forge World newsletters so you don’t have to worry about signing up again. Stay tuned for more in the not-too-distant future…
Dates for Your Diary – Forge World 2011 Events News
AdeptiCon, Chicago – 1st to 3rd April 2011
For the first time, Forge World will be attending AdeptiCon at the Westin Lombard Yorktown Centre in Chicago, IL, and we are now taking reservation orders for the event. This is the best way to guarantee that we will have exactly what you’re looking for, and you can place a reservation order either by telephoning the Customer Service team on 011 44 115 916 8177 or by sending an e-mail titled ‘AdeptiCon Reservation’, including your name and a list of the items you’d like to reserve, to ForgeworldReservations@games-workshop.co. uk.
We must receive your reservation orders by January 24th to allow us to process and ship them in time, so don’t delay! We’ll be bringing you more news about our presence at AdeptiCon over the next few weeks, so please keep an eye on our Events pages.
The Forge World Open Day, Nottingham – 3rd April 2011
Warhammer World in Nottingham will play host to the fifth annual Forge World Open Day on Sunday the 3rd of April.
As part of the event, held at Warhammer World in Nottingham, the Forge World studio team will be showcasing their work-in-progress and unveiling their new projects. As part of this showcase, final proof copies of both Imperial Armour Volume 11: The Doom of Mymeara, and Tamurkhan: The Throne of Chaos will be on display for your perusal. We will also be bringing you our Charity Titan Raffle, fantastic participation games and our Open Day Painting Competition, and the facilities of Warhammer World will also be available. Our sales stand will, as always, be packed with our full range of products including some top-secret new releases, and our exclusive 2011 Events Only miniature will be on sale for the very first time!
Stay tuned to our Events Pages for more details about this ever-popular event, which will again be free to attend.
Salute, London – 16th April 2011
The ExCel centre in London will be the venue for the popular Salute show which we are excited to be again attending. Our sales stand will be jam-packed with a selection of the Forge World range of products as well as new Warhammer Forge releases and Warhammer Historical rulebooks.
Keep an eye on our Events Pages, where we’ll be bringing you more information about our presence at Salute 2011 over the coming weeks.
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Post by: Alpharius
Just Dave wrote:Yeah, you're right Xcaliber. The Shadow Spectres don't really seem like they can compete with the Fire Prism, despite their beautiful models.
The Warp Hunter however looks really good and the D-cannon is a freakin' nasty weapon against ALL targets. Including titans. I know I'd include one...
I think I might find a way to purchase a Warp Hunter or two, especially for use as a 'counts as' Fire Prism - it is too nice looking to not use somehow!
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Post by: Aduro
I don't like the rocks the Spectres are floating on. I'd rather they had them just using the tabards to float on, and then FW supplying one metal tabard per Spectre for the load bearing, or just making/reinforcing one on my own.
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
12" range guns? Not again.
18", and Fast Attack please. Then they'd be great.
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Post by: punkisntdeadyet
well if you have a squad then the range gets bumped up significantly + it's strength also goes up. I think with 5 models you have a pretty crazy lance weapon. Even if it is 1 shot it's actually not too bad considering the points cost. And if you have the exarch firing the ghostlight... definitely interesting.
not to mention they're relentless.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
I hate to double post too, but if spectres were fast attack then they'd be amazing.
Something I'd like to see in the next Eldar Codex would be adding more elite/fast attack choices to the list. It seems if GW want's super specialized troops... might as well let you get more!
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Post by: Alpharius
Which model is supposed to be the Exarch?
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Post by: DarknessEternal
punkisntdeadyet wrote:well if you have a squad then the range gets bumped up significantly + it's strength also goes up. I think with 5 models you have a pretty crazy lance weapon. Even if it is 1 shot it's actually not too bad considering the points cost. And if you have the exarch firing the ghostlight... definitely interesting.
Seriously? 200+ points for 1 single target shot? You think that's acceptable?
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Post by: Kanluwen
Even with a 3(2 Spectres and an Exarch) model squad it can be kinda nasty.
Give the Exarch Cynosure and a Haywire Launcher, you can have a decent transport popping squad.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Alpharius wrote:Which model is supposed to be the Exarch?
I don't think any are really "meant" to be the Exarch at this moment. There were rumors that we'll be seeing a Shadow Spectres character, so that may be where they'll release it(along with the Haywire Launcher and Prism Lance options).
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Post by: endtransmission
Alpharius wrote:Which model is supposed to be the Exarch?
None of them, I think the Exarch is coming later. These are just the basic aspect warriors
Damn. Beaten to it...
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Post by: Agamemnon2
DarknessEternal wrote:punkisntdeadyet wrote:well if you have a squad then the range gets bumped up significantly + it's strength also goes up. I think with 5 models you have a pretty crazy lance weapon. Even if it is 1 shot it's actually not too bad considering the points cost. And if you have the exarch firing the ghostlight... definitely interesting.
Seriously? 200+ points for 1 single target shot? You think that's acceptable?
I'd say it's high time for other armies to be given units as intolerably gak as, say, the Malcador. Why should the Guard stand alone as FW's cesspit of terrible rules?
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Post by: Nurglitch
I love the Warphunter as a shout-out to the Epic Space Marine Eldar vehicle.
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Post by: Gavin Thorne
The more I look at the rules, the more ambivalent I feel about the Spectres. It's neat that they combine fire, but Prisms are more effective and cost less, as well as fill the same slot. Maybe in a fun, fluffy footdar list running Hawks, Spectres, and Reapers, but otherwise I'm not convinced.
Love the models, though!
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Post by: chaos0xomega
I dunno, I think the Spectres are more effective. 60" BS4 twin linked S10 lance, and they can jump shoot jump... I.E. they can permanently remain out of LOS of your opponent if you play them smartly, and still manage to take out all manner of enemy vehicles. In other words, they are probably about as likely to hit as the Fireprism, but the weapon is more effective, and barrying indirect fire weapons, they are much less likely to be fired on.
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Post by: Deathklaat
did anyone else think the rear top shots of the Warphunter looked odd? like the tail broke off and they glued it back on?
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Post by: punkisntdeadyet
DarknessEternal wrote:punkisntdeadyet wrote:well if you have a squad then the range gets bumped up significantly + it's strength also goes up. I think with 5 models you have a pretty crazy lance weapon. Even if it is 1 shot it's actually not too bad considering the points cost. And if you have the exarch firing the ghostlight... definitely interesting.
Seriously? 200+ points for 1 single target shot? You think that's acceptable?
that does seem a bit much, but if you take a squad of 4 + Upgrade one to an Exarch and the re-roll to hit power + the lance, @ 177 pts for a 48" strength 10 lance that can move and shoot isn't too bad anti-tank. It also hits on a 2+ with re-rolls. Fairly reliable. If you find some nice big piece of cover (or one of your tanks) to hide behind... it's not too bad.
However, it is unfortunate that they are heavy support and not fast attack. The likelihood of them replacing a falcon or fire prism doesn't seem that great.
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Post by: Raxor
These are experimental rules right? Email FW a few dozen emails suggesting they be placed in Fast Attack. Maybe they'll come around.
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Post by: FM Ninja 048
Raxor wrote:These are experimental rules right? Email FW a few dozen emails suggesting they be placed in Fast Attack. Maybe they'll come around.
Good plan 
(phone them as well, phoning always works better with forge world)
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Post by: chaos0xomega
FM Ninja 048 wrote:Raxor wrote:These are experimental rules right? Email FW a few dozen emails suggesting they be placed in Fast Attack. Maybe they'll come around.
Good plan
(phone them as well, phoning always works better with forge world)
Keep in mind that FW gets to work w/ early versions of updated codecies (even if the Eldar are not formally in the release schedule for the next year, development/tweaking is always ongoing within the studio), so things that might not make sense to us at this time, might end up beng more beneficial in the long run...
Also, I have 30 warp spiders, I don't want to give up a squad for these.
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Post by: Reecius
goo in my pants!
Those look amazing and the rules for the Warp Hunters are fantastic! Well done FW, a great model that isn't grossly under or over costed.
And wowzers! Those Shadow Specters are bad ace! A stength 10, ap2, twin linked, BS5 lance at 60" on a JSJ platform? Holy jeebus, yes!
That is the business.
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Post by: Breotan
Current exchange rate prices them at just a little more than a Terminator squad. Given how nice they look and the fact that they're resin, it seems pretty reasonable.
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Post by: Griever
H.B.M.C. wrote:12" range guns? Not again.
18", and Fast Attack please. Then they'd be great.
I'd give the rules another look through. For each Spectre that channels the shot, the range is 12" farther. If all 5 combine and you buy one of the Exarch powers, that's a Str 10 Ap 2 60" Range TL-Lance that is relentless and can JSJ. The Exarch can also take the Prism cannon and fire his own Str 7 Ap 2 Lance shot @ BS 5 as well.
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Post by: ghosty
And that folks, is why Eldar are OP.
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Post by: FM Ninja 048
ghosty wrote:And that folks, is why Eldar are OP.
Glass hammer Ghosty, usually, not this time, [grumble] supid eldar, replacing the glass with diamond when we look the other way [/grumble]
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Post by: Goliath
Alpharius wrote:Which model is supposed to be the Exarch?
They haven't made an exarch yet, but according to warwick, they are working on an exarch, and intend to make a pheonix lord (this was true as of games day)
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Post by: Platuan4th
Reecius wrote:goo in my pants!
Those look amazing and the rules for the Warp Hunters are fantastic! Well done FW, a great model that isn't grossly under or over costed.
And wowzers! Those Shadow Specters are bad ace! A stength 10, ap2, twin linked, BS5 lance at 60" on a JSJ platform? Holy jeebus, yes!
That is the business.
Hate to correct you Reecius, but:
"Roll to hit as normal using the squad’s majority BS of 4." Automatically Appended Next Post: chaos0xomega wrote:Platuan4th wrote:Definitely ordering 2 sets of the Spectres for a full unit. Here's hoping for an actual Exarch to be released, though.
Unless something changed in the last 10 minutes, a set contains 5 models, and a unit contains 3-5 specters incl. the exarch...
Yep, I had a Reading Fail moment.
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Post by: HudsonD
Raxor wrote:These are experimental rules right? Email FW a few dozen emails suggesting they be placed in Fast Attack. Maybe they'll come around.
I guess that's the kind of vehicles Spearhead was made for...
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Post by: Happygrunt
Wouldnt be a bad idea to have these guys moved to FA. Silly Forge World , Heavy support is for tanks.
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Post by: Platuan4th
Happygrunt wrote:Wouldnt be a bad idea to have these guys moved to FA. Silly Forge World , Heavy support is for tanks.
But FW tells us Elites is for tanks!(This is a Land Raider Prometheus reference)
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Post by: DarknessEternal
Griever wrote:H.B.M.C. wrote:12" range guns? Not again.
18", and Fast Attack please. Then they'd be great.
I'd give the rules another look through. For each Spectre that channels the shot, the range is 12" farther. If all 5 combine and you buy one of the Exarch powers, that's a Str 10 Ap 2 60" Range TL-Lance that is relentless and can JSJ. The Exarch can also take the Prism cannon and fire his own Str 7 Ap 2 Lance shot @ BS 5 as well.
The Exarch's weapon is not a Lance. Also his BS doesn't affect Ghostlight, it's always 4.
2 Fire Prisms cost the same amount, get a better shot (since it'll be AP 1), and aren't wiped off the board by two heavy bolters.
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Post by: Eldar Craft
Yeah they seem marginally useful as a unit. They are a beautifully sculpted and I probably will buy them. The problem is you basically have fast moving/vulnerable fire dragons and I see them getting shot out of the sky turn one and I'm out a heavy slot and a bunch of point. In the hands of a good general I could see them being potentially deadly but it will be a win big or lose bigger style unit.
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Post by: ancientsociety
Shadow Spectres are Heavy Support!?
Why?
The Eldar have the most bloated HS list of any army and are severely lacking in viable Fast Attack options, which is totally opposite of what their fluff dictates.
Bonehead move, FW....
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Post by: chaos0xomega
Happygrunt wrote:Wouldnt be a bad idea to have these guys moved to FA. Silly Forge World , Heavy support is for tanks.
So Devestators, Obliterators, Carnifexes, Trygons, Mawlocs, Biovores, etc. etc. etc. are all tanks?
2 Fire Prisms cost the same amount, get a better shot (since it'll be AP 1), and aren't wiped off the board by two heavy bolters.
Yeah they seem marginally useful as a unit. They are a beautifully sculpted and I probably will buy them. The problem is you basically have fast moving/vulnerable fire dragons and I see them getting shot out of the sky turn one and I'm out a heavy slot and a bunch of point. In the hands of a good general I could see them being potentially deadly but it will be a win big or lose bigger style unit.
No instead they're wiped off the board by all the melta weapons, lascannons, missile launchers, railguns, etc. that they are packing. You can JSJ w/ the specters, and you can hide them a lot better. Also, since everyone loads out for anti-mech, they probably won't be as ready to go after your Specters as they would your prism's
Heaven forbid that you have to actually put some thought into how you play a unit. Yes, they aren't as obvious as the fireprism, but the nuances of their rules will make them a better option.
Also, can you describe to me how they are vulnerable fire dragons? A unit which can sit in your deployment zone, behind LOS blocking terrain, pop out of cover, blow up a tank, and then jump bank into cover? If anything, they are long range warp spiders.
ancientsociety wrote:Shadow Spectres are Heavy Support!?
Why?
The Eldar have the most bloated HS list of any army and are severely lacking in viable Fast Attack options, which is totally opposite of what their fluff dictates.
Bonehead move, FW....
Again, FW get to work w/ design notes for the next Eldar codex. Chances are, 5th ed. Eldar codex will move some of the current heavy support units to fast, or something.
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Post by: DiscoVader
Oooh, I don't even collect Eldar and I'm liking that Warp Hunter. Very pretty.
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Post by: brettz123
All of those models are just amazing. My only question is do the new aspect warriors make the swooping hawks completely useless now?
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Post by: Kanluwen
DarknessEternal wrote:Griever wrote:H.B.M.C. wrote:12" range guns? Not again.
18", and Fast Attack please. Then they'd be great.
I'd give the rules another look through. For each Spectre that channels the shot, the range is 12" farther. If all 5 combine and you buy one of the Exarch powers, that's a Str 10 Ap 2 60" Range TL-Lance that is relentless and can JSJ. The Exarch can also take the Prism cannon and fire his own Str 7 Ap 2 Lance shot @ BS 5 as well.
The Exarch's weapon is not a Lance. Also his BS doesn't affect Ghostlight, it's always 4.
2 Fire Prisms cost the same amount, get a better shot (since it'll be AP 1), and aren't wiped off the board by two heavy bolters.
The Exarch's weapon may not be a lance, but the Exarch can fire separately at BS5 with a S7 gun and with Cynosure, he allows the squad to reroll their Ghostlight attack.
Give him a Haywire Launcher in lieu of a Prism Lance and he becomes marginally better in that setup, assuming you're hunting vehicles only.
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Post by: Lt. Coldfire
Awesome looking models, but forgeworld is just too expensive.
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Post by: Just Dave
Actually, to be fair the Warp Hunter's well priced considering...
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Post by: Savnock
Cynosure with BS5, that's a 2+ to hit, sure... that can be discarded half the time by anything in cover.
My issue with the Spectres isn't actually their weapon, which could be made to work under the right circumstances. And it isn't the points cost... FW stuff is often overcosted out of their strange "can't let it be too good for the points so err on the side of suckage or overcosting" formula.
No, the big issues with the Spectres are:
1- Their saves. 4+ isn't good enough for something that will draw this much fire, especially with 12" weapons. Sure they can combine fire to go long, but individual shots could/should be used in close (great Marine killers in that mode). But 4+ isn't good enough for close-in roles. And the armor is even modeled to look quite heavy, flowy robe bits aside.
The holofields are also pretty redundant, as the whole point of jetpacks is effective use of cover. If well played, that 5+ invuln is marginal in value. A 3+ regular save would be much, much more useful.
2- The HS slot assignment. Discounting those "But FW gets to read secret GW future codex drafts and are therefore immune to error!!!!" posts, it's pretty obvious that this is an aesthetic choice. But it's not a clear one, these guys are plenty mobile enough to be FA.
Maybe we CAN start a write-in campaign to FW and get this changed.
As for the Warp Hunter, WOOT! Great model, great rules. Makes me want to haul all those Wraithguard that I never field out and put them on the Apoc battlefield for aesthetic unity with this thing and 9 D-Cannon battery. If there were enough superheavies stomping around it might actually be worth it.
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Post by: Kanluwen
First off, Cynosure doesn't let you use the Exarch's BS5.
Taking an Exarch with Cynosure, and then adding in a Haywire Blaster on the Exarch means a nasty little transport/tank popper.
Anyways:
1--The armor doesn't look "quite heavy" actually. It looks like standard Guardian armor, just with the jetpacks fused to the armor making it appear heavier.
4+ isn't bad for what they are. It's also likely they'll be altered to 4+ for both invulnerable and armor save.
Which brings us to the Holofields.
Holofields are likely a "just in case", meant to make the unit a smidge more forgiving while people are getting used to them.
The real point of this unit seems to be the "Ghostlight". Which is slightly underwhelming, simply because the shot halts. A continually penetrating shot would be much better.
2- Historically, we've always had units that fill roles like Devastators(which these guys do actually, fairly well even. Lascannon armed Devastators that are more mobile, but...still. Devastators) in Heavy Support. Add in that likely the army list we'll be seeing in IA11 will put restrictions on some stuff(or have weird weather rules that make the Spectres a far better choice than Fire Dragons or Dark Reapers, Falcons, etc) and the slot makes sense.
And yes. The rules are likely going to be changed.
Know why?
They're experimental.
And the book is more than two or so months out.
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Post by: Wulfenone
Ok seriouslly i think im starting an eldar army. like Now!
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Post by: CT GAMER
Love the tank.
I also like the ghost guys EXCEPT for the rocks on the bases: it looks really forced and overdone imho (and are gonna look weird in an army unless you do all yur models bases with a similar rock theme).
I hope they are not cast attached to the rocks, as I think they would look better without the rocks tbh...
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Post by: severedblue
It's a shame that the Warp Hunter is BS3 and only 36" Range
Fire Prism is still superior; neither of these units with their experimental rules are competitive enough to replace the Fire Prism at this time, in terms of points cost and effectiveness. That's the problem when you have to balance units by how easy they are to min/max
Maybe if they are revised into the Codex they will be better and will get a buff to their utility
Still hanging out for Eldar flyers, like the DE Voidraven and Razorwing
PS: That being said I'd buy 3 units of Spectres for the "LOLFUN" factor and because they look awesome and fun to paint
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Post by: Alpharius
Maybe so, but that's why, at only US$6.00 more, they'll be my "counts as" Fire Prisms!
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Post by: chaos0xomega
Savnock wrote:
No, the big issues with the Spectres are:
1- Their saves. 4+ isn't good enough for something that will draw this much fire, especially with 12" weapons. Sure they can combine fire to go long, but individual shots could/should be used in close (great Marine killers in that mode). But 4+ isn't good enough for close-in roles. And the armor is even modeled to look quite heavy, flowy robe bits aside.
The holofields are also pretty redundant, as the whole point of jetpacks is effective use of cover. If well played, that 5+ invuln is marginal in value. A 3+ regular save would be much, much more useful.
2- The HS slot assignment. Discounting those "But FW gets to read secret GW future codex drafts and are therefore immune to error!!!!" posts, it's pretty obvious that this is an aesthetic choice. But it's not a clear one, these guys are plenty mobile enough to be FA.
Maybe we CAN start a write-in campaign to FW and get this changed.
1 - 4+ is perfect for them. Your opponent shouldn't have many opportunities to actually fire on them. If they do manage to outmaneuver you, then they have an invul save, an armor save, and they are likely to have a cover save as well. If you want a marine killer, take a unit of fire dragons and stick them in a wave serpent. It comes out to about the same cost, the dragons are better protected as they move upfield thanks to the serpent, and they need to be in close to take out their intended targets (tanks) anyway. If you don't want to bother w/ a serpent, you can take a full squad of warp spiders w/ tooled out exarch. I usually manage about 5-6 dead marines per round of shooting and 1-2 in cc. Plus they can potentially JSJ a much farther distance. Their intended role is not close-in. They are long-range AT. Consider their ability to kill things up close a bonus , intended to give them a measure of protection against deepstrikers/outflankers, etcand to give them something to do once enemy tanks have been eliminated.
The holofields are there to protect them from barrage weapons/things that ignore cover. Since actually ENTERING cover would require dangerous terrain checks, its kind of a nice addition.
2 - Whatever. I don't really care much about the slot assignment. Since the Heavy section is kind of aspect-light at this point (aside from the Dark Reapers) I think it makes a nice addition to this section.
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
Their Range should be 18” because it allows them to function as a shooty unit that uses their own guns rather than always having to combine to get the most use of their weapons. And they should be Fast Attack so they don’t have to compete with things like Prisms.
If you want to make the combined shot have a max range of 60”, that’s fine, but the individual guns need to have a range that makes them useful. 12” is not useful.
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Post by: chaos0xomega
H.B.M.C. wrote:Their Range should be 18” because it allows them to function as a shooty unit that uses their own guns rather than always having to combine to get the most use of their weapons. And they should be Fast Attack so they don’t have to compete with things like Prisms.
If you want to make the combined shot have a max range of 60”, that’s fine, but the individual guns need to have a range that makes them useful. 12” is not useful.
The point of the unit IS the combined shot. At the Games Day display thing where they revealed the unit, it was stated that they would be an aspect specializing in long range anti-tank. The eldar have enough mobile shooty units in the army. The 12" weapons are there so they can defend themselves from enemy units that get to close. If you want an offensive shooty unit, take Dire Avengers, Fire Dragons and Warp Spiders.
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Post by: Savnock
H.B.M.C. wrote:Their Range should be 18” because it allows them to function as a shooty unit that uses their own guns rather than always having to combine to get the most use of their weapons. And they should be Fast Attack so they don’t have to compete with things like Prisms.
If you want to make the combined shot have a max range of 60”, that’s fine, but the individual guns need to have a range that makes them useful. 12” is not useful.
Agreed.
@chaosxomega, H.B.M.C. means (and I agree) that Spectres would be most interesting as multi-role troops, having one specialized role and the ability to shift into another not just in a pinch, but as another peak function. Kind of like how Hawks are supposed to be both decent against lightly armored troops and nasty against heavy vehicles thanks to their las plus grenades kit (actually they are decent at both, their points are just too high for such fragile troops). Having a viable anti-troops role is important, even for specialists. It's also why Dragons carrying flamers can be useful.
Also, good point about the holofields. And they are kind of a cool idea. But the 4+ is still too low for close-range roops that cost that much, and I do think they need a close-range role if they have 12" (or even 18") guns.
@Kanluwen: Enough condescending, bud. I'm here to discuss too. That said:
Having the ghostlight "penetrate": do you mean a line attack like Blood Lance or JotWW? That would be pretty cool. Great idea, and well worth bringing to FW's attention.
Speaking of experimental rules, crappy ones often do not change, unfortunately. Experimental means they might be changed, but does not mean that they will be changed for sucking unless the FW guys have the time and inclination to do so. Sad past experience (Malcador is again a good example) has proven this.
As for armor, the jetpacks, chest plates/pack attachments, helms, arm guards attached to the weapons, and the greaves all look heavier than Guardian armor, or even DA armor for that matter. They look equivalent to Warp Spider armor, actually, which carries a 3+. Not as heavy as Reaper armor looks, given, but then there's those big honkin' packs.
Regarding slots, you may have a point that IA11 might make Spectres good in some specialized settings due to weather rules or something. But I will believe that when I see it and until then judge the rules by the other 99.5% of 40K scenarios.
More importantly, I and lots of other Eldar players would never field Spectres in a competitive environment. They're in HS ad not even vaguely comparable to Prisms for firepower-to-points ratio, durability, or even mobility. So we won't buy them because time and money are too short for models that will only get trotted out in a friendly game once every two years. I like and support FW's sculptors, and want them to sell models both to increase my enjoyment of the game, and just to see good artists rewarded for their work. It sucks that their support staff makes bad rules (and can't edit worth a damn, either).
And yes Spectres are indeed kind of like Devastators but more mobile. More mobile than regular Troops infantry, in fact. Which would make them great for, say, a FA slot.
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Post by: Kanluwen
Savnock wrote:@Kanluwen: Enough condescending, bud. I'm here to discuss too. That said:
There was no condescending. Sorry if it gave you that impression.
My point was simply that no matter what, you don't use the Exarch's BS of 5. But giving him a Haywire Launcher and Cynosure in a full unit of 5 means that it can be a pretty effective anti-vehicle platform.
Having the ghostlight "penetrate": do you mean a line attack like Blood Lance or JotWW? That would be pretty cool. Great idea, and well worth bringing to FW's attention.
Yeah. The biggest issue I see is just how far they could penetrate.
Speaking of experimental rules, crappy ones often do not change, unfortunately. Experimental means they might be changed, but does not mean that they will be changed for sucking unless the FW guys have the time and inclination to do so. Sad past experience (Malcador is again a good example) has proven this.
The Malcador's experimental rules came out like a week before the actual model and book went up for sale.
Kinda hard to turn back the clock there
As for armor, the jetpacks, chest plates/pack attachments, helms, arm guards attached to the weapons, and the greaves all look heavier than Guardian armor, or even DA armor for that matter. They look equivalent to Warp Spider armor, actually, which carries a 3+. Not as heavy as Reaper armor looks, given, but then there's those big honkin' packs.
It looks pretty similar to me. The straps are even in the same place on the boots. I really do think it's the harness for the pack skewing the "heavy armor" look.
Regarding slots, you may have a point that IA11 might make Spectres good in some specialized settings due to weather rules or something. But I will believe that when I see it and until then judge the rules by the other 99.5% of 40K scenarios.
Yeah. The problem is Forge World stuff is sometimes designed for specific scenarios.
Which is silly.
More importantly, I and lots of other Eldar players would never field Spectres in a competitive environment because they're in HS ad not even vaguely comparable to Prisms for firepower-to-points ratio, durability, or even mobility. Which is sad, because I would really love to buy and field those great models, but I don't buy models with terrible rules that I'll never field (and again suspect many others are like that). I like and support FW, and want them to sell models both to increase my enjoyment of the game, and just to see good artists rewarded for their work. It sucks that their support staff makes bad rules (and can't edit worth a damn, either).
Not an Eldar player, personally, but I just find it silly that people are decrying it before we've seen the finalized rules for it.
And yes, Spectres are kind of like Devastators, but more mobile. More mobile than regular Troops infantry, in fact. Which would make them great for, say, a FA slot.
Yeah, they may be more mobile...but at the same time, they are a heavy firepower unit.
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Post by: chaos0xomega
Savnock wrote:
@chaosxomega, H.B.M.C. means (and I agree) that Spectres would be most interesting as multi-role troops, having one specialized role and the ability to shift into another not just in a pinch, but as another peak function. Kind of like how Hawks are supposed to be both decent against lightly armored troops and nasty against heavy vehicles thanks to their las plus grenades kit (actually they are decent at both, their points are just too high for such fragile troops). Having a viable anti-troops role is important, even for specialists. It's also why Dragons carrying flamers can be useful.
Also, good point about the holofields. And they are kind of a cool idea. But the 4+ is still too low for close-range roops that cost that much, and I do think they need a close-range role if they have 12" (or even 18") guns.
Aspect warriors tend to be hyper-specialized one-trick ponies. Multi-role would kinda go against the trend and the fluff. The Swooping Hawks are a bit of an anomaly in this case, I'm not sure what their role is supposed to be, and I don't think GW does either. They seem to have a grenade theme going... but thats not really a role. Fire Dragons got away w/ the exarch flamer because of the fire theme, but thats also just the Exarch, that doesn't make the rest of the squad more effective at the anti-tank role. Ditto Dark Reapers, exarch can take a missile launcher, but it doesn't make the rest of the unit better at anti-tank. Perhaps that could be how to 'fix' the squad, as right now the Exarch seems rather pointless IMO, aside from giving the squad cynosure, I'm not sure if paying for the +1 strength on the gun is worth 10 points, and the haywire grenade launcher seems a bit out of place in a long range AT squad.
Speaking of experimental rules, crappy ones often do not change, unfortunately. Experimental means they might be changed, but does not mean that they will be changed for sucking unless the FW guys have the time and inclination to do so. Sad past experience (Malcador is again a good example) has proven this.
As of late, FW seems to be getting better at this. As I understand it, the rules for the Land Raider Achilles have changed in IA10 (no more 'immunity' against Strength D and an increased point cost
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Post by: Powerguy
That depends, Eldar haven't really changed since there 3rd Edition codex but all the 5th edition codices have been pushing at least some versatile units which can multi task. From a balance stand point an army completely made up of specialists is very hard to get right.
Having said that I do think all Eldar Aspect warriors should cover a different primary role (but from a balance perspective need to be able to partially cover others), and in this regard there are still plenty of holes which the Spectres can fit into. Carrying Prism Rifles I was expecting them to be long ranged anti tank specialists, fitting into heavy support (yes I know its packed, but only 1 choice is an Aspect atm) along with Dark Reapers (who are long ranged anti infantry). The way their weapons are set up at the moment they are too close to Fire Dragons, a close ranged anti tank Aspect and they just trade some effectiveness for mobility and a limited long ranged option. They are no more effective against MEQ than Fire Dragons are either, just some added mobility (which you pay for). I was hoping for something more like S7 AP3 (with the ability to boost this to get S10 AP1 using the same concept as the Fire Prism, +1 per contributor) with 24-36" range. This would make them more like mobile Devastators with a cross between Lascannons and Autocannons who trade survivability and range for mobility (which is the Eldar way). That I could certainly fit into a list, as it is they are very nice models but the rules need some work.
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Post by: AlexHolker
chaos0xomega wrote:As of late, FW seems to be getting better at this. As I understand it, the rules for the Land Raider Achilles have changed in IA10 (no more 'immunity' against Strength D and an increased point cost
The problem was never Strength D, it was Strength 8. But yes, from what I've heard, they fixed it.
I just had another idea that would be fun for this unit: let the entire squad count as a single Fire Prism for the purposes of Linking.
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Post by: chaos0xomega
AlexHolker wrote:
I just had another idea that would be fun for this unit: let the entire squad count as a single Fire Prism for the purposes of Linking.
Now THAT would be sweet.
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Post by: DarknessEternal
chaos0xomega wrote: At the Games Day display thing where they revealed the unit, it was stated that they would be an aspect specializing in long range anti-tank.
They're a total failure then. One shot per unit is not a good anti-tank weapon.
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Post by: chaos0xomega
DarknessEternal wrote:chaos0xomega wrote: At the Games Day display thing where they revealed the unit, it was stated that they would be an aspect specializing in long range anti-tank.
They're a total failure then. One shot per unit is not a good anti-tank weapon.
Its a twin-linked BS4 shot, its just about as good as a fire prism, better than a hammerhead, way better than a leman russ vanquisher, and about the same as a lascannon predator... Its clearly not a bad anti tank weapon.
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Post by: severedblue
chaos0xomega wrote:AlexHolker wrote:
I just had another idea that would be fun for this unit: let the entire squad count as a single Fire Prism for the purposes of Linking.
Now THAT would be sweet.
Seconded. 5 spectres counting as one fireprism for linking would be intense. And if they share heavy support it could be balanced so that the synnergy would be that you could take spectres that "Count as " fire-prisms, hence making them more attractive
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Post by: Agamemnon2
I really don't understand what FW was thinking about with these. The unit just seems completely misbegotten.
chaos0xomega wrote:Its a twin-linked BS4 shot, its just about as good as a fire prism, better than a hammerhead, way better than a leman russ vanquisher, and about the same as a lascannon predator... Its clearly not a bad anti tank weapon.
Being better than a Vanquisher at anti-tank is kind of like being a better husband than Tiger Woods. Nothing to sing high praise about.
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Post by: Mukkin'About
Those look really sweet! It's too bad they are a heavy support choice. Also the tabards look strange. seems rather fragile to me.
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Post by: Savnock
severedblue wrote:chaos0xomega wrote:AlexHolker wrote:
I just had another idea that would be fun for this unit: let the entire squad count as a single Fire Prism for the purposes of Linking.
Now THAT would be sweet.
Seconded. 5 spectres counting as one fireprism for linking would be intense. And if they share heavy support it could be balanced so that the synnergy would be that you could take spectres that "Count as " fire-prisms, hence making them more attractive
Hmmm. Dunno, copying the function of an already-existent unit wouldn't be that great, especially because their mobility is worse (sure they can JSJ but Prisms are fast skimmers with an option for star engines) and their fragility as well.
I'd rather see a different shape for the attack: either a line attack as Kanluwen suggests, or a smaller version of the Prism. This last could be a small blast each (S6 AP4) with the ability to focus into single-shot (S7 AP2 lance). Linked shots could then be powered up +1 S./-1 AP per Spectre contributing, up to a scarier small blast (up to S10 AP 2) or a nasty single shot (S10 AP2 lance).
That would make the unit just as flexible as the prism, but with a different function (layering small blasts or taking single shots)
chaos0xomega wrote:Aspect warriors tend to be hyper-specialized one-trick ponies. Multi-role would kinda go against the trend and the fluff. The Swooping Hawks are a bit of an anomaly in this case, I'm not sure what their role is supposed to be, and I don't think GW does either. They seem to have a grenade theme going... but thats not really a role. Fire Dragons got away w/ the exarch flamer because of the fire theme, but thats also just the Exarch, that doesn't make the rest of the squad more effective at the anti-tank role. Ditto Dark Reapers, exarch can take a missile launcher, but it doesn't make the rest of the unit better at anti-tank.
Must disagree. Most aspects have secondary functions, which they are equipped with secondary gear to cover. Some aspects lost this a bit in 4th/5th, but the precedent is there. Hawks' haywires and Dragons' flamers are not aberrations. In addiiton to those two, Spears have a decent amount of S6 lance shooting (and can include a shuriken cannon) and Spiders have a CC exarch option plus Withdraw and decent armor. That's most of the aspects- as for the others Scorps used to pack haywires, Reapers had webs of skulls on their exarch and even Hawks had a powerweapon and the ability to do LOTS of hits with it thanks to whatever that exarch power was.
Having a "backup option" is still something Aspects do, and it used to be universal. While they have become even more specialized in 5th, at least half of them are still left a secondary role option. Yes, it may be "just the Exarch", but when your primary targets are all gone you're very happy to have a flamer or haywires or whatever. And Dragons can indeed do anti-personnel well, Spears kill tanks decently thanks to their mobility, and Spiders kill infantry, light vehicles and tanks on rear armor all pretty decently. Heck, with a 3+ save, powerblades and Withdraw they can even do okay in CC. As someone occasionally left with a handful of Aspect Warriors and little else left on the board, I am particularly happy about having backup options When you've GOT to kill a tank or a horde unit to score, it's a good thing to be flexible.
I'm hoping the designers build a bit more of that back into the Aspects in the next edition. Let the noobs be confused about primary purpose or the min-maxers sneer at the backup gear: it's really fun to have around in friendlies. I cannot tell you how many times a 12-point flamer on my Fire Dragons has helped me against pissed-off Orks or my Spiders have been used as a CC tarpit thanks to their exarch.
Perhaps that could be how to 'fix' the squad, as right now the Exarch seems rather pointless IMO, aside from giving the squad cynosure, I'm not sure if paying for the +1 strength on the gun is worth 10 points, and the haywire grenade launcher seems a bit out of place in a long range AT squad.
Kanluwen had another good point with the Haywire launcher plus squad shooting making the Exarch worth taking. With Cynosure on the squad and Haywire on the exarch, you've got two shots that are pretty likely to hit and penetrate at least once (50% or better between the two weapons if my admittedly poor mathhammer is sufficient).
BTW, reading the rules for Cynosure, I'm pretty sure it can be used by the squad even if the Exarch is firing a different weapon. The flavor text says "the Exarch is adept at precision targeting using the ghostlight.", but then the actual rules bits say "The squad may re-roll a failed hit when using the ghostlight."
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Post by: AlexHolker
Savnock wrote:Hmmm. Dunno, copying the function of an already-existent unit wouldn't be that great, especially because their mobility is worse (sure they can JSJ but Prisms are fast skimmers with an option for star engines) and their fragility as well.
I am suggesting an expansion of the existing synergistic ability of the Prism weapon, not merely a copy of a standalone function. It's kind of like a combination of Tesla and Prism Towers in Red Alert: all the Fire Prisms in a network can combine their attack into a single massive blast, but nearby Shadow Spectres can contribute power to the network with their Prism Rifles as well.
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Post by: JOHIRA
AlexHolker wrote:Savnock wrote:Hmmm. Dunno, copying the function of an already-existent unit wouldn't be that great, especially because their mobility is worse (sure they can JSJ but Prisms are fast skimmers with an option for star engines) and their fragility as well.
I am suggesting an expansion of the existing synergistic ability of the Prism weapon, not merely a copy of a standalone function. It's kind of like a combination of Tesla and Prism Towers in Red Alert: all the Fire Prisms in a network can combine their attack into a single massive blast, but nearby Shadow Spectres can contribute power to the network with their Prism Rifles as well.
THAT would be cool.
I have an Eldar army idea in the back of my mind and I may even start on it this spring depending on how personal stuff works out. While I think both these models look excellent, I'm not sure if they'll be a part of my plan or not. The Warp Hunter isn't bad at all. I like the template idea, but it doesn't really light any fires for me as a tank. I happen to like the look of the Fire Prism model as well, so I don't really want to replace it with this. Unless the meta-game ends up being very titan-heavy where I play, I may give it a skip.
I really like the look of the Shadow Spectres, and I think their rules are intriguing. I'm just terrified of owning these models because I'm sure I'll snap them in half.
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Post by: Captain Jack
Hmmm, I think it's a tough one. I've been planning and building an eldar army based around these two units and a trio of Hornets, which is now at the 1500 point stage. The problem I now face is that my HS slots are all accounted for, 2 Falcs and a Prism, and I was hoping these would be in the Elites or FA section with the possibility of dropping the prism for the mini cobra.
It could all still work, but only if Wave Ser pants stopped performing so poorly. If I could get Holo Fields on a WS then life would be pretty again and my FoC would not be so cluttered. I've ordered them any way as they are superb in the flesh, but am unsure as to how I can fit them into my 2000 points list.
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Post by: obsidianaura
That Vehicle looks like an upgrade kit to me.
So it's in line with the other things in the same catagory.
I'd rather have the Eldar Lynx I saw at Gamesday TBH its more pretty.
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Post by: col. krazy kenny
I wonder if theese are the Eldar Ghosts that they talked abuot during the eye of terror campaign,New craft world?Like they mentioned before.
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Post by: AlexHolker
obsidianaura wrote:I'd rather have the Eldar Lynx I saw at Gamesday TBH its more pretty.
It would be all resin, meaning it would carry a vastly higher price for little benefit.
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Post by: Reaver83
hmm you know i'd love all these new eldar toys, just need to finish off what i have already, - hey only three things, some banshees some warp spiders, - oh whats this, a scorpion... damn you forgeworld! my wallet hates you!
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Post by: cvtuttle
SlaveToDorkness wrote:Very nice looking, I'd use the Warp Hunter for a Fireprism in normal games.
I like this idea. I like this idea alot.
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Post by: Just Dave
col. krazy kenny wrote:I wonder if theese are the Eldar Ghosts that they talked abuot during the eye of terror campaign,New craft world?Like they mentioned before.
I'm pretty sure that was a Craftworld that returned from the EoT alongside Maugan Ra - Altansar
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Post by: Sol Invictus
I am so glad I saved some Christmas money. The Shadow Spectres look awesome!
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Post by: MikeMcSomething
Anyone else notice their jetpack rule is written really weird?
And man those spectres' rules are BAD, I would say counts-as reapers or hawks but...you know
Counts as fire dragons!
All the ghost shots should be TL anyway and cynosure should let them longfang split their fire and there should be no "all or nothing" restriction on the combined shots.
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Post by: Morathi's Darkest Sin
I love the Warp Hunter, it looks awesome, sort of love it the same way I did the first time I saw a Leman Russ Tank Destroyer.
Got to have one at some point.
Not so sold on the Spectres, not sure what it is I don't like about them mind.
Would have rather FW had stepped on GW's toes and done varient Warp Spiders myself.
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Post by: aurelion
I love the spectres, am concidering picking some up for my Biel-tan army (fits right in the fluff)
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Post by: The Fragile Breath
Call me crazy if you like, but if I had the money (I don't have enough for more GWS models, let alone FW) I would love to pick up a set of Spectres for Dark Eldar Scourge conversions. By the time I have enough money to do so, they'll probably release completely amazing (if they stay true to concept art in the codex...) Scourge models by then. Maybe a distant future project? Sigh.
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Post by: MikeMcSomething
Yeah they would make awesome proxies for a good unit.
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Post by: Goliath
MikeMcSomething wrote:Anyone else notice their jetpack rule is written really weird?
And man those spectres' rules are BAD, I would say counts-as reapers or hawks but...you know
Counts as fire dragons!
All the ghost shots should be TL anyway and cynosure should let them longfang split their fire and there should be no "all or nothing" restriction on the combined shots.
Why should they be counts as hawks?
Warwick has stated in conversation, and it has always been acknowledged that they would be an anti-tank unit.
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Post by: chaos0xomega
Captain Jack wrote:
It could all still work, but only if Wave Ser pants stopped performing so poorly. If I could get Holo Fields on a WS then life would be pretty again and my FoC would not be so cluttered. I've ordered them any way as they are superb in the flesh, but am unsure as to how I can fit them into my 2000 points list.
You must be doing something wrong if your serpents are performing so poorly. At least half of mine will usually manage to make it through a game largely intact. The only complaint about their performance I really have is my inability to hit with a twin-linked bright lance. I swear that thing hates me for some reason. Even with the re-roll I can't ever get a shot off.
And I think the Lynx (mini-cobra) is a small superheavy. 2 structure point kinda deal (like the Macharius/Malcador). Its certainly larger than a falcon chassis vehicle.
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Post by: Reanimator
Holy feth!! How have I missed this! I have been waiting eagerly since I first saw the pics on here a while back. I don't care if the rules meant that they fired flowers at the enemy, I'd still field them, cos their so damn cool. IMO anyway.
Fair point about the lack of Heavy Spt choices and too many units though. Oh well.
EDIT: just noticed that the warp hunter is sporting the same colours I was thinking of doing my new craftworld in. Not sure if I'm happy about that or not.
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Post by: Captain Jack
chaos0xomega wrote:You must be doing something wrong if your serpents are performing so poorly. At least half of mine will usually manage to make it through a game largely intact. The only complaint about their performance I really have is my inability to hit with a twin-linked bright lance. I swear that thing hates me for some reason. Even with the re-roll I can't ever get a shot off.
Deffinately, though I can't determine what . The same mini (magnets are helpfull) working in a similar roll in the list and the WS get ravaged and the the Falcs come away smelling of roses. TBH, am learning and modifying the list as I go so I shouldn't be so harsh
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Post by: Kroothawk
Use the Warp Hunter as Fire Prism and the Spectres as Warp Spiders or Fire Dragons and forget the rules
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Post by: Ehsteve
Does it seem somewhat strange that the Shadow Spectres are HS? I mean they have jump packs, resillient, they seem more an elite slot to make them more accessible.
One thing that also bugs me is that the rocks seem somewhat...out of place. I mean theyout of place. With the harlequins everything fitted together perfectly, and i would sacrifice options if they made the bases/leags fit together more stable.
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Post by: chaos0xomega
Ehsteve wrote:Does it seem somewhat strange that the Shadow Spectres are HS? I mean they have jump packs, resillient, they seem more an elite slot to make them more accessible.
One thing that also bugs me is that the rocks seem somewhat...out of place. I mean theyout of place. With the harlequins everything fitted together perfectly, and i would sacrifice options if they made the bases/leags fit together more stable.
Yeah the rocks are buggin' me, I'm pondering cutting them off so I can mount these things onto the microart studios craftworld bases.
And no, not really odd at all. While they probably are more of an elite choice, there are already 3 elite aspects + wraithguard + harlequins. Its nearly as full as the heavy section. But the Jet packs aren't there for mobility, so much as defensive capability w/ the JSJ maneuver.
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Post by: MikeMcSomething
Goliath wrote:MikeMcSomething wrote:Anyone else notice their jetpack rule is written really weird?
And man those spectres' rules are BAD, I would say counts-as reapers or hawks but...you know
Counts as fire dragons!
All the ghost shots should be TL anyway and cynosure should let them longfang split their fire and there should be no "all or nothing" restriction on the combined shots.
Why should they be counts as hawks?
Warwick has stated in conversation, and it has always been acknowledged that they would be an anti-tank unit.
How did you read my post and get "They should be swooping hawks" ?
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Post by: Kanluwen
Ehsteve wrote:
One thing that also bugs me is that the rocks seem somewhat...out of place. I mean they're out of place. With the harlequins everything fitted together perfectly, and i would sacrifice options if they made the bases/legs fit together more stable.
Well, considering IA11 is supposed to be taking place in the ruins of a ruined Eldar planet...
I think the ruins the Spectres are floating on make a kind of sense.
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Post by: Ehsteve
I apologize for my terrible grammar in the post before, rushing to get out the door
I have no issue with the fluff, they have some awesome backstory potential and I have good confidence FW will put it to good use. My issue is that it looks wrong. You can have ruins, just that aesthetically...it looks thrown together at the last minute. Each model by itself (both ruins and shadow spectres) looks awesome, but the way they are put together simply doesn't correspond. Harlequins you could slot into the base and pin in the case of the troope master, but these...I am hesitant.
Beautiful centrepieces, but not very practical. That does not mean that I would not buy them had I the money or the time to paint them, simply that it will take a lot of effort to stabilize, safely store and transport said models, even moreso than my hazard suits with lots of delicate pieces such as the pea-sized elbow joint designed to hold the entire weight of the weapon and paper-thin stabilizer fin joints.
They would make perfect counts-as fire dragons I highly agree.
Oh and I have to say, the D-Cannon is possibly the most awesome named weapon the Eldar have ever had. That and the awesome rules at the current moment.
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Post by: Tylerkabana
The Warp Hunter's rules almost make me want to start an Eldar Army!
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Post by: obsidianaura
AlexHolker wrote:obsidianaura wrote:I'd rather have the Eldar Lynx I saw at Gamesday TBH its more pretty.
It would be all resin, meaning it would carry a vastly higher price for little benefit.
I wasn't saying that it made economic sense, just that'd I'd like to have that more as its prettier.
My Guess is the Lynx will cost abouy £55/65 on release.
Strange that the Lynx was shown at gamesday and not released yet but this new thing wasn't there but is now being released
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Post by: FM Ninja 048
Maby this is the lynx?
they look a bit similar...
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Post by: Just Dave
The problem in regards to the rocks I would think is due to the apparent fragility of resin models and their thin/probably weak flowing capes.
Although, yes, the rocks are a bit big, they are there to solve a problem in the basing of the models. Whilst a small flying base would've done, the rocks compensate for the apparent fragility of resin whilst allowing the model to still seem ghostly/smooth/flowing/floating.
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Post by: Sol Invictus
As far as the rock bases go, I'm thinking of putting them on wire stands like they have in the last 2 pictures on FW.
I figure I can always use the rocks for terrain.
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Post by: darthmatty
These look sweet! Kind of feel like starting some Eldar now. Hmmm we shal see.
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Post by: vitki
Sol Invictus wrote:As far as the rock bases go, I'm thinking I'm of putting them on wire stands like they have in the last 2 pictures on FW.
I figure I can always use the rocks for terrain.
I think this is my answer too. I can make a wire base that bypasses the tabards and remove the weak point there and the chance of snapping. Drill directly into the bodies and leave the tabards free-hanging.
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Post by: obsidianaura
FM Ninja 048 wrote:Maby this is the lynx?
they look a bit similar...
Yes slightly similar, but I was at gamesday and saw it maybe the picture doesn't make it clear but the whole back body of the tank is different.
It's like the transportation section has been cut away.
The Lynx was a solid resin build, the hunter is almost certainly an upgrade kit to a falcon/prism.
Plus it was armed with a Pulsar, and the hunter has a D-cannon if I'm gonna nitpick
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Post by: FM Ninja 048
obsidianaura wrote:
Yes slightly similar, but I was at gamesday and saw it maybe the picture doesn't make it clear but the whole back body of the tank is different.
It's like the transportation section has been cut away.
The Lynx was a solid resin build, the hunter is almost certainly an upgrade kit to a falcon/prism.
Plus it was armed with a Pulsar, and the hunter has a D-cannon if I'm gonna nitpick
true, and just checked FW, Warp hunter is hybrid
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Post by: Fayric
Well,the spectres rules are a great dissapointment.
Although the models look really nice.
A full squad would be to expencive to make worth the single shot that actually can accompilsh anything. Even with the spectres movability the wraithguard are far superior at their close range role (seeing they have similar firepower).
They may deepstrike and move more freely than infantry. So? they are supposed to stand at the back and fire longrange anti tank blasts anyway. I can see some small use in a deepstriking anti light-tank unit, but not for that cost, and not as heavy support.
The main problem I see with them though, s that the iindividual models cant do anything by them self. Why not make a new aditional Prism tank instead? Then you would not have to pay about 200 points for that single blast either. As it is now the squad get hit by a frag blast, two spectres die (not unlikely they do), and they can at best produce a 36" s8 shot (not that bad, like the bright lance, still a unit of guardians with a BL platform would be cheaper.
Edit: OK the individual specters not beeing able to do anythingwas maybe a bit hard, they are not worse than most other shoting squad in the codex I suppose. Still, I find the ambivalence between their squad wapons and joined attack to contradictory to make sence of the unit.
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Post by: darktau
Those models are just awesome looking, will be fun to paint.
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Post by: Dysartes
Kroothawk wrote:Use the Warp Hunter as Fire Prism and the Spectres as Warp Spiders or Fire Dragons and forget the rules
Why, Kroot? The final Forge World rules are as valid as the rules produced in-house by GW.
Only case for the counts-as is due to hide-bound TOs.
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Post by: chaos0xomega
Dysartes wrote: Kroothawk wrote:Use the Warp Hunter as Fire Prism and the Spectres as Warp Spiders or Fire Dragons and forget the rules
Why, Kroot? The final Forge World rules are as valid as the rules produced in-house by GW.
Only case for the counts-as is due to hide-bound TOs.
He's saying to do that because he's unimpressed by the rules, not because of legality arguments.
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Post by: Savnock
AlexHolker wrote:Savnock wrote:Hmmm. Dunno, copying the function of an already-existent unit wouldn't be that great, especially because their mobility is worse (sure they can JSJ but Prisms are fast skimmers with an option for star engines) and their fragility as well.
I am suggesting an expansion of the existing synergistic ability of the Prism weapon, not merely a copy of a standalone function. It's kind of like a combination of Tesla and Prism Towers in Red Alert: all the Fire Prisms in a network can combine their attack into a single massive blast, but nearby Shadow Spectres can contribute power to the network with their Prism Rifles as well.
That's a great idea. You know, even if it (probably) doesn't end up working that way in the FW rules, an Apoc datasheet with that concept would be a really cool idea. It's pretty close to the Sunstorm or whatever the prism sheet already is- but with Spectres in there too. Would you want to whip up some rules for that and post them?
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Post by: Kroothawk
chaos0xomega wrote:Dysartes wrote: Kroothawk wrote:Use the Warp Hunter as Fire Prism and the Spectres as Warp Spiders or Fire Dragons and forget the rules
Why, Kroot? The final Forge World rules are as valid as the rules produced in-house by GW.
Only case for the counts-as is due to hide-bound TOs.
He's saying to do that because he's unimpressed by the rules, not because of legality arguments.
Yepp!
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Post by: Kanluwen
Savnock wrote:AlexHolker wrote:Savnock wrote:Hmmm. Dunno, copying the function of an already-existent unit wouldn't be that great, especially because their mobility is worse (sure they can JSJ but Prisms are fast skimmers with an option for star engines) and their fragility as well.
I am suggesting an expansion of the existing synergistic ability of the Prism weapon, not merely a copy of a standalone function. It's kind of like a combination of Tesla and Prism Towers in Red Alert: all the Fire Prisms in a network can combine their attack into a single massive blast, but nearby Shadow Spectres can contribute power to the network with their Prism Rifles as well.
That's a great idea. You know, even if it (probably) doesn't end up working that way in the FW rules, an Apoc datasheet with that concept would be a really cool idea. It's pretty close to the Sunstorm or whatever the prism sheet already is- but with Spectres in there too. Would you want to whip up some rules for that and post them?
But then the problem is nobody takes Shadow Spectres for what they bring to the table, but because they augment an already powerful choice(the Fire Prism).
For Apoc? That's fine. But with people wanting Spectres moved to FA, then you're going to have an issue with Spectres forcing out the other FA slots because of synergy with Fire Prisms.
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Post by: Savnock
Sorry, I was unclear: I meant that no matter what the regular 40K rules for the Spectres are, a datasheet that gives them the ability to function as members of the Sunstorm too would be great.
As for the other FA slots, the Eldar FA choices have been doing a fine job of edging _themselves_ out of regular tabletop armies, just by being less effective than, say, Prisms, Fire Dragons, War Walkers, etc. Except maybe Warp Spiders. I regularly see Eldar armies with maxxed HS but very rarely maxxed FA choices, and for Mechdar no FA choices at all is common (ironically).
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Post by: Aramus
Dysartes wrote: Kroothawk wrote:Use the Warp Hunter as Fire Prism and the Spectres as Warp Spiders or Fire Dragons and forget the rules
Why, Kroot? The final Forge World rules are as valid as the rules produced in-house by GW.
Only case for the counts-as is due to hide-bound TOs.
Eh no offense, but with those books weighing in at at least $60 each(and some close to $100!), and there being what, 11 now, unless you're gonna buy them for me, I can't afford to get them to read over them and ensure that there isn't anything wonky and game breaking (i.e. the godawful rules for the LR Achilles, for example)
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Post by: Agamemnon2
Aramus wrote:Eh no offense, but with those books weighing in at at least $60 each(and some close to $100!), and there being what, 11 now, unless you're gonna buy them for me, I can't afford to get them to read over them and ensure that there isn't anything wonky and game breaking (i.e. the godawful rules for the LR Achilles, for example)
You know what I say to that? Tough. I don't have any inclination to buy your army's Codex and am thus forced to rely on your say-so as to its contents. The least you can do is return the favor.
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Post by: MikeMcSomething
Agamemnon2 wrote:Aramus wrote:Eh no offense, but with those books weighing in at at least $60 each(and some close to $100!), and there being what, 11 now, unless you're gonna buy them for me, I can't afford to get them to read over them and ensure that there isn't anything wonky and game breaking (i.e. the godawful rules for the LR Achilles, for example)
You know what I say to that? Tough. I don't have any inclination to buy your army's Codex and am thus forced to rely on your say-so as to its contents. The least you can do is return the favor.
I believe Aramus was speaking from the POV of a tournament organizer.
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Post by: Kroothawk
Of course the FW rules are extensively tested and balanced, that's why they are called "experimental rules"
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Post by: BrookM
And in most cases the experimental rules make it into the book with hardly a change at all. Or half the rules get lost during the copy-pasting.
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Post by: Agamemnon2
Or they might just make overpriced things randomly more expensive (Malcador Defender)
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Post by: DarknessEternal
Anyone know how to provide Forge World with feedback on their experimental rules?
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Post by: BrookM
You mail them.
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Post by: FM Ninja 048
Phone?
probably the best way, they get alot of emails
or snail mail, if you want a challenge
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Post by: Kanluwen
FM Ninja 048 wrote:Phone?
probably the best way, they get alot of emails
or snail mail, if you want a challenge
They actually are doing much better than they feasibly should be doing with emails, considering it's one or two guys answering them.
If you write them an email, title it "<(Wh40kFeedback: Experimental Rules for XXXXXXX-unit)>" and it should get their attention.
And don't do it from a junk email account, because their spam filters block them, same as ours do.
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Post by: Squigsquasher
Those Shadow Spectres are awesome. The Warp Hunter is pretty cool as well.
However, this further pushes back any potential Tyranid releases, so that's not to good....
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Post by: Kanluwen
Squigsquasher wrote:Those Shadow Spectres are awesome. The Warp Hunter is pretty cool as well.
However, this further pushes back any potential Tyranid releases, so that's not to good....
You weren't going to see any Tyranid releases at this point anyways. The Tyranid line is pretty rounded out from Forge World.
FW's pretty much moved towards only doing releases to go with their Imperial Armour books.
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Post by: FM Ninja 048
mostly, those hazard suits and the tomb stalker were out of the blue, but yeah, don't expect much from FW if they don't have a book planned for it.
If you do get something, consider it a treat
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Post by: Kanluwen
FM Ninja 048 wrote:mostly, those hazard suits and the tomb stalker were out of the blue, but yeah, don't expect much from FW if they don't have a book planned for it.
If you do get something, consider it a treat
The Hazard Suits weren't really out of the blue. They came out with Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2.
The Tomb Stalker most definitely was out of the blue though.
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Post by: supagigashoota
eldar are cool but are very hard to convert because the have smooth armour and curved edges
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Post by: NewDeal
Those look awesome. Rules don't look half bad either.
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Post by: Reanimator
supagigashoota wrote:eldar are cool but are very hard to convert because the have smooth armour and curved edges
And therein lies the challenge!
They are however a joy to paint.
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Post by: inqscott
the models are great the challenge will be fielding them inanything but apoc. But, I can't lie they will make an apperance in my Eldar force.
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Post by: Captain Jack
Got mine today, they are better than in the pictures. It is going to be a nightmare to get the Spectres together, the same as any of the fiddley Eldar range. I will start working on them both (Spectres and Warp) next week when I have some time spare.
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Post by: Kanluwen
I'm waiting for my Spectres to arrive.
Hopefully, this weekend
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Post by: Reanimator
Been fighting with mine this weekend. The sculpts are awesome, but I may have a few suggestions for everyone else who's waiting:
1. There's a helluva lot of flash from the moulds, especially on the tabards, which is especially fiddly to clean off. A craft knife is a must, as is absolute thoroughness. I've moved them under the light and found stuff I missed the first time.
2. The fabric strips fit some of the arms better than others, and will often only match one of the bases for the logical flow of the streamers, definitely worth checking which matches up. Also, there is one piece of streamer per model that is two intertwined. This is meant to fit with the right arm of each model, gluing the arm first then trying to fit the streamer after is much more difficult.
3. It's not 100% clear to me where the other streamers go, but my guess is the waist. It's not an easy fix and the pics don't make it that clear.
4. Transportation is going to be a pain. Something like a box where the models are completely immobilised and not touching anything else, tissue paper or foam or anything else is going to break the fragile streamers off the back. Bluetacking the bases to a sealable box might work.
Apologies if this is teaching anyone to suck eggs, but I would have liked someone to tell me before I started, so I hope it helps at least a few.
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Post by: Scottywan82
Reanimator wrote:Been fighting with mine this weekend. The sculpts are awesome, but I may have a few suggestions for everyone else who's waiting:
1. There's a helluva lot of flash from the moulds, especially on the tabards, which is especially fiddly to clean off. A craft knife is a must, as is absolute thoroughness. I've moved them under the light and found stuff I missed the first time.
2. The fabric strips fit some of the arms better than others, and will often only match one of the bases for the logical flow of the streamers, definitely worth checking which matches up. Also, there is one piece of streamer per model that is two intertwined. This is meant to fit with the right arm of each model, gluing the arm first then trying to fit the streamer after is much more difficult.
3. It's not 100% clear to me where the other streamers go, but my guess is the waist. It's not an easy fix and the pics don't make it that clear.
4. Transportation is going to be a pain. Something like a box where the models are completely immobilised and not touching anything else, tissue paper or foam or anything else is going to break the fragile streamers off the back. Bluetacking the bases to a sealable box might work.
Apologies if this is teaching anyone to suck eggs, but I would have liked someone to tell me before I started, so I hope it helps at least a few.
If I may offer my own solution for transport, I used this method for Confrontation figures which might as well have been made of glass held together by faerie dreams.
I put a very thin piece of metal on the bottom of the base, custom cut for the 25mm bases. Litko Aero sells some great ones. then I but a magnetic strip attached to the bottom of a box and put them in there. That way, they are always standing as they will for gaming. You can also put the magnet on the base and use a metal case instead. Whatever is easier for you. Saves on packing peanuts.
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Post by: Alpharius
VERY good call Scottywan82 - transporting them CAREFULLY while they are magnetized is probably the best solution...
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Post by: Just Dave
Personally, I'd hire some midgets to carry my delicate models.
Say one in each hand; that'd require 3 midgets for 5 Shadow Spectres and a Warp Hunter. sorted.
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Post by: Reanimator
Thanks for the tip, I was wondering about magnets and that sounds like a good solution!
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