Basically, Gabe (yellow shirt) goes to play his first ever game of "Warmachine" at a game store, and has a run in with a "mathhammer" type who basically calls the game before it starts. Funny how these guys hit the nail on the head so frequently. Basically guys like this is why they DON'T go to stores or game clubs (other then their own kitchen table(s)) to play games.
I have a friend that I refuse to play anymore because he's a WAAC jerk while playing. Whenever he asks to play a game I simply reply, "You win, good game."
Well in this case it is more like quit playing the game entirely, according to this it was the first game, so at this point I would just start finding another hobby, or someone else to play with that will actually take the time to explain how to play the daggone game without bieng a jerk about it.
btemple0 wrote:Which I cannot see, it is linked to a site I cannot view, hence my comment from before.
Oh, you can't even see the comic? I thought you meant that you couldn't go to the comment page. If you can't even see the comic, why comment on it? Do you randomly review books you haven't read as well?
Personally I tone down my level of competitiveness in list building when facing new players, don't hold anything back once the game starts, and try to give them some advice about how to handle a specific armies shenanigans. Newbies need to play good players and learn how to deal with hard lists. The difficult problem is there is a very fine balance between going to soft on the newbies and being to hard on them. Winning tournaments is more of a science than an art, but teaching new people how to play the game better is more of an art than science.
"Math-Machine" "Math Hammer" its all the same lol.
I posted this because I have had so many frustrating tournament, and even casual play experiences where the game was "decided" just based on someone looking at an army list, or what was placed on the table.... before the game even started. Which needless to say is usually frustrating to someone involved.
I have had people not even play me... yes even in a tournament.... they quite without putting one model on the table, because... their list (based on some sort of "math") wasn't competitive enough against mine.
I have also had people ask me if I wanted to just call the game "now" (before we put figures down) because my list wasn't "competitive" enough to play against theirs.
This is my biggest problem with the statistic game..... math doesn't lie.... but it's math based on unknowns that haven't happened just the likely hood of it happening. People put too much faith in odds and stats. In situations like this, it's no fun for anyone, the newbie gets majorly discouraged, and the veteran doesn't get to play.
hcordes wrote:"Math-Machine" "Math Hammer" its all the same lol.
I posted this because I have had so many frustrating tournament, and even casual play experiences where the game was "decided" just based on someone looking at an army list, or what was placed on the table.... before the game even started. Which needless to say is usually frustrating to someone involved. I have had people not even play me... yes even in a tournament.... they quite without putting one model on the table, because... their list (based on some sort of "math") wasn't competitive enough against mine. I have also had people ask me if I wanted to just call the game "now" (before we put figures down) because my list wasn't "competitive" enough to play against theirs. This is my biggest problem with the statistic game..... math doesn't lie.... but it's math based on unknowns that haven't happened just the likely hood of it happening. People put too much faith in odds and stats. In situations like this, it's no fun for anyone, the newbie gets majorly discouraged, and the veteran doesn't get to play.
Wow, really? That's absurd, as well as insanely rude and inconsiderate. They may as well not even have bought an army and played, they can just play Theoreticalhammer for cheaper. People come to play, not be handed wins or told their list isn't worth playing against. Especially if you pay to play in a tournament, this sort of thing is inexcusable, because I didn't spend money to NOT play the game. No matter how Mathammered(or not) your list is, I say let the dice decide.
Yeah, that's crazy talk. If you're playing Steamroller you might run your alternate list if they've got a build which really counters yours, but you always play the darn game. Even if it's a bad matchup, you gain experience dealing with that bad matchup which may serve you well in a future game. People that call it after comparing lists are cheating themselves.
Mannahnin wrote:Definitely! I was surprised and saddened to hear that it does happen IRL.
I don't think it's a common occurrence, but it can definitely happen. I typically play a very fluffy Eldar list using my personal favorite units and not necessarily the "competitive" ones. It works well in my playgroup, as we all tend to play at about this level.
But, when you show up to a LGS and find yourself playing against a fully tweaked competitive build, it's pretty clear from the start that you don't stand much of a chance. You may be able to put up a bit of a fight, and with very lucky rolls possibly even win a game. But, when you're facing an army that is going to table you by turn 3 90% of the time, it's not much fun.
Of course, as long as you're not playing against a WAAC gamer, there are plenty of ways around this (uneven point totals, they tone down their list, you get to proxy in some of the better units, etc)
I've had that sort of experience once or twice, but I didn't back down. Because I go to tournaments (or the shop, wherever) to play some fething games.
People shouldn't be having this kind of experience often IRL.
Well part of it is the sheer difference between playing with just a small group of friends, and then dipping your toes into the greater the pool of players. I've had experiences life that with M:TG, L5R, Warhammer... Especially when you start out playing the same small group of people who might be just as much of a beginner in the system as you are, with a limited amount of whatever the game runs on, you don't realize you might be using suboptimal choices and strategies because they work when used against a similarly resourced opponent.
So yeah, it's an exaggeration for the point of humor, but not too far off the mark of what the experience is like.
People shouldn't be having this kind of experience often IRL.
Penny Arcade is a cartoon, but they do it from their own experiences with games, and life. While i haven't experience EXACTLY what the cartoon describes, I have many many many stories of game(s) and gamer(s) that are almost as bad. People are that ridiculous. The longer you play the more they crop up.
I've never personally had a game 'called' one way or another before any models were put on the board.
But I do know that several people at our FLGS will simply refuse to play certain WHFB armies becuase they are overpowered, such as my friend (a player who has won tournies with his Empire) who refuses to play High Elves in any casual game becuase he believes there isn't anything he can do against it.
Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:Penny Arcade fails to be funny or have a punchline yet again. Yay, they can state the obvious :/
The joy of Penny Arcade is not so much in the punch lines. At first I admit, i would read a comic and say "wtf???" because i wouldn't get it. You have to read the articles.
They explain what's going on, and how the cartoon relates to their real world experiences, since I started reading BOTH the articles and the cartoon, i have enjoyed it much much more than i would have otherwise.
but humor is a relative thing... so if you don't find it funny, i guess i can't fault you for it.
I was trying to prove a point but what entertains, entertains I suppose
Well, if you replaced the first guys "We won't be finishing this game in any reasonable amount of time" with "That'll take FOREVER!" It wouldn't be funny.
Same goes for if you replaced "I perceive you to be a noob" with "What a noob". It's the poshness that makes it funny.
Oh hey, wrong webcomic, I know, but LicD is starting up their Valentine's Day contest. You know, where you submit a photo and a Why should I get to date X character and if you win, you get drawn into the comic.
Amaya wrote:LiCD is actually funny even though Rayne is the cheesiest author insert outside of Twilight.
You know, Isabella Swan/Stephanie Meyer doesn't give it away quite as well as Ryan Sohmer/ Rayne Summers.
If you didn't know, Richard from LFG is also a Author Insert. Both characters represent Ryan's wish that he could be an absolute ass to everyone and get away with it.
Amaya wrote:LiCD is actually funny even though Rayne is the cheesiest author insert outside of Twilight.
You know, Isabella Swan/Stephanie Meyer doesn't give it away quite as well as Ryan Sohmer/ Rayne Summers.
If you didn't know, Richard from LFG is also a Author Insert. Both characters represent Ryan's wish that he could be an absolute ass to everyone and get away with it.
I stopped reading that PoS when he introduced the stupid Sword of Truth to the story and the only thing that kept me going that long was that Richard was funny occasionally.
Just read through all the "web comics" and had a good laugh, all you guys are funny.
I think the Penny Arcade bashing is gonna get old though. They have the coolest job ever (next to Mythbusters), and they make money off of it!? One could assume that the bashing is a from a deep rooted jealousy. maybe. How ever please remember that, while Penny Arcade is a web comic/video game review/nerd web page, they do a lot for charity. This past year their Childs Play Charity, raised over $2.2 million dollars in donations for children's hospitals all over the world. Those are good guys that point out the obvious and try to make it funny for the rest of us.
OOTS? Nah, that style is all xkcd. Penny Arcade requires a love of the absurd, not punchlines. If you can really read through their 80s ping pong arc, or their Song of the Sorcelator and not get a great laugh , then we have very different tastes in comedy.
I'll bet you don't like Dr. McNinja either, Cannerus. He's a Doctor who is also a Ninja.
Amaya wrote:LiCD is actually funny even though Rayne is the cheesiest author insert outside of Twilight.
You know, Isabella Swan/Stephanie Meyer doesn't give it away quite as well as Ryan Sohmer/ Rayne Summers.
If you didn't know, Richard from LFG is also a Author Insert. Both characters represent Ryan's wish that he could be an absolute ass to everyone and get away with it.
I stopped reading that PoS when he introduced the stupid Sword of Truth to the story and the only thing that kept me going that long was that Richard was funny occasionally.
hcordes wrote: One could assume that the bashing is a from a deep rooted jealousy. maybe.
Not totally, don't forget the allure of "interwebz cool points" (ICP): often gained via the degrading, downplaying or dismissing of the work of others.
I think it's interesting that I can "bash" one thing (realistically only making one legitimate, close to objectively provable complaint) and that instantly throws me in some "h8ers camp." If one digs through my post history I defend all sorts of things constantly. My guess is those who speak out against it probably can't handle seeing something they think is awesome considered not awesome for some reason And it's not like this is the first time anyone has complained about Penny Arcade. There have been a few webcomics over the years that made wry remarks about it, then had their sites DOSed and things of that nature by the fans.
I think that when you go into a thread where people are liking something and start acting like you're too cool for the room you're going to get that kind of reaction.
I for one don't read Penny Arcade regularly; however, when I do read it I enjoy it.
I took the comic in the OP to be a slap at the interweb theory gaming machine and the absurdity of basing the probable outcome of a game on lists and mathhammer, but that's just me.
I took the comic in the OP to be a slap at the interweb theory gaming machine and the absurdity of basing the probable outcome of a game on lists and mathhammer, but that's just me.
Please stop inserting logic into this thread, it makes it hard to continue nerdraging and earning my daily ICP...
Monster Rain wrote:I took the comic in the OP to be a slap at the interweb theory gaming machine and the absurdity of basing the probable outcome of a game on lists and mathhammer, but that's just me.
See, I still think it's about the difference from getting into the game with just a couple of friends and then going out and mingling with gamers who have been at the game longer, and understand it better than you. Referring back to my M:TG experience, when I just got into the game and was playing with just three other friends, I had a pretty strong red deck because I had three hill giants, a couple of fireballs, some lightning bolts, and a disintegrate. If I got those giants out early, I was unstoppable! Then I found out a local game store had a CCG group, so I joined that, and nearly tapped my drawers when a Shivan Dragon hit the table across from me during my first game. I also quickly learned the importance of an all comers deck, as opposed to one focused more on countering what I knew my friends had.
Monster Rain wrote:I for one don't read Penny Arcade regularly; however, when I do read it I enjoy it.
I took the comic in the OP to be a slap at the interweb theory gaming machine and the absurdity of basing the probable outcome of a game on lists and mathhammer, but that's just me.
No, that's the joke. Agreed; PA is only occasionally a source of a kneeslapper, but it's consistently amusing.
Bookwrack, your thought isn't a bad one either. I remember when I first played Magic at a Con, outside my circle of friends. I owned maybe 150ish card and probably half of them were in my deck. I walked into the room and saw people playing whose LANDS I didn't even recognize. People playing with all multilands. There was no way to compete; my deck and understanding of the game were just so far behind.
CT GAMER wrote:
hcordes wrote: One could assume that the bashing is a from a deep rooted jealousy. maybe.
Not totally, don't forget the allure of "interwebz cool points" (ICP): often gained via the degrading, downplaying or dismissing of the work of others.
Heck DaKKA is like the official sponsor of ICP...
Clearly, you've never read Yes The Truth Hurts or any of the blogs associated with it.
Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote:My mistake. I thought forums were there for expressing one's opinions
Ahtman wrote:You're so edgy and cool.
Monster Rain wrote:I think that when you go into a thread where people are liking something and start acting like you're too cool for the room you're going to get that kind of reaction.
Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote: I thought forums were there for expressing one's opinions
Certainly, just don't get all defensive and teary eyed when people disagree with you...
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Mannahnin wrote:
CT GAMER wrote:
hcordes wrote: One could assume that the bashing is a from a deep rooted jealousy. maybe.
Not totally, don't forget the allure of "interwebz cool points" (ICP): often gained via the degrading, downplaying or dismissing of the work of others.
Heck DaKKA is like the official sponsor of ICP...
Clearly, you've never read Yes The Truth Hurts or any of the blogs associated with it.
I think someone pointed me to it once. I quickly realized that I had little in common with the ideas being presented and quickly forgot the link...
Monster Rain wrote:I for one don't read Penny Arcade regularly; however, when I do read it I enjoy it.
I took the comic in the OP to be a slap at the interweb theory gaming machine and the absurdity of basing the probable outcome of a game on lists and mathhammer, but that's just me.
No, that's the joke. Agreed; PA is only occasionally a source of a kneeslapper, but it's consistently amusing.
Bookwrack, your thought isn't a bad one either.
If the other guy in the strip had been a real dick about it, then I think Monster Rain's interpretation would've been the right one, but his reaction is the same as I imagine what a veteran Magic player's would've been if I'd handed him my all color, 150+ card deck for evaluation (what? the game gives you five colors to play with, what do you mean you shouldn't use all of them? )
In panel one, I was expecting a 'this is terrible and you're terrible' punchline, but I don't think that's what we got.
Bookwrack wrote: (what? the game gives you five colors to play with, what do you mean you shouldn't use all of them? )
The most brutal deck I ever played against was 5 colors. Granted the guy had the money to buy Moxes and Black Lotus and 4 of every dual land so it wasn't really a disadvantage.
Bookwrack wrote: (what? the game gives you five colors to play with, what do you mean you shouldn't use all of them? )
The most brutal deck I ever played against was 5 colors. Granted the guy had the money to buy Moxes and Black Lotus and 4 of every dual land so it wasn't really a disadvantage.
I'm having a lot of fun trying make a 0 colour deck at the moment, and a five colour ally deck is fun as well. Really the game can be played in so many ways that it doesn't really matter. I kinda wish (outside of Apocalypse) that 40K allowed that sort of interaction still (even the limited version that was allies in 2nd edition).
Cannerus_The_Unbearable wrote: I thought forums were there for expressing one's opinions
Certainly, just don't get all defensive and teary eyed when people disagree with you...
No issue with people disagreeing. I do have issue with people calling "haters gonna hate" because I disagreed. At least pick the right grievance The comics were more to irritate anyone who was calling "haters gonna hate" because it's fun
I agree with Kilkrazy that the new webcomic by The_Unbearable is pretty amusing, although I disagree with Kilkrazy about the art, as its style is clearly stolen from xkcd.
Kilkrazy wrote:I have to say I read it the other way.
I.e. that Gabe in his innocence had picked a rock hard list that would wipe the other guy off the table.
Perhaps I am naive.
LOL
...and I took it to be commentary on the current "state of game" with WARMACHINE in that you play certain combos or you lose. I took it to mean gabe just played a bunch of stuff he thought was "neat," and the other guy plays in the competetive "play this or lose" scene more.
Amaya wrote:LiCD is actually funny even though Rayne is the cheesiest author insert outside of Twilight.
You know, Isabella Swan/Stephanie Meyer doesn't give it away quite as well as Ryan Sohmer/ Rayne Summers.
If you didn't know, Richard from LFG is also a Author Insert. Both characters represent Ryan's wish that he could be an absolute ass to everyone and get away with it.
I stopped reading that PoS when he introduced the stupid Sword of Truth to the story and the only thing that kept me going that long was that Richard was funny occasionally.
Have to ask, do you read CAD?
Very rarely. Only humorous webcomics I follow closely are LiCD, OOTS, and Oglaf.
Bookwrack wrote:(what? the game gives you five colors to play with, what do you mean you shouldn't use all of them? )
My Sliver deck runs all 5 colors and has never once been accused of being a "soft deck".
Thats because its Slivers... and slivers are EVIL VILE creatures....... though we made a deck once that just had the Sliver queen in it. Two copies... only creature in the deck.
Very rarely. Only humorous webcomics I follow closely are LiCD, OOTS, and Oglaf.
Ok, I was about to say you don't know good webcomics if you said you liked it, and say you just don't like webcomics in general if you didn't, but your list has two of my three favorites. It's all good.
hcordes wrote:
Platuan4th wrote:
Bookwrack wrote:(what? the game gives you five colors to play with, what do you mean you shouldn't use all of them? )
My Sliver deck runs all 5 colors and has never once been accused of being a "soft deck".
Thats because its Slivers... and slivers are EVIL VILE creatures....... though we made a deck once that just had the Sliver queen in it. Two copies... only creature in the deck.
Slivers are indeed evil. I have never beaten a Sliver deck, but that disappeared before I put my Blue/Black deck together.
My brother once did a similar thing with an all black deck that only had two copies of the.... Avatar of Woe? Everything else were spells along the lines of "Target player loses X health, you gain X health" and "Destroy Target Creature, it can't be regenerated". The only deck that could beat it was my dad's all white deck, which had protection from black, and this creature that he very easily got to 5/20 "Tap this creature: Redirect all damage you take this turn to this creature".
That's really funny. They've all been pretty funny. It's weird, because you're basically deconstructing someone else's joke to make it awkward and unfunny, and that's strangely making it funny all over again.
Bookwrack wrote:(what? the game gives you five colors to play with, what do you mean you shouldn't use all of them? )
My Sliver deck runs all 5 colors and has never once been accused of being a "soft deck".
I somehow doubt that your sliver deck was 150 cards, which also happened to be your entire collection.
My sliver deck ran all 5 colors. Gemhide Slivers give you "one mana of any color." You only need like 10 forests to run it. I don't remember the specifics.
Edit: I started reading CAD just now and wow, that comic is terrible.
Then I went to Enc Dramatica to read about it and wow, the creator of that comic has some serious issues.
Bookwrack wrote:(what? the game gives you five colors to play with, what do you mean you shouldn't use all of them? )
My Sliver deck runs all 5 colors and has never once been accused of being a "soft deck".
I somehow doubt that your sliver deck was 150 cards, which also happened to be your entire collection.
My sliver deck ran all 5 colors. Gemhide Slivers give you "one mana of any color." You only need like 10 forests to run it. I don't remember the specifics.
Edit: I started reading CAD just now and wow, that comic is terrible.
Then I went to Enc Dramatica to read about it and wow, the creator of that comic has some serious issues.
And CAD is still not funny.
The fact that you used encyclopaedia dramatica for any serious research instantly invalidates that comment.
Bookwrack wrote:(what? the game gives you five colors to play with, what do you mean you shouldn't use all of them? )
My Sliver deck runs all 5 colors and has never once been accused of being a "soft deck".
I somehow doubt that your sliver deck was 150 cards, which also happened to be your entire collection.
My sliver deck ran all 5 colors. Gemhide Slivers give you "one mana of any color." You only need like 10 forests to run it. I don't remember the specifics.
Edit: I started reading CAD just now and wow, that comic is terrible.
Then I went to Enc Dramatica to read about it and wow, the creator of that comic has some serious issues.
And CAD is still not funny.
The fact that you used encyclopaedia dramatica for any serious research instantly invalidates that comment.
A terrible webcomic that once had several strips about a failed abortion/miscarriage written by a terrible human being who shows his genitilia to underage girls.
I actually enjoy CAD, FWIW.
Yes. It's brainless, occasionally nonsensical, and relies a lot on unrealistic occurances as plot devices.
Know what, though? It's not real life. It's a web comic. All those things are acceptable.
Almost every "favorite" comis listed in this thread does the same things.
MagickalMemories wrote:I actually enjoy CAD, FWIW.
Yes. It's brainless, occasionally nonsensical, and relies a lot on unrealistic occurances as plot devices.
Know what, though? It's not real life. It's a web comic. All those things are acceptable.
Almost every "favorite" comis listed in this thread does the same things.
Yeah, but CAD is not funny. I just read like a dozen or two dozen of those things, and they are not funny.
I mean, is it supposed to be funny? If this is some kind of ironic gimmick with a comic strip that would need to catch a plane to be anywhere near funny I could say this had any kind of merit.
It's the miscarriage strip that he removed from the site cause it caused an internet poostorm. Apparently the GF goes on to apologize to the main character Ethan for having the miscarriage. It was believable and well done. >.<
Emperors Faithful wrote:But why would that be on a gaming comic? Is that...the joke?
It was a an out of left field dramatic swerve that derailed and aborted what had been ongoing character development for the guy. As it is no longer included in the strip archive, you can guess how well it went over.
Not quite as bad but almost as WTF, the other main character met a girl online, and when they met in person, OMG! She's a fatty! The guy spends the rest of the date politely disengaged and uninteresting, and at the end he's ready to leave and never speak to her again, when she reveals, wait! it's a fat suit! She's actually a hottie! And she's really sorry she lied to him, but she wanted someone who was interested in her for her mind and not her body, and he passed the test! (good thing she didn't get to read his thought balloons). So if he'd forgive her, and please give her a second chance... And the guy is like, 'Zing! Oh yeah!' while saying, "Yeah, I guess I can give another chance."
I was waiting for a punchline, or a reference, or something referring to the fact that the guy couldn't wait to leave until he knew she was hot, and had zero interest before then, but no, by the way the strip portrayed it, everything wrong in that situation was on the girl, and there was nothing worth commenting on on the guy's behavior.
Amaya wrote:A terrible webcomic that once had several strips about a failed abortion/miscarriage w
Wait, we're talking about vgcats now? That strip wasn't terrible, it was the funny!
We weren't, but I'm glad you brought them up.
I've tried to like both VG Cats and CAD. Neither of them has ever provided me with any laughs, so a long time ago I stopped bothering to look at them. And the one by a guy called Scott something, which is line drawings. No laughs, ever.
I've always been down with Penny Arcade, though. Maybe it's a generation gap thing.
Amaya wrote:A terrible webcomic that once had several strips about a failed abortion/miscarriage w
Wait, we're talking about vgcats now? That strip wasn't terrible, it was the funny!
We weren't, but I'm glad you brought them up.
I've tried to like both VG Cats and CAD. Neither of them has ever provided me with any laughs, so a long time ago I stopped bothering to look at them. And the one by a guy called Scott something, which is line drawings. No laughs, ever.
I've always been down with Penny Arcade, though. Maybe it's a generation gap thing.
There's quite a few of these comics out there. Most are video game related.
They're not particularly funny, or all that well-written. But, people like reading about their hobbies, so if they're really into video games, they'll follow the semi-poor comics that are about video games.
I do the same thing with a few comics, CAD being one of them. Most of the time, it's not particularly funny, but every once in a while, it makes me chuckle. And, it only takes a moment or two to read 3 times a week, so it's not quite worth the effort of removing it from my bookmarks... yet.
Someone posted all the wargaming related CAD strips a long while back, and that was what got me reading it in the first place. If only the rest had been like those in any way shape of form...
sebster wrote:Yeah, but CAD is not funny. I just read like a dozen or two dozen of those things, and they are not funny.
To each his own.
I happen to like CAD. It does entertain me.
Eric
[edit]
Okay. So, I think I'm seeing the issue.
You guys aren't looking to be entertained. You're looking to be amused.
Sure. CAD isn't always funny. Sometimes, he tries to go in a different direction. Okay.
So?
I had little to no problem with the miscarraige story line, in and of itself. Women have miscarraiges every day. Why can't it be addressed in a webcomic? Not all comics have to be funny... that even goes for strips/story arcs *within* an overall humorous comic. I have more problems with the edited strips making a joke out of the miscarriage story/strip than I do with the original.
Another point: the "fat girl" strip. I remember that one well... not because it was funny, but because it was TRUE. It's how we (in general) are. He spent the whole date thinking she was nice, but fat. He wasn't interested because she was fat. When he found out she wasn't, his attitude turned a 180. Fact is, that's how many (if not most) guys who "don't like fatties" would act. They'd be relieved because now they can like her, which is what they WANTED to do, but wouldn't let themselves, because she was 'the fatty.'
If you're only looking for funny, then many comics out there won't be for you. Sometimes, they take a turn for the serious.
PBF really isn't funny. Just went through about 30 comics and got one or two chuckles. Half of them should have the character in the last frame saying "That was unfortunate" as the punchline.
It's a story in comic form and, while often funny, it's NOT a humor comic.
Sometimes, it's way too wordy, and the location of the bubbles can make it hard to decide who is supposed to be talking *when* but, overall, it's an enjoyable read.
And it's not like this is the first time anyone has complained about Penny Arcade. There have been a few webcomics over the years that made wry remarks about it, then had their sites DOSed and things of that nature by the fans.
